Moving From Self-Focused Faith to Others-Centered Living

Summary

Living Influence with Bill Thrall and Scott Boyd

Episode: Moving From Self-Focused Faith to Others-Centered Living
Date: January 15, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Bill Thrall and Scott Boyd explore the transformative journey from a self-focused faith to an others-centered way of living. Drawing on their personal experiences and decades of mentoring, they discuss how genuine spiritual maturing requires confronting shame, embracing vulnerability, and learning to receive—and give—real love. This maturation, they argue, not only brings healing but also magnifies one’s influence in the world. The conversation is candid, compassionate, and rooted in practical wisdom about trusting Jesus not just with one’s sin, but with one’s person.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Stages of Faith and Maturing

• "Me-Centered" Beginnings:
  • New believers start with a self-focus—a journey often marked by hidden struggles and striving (00:05–01:57).
  • Bill shares his personal "bottom" experience: business troubles, his wife's cancer diagnosis, and wrestling with sin, all of which led him to a deeper understanding of grace and the necessity of vulnerability (00:24–01:56).
  • Quote:

    “It was 20 years into being a Christian...and this new reality began to open up for me.”
    (Scott, 01:33)

• Blossoming into Others-Centered Living:
  • As maturity develops, believers shift from focusing on their needs to recognizing and serving others' needs (01:57–02:22).
  • Quote:

    “When a believer begins to experience these truths and mature, I think they blossom.”
    (Scott, 01:52)

2. Discovering Grace and Its Impact

• Grace compels a move from self-focused living to offering oneself for others. Scott illustrates this via his business (“QuesTec”), transforming its purpose from personal gain to facilitating growth opportunities for others (02:30–03:36).
• Quote:

  “I gotta find a reason for doing questech besides my wallet... I want questech to help other people to grow because I had begun to grow.”
  (Scott, 02:31–02:48)

• The mission grows to encompass both clients and employees—the builders—as beneficiaries.

3. Trusting Jesus with Your Person

• Distinction Between Trusting Jesus with Sin vs. Person:
  • Many Christians trust Jesus with their sin but not with their identity or person (03:44–04:09).
  • Quote:

    “Thousands of individuals who have trusted Jesus with their sin have not yet trusted Jesus with their person, who they are.”
    (Bill, 03:58–04:08)

  • Maturity is marked by believing what Jesus says about you and living out of a received identity (04:33–05:27).

4. From Striving to Trusting

• Early faith is full of striving—to please, to be acceptable.
• The mature journey is a shift:

  “We move from that striving to please... to trusting.” (Scott and Bill, 05:49–05:53)

• When one trusts Jesus for identity, they experience grace, which leads to being loved and, crucially, to being able to love others (05:54–06:08).

5. Experiencing and Extending Love

• Affirmation and Vulnerability:
  • Scott describes confessing sin to a friend who responds with affirmation, teaching him the profound link between being loved and being able to love (07:03–08:34).
  • Quote:

    “It began to change me... our love for others actually begins to become a fruit out of letting ourselves be loved.”
    (Scott, 08:34–08:47)

• The Concept of "Letting" Love:
  • True maturity and healing require “letting” oneself be loved—by God and others—on their terms, not your own (09:18–10:14).
  • Quote:

    “I cannot experience even God's love until I let him love me.”
    (Bill, 09:25–09:29)

  • Immature love demands to be loved “my way”; mature love allows others to love you according to who they are (10:14–10:23).

6. Understanding and Accepting Love's Terms

• Bill shares a moving story about his wife Grace, revealing how he learned to trust and receive her love—and the love of others—on their terms, which deepened his capacity to receive and extend love (10:45–13:00).
• Quote:

  “Trust me, so I can love you. So that was the foundation. It’s the foundation, in my opinion, in every relationship of love, including God.”
  (Bill, 11:36–11:46)

• Mistaken attempts to “earn” love (e.g., buying gifts for his kids) are replaced by openness to being loved without self-imposed conditions.

7. Healing and Its Evidence

• Healing is both a sign and a catalyst of spiritual maturity; it reduces self-focus and increases one's capacity to love and serve others (14:08–15:18).
• Quote:

  “How would I know if you’re healing? Well, maybe you react less, because you don’t have to justify yourself as much—or anymore—because Jesus is the one who justified you.”
  (Scott, 15:03–15:18)

8. Maturity, Influence, and Leadership

• Maturity is demonstrated not only in the healing one receives but also in the influence one extends to others.
• A key shift: self-centeredness cares little for others’ perception or well-being; mature influence becomes deeply aware of impact and seeks to build up others (17:24–19:21).
• Quote:

  “When I’m self centered, I could care less about how I’m affecting you. But you know what? As I mature, something happens. I begin to become aware of how I’m affecting you.”
  (Bill, 18:16–18:52)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “When a believer begins to experience these truths and mature, I think they blossom.”
  (Scott, 01:52)
• “Thousands of individuals who have trusted Jesus with their sin have not yet trusted Jesus with their person, who they are.”
  (Bill, 03:58)
• “I cannot experience even God’s love until I let him love me.”
  (Bill, 09:25)
• “Trust me, so I can love you. So that was the foundation… in every relationship of love, including God.”
  (Bill, 11:36)
• “How would I know if you’re healing? Well, maybe you react less, because you don’t have to justify yourself as much—…Jesus is the one who justified you.”
  (Scott, 15:03)
• “I know what they need desperately is to be loved. So who—who are you? Who am I letting love me?”
  (Bill, 14:11)
• “When I’m self centered, I could care less about how I’m affecting you. But you know what? As I mature, something happens. I begin to become aware of how I’m affecting you.”
  (Bill, 18:16)

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Key Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:05–01:57 – Introduction to stages of spiritual maturing: moving from self- to others-centered faith
• 02:30–03:36 – Scott’s story: shifting business purpose from self-gain to others’ flourishing
• 03:58–05:27 – The distinction between trusting Jesus with sin vs. one’s person
• 07:03–08:47 – Experiencing love and learning to love others through vulnerability and affirmation
• 09:25–10:23 – The crucial step of “letting” oneself be loved, on the terms of the other
• 10:45–13:01 – Bill’s practical illustration: accepting love from his wife Grace and learning trust
• 14:08–15:18 – Signs and evidence of personal healing
• 17:24–19:21 – The link between maturity, influence, and leadership

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Episode Tone and Language

The conversation is openhearted, humble, and gently challenging. Both speakers reflect personally, drawing listeners into an honest dialogue about real-life faith, relationships, and vulnerability. Their tone is encouraging—at times humorous, always gracious—with a persistent emphasis on hope and transformation.

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Takeaway

Living an others-centered life is not about trying harder, but about allowing oneself to experience healing, receive love, and extend that love—influence—to others. True maturity flourishes when we risk being known, let ourselves be loved, and allow our stories and growth to serve those around us.

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Next episode will explore the role of community and encouragement in realizing one’s potential and influence.

Transcript

[A]

Welcome to Living Influence. If you've been with us last week, we've been talking about the process of maturing. And we're kind of on a path where we are taking a believer from when they're first saved. And we're going to call that stage the me centered stage. When you're first saved, you know, you've discovered Jesus, you've trusted him with your sin. It's an amazing new world. But there's a lot hidden. There's a lot that you haven't processed in your life. And so we talked about that, talked about creating, Creating a safe place where someone could learn to not hide. And we're going to move today to the next stage in maturing, which is the others centered, where we become aware of other people. You know, in this experience, I. I think in my journey, I've talked about the bottom. You'll hear a lot of people talk about the bottom in their life. And the bottom of my life came. My business almost went bankrupt. I'm not even sure if we're going to climb out of that hill. And my wife gets breast cancer and I'm struggling with sin. I actually am experiencing almost a prison or a bondage to it. And it's where my cry for God's grace began and I began to discover grace. I began to discover becoming vulnerable and open. The interesting thing is it was 20 years into being a Christian. I was almost 40, I think I was 41, 42 years old. And this new reality began to open up for me. And so this other centered time, I actually love this time when you're with a believer, because when a believer begins to experience these truths and mature, I think they blossom.

[B]

Amen.

[A]

I think their life becomes filled with a bit more joy. They let themselves have fun. They have a little lightness to their step. They have a little sparkle in their eye. It's probably what has caused me to go, I want to give my life to teaching these principles to others because it makes such a difference.

[B]

When you discovered grace and its reality, it did something. It caused you to want to give your life away.

[A]

Yeah. You know, at the same time that that happened for me, this epiphany happened at my work. And the way I would take. I don't have my wallet in my back pocket, but I'd take my wallet out and I'd go, I gotta find a reason for doing questech besides my wallet. And that was me centered. My wallet was me centered. And I set my wallet down. I said, I, I want questech. I initially Said it, I want questech to help other people to grow because I had begun to grow. And I eventually changed it because I. I can want people to grow more than they want to grow for themselves. And so I changed the verbiage to questech. Provides opportunities for people to grow and actually a really cool thing. My son, who's leading the company now with his team, came up with questech. Builds opportunities. There you go. And he included, the buildings that we build for people, provide opportunities for people, but they also provide opportunities for our employees. Who are the builders of it? Who are the builders? Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Those are great examples.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So you just modeled for us what we're talking about.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And two different dynamics.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Personal.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So as we think about this becoming other, centered, I want to make a big deal about something. No one becomes a Christian until they trust Jesus with their sin.

[A]

Right.

[B]

But thousands of individuals who have trusted Jesus with their sin have not yet trusted Jesus with their person, who they are.

[A]

Instead of trusting Jesus with their person, they're working to become a person.

[B]

Right. Is that interesting? They're working on their person to become acceptable to Jesus.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And he's going, you got it backwards. I've already redeemed your sin. I've redeemed you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I've made you different. Our language, biblical, we believe, is he transformed the sinner into a saint. One of the dynamics that has to be true in order for a person to mature is they've got to believe who Jesus says they are. We can make, unfortunately, we can make Christianity a religion. We can make it a religion where we have to do certain things to become, or we can make it a relational faith, beginning with Jesus and the work he's already done in us. And so as I am maturing, one of the evidences of my maturing is I'm trusting Jesus with who he says I am.

[A]

Right. And so the new believer is just striving to please.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

You know, and it's. It's the guy.

[B]

That's true.

[A]

When I wake up in the morning, I didn't think about God, and I wanted to think about God more because he's so important. But it's like, well, what if it's okay to think about work when you wake up and God's still pleased with you? And so we move from that striving to please.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And to rusty to trusting.

[B]

To trusting.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

Some people say, well, that's too simple. No, it's not. It's not too simple. Because here's what happens. A phenomenon takes place. When I learn to trust Jesus with who he says I am, I begin to experience grace. And when I begin to experience grace, something happens. I begin to experience being loved. Now here's the mature part. And I begin to experience loving others. Now, how would I know. How would anybody know that they're experiencing love? Because their needs are being met. No matter who it is, Jesus, God goes out of his way to convince me that he loves me by really accepting me. We sing the song accepted in the beloved. We can sing it, but when do I learn to believe it? When do I learn to let my God love me? Yeah.

[A]

And for me, when I first began to confess my sin to my friend, and my friend looked back and said, you have no idea how courageous you just have been. I mean, I'm just amazed by your courage.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Do you know? And so what was happening for me was I was being affirmed.

[B]

Right? Good for you. I was being affirmed. That's called love.

[A]

And that's called love to be affirmed. And it began to change me. Amen.

[B]

I'm not asking anybody, does God love you? I'm not asking that. I'm not asking if you love one, if you have love for one another. What I'm asking is this. Are you experiencing love? Maturity is beginning to experience love. Maturity is beginning to let others experience your love.

[A]

Well, I think when we. For me, when I began to experience love, like just having confessed my sin to my friend, right? And he tells me how courageous I was. And so I'm being affirmed and loved in the midst of that, there's a part of me that was like, I don't deserve that.

[B]

Good for you. Honest response.

[A]

And there's this. I don't deserve that. But letting it happen anyway produces a fruit in me. And the fruit is, is that I can't judge you now.

[B]

Amen. Good for you.

[A]

And so I love you.

[B]

It's very wisely.

[A]

And so it's. Our love for others actually begins to become a fruit out of letting ourselves be loved.

[B]

Amen. And in that process, Scott, something's happening. We become a vehicle for each other's healing, right?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Do you hear what Scott just said? Scott said, I don't deserve that. That's an unhealed. That's an unhealed statement. That. That's. That's a shame statement.

[A]

It is a shame statement.

[B]

It's a shame statement.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Unhealed statement.

[A]

I don't deserve it.

[B]

And he went, wait a minute. But I let it happen anyway. Oh, my gosh, what a great feeling. That Was.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So.

[A]

So that's.

[B]

That's a good example of what we're talking about. How do I let. That's. It's a key word here.

[A]

Let.

[B]

Let. I cannot experience even God's love until I let him love me. I can't experience your love. You can't experience my love. The let is critical. There's a biblical word for that. We teach it. But if I'm going to mature, I'm going to mature by experiencing love. I'm going to mature by trusting. I'm going to mature by letting go. Others love me. Now, mature love does something. It says this, Scott, I'm going to let you love me. But as our relationship grows, you know what I'm going to learn to do? I'm going to let you love me on your terms, not mine.

[A]

Yeah. So tell me more about that.

[B]

Immature love says this. I want you to love me the way I want to be loved.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Mature love says, I want you to love me the way I need to be loved. And when I put. This is so weird. When I put the way I want to be loved, I've made love a rule.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I'm the one that's dictating whether I'm being loved or not.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But if I let you love me, period.

[A]

So can you give me an example of letting Grace love you on her terms?

[B]

I think several, actually. Yes. Because this was a great learning experience for me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

The first one is the story I've told already, but I'll just repeat it. I did not know, Scott, that I could not experience Grace's love until I trusted Grace. I didn't know that I wanted Grace to love me on my terms. And my terms did not require my trusting her. All it did was tell her what my wants were.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Love me the way I want to be loved and I will be happy. And she said, no, No. I want you to understand something, Bill. Trust me, so I can love you. So that was the foundation.

[A]

Foundation.

[B]

It's the foundation, in my opinion, in every relationship of love, including God.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But beyond that, it's. Then practically, how did I experience that love? Grace is a. Is a person who loves budgets and loves to plan and. And I'm not so much. And so early on, when our children were like two and four, maybe three and five, I don't remember. But this is an example, she would have a budget for Christmas, and it was practical and it was wonderful. And we would go shopping, we'd buy everything according to the budget, and then, tragically, Two days before Christmas, I'd go out and buy the kids a bunch of stuff, charge it. So now the bill's going to come due in January, but I don't care. And then Grace, one day after I did that one year, she came to me a week or two after Christmas and she said, bill, our children love you. Yeah. You don't have to buy their love anymore. They already love you. It made me cry. Makes me cry now. See, what I was doing is I was trying to impress my children so they would know how much I love them.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And she was saying, bill, your children love you dearly. Let them. And so that's kind of a silly illustration, but it's not at all, because it carries the weight of my learning from someone who loved me that there are healthy boundaries to love that I had to learn. And it's so interesting, Scott, because over many years and many examples, I became a person who preaches, teaches about love. It's kind of like one of those paradoxes.

[A]

It's like this character who didn't know how to.

[B]

Didn't know anything about loving well and didn't know anything about the relationship. But it's become one of my life themes. And so as we think about that and we think about this process of maturing, the question I will ask anybody is this. Who are you letting love you? I spend almost no time asking people how they're working or dealing with their sin.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I know better.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I know what they need desperately is to be loved. So who. Who are you? Who am I letting love me? And. And so as. As we. As we go through this process, and.

[A]

And by the way, I happen to know dozens of people who testify that you changed their lives.

[B]

Oh. By God's grace, probably me included. But isn't that a miracle?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

No, but. Scott, thank you. But isn't that a miracle? So here we are, wounded people experiencing healing. And that's one of the things how. Well, I know I'm maturing because I'm experiencing healing. What does my healing do? It frees me to love more.

[A]

Yeah. I was thinking about this word healing, and made me think about a sore. You know, you touch your sore and.

[B]

It hurts and you react.

[A]

And so how do you know if you're healing? Well, maybe you react less.

[B]

Amen.

[A]

You react less because you don't have to justify amen yourself.

[B]

No, that's excellent.

[A]

As much or any more, because Jesus is the one who justified you.

[B]

Amen.

[A]

Thank you. And so this healing thing, it's really real.

[B]

It's big, it's real, it is big. And it's like, as we know, Scott, we've done cohorts together sitting with a group of people who begin a cohort of strangers after two years, have created a safe place where they can tell their stories and where they can begin some of them to have some of the most profound healing of their whole lives. And they're 55 and 60 and 65, or they're 45 and 39, it doesn't matter. Here's the point I want to make. How would I know I'm maturing because I'm experiencing healing? What would be the evidence of my healing? I don't think about me as much as. Yeah, how would I know that Scott is healing? Because he said to us as his introduction that he can't now not want to share these principles for the benefit of others. That's the whole part of this second section. The whole part of this second section of our maturing is how others become our focus. What keeps me from being focused on you? My stuff. My wounding.

[A]

My stuff is hiding. Keeps me focused on me.

[B]

Keeps me focused on me. So God begins to heal me from my stuff. And it opens my life to others. As you know, when we work with leaders, one of the ways that I help them experience maturing together is a simple process of submitting to each other's law, submitting to each other's strengths, protecting each other's limitations. That's a process of maturing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Immature people compete with each other.

[A]

Yeah. It's interesting in business, we were talking about this earlier, but particularly in sales culture, you get, you get these guys that get promoted as leaders and you want everyone to have this drive to be, to be a hunter and to go for it. And it doesn't promote maturity. And often some of those guys that are driven and drive, maybe they drive, really, they drive some results for themselves, but then they get promoted and their lives become a disaster. I mean, the wheel falls off on one side or the other. It was a performance life. And they never learned to not hide.

[B]

That's a great segue for me to my last point I wanted to make about this. And that is, how would I know I'm maturing? I'm discovering the significance of my influence. Yeah, that's one of the ways I'll know I'm maturing. I'll measure it this way. When I'm self centered, I literally don't care what you think about me. When I'm self centered, I could care less about how I'm affecting you. But you know what? As I mature, something happens. I begin to become aware of how I'm affecting you. And with that salesman, he might be able to make a big project, sell a big project, but he can't lead. Why? Because he doesn't know how to own his influence. And so, as I see Christians who are maturing, I become someone who comes alongside them to encourage them into the influence they're having on others.

[A]

Yeah, that's good.

[B]

And so that's part of our development. Who stands alongside you to encourage you into the possibilities that God has for your life. That's our next podcast.

[A]

That'll be the next one. Thanks for joining us on Living Influence, and we hope to see you next week. Thank you for listening to the podcast. We're really glad that you're here. We'd love to know that you're here. And so if you could leave a comment, we would appreciate that. But more importantly, if you know someone that should listen to this or hear it, we would love for you to share it with them. Thanks again.