Podcast Summary: "Managing Autoimmunity with a Whole-Food Plant-Based Diet with Karen Lee"

Living Well with Multiple Sclerosis | Overcoming MS | S8E3
Release Date: January 28, 2026
Host: Geoff Allix
Guest: Karen Lee (Retired RN, Nutritionist, Author, Overcoming MS Facilitator)

Episode Overview

This episode explores the critical role of diet—specifically a whole-food, plant-based approach—in the management of multiple sclerosis (MS) and other autoimmune diseases. Host Geoff Allix is joined by Karen Lee, a retired intensive care nurse, nutritionist, author, and passionate advocate for plant-based eating. Recently celebrating 10 years since her MS diagnosis, Karen discusses her health journey, the science linking gut health to autoimmunity, practical strategies for dietary change, and her new book, “Healing from the Inside Out: Managing Autoimmune Disease with a Whole-Food Plant-Based Diet.”

Key Discussion Points

1. Karen’s MS and Career Journey – [01:40–09:26]

• Diagnosis and Adoption of Overcoming MS Program

  • Diagnosed with relapsing MS in 2016 after severe optic neuritis.
  • Already eating plant-based, but needed to adjust for MS (e.g., reduce saturated fat, manage stress).
  • Only one minor lesion in the past ten years, credits lifestyle changes.

• Professional Path

  • Former intensive care nurse (neuro & general ITU), turned to nutrition during a family stint in India.
  • Inspired by Dr. Nandita Shah’s talks on food as medicine; began blogging and creating recipes as "The Sensitive Foodie".
  • Transitioned focus to food education, writing, and running plant-based cooking courses.

“I didn’t want to be disempowered...I wanted to be able to live my life well.”
— Karen Lee [07:29]

2. Overview of Overcoming MS Diet Recommendations – [09:26–10:31]

• A predominantly whole-food plant-based diet with optional fish/seafood.
• Emphasize: Fruits, vegetables, whole grains, beans, lentils, nuts, seeds; includes 20-40ml cold-pressed flaxseed oil daily for omega-3s.
• Avoid: Highly processed foods, refined ingredients, saturated fat, meat, dairy, deep-fried foods.

3. Diet and Immune Health: The Science – [10:36–17:48]

• Role of Nutrition in Immunity

  • Macronutrients (proteins, fats, carbohydrates) and micronutrients (vitamins—especially A, C, E, D; minerals like zinc, magnesium) are essential for cellular function and immunity.
  • Vitamin D: Mainly synthesized via sun exposure, supplementation important in low sunlight.

• Gut Health & Microbiome

  • Gut houses ~70% of immune cells.
  • Fiber feeds microbiome ('good bacteria'), key to immune modulation.
  • Western diets (high in processed foods, low in fiber) disrupt gut health, promote inflammation, and elevate chronic disease risks.

“We are literally what we eat.”
— Karen Lee [13:08]

• Only 4% of the UK population meet recommended daily fiber intake; calls for greater focus on fiber diversity.

4. Dysbiosis, Leaky Gut, and Autoimmunity – [17:48–23:04]

• Dysbiosis: Imbalance of gut microbes; harmful bacteria outcompete beneficial bacteria if fiber is inadequate.
• This leads to:
  • Breakdown of the protective gut mucosal layer.
  • Triggers local and systemic immune responses, potentially confusing self and non-self, leading to autoimmunity (e.g., MS, Crohn’s, lupus, rheumatoid arthritis).

“If we look after [the microbiome], it will look after us.”
— Karen Lee [15:56]

• Leaky Gut: Damaged gut lining permits harmful compounds to enter bloodstream, exacerbating inflammation and immune misidentification.

5. “Healing from the Inside Out”—Karen’s New Book – [23:04–26:13]

• Structure: First half explains autoimmunity and gut health, busts myths, shares real-life stories (including her own and those of three other women with various autoimmune diseases).
• Second half features 100 easy, gluten-free, whole-food plant-based recipes, designed to minimize kitchen time (vital for those with fatigue).

“It’s about a way of eating that promotes lifelong health...they’re good for the family as well.”
— Karen Lee [25:46]

6. Why Whole Plant Foods Benefit Everyone – [26:39–29:36]

• Research supports plant-predominant diets (e.g., Mediterranean, Blue Zones) for longevity and lower chronic disease risk.
• Benefits extend to healthy individuals and those with conditions like heart disease or high blood pressure.
• Plant-rich diets are also vital for planetary health (Eat Lancet report).

“We just know that these whole plant foods contain all of the nutrients we need to thrive, packaged up in this wonderful fiber.”
— Karen Lee [29:31]

7. Addressing Common Plant-Based Diet Concerns – [29:36–31:12]

• Protein Myths:
  All foods contain protein; beans, lentils, tofu, tempeh, seeds, and nuts are rich sources. Most people are fiber-deficient, not protein-deficient.

• Building Variety: The '30-Plant Rule'—Tips for Transition

  • Start with 5-a-day, then work toward 10 (fruits/veg) and aim for 30 different plant foods/week.
  • Mix up berries, swap white for whole grains, vary nuts and seeds, increase legumes slowly, count herbs/spices, use frozen produce for affordability.
  • Make incremental swaps and focus on abundance and enjoyment, not restriction.

“Eat the rainbow—different colors have different phytonutrients...they all support the body in a different way.”
— Karen Lee [32:32]

8. Favorite Recipes from the New Book – [37:21–39:59]

• Favorites include:
  • Sticky date and ginger cake
  • Raspberry "Bakewell" tart
  • Vegetable curry with chickpea dumplings
  • Selection of sweet/savory sauces (e.g., tahini-based, raspberry, chocolate)
• Recipes designed to be easy, delicious, and freezable.

9. Beyond Diet—The Importance of Movement and Mindset – [40:53–42:29]

• Exercise and time outdoors are essential for Karen’s well-being.
• Training for the Taunton Half Marathon to mark 10 years post-diagnosis—no time goal, just to finish ("doing it to celebrate the fact that I actually still can").

“I want to raise money for Overcoming MS because I’m so grateful I found them when I did.”
— Karen Lee [41:44]

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On lifestyle empowerment:

  “I vowed I’d never be like that [disempowered patient]. I was going to be the difficult patient.”
  — Karen Lee [08:23]

• On practical plant-based eating:

  “It is definitely not about restriction, but about abundance.”
  — Karen Lee [29:32]

• On enjoyment of food:

  “Taste is so important...I don’t want this to be some kind of austere, boring practice.”
  — Karen Lee [35:54]

Notable Segments & Timestamps

• [01:49] — Karen’s MS diagnosis and initial response
• [04:55] — From intensive care nursing to nutritionist and author
• [09:36] — Overcoming MS diet recommendations explained
• [10:36] — How diet supports immune health and role of gut microbiome
• [18:02] — What is dysbiosis and its link to autoimmunity?
• [22:01] — Explaining leaky gut and its impacts
• [23:23] — Introduction to “Healing from the Inside Out”
• [26:46] — Evidence for plant-based diets benefitting everyone
• [29:36] — The truth about protein on plant-based diets
• [31:38] — Practical advice for increasing plant variety
• [37:37] — Favorite recipes from Karen’s new book
• [40:53] — Celebrating movement and raising funds with a half marathon

Final Thoughts

Karen Lee’s evidence-based optimism and lived experience shine in this episode. Her journey exemplifies how intentional lifestyle change—anchored in a fiber-rich, varied plant-based diet—empowers those with MS and other autoimmune diseases to thrive. The episode is rich with accessible advice, myth-busting science, and an encouraging message: abundance, enjoyment, and small steps matter.

Further Information

• Karen Lee’s new book: “Healing from the Inside Out: Managing Autoimmune Disease with a Whole-food Plant-Based Diet” is available globally.
• Links: Show notes at overcomingms.org/podcast include Karen's social media and JustGiving fundraising page for Overcoming MS.

For anyone newly diagnosed with MS, managing autoimmunity, or simply seeking a longer, healthier life, this episode is an inspiring and practical guide to the power of food, self-advocacy, and gentle progress.