Boston Celtics' Front Court CRISIS | Can Xavier Tillman SAVE the Day?

Summary

Locked On Celtics - Daily Podcast On The Boston Celtics
Episode: Boston Celtics' Front Court CRISIS | Can Xavier Tillman SAVE the Day?
Host: John Karalis (with guest Tom Westerholm)
Date: September 10, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the looming crisis in the Boston Celtics' front court as the team faces the upcoming season with uncertainty at the power forward and center positions. Host John Karalis is joined by Tom Westerholm to dissect the available options, with a keen focus on the largely overlooked Xavier Tillman. The discussion explores if Tillman, should he be healthy and return to his Memphis Grizzlies form, could "snap" the shaky Celtics rotation into place and help the team reach its best-case scenario. Together, they analyze how the front court fits together, debate starting options, and candidly assess the roster’s limitations and possible upside.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The State of the Celtics’ Front Court [01:26]

• Boston's front court is widely seen as their main weakness heading into the season.
• Few names have dominated off-season conversations—except, notably, Xavier Tillman, who has been largely forgotten.
• John Karalis: "One name we have not been talking about very much at all… it's Xavier Tillman" [02:54].

2. Why Xavier Tillman Matters [04:11 – 09:43]

• If healthy, Tillman’s presence as a starting power forward could bring much-needed stability.
• John Karalis: "If Xavier Tillman can be a starting power forward for the Celtics, then that snaps the entire… rotation into place.” [05:37]
• Tom and John reflect on how Tillman's age, play style, and locker room presence would fit in—despite never being a regular NBA starter.
• Tom Westerholm: “He’s really not that far removed from being the guy that Memphis was really upset to lose.” [07:34]

On Team Defense

• Tillman’s mobility, lateral movement, and ability as a help defender are key, especially when defending pick-and-rolls and rotating out to corners.
• John Karalis: “If Tillman can come in and help… defensively, then he is worth his weight in accolades for it.” [11:17]

3. Reality Check: Limitations & Best-Case Scenario [09:43 – 13:04]

• Both agree: Even at his best, Tillman is not an ideal starting-caliber NBA power forward.
• Tom Westerholm: “Historically, he’s never been [a starting-caliber player]... the most starts he’s ever had was 29 out of 61 games.” [09:59]
• The front court is a patchwork, and expectations need to be managed.
• John Karalis: “Even Brad Stevens couldn't come up with anything complimentary to say… He was just basically saying like, yeah, yeah, we, our front court sucks.” [10:25]

4. Front Court Rotation & Defense Scenarios [16:04 – 22:16]

• The perimeter (White, Brown, Pritchard, etc.) is solid offensively, but lack of interior defense and rebounding is a glaring issue.
• If Tillman is passable defensively, starting Nimius Queta at center becomes more viable, with Tillman or Boucher covering power forward.
• The group weighs offensive vs. defensive priorities, considering whether to start shot-blockers like Boucher or offensive bigs like Garza.

Notable Quotes

• John Karalis: “A middle of the pack defense with… an offense that’s going to be pretty good still… that’s still a potential sixth seed.” [16:22]
• Tom Westerholm (on Boucher): "For this team… you want to talk about something that if Tillman could do at any level, that would be super helpful… remember that like, three game stretch where it looked like he might make threes? If you could get a little bit of Fool’s Gold for a season, that would go a long way." [20:39]

5. Maximizing Role Players & Managing Weaknesses [22:35 – 29:19]

• Playing Keda at the rim lets him focus on what he does best—rim protection—while Tillman or Boucher do the running.
• Simplicity is key: giving players clear, focused roles increases the odds of success.
• Tom Westerholm: “So much of this season is just going to be trying to… maximize the super strengths that you can. There's going to be weaknesses and that just… is going to have to be what it is because this is a deeply, deeply imperfect basketball team.” [28:18]

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The Big Picture: Realistic Goals & The “Four Game” Theory [29:19 – End]

• How can Boston reach a 44–45 win season? It comes down to winning more of the “evenly matched” games versus other mid-tier teams—potentially by just four additional victories.
• John Karalis: “If Tillman being available and passable as a starter… helps you win four of those games… now you’re a 45 win team. That’s how I get to 45 wins with these guys.” [31:34]

Memorable Closing Metaphor

• John Karalis: “This season’s gonna be like driving an unreliable car. There’s gonna… be a lot of times you’re like, alright, I’m gonna turn this key and… see if this sucker starts.” [34:33]
• Tom Westerholm: “We’re gonna spend the whole season telling ourselves that… that’s condensation. That’s not oil.” [35:16]

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Highlighted Quotes

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|--------------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 05:37 | John Karalis | "If Xavier Tillman can be a starting power forward for the Celtics, then that snaps the entire… rotation into place." | | 07:34 | Tom Westerholm | “He’s really not that far removed from being the guy that Memphis was really upset to lose.” | | 11:17 | John Karalis | "If Tillman can come in and help… defensively, then he is worth his weight in accolades for it." | | 10:25 | John Karalis | "Even Brad Stevens couldn't come up with anything complimentary to say… He was just basically saying like, yeah, our front court sucks." | | 16:22 | John Karalis | “A middle of the pack defense with… an offense that’s going to be pretty good still… that’s still a potential sixth seed.” | | 20:39 | Tom Westerholm | "If you could get a little bit of Fool’s Gold for a season, that would go a long way." | | 28:18 | Tom Westerholm | “So much of this season is just going to be trying to… maximize the super strengths that you can.” | | 31:34 | John Karalis | "If Tillman being available and passable as a starter… helps you win four of those games… now you’re a 45 win team." | | 34:33 | John Karalis | "This season’s gonna be like driving an unreliable car… we're gonna see if this sucker starts.” | | 35:16 | Tom Westerholm | “We’re gonna spend the whole season telling ourselves that… that’s condensation. That’s not oil.” |

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Important Segment Timestamps

• [01:26] – Setting up the Celtics’ front court crisis
• [04:11] – Discussion of Tillman’s possible role and the IF of his health
• [06:21] – The ripple effect of having a reliable power forward
• [09:43] – A reality check on Tillman’s career as a starter
• [16:04] – Projecting the defense and rotation possibilities
• [22:16] – Offense vs. defense trade-offs in rotation
• [26:37] – Keeping Keda in a simplified role to maximize impact
• [29:19] – “Four games” theory for the Celtics to achieve 44–45 wins
• [34:33] – Closing car metaphors and expectations

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Conclusion

The hosts agree: The Celtics’ season hinges on maximizing the available (if flawed) bigs—especially Xavier Tillman. His surprising re-emergence as a key power forward could plug critical rotation holes, lift the team’s defense from bottom third to merely below average, and help Boston snag those crucial win margins over middling teams. But if Tillman falters, the path to respectability becomes far more daunting. The consensus? It’s a season of “making do”—and hoping that the unreliable car at least gets you to your destination more often than not.

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For more Celtics breakdowns and daily coverage, subscribe to Locked On Celtics on your favorite podcast app or YouTube.

Transcript

[John Corrales]

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[John Corrales]

The Celtics front court situation is eh. But there's one guy who might be able to snap it all into place. We'll talk about it right now on the Locked On Celtics Podcast. Huh?

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[John Corrales]

Hey there. Welcome back. Lockdown Celtics Podcast right here on the Lockdown Podcast Network where it is your team every day. Your team is the Boston Celtics. I talk about them Monday through Friday right here on any podcasting app that you use. So whichever one it is, thank you for opening it up and listening. Or if you want to watch the show, it's on YouTube. Get into the comment section there. Share your thoughts with me. I'm John Corrales, beat writer for Boston Sports Journal. I've been doing a version of this job for about 20 years now. I've also written a couple of books about the team, so go check those out. Today we're talking about the Celtics front court situation, which is their obvious weakness. But one name we have not been talking about very, very much at all. In fact, I. I barely have remembered talking about him at all. Now I know who we're talking to, and we've talked about. Talked to, to him a lot. It's Tom Westerholm. Tom, Tommy podcast. What's going on?

[Tom Westerholm]

That's me, Tom. The. The. The Tommy podcast.

[John Corrales]

I'm good, man.

[Tom Westerholm]

How are you?

[John Corrales]

Oh, I'm great. I'm great. Because we just keep, you know, tinkering around with the Boston Celtics lineups here. Later on, we'll. We'll get into some of the depth and. And you know, who might be the starting center. But I want to get into the one person we haven't talked about in all of this, and it's Xavier Tillman. Because I don't know if you. Do you remember even saying his name this summer?

[Tom Westerholm]

I mean, we were like, before we started recording, you called him Xavier McDaniels because, like, you know, that's an old.

[John Corrales]

Man knee jerk reflex. Yeah, it's. It's not the first time it's happened, and it absolutely will not be the last time. It's. It's front of mind. Like, Tillman's gonna have to do a lot more. Yeah. Passes Xavier McDaniel in my. Xavier, who I think about the most list.

[Tom Westerholm]

Well, yeah, like the. The McDaniels is the name that rolls off the tongue after you say Xavier, of course.

[John Corrales]

It's perfect.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah.

[John Corrales]

So the reason why he's such an X factor. No pun intended.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah.

[John Corrales]

Ah. So let's start with this. There are two people that we know are starters on the Celtics. Everybody else, it's all up for grabs. We know Derrick White and we know Jalen Brown. Those are the two starters. Everyone else is going to be Peyton Pritchard or Anthony Simons. There's some debate about that. Who's going to be the center? Is it Keda? Is it Boucher? Is it Garza? We can have a debate about that. Who's the four people? Talk about Sam Houser. Maybe you start Boucher in and Namish Kida. Maybe you go double big. Maybe you go with Xavier Tillman. And honestly, the more I think about it, and I'm not saying I expect Tillman to be healthy enough, I don't know what's what. The knee issue is. The fact that it recurred last season is not something that I. I am hopeful that it's gonna, you know, go away. But if the giant capital I bold italicized if. If he can be healthy and can get to Memphis Grizzlies level, where when I was there, people were like, oh, my God, you're gonna love this guy and all that stuff. And he's a nice guy and, you know, great locker room guy and family man and, you know, like, legitimate, like, loves his family, his kids are around. Like, that's just a good, solid person. But as a basketball player, can he be that starting? Can. Can he at least get into the mix? I'll throw it to you, Tom. This way, if Xavier Tillman can be a starting power forward for the Celtics, then that snaps the entire. I know it's makeshift and I'm not saying it's going to be good, but it snaps the rotation into place. What do you think?

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah, I think it. Well, for sure, right? I mean, I think starting with the premise, right? Like, let's, let's say that Xavier Tillman can, can be that. That simplifies everything enormously, right? Then, then you don't have a player, you know, kind of playing up a little bit too much. Like, I, I don't know. I, I see the argument for Sam Houser, you know, I see. I, I see it. I see what people are getting at. It's gonna be a big old challenge for Sam Houser. And, you know, I think that it really does. It's one of those ones that kind of does. I mean, honestly, when you think about, like, speed, you know, actually not that bad for, for Hauser when you, when you think about it from certain perspectives. But I do think that you're, you're really throwing in the towel on anything defensive at that point, which is going to be a huge challenge either way. But you're like, like you're not just throwing the towel away. You're, you know, putting in it, throwing, putting the towel and kind of launching it somewhere. You got one of those cannons that can reach the upper deck.

[John Corrales]

Which they need in that building, by the way, anyway.

[Tom Westerholm]

So, yeah, I think, I mean, you know, look, Tillman makes a lot of sense there. I think, you know, he's 26, which is crazy to like, to. He just seems older. You know, I think it's not just because he looks older. It's also like, you know, like you were saying, he's a, he's a family man. He's. He's a, he's a senior. You know, he seems like, seems like he should be getting, you know, like, like cheaper ice cream discount or something. But. But he's not. He's 26. He's still, you know, pretty young. He's still. He's really not that far removed from being the guy that Memphis was really upset to lose. Like, yeah, he's, he's not that far removed from that. So I do think that, I think that you're right that, like, if Tillman can, can be that player, I mean, that simplifies things a lot. You can play lineups that make more sense. You can, you know, you, you're, you start to get some stuff out of the front court that you're, that you were really worried about at the start of the summer, right? Like, you start to get some, you know, some size, some, some, Some heft, some, you know, like, yeah, you're still lacking a lot of kind of key elements that the, that the front court has had in previous years. But, you know, I mean, even like, you know, when Tillman came to the Celtics, one of the things that really made him an attractive option was the fact that he was a little bit more able to move, you know, than some guys. Like, he is, you know, he's always been kind of a guy who could kind of get side to side a little bit and, and help in the pick and roll. Like, if not every, if you don't have to play drop on every single pick and roll, that, that involves a big man. That's not, you know, that's helpful. It's helpful to be able to have some more options. And, and yes, those options, you know, for the millionth time this summer, those options are not going to be as good as they were last year, but if you can start to plug some of those gaps, that's a really good thing. So, yeah, I'm. He's an interesting, he's an interesting player that, you know, like, like you said, I really, I was honestly trying to think about it, and I don't think I've said Xavier Tillman. I've certainly have not said Xavier Tillman on this podcast since July at the, like, it's been a while. It's been a while.

[John Corrales]

It's been a long time. And, and I want to be clear, there is no great option. Like, even I think at his best, Tillman is not a starting level power forward. I don't think he's a starting level player at this point. Hey, look, he might play.

[Tom Westerholm]

Historically, he's never been one. I mean, even, even in Memphis. Like, like, you know, I was just looking at it when we were talking. The most starts he's ever had was 20, 22, 23. He had 29 starts out of 61 games. Like, that's the most he's ever had. He's never been a starting quality, like, starting caliber Player necessarily.

[John Corrales]

Right. And so having him as a regular starter starting, let's say 60 games, you're, you're looking at a front court that's less than you need it to be. Yeah. And you know, no offense to the guys that are here, but you know, I go back to the, the Brad Stevens quote where he said something along the lines like, yeah, on paper the people aren't going to look at this and say it's the best, but they're just gonna have to prove us wrong. And like it's it. Even Brad Stevens couldn't come up with anything complimentary to say. He was just basically saying like, yeah, yeah, we, our front court sucks and everybody's saying it and I can't refute it. So very Principal Skinner. Prove me wrong, kids. Prove me wrong. It's the, it's a tough situation, but Tillman presents this very obvious power forward type of player who if he is mobile enough to do things like guard a guy in the corner still have the lateral movement to come over and tag the roll man.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah.

[John Corrales]

On a pick and roll. And for people who don't, you're just coming over and slowing that you're disrupting the timing of a pick and roll. When the center is up, playing up higher and you come over and tag literally like kind of touch the roll guy just to kind of disrupt the timing and show the point guard like there's a defender there and then still get out to the corner in enough time where. Because normally what's going to happen is the pass is going to go out to the corner. If you can come tag the roll man and get out to the corner defensively and contest the three or run the guy off the line. That is a massive, massive help defensively. This is the Celtics major weakness this year is front court defense. That's going to be a problem. If Tillman can come in and, and help that in anyway, then he is worth his weight in accolades for it. And not. That doesn't come out exactly the way I wanted it to, but he, he, he will be worth it. Let's, let's continue that and we'll talk about who might start at center. Now if he's able to do this, we're basically going best case scenario because Tillman being able to start is I think the ultimate best case scenario. So we don't need to do the downside. We know what the downsides are. Let's see if we can get to the best case scenario.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah. Yeah.

[John Corrales]

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Get more than just savings. Get more with Geico. Hey, thanks for making Lockdown Celtics your first listen every day. If you missed yesterday's podcast, it was a reaction to the top 100. The locked on top 100 is here voted on by NBA, locked on NBA Hosts and Locked on podcast network. Our top 100 was formed by the experts that cover these teams and players every day. You can file the full find the full list on Lockdown Sports Today on YouTube. Wherever you get your podcast, you if you missed it. My reaction show to this was yesterday it was animated because I did not like the results. Let's get back to the conversation here with Tom Wesley where Tom. Look, the, the. I left it as. I don't expect. I don't really expect Tillman to do a lot, but we know that the perimeter is going to be fine for the Celtics, right? You get Derrick White, Jalen Brown, Peyton Pritchard, Anthony Simons, Sam Houser. There's gonna be, there's gonna be points.

[Tom Westerholm]

There's options there. Yeah, for sure. Those are all good basketball players. Like they're good basketball, good NBA players. To be clear, Xavier Tillman is a great basketball player. Those are all good NBA players.

[John Corrales]

That's right. So this Celtics team is going to be. It's missing front court defense. It's missing the rebounding. We know that perimeter defense is. You can't do anything, can't touch anybody. So there's going to be a need for some help back there. If Tillman can do the stuff I said before, if he can be part of effective pick and roll coverage, doesn't have to be great effective pick and roll coverage then now the Celtics is like, okay, it's. It's the defense that I'm thinking is going to be like at least bottom third in the league. Maybe it can climb to middle of the pack and a middle of the pack defense with I think an offense that's going to be pretty good still. Well, that, that's still a potential succeed. You know what I mean? Like that's still in the East. That's still a team that can maybe finish the season with 43, 44 wins and put them, put yourself. It's a winning season and you put yourself in a position to get a six, a seventh, an eighth seed, not. I don't want to be in the plan, but regardless, you can know what I'm saying?

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah. I think a really good season is avoiding the play in and being above.500. That's like.

[John Corrales]

Right.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah.

[John Corrales]

So if Tillman can do that, then great. And I know it's gigantic if like I said before, but if he does well then now the notion I think of starting Nimius Kada, I think it's a little bit better because now he can be a little bit more of a roamer. He can be a little bit, you know, you can use his height and shop blocking ability. You can kind of start to play a little bit of the defense that you did over the past couple of seasons. It's not going to be great. It's. It's still going to have problems. But Okay, I can see Keita starting and then Boucher off the bench, Garza coming in off the. Now you've got an offensive player in Garza with some level of a shot blocker in Boucher. You, you can now mix and match a little bit. And you don't have to worry about Garza not being a defender because you have an extra power forward in Tillman that you can throw in there. And you can. If, if Keda and Boucher are your shot blockers, Cata more because he's seven foot tall, then, then I think that that mitigates the deficit, the offense, like, it mitigates the defensive deficiency of Garza. And you don't have to worry too much about the offense from Tillman. Follow me on that one.

[Tom Westerholm]

I'm with. I'm, I'm following you, I think. And I mean, there's something, look, there's, there's stuff to that. It's, it's. I, I don't want to, like. You're not overstating the, the positivity here, to be clear. I, I don't want to continue along too positive about it because I don't want to like, oversell, you know, what we're talking about here because again, like you said, we're talking about trying to get somewhere closer to middle of the pack on defense, which I think is a really tall task for, for this roster. Even if Tillman is everything that we're hoping for. I think that there's a lot. I think it's a very tall task because a big part of the problem, right, is like, it's not just the big men that are the issue. It's also there's going to be holes on the perimeter too, which is.

[John Corrales]

Right.

[Tom Westerholm]

Extra problematic, I think. I think Tillman helps. I think you're right that, that it would allow Kada to be a little bit more of a Roamer. I think, you know, I think the, the Boucher thing is interesting because he can block shots and he also can, like, you know, hoist threes. Right? And I think that, like, for this team, you know, people, people have criticized the Celtics for hoisting a lot of threes. You want, like, this is a team that needs a great equalizer. Like, they need to be hoisting, they need to be chucking up three pointers. So, like, you know, you want to talk about something that if Tillman can do at any level, that would be super helpful would be. You remember that like, three game stretch where it looked like he might make three?

[John Corrales]

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[Tom Westerholm]

Like, it was like very much Fool's Gold, but if you could get a little bit of Fool's gold for, for a season, oh, boy, that would go a long way. So. No, I mean, I, I, I think I, I'm interested in Boucher from that perspective, from the offensive side just of that, like, you know, hey, I don't know, can you shoot like, right, right now he shoots like, you know, three or four a game. Can you shoot five or six and stay somewhere close to 36%? Because if you can, I think, I think at that point it's kind of tough to keep a guy like that off the floor, you know, on a team that's, that's going to have some holes on it. So I look at it from that perspective, but I think that you're right that, like, you know, having that extra size with Keda and having, having just that guy, I mean, he is, he is a large man, right? So, like, if you've got, if you're able to kind of COVID the corners, if you're able to, you know, just kind of gum things up a little bit up top. Even if Keda isn't the best defender in the world, just having that deterrent in there matters. And that's, you know, that's, that's more like you said, that's more than you can say for Boucher. It's more than you can say for certainly, certainly a lot more than you can say for Garza. So I don't know. Those are the things I kind of toggle back and forth on in terms of starting is like, I mean, you know, which, which side of the floor are you more concerned about? I, I feel like either one is valid. There's going to be big defensive concerns. There's going to be. But also, like, I don't know, do you want to make your, your strength, like your offensive strength, a super strength, like, have Boucher launch threes? I don't know. I could see it both ways.

[John Corrales]

When we come back, I'll, I'll explain why Tillman, Tillman being available as a power forward makes, makes it easier, I think for Keda defensively, I think, I think it would maximize what Keda can be defensively.

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[John Corrales]

Thank you for making Lockdown Celtics your first listen every day. Lockdown NBA Lockdown NBA game night. Make that feed your second Check that second. After you're done with Lockdown Celtics, this is your first listen. Lockdown NBA game night. I'm going to be there on Friday nights. On Friday during the day, we record on Thursday nights, me and Jake Madison. And then Lockdown NBA during the day, it's covering the big stories during the, during the season, Jake and I cover the games at night. So just Lockdown NBA feed two podcasts there. Check that out after you're done with this show. So I think Keda, my, my biggest problem with Keda is you can't move him around too, too much on the floor, right? I think he, you got to make sure that he's just in this, in that, in the paint. Like he, he can't be out on the perimeter too much to have. Like if Tillman is an option and you, you constantly have a Tillman or Boucher out there with, with K. Like I don't think you can put Garza out there with K too much, right? I think, I think Garza at least is more mobile. You can, you can play around with the, the mobility and, and, and go small, whatever, but I don't want K to do too much so to maximize him and keep him around the rim and have him be like a instinctive help defender, shot blocker. You need that depth. You need that big man depth that Tillman is going to give you. And again, to be clear, my best case scenario here is still, it's still going to be like a middle of the pack defense. But I'm heading into the season thinking this defense is going to be awful. So I think, I think with if Tillman's there to handle a lot of that running around, or Boucher is there to handle a lot of that running around. And, and Keda is just kind of there like at the block and just doing that little dance where you're like, oh, I'm gonna take my foot out of the paint, put it back in the paint. One foot in, one foot out, and do the hokey pokey. That, that's. If Kate is just doing that the whole game, then he can get in there and at least be a seven footer with long arms. And I don't, I don't necessarily love his mobility. I'm not sure about his decision making. It's. It's probably. It's gotten a little bit better, but I still want to see it at NBA speed. Eurobasket was, you know, somewhat encouraging. I want to see it at NBA speed now to maximize him and kind of hide his limitations. I think it'd just be so huge to have that one extra guy. You now have two solid power forwards to throw out there with, you know, Keda at different times. That, that just. It, it. You're not asking too much of Keda, and if you're not asking too much of Keda, then I think you can get a really good year out of him.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah, I mean, look, I think simplifying the game, right, it just, it makes it. If you, if you can simplify the game for a player, it does increase the chances that they're going to succeed, right? Because if you can focus on, you know, one or two things, if you can focus on, you know, two or three, whatever it is, very specific things. And you, you. It's all about knowing your role. Right. A player like Keda has had, you know, like a turbulent NBA career. You know, like, he's trying to do a lot of different things, like try to be in a lot of different places. If you can kind of say, like, okay, listen, here are the things. These are the things. And you know, he's also going to have a lot of freedom this year too. Right? Like, this is going to. Like, he, he's never had an opportunity like this to play a ton of minutes and, and, and to just kind of be a huge part of a team. Like, he's never been in this position before, so to kind of give him some parameters and some freedom at the same time. I think, you know. Yeah. That that could make a big difference for him. I, I'm. I think you and I are very aligned on what we expect and like, where we kind of like where our hopes are for Kada? Yeah, you know, I mean I'm not, I have nothing against the guy at all. No, I think he's, I think he's a fine, you know, lower level second, more like a third kind of tier center. Right? Like, like I think on a normal team that's where I would feel comfortable having him. I have no problem having him be, you know, the backup to the backup or you know, the, the second backup if you're primary center is injured. So like I think we're very much aligned on, on what we think of Keda but I think that to a lot of this season, right, it's just going to be like looking at players trying to maximize, trying to like more so than trying to minimize weaknesses because this team is going to have weaknesses. I think so much of this season is just going to be trying to like maximize the super strengths that you can. Right? Like, like okay, what is Peyton Pritchard really good at? Let's give Peyton Pritchard a chance to do the things that Peyton Pritchard is really good at and just hope for the best, you know. And I think the same thing is true of the bigs, right? You look at Keda, it's like, okay, what are the things that Keda can do really well? He's very big. You know, he's able to, he's able to play around the rim a lot. Let's maximize the things that Kata can do. Let's, let's put him in the right positions and there's going to be weaknesses and that's just going to, is going to have to be what it is because this is a deeply, deeply imperfect basketball team and you just got to kind of do your best with it. And you know, I mean these are all NBA players. Like they all have, they're all here for a reason. So try to maximize those reasons as much as you can. And I think that's kind of what you're getting at, right is like, yeah, that's, you know, that's what you want to see from Kata this season.

[John Corrales]

I'll wrap it up saying this. If we're looking at a 40 something win team where, how do you, how do you get to a point where you're a couple of games above.500? You know, how do you get to 44 and 38? You know, how do you get to that level? Because that's what the Pistons were and they were the succeed last season.

[Tom Westerholm]

Right?

[John Corrales]

Right. How, how do you get there? Okay, the Celtics are not going to be as good as the best Teams in the league, best teams in the East. Right. So I'm going to just. They'll, they'll beat, I assume they're going to beat Cleveland once, you know, let's just say. But they're not as good as Cleveland, right? They're not as good as New York now. They're not as good as the best teams. They're not as bad as the bad teams. So they should beat Washington and Brooklyn and Toronto. Most of the time it's those evenly matched games that the, these things that we're talking about are going to matter. That's where a surprisingly good season, 44, 45 wins happens. Or a little bit of a disappointing season, 40 wins, 39 wins happens. And that'll still be enough probably to put you in the plan, which is exactly where I don't want them to be. But these things, the Tillman thing, all of these things to me that wins you more of those games against the evenly matched teams than, than not. So if, if we split it up and we say, you know, 20, you know, 25 games against the good teams, 25 games against the bad teams, and 32 games against the middle of the pack. Okay, so we'll say 25 and 25. We'll just, you know, to make it easier. 500 team, can you win? So 16, you know, can you win more than 16 of those games against the evenly matched teams? I think Tillman being available and passable as a starter, maybe that helps you win four of those games and you win 20 of those and now you're a 45 win team. That's how I get to 45 wins with these guys. That's where I think they make a difference beating some of these middle of the pack teams. Those 50, 50 games, you win four more than, you know, that 500 mark you're in, that's, that's a season where you look at and go, wow, 45 wins for this team is, is pretty damn good. And by then who knows what happens in the playoffs. But that, that's where I, that's where all of this is going for me.

[Tom Westerholm]

I think that's, I think that's a lofty but achievable hope for this team. Like, that's like again, this case scenario.

[John Corrales]

I think that's the best case scenario.

[Tom Westerholm]

I think that is a literal, that is literally the best case scenario. Yeah, right.

[John Corrales]

I'm not looking at a 50 win team. I'm not, I'm not pie in the sky here. I'm not sitting there being like, oh, My God, they're gonna get the 50 wins you just watched. They're gonna get the fourth seed, and Jason Tatum's gonna come back and they're gonna make a run. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Okay. I am arguing for Xavier Tillman to be your starting power forward. That's not the hallmark of an elite team. Okay? But on this team, with this roster construction, with who they have there, with, with Kada as a guy you're going to rely on as, as the center man, that's going to be very helpful. And again, four games. There's four games there that. If those go Boston's way and everything else goes the way we expect it to, that's going to be a 45 win season. That's. To me, it just boils down to four games. And so I think, can, can you win those four games? And, and maybe Tillman is enough and maybe he's not. And maybe in. Just put it, you know, wrap it up, bow on this. If he can't play, then forget those four games. Forget the 16. Then, then it get. It gets problematic because then, you know, you're gonna maybe have to start Boucher. Now. You don't have another option, a power forward option off the bench now. You have to start mixing and rotating guys are gonna have to play up. And now you're gonna have to mess with Hauser. If Tillman steps up now, Hauser's a little bit more in his normal role. Like the. There's a lot that happens when I said earlier, it snaps things into, into place. There are a lot of guys who can just play a more natural position. If Tillman is there to eat up 24 minutes at power forward, that. That's, that's what it is.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah. Which could be done on or off the bench, but either way.

[John Corrales]

Well, yeah, right. And, and sure. Just. Just play. That's all.

[Tom Westerholm]

Just.

[John Corrales]

Can you give us something? All right, the theme of the Boston.

[Tom Westerholm]

Celtics of 20, 20, 25, 2026. Can you just. Can you just give us something?

[John Corrales]

Yes. Yeah. This. This season's gonna be like driving an unreliable car. There's gonna just be a whole lot of times you're like, all right, I'm gonna turn this key and we're gonna see. We're gonna see if this sucker starts.

[Tom Westerholm]

Or I. I feel that there's something wrong. And please just don't let it be the transmission. That's all I'm asking.

[John Corrales]

Yeah.

[Tom Westerholm]

Yeah.

[John Corrales]

Like, this is, this is something like, I've done a lot in my life, you know, you park your car or you move it onto this, like, the street or something like that. You just look in the driveway. Every time you look in the driveway, you're like, are there any new spots there? Are there any new.

[Tom Westerholm]

Is there any oil?

[John Corrales]

Is that oil?

[Tom Westerholm]

Is that.

[John Corrales]

Is that the. That's probably. That's oil. Ah, crap. You know, like, that kind of stuff.

[Tom Westerholm]

We're gonna spend the whole season telling ourselves that it's. That's condensation. That's not oil. It's kind of.

[John Corrales]

Right, right, right, right. That's right. That's right. People know. All right, Tom. Appreciate you, man. Appreciate you, and I appreciate all of you. Every day is here with me and Tom. But me, I'm here every Monday through Friday. So here with me Monday through Friday. I do appreciate you being here. I know that the off season, it can be a little bit of a struggle with, you know, there's. And Patriots are back, football's back, baseball's heading into the playoffs. I know there's things to distract you, but I'm still here five days a week if you want to get a little bit of a Celtics fix. It's still here. We're still here. Once the season goes, it might be six days, might be seven days a week. So make sure you are subscribed podcast after every game. So subscribe wherever you get your podcast. Watch the show on YouTube, get into the comment section, share your thoughts with me and fellow Celtics fans, and then share the podcast. Tell everybody they should be listening to and watching the Lockdown Celtics podcast here on the Lockdown podcast network. It's your team every day.

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[Tom Westerholm]

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[Tom Westerholm]

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[Tom Westerholm]

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