Jaylen Brown's CONFUSING memory of early benching | Boston's offseason approach

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Locked On Celtics

Episode: Jaylen Brown's CONFUSING memory of early benching | Boston's offseason approach

Date: May 14, 2026
Host: John Karalis (with guest Tom Westerholm)

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on Jaylen Brown’s recent podcast comments describing his 2018-19 benching in Boston—a story Karalis and Westerholm believe is dramatically misremembered. The hosts clarify the actual events, discuss Brown’s tendency to reframe narratives for motivation, and analyze how this public revisionism may (or may not) affect his relationship with the Celtics and the team’s offseason blueprint.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Setting the Scene: Jaylen Brown’s Story vs. Reality

• Jaylen’s claim: On another podcast, Brown said he was benched in favor of Gordon Hayward in 2018-19, Brad Stevens “favored” Hayward, and only a fan petition forced him back into the starting lineup, which (he claims) “set his development back.”
• Karalis & Westerholm’s correction:
  • Brown started the first 19 games of that season before missing three (likely due to injury). Afterward, his starts became spotty, but Hayward actually didn't consistently start either and was not the main reason Brown was benched.
  • Playoff lineups did not favor Hayward and, crucially, fan petitions had zero real organizational impact.
  • The only petition they found (“We need Jaylen Brown back in the starting lineup”) had 12 signatures ([05:22]).

Notable Quote

“A petition... had 12 supporters... The Boston organization is never going to listen... They're not going to listen to you for their starting lineup decisions. That's just not how any of this works.”
— Tom Westerholm ([12:03])

Analyzing Jaylen’s Motivation and Memory

• The hosts don’t attack Brown for misremembering but are perplexed by his confident public retelling, which casts him as overcoming adversity that didn't really exist in that way.
• Karalis suggests Brown’s version seems “very self-serving” and tailored to make him look better, possibly due to his well-known need for motivational fuel:

  “He has twisted that situation into something that he has used for motivation.” — John Karalis ([08:07])

• Westerholm highlights Brown’s and others’ tendency to deflect responsibility onto Hayward, when the lineup changes really stemmed from injuries and an overloaded, splintered roster.
• Both hosts differentiate between using perceived slights as motivation (something they respect) and rewriting history.
• They also raise the role of podcasting culture: offhand comments now get amplified and clipped for social media, regardless of accuracy.

“Fans forced the change” — The Mandela Effect in Sports Memories

• Brown’s narrative (Petitions, winning back the fans with flashy dunks, being “unfairly” benched) is dissected:
  • The “petition forced the coaching staff” is described as “Berenstain Bears” (Mandela Effect) logic.
  • Karalis: “Danny Ainge... is going to be, oh, God, people signed a petition? If anything... he'd do the opposite.” ([24:43])
  • Even myths fans remember (like Brown being booed at the draft) have nuanced realities—fans were booing the lack of a Jimmy Butler trade, not Brown himself ([27:59]).

Notable Quote

“Everything, every detail in that story enhances his public persona... This is a story about me, and I'm going to make myself look good.”
— John Karalis ([22:27])

Is Jaylen Brown Positioning to Leave Boston?

• The hosts debate: Are these comments a veiled trade request or just media banter?
• Both agree: No “trade request energy” here—a misalignment in perspective, yes, but not a campaign to force an exit.
• “Something doesn't quite feel right,” says Westerholm, but sees this more as part of ongoing superstar/organization tension than a precursor to a major move ([32:45]).

Offseason Implications & Celtics’ Approach

• With few superstar trade options (Giannis, Donovan Mitchell, maybe Devin Booker), Karalis sees no realistic scenario or return that makes sense for moving Brown.
• The most plausible path: Keeping the core and using the traded player and mid-level exceptions (TPE) to add 1-2 rotation players of significance rather than making drastic changes ([38:47]).
• The episode ends with emphasis on patience—see what next year’s Tatum/Brown/Jrue/Porzingis core can do before big moves.

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Memorable Moments & Quotes

• On sports revisionism:

  “He remembers it a certain way. And everything... enhances his public persona.”
  — Karalis ([22:27])

• On the “petition” myth:

  “If this petition hits 12, our hands are tied.”
  — Westerholm ([24:40])

• On Danny Ainge reacting to fans:

  “If anything... he'd do the opposite of what this petition says just to prove a point.”
  — Karalis ([24:43])

• On Jalen Brown’s sensitivity:

  “He is a sensitive guy... all of his actions tell you that he's sensitive.”
  — Karalis ([21:31])

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Key Timestamps

Jaylen’s Story vs. Actual History

• [02:53] – Recap of what Brown said on the NBPA podcast
• [04:00-05:22] – Karalis/Westerholm detail the real lineup chronology
• [05:22] – The 12-signature petition uncovered

Breaking Down the Motivation

• [08:07-09:05] – Jaylen’s tendency to reshape past events for motivation
• [10:22] – The actual reason for Brown’s return to the lineup: injuries, not Hayward

The Idea of Public Narrative

• [12:03-13:05] – Fan petitions have zero sway in NBA decisions
• [17:24-18:06] – The context of that “fractured” 2018-19 Celtics locker room

Was This a Trade Tease?

• [32:45-34:27] – Is Brown “angling” to leave? Both hosts say no, but note some general misalignment

Offseason Outlook

• [35:53-41:21] – Discussing possible but highly unlikely blockbuster trades, more realistic plan for summer

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Tone & Closing Thoughts

The episode balances respectful skepticism of Brown’s story with appreciation for his competitive fire and impact on the Celtics. Karalis and Westerholm, both credentialed insiders, combine dry humor (“If this petition hits 12, our hands are tied”) with nuanced analysis, repeatedly urging listeners not to fall for aggregated headlines or simplistic narratives.

Bottom Line:
Jaylen Brown’s heroic, fan-against-the-world retelling of his 2018-19 benching is more fiction than fact—but, for now, it’s just another chapter in the always-complicated NBA star journey. The Celtics’ offseason is more likely to be about savvy “addition to the core” than seismic change.

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For more in-depth Celtics coverage and daily analysis, subscribe to Locked On Celtics with John Karalis on your favorite podcast platform.

Transcript

[A]

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[A]

Jaylen Brown shows up on a podcast, tries to make a point, and gets just about every detail wrong. Which raises. What is he doing? Locked on Selfish pod. Hey, welcome back to the show. I'm John Corrales. Coming up later, we'll get into Brad Stevens. We're gonna, we're gonna start really focusing on the off season, the, the road map, the blueprint, however you want to call that. That's coming up later on. But first, we're going to start with Jalen Brown, who was on the, the, I guess the National Basketball Players association, which he's the vice president, did a podcast and he was recalling a, a scenario from the 2018-19 season. And man, he just got the whole thing wrong. So let's, let's bring in Tom Westerholm Thomas, everybody, by the way.

[B]

Thank you, thank you, thank you. I'm here to, I'm here to get things right.

[A]

Yes. We're gonna set the record straight. I just, I'm, I'm Tom, I'm just like confused here. I really am confused. So let's, let's set the, the stage for. It's, it's some NBA Pennsylvania thing. It's him. It's Grant Williams.

[B]

Yeah. Can I, before we get in too far into this, can I say on precisely the wrong forum, there's too many podcasts. Yes,

[A]

I know.

[B]

Podcasts, guys.

[A]

There's too many of them. There are a lot. There are a lot of them. Yes. And, you know, listen, fine. You know what? There's a natural selection that's going to happen at some point.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So Jalen in the Now, I admit I have not listened to the whole thing.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

But I listened, I started to listen to it. I got through, like some of the officiating stuff and everything. It's just. It was hard because I normally listen to podcasts, like in my car or it was on YouTube. I couldn't find it anywhere else. So it's hard to play a YouTube video through the car. Yeah, for me anyway, as an old person, it's hard to do that and get through everything while you're driving places. So just kind of didn't get through everything. But I saw the clips that are circulating and Jalen's talking about how he was in 2018-19, he was benched and how Brad Stevens favored Gordon Hayward over him. And he had to get a petition to. You know, it put the pressure. He put the pressure on the front office that people started a petition and it's because of the petition that the Celtics had to start him again. And Tom, none of that is actually how it went. So. Yeah, you. You. Can I. Can I set the scenario here before we start reacting? Please, Real quick, please. In 2018-19, this was the year after Gordon Hayward's injury. Okay. Jalen was in his third season in the league. Okay. A 22 year old. He started 70 games the year before, partly because of the Gordon Hayward injury and all of that. So he started the first 19 games of the season and then he. Inactive for three games, I'm assuming an injury. I don't know what that was. And then he didn't start after that except for spotted spot starts. And then in the playoffs, he started again. The notion that Brad Stevens favored Gordon Hayward is incorrect because Gordon Hayward started the first 15 games and then only started 1, 2, 3 the rest of the way, including none, none in the playoffs. So he never. Brad Stevens never favored Gordon Hayward necessarily in that way, the way Jalen was saying it. And to your credit, this is. You found the petition.

[B]

Let's be abundantly clear. I found a petition.

[A]

A petition. So there's one petition from March of 2019. That's right. So the issue, we need Jaylen Brown back in the starting lineup. Sign this so Celtics fans and staff will see this. I don't know how many petitions there might have been. This is one. If there are others, please put them in the comments. This is a change.org petition. Yeah, it had 12 supporters. 12 people signed this particular petition. Is there more than one petition out there? I don't know. Maybe there is. Hard to say. This is the one that was. That we could find or Tom found to give you proper credit.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Thank you. So listen, let me say this up front. I do not have the best memory in the world. I, I, I can admit like I don't remember certain things from earlier today. Remember things from a few days ago like certain so look, I not gonna, I'm not gonna get on a guy for misremembering how certain things went but for Jaylen to go on a podcast, state this as fact and to just kind of like I don't know man, like it, it gives off a what what are you doing? Vibe because this is a very kind of self serving kind because he said this set my development back.

[B]

Yeah, it's like

[A]

did it because I, I'm, I don't know how a finals MVP and multiple time after this year, multiple time all NBA guy. Like how did that season set your development back when you're this player now? Like are you saying that that's, you could be even better but that season kind of held you back?

[B]

I'm just, that's 100, I think that's 100% what he's saying. Right? Like that's what it sounds like.

[A]

That's what it sounds like. I just don't know what he's doing and I've, I've been 100% on Jaylen Brown's side but I just don't understand what, what this accomplishes because it just feels very self serving and all of the details are wrong in a way that makes himself look better and I want to give him the benefit of the doubt, just be like I, I, he just misremembered. I want that to be the case because I don't, I don't like what the opposite of that is. Which means he's, he's somehow intentionally misremembering or, or more likely. I'm going to let you talk to him, I swear.

[B]

Yeah, you're good.

[A]

That because Jalen is constantly looking for motivation and needs to twist situations and into the way that helps him find that motivation in the, in whatever way possible. I kind of feel like the, the thing that's happening here is that he has, he has twisted that situation into something that he has used for motivation, which is great and he has driven him to become a great player, which is great. But now he's going back and he's remembering the version in his head that he thought happened and it's not jiving with what actually happened. And it's kind of like one of the pitfalls of someone, as Joe Missoula has said, who credits Jalen for, he can, he can get into a dark place mentally. I feel like this is like Jalen it's almost like he had a dream and he's remembering the dream versus what actually happened.

[B]

Yeah. So a couple things that I think let's. So I'm gonna shout out, you know, masslive.com Brian. Brian. Rob transcribed some of this, right? And I think it's worth, like, okay, here's exactly what Jalen said, right? They decided to move me to the bench, which was understandable. You got guys making 30 million or whatever, but as a 20 year old who is extremely talented, it slowed down my development. So right there, right, we've got. You've got guys making 30 million or whatever, and he calls that understandable. Now, again, I think it's really clear to note and this is something that, like, you know, Terry Rosier, again, these. I think Gordon Hayward. I don't have strong feelings about Gordon Hayward as a, as a person, as an individual. Right. Like, I didn't. He was not a super interactive guy. You didn't talk to him and come away like, wow, what an electric personality. Right? He seemed fine, like, but like, I think he has taken some unbelievable strays from, from that team, right? You look at your Terry Rosiers, you know, like, like Jalen here, these, these strays that Gordon Hayward is taking just unearned. Like, why, why, why are people still crapping on Gordon Hayward for that season? Like you said, he wasn't the reason Jalen was coming off the bench. It was Marcus Smart. Marcus Smart was the one who suffered an injury which then got Jalen back into the starting lineup.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Down, like, I think very late in the season. So. All right, continuing with, with B. Rob's transcription here, right now I'm getting criticized for not working on my game. I don't think that happened again. Like, I know we're like, we're talking about things that.

[A]

I don't remember that happening.

[B]

I don't remember that happening. And it probably did on social media to some degree. And I think that when you talk about him kind of conflating things, right. I think that, you know, now I'm getting criticized for not working on my game. Well, okay, like, maybe some fans, right? Yeah, I guess I'm getting criticized for not being ready for my opportunity. Again, I don't think that happened. The reality was we had a stacked deck and it was too much responsibility for everybody to equally share. What I did was like. And then he goes on to talk about how, like, he won over fans by windmilling dunks and like, look, I mean, everybody did love a good Jalen Brown dunk. But like, just not the narrative of that season that I remember from having been up close. Like, you were very up close to that season. We were.

[A]

We were at Mass Live together at that.

[B]

We were right there in that locker room and everything else. Right. I, you know, the fan, why is this kid not playing more? They start asking the questions and then it's in Boston. What ended up happening. This is like a forgotten moment in time. I would. Forgotten is like forgotten in the way, like, this is like a real Berenstain Bears, Berenstein Bears kind of situation. Right. The Mandela effect or whatever like this is. They ended up having to petition the fans to put Jalen back in the starting lineup. That eventually made the Celtics put me back in the starting lineup. Not because I feel like they wanted to. Now, I think that last phrase is really. Not because I feel like they wanted to. Like, he is saying. Yeah, he's either saying one of two things happened and one is more insane than the other. Right. He's saying he forced them to get him back in the starting lineup because he was playing well. And that's not correct. But, like, if you need to phrase it that way, fine. Right. I. I mean, he was back in the starting lineup because there were injuries that season. Or he's saying that a Change.org petition or another petition that I haven't been able to find with 12 signatures forced the Celtics to put him back in the starting lineup, which, I'm sorry, The. The Boston's organization is never going to listen. They love you guys, right? The fans out there. They love you guys. They're not going to listen to you for their starting lineup decisions. That's just not how any of this works. So, yeah, it's a. I don't know, man. It.

[A]

Let's. Let's dive into. Let's continue the conversation here because it's. I just. Let's just. I'm so flummoxed. I've been using the word flummox a lot lately.

[B]

Let's.

[A]

Let's pick this back up when we come back. Today's show is brought to you by Five Hour Energy. If you've got a sweet tooth, that 5. Five Hour Energy has the perfect tweet. Perfect treat, not tweet. Well, maybe they have some good tweets, but the perfect treat is the Fruity Rainbow five Hour Energy. That shot brings back nostalgic flavor in a whole new way. Fruity Rainbow 5 hour energy shots treat your taste buds to an explosion of fruity flavor with a tasty caffeine kick. It's quick. It's easy to satisfy sweet cravings while keeping things simple and on the go. Zero sugar is important because it's sweet tooth approved. Without wearing at that sweet tooth and making your dentist a little extra money, it's very convenient. You throw just grab a hand. You can grab a handful of those, throw them into a work bag and when you need one, it's right there. Boom. Get a nice little pick me up. It's a go to when I need something sweet and a little kick that tasty caffeine kick without going overboard. Get candy flavored Chaos with fruity rainbow 5 Hour Energy shots available online at 5 Hour Energy, the number 5 hourenergy.com or on Amazon. Today's show is also brought to you by Wayfair. Your outdoor space should feel like you. It's one of those spots you keep meaning to fix up but never quite got around to. That's where Wayfair comes in. They make it easy to find that match and so it fits the vibe that you want. So whatever your price point, whatever your style, you're going to find something that fits your budget, your lifestyle, what you like, something that you and your partner can agree on. I know my wife and I go back and forth sometimes, but eventually it's like a big negotiation. How about this one? No? How about this one? How about this one? How about the very easy to share all the links and narrow it down to get everything in one place. With thousands of verified reviews, you feel confident in what you're getting. And now the space feels put together somewhere. You want to sit, relax and spend some time, maybe do a podcast, get prepped for patio season for way less. Head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. That's w a y far.com Wayfair Every style every home. Thank you for making Lockdown Celtics your first listen every day. Joining me Monday through Friday. Got bonus podcasts every once in a while during the week when they play on weekends. When the season kicks back up, I will be doing that as well. I'm John Corrales. I cover the Celtics for Sports illustrated Celtics on SI. I've been covering the team for 20 years. I've been doing this podcast for 10. So thank you for being with me for all of that and being an every dayer. Let's get back to this conversation, the confusing conversation. Jaylen Brown look. So I remember that season. I remember that they need look they needed Gordon Hayward. They needed to for for that team to be its absolute Best. They needed Gordon Hayward to kind of find his way. They had Hayward and Brown coming off the bench. That was Shimmy Ojale, Daniel Tice. Yabu was there.

[B]

Marcus Smart, Paper on paper. That team. Goodness, yeah.

[A]

Like Terry Rosier, Jason Tatum, Marcus Morris, Al Horford, Marcus Smart. That's Rosier. Had a great season. He had a great playoff run the year before. He, he was not, I want to say a great season, but, but it

[B]

was, compared to the rest of his seasons, it was pretty great.

[A]

And I get it. This was the year that, that Rosier and Jalen, I think we, we knew at the end, like, the, the young guys. This was the, the young guys kind of see where, where it was Kyrie and like, they, they were just trying to kind of like the, the locker room was kind of splintered. Right? Was. This was the season where the Celtics swept Indiana. They beat Milwaukee in the first round. You're like, oh. And the first, in the first game, you're like, oh. And then it just all fell apart, and Kyrie was guarding Giannis and all that stuff. That was, that was this mess of a season.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So I understand it was fractured. I understand that Jalen wasn't happy. I think we kind of knew that Jalen wasn't exactly thrilled with his role, but I, I, I, I don't know that this, this way that he remembers it, like, I, I think he remembers being upset. I think he remembers people being upset at Gordon Hayward. The, the notion that Brad favored Gordon Hayward for all of the stuff that he mentioned out there, like the Butler connection and all that. I think he, I think Brad was just like, we need, we're not going anywhere if Gordon Hayward can't get up to speed.

[B]

Correct.

[A]

I mentioned this in the podcast with Sean Grandy. It was almost like the Vic situation this season, where you're like, oh, man, we got to get this guy up to speed, because if we do and he's good, then, hey, we got a chance to make some noise. If we don't, then it's going to get, it's going to get ugly fast. And it got ugly fast for the Celtics. So I don't know. I guess, I guess. Is this, Is this just Jalen? I don't know. I go back to the question of what's Jalen doing? Is he, is. I don't want, I don't want to think. I don't think that he's maneuvering. I don't think he's sitting there being, like, trying to find a way out. You can find A way out in a different way. Is this. Is this him kind of letting people know that he's had frustrations with the. With Brad in the past? He said he had a good relationship with Brad. I don't know. I don't know what this is other than. I think Jalen's just. I think Jalen's feeling himself. He is. He's. He's kind of like, coming off the. His favorite season and all of that. And I think. I think I go back to my earlier point of. I think he's. He's used so much. He's twisted so much that I don't know that he has a full grasp on how. What the reality of things were, you know, back then.

[B]

Yeah. So, I mean, how long are Jalen's twitch streams, right? Like an hour, Hour or two, maybe.

[A]

Watch the whole thing.

[B]

Yeah, I also can't watch the whole thing. I have a family. Right. So, like. Like, Jalen's twitch streams are very long, right. And he spends a lot of time just kind of. Gavin. Right. Like, and that's like. That's what podcasting is, right? You're just. You're just, you know, yap it into a microphone. Right?

[A]

Right.

[B]

And I wonder if. If some of this is just kind of like, you know, you. You just kind of get comfortable talking. You know, you kind of get comfortable, like, just kind of saying stuff. And because. Because some of this feels like you're just kind of like, yeah, here's some. Some stuff that I think. And, like, I don't know, man. Like, as somebody who regularly comes on a podcast, like, yeah, sometimes. Sometimes you just kind of say stuff, right? You're not. You're not. It's not like, the most fully, like, this point that I'm making right here. Right? It's not the most fully formed thought that comes out. And then, you know, you might conflate some things. You might. You might kind of, like, pull some things from here and there. I almost wonder if it's like, something with that, right? Where it's like, you got really comfortable just kind of talking on the Internet, and here you are on a podcast just kind of talking on the Internet. But the thing about a podcast is that it gets clipped, right? The thing about a podcast is that you have a. A producer who goes through and takes out the notable moments, and a producer who heard this moment and was like, bingo, let me write down 1835. I'm gonna put that on the Internet. You know, Like, I kind of wonder if that was. If that's Part of it, because it would be weird for him to, in one, you know, in one situation, say, I have a great relationship with Brad. I love Boston, all this stuff. And then, you know, like, I don't think he's bouncing back and forth and sort of like, no, I have a great relationship with Boston and Brad. I want out. No, I want, like, I don't think that's what's happening here. That wouldn't make a lot of sense. So I, I kind of wonder if it's just sometimes you get on a roll when you're talking.

[A]

I, I, the more I think about it, the more I settle at that. He's. Look, Jalen. Jalen is a sensitive guy. He may, he may disagree, but he's a sensitive guy because he, he is trying to, you know, all of his actions tell you that he's sensitive, right? He. The going on to the twitch stream and creating that to be like, no, I want you, I want it to. You want you to hear my version of the story. Okay. That, that's, I mean, the dude paints his head. You know what I mean? Like, he, you know, all that stuff people forget. Like, remember, like, his hair paint was coming off. Like he doesn't want to go bald. Like, he's, that's, that's a, He's a sensitive type of person in that way. He even said it on the, on the Jennifer Hudson show that he doesn't, he wants, you know, in his 20s, his 20s are ending when he goes into 30, he wants to skydive because he's afraid of heights, and he wants to get rid of his insecurities and all that. He has those. We all have those.

[B]

So.

[A]

Okay, let's. I'm not, there's not a criticism. No, he, but he is. Let's just, let's admit it. He has to admit this, that he's sensitive about certain things, and his standing as a basketball player is one of those things. And so he's doing the classic kind of like, I'm going to pump up the story to make myself look good type of thing. He remembers it a certain way. And the, Everything, every detail in that story enhances his public Persona. Right? Oh, I got, you know, it was the coach that favored somebody else. And, you know, I had to find a way to make my way with the fan. So I was, I brought the ball down here on dunks and I was windmilling. You remember that? Like, like, he, like, he was like, like, I don't know that he actually made the conscious decision, like, hey, Man, I normally don't dunk in a fancy way, even though I'm a mega athlete and I can dunk on everybody, I'm going to do this as a calculated plan to win over the fans so I can start again. No. You kidding me? No, that's just. He just did a whole thing with Jordan Walsh. Be like, hey, dude, when you're out there on the break, you got to throw something out. You got to throw a windmill down or something. You got to put on a show. He was just putting on a show because he's capable of putting on a show. This wasn't some calculated thing. He just threw a windmill because he could throw a windmill off camera.

[B]

On the podcast with Jordan Walsh, he's like, Jordan, okay, it's change.org and the way you set up the petition is.

[A]

But, like, everything he said was very much the guy who's like, I'm going to tell this story, and I'm going to kind of just like, pump up the details. And, you know, this is a story about me, and I'm going to make myself look good. I'm sitting there with Andre Guadala, and I'm sitting there with all these guys, and I'm going to be like, hey, look at me. Look how great I am. I. I'm so great that I won over the fans with my crazy dunks. So much so that they started a petition that was so popular, the front office was like, man, we don't want to start Jaylen Brown, but, man, look at how many people have signed this thing. We got no choice. No, that has never happened. That has never, ever happened.

[B]

If this petition hits 12, our hands are tied.

[A]

We, like, we got no choice. Come on, man. Just. That's not true. It's just not true. You can believe it. He can believe it to be true, but it's not a petition. Danny Ainge did not call up Brad Stevens, say, you gotta start Jaylen Brown. I'm feeling the heat from this petition. It's Danny Ainge. He. When you say idgaf, Danny Ainge personifies that, man. That dude was going up to Larry bird and Kevin McHale putting a stethoscope to their. To their chest, you know, heading into a Game 7 of the NBA Finals going, I want to see if any of you guys have any heart. Like, you think that guy is going to be, oh, God, people signed a petition. Like, if anything, if I know Danny Ainge at all, he'd be like, you know what? I'm going to do the opposite of what, what this petition says just to prove a point. That's more Danny Ainge than him caving to a petition.

[B]

Like, if Danny H. Would. Cage would, would cave to a petition. Markel faults. Absolutely would have been a Boston Celtic.

[A]

I mean, come on, man. That's the other thing that's out today. Like how, you know, like, Danny Ainge manipulated a system because his son played AAU and got to see Markel Fultz when he was like, real, real fun

[B]

little addition to that. You can also do it if the kid is doing a post grad year with a prep team where he's going to skip college, then you can also. So then those post grad players play against other prep players. So then you can use that as a way to get in the door against prep teams. That's how there were a bunch of people in the door to watch. And Freddy Simons one time because he was doing the, the extra post grad year with a prep team to skip college. And, and then anytime that he played against another prospect, you'd be able to go and watch Anthony Simons and that prospect. So.

[A]

Yeah, crazy. So look, I, I want to be clear here. I do. I love Jaylen Brown. Like, I, I legitimately, I think he's a good person. I think he's a great player. I think he has done incredible things in Boston. I think, I think the city of Boston is better off for having Jalen Brown here, and he should continue to stay here. The Celtics can win another championship with Jaylen Brown here. All of that. I believe this. I like Jalen Brown in the locker room. I like, I think, you know, in the few interactions that I've had with him on a one. On one basis have all been pleasant. I do not begrudge Jalen for even wanting to pump up his own kind of value, all of that stuff. I do not begrudge him for doing that. However, get the facts right. And under, like, just, please, Jalen, please read the room. Because now all of these people, these aggregators, the radio people, they're just jumping down your throat and we do a podcast because that's the thing that's out there and that people are talking about. And it's just, even, even the people who are like, behind you are saying, like, dude, man, come on. Just, just understand what's going on here and how that stuff is being perceived. If, if you like, I think Jalen should go back. Like, like, I, I volunteer to sit with Jalen just privately and have him tell me how he thinks everything went And I'd be like, okay, okay, here's what actually happened. Here's why you were booed at the draft, which is one of the. The. Man, I'm so late on this thing. We've. We've talked about this. That it wasn't that Jaylen Brown himself was booed. It was booed because. Right. Celtics fans wanted a Jimmy Butler trade, and they wanted. Was Chris Dunn. If the Celtics were driving Chris Dunn, that meant they were trading for Jimmy Butler. And because they. They. When they drafted for Jaylen Brown, that meant they were keeping Jaylen Brown. And people booed that they were not trading for Jimmy Butler. That was what the booze were for. But no, Jalen's going to internalize that. And he should. You know, he should. He internalizes. Oh, they booed me. Not really true. Not really true. But that's how you have to process it to fuel you. Fine, Process it that way to fuel you. But.

[B]

And also, that's truer than the change.com or the change. That's truer than the petition that like. Like, you did get booed. Right. And like, you could use that as fuel. Absolutely. But like, that's truer than, like, the city of Boston made a petition and that forced the Celtics to start you like that. You know what I mean? Like, there's levels of truth here. And the other one is absolutely defensible. And the petition one is just kind of odd.

[A]

All right, let's take a break. Let's talk about how this might impact the off season and all that stuff that's coming up next. Today's show is brought to you by Kelsey. Playoffs are here, and it's the most electric time in basketball On Kelsey. You can trade every single playoff game, every series, conference, finals, championship. You can do it all at Kelsey. You go to Kelsey.com or the download the Calci app. You could have gotten the San Antonio spurs at 78. The payout was 129 on that. They clearly paid off on that. But basically, what Kalshi is, is trading like a stock market. You're trading against peers. In a live market, there's no house. You have odds and probabilities, but you can buy in and out of your position at any time. So you can buy into something, and if the value of it goes up, you can sell before the game even happens. And. And there you go. So download the Calci app. Use the code locked on. You get $10 when you trade 10 Kelshi K A L S H I trade on anything. 18 plus only restrictions and eligibility requirements apply. This is very important event. Contract trading involves risk and may not be suitable for all investors. Prices, values and available markets may differ from those mentioned. For more information, see calsheet.com regulatory TATIO is also brought to you by Rocket Money. If you've ever opened up your bank account, thought where do my money go? You're not alone. Keeping track of subscriptions, spending and bills can get overwhelming fast. That's where Rocket Money comes in. Helps you take control of your finances all in one place. Attracts your subscriptions in one spot and can help you cancel the ones you don't need. With just a few taps, it categorizes your spending automatically so you can see where your money is going, set budgets, get alerts, and stay on top of upcoming bills. Everything is so expensive nowadays. You can use something like this to help you manage everything. Just makes you feel more organized. Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps find and cancel unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings. Let Rocket Money help you reach your financial goals faster. [e-mail] Locked on that's RocketMoney.com LockedOn thank you for making Locked On Celtics your first listen every day. If you never miss a show, let's go ahead and make this official. Join the Locked on every day or club. Get ad free audio access to our members only. Discord and more. All built for our most loyal fans. That's you. Click on the link in the show notes or go to locked on celtics.super cast.com locked on celtics.Super cast.com $5 a month or $50 for the year to join the Everydayer Club. All right, how does all of this impact the off season? I still, I guess we I should ask the question one more time. Does any of this give you the feeling that Jalen is trying to angle his way out of here? Or is this just Jalen being, you know, just, just going on a media tour for the hell of it, trying to promote his sneakers and just saying things that are somewhat outrageous?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, I think there's a small amount of, I think smoke here right where you're like, okay, like something isn't there, is there? I I. To me, it sounds like there is a misalignment somewhere in this. And that doesn't mean that Jalen Brown is gone. Right? That just means like that doesn't mean that Jalen Brown wants to be gone. That just means that there, it feels like there's something that's just not quite. Yeah, right. You know, with Jalen Brown and the Boston Celtics, like, something just feels like it's, it's not quite clicking into place right now in a way that gives me a small amount of pause. I, I, I, I certainly don't think that this is a Jalen Brown, like, veiled trade request. I don't think that it's anything like that. I think that it's just something doesn't quite feel right. And I mean, look, you have to take everything into account in an off season, right? Especially Brad said in his press conference, he made it pretty clear that, like, hey, this is what happened in the postseason was unacceptable and he's going to try to put the team in the best position to accomplish the thing that's on his office wall. Right. So that, you know, that's, that's where he's at with all of this. So I think it's, it's reasonable to say that this probably has some amount of impact. Not, not, maybe not this appearance directly, but kind of the, the misalignment that it seems to be exposing or representing. I think that probably has some impact on the off season. I don't think that means that Jalen Brown is out the door. I don't think that means that everybody should, you know, panic and aggregate everything, all the, everything. Like, it's not, it's not, that's not what this is. It's just, yeah, you have to think about it. You have to consider the, you know, the implications of it, I guess. So.

[A]

I don't think, I really don't think that he's, he's trying to angle his way out. I just feel like he's, he's, he's trying to enhance his, his image. So, okay, fine. Maybe that's part of the, you got to pump yourself up to pump up the sneakers. Maybe that's, maybe that's he's selling his brand. Okay, fine. Also fine. So I don't think this, I talked about the Giannis potential for a Giannis trade. First of all, I don't know what Milwaukee wants. I don't know if they want to stay somewhat competitive, and I don't know if they view Jaylen Brown as somebody that would keep them as competitive as they need to be. What, what is Milwaukee trying to do? That's something you got to try to figure out this, this summer, but I don't see a lot of moves out there that make much sense. I can think of three guys that make any kind of that, that might even be available in any way. Giannis is one. If Cleveland loses, Donovan Mitchell has to be in that conversation. And Devin Booker. Are there three high salary guys that I can say they might, their time might be kind of coming to an end where they are. Devin Booker, 29 year old shooting guard. Like just, you're, what are you getting?

[B]

You're.

[A]

You're basically doing the same thing and he's lesser of a. Less of a defender, maybe more of a shooter, but like not, not a

[B]

three point shooter recently.

[A]

Not recently. Right. And so it's like you're, you're kind of trading for Jalen Brown who doesn't play defense quite the same. Like, so Devin Booker's out to me even like Donovan Mitchell has obviously like you talk about clutch though that 11 point fourth quarter against the Sixers would not have happened with Donovan Mitchell around. No doubt about it.

[B]

However, also, then you don't have to play against Donovan Mitchell, so. Which is also many things to keep in mind.

[A]

Yeah, but, but he's, you know, what is he, 30, 31? He. He's a small guard. Those guys age quickly. His athleticism is already, already not where it used to be. He doesn't dunk much anymore. He used to dunk on Everybody.

[B]

He's. He's 29. He'll be 30 in September, so next year he'll be 30.

[A]

So same thing as Jalen. I'm kind of like, sure. I mean there's, there's advantages to, to having him, but there's also. He's defensively, you're big drop off defensively and again he's gonna age, he's gonna age out faster than Jalen Brown ages out. And that brings you to Giannis, which

[B]

I've, we've already done real quick on Donovan Mitchell. That, the concern to me is like real Kemba vibes, right? Where it's like, you know, that was, that was a, a really good small guard when he arrived, but you got him by signing him. Whereas Donovan Mitchell, it's like, you know, if you're trading a big part of your franchise for it, that's a little scary to me.

[A]

So even if Jalen was like, hey man, if, if just if you find something we could, I don't know, like is Atlanta comes up? Are, are there, are there Atlanta trades that would make any sense? Let's just pop up the Atlanta Hawks real quick. Their, their biggest salary guy, C.J. mcCollum, he's a restricted. He's. He's unrestricted, so he's not even really part of Jalen Johnson makes 30 million. But you still have to add somebody. You gotta be Jalen Johnson and somebody else. Like you're gonna do Jalen Johnson and Jonathan Kaminga. Is, is, is that like.

[B]

Yeah, Atlanta's not.

[A]

That makes. Atlanta's not doing that. You're giving up. I mean, you're not giving up Jalen Johnson at 24 years old. You just traded away Trey Young to build around Jalen Johnson. You're not bringing in a 30 year old to kind of take that spot. Correct. And then after that it becomes like you to start piling three and four guys together to get to. Unless you're out on Dyson Daniels then. But no, that like that's so that. That doesn't even make sense. So all of this is to say I don't see a real reasonable Jalen Brown trade out there. Even if that's where we, we got.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

If anything with Jalen, maybe there's a little smoke, but this is a slow burn. We can talk next summer, maybe after that. Maybe like if it does, if they flame out again next summer, maybe there's bigger changes at that point, but I don't think this is the. So to me, the approach is adding. I, I still think it's two players of some significance to this roster. That's my. Using the, the 27.7 million dollar traded player exception and the mid level exception. And the one thing that I wrote on, on Celtics on SI was you can use the 27.7 million to target a free agent in a sign and trade because you're close enough, you're far enough away. I'm sorry, to the. From the first apron where you can acquire somebody via sign and trade and not worry about the first apron being hard capped at the first apron. So the 27.7 million does kind of act as free agent money as well. And because the mid level exception is also now available to be used as a traded player exception, you can use that to trade for somebody making $15 million or less. So the Celtics do have tools. I just think that's the path that makes the most sense somehow using those two tools to sign. Sign and trade. Trade for two players of some significance, not just tinkering around the edges. Two players of some significance that can come in and handle a bunch of the workload, much like Horford or Porzingis or Holiday did when they were here.

[B]

Yeah, no, I, I think that's right. I think that makes the most sense. And I mean, I think it's. I think it's a Tough sell to, like, give up. I understand that this, that this offseason or that this postseason was considered unacceptable within the organization, but I think it's, it's tough to, to give up on this core that won you a championship before you see what next year Tatum looks like, right? I think that it, you just, I don't know, man. Like, you want to, you want to punt on it now. You, you really don't know how good Tatum can be again. He's going to be really good next year. Like, yeah, yeah, he's gonna be awesome. And I think if I'm the Celtics, I, I, I understand, I could, you know, I, I understand why some of these conversations are happening, but I think it's, I, I think I agree with you that it's, it's too soon to, to, to kind of see them materialize at this point.

[A]

Yeah, we, I gotta wrap up the show. I gotta wrap up the show, but there's a lot more to discuss. I just think no matter what's going on, unless Jaylen says, hey, you know what? I thought about it, I am out of here. I don't see, I don't see the, the, the, I don't see the rationale for it, not this, not this upcoming season for exactly what you said, Tatum, you got to give this one more chance. And I do think there are players of consequence that are going to be out there that they can get and it can work. So we'll see, we'll dive deeper into the off season as the weeks, the days and whatever progress for now. Tom, appreciate you. Thank you for hopping on.

[B]

Appreciate you man.

[A]

And I do thank all of you and appreciate all of you long show today. So thank you for being here. It's almost like a bonus podcast at the end of this show. So thanks for listening. Thanks for watching. I do thank you for being in every day or being with me every Monday through Friday. Join the Everydayer club@lockdown celtics.supercast.com and now please share the podcast. Tell everybody they should be listening to and watching the Lockdown Celtics podcast. Here in the Lockdown Podcast network. It's your team every day.

[B]

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