Defensive Coordinator SEARCH in Dallas HEATS UP—Is Jonathan Gannon the Right CHOICE For Cowboys?

Summary

Locked On Cowboys Podcast | January 14, 2026

Episode Title: Defensive Coordinator SEARCH in Dallas HEATS UP—Is Jonathan Gannon the Right CHOICE For Cowboys?
Hosts: Marcus Mosher & Landon McCool

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Episode Overview

This episode focuses on the Dallas Cowboys' search for a new defensive coordinator, with particular emphasis on Jonathan Gannon, former Eagles DC and current Cardinals head coach. Hosts Marcus Mosher and Landon McCool break down Gannon’s background, scheme, strengths and weaknesses, debate his fit in Dallas, and discuss other candidates such as Zach Orr. The hosts also explore how the wider NFL head coaching carousel could affect the Cowboys’ search.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Jonathan Gannon: Scheme, Philosophy, and Resume

[01:11–03:47]

• Jonathan Gannon interviewed for the Cowboys defensive coordinator job, and there’s increasing buzz he’s a leading candidate.
• Landon praises Gannon’s modern approach:

  "We can expect a lot of quarters coverage...Gannon is a very modern kind of defensive coordinator. He understands how to attack offenses...has shown the ability to get the most out of the personnel he’s been given..."
  (Landon McCool, 02:14)

• Historically, Gannon’s defenses, especially in Arizona, use a high rate of quarters coverage (four-deep zone shells) and have adapted well even with less-than-ideal rosters.
• Mosher adds the Cowboys seem to want someone with a defensive back background:

  "It seems like they want someone who knows how to figure out coverages and what’s the best way to stop, you know, Kyle Shanahan, a Sean McVay. And that part is really appealing to me."
  (Marcus Mosher, 03:47)

• Gannon’s track record includes leading the Eagles’ defense to a Super Bowl appearance and adapting schemes to take on top NFC West offenses.

Notable Quote

"If he ended up [as] the defensive coordinator, I would be absolutely over the moon."
(Landon McCool, 03:27)

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2. Positional Background & Age

[04:40–05:51]

• Gannon spent 9 years coaching defensive backs and is known for his skill in scheming coverages.
• He is still young ("early 40s"), began coaching at age 20, and has NFL experience dating back to 2007.
• The hosts note that his innovation and his ability to confuse Dak Prescott and Brian Schottenheimer (in matchups vs. Dallas) likely contributed to his interview, perhaps for self-scouting as well as hiring considerations.

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3. Gannon's Strengths and Weaknesses: The Run Defense Debate

[06:42–10:07]

• Gannon’s defenses tend to be strong in pass defense but struggle vs. the run—because the scheme often sacrifices men in the box for more coverage.
• Surface stats: As a DC, Gannon’s teams have allowed high rushing yards and rushing touchdowns in multiple seasons (e.g., ranked 24th to 29th in yards per attempt, allowing 23+ rushing TDs in 3 of 5 years).
• Marcus challenges whether this is still viable in the evolving NFL:

  "Are we going back to a little bit where stopping the run is at least, on early downs, more important than stopping the pass?"
  (Marcus Mosher, 08:42)

• Landon notes the NFL is trending back toward more balanced run/pass ratios due to how passing-focused defenses (like Gannon’s) have provoked offenses to respond with heavier run schemes:

  "The importance of the run game...is becoming back in fashion because these defenses were doing a good job of stopping the pass...so teams started going back to [the run]."
  (Landon McCool, 09:28)

• If Gannon is hired, Dallas would need to bolster personnel at linebacker and up front to withstand a heavier run focus.

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4. Zach Orr: Alternative Candidate Breakdown

[13:58–18:43]

• Zach Orr, former Ravens DC, also interviewed.
• Landon puts Orr into a "third bucket" of candidate types: an up-and-comer with promise but limited experience as a play-caller.

  "He hasn't had a ton of experience...and in the last year, 50% of his experience hasn't always been great..."
  (Landon McCool, 13:58)

• Orr is considered extremely intelligent and was on track to be an excellent linebacker before retiring early due to neck injury.
• Marcus explains Ravens’ defensive success under Mike Macdonald, but notes the unit has declined as Orr’s influence grew—especially versus strong opponents:

  "The further you get away from the Mike Macdonald impact in Baltimore, the worse that defense has gotten...they beat up on bad teams, but whenever they played a decent team, they kind of got crushed..."
  (Marcus Mosher, 15:44)

• Suggests Orr might be better suited as a linebacker coach or consultant than full DC at this stage.

Notable Quote

"I think he's incredibly bright. I would love to have him here—I just think defensive coordinator might be too big of a step."
(Marcus Mosher, 16:45)

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5. Comparing Defensive Styles: Stopping the Run vs. the Pass

[18:43–19:47]

• Stats: Orr’s defenses were exceptional vs. the run (1st in rushing yards in 2024, top 10 in 2025), but dead last in pass defense (30th–31st both years).

• Scheme: Orr loads the box to stop early-down runs and blitzes with man coverage on third downs—needs top-tier corners to make it work.

• Landon jokes:

  "Maybe you just need to get Gannon as your DC and Orr as your linebacker [coach]. Perfect."
  (Landon McCool, 19:48)

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6. The Coaching Carousel & How It Affects Dallas

[20:14–28:29]

• The league-wide coaching shuffle, including potential moves by John Harbaugh and Mike Tomlin, could heavily influence which defensive coordinators are available to Dallas.
• The hosts believe top DC candidates (e.g., Brian Flores or Jim Schwartz) could be snapped up by other teams quickly, limiting the pool.
• The Steelers and Ravens, as premier coaching destinations, make competition fierce for candidates, possibly reducing Dallas’ options.
• The complex timing of hires means some coaches—like Jim Leonard or Raheem Morris—might have to accept DC jobs rather than wait for head coaching opportunities that may not materialize.
• Landon observes:

  "It's going to make for more opportunities for guys to go here and there…Pittsburgh becomes such a destination...a spot where tough football is valued, where defensive coordinators are valued."
  (Landon McCool, 26:42)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Gannon’s schematic fit:

  "Gannon is exactly the kind of guy you’re looking for, whether you’re Jerry Jones and want the former head coach or...want a modern defensive coordinator."
  (Landon McCool, 03:27)

• On the state of pass vs. run defense:

  "There are a certain category of defensive coordinators...willing to sacrifice the run almost all the way to win with the pass."
  (Landon McCool, 07:37)

• On the NFL’s cyclical nature:

  "The cycle continues."
  (Landon McCool, 09:56)

• On younger, less-established coaching candidates:

  "They've got to hire a lot of coaches...casting a wide net to find other guys."
  (Landon McCool, 17:25)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Gannon’s Interview & Scheme Fit: [01:11–03:47]
• DB Background & Innovation: [04:40–05:51]
• Gannon’s Run Defense Struggles & NFL Trends: [06:42–10:07]
• Zach Orr as Candidate: [13:58–18:43]
• Scheme Comparison (Run vs. Pass): [18:43–19:47]
• Coaching Carousel Implications: [20:14–28:29]

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Takeaways for Cowboys Fans

• Gannon is a modern, innovative DC option, strong in coverage and adaptable, but may replicate recent issues with Dallas' run defense unless personnel are upgraded.
• Zach Orr is viewed as extremely smart but inexperienced; an ideal addition as a positional coach or consultant rather than DC.
• The broader NFL coaching carousel may dictate which candidates are ultimately available to Dallas, with some big names potentially snatched elsewhere soon.
• The hosts are cautiously optimistic about Gannon, emphasizing the need to balance scheme and personnel to avoid repeating past defensive issues.

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Summary Tone

The hosts bring their typical blend of measured optimism, insider knowledge, and candid skepticism—balancing excitement about potential upgrades with a critical eye on past defensive coordinator shortcomings and the rapidly shifting NFL landscape.

Transcript

[Marcus Mosier]

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[Landon McCool]

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[Landon McCool]

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[Marcus Mosier]

The Dallas Cowboys have interviewed Jonathan Gannon for their next defensive coordinator job. And it seems like there's a pretty good chance he might get that role. We'll talk about it next. You are Locked on Cowboys, your daily Dallas Cowboys podcast, part of the Locked On Podcast network. Your team every day. Welcome back to the Locked on Cowboys podcast, part of the Locked On Podcast network. Your team every day. We'd like to thank you for making us the number one sports podcast network. And on today's show we are discussing the Cowboys defensive coordinator search. We're going to talk about Zach Gore, we're going to talk about all the movement across the NFL. But Landon, let's start with this. The Cowboys interviewed Jonathan Gannon on Tuesday. He is a well respected defensive mind. If he ends up being the Cowboys next defensive coordinator, what can we expect to get?

[Landon McCool]

We can expect a lot of quarters coverage. Right. Like this guy is. I think he led the Arizona Cardinals, led the league in quarter quarter as quarters usage if I'm not mistaken. Or at least they were well ahead of the second place the last time I checked. And I think that, you know, Gannon is a very modern kind of defensive coordinator. He understands how to attack offenses. He understands how to have success against the Shanahan offense. We saw that, you know, over and over again in his time and the AFC west despite having NFC West.

[Marcus Mosier]

Yep.

[Landon McCool]

I'm sorry, NFC west, yes. Despite not having necessarily the top end talent at times. I mean sometimes he had some talent, sometimes they had first round picks that didn't quite make make sense of the positions that that they were supposed to be playing. So I think he made a lot of positive improvements to that defense despite some hit and miss personnel there. And then obviously, you go back to his time with the Eagles and he, you know, he was a major part to why they went to the Super Bowl. So I think he's a guy that, you know, we talked about it early on. There's a lot of really good candidates this year. We've, we've harped on a couple of that we really, really like. But the truth is, is that Jonathan Gannon is one of these guys that we haven't spoken a ton about. But if he ended up the defensive coordinator, I would be absolutely over the moon because I think he's exactly the kind of guy that you're looking for, whether you're Jerry Jones and you want the former head coach for the security or you're like us, that wants a modern defensive coordinator who has shown the ability to, to get the most out of the personnel that he's been given and create defenses that create plays and, and win games.

[Marcus Mosier]

All right, so let's, let's talk about the positives before I be a typical wet blanket at the next part of it. One of the things that I'm fascinated by is it seems like at least with a lot of the names that have been mentioned or have interviewed, there is a defensive back background. And that's, you know, the case with Jim Leonard, obviously. But if you look at Jonathan Gannon's history, he was a cornerbacks coach or a defensive backs coach for like nine years. Like, he's got a lot of, of experience coaching defensive backs. He then became the defensive coordinator in Philadelphia and then the head coach in Arizona. It seems like that's the one spot that they're identifying is they want someone that knows how to figure out coverages and what's the best way to stop, you know, Kyle Shanahan, a Sean McVay. And that part is really appealing to me.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah, I mean, it kind of goes back to what we were talking about on yesterday's show, right? Where like, let's get the guy, the dudes in the pass rush and we'll scheme up the coverage, right? And I think maybe they're approaching it that the same way is that if they can get some more, a couple more dudes to make this defensive line look solid and get after the passer, you can scheme up the coverage stuff if you get the right personnel and the right coaches in here.

[Marcus Mosier]

He's also pretty young. I think he's early 40s. He actually started as a coach when he was 20, he was a, an assistant and at Louisville and has kind of worked his way up. He's been in the NFL since 2007, so he's been around it for a long time. I do think he's innovative and I've seen them play some awesome games and honestly their game against Dallas this year, I mean they were doing some wild stuff and it had Dak Prescott and Brian Schottenheimer confused. And I have to believe that's one of the reasons why they brought him in for an interview. And maybe it's for the defensive coordinator job. I also wouldn't be surprised, Landon, if it's like, hey, you did a great job of stopping us over the last couple years. Tell us what went wrong, how you attacked us. A little bit of self scouting here.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah, I mean I think that's a big reason that some of these teams bring in some of these interviews and that that's not necessarily saying that that's why Dan is in here. Yeah, but it certainly is is a benefit. Right. Like, I mean you get the opportunity to kind of pick their brains on what they thought about the Cowboys offense and what they thought to think about the Cowboys defense is obviously going to come up too. So. Yeah, I agree. I think it's an opportunity to kind little bit about a coach that you respect and frankly, like you said, I mean he's played the Cowboys extremely tough whenever they face him. And I think you've got a quarterback who is as good as any quarterback in the league at diagnosing defenses. So when he, when you run into a defense coordinator that, that causes them some, some pause again, especially with the kind of personnel that they've had over the years in and out at different points, I, I think you at least want to pick their brain and certainly see if they're up to the job and if not, maybe just some ideas on, on how to improve the offense or maybe with the direction they want to go on the defense.

[Marcus Mosier]

And here's a couple surface level stats. Again, this is not the end all be all. So just take these with a grain of salt. He's been a play caller on defense for five years. In those five years his team has ranked in the top half the league in passing yards four different times. They were kind of up and down a little bit if you look at like yards per attempt and net yards per attempt, but generally pretty good in coverage. The issue with Gannon and because you play a lot of quarters and you've got some, you know, lighter boxes is the rushing yards. Listen to his yards per attempt allowed over the last five years. Six in 2021 and then 24, 29, 25, 24. You look at the rushing touchdowns, he's given up at least 23 rushing touchdowns in three of the five seasons. You could probably expect the Cowboys to be a very middling run defense again.

[Landon McCool]

If you, I mean, I think if you were gonna. I would love to hear what Cody Alexander has to say about this, but I think that if you look at the other defensive coordinators or people that are similar to him, to me, the guy that is, is closest is probably Brandon Staley, right? And stale thing, same exact daily. Staley suffered from the same sort of issue. And I think that part of that is that they both kind of came, you know, to, to age during that late, that end of peak passing era, right where, where defensive coordinators were and even Quinn kind of was, was maybe falls into that category a little bit where there are a certain category of defensive coordinators that in, in, you know, five or six years ago were willing to sacrifice the run almost all the way to win with the pass. And, and I think that he's one of these guys that scheme wise is willing to sacrifice pieces on this chessboard in order to stop the pass. Because the idea that passing is ultimately how offenses are trying to win these games now is that the right way.

[Marcus Mosier]

To go in 2026? I'm genuinely asking. No, you're seeing more, you're seeing more, you know, 13 personnel. You're even seeing more like six offensive line packages. Like I honestly wonder, are we going back to a little bit where stopping the run is at least an early downs more important than stopping the pass.

[Landon McCool]

That's literally where I was going to go is because yes, I do think that the game has changed. And that's the problem, right, is that they got in right at the tail end of the peaky peak passing era. And now in the last, let's say what, two years probably the game is not completely changed the other way. I don't think we're going back to, you know, 1987 football, but I do think that the ratio of run to pass is going to start trending a little bit more towards balance. And the importance of the run game, especially because of guys like Brandon Staley and Jonathan Gannon has become back fashion because these defenses were doing a good job of stopping the pass and creating problems. So teams started going back to how do we get those. That safety, how do we get that second safety start dropping back down to the box, you start running the football at their 215 pound, you know, nickel linebackers and then suddenly teams are going to start wanting more men in the box again and the cycle continues.

[Marcus Mosier]

So just to wrap it up here on Gannon, I think generally you would be excited with the hire because he does have experience, he's young, he's willing to mix things up, but he doesn't come without flaws and warts.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah, absolutely. Because I think part of it too is, you know, personnel is going to need to be a part of stopping the run. If we're going to have Gannon here, they're going to need to make sure that they have the right personne nail to physically handle that. So what does that mean? You might need to invest a little bit more in kind of more two way linebackers just to be able to handle the, the extra load that's going to be asked upon you for, for being a running, I mean, for being, running the scheme against the, the running game. So, yeah, it's just something that, you know, you have to, you know, add into your calculus when you're thinking about how you're building this defense top to bottom from coaching and personnel.

[Marcus Mosier]

All right, let's talk about another name that has popped up, and that is Zach, or who is currently or at least was the defensive coordinator for the Baltimore Ravens. He was in the building on Tuesday. Could he be their next defensive coach? We'll get to that next. This episode is brought to you by Gusto. Let's be real. No one starts a business for the joy of calculating tax withholdings or managing payroll spreadsheets. And that's where Gusto comes in to take the stress out of payroll, benefits and HR so that you can focus on running your business and supporting your team. Gusto is the all in one remote friendly payroll and HR platform that makes managing your team simple, transparent and fast. And whether you're hiring, onboarding or paying employees, Gusto helps you do it all from one place without the hassle or the hidden fees. And unlimited payroll runs for one monthly price means that there's no surprise charges at the end of the month. So try gusto [e-mail] Loton NFL and get three months free when you run your first payroll. That's right, three months of free [e-mail] LotOn NFL and one more time, that is gusto.com/locked on NFL.

[Matt Derry]

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[Marcus Mosier]

Vary welcome back to the Lock on Cowboys podcast. We'd like to thank you for making us your first listen every single day. If you haven't done so already, check out the New Everydayer club. For just $5 a month, you're going to get access to to add free audio of the Loton Cowboys Podcast compatible with Apple Podcast, Spotify and every major podcast app, go to lockon cowboys supercast.com or tap the link in the show Notes to learn more. All right L let's talk about Zach or who the Cowboys have had an interview with. He was the Ravens defensive coordinator over the last two years. Is this someone who interests you as a potential, you know, guy to run the defense?

[Landon McCool]

I think all of these candidates fall into one of three buckets, right? There's the guy that is either going to get a head coaching job or he's going to be one of the top defensive coordinator types, right? The Brian Flores falls into that. Obviously there's the guy that is solidly a defensive coordinator, right? Probably not going to get a head coaching job or doesn't have any interest in getting a head coaching job, but is definitely a defensive coordinator and the guy calling plays has experience, usually doing that. And then Zach Orr falls into this third bucket where he has been a defensive coordinator in the NFL. He has experience, but he hasn't had a ton of experience. And in the last year, I mean really 50% of his experience hasn't always been great, right? And it's hard to kind of get a read on some of these guys and try to figure out like are these definitely situations where you are looking for a defensive coordinator? Or are you like. Like you mentioned before, you know, interviewing a guy just to kind of pick his brain a little bit about something that you're interested in, maybe against. Against the Cowboys? I know that wasn't necessarily the case this year, but I mean, you know, he's. He's obviously been around. He's seen the lit tape, he's been around the league. Or are you hiring this guy? Or are you interviewing this guy with the idea of maybe hiring him as a defensive coordinator or as a position coach? Like, if you feel like you're. You're interested in him as a coach, maybe developing him a little bit? Because again, he only called plays for two. I think it was two years at Baltimore, and before that he was a top lieutenant at Mike McDonald's. Maybe he just needs a little bit more time kind of developing or maybe, you know, he's a defensive coordinator. I. I don't know, but I think you don't really find out about these kind of guys who have, you know, interesting but very light resumes unless you kind of bring them in and interview them.

[Marcus Mosier]

So just a couple of things that I've, you know, heard or just talked to people about, everybody that talks about Zach or thinks he's incredibly smart, if you remember him as a player, like, he was on his way to becoming one of the best linebackers in the league. And then I think it was a neck injury that he suffered that forced him to retire at a very young age. He became a defensive analyst for the Ravens at age 25. So, like, he's been around for a little bit. He was a outside linebacker coach for Urban Myers Jaguars, which is kind of funny. And then he came back to Baltimore. He was the inside linebacker coach for two years under Mike McDonald, and then he went from inside linebackers to the defensive coordinator, and that was a big jump. And I think the concern is in 2024, the defense was really good, but that was with Mike. A lot of Mike McDonald's players running his scheme. The further you get away from the Mike McDonald impact in Baltimore, the worse that defense has gotten. And you saw it play out this year where whenever they played a decent team, they kind of got crushed. Whether it was New England or Pittsburgh late in the year, they, The. The Texans scored 44 points on them. They beat up on a lot of bad teams middle of the year. I don't know if he's going to get another defensive coaching or a head coaching or, sorry, a coordinator job, but I do think he's somebody that would be really nice to have in your building, either as a linebacker coach or as a consultant. I think he's incredibly bright. I would love to have him here. I just think defensive coordinator might be too big of a step.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah. And I think that, you know, the resume looks like one that you wouldn't necessarily see someone who's obviously. And only walking in under that second bucket. Right. Obviously a defensive coordinator. He's just, he's only done it for two years. Like you mentioned, he's very young. He doesn't have a ton of experience necessarily for a guy that's being considered for a defensive coordinator. And the experience he has is, Is uneven. So I, I don't think it's unrealistic to think that, that, that he might be interviewed in for, you know, more than just the, the defensive coordinator role. Just they're interested in the guy. They want to see what he's like. Yeah. Is this someone's mind that we want inside the building with, you know, kind of consulting on this? Maybe that's a great role for him. Maybe he's a linebacker coach or someone that likes him. So there's lots of opportunities here, and I think, you know, there's. They've got to hire a lot of coaches, you know, and not even, not even just, you know, defensive coordinator being the high profile one. They need a lot of good coaches. So, you know, casting a wide net, even if to find other guys. And obviously Zach. Zach or has a history with Schottenheimer. That's how he got this job from the Jaguars. Right. But I think that it's important to kind of ask all these guys, give them opportunities to at least say, hey, I interviewed with the Dallas Cowboys, and in exchange, maybe you get some good information out of them or an opportunity for them to be a, you know, position coach.

[Marcus Mosier]

A couple stats on or that we should mention. They were first in rushing yards in 2024. They were 10th this year in terms of like, rushing attempts and yards per attempt. Number one in 2024, number 11 in 2025. So he is really good at stopping the run. We should also point out that he kind of sells out to stop the run on first and second down. That's not necessarily a bad thing. It's also, I think, a little bit tied into the division that he played in with Pittsburgh and Cleveland, who were so run heavy. The drawback to that, this is the opposite of Gannon. 31st in passing yards allowed in 2024, 30th in passing yards allowed in 2025 30th attempts, both years they gave up a bunch of touchdowns. His style is load the box on first and second down and on third downs. He's going to blitz and play a lot of man to man coverage. You've got to have the corners to do that. And that's where Baltimore over the last couple years, relying on, you know, Chittebeo Wuzier and a older Marlon Humphrey, it's kind of cost them in these bigger spots.

[Matt Derry]

Yeah.

[Landon McCool]

Maybe you just need to get Gannon as your DC and or as your linebacker. Perfect. Right? Yeah. And then you got the whole thing covered. Yeah, I, I do think it's, you know, it's, it's going to be interesting to see kind of what sort of role this guy ends up even if he's not with the Cowboys, what sort of role he ends up with next year because there's just a lot of defensive coordinator candidates. So I wouldn't be shocked if he didn't get a DC job, even if it wasn't with the Dallas just because there's only a certain amount of seats and there's tons of these defensive guys out this year.

[Marcus Mosier]

Well, and there's a lot of quality defensive minded head coach options, including like guys like Jesse Minter or Chris Shula. And I think those guys are going to gobble up some of these jobs as well. But let's talk about the, the coaching carousel because I do think that's going to have a big impact on what the Cowboys do. We'll get into some of the latest news next. This episode is brought to you by Quo New Year New Systems. This is the time when a lot of us look at the messier parts of how we run our business and think there has to be a better way. And there is. Streamlining your communications is one of the quickest upgrades that you can make. And that's why today's episode is brought to you by Quo, spelled Q U O the smarter way to run your business communications. Because when your whole team is reachable, organized and communicating in one place, you're not just working cleaner, you're creating more opportunities to connect with customers. I love how simple Quo makes everything. Your whole team can call and text from one shared business number so nobody misses anything. Everyone sees the full conversation thread, which makes replying faster and more personal. It's no surprise that Quo is the number one rated business phone system on G2, trusted by more than 90,000 businesses from solo operators to growing teams. Make this the year where no opportunity and no customer slips away. Try quo for free. Plus get 20% off your first six months when you go to quo.com lot NFL that is quo.com lot NFL quo no missed calls, no missed customers. This episode is brought to you by Home Chef. As the new year gets going, a lot of people are trying to simplify their routines and dinner is a big one. Between busy work days, cold winter nights, which I certainly know, and packed schedules, having an easy and reliable dinner plan makes a huge difference. And that's where Home Chef comes in. Home Chef takes the stress out of cooking by delivering fresh pre portioned ingredients right to your door. With easy to follow recipes that actually taste great. They're rated number one by users of other meal kits for quality, convenience, value, taste and recipe ease. And it's easy to see why meals come ready to fit your schedule. 30 minutes recipes, oven ready trays or quick lunches. And with over 30 weekly options including family sized meals and different dietary choices, everybody is going to get a meal that fits them. And for a limited time, Home Chef is offering our listeners 50 off your first box, free shipping and free dessert for Life. Again, that is 50% off your first box plus free shipping and free dessert for life. Just go to home chef.com lockedon that's home chef.com locked on for 50% off your first box, free shipping and free dessert for life. Must be an active subscriber to receive free dessert. Welcome back to the Lockdown Cavaliers podcast. We'd like to thank you for making us your first listen every single day. Linda, let's talk about some of the other coaching news going around the league because it's, it's been a while. We've got what, nine guys that are available or spots that are available. Nobody has taken a job yet. I think they're all waiting on John Harbaugh to make a decision. And honestly, where he goes is probably going to decide where the Cowboys go at defensive coordinator because you know, if he like, if, if Harbaugh takes the Giants job, I don't know, Advance Joseph gets a job and Advanced Joseph doesn't get a job. That means that Jim Leonard's probably going to take a defensive coordinator job. So there's a lot of moving parts here.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah. And I mean Harbaugh is probably the one that, that is the most related to the cowboy situation. Right. Because of what you just mentioned. But I mean, I have to say the news about Tomlin being released is, is just as league shattering, I would say. And certainly, you know, it cranked the wheel on the coaching carousel just as Fast right as Harbaugh. So yeah, I think to have the Harbaugh situation happen and then suddenly to have his division mate, you know, kind of have the similar situation of, you know, almost, you know, basically longer tenured guy, that probably will be in equal demand, I would imagine. You know, despite obviously the reasons that he got let go in the first place. I, I think it's, it's going to have a huge impact and obviously it's already having a huge impact across the league.

[Marcus Mosier]

Well, and I think you've talked about like Mike Tomlin in the Steelers. One name that has kind of come up over and over again is Brian Flores who has coach with the Steelers was a couple of years ago. He was the linebacker coach under Mike Tomlinson. He just seems like the type of coach that would fit in well in the AFC North. And if that's the case, that's one less option for the Cowboys. We've heard rumblings now for a couple of weeks that the Cowboys have been interested in Brian Flores, but if he gets a head coaching job, that's one less candidate to go after. However, there's not going to be a shortage of candidates. It feels very much like this is one of the better cycles and I'll give you another one. Jim Schwartz with the Browns. It came out on Monday that the Browns would prefer to keep Schwartz, but that's not a guarantee. That's their preference. If they hire a defensive minded head coach like a Jesse Minter or Chris Shula, I gotta believe that Schwartz is going to be available. And that's another name the Cowboys would love to talk to.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah. And kind of just to what you were saying before, like the other side of obviously the, the names that are getting out of the carousel is, is the seats. Right. The places and, and Pittsburgh is. Despite how Marcus may feel about Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh is a premier place to take a coaching job. I mean maybe the top of this list. I mean the Baltimore Ravens are in a premier organization, one of the best in the league. But I mean the Pittsburgh Steelers, whether you like it or not, are the Baltimore Ravens and the Dallas Cowboys combined in some ways.

[Marcus Mosier]

Right. I mean that's like a Supreme Court seat. Right. Like you're there for as long as you want to be there.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah, exactly. And it's high profile. And you're going to get every single call by the refs.

[Marcus Mosier]

Absolutely. I'm glad you said that. Yeah, go ahead.

[Landon McCool]

So, yeah, it doesn't really matter who the coach is. You're going to get every call. So yeah, I think it's it. So it's going to make for more opportunities for guys to go here and there. Obviously put another name on the carousel, which helps you, but at the same time, like Mike Tomlin is a big fish, but not as in relation to Pittsburgh as a destination. So, so you may lose out a little bit because Pittsburgh becomes such a destination that, you know, and, and again, a spot where tough football is valued, where defensive coordinators are valued, so might be a good spot for a defensive minded head coach to end up at.

[Marcus Mosier]

I'm also curious to see if you have a couple of these guys start taking jobs before waiting around too long. Like, for example, maybe Jim Leonard takes the defensive coordinator job in Dallas instead of waiting for potentially the Denver job to open up. Right. Because you don't want to be, you don't want to be the last one, you know, to get a spot. And I do think there's, there's only so many of these jobs available and maybe if you're a Jim Schwartz, you just say, you know what, Hey, I don't want to wait around to maybe get this Cleveland job. I'm going to go take the Dallas defensive coordinator job and figure it out. That's going to happen. Like you're going to start seeing these, these seats get filled over the next week.

[Landon McCool]

Yeah. And I think it's probably someone at the, more the, the Jim Leonard level. Right. Because you think that guys like Jim Schwartz, no matter what, like he's not going to end up without a seat, whether it's a, you know, a defensive coordinator position at Cleveland. I feel like you're right. I, I, he may decide to do that and that was an example. But like, I, I do think it's more the Jim Leonard level of, of, of guys that, that is a name, but maybe not so guaranteed to end up with, with a job unless he takes, is a little aggressive and takes.

[Marcus Mosier]

I'm a different example. Raheem Morris is interviewing for several head coaching jobs. I would be shocked if he gets a third chance. I mean, he's already failed twice. If he kind of strings this out, he doesn't get a head coaching job. Would I be surprised if all these other defensive coordinator jobs fill up and he doesn't get one? No, I wouldn't. So maybe while he's still, you know, hoping to get a head coaching job, maybe he settles for a defensive coordinator job in Dallas or in one of these different spots. I, I think you're going to see some movement like that over the next few days.

[Landon McCool]

Every one of these jobs is different and every one of these people is different. What they're looking for, the mixing and matching of that is always very interesting. So anything can happen here.

[Marcus Mosier]

All right, that is it for today's show. We want to thank you for making lots on Cowboys. Your first listen every single day. If you never miss an episode, the Everydayer Club is built for you. Get loth on Cowboys ad free plus members only, Discord Access and so much more. Head over to lathon cowboys.supercast.com to join the club. And for those of you on video, we can send you the first ever 24. 7 national NBA YouTube channel on an audio. Make your second listen the lat on NFL podcast. Follow Landon on Twitter @McCool BCB. I'm @MarcusMosier and we will see you right back here tomorrow.

[Landon McCool]

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[Marcus Mosier]

Breaks down all of the weekly action.

[Landon McCool]

A six pack of takes daily on the playoff pushed in the 2025 season or if your team's in draft mode. Yeah, we'll hit that too all right here. Every day on the Locked on podcast network, the NFL Six Pack. Subscribe on YouTube or everywhere you get your podcasts locked On.

[Marcus Mosier]

Listeners asked for more and now you can get it with the Everydayer Club. For just $5 a month. You'll get every episode ad free free plus access to our members only, Discord exclusive audio from Locked On, Sports Today and other perks you won't find anywhere else. If you never miss a show, this is the next step. Join the Everydayer club [e-mail] everydayerclub or visit the link in the show notes. That's lockedonpodcast.com everydayerclub part of the Locked on podcast network. Your team every day.