Anthony Scaramucci (6:40)

Well, first of all, I agree with all that. I want you to react to this, and this is apropos to what you're saying, and I'm going to give you the facts that 41 year old centimillionaire ready, 41 year old sentimillionaire venture capitalist. I'm meeting him for coffee and he says, you know, I really feel like I'm underachieving. I said, you feel like you're underachieving? Tell me why. He says, well, J.D. vance is my age, he's the Vice President of the United States, and I feel like I've missed the boat. And I'm capturing for you in a real life story that somebody said to me what is going on in terms of Instagram comparison, life comparison. Here's a guy that by your and my imagination growing up, I would say is arguably one of the most successful people in the world. But we've lost our anchor, I guess, is what I'm getting at. I guess. How do you get the kid to feel better about themselves? Yes, certainly you and I grew up and we've talked about this. My, my parents, I guess, set a low bar, if I'm being brutally honest.

Scott Galloway (7:48)

Right.

Anthony Scaramucci (7:48)

My dad was a construction worker. So if I did better than him, I was okay in my mind. But how do you get these kids that are comparing themselves to different people to stop doing that and to get the affirmation or the pat on the back that they need to feel good about where they are.

Scott Galloway (8:11)

There's a philosopher here, Alain de Bouton, a British guy, and he said that the downside of a meritocracy, the downside of believing that anyone can make it, and that's the belief we foment in the US that it's a true meritocracy, that if you're hardworking and you're talented, you can make it. That's a wonderful thing. Except there's a really ugly, dark side to that. It means if you don't, it's your fault. It means if you aren't providing, if you haven't been able to attract a mate, if you haven't been able to save a million bucks by the time you're 30, if you can't go to Coachella and get backstage passes, it means it's your fault you screwed up. And the reality is, and this goes to advice, a lot of my success is not my fault. And what I mean by that, and a lot of kids, failure is not their fault. It took me until I was probably 45 to realize that. Up until the age of 40 in America, if you really are honest about it, I raised money. I was starting Internet businesses in the 90s, and it never dawned on me that everyone raising tens of millions of dollars had pale skin and outdoor plumbing and was heterosexual. At least claimed to be heterosexual. So that was 30% of the population. So you had the most robust economy in history, crowding all of the prosperity into one third of the population. So if you were in that one third of the population, a lot of your success wasn't your fault. At the same time, what I say to young men is, you do your best. Success is a series of small, disciplined efforts every day, whatever it might be. Working out, making a few calls, dusting off your LinkedIn resume, approaching someone about ment. Just a series of small efforts every day, like compound investments. But if you wake up and you're 28 and shit's hard and you aren't killing it and you haven't bought a meme coin, you don't have millions of dollars. The first thing I tell young men is, forgive yourself. As long as you're trying, as long as you're being a good person, a lot of it is out of your control. If I'd been born in 1920, I would have died on a Russian field as a Nazi. I would have thought, oh, I'm fighting for the fatherland. I would have been sent to Russia, and I would have died. So a lot of where you end up in life, you have no control over success and failure. Be humble when you're successful. Forgive yourself when you fail. As long as you're trying every day and you're a good. First thing I tell kids or young men is you got to forgive yourself. You got to get past this notion that you have fucked up and you're a failure. Just stop it. Stop it. The next thing what I do with young men is when I coach young men, is I say, all right, we're going to find 8 to 12 hours in your phone. Super easy. Unlock your phone. I'm not going to judge you. And the first thing I tell them to put them at ease is I say, I watch porn. So if I find something on your phone, I'm not going to judge you. I gamble. I don't gamble in Vegas, but I basically have a gambling bug. I buy, I do covered calls options, which is just crazy. That's gambling, right? But I do it because I enjoy it. I know it's stupid. I know over the long term I'll lose money, but I like to gamble. So I tell them this to put them at ease. They unlock their phone and I say, we're going to find 8 to 12 hours in your phone. Every young man, every person has an advantage. They just may not know it yet. Most young people have an advantage, and that is, it's their human capital. They have more time than money. They have human capital, and in many ways that's very, very powerful capital. I said, we're going to find eight to 12 hours in your phone. Between TikTok X, Coinbase, YouTube, we're going to find eight to 12 hours. I'm going to put screen limits on it. And then we're going to take that eight to 12 hours and we're going to do three things. One, we're going to get really strong. We're going to work out three to four times a week and we're going to get really fit. I want you to be able to walk in any room and believe that if shit got real, you could kill and eat everybody or outrun them. I'm at the age now where it's about outrunning everybody. Now, I'm not suggesting you do that, but if you look at men who break up fights at bars, they're generally big, strong men. If you look at men who are patriotic and defend their country and speak well of other people behind their back, they're usually strong men. So we're going to get fit you're going to feel better about yourself, you're going to look better naked, you're going to be more confident, you're going to be more kind, you're going to be less prone to depression. First thing we're going to do is we're going to start working out three to four times a week. Second thing, you have to start making some money. In this economy, with a smartphone, you can make some money. I don't care about the TaskRabbit, a Lyft driver. There are ways to start hustling. Walk into a Panera Bread. You can start at 18 bucks an hour. Whatever it is. I'm not saying that's your career. I'm not saying we're not going to keep working, shop, workshopping, something better. But you're going to start. The way to make a lot of money, and I know this is your story, is you start making a little bit of money because you get a taste of the flesh. And it's exciting to be able to take your parents out to dinner. It's exciting to be able to buy that first suit. It's exciting to be able to go on a date and have the money and it gets those green glands going and you start thinking about the intersection of your human capital and money and you start making a little bit of money. And then the third thing we're going to do is three to five times a week, we're going to put ourselves in a group setting with strangers working on something bigger than ourselves. Church, group education, writing class, non profit. And you are going to approach strangers. You are going to learn how to open. Hey, what are you doing? Do you want to hang out this week? Do you want to go to a ball game? Hey, do you want to have coffee with me? Hey, can we get together? Can you tell me more about your business? Hey, I heard your family does this. I'd love to learn more about it. Hey, you have to figure out a way to learn how to open. Because by the time you're 30, if you have not engaged, here's a scary stat. Men who have not had lived with somebody or have not been married by the time they're 30, a third of them are going to have a substance abuse problem. You need to be around people. I'm not talking just romantically. Friends, contacts. Last stat here, Google puts out a job requisition or a job opening. They get 100 resumes literally within like minutes and they take it down. They bring in 20 people. 80% of the time the person they give the offer to was recommended and advocated for by someone internally. So if you don't know, if you don't have people inside of companies advocating for you, it's really difficult to get a good job. So what you want to do is you want to get out there, you want to be social, and you want to figure out a way to be so kind, so interesting, so much fun, quite frankly, that people put you in a room of opportunities even when you're not there. One of the keys to success is being really social. You got to learn how to be social. You got to get out of your house three to four times a week. Those are the three things I coach young men around. We're going to take human capital out of your phone and we're going to reinvest it in fitness, a little bit of money and being social.

Anthony Scaramucci (15:05)

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Kaley Cuoco (18:03)

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Scott Galloway (18:28)

Go to your happy price, Priceline.

Anthony Scaramucci (18:33)

I love everything you're saying, which is why I'm sitting here listening raptly. I guess the thing that you said that really made me laugh is the Aqua Velva. So I was an Aqua Velva person. Okay.

Scott Galloway (18:44)

I could see that.

Anthony Scaramucci (18:45)

I was not an Old Spice person.

Scott Galloway (18:47)

Not hard to believe.

Anthony Scaramucci (18:48)

I can still see that plastic and that blue stuff. And I was. And by the way, I put it directly on my face to burn the face. Scott.

Scott Galloway (18:56)

I meant it where it was working.

Anthony Scaramucci (18:57)

Yeah. After scraping the face. Okay. And so I just. It's just a brutal thing actually to be an Aqua Vulva person. But the. I think I want to ask you about and I want to get your ethos on. This is the forgiveness part because. And I want people to know they're listening to this, that we have all felt it, Scott. I wrote about it in my first book. I called it Davos Envy. I walked into a cocktail party. I was 44 years old. I met Mark Zuckerberg. He was 24. I was worth no million dollars. Maybe a few. He was worth multiple billion dollars. Okay? And I remember the feeling of insecurity or inadequacy, and what did I do wrong with my life? And so even me, I'm a happy camper. I've accomplished a lot. But I want people to know, I want to be vulnerable with you for a moment, and I want people to know that we've all felt what you've described. Have you not felt that? Because I have felt it. Maybe you're more enlightened than me, but I guess the point that I'm making is it's okay to feel it and it's okay to get through it. And I want you to address. Because this is tied back to money, by the way. I want you to address the concept of forgiving yourself, because you have to do that if you're an entrepreneur. You have to do that if you make a mistake at work, you have to do that if you made a bad decision. People get depressed, Scott, when they think about their past and they think about their decision making, and they say, oh, I made this bad decision. You know, I don't walk around with a millstone on my neck of regret thinking about the mistakes I made joining the White House or the mistakes I made during my period, and the White House got me fired. I don't do that. I put that millstone of regret behind me. I have forgiven myself. How do you forgive yourself, Scott? And how do you deal with this vulnerability that I'm describing?

Scott Galloway (21:04)

We're going to need a bigger boat. I mean, you're talking about. You mentioned. How old were you when you met Zuckerberg? 44. 42.

Anthony Scaramucci (21:10)

I was 44. He was 24. We're 20 years apart. And at that point, we were separated by. I don't know. I think we're separated by several hundred billion now, but at that point, we were only separated by 5 or 10 billion.

Scott Galloway (21:24)

Okay, so I'll put myself. I have so many examples to draw on here. And I'll put myself in the same age. I was 42 when I had my first kid. And when my youngest or my oldest came rotating out of my girlfriend, I was expecting bright angelic lights and opera singers that I immediately be in love with this thing. I was so nauseous. I've never felt that bad. I've never felt that bad without throwing up and passing out. The doctors had to turn to me and say, if you go down, we're not doing anything. We're focused on the kid and its mother. Because they looked at me and they thought, this guy is not doing very well. And they thought it was because that I was squeamish. And I want to be clear. I think childbirth is disgusting. I want to go back to the 60s where you're smoking a cigarette and you bring the baby out. But that wasn't it. I was so incredibly nauseous because I felt that the overwhelming emotion I had when my first son was born was not joy, it was shame. And that is, I had always found a way to make a lot of money. I'd always had a ton, blessings, privilege, and I was very talented. I'm not a modest person. I think I'm a monster. I'm talented, I work hard. But I'd also had a lot of privilege. I had made millions of dollars. At some point I'd been worth tens of millions. But because I always kept doubling down, always thought I could overcome anything, always went all in. And that was The Gestalt and 90s and 2000s Internet, you know, are you in it to win it? The stories of Mark Zuckerberg pushing back the offer for 30 billion. So I was all in on my e commerce startup red envelope when chapter 11. Three weeks before my first kid was born, I walked into that delivery room worth negative $2 million, having had been worth 10 or 20 or 30 million at some point, several points before that. And all of a sudden I felt not only personal failure, but for the first time, my first emotion as a father was that I was failing my son. That was the first feeling I had. I failed this kid, my only job on this earth. All of a sudden I had this new sensation I had never felt before. And you can't explain to anybody until you have a kid. My purpose in life is to protect this thing. And the first emotion I have is failure. If I'd just been a little less arrogant, if I'd just been a little smarter, if I'd just been a little less fucking stupid and put a couple million bucks aside, sold some stock, not reinvested, not doubled down, not beating my ch and said, no, I'm going large. Go home or go big or go large. And I felt so much shame. I've been there, man. It was just so emasculating and humiliating. And here's the Thing, your ability. I say forgive yourself. Like it's this Kumbaya thing. It is. It's important just for your own mental well being. But it's also kind of the key, one of the keys to success. I mean, we'll do a contest. I ran for sophomore, junior and senior class presidents in high school. I lost all three times. And based on my track record, I decided to run for student body president, where I went on to wait for it, lose. I got rejected from the one college I applied to that had a 76% admissions rate. UCLA was one of the 24% that didn't get in. And I had to go home to my mom until I got rejected. When she said maybe you should apply to more than one school. I got in on appeal. Eventually, I applied for 28 jobs out of UCLA. I got one offer at Morgan Stanley because they made automatic hires, automatic hires to people who'd rode crew. That's where I got my job. They decided that anyone who rode crew, varsity crew at UCLA got an automatic offer. Every other job I actually had to interview for, I got rejected. I applied to nine business schools. I got rejected, excuse me, by seven of the nine I've started. I've had five businesses fail, including one go chapter 11. My first marriage ended in divorce. I've had five TV shows. All five were canceled within weeks of launching. I mean, my superpower is the ability, as Winston Churchill said, to move through failure without losing my sense of enthusiasm. And if you don't maintain that ability to mourn and move on, you aren't taking advantage of one of the greatest features about America. And that is in America, we don't embrace failure. That's bullshit. But we tolerate it. I couldn't have had all this failure in Europe and kept raising money. At some point they would have said, oh, you're uninvestable. But in the US as long as you're a good person, you try hard, occasionally have a win, you'll find people who will back you and come to work with you.

Anthony Scaramucci (26:09)

Why is that, Scott? Because you and I have both traveled around the world. We know that that's the case in most of these other countries. But why is the ethos about America and entrepreneurship different?

Scott Galloway (26:20)

I get asked. I'm living in London right now and whenever I speak in the uk, I'd say two thirds of the time in Q and A, the question is some form of what are the key distinctions between the UK and Europe? In the US and there's a lot, but I would distill it down to kind of one basic feature, and that is the following. I say to them, you're the people that stayed. My mom got on a steamship about the same time. My dad distinctly got on a steamship from Glasgow, her from London. They each had about three or four hundred dollars and they crawled across the Atlantic in a steamship over seven or eight days and landed in a place initially in Toronto where there were people with megaphones saying, no jobs here, go home. Enormous risk and by the way, selfish. My mother did it when her two younger siblings were in an orphanage. Her parents had already passed away. Selfish risk taking. And in the US what you have is a DNA of risk taking that is unparalleled anywhere in the world. Maybe the exception of China. For every business in the US there are $5 million in venture capital. Raise in Europe is 1 million. So there's five times the amount of risk capital capital available in the us. What is the center of risk taking and innovation? Even within the us it's in California. What do those people have in common? They left the east coast and risk having to eat their niece across the Appalachian Trail or across the Rockies or die of scurvy on their way to the west coast. Because they were not only risk takers, they were the riskiest of the risk takers. And what do you know, the most tectonically valuable companies in history are all on the West Coast. So our DNA of risk taking is just singular. And you can have just a ridiculously fucking crazy idea. And if you can outline a vision and tell a good story and have perseverance and maybe willing to put some of your own capital and work your ass off, you can raise tens or hundreds of millions of dollars in a ridiculously crazy idea. But sometimes those ideas end up being crazy genius. And I'd say other than China, there's nowhere else you can do that. So I think it's a, it's in a. It's a full throated embrace of risk. Your thoughts?

Anthony Scaramucci (28:35)

Well, I agree with that. But before I get to my thoughts, I gotta ask one quick follow up. Why it's so hard for boys then today, here, if this is the place and you've aptly described the place, why is it still so hard?

Scott Galloway (28:51)

Because a variety of features. Okay, so now we're talking specifically about boys. One biologically, and they still don't know why. They don't know if it's pesticides or hormones, but boys are maturing later and girls are maturing earlier. Girls are menstruating earlier and earlier. Boys, testicles are Descending later and later. It's just a strange phenomena. They haven't figured it out yet. If you have. How old are your kids, Anthony?

Anthony Scaramucci (29:18)

I've got them all over the place. You know, as my older kids say, I made my own grandchildren, So I have 32, 29, 24, and then I have a 10 and 7 year old at home.

Scott Galloway (29:31)

So I don't know if you remember this, but My youngest is 14. He had a Halloween party, had his whole class over, like 22 kids. 11. 11 girls, 11 boys. The boys are dopes. They don't even look you in the eyes. Some of them are tiny. Of the 11 girls, three or four of them could be the junior senator from Pennsylvania. Hello, Mr. Galloway. What a lovely home you have. I love your podcast. Well, what are you studying? Well, I'm studying, I'm really interested in physics and I'm interning at this clinic at the nhs. And you think, Jesus Christ. I mean, and physically, literally, biologically, the prefrontal cortex of an 18 year old girl is 12 to 18 months more mature than a boy's. So an 18 year old who's a senior in high school applying to college is competing against a 16 and a half year old when she's applying next to an 18 year old boy. So they're literally biologically boys who are literally biologically behind and they don't catch up until they're 25. And then economically, or let's talk educationally, the education system is just biased against boys. A boy in K12 is twice as likely to be suspended on a behavior adjusted basis. Same exact infraction, twice as likely to be suspended if he is a boy, five times as likely to be suspended if he's a black boy. And once a kid is suspended three times, it means they're not going to college. Think about who's in Primary School. 70 to 80% of primary school teachers now, female. And who does a female teacher champion? The same people we would champion. People that remind them of themselves. And what are the behaviors we encourage in education? Sit still, be organized, raise your hand, be a pleaser. You're essentially describing a girl. And when we level the playing field in an education system that in many ways is bias or rewards the behavior that women or females are more have an easier time embracing. We now have 60, 40 female to male college attendance, and it may even be higher than that when you look at graduation rates, because men are more likely to drop out. And then you combine it with the fact that 40 years ago, one in three jobs required a college degree. Now it's two in three medical schools, law schools, now overwhelmingly female in the high end information, higher paying jobs are now kind of open or have been sequestered from many of the men who aren't cut out for college. In addition, we have cauterized those on ramps into a middle class that used to exist, whether it's manufacturing jobs or even just the zeitgeist in our society. What happened to metal Ottawa and wood shop? We got rid of them. We shamed vocational jobs, even though actually those jobs are in huge demand and well compensated. Now kids would rather be a barista and go get vocational training and learn how to install H vac efficient heaters. So it's biological, it's educational, it's societal, it's economical. And then what you have, you speedball it all with online dating where effectively, if you have 50 men and 50 women on say Tinder, 46 of the women show all of their attention to just four men. They all want the same dude. It's what I call Portia polygamy. Now those four dudes can have a date every night which does not encourage good behavior, does not encourage long term relationships. And the other 46 men are shut out. A man of average attractiveness on a dating app. So 1 to 100, least attractive, most attractive number 50. He has to swipe right 100 times to get one coffee. And then out of five coffees four will ghost him. The woman will reconsider and not show up or cancel. So he has to swipe right 500 times to get one coffee. So he feels rejected by females. He feels like dating is a humiliating experience. He doesn't learn the skills to go out, especially with remote work and establish game in person. Do you realize 50% get this Anthony. 50%. 50% of 18 to 24 year old men have never asked a woman out in person.

Anthony Scaramucci (33:47)

It's rough.

Scott Galloway (33:48)

Think about that. And what are those skills? Show me a guy who's good in a bar, I'll show you a guy who's good in a boardroom. Those skills are hugely important, very transferable. And if you don't. And then they don't even have the mojo, I never want it. Approaching a strange woman, setting yourself up, rejection. No one likes that. No one likes that unless you get really good at it. But what you do is you become resilient. And the way you actually get the mojo to do it. And I speak in very graphic terms. If I'd had when I was at ucla, there were days during the week where the only reason I went on campus and I went to class was because I thought there was a prospect I might meet a girl, convince her to come to my fraternity party and at some point have sex with her. I would get so fucking horny, I would say, okay, I am actually going to take these risks. And if I'd had porn at home and on my phone, I don't know whether I ever would have taken those risks because I just would have engaged in porn all goddamn day. I don't want to sound like these kids have something wrong with them. The low risk, low entry into friendship, discord and Reddit, trying to make money, Coinbase or Robinhood or relationships with YouPorn lowers your risk taking threshold. To go on campus and walk up to a strange woman and say, hey, doesn't English suck? What are you doing? Oh, we have. Are you going to the basketball game tonight? Would you like to grab coffee? And if you don't establish those skills, and specifically the ability to endure rejection, try the woman's not interested, and guess what, you're both going to be fine. And then you try again the next day and you realize, okay, this is what life is. Life is about rejection and then figuring out you're both going to be fine. And then occasionally someone says yes. The example I always use my friend David Frey, Dr. David Frey, dentist, not an attractive guy, strange guy, unusual guy. David would go up to. We would walk into a restaurant, we went to UCLA together. He would walk into any restaurant, any place, he'd look around the room, any attractive woman, he'd go up, whether she was with another guy, friends, and start talking to her. I remember being on the freeway, going to the Rose bowl to see a UCLA football game and he saw an attractive woman. So he sped up, started honking at her until she rolled down her window and he tried to get her number on the 405 freeway. And guess what? David always had dates. Because nine out of ten women would be like, mildly horrified he didn't care and reject him. But the 10th would give him his number or give him her number. If you want to score above your weight class, economically or romantically, then get out a big spoon and get ready to eat shit and deal with rejection. And the problem is the smartest, brightest people and deepest resourced companies in the world are trying to convince people you don't need to take these risks. In real life, you have a low entry, reasonable facsimile of friendship, mentorship, professional success, and sex on a screen with an algorithm. And it's Creating a new species of young men that are asexual and asocial and end up depressed, obese, and never develop the skills to interview, never develop the skills to have great friendship, never develop the skills and the resilience to get romantic and sexual relationships. And they end up. And if they don't develop these skills by the time they're 30, it is very hard, very hard to bring them back. And then they become more prone to misogynistic content. They have people online telling them that it's women's fault. They become very nationalistic. They start blaming immigrants, they start engaging in self harm. Everyone pathologizes these people as being school shooters. Yes, some of them are, but you know who, they're much more likely to hurt? Themselves. So we have this. I worry we're developing a new species of young man that is not connecting to work, not connecting to school, not connecting to women. And once they get to a certain point in their lives, they become very hard to retrain, to train up, to give those skills to them. So we have two thirds of people who apply for the armed services now are either too obese or too mentally unfit. So we have a real issue here around how do we level up young men such that they're more attractive to women, they're more confident, they get out more, they're better workers, they're more patriotic, they're stronger, they're more fit. Otherwise we're going to end up, we're going to keep going where we're going. And that is the most violent, unstable societies in the world have all one thing in common. They have a disproportionate number of young men with very little romantic or economic prospects. I would argue, Anthony, that is why Trump got elected.

Anthony Scaramucci (38:46)

Yeah.

Scott Galloway (38:48)

Anyways, I'll stop there.

Anthony Scaramucci (38:49)

No, no, listen, I wanted you to go because the stuff is so excellent. The content is very important for people to hear. And I do think that that's a reason why Trump got elected. It's sort of a backlash. But in our next episode, we're going to talk about a lot of these themes, which is masculinity and family. But I think you're hearing from Scott and myself, it's okay to fail. And the more failure you're comfortable with, the more success you're going to have in life. And I failed upward, Scott. I have stumbled a lot in my career, but by staying in the game is the number one thing. And I think it's a big message for these people. Almost want to put my arms around them and just give a hug and say, hey, it's okay to fail. I failed. Scott has failed. All those people you're looking up to have failed, and you got to just stay in the game. Thanks for joining us for this episode of Lost Boys. If you'd like more information, please go to our website www.lostboyz.men. in our next episode, Scott and I talk with Andrew Yang, businessman, author and politician who has a lot to say about why young men have been neglected and what we can do about it. Be sure to, like, follow and subscribe to Lost Boys wherever you get your podcast. And please share it with someone who cares about this or should care about this. And let's spread the word. Lost Boys is a production of Salt Media and the Casablanca Strategy Group. Barbara Fedita and Keith Summa are executive producers. Tanya Salotti is our researcher, Holly Duncan Quinn and Stanley Goldberg our editors. Special thanks to Christina Kasese, Mary Jan Ribas and Drew Barrows.