Louder with Crowder: Andrew Wilson Solves Feminism, Unpacks the Red Pill & Defines Gender Roles
Episode Release Date: May 7, 2025
In this compelling episode of "Louder with Crowder," host Steven Crowder engages in a deep and often contentious dialogue with guest Andrew Wilson. The conversation navigates through complex topics such as feminism, the red pill movement, gender roles, and the societal implications of shifting gender dynamics. Co-host Tomi Lahren also contributes, adding further layers to the discussion.
1. Introduction to Andrew Wilson and Key Concepts
[03:15] Steven Crowder:
Steven Crowder introduces Andrew Wilson, highlighting his presence in the manosphere and his critiques of feminism. Wilson is recognized for his roles in "Whatever Podcast" and "The Crucible" on YouTube.
[03:49] Andrew Wilson:
Wilson clarifies his stance, positioning himself as a Christian ethicist focused on politics. He distinguishes himself from the red pill movement and the manosphere, emphasizing his engagement in debates within these circles to understand and address their perspectives.
Notable Quote:
"The red pill itself is not actually an ideology. It's an idea of descriptors. And then there are ideologues, which we use the descriptors to back up whatever their ideology is."
— Andrew Wilson [05:39]
2. Defining the Red Pill and Manosphere
Wilson elaborates on the red pill as a collection of descriptors rather than a prescriptive ideology. He explains how different groups, such as pickup artists and men's rights advocates, interpret and utilize the red pill concepts to support their agendas.
[05:04] Andrew Wilson:
"Or another guy picks up this file and he's like, oh, well, this can help men with their dating."
— Andrew Wilson
Crowder relates this to earlier discussions on the show, drawing parallels with historical feminist movements and their impact on gender dynamics.
3. Gender Roles and Societal Duties
The discussion shifts to traditional gender roles, with Wilson asserting that men's primary duties are to protect and provide for women, while women’s responsibilities revolve around childbearing and maintaining the household.
[08:36] Steven Crowder:
Crowder challenges Wilson to define women's duties to match men's, pushing for a balanced view of gender responsibilities.
[09:54] Piers Morgan Clip:
A pre-recorded segment features Andrew Wilson debating Piers Morgan on the inherent duties of men and women, where Wilson criticizes Morgan’s stance on traditional masculinity and femininity.
Notable Exchange:
"What are the duties that women have towards men? What do men get out of this arrangement?"
— Andrew Wilson [09:17]
Crowder and Wilson discuss the implications of low birth rates and societal shifts away from traditional family structures, emphasizing the perceived negative consequences on civilization.
4. Historical Context and the Absence of Matriarchies
Wilson argues against the existence of matriarchal societies in history, contending that patriarchy has been the prevailing system across civilizations due to men's monopoly on force and governance.
[18:30] Andrew Wilson:
"There's never been a matriarchy in all of human history, ever."
— Andrew Wilson [19:35]
Crowder and Wilson critique progressive narratives that claim historical matriarchies existed, asserting that such claims lack substantial anthropological evidence.
5. Addressing Women's Happiness and Biological Differences
The conversation touches on studies indicating that women report lower happiness levels than men across various societies, regardless of conditions. Wilson links this to biological factors and societal expectations.
[21:11] Andrew Wilson:
"In a comparative analysis, they're always less happy than men. Always. So basically, it's just like, you just can't make women happy."
— Andrew Wilson [21:11]
Crowder introduces psychological perspectives, suggesting biological predispositions contribute to women's reported anxiety and worry.
6. Solutions to Declining Birth Rates and Societal Shifts
Wilson proposes two primary solutions to address declining birth rates:
-
Stop Emphasizing College for Women:
He argues that industrialization has led women to defer childbearing, resulting in aging populations and lower birth rates. -
Promote Traditional Virtues Through Propaganda:
Drawing parallels to World War II propaganda, Wilson suggests top-down promotional campaigns to reinforce traditional gender roles and virtues, such as chastity for women.
[25:28] Steven Crowder:
Crowder echoes Wilson's concerns, emphasizing the unrealistic expectations placed on women regarding ideal partners and the impact on long-term relationships.
Notable Quote:
"We need top-down propaganda like you had in World War II... Just make the propaganda all about the family unit."
— Andrew Wilson [34:34]
7. The Role of Rhetoric and Logic in Debates
Wilson highlights the importance of logic and rhetoric in debates, criticizing opponents for resorting to ad hominem attacks when faced with logical arguments. He emphasizes the effectiveness of combining logical reasoning with rhetorical strategies to sway opinions.
[58:14] Andrew Wilson:
"So, bam. You smack them back. They lose their argument and their personal stance."
— Andrew Wilson [58:14]
Crowder relates his personal experiences, praising fatherly guidance in developing logical thinking and effective debate techniques.
Notable Anecdote:
"My dad taught me how to think... logic is intuitive anyway, but you can formalize it."
— Andrew Wilson [55:23]
8. Personal Experiences and Anecdotes
Both hosts share personal stories illustrating their approaches to logic and debate. Wilson recounts his father's fervent political discussions, while Crowder shares moments where logical reasoning influenced his perspectives.
[56:23] Steven Crowder:
Crowder appreciates his father's role in fostering his logical thinking, recounting a memory where his father challenged his drama teacher's political views.
9. Conclusion and Final Remarks
The episode concludes with Crowder and Wilson summarizing their viewpoints on the necessity of reinforcing traditional gender roles to stabilize society. They advocate for a return to virtues and structured societal duties as a means to address contemporary challenges related to gender dynamics and population decline.
[43:50] Andrew Wilson:
"Men, much, much harder. And here's what we have to deal with... the submerged propaganda."
— Andrew Wilson [43:50]
Crowder emphasizes the importance of dismantling misconceptions and promoting realistic expectations in relationships to foster healthier societal structures.
Key Takeaways
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Red Pill as Descriptors: Wilson distinguishes the red pill movement as a set of descriptors rather than a cohesive ideology, used differently by various groups within the manosphere.
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Traditional Gender Roles: The discussion underscores the belief in inherent duties of men as protectors/providers and women as caretakers and childbearers, arguing that deviations from these roles contribute to societal issues like low birth rates.
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Propaganda for Virtue Reinforcement: Wilson proposes utilizing top-down propaganda to re-establish traditional virtues, drawing parallels with historical wartime propaganda efforts.
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Logic and Rhetoric in Debates: Emphasis is placed on the strategic use of logic combined with effective rhetoric to counteract opposing viewpoints and enforce one's stance in debates.
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Critique of Feminism and Modern Societal Shifts: The episode critically examines contemporary feminist movements, arguing that they undermine traditional gender roles and contribute to societal instability.
This summary encapsulates the main discussions and viewpoints presented in the episode, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the full podcast.