Episode Overview

Podcast: Love and Radio
Episode: Representation
Date: April 26, 2023
Guest: Marilyn York, prominent men's rights divorce attorney
Host: Nick Van Der Kolk

In this candid, darkly humorous episode, Marilyn York—an attorney known for representing men in divorce and family law—talks about abusive clients, the gendered dynamics of custody, her controversial commercials, and the personal history that fuels her empathy for “underdogs.” The conversation delves into family court biases, her complicated relationship with her father, and why she is both adored and reviled for her work.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Handling Difficult and Abusive Clients

• Marilyn regularly fires clients who cross ethical or personal safety boundaries.
  • “I have clients that death threat me and throw a brick through my window... I stood there and let the loogie drip down my face and onto my lips. ...I know exactly how to de-escalate and when to be afraid for my safety.” (00:18–01:18)
  • She recounts firing clients for abuse, dishonesty, or non-payment, and involving law enforcement or CPS when necessary.
• Masculine client base and staff perspectives:
  • “Women don’t leave nice guys, they leave psychos. By nature, we have a higher percentage of difficult personalities in our client base.” (01:36)
  • Despite this, she describes genuine gratitude and affection from most clients, creating a “contingent of dudes” protective of her on social media and beyond.

2. Personal History: Advocacy for Underdogs

• Family background as an influence:
  • Marilyn describes growing up as her older brother’s protector, who struggled socially and may have been on the autism spectrum.
    • “I graduated from high school early in Reno at 16... I got called ugly my first day of school… I literally already get blowjobs, honey.” (02:58–05:28)
  • Response to adversity: Leaving home early and racing through education as a response to an emotionally distant, at times abusive, father.
• Early legal career and the allure of family law:
  • After graduating law school at 20, Marilyn was drawn to family law for its real, raw emotional stakes, connecting her with “good people at their worst.”

3. Transition to Men's Rights Advocacy

• Motivation and immediate focus:
  • “As soon as I started my firm in April 2001, I immediately did men’s rights from the moment I opened the doors.” (07:58)
• Highlighting system flaws with poignant case studies:
  • Case of man surprised by a 16-year-old son and back child support; the system’s rigidity and the emotional chaos it produces.
    • “The mom says, ‘He raped me,’ in the hallway to my client… My client falls to his knees, hysterically crying at the feet of his child.” (09:19)
  • Marilyn condemns the ways mothers can conceal paternity or custody from fathers with “no repercussions.” (10:44)

4. Notable Victories and Gender Dynamics

• Legal “accidental genius” and empowerment:
  • Story of a “rich cowboy” client whose gold-digging wife’s claim unraveled because their marriage was technically invalid—leaving her with nothing but a diamond ring.
    • “...She picked the big diamond. So that’s all she’s getting from this marriage because she’s legally entitled to nothing.” (11:20–13:29)
• Female attorney representing male clients:
  • “If a man spoke to my male clients the way I do, they’d get punched in the face. …I called my client a pussy four times. He’s in a motorcycle gang, used to sell meth… I said to him, if a man had spoken to you the way I did, would you punch him? He goes, ‘I would have fucking shot you.’ And I said, and you just paid me $10,000.” (14:10–14:38)

5. Family Court Biases and Societal Realities

• Different standard for mothers and fathers in the system:
  • “Not in a million years. Not in a million years would a man ever see his kid again if he did this.” (17:10)
• Acknowledges men often fare better post-divorce, but criticizes fairness:
  • “I will never get the same amount of spousal support for a man as I would a woman in the same exact financial circumstances... Now, I’m not sure that’s wrong. ...the reality is men still outearn women.” (18:14)

6. The Power and Backlash of Media: Marilyn's Commercials

• Commercials use humor and provoke strong reactions:
  • Example script: “Are you watching the game at a friend’s or the bar again? Because you can’t watch at home with your wife? Or worse, because she kicked you out and kept your couch, your flat screen, and your kids. …What’s the one thing a man needs when he loses a good woman? A good lawyer. And when he loses a bad woman, he needs a great lawyer.” (20:10–21:03)
  • Negative responses: “Marilyn York is white trash. She just runs a brothel for herself to sleep with her own clients. Is anyone still wondering why I represent men?” (21:38)
  • Marilyn notes the irony that the angriest responses come from women, not men.
• Commercials spark real-life cases:
  • “I had two kids who filmed my commercial with their iPad because their mom was screwing their baseball coach to show their dad my commercial to tell him. ...CPS got involved, and I got hired by the dad because of it.” (22:20–22:50)

7. Reflections on Gender Roles and Family

• Contrasts with her mother’s submissive role:
  • “My mom is religious and Midwestern. She’s very submissive. ...I call her Stepford Wife because I’m an asshole.” (24:46–25:16)
• Male-female dynamics and inability to play “helpless”:
  • “She would tell me, like, honey, you need to be more helpless. Men love that. And I was like, she’s right. But hell no. Hell no. If someone tells me what to do, I lose my mind.” (25:55–27:00)

8. Complex Relationship with Her Father

• Deeply formative but also emotionally and physically abusive:
  • “My dad told me what to be from the time I was a child. ...My dad’s straight up abusive. Like, he was physically abusive to me as a child, and he’s verbally abusive, and he’s emotionally manipulative and extremely dangerous. Absolutely. I’ll say it to his face.” (30:47–31:50)
  • Despite this, she credits him with her career and drive, describing a cycle of emotional closeness punctuated by harm.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Who do you think gets left? Women don’t leave nice guys, they leave psychos.”
  — Marilyn York (01:36)

• “My inspiration for representing men is just two, basically: my dad... I’ve always liked spending time with men more. ...I’m a little boy hungry too, in case my track record of husbands doesn’t make that clear. I had seven fiancés too.”
  — Marilyn York (13:29)

• “If a man spoke to my male clients the way I do, they’d get punched in the face. ...‘I would have fucking shot you.’ And I said, and you just paid me 10 grand. Like, I have the best job ever.”
  — Marilyn York (14:10–14:38)

• “Not in a million years would a man ever see his kid again if he did this.”
  — Marilyn York, on double standards in family court (17:10)

• “I’m men’s rights attorney Marilyn York, and I represent men in divorce, custody, and family law matters. The first couple versions I write of any of these commercials are way worse than the ones that air.”
  — Marilyn York (20:55)

• “Apparently, some women take great exception to me representing men in family law matters. ...About 10% of the calls were to tell me I suck and I should go to hell and they’re gonna kill me. And it’s women, always.”
  — Marilyn York (21:38)

• “My mom... is very submissive… and yet, it’s not fair for me to impose my upbringing on her... Her marriage works. And I’m on number four. So, like, she’s got some tricks up her sleeve, but no, thanks.”
  — Marilyn York (25:16)

• “My dad’s straight up abusive… And he’ll literally tell me, like, you should thank me for hurting you as a kid because you were a fucking nightmare and a monster.”
  — Marilyn York (31:50)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Dealing with Abusive Clients: 00:16–02:35
• Underdog Advocacy & Early Career: 02:58–07:53
• Men’s Rights and Legal System Critique: 07:58–11:13
• Personal and Professional Triumphs: 11:20–13:46
• Gender Dynamics in Practice: 13:46–17:10
• Family Court Biases and Outcomes: 17:10–19:46
• Controversial Commercials and Backlash: 19:58–24:46
• Family Traditions and Gender Roles: 24:46–27:00
• York's Relationship with Her Father: 27:00–31:50

Tone and Style

Marilyn York’s storytelling is candid, irreverent, self-deprecating, and at times, darkly comic. She moves fluidly between brutal honesty about abuse and trauma, scathing takes on family law hypocrisy, and playful jabs at herself and those around her. Her strength and survival instincts shine throughout, as does her simultaneous empathy for “underdogs” and willingness to challenge both societal and professional expectations.

Summary

This episode offers a complex, unvarnished look into the life and philosophy of a woman who’s made a career out of advocating for men in a system she thinks is biased against them, all while grappling with her own fraught family legacy and public notoriety. With raw anecdotes and biting humor, Marilyn York exposes the ugly, the unjust, and the unexpectedly redemptive sides of family law.