Not Over Yet | EP 15

Summary

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Love Trapped | Episode 15: "Not Over Yet"

Release Date: July 9, 2026
Host: Stephanie Young
Podcast by: iHeartPodcasts and Glass Podcasts

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Episode Overview

This episode of Love Trapped follows former Bachelor Clayton Echard as he attends key court hearings in the ongoing criminal case against Laura Owens—a one-night fling turned multi-year legal nightmare. Owens is facing 14 felony charges involving fraud, forgery, and more, with several named victims, including Clayton and Greg Gillespie. The episode delves deep into the recent pre-trial hearings, the emotional toll on the victims, the persistent plea deal delays, and tangential legal trouble involving Laura’s family.
Theme: The pursuit of accountability amid manipulation, bureaucracy, and personal pain—with a close look at the justice system’s slow grind.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Clayton’s Courthouse Reflections (02:16–03:47)

• Clayton records a voice memo en route to court, underscoring his determination for resolution and desire for the judge to understand his persistence.
• Memorable Moment: He makes intense eye contact with Laura, describing visible sadness and defeat in her demeanor—a stark change from previous hearings.

“I almost saw in her eyes, like a sadness at what she's done. Maybe it's hit her that it's a very real possibility she's going to get locked away.”
—Clayton Echard, (03:03)

2. Courtroom Proceedings & Settlement Conference (04:30–14:03)

• Laura’s Legal Status: 14 felony charges (mainly fraud and forgery), potential for years in prison, but also eligibility for probation.
• Digital Evidence Issues: The prosecution's voluminous digital forensic evidence (multiple terabytes) is cited as a source of delay—Owens’ new attorney needs more time to review it.
• Prosecutor’s Frustration: Repeated delays, third defense attorney, mounting victim frustration.
• Defense Admission: Laura’s lawyer admits evidence of perjury is “strong” (13:17).

“Listen, you know the evidence of perjury is strong. You and I have talked about that.”
—Christian Lueders, Defense Attorney, (13:17)

3. Victim Testimonies & Plea Deal Delay Frustration (14:03–16:59)

• Clayton’s Statement: He objects to further plea extensions, perceiving the defense’s delays as tactical and emotionally draining for all involved.

“She's admitted on the stand to medical fraud. She's admitted to certain lies. It's a clear cut case. She's guilty. There's no reason to drag it out…”
—Clayton Echard, (14:03)

• Greg Gillespie’s Concerns: Wonders about time limits if Laura continues to switch attorneys.
• Commissioner Simon assures the court must balance due process with moving the case along (20:25).

4. Emotional Fallout & Systemic Frustrations (22:20–34:24)

• Both victims discuss the emotional weight of enduring years of court proceedings, feeling powerless against the pace and decisions of the court.
• Revelation: Judge in chambers learned Laura would accept a plea only if no jail/prison time; prosecutors refuse to remove incarceration from the table.

“For me, I'm just gonna sit here and go on with my life…let the justice system basically go at a snail's pace like it always does. Maybe we just see it for what it is. A system that's broken.”
—Clayton Echard, (31:28)

• Attorney Woodnick’s Take: Reminds listeners that these delays are standard, built in to ensure fairness and minimize grounds for appeal.

“If those sort of accommodations assure that a defendant, Laura or anyone else gets a fair trial, then the court needs to be doing that.”
—Greg Woodnick, (33:35)

5. Victims’ Resolve & Court Impact (34:24–35:01)

• Woodnick underscores the power of victims attending court—sending a message about persistence, accountability, and their refusal to back down.

“The victim showing up sends a message that we're here, we will be here, we will be here no matter what.”
—Greg Woodnick, (34:38)

6. Parallel Legal Trouble: Laura’s Family Bankruptcy Saga (38:41–53:10)

• Parents’ Home in Peril: Laura’s parents, Ron and Jan, are facing foreclosure and bankruptcy issues, with a judge scrutinizing their lack of transparency, especially regarding $137,000 raised on GoFundMe.
• Judge Wansley’s Stern Approach: Demands a full accounting of assets, is unimpressed with the Owens' explanations, and repeatedly calls out lack of compliance.

“It's not appropriate to file bankruptcy…obtain the protections of bankruptcy and yet not fulfill the obligations.”
—Judge Madeline Wansley, (46:52)

• Key Deadlines: July 10 for paperwork, foreclosure auction set for July 28, 2026, and court return August 6.

7. What’s Next for Laura Owens (54:07–End)

• Laura remains at her parents' home, likely awaiting the outcome on both the criminal charges and her family’s financial struggle.
• Next key criminal court date: August 28, 2026, for the possible plea resolution.

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• Clayton on Laura’s demeanor:
  “It really felt like she's defeated.” (03:03 — Clayton Echard)
• Clayton confronting delay tactics:
  “It's been three years. I know we're all tired…She's admitted on the stand to medical fraud.” (14:03 — Clayton Echard)
• Defense Atty. Lueders admits:
  “The evidence of perjury is strong. You and I have talked about that.” (13:17 — Christian Lueders)
• Prosecutor Ed Leiter on digital evidence:
  “I think we're multiple terabytes of data…the evidence is voluminous.” (10:46 — Ed Leiter)
• Greg Gillespie on process fatigue:
  “Are we going to put any time frames around [getting new counsel] so we're not doing this over and over again?” (20:15 — Greg Gillespie)
• Judge Wansley to Jan Owens:
  “Once you’re under the jurisdiction of this court, you have to abide by the Bankruptcy Code…It requires absolute transparency.” (46:52 — Judge Madeline Wansley)
• Woodnick on fairness in process:
  “If Laura wants to go to trial, great, go to trial. Let’s make sure it’s a very fair trial.” (33:35 — Greg Woodnick)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Clayton heads to courthouse / Laura’s demeanor shifts: 02:16–03:34
• Outline of charges and sentencing range: 06:50–08:54
• Discussion about volume of evidence causing delays: 10:41–12:24
• Victim statements addressing ongoing delays: 14:03–16:44
• Victims urging for deadlines and accountability: 20:05–21:03
• Plea deal extension frustrations and new deadlines: 28:06–30:31
• Attorney Woodnick’s insight on systemic pace: 32:15–34:24
• Owens family bankruptcy hearing highlights: 40:08–53:10

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Episode Flow and Tone

• The episode is methodical, emotional, and deeply personal—capturing the frustrations of victims trying to move on, contrasted with the clinical slow-rolling of the justice system.
• Repeated themes: exhaustion, tangles of bureaucracy, the human toll of “the process,” and the difficulty of holding a master manipulator accountable.
• Host Stephanie Young maintains a steady, investigative tone, unafraid to let the ugliness of frustration and fear into the conversation:

  “Let's show all of it, including some of the stuff that might be perceived as ugly. I don't care. I'm just human.” (31:34 — Clayton Echard)

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Summary Table: Upcoming Legal Milestones

| Event | Date | |-----------------------------------------------|---------------------| | Laura's new settlement conference / plea deal | Aug 28, 2026 | | Ron & Jan’s bankruptcy paperwork deadline | July 10, 2026 | | Foreclosure auction for parents’ home | July 28, 2026 | | Next bankruptcy court hearing | August 6, 2026 | | Potential criminal trial (if no plea) | November 2026 (est.)|

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Final Thoughts

This episode stands as a raw window into the toll of protracted legal battles, for both the accused and accusers. The “battle of narratives” isn’t over, and the collective hope remains for both justice and closure.

Next steps: Awaiting Laura’s decision at her August plea deadline. Meanwhile, her family’s financial crisis continues to unfold in parallel—potentially influencing whatever comes next in this ongoing web.

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For more information or to share your own story, reach out at [e-mail], and follow @glasspodcasts on Instagram.

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Transcript

[Stephanie Young]

This is an iHeart podcast, guaranteed human

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[Clayton Eckerd]

It's Friday, June 26th and I am heading to the courthouse right now for hearing on whether or not they extend this plea deal out again.

[Stephanie Young]

Clayton sent me this voice note as he headed to the Maricopa County Superior Courthouse. He was hoping for a resolution, one that included jail or prison as part of Laura's sentence. And Clayton is determined to go to all the pre trial hearings he can so he can let the judge know that at every hearing he's been trying to catch Laura's gaze to let her know he's not afraid of her. She usually won't look him in the eye, but at this specific hearing, Clayton says she looked right at him.

[Clayton Eckerd]

I made eye contact with Laura and she looked away and then looked right back. Stared at me for a couple seconds and did that about four times. As I stared at her for a solid 20 seconds look, it felt different. I almost saw in her eyes, like a sadness at what she's done. Maybe it's hit her that it's very real possibility she's going to get locked away. It really felt like she's defeated.

[Stephanie Young]

Clayton wasn't the only victim who showed up in court that day. Greg Gillespie was there too. He's the one who went on a few dates with Laura back in 2021 and is now named as the state's other primary victim.

[Clayton Eckerd]

And it could have been that me and Greg showed up, that she realized like, oh, fuck, these guys are not just gonna like move on. They're here to make sure that I face accountability.

[Stephanie Young]

I'm Stephanie Young and this is love Trapped, there's no way out.

[Voice Actor (Threatening Quote)]

You'd better believe I'll be raising holy hell, my love if you ever, ever, ever, ever try to leave.

[Stephanie Young]

Last week on Monday, June 29, Laura was back in court. She's facing 14 felony charges, including fraud, forgery, perjury, tampering with physical evidence, and theft by extortion. She'd been offered a plea deal by the state, and we thought that on June 29, she'd either have to accept the plea or begin the trial process. Instead, the deadline for her criminal plea was extended. Once again, I don't like to be the person who brings you this news. I feel like the boy who cried wolf. I believed, like a lot of my sources in this story, that we would finally have an answer on Monday. But we didn't. So I'm going to walk you through what happened. Let's go back to Friday, June 26th. That's when there was a settlement conference in her case. It's basically a meeting where a defendant can have a more transparent conversation with a judge about how this case can be resolved without trial. We were told these meetings are typically private behind closed doors, so I didn't plan to attend, but to our surprise, this one was open to the public. Two of the victims listed in this case, Clayton Eckerd and Greg Gillespie, were both in attendance. I caught up with Clayton and his attorney Woodnick, right after the hearing, and you'll hear from them throughout this episode. Thankfully, the hearing was recorded and posted

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

on YouTube and the court will call matter on the calendar. State v. Laura owens, case number Sierra2025 00 905. Can I have appearances, please, starting with State?

[Ed Leiter (State Prosecutor)]

Good afternoon, Adler and Beth, State.

[Christian Lueders (Defense Attorney)]

Afternoon, you, Honor. Christian leaders on behalf of Laura Owens, who's present with me at the defense table.

[Stephanie Young]

This hearing was presided over by a commissioner, not a judge. And Commissioner Jonathan Simon was pretty thorough. Part of his job is to explain the criminal process to the defendant. In this case, that's Laura.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

Ms. Owens, my name is Commissioner Simon, and I've been asked to do a settlement conference in your case today. This is an informal setting where you'll have the opportunity, opportunity to talk about your case if you want to, and just see if you can get it resolved. We're going to discuss and you can ask questions about the plea agreement that you've been offered in this case and the options that you have in this case and the potential range of penalties.

[Stephanie Young]

Commissioner Simon made it clear that he won't be the one making a ruling on her criminal case. But it's important to have the commissioner explain all the options on the table for the defendant. This has to be on the record.

[Narrator/Host or Production Staff]

It's part of due process.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

I'm just going to help you get as much information as you can about your case while you still have some options. And I know that there is a current plea offer on the table.

[Stephanie Young]

He then detailed what would happen if Laura doesn't take the plea deal.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

If you do decide to go to the trial and you don't want the plea agreement in this case, there is a possibility, obviously, that the jury finds you not guilty on these charges, which would be, I think, your best case scenario. Right. But if the jury finds you guilty on any of these charges, then the judge would have to impose the sentence and you are probation eligible. So if the jury finds you guilty on any of these charges, the judge at sentencing could place you on probation for each of those counts. With any probation term, a judge can impose up to 12 months of jail as a term of probation. Do you understand that?

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Yes.

[Court Participant (Likely Defense or Witness)]

Thank you.

[Jennifer Giamo (US Trustee Attorney)]

Okay.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

And if you don't get probation, the judge may sentence you to prison.

[Stephanie Young]

Laura is being charged with 14 felonies. Here's the breakdown, 11 class four felonies, one class six felony, and then the most serious, two class two felonies. Arizona has guidelines for prison terms for each kind of offense, and within each guideline, there's a wide range of sentencing.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

You'll see for the Class 2 felony, the lowest sentence is three years, and the aggravated sentence is 12 and a half years. For the Class 4 felonies, that would be a mitigated sentence of one year, and the maximum would be three years on those. And for that Class 6 felony, the mitigated, the lowest, would be four months, and the aggravated, which would be the highest, would be two years. So if you're found guilty on multiple counts in your sentence, the judge can have those run concurrently. So those prison sentences at the same time or consecutively, which means they'd run one after the other, do you understand that as well?

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[Court Participant (Likely Defense or Witness)]

Thank you.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

I guess if you took this to trial and it was the absolute worst day that you could have at trial, but just assuming for today's hearing that they'd all have to run consecutively one after the other, for the Class 4 felonies with the 11 of those, that would be over 37 years for those. And for the Class 2s, it would be over 25 years for those, and for that Class 6, it would be two years on that one.

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[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

If you add those up, it would be a significant amount of time.

[Stephanie Young]

The commissioner said he didn't think that was likely to happen, but wanted to make sure Laura understood what was at stake here. I asked Clayton's attorney, Greg Woodnick, about this moment.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

Does that mean she's going to prison? No, but it's really fucking scary. I mean, if I were Laura, I would have been anxious hearing that read out loud, even though she's probably read the supervening indictment hundreds of times.

[Stephanie Young]

After the commissioner explained the whole process, the state prosecutor, Ed Leiter, was given the opportunity to address the plea deal on the table.

[Ed Leiter (State Prosecutor)]

Your Honor, the plea agreement, which was sent to defense counsel over a month ago, it does expire today. One of the issues, and I do want to express, and I think one of the victims wants to address the court. The frustration, and this is often a frustration that all parties, but often victims specifically feel in terms of how long the justice system often takes in this particular case. Mr. Lueders is now her third attorney. Whenever additional attorneys come onto a case or a new attorney, that tends to drag the case on further. And certainly I understand, and the victims, rightfully so, are deeply frustrated about how long this is taking.

[Stephanie Young]

And then Mr. Leiter addressed the amount of evidence they're working with in this case.

[Ed Leiter (State Prosecutor)]

One of the issues, and it provides the crux of the State's case against Ms. Owens, is the vast majority of our evidence against her is digital forensic evidence derived largely from her cloud account, cell phone extractions, among others. As a result, that evidence is voluminous. I think we're multiple terabytes of data. The state has moved as quickly as we can to get that information in front of Mr. Lueders, but as I understand, he can explain in more detail, but there has been some issues in terms of his ability to review some of that evidence.

[Stephanie Young]

According to the prosecutor, Laura's attorney is having difficulty accessing some of the digital evidence, which seems to be causing a delay. Here's how the commissioner responded.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

I do understand the frustration that this case is taking longer than you'd like, but Mr. Liters does have an obligation to properly advise his client on how to proceed. And in order to do that, I think he has to review all of the evidence. So if he were go to trial without having to review all of the evidence or the court didn't give him that proper time to do that, the case wouldn't be closed as quickly as maybe you would like, because I think it would open the case up for potentially an appeal and possibly going back to trial on that. So I think the idea is that if we can give Mr. Lueders the opportunity to review all of the evidence here, he can properly advise Ms. Owens and prepare for trial. Given the terabytes, I would think that that would take some time to go through. So I'd be inclined to give, and it wouldn't be again the ruling on this, but any judge would be inclined to give Mr. Luders time to review that.

[Stephanie Young]

Laura's attorney is telling the courts there are terabytes and terabytes of evidence and he needs more time to go through it all. We've only heard about a sliver of what's in that digital evidence. So when I hear there's so much more digital evidence, my mind is racing trying to imagine what the state might have found. There was one moment where the prosecutor revealed more details about the charges and the listed victims in this case.

[Ed Leiter (State Prosecutor)]

I haven't spoken about this, but there's also Stormy Mitchell, who is the woman whose ultrasound was used by Ms. Owens. That is actually a third victim, and she feels very strongly about being exploited by the miss Owens.

[Stephanie Young]

Then Laura's attorney asked the prosecutor about the specifics of the Fraudulent scheme charge. And in the middle of that question, he said something interesting.

[Christian Lueders (Defense Attorney)]

Listen, you know the evidence of perjury is strong. You and I have talked about that.

[Stephanie Young]

I was surprised. Laura's attorney admitted on the record that the evidence of perjury is strong. So I asked Greg Woodnick about it.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

I heard Christian's comment on the recording. I don't know if that's what he meant, but I heard what he said. Is it possible that he's already looked through some of it and seen some very damaging data? Yeah, I think there's probably more than a lot of evidence against Laura. I think we all think that. I think that's probably the genesis of a lot of the frustration.

[Stephanie Young]

Because this settlement hearing is informal, the victims were allowed to speak. Clayton went first. He questioned Laura's attorney's request for more time to review the evidence.

[Clayton Eckerd (Victim)]

The big thing I want to focus on is not allowing an extension of the plea deal simply because she has a history of delaying, and it's just going to continue. My understanding is he's come into the case a few months ago, and this feels like an 11th hour push to say, I can't access the material. You know, to me, if you couldn't access the material, you should have accessed it day one and every single day. You should have been following up to get that evidence. I'm all for due process, but to me, this just feels like an extension of her tactic carried out by him to extend it. And it's been three years. I'm tired. I know. We're all tired. And a ton of evidence, blatantly obvious. She's admitted on the stand to medical fraud. She's admitted to certain lies. It's a clear cut case. She's guilty. There's no reason to drag it out and say the terabytes of information are going to somehow change something. When did you come in? When did you get the material first sent to you? And then how hard did you really try to access this material? I just would like to know how much effort he's put into actually accessing the documents. I think that's important to take into consideration.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

I mean, do you have any ideas how long it will take you to. To get to that information? All right, Review that information.

[Christian Lueders (Defense Attorney)]

The specific question is how hard I've tried.

[Stephanie Young]

Clayton sent me a voice memo after the hearing where he talked about this moment.

[Clayton Eckerd]

He kind of gave me a smart ass response to my question as far as like, when did he get the information and what's he been doing this whole time? And he just said to the judge, like, what's the question? Like, how much effort have I put in? That felt very condescending.

[Stephanie Young]

Back in the hearing, Christian Lueders had a response to Clayton. He said he had been trying to access the evidence, at least more so than any of Laura's previous attorneys, I can safely say.

[Christian Lueders (Defense Attorney)]

And I've made this clear to the prosecutor's office for the past month and a half or so, since this was officially disclosed and actually was disclosed to her previous attorney. That's not incorrect. But there was nothing done about that information with any of the previous attorneys. I can safely say that, that we're the first ones who have actually started to look at it and we have done everything we can up to this point to do that. That's what I'll say.

[Stephanie Young]

Before Friday's hearing concluded, there was another victim who wanted to speak, someone who has his own history with Laura. But we haven't heard a lot from Greg Gillespie.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

If Laura attains new representation, are we

[Stephanie Young]

going to put any time frames around

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

that so we're not doing this over

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

and over and over again?

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[Stephanie Young]

One of the victims named in Laura's criminal case, Greg Gillespie, attended the hearing on June 26. Greg had one particular concern.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

If Laura attains new representation, are we

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

going to put any time frames around

[Stephanie Young]

that so we're not doing this over

[Clayton Eckerd (Victim)]

and over and over again?

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

Given the circumstances, I would think that if there was a new attorney on the case, the judge would try to put some parameters in place. But again, it's really difficult for me to say what those parameters would be. But again, I do understand your concerns and your frustrations in that regard and wanting to get this case moving and see that justice is done.

[Stephanie Young]

Greg Gillespie told the judge he'd been dealing with the impacts of this since 2021, and Greg had a good question what happens if Laura fires this attorney and gets a new one? Or what if he quits? I asked Woodnick about this very real possibility.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

If she did part ways with current counsel, she would need enough time to get new counsel so that they could get up to speed and handle advising her on a plea or getting the matter ready for trial. Is that going to cause delays or would that cause delays? Absolutely. At some point, is the court going to say, you know, we can't do this anymore. We need to move this along? Yes, but the court is never going to say that in a way that deprives Laura of the ability to defend herself. And the court should not do that because it's important that Laura is adequately represented. It's important that Anyone accused of 14 felony charges have adequate representation representation.

[Stephanie Young]

Friday's hearing gave us insight into why the state is considering an extension of the plea deadline, but nothing was officially decided.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

So it sounds like we're not going to be able to get the case resolved today, at least this current version of the plea agreement. Would that be fair? That's fair, your honor. Okay. Is there anything else that we need to address today? I know we do have. There is. Case management conference. Looks like Monday. In front of judge Ruder?

[Christian Lueders (Defense Attorney)]

I don't think so. Not from the defense perspective.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

Ms. Hollins, did you have any questions for me?

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

No.

[Stephanie Young]

Thank you, your honor.

[Ryan Reynolds (Mint Mobile Advertiser)]

Okay.

[Commissioner Jonathan Simon]

Well, I appreciate you all being here this afternoon and sharing your concerns as well.

[Stephanie Young]

After the hearing ended, I talked with Clayton. He told me something interesting. He and Laura were making eye contact, and he felt like something about her had changed.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

There was a moment in the court where I felt this urge to just stare her down. And in the past, I've done it. It's not so much to intimidate her. It's more like, I'm not afraid of you. You can't do anything to me, and I hope you can feel that. So I did that this last time, and Laura made eye contact and then darted her eyes away like she typically does. But this time, she darted her eyes away and then instantly looked back at me. Held her gaze for, like, three seconds, darted her eyes away, then held her gaze for, like, five, six seconds. And at that point, I broke my eye contact because, like, I was taken aback because it was the first time that she's ever locked eyes with me and held it. In that moment, there was something different resonating from her. She's looked at me in the past, and she's given me, like, that smirk, you know, like I've Got you. And who do you think you are doing this to me? But this time was like there was something weird there where it was like she was looking at me and it was almost like a scared child. So it was fear, but it was also a mix of like, I'm sorry, I don't know what I've done. And that was weird. That was just something on Friday that happened. That was a first time thing and it was something new. I'll just. That was for sure. It was a new look that I am like, okay, something has shifted.

[Stephanie Young]

On Monday, June 29, everyone arrived at the Maricopa County Superior Courthouse once again. This time, it was for a status update in Laura's criminal case.

[Court Clerk or Bailiff]

This is CR2025 007905. State versus Laura Michelle Owens. Time set four for a complex case management conference and a status conference.

[Stephanie Young]

I wasn't able to be there in person, but a few of my sources were there, and they said there appeared to be extra security in the courthouse that day. We'd already gotten a preview of what Laura's attorney might say, which is that he needed more time to review the evidence. But Monday was Laura's opportunity for a formal answer on the plea deal. And there was still a little hope that it could finally be over, that Laura would surprise us all by taking the plea. Clayton told me the hearing began in a way he didn't expect.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

The judge wants to meet with the prosecutor and her lawyer back in the chambers. So I was already kind of like, really? Like, why can't we discuss this openly?

[Stephanie Young]

After a few minutes, the judge and lawyers returned to the courtroom. But now that they were on the record, there was very little they had to discuss. Most of it had already been covered at the settlement conference a few days earlier. The only thing left was an administrative detail.

[Court Clerk or Bailiff]

All right, there's a pending motion. Modify release conditions to permit travel. Mr. Leiter, did you want to be heard on that issue?

[Stephanie Young]

On Friday, June 26, Laura submitted an out of state travel request. Remember, because she's charged with 14 felonies in the state of Arizona, she has to ask for permission to leave the state. She wanted to go to San Diego, California, right after this hearing. We've had a voice actor read from the travel request.

[Voice Actor (Reading Travel Request)]

The purpose of her trip is to help her sister Sarah with caring for her young children. Sarah has been away from her home on business, and her husband was unexpectedly called away next week for work. They have no one to care for their two young children while they're away. The couple frequently relies on Ms. Owens for childcare, and they do not have another option in this situation.

[Stephanie Young]

The victims have the right to object to travel requests. In this case, both Greg and Clayton said they didn't want Laura to travel out of state. Afterwards, I asked Clayton why he feels that way.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

She deserves to start feeling the pain of her actions. There needs to be something inconveniencing her, because as of right now, there is nothing inconveniencing her. Laura can go do anything she wants today because she has no restrictions. You wouldn't even know that Laura is facing felony charges.

[Stephanie Young]

You can hear the frustration in Clayton's voice. But in the end, Judge Ruder permitted Laura's travel request.

[Court Clerk or Bailiff]

I did review the record. Ms. Owens made all her court appearances. Does not appear to be a flight risk. So over the Victim's objection, permit Ms. Owens to travel to California.

[Stephanie Young]

When I talked to Clayton after the fact, he was still heated about this.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

I'm like, that's problematic to me because Laura should have been already feeling the ramifications for her actions. But yet the court has just said, you want more time? There you go, Laura.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

Have it.

[Stephanie Young]

At the end of the hearing, there was some back and forth about scheduling the next one. And interestingly, this line from the judge.

[Court Clerk or Bailiff]

I know there's some. I guess there were some recently disclosed evidence the defense is reviewing.

[Stephanie Young]

We don't know yet exactly what that means, but it's worth mentioning just in case something comes of it. Like we said, most of the substance had already taken place in chambers. The plea deal was not even discussed directly in this hearing.

[Court Clerk or Bailiff]

So, Ms. Owens, stay in touch with your lawyer. And we are in recess this minute.

[Stephanie Young]

Shortly after the hearing, a new settlement conference appeared on the docket for August 28, 2026. That looks like the new plea expiration date. After this hearing, Clayton spoke to the prosecutors directly. They told him about what happened in the judge's chambers that day. And it was illuminating. For me. It seems like Laura has a hard line. No jail time, no prison time.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

He said, basically, like, look, we're in the chambers, and the judge is trying everything in his power to get us to come to a plea. He doesn't want to take this to trial. So he's like, what can we do to make this a plea? Laura's lawyer said if there was no jail time or prison time that could be attached to the plea, she would have taken the plea already. That is what she's most afraid of.

[Stephanie Young]

As we know, Laura's demand is at odds with Clayton's. Clayton wants her to see jail or prison time. In this meeting, the prosecutors told Clayton they would not take jail or prison off the table. Clayton also wanted an answer to another question.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

I asked the prosecutor, I said, this deadline on 28 August, is that the absolute last point at which she can take the plea? He said, yes. I said, there is no situation in which that will get extended. He goes, no, I'll make sure of it. Is that okay? So if she takes the plea on the 28th. Because she will wait. She's not going to take it on the 27th. She's not going to take it, you know, a month earlier. She's going to wait until the last minute because she just wants to drag this out because she knows that it only harms us. But I said, if she accepts that day, what happens from there? He goes, well, she accepts. We go to sentencing, which will be scheduled within a month. He goes, and then that'll be it. You'll go in your day at court, and then sentencing will happen, and that'll be it. I said, okay. And if she declines it? He goes, then she goes to trial. I said, unrealistically, when does that occur?

[Ed Leiter (State Prosecutor)]

Trial?

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

He said, likely two months from that point. So you're saying probably sometime in November. Crazy how we just pushed trial out four months when it was supposed to be end of July. That's the court system, though. That's just the business, baby. That's what we're all supposed to be okay with.

[Stephanie Young]

I've spent about 30 hours interviewing Clayton over the last year. This interview was different. His emotion was so raw in this conversation.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

I don't feel like I have any power. And again, I'm just being honest. I'm at the mercy of the court. You know, there's nothing I can do. So for me, I'm just gonna sit here and go on with my life and live my life outside of this situation, try to think about this as little as possible, and then show up on August 28th because there's nothing I can do. I've written a letter to the prosecutor. They've taken what I've said into consideration, but nothing changed. It's neither bad nor good. It just is what it is. We sit and wait, and we just let the justice system basically go at a snail's pace like it always does. Maybe we just see it for what it is. A system that's broken, that is still moving forward at a glacial pace, and let's just wait it out, and that's it.

[Stephanie Young]

He sounds defeated, but of course, Underneath that, it's frustration and anger.

[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

This whole thing is emotional. So let's show it. Let's show people what it really is. Let's show all of it, including some of the stuff that might be perceived as ugly. I don't care. I'm just human. I'm just trying to show the human experience. And this is the ugly, unfortunate part of it. I'm the one that has to carry this frustration for the next two months.

[Stephanie Young]

When I spoke with Woodnick, he took a much more measured approach. He says the court has to take reasonable requests into consideration because if they don't, and then Laura's found guilty by a jury, she could have grounds for an appeal, which would make this process much, much longer.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

The delays that we've dealt with, I think are very normal delays involving the professionals and the process and assuring that there's due process for Laura. I think the court's doing exactly what the court is supposed to do. Prosecutors doing exactly what they're supposed to do, as is Laura's attorney, who's a good lawyer and doing what he's supposed to do.

[Stephanie Young]

Wudnick says the delays we've seen in this criminal case are all pretty standard. So far, we haven't even gotten to the phase where potential delays are coming from the defendant.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

Are there going to be other delays that we haven't seen yet that are more Laura centric? And is she going to on the day a jury set to empanel to start a trial, is she going to be hospitalized? Is she going to claim she's got other medical issues or family emergencies? Maybe, but those are tomorrow problems and we're not going to be able to deal with them until that happens. And the court is going to have to deal with those accordingly when they happen.

[Stephanie Young]

Woodnick has been navigating the Laura Owens saga for nearly five years, and even he admits he's running low on patients.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

I get people's frustration, and candidly, Stephanie, I'm frustrated not because I'm frustrated with the process. I'm frustrated because I want this chapter to come to an end. I want the book to come to an end. I want to know what's going to happen in the criminal process.

[Stephanie Young]

We all want to know the end of the story, but Woodnick provided kind of a wake up call.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

I want this to be over with too, but I also want it to be over with the right way. If Laura wants to go to trial, great, go to trial. Let's make sure it's a very fair trial and there's no argument that she didn't have access to all the data she needed or she needed an extra couple weeks. If those sort of accommodations assure that a defendant, Laura or anyone else gets a fair trial, then the court needs to be doing that. And it does seem like the court did that in the podcast. Everyone's kind of expecting this to come to a head. Your podcast Love Trap is kind of in real time, and I think when you watch a lot of docu series and people documenting crimes that have happened have gone to trial, they're happening after the fact, the story's already been told, and you're in this very unique situation of being in the middle of the story. And I think that's why people feel some level of frustration.

[Stephanie Young]

Before we hung up, Woodnick stressed one more point. That the victims themselves continuing to come to court and advocate for justice, as difficult as that can be, really does move the needle.

[Greg Woodnick (Clayton's Attorney)]

The victim showing up sends a message that we're here, we will be here, we will be here. No matter what. Whether or not this trial goes In July or November 2030, we will be here. I think that was the message that Greg and Clayton were sending.

[Stephanie Young]

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[Stephanie Young]

Right as we pressed publish on the last episodes, we heard some news. It's about Mike Maracini's domestic violence restraining order case in California. As you'll remember, Laura's DVRO against Mike was dismissed by a San Francisco judge, but Laura planned to appeal that decision. She had until June 29, 2026. But at the Last minute she requested an extension and it was granted. She now has until July 29 to appeal the DVRO dismissal. As for Laura's parents most recent bankruptcy filing, we have quite the update. Ron and Jan filed for bankruptcy last year in an effort to keep their house from being foreclosed on. But they didn't complete their financial paperwork or make the required payments. Because of that, their bankruptcy filing was dismissed and their house was set to go to auction on May 26, 2026. But a few days before that, they filed for bankruptcy again to try to save their home. This time they filed pro se, meaning without an attorney. The judge asked them to come with documentation to prove they qualified for the refiling. Ron and Jan said they would. That's where we left off at the last bankruptcy hearing.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

And so do you intend to complete your schedules due on the 26th?

[Jan Owens]

I would like to if. If that timing doesn't work out. I am committed to this. We are committed to this.

[Stephanie Young]

It turns out Ron and Jan were only committed for about a week. Six days after that hearing, they filed a motion for voluntary dismissal of their Chapter 11 bankruptcy filing, citing they were unable to obtain Counsel. Then on July 1st, Ron and Jan appeared virtually to continue their bankruptcy hearing.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Good afternoon. I'll take the appearances and the no. 1's better. Let's first start with the debtors.

[Stephanie Young]

I expected some boring bankruptcy dismissal full of technical jargon and boy was I wrong. Luckily, a recording of this hearing was posted on YouTube. The presiding judge, the Honorable Madeline Wansley, started it off with a bang.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

At the last hearing, I heard a lot of information about ponies and GoFundMe accounts and other potentially non disclosed assets.

[Stephanie Young]

Before this hearing, the attorney for the US Trustee, Jennifer Giamo and Ron and Jan had all come to an agreement that their bankruptcy filing would be dismissed. But when they got to court, Judge Wansley wasn't having it. She'd taken into consideration the other potential assets like the GoFundMe account that was started for Ron's medical issues. The bankruptcy judge saw some discrepancies that didn't sit right with her.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

I guess what concerned me was if we had this large sum of money within the last year for the GoFundMe account, that that seems to be an asset that could be potentially recovered for the benefit of creditors.

[Stephanie Young]

Jan tried to minimize the GoFundMe, which is still active and to date has collected nearly $137,000. This was Jan's reply to the judge.

[Jan Owens]

And with regard to the GoFundMe, which I'm sure you were. Were notified by the online smear campaign that has gone against us that.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

So, so let me just interrupt you to say that, that the court only reviews what is filed with the court. So I know you referenced an online smear campaign before. I really have no idea what you're talking about. All I have. All I have is what has been filed on the docket and what people tell me in open court. I do not independently go out, and it would be unethical for this judge or any judge to go out and do background research on people and learn about them. So just. Just so you know, that's. That's the way the court will operate.

[Jan Owens]

I, I.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

And.

[Jan Owens]

And I'm not suggesting that. I'm. I know that the, the smear campaign people have said online that they have. Have sent information to your office, so I don't know whether you've received it or not. I know that they also send it to the US Trustee's office. But with regard to the GoFundMe, as I mentioned before, it was started in 2024. It was all virtually exhausted by, I would venture to say, by May of 2025.

[Stephanie Young]

Here's the thing. Ron's GoFundMe is still active and accepting donations. I did some quick math on the public contributions, and in the last year, they received almost $6,000. I think Jan believed that she could talk her way out of not reporting that income, but the judge was intent on pushing the issue.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Well, transfers that are made shortly before the bankruptcy filing do have to be disclosed that it's problematic if you did not disclose the use of those funds. I'm going to order and direct that you provide the records concerning that particular issue to Ms. Jaimo so that she has an understanding as to the financial circumstances immediately preceding your prior case and this case, so that we, she, her office, and the court has a full understanding of the circumstances before the case is dismissed.

[Stephanie Young]

Instead of issuing a dismissal, Judge Wansley wanted a full accounting of their finances.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

I'm really asking for a full accounting of the GoFundMe account, the monies that were received and the monies that were spent and how they were spent. And so, you know, the whole typical information, you know, what did you get? When did you get it? What did you do with it? Where are your receipts?

[Jan Owens]

Okay.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Okay. The who, what, when, where, why, and how? Okay, okay.

[Jan Owens]

But again, that was all prior to the chapter 13, that if we'd had those funds, we wouldn't have needed to file chapter 13 or chapter 11.

[Domino's Pizza Advertiser]

Okay.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Well, I. I hear what you're saying. Some transfers can be recovered despite the passage of time. This case was filed on May 22 of 2026, and it could be that if there were funds that were transferred in a particular period, they would be of interest to the US Trustees office.

[Lowe's Milo's Money Advertiser]

This.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Okay.

[Stephanie Young]

It seems like one of the reasons the judge was so firm with Jan is because the court previously asked for documentation, and it wasn't submitted to the US Trustee, Jennifer Gianna.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

I know that I had directed you to email to Ms. G the information required, and I don't know if that's occurred. I believe that that should happen before this case is dismissed. I think we should have a fulsome understanding of your financial circumstances. So I'm. Again, I'm in order and direct that you provide that information to Ms. Jaimo's office. Everything that you're supposed to be providing, you need to provide. So whatever that office is asked for, I'm ordering and directing you to cooperate and to provide that to her.

[Jan Owens]

Your honor, we were unable to do that. I had presumed that we would be able to get counsel to help us. This was never my intention to file pro se. And I'm very aware of the fact that chapter 11 is a very exhaustive chapter to go into as a pro se litigant, and that was not our intent. Our intent was to be able to get counsel, and we have been unable to obtain counsel.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Well, you know your financial circumstances best, and so you should be able to reconstruct that information and gather those records to provide it to Ms. Giamo.

[Jan Owens]

But, your honor, I'm unable to without adequate counsel. If I had been able to do that on my own, we would have continued this on our own.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Right, but you filed this case. You filed a Chapter 11 bankruptcy case. You have not yet paid the full filing fee. And once you're under the jurisdiction of this court, you have to abide by the United States Bankruptcy Code and its rules and requirements. And I'll tell you, one of the most important things about the Bankruptcy Code is it requires absolute transparency. And that's the concern of the court is that the schedules and statements here, compared to the prior schedule statements, seem to indicate a lack of transparency. And so, as a participant in the system, you have certain obligations, and I'm directing you to fulfill those obligations. It's not appropriate to. To file bankruptcy and park in bankruptcy and obtain the protections of bankruptcy and yet not fulfill the obligations. And so, again, that is your obligation. You filed this case. You undertook these duties and responsibilities, and Now I'm directing you to cooperate.

[Stephanie Young]

I've heard that the judges and lawyers in bankruptcy court don't mess around. This was my first time really seeing what that means.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

You were previously ordered to provide them. You haven't provided them from where the court sits. You're currently in contempt, ma'.

[Jennifer Giamo (US Trustee Attorney)]

Am.

[Jan Owens]

Oh, I understand. I understand. Okay.

[Voice Actor (Threatening Quote)]

Okay.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Any other questions or concerns?

[Ryan Reynolds (Mint Mobile Advertiser)]

None for me.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Okay. Thank you.

[Stephanie Young]

It's worth mentioning that those are the only words Ron spoke during the whole proceeding. Aside from announcing his name at the very beginning, he sounds like he doesn't want to be there, But Jan has another question for the judge.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

I'm sorry. Did you have a question?

[Jan Owens]

Well, the foreclosure date has been set for July 28, and I have filed some objections with the lender, and I would like to hire an attorney to handle the foreclosure. So I'm just wondering about how those dates coincide. So with this date being set of August 6th, I'm. I'm a little unclear about the. The overlapping.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

I. I don't really understand your question. I mean, the court has set a hearing on August 6th, and you said you have a foreclosure on July 28th, so I bet. I don't understand what your question is. You stated facts, but what is the question?

[Jan Owens]

The question is, if the hearing is set on August 6th, how does that impact foreclosure on the 28th?

[Stephanie Young]

To try and translate, Jan is asking if their home will be protected from foreclosure. When they filed for bankruptcy, an automatic stay was put in place. It instantly freezes all debt collection lawsuits and foreclosures. That stay was extended until July 1, the date of this hearing.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

I see. What you're asking is if the court would be inclined to extend the stay that's temporarily in place.

[Jan Owens]

Correct?

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Is that what you're asking? Okay. Correct. Ms. J. To allow us to.

[Jan Owens]

To sort through all. All of this.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

Ms. Jmo, do you have an opinion?

[Jennifer Giamo (US Trustee Attorney)]

Yes, your honor. The U.S. trustee objects to the extension of the stay. I mean, this is precisely one of the reasons that the US Trustee considered the case to be filed in ban fee and an abuse of the system. I believe that the debtors have not paid their mortgage to the tune of $191,000 of arrearages. And while they're seeking the benefit of the state, they haven't complied with the obligations of the bankruptcy court to justify getting the benefit of this debt.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

All right. Do you wish to respond?

[Stephanie Young]

Jan spends the next three minutes explaining that they've been trying to get in touch with their mortgage lender, but they're having a hard time figuring out who to contact and how to get a reply.

[Jan Owens]

So we really have been trying very, very hard for a long time to get this resolved and to get something in place so that we can move our lives forward. And as I say, we have uncovered things that we feel are violations that really need to be addressed before a 4 foreclosure could take place.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

I can't really speak to your situation with your mortgage servicer. I think you'll have to continue to. To deal with that and find a way to connect with the appropriate individuals or to assert those claims in a proper forum. This is generally not that forum in bankruptcy court. So I'll answer you that. With respect to the pendency of the automatic stay, the court did take the extraordinary step to temporarily extend that stay so that you could perfect the papers. And unfortunately, those things have not occurred. And so this court can no longer continue to extend the automatic stay. The court's going to deny that requested relief.

[Stephanie Young]

They concluded the hearing by setting a deadline for Ron and Jan to submit their paperwork that includes a full accounting of the GoFundMe. You'll hear Jennifer Giamo asking for clarification.

[Jennifer Giamo (US Trustee Attorney)]

Your honor, I just want to clarify for the record the deadline by which the debtors need to provide our Office with, number one, the accounting of all the GoFundMe funds, and two, all of the documents that they are on notice of being required to produce. May I suggest that the deadline be set no later than Friday, July 10, because that gives me sufficient opportunity to review the documents before the meeting that

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

is a week from this Friday, which seems like it should be a sufficient amount of time.

[Jan Owens]

Okay.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

All right. Anything further from the parties?

[Jennifer Giamo (US Trustee Attorney)]

No. All right. From the U.S. trustee. Thank you, your honor.

[Judge Madeline Wansley]

All right. Thank you. We're adjourned. Good luck.

[Stephanie Young]

As you heard, the month of July is going to be a bumpy ride for Ron and Jan. They have until July 10th to submit paperwork about the GoFundMe. Internet detectives have been clamoring for transparency around that fundraiser for years. Plus, their house looks like it will be up for foreclosure auction again at the end of July 2026. And they're due back in Judge Wansley's

[Narrator/Host or Production Staff]

court on August six.

[Stephanie Young]

One of the questions that's gotten lost in this story is the true status of Ron's health. According to the GoFundMe, he has severe health problems, Parkinson's, cancer, and heart issues in many of the latest bankruptcy hearings. He sounds very frail. Then on July 4, just a few days before I recorded this episode, Ron Owens posted this patriotic message on Facebook.

[Ryan Reynolds (Mint Mobile Advertiser)]

Hey guys, my buddy here and I are hoping you are enjoying the fourth of July. What you doing? Maybe going out, having a barbecue, maybe going to a baseball game. Go Giants. Maybe just sitting back and watching TV and remembering this is the greatest country on earth. Happy 250 USA.

[Stephanie Young]

At the time I'm recording this, Laura's still living in the casita at her parents house, the one they might lose. And Laura's also got some big decisions to make this summer because at the end of August she'll be due in court again for another settlement conference to discuss her plea deal and hopefully come to a resolution on her 14 felony counts. If that all goes to plan, I'll be there in person at the courthouse in Arizona with Clayton. You'll hear from me after that. Unless of course Laura has something else in mind.

[Voice Actor (Threatening Quote)]

If you ever, ever, ever, ever try to leave.

[Narrator/Host or Production Staff]

Thank you so much for listening. Please be sure to follow Love Trapped on Apple Podcasts, the iHeartRadio app, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And please leave us a review. A five star rating helps others find this show.

[Stephanie Young]

We're grateful for your support.

[Narrator/Host or Production Staff]

If you would like to reach out to the LoveTrapped team or have a similar story to share, email [e-mail] that's

[Stephanie Young]

lovetrapped p o dmail.com love trapped is

[Narrator/Host or Production Staff]

a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass Entertainment Group, in partnership with iheart Podcasts. This show was executive produced by Nancy Glass, Andrea Gunning and Ben Federman. Written, produced and hosted by me, Stephanie Young. Our story Editor is Monique Laborde. Producer on this episode is Sidney Gladue. Additional production support from Todd Ganz. Our Production Manager is Kristin Melkeary for iHeart podcasts.

[Stephanie Young]

Ally Perry was our Executive producer.

[Narrator/Host or Production Staff]

Audio editing and Mastering by Anna MacLaine. Additional editing support by Tanner Robbins and Matt Del Vecchio.

[Stephanie Young]

Thank you to our voice actor, Olivia Hewitt.

[Narrator/Host or Production Staff]

This podcast was developed in collaboration with Danny Passman and Leb Abramoff at Crybaby Media. The Love Trapped theme is composed by Oliver Baynes Music Library, provided by MyB Music. A special thanks to Carrie Lieberman, Will Pearson, Jessica Kreinscheck, Ali Kanter and the entire iHeart podcast team. And for more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Stephanie Young]

And before we end the show, we have some good news. Love Trapped was named one of The Best so Far 2026 by Apple Podcasts I want to thank all of you who've listened and recommended this show to friends. The Best so Far 2026 list includes some other incredible shows, so be sure to check out the full collection right now in the Apple Podcasts app.

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[Stephanie Young]

It's called football.

[Domino's Pizza Advertiser (Alternate)]

Soccer.

[Jan Owens]

Soccer.

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[Greg Gillespie (Victim)]

find Slide over is who's ordering.

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[Court Participant (Likely Defense or Witness)]

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