The Miracle | The Walkers Ep4

Summary

---

The Walkers: The Real Salt Path | Episode 4: "The Miracle"

Host: Chloe Hajimatheou (The Observer, Tortoise Investigates)
Date: January 27, 2026

---

Episode Overview

This episode interrogates the central, miraculous premise behind Raynor Winn’s memoir The Salt Path: that walking 630 miles could stall or even reverse the symptoms of a rare, terminal degenerative brain disease, CBD (corticobasal degeneration), as experienced by her husband, “Moth.” Reporter Chloe Hajimatheou digs into the medical realities of the illness and speaks with patients, neurologists, and those impacted by Winn’s story, examining the profound consequences of promoting hope—and potentially false hope—for the incurably ill.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Central Claim: Walking as a Medical Miracle

• Raynor Winn’s books, especially The Salt Path, describe how Moth’s health rapidly improved on long, punishing hikes, though he was said to be dying with CBD.

• Raynor’s hypothesis draws on studies about endurance exercise benefiting cognitive function and claims about the healing powers of nature.

  • Raynor Winn (01:28):
    “I’ve been researching CBD, looking for the answer to why you were so well when we were walking and why you’re deteriorating so quickly now.”

• The memoirs culminate in recounting miracle recoveries: brain scans returning to “normal,” disease symptoms receding, hope rekindled.

2. Moth’s Absence and Public Persona

• Despite being the subject of the memoirs and film, Moth rarely appears publicly, but when he does, he doesn’t present as particularly disabled.

• Raynor Winn (03:04):
  “We actually physically need [nature]. I’m convinced it’s part of the answer to why your health was so much better while you were walking. It has to be.”

3. Disease Reality: Interviews with CBD Sufferers and Specialists

• Reporter Chloe interviews John Todd and Chris Pleasby, both diagnosed with CBD, and Dr. James Gratwick, a leading UK specialist.

The experience of genuine CBD patients:

• Rapid, inevitable decline; loss of mobility and dexterity; median life expectancy of 5–8 years.
  • Dr. Gratwick (12:25):
    “I’m afraid that the life expectancy for corticobasal syndrome is around five years to eight years.”
• Patients unable to perform physical feats described in The Salt Path even at early stages.
• Emotional toll of false hope: feeling guilty or responsible for not recovering.
  • John Todd (34:16):
    “It’s cruel hope.”

Medical Expert Testimony:

• Never in clinical experience (or medical literature) has a CBD sufferer’s progress reversed or stabilized in the way described in Wynn’s books.

  • Dr. Gratwick (23:11):
    “Certainly not in corticobasal syndrome.”

• Review of Moth’s videos raises red flags concerning diagnosis: dextrous, expressive, walking unaided—a profile inconsistent with end-stage CBD.

  • Dr. Gratwick (25:26):
    “It’s certainly not at all consistent with patients I’ve seen with cortico basal syndrome… I must say, from what you showed me of this video, this does not particularly to me look like somebody with cortico basal syndrome.”

4. Public & Patient Impact

• Many patients and families found hope in The Salt Path’s narrative—or anguish when their reality didn’t match.

  • Chloe Hajimatheou (31:19):
    “One woman told me that as she read my article…relief washed over her because for years after reading The Salt Path, she wondered whether she could have kept her sick mother alive longer if she’d forced her to walk the coastal path.”

• The show explores the damage of “cruel hope,” particularly in shifting blame to the sick for not getting better through sheer effort.

  • Chris Pleasby (34:03):
    “I couldn’t pull on a rucksack. I could walk to the end of this house. Impossible. Yeah. It’d be cruel. You’ll give them false, false hope.”

5. Discrepancies and Investigation into Moth’s Diagnosis

• Letters provided by Raynor do not constitute categorical diagnosis; even the suggested diagnosing doctor is not a CBD specialist, and expresses privately that the published “miracles” are not plausible.

  • Dr. Gratwick on doctor’s letter (28:41):
    “So, what’s effectively said here is, I don’t know what’s going on.”
  • Chloe Hajimatheou (36:23):
    “So could Raynor, Wynn and Moth have just dreamt this whole thing up? Well, it’s likely to be more complicated than that…”

• Raises the likelihood of alternative explanations (e.g., Functional Neurological Disorder), which can present with similar symptoms but are not degenerative or fatal in the same way.

6. The Ethical Debate: Publishing Hope vs. Medical Reality

• Leading specialists decry the danger of presenting strenuous exercise or positivity as treatment for incurable diseases.

  • Dr. Gratwick (30:28–31:19):
    “It is dangerous to, with a condition which is as severe as this, promote an idea that strenuous exercise could reverse or cure it…it will have a huge psychological impact upon them… it is no fault of the patient whatsoever.”

• Chloe and patients point out the responsibility of high-profile memoirists to avoid misleading the public, especially the ill and vulnerable.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• John Todd, on initial hope (06:22):
  "I believed it. I wanted to believe it. That maybe, just maybe, I need to sort up my game and fight it."

• Dr. James Gratwick, on reversals (23:11):
  “So it’s not possible to have a brain scan showing the brain closing down and then six months later for that to have been reversed…?” “Certainly not in cortico basal syndrome.”

• Chloe Hajimatheou, on emotional consequence (34:20):
  “If you’re sick and you have limited time left, false hope doesn’t give, it only takes.”

• John Todd, on aftermath of hope dashed (34:42, 35:03):
  "I had no hope then. Just for a fleeting few days, I had hope."
  "I believed it. I wanted to believe it. Sometimes if you’re desperate—you’re desperate to believe something, you will. You’ll try to."

• Dr. Gratwick, on outcome if reversal was real (39:23):
  “If I had somebody with cortico basal syndrome and… I’d effectively changed its progression or reversed it, I’d be very excited. I mean, I want to publish it and more than that would be quite important to publish it.”

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Raynor’s initial research and miracle claims: 01:28–03:22
• Introduction to John Todd’s CBD experience: 07:15–14:57
• Medical reality of CBD with Dr. Gratwick: 11:07–13:29
• Public impact and confusion about the memoir: 14:57–16:38, 23:16–24:42
• Analysis of the evidence (doctor’s letters, videos): 25:06–29:38
• Discussion of alternative explanations (Functional Neurological Disorder): 36:23–39:23
• Closing reflections on truth vs. narrative: 34:20–36:09, 39:23–39:57

---

Tone & Language

The tone is investigative, empathetic, and at times skeptical—neither attacking nor excusing Raynor and Moth, but focusing on the human and societal costs of blurring hope with reality.

---

Conclusion

Episode 4 of The Walkers explores the line between inspiration and misinformation. The claims central to Raynor Winn’s bestselling memoir are contradicted by medical science and the lived experience of people with CBD. Patients and neurologists alike underscore the immense harm caused when the incurably ill are offered false hope—whether by well-meaning stories or commercial publishing machines. The episode closes with both a call for truth and a teaser: there may be more untold secrets at the heart of The Salt Path.

---

Next Episode Preview:
A new source steps forward, raising even deeper questions about the real identities and history behind the memoir’s celebrated couple.

Transcript

[Advertisement Narrator]

Financial planning needs to only be for the few, expensive, exclusive and tied to huge account minimums. At fasst we change the rules. No more high fees based on your assets, just a simple flat fee, membership guidance from a certified financial planner and planning that covers every facet of your life from big goals to everyday decisions. Learn [e-mail] Add is sponsored by FASTT.

An SEC registered investment advisor. Not an offer to buy or sell securities, nor is an investment legal or tax advice. Past performance is not a guarantee of future performance. This is a Monday.com ad, the same Monday.com designed for every team. The same Monday.com with built in AI scaling your work from day one. The same Monday.comwith an easy and intuitive setup. Go to Monday.com and try it for free. Instacart helps you get what you need fast. Like when the watch party at your place finally makes it out of the group chat. Suddenly you need snacks, drinks and all the things nobody planned for. With Instacart, you can get groceries and party essentials delivered. Check Just download the app, place your order and it shows up in as fast as 30 minutes. That way hosting feels easy and looks like you had a plan all along. Get the Instacart app today and get game day deals.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

The Observer.

[Rainer Wynne]

Moth, I have to tell you this. This is important. I've been researching cbd, looking for the answer to why you were so well when we were walking and why you're deteriorating so quickly now.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

It's the summer of 2015 in Rainer Wynn's second book, the Wild Silence. The couple are living in the Cornish coastal town of Polruen, and Moth's been studying horticulture at university. But the sedentary lifestyle means his health is getting worse. The neurological condition he has means his memory's going and he's losing weight and limping. In desperation, Rainer starts digging into medical papers, trying to understand why Moth's health was so much better when they took their massive walk along the southwest coastal path the previous year.

[Rainer Wynne]

I showed him the research and made him read about patients with Alzheimer's who had undergone endurance training and had miraculously regained some cognitive abilities which doctors had believed were lost forever. Don't you see? That's what the path was for us, extreme endurance training. We were walking miles every day carrying heavy weights on a really restricted diet. It's the same thing.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Moth has cbd, not Alzheimer's. But both illnesses involve a build up of protein in the brain, so Rainer thinks this study must be relevant. Then she tells Moth about another paper that shows that plants release chemicals that have a positive effect on humans.

[Rainer Wynne]

Surely this proves it. Proves what I've always believed. We need the plants, the land, the natural world. We actually physically need it. I'm convinced it's part of the answer to why your health was so much better while you were walking. It has to be.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

The Salt Path isn't just a memoir about a difficult time in Moth and Rainer's lives. It's about how grit and perseverance coupled with true love and nature is a recipe that revives the dying moth in a way that modern medicine can't. It's about a secular miracle. These are Rainer Wynn's books, but in many ways, it's Moth's story. And yet Moth is largely absent from all the publicity. Rainer's headlined so many literary festivals, been on dozens of chat show sofas and countless podcasts, and Moth has only done a handful of media appearances. Of course, that's understandable, given his terminal neurodegenerative illness. But when he does appear in public, he's not camera shy. Here he is on Channel 5 at Hay Farm, talking about why most cider apples aren't good to eat.

[John Todd]

It's very dry, very, very bitter. I love the American term for cider apple trees and that they're spitters. And forgive me, it's. It really is unpleasant.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Elsewhere, he's appeared on the red carpet with Jason Isaacs and beamed into the One show with his own video message for the actor who played him in the Hollywood movie of his life.

[John Todd]

Jason, I just wanted to say what a pleasure it has been meeting you and an absolute honour to see you portray me.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Be of all people.

[John Todd]

Thank you. It's not up to Jason's standard, is it?

[Chloe Hajimathe]

There's also this video I found online before I released my investigation. It was made by a charity called the PSPA that represents people with cbd.

[John Todd]

This whole CBD journey started with just an aching shoulder. I thought I just pulled a muscle. I didn't realize at the time that I was also gaining a limp. It affects every moment of my waking day. It feels like somebody's moved into my body. This presence, if I dare call it that, is very cold. It is so tiring.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

The Salt Path has been read by millions of people. Millions more have watched the film. That's a lot of people being told that if you're dying and you simply try hard enough, if you're prepared to push beyond what you think you can endure, and if you really connect with nature, then you can cure The Incurable. The film and books were watched and read by people who've been diagnosed with CBD and those who've nursed loved ones as they died.

[John Todd]

I believed it. I wanted to believe it. That maybe, just maybe, I need to sort up my game and fight it.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

There was just one problem with that. Do medical miracles happen?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

No.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Chloe Hajima and from Tortoise Investigates and the Observer. You're listening to the Walkers. The Real Salt Path Episode 4 the Miracle.

[John Todd]

I've always loved walking. I don't drive, never have done.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

If we're going to talk about walkers, well, John Todd's a walker and so.

[John Todd]

Walking was my sort of mode of getting anywhere and I found that I was having pains in my legs, or.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Rather, he used to be a walker. These days he walks very slowly with the help of a stick. Watching him, it's hard to see the man he once was. But I've been chatting to him for months and I've got to know. A warm, witty man with a dry sense of humour. I first visited him at his home near Aldershot last summer, and this time round, several months later, I can see a difference. He's more hesitant when we speak and he takes longer to find the words he wants to say. Just so you know, we've decided to edit his answers slightly for brevity. So a few years back, through the haze of lockdown, he wasn't feeling well. Even after he'd recovered from COVID something just wasn't quite right.

[John Todd]

I started to have balance problems. And I don't mean just when I came home from the pub. I mean, sort of. There were times where I would just feel unsteady on my feet. I had a lot of problems in my left hand, which I didn't really understand why I hadn't injured it. I was struggling to make a fist, or just inflexible.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

The doctor guessed he must have hurt it somehow.

[John Todd]

I thought it would be a. What's the word? A physical type problem. So physiotherapy on the hand was there. They arranged for me, but it didn't help.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

He was continuing to deteriorate.

[John Todd]

They had another look at it. I had a scan. I was told eventually that it was Parkinson's.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

For most people, finding out you have Parkinson's would be pretty devastating. But John's quite a stoic guy. A few years before all this, he actually discovered he has autism, which really helped explain why he hasn't always found things easy.

[John Todd]

As I've always struggled with living, dying held no fears for Me, it just didn't and it still doesn't. I sort of live with the fact that I had Parkinson's for about a year or so.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

But John was continuing to get worse. The medication wasn't working, at which point.

[John Todd]

I thought, I'll go back to the specialist. Eventually I was sort of referred to a neurological specialist, Dr. James Gratwick. So he said to us that I've got to tell you that you haven't got Parkinson's.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

That was obviously an enormous relief.

[John Todd]

Bridget and I, we sort of smiled and sort of made it sort of quite clear that we were pleased with that revelation. And Dr. Gratwick sort of cut our celebrations, if you like, short.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

He told them that what John has is much worse than Parkinson's. Actually, I'll let John's doctor explain.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

It was unfortunately a rarer condition, often mistaken for Parkinson's disease early on and one which carries a worse prognosis. It was of course a shock to him. I remember that. It's never nice having to give this diagnosis to anybody.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

John had cortico basal degeneration or CBD for short, the same condition Moth was diagnosed with in the Saltpath. It's rare, it only affects roughly one in a hundred thousand people and it's fatal. John's doctor, Dr. Gratwick, is one of the UK's top specialists in CBD. People are referred to him when, like John, doctors can't work out what else might be wrong with them. Even so, in his 20 odd years of practice, he's probably only seen around 3, 30 people with the condition. He says most neurologists might only encounter one or two cases in their entire career. What's interesting is when Dr. Gratwick has to break the news about CBD to someone like John, he doesn't use euphemisms or try and soften the blow. He's incredibly direct.

[John Todd]

He explained that it was an incurable condition, there was no medication and I think he did give me an idea of life expectancy.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

I'm afraid that the life expectancy for corticon basal syndrome is around five years to eight years.

[John Todd]

I remember at one point I said, so this is going to kill me then? And he said, oh no, he said, it won't kill you. Excuse me, I'm a bit dense at times, but why have I got life expectancy if it's not going to kill me? He said the most likely cause of death would be something like choking on because you'll lose the ability to swallow or pneumonia.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Eventually the muscles of swallowing will Become like that. And then you can't swallow. And there's two elements that, one, you can't feed so well. So it becomes questions about do we need to place feeding tubes in the stomach to feed people. But even around that, if there's difficulty swallowing your own saliva, then you can swallow it quite easily into your lungs. If that does happen, it can very quickly lead to pneumonia and that is the primary cause of death, usually in cortico basal syndrome.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

It's a tragically fast and cruel disease. All things considered. John took the news pretty well.

[John Todd]

I'll be honest, a lot of me was actually relieved that I had a reason for what was going on.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Even so, Dr. Gratwick was unequivocal with him about the inevitability of what was in store for him.

[John Todd]

This is how certain it was. He said, look, it always takes the same route like it normally starts with a hand. He said, then it will be, I think he said it will be leg goes to the right hand and then the left leg is sort of same order apparently. I remember him saying that it's pointless trying to fight, fight it. And he said, you just need to accept that this is going to happen. It's happened on every case that he'd observed.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Then later that summer, John's wife Bridget was listening to the radio when she heard Rainer Wynne being interviewed. And she heard her talk about the fact that her husband Moth has the same rare condition as John. So she ran out and bought the Salt Path. She didn't much like the book, but a few weeks later John picked it up.

[John Todd]

When I sort of read this book where this guy seems to be doing all kinds of incredible feats of endurance and, and his mental health improved, everything had improved and, and I was astonished. I thought, wow, you know, how marvelous sort of thing that actually the picture may not be as painted. To me, maybe, yeah, yeah, maybe Dr. Gratwick, maybe he did get it wrong, I thought. I guess I didn't know what to believe anymore.

[Advertisement Narrator]

My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends. But my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi Risankizumab RZA, a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy with Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free. At four months, Skyrizi is just four doses a year. After two starter doses don't use if.

Allergic to Skyrizi, serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.

Thanks to Skyrizi, there's nothing on my skin and that means means everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Hi, this is Matt from P1 with Matt and Tommy and this episode is sponsored by ebay. The cars you'll find on ebay are just different. They come with a story that you can't wait to share. Like this 1973 Dodge Charger on ebay that has been tucked away in an Arizona Barn for over 40 years. Only 55,000 miles and somehow in great running order, it even has a rare sunroof. Suddenly a car that was hidden for decades is being delivered in just a few clicks with ebay's secure purchase. All the paperwork handled. There are thousands of cars on ebay, from unique finds like the Pontiac Grand Prix SJ to daily drivers. And now with a new way to buy them, ebay, things people love.

[Advertisement Narrator]

Is your dog's food created to maximize your dog's quality of life or to extend the food's shelf life? It's time to make the switch to sundaes. Sundaze was founded by a veterinarian and mom, Dr. Tori Waxman who got tired of seeing so called premium dog food full of fillers and synthetics. So she designed sundaes air dried real food made in a human grade kitchen using the same ingredients and care you'd use to cook for yourself and your family. Every bite of sundaes is clean and made from real meat, fruits and veggies with no kibble. That means no weird ingredients you can't pronounce and no fillers because your dog deserves food made with care, not in the interest of cost cutting. You just scoop and serve. No freezer, no thawing or prep, no mess. Just nutrient rich clean food that fuels their happiest, healthiest days so you get more of them to share together. So go right now to sundaysfordogs.com Acast30 and get 30% off your first three orders. Or you can use code Acast30 at checkout. That's 30% off your first order at sundays4dogs.com Acast30 or use code Acast30 at checkout.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Back in the world of Rainer Wynn's books, it's 2019 and Moth's been getting gradually sicker and sicker. The sedentary lifestyle in Cornwall is hurting him. But then that summer, the couple plan a walking holiday in Iceland. And before long, Rainer's struggling to keep up with him.

[Rainer Wynne]

In the cold wind blowing salt laden air from the sea, the no doubt remained. No drugs or doctors could help Moth, but he didn't need them. Simply by living as he was built to, his body had found a way to sidestep the failures and go on. Moth was surviving by returning to a more natural state of existence.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

But when the walk's over, they can't sustain his health. It's the same pattern being repeated in all her books. Moth's ill, they walk, he recovers, he keeps yo yoing in and out of wellness. And then in her third book, she becomes even more categorical about the medical miracle. Landlines opens on Moth in crisis. They've been living on Hay Farm and his health's worse than ever. He's falling over and suffering incontinence. They go to the doctor and it's bad news.

[Rainer Wynne]

Moth's scan showed that he has a distinct reduction in his receptor cells which show up as lights on the screen. His lights were undoubtedly going out. Since walking the coast path, doctors, physiotherapists and neurologists have contacted us suggesting reasons why his health improved as he did. So it could be argued that what Moth undertook on that very long walk was an extreme form of physio. Or maybe it was the very low calorie diet we survived on because we couldn't afford to eat, or the time spent in nature, or any number of other reasons that have yet to be considered. What was without question was the speed with which his health deteriorated when he returned to a more sedentary life, all the old symptoms returning more aggressively than before.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Rainer's love for him won't allow her to accept his inevitable death. She persuades him to go on one last hike, this time from Scotland all the way down to Cornwall. It's their toughest walk yet, but it's worth it because when they visit the doctor again and have another brain scan, they, they get a totally different picture.

[Rainer Wynne]

What we're seeing are two sets of results. The old DAT scan showing an abnormal reading and this, the new one showing a normal reading.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

This time round, there's no sign of CBD in his brain. It's been reversed. Rainer acknowledges that this seems miraculous.

[Rainer Wynne]

Neuroplasticity exists, although we know very little about it. We used to think the earth was flat. We Used to think no universe existed beyond our own. One day there'll be answers for questions as yet unasked.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

When I first reported this story last summer, I kind of acknowledged that medical miracles do sometimes happen. So could this be a medical miracle?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

So you would find in corticopausal syndrome that, yes, if you had that, the appearances, the colours, if you like, on those kind of scans, would be reduced.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

On a screen in a clinic in central London, there are slides showing cross sections of brains. In each hemisphere, a colon of purple light where the dopamine receptors are. Dr. Gratwick Population points and describes how these colons get smaller and dimmer as the disease progresses.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

So in these conditions, as we've said, they're not treatable, not reversible. So any reduction in levels of dopamine or glucose in the brain, which is what those kind of scans pick up, you would not expect to see it improve. It would only ever gradually get dimmer.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

So it's not possible to have a brain scan showing the brain closing down and then six months later for that to have been reversed and to then see that patient have a normal brain scan?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Certainly not in Cortica basal syndrome.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

In 2023, on a poster advertising all three of Rainer Wynn's books, Penguin, her publisher, had written, Some People Live to walk. Rainer and Moth walk to live. It's confusing. In her books, Rainer is telling us he's better. But then Moth appears in videos, or like the one for the PSPA charity, in which he's describing how difficult life is with his condition.

[John Todd]

CBD is a very lonely existence. Terminal condition, no cure, nobody gets it.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

This video appeared on the PSPA website alongside videos of two other CBD sufferers who were diagnosed more recently than Moth, but who are obviously extremely disabled. One appears wheelchair bound and unable to speak, the other struggles to articulate and walks with the aid of two sticks.

[John Todd]

And the real sad thing is that although I feel as I'm still mentally still sharpened with it, I now know that's not the case.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Moth's seated in an armchair by a window. He's wearing a jumper and his signature cravat. But then he gets up, puts on and zips up his jacket and then kneels down to tie his laces before striding out the door.

[John Todd]

You have to concentrate on everything. It's seeing the sad Sin Ray's face some days.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

The PSPA have now taken down this video and cut ties with Moth and Raina because they said there were too many unanswered questions raised by my Investigation.

[John Todd]

To be told you have a terminal condition but no treatment for and there is definitely no cure. That was startling.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

How does what you see in this video correspond to your experience of the treating patients with this condition?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Well, it's certainly not at all consistent with patients I've seen with cortico basal syndrome, or CBD for that matter. Just to be clear, one thing that's often very prominent is loss of facial expression and this is excellent facial expression. I mean, there's absolutely no problem with movement of his face at all. Furthermore, there's very good dexterity in the leg on the right. There's a little bit of problems I can see with the dexterity in the right hand, but still able to do up shoelaces, which is certainly at 18 years. I've never seen a patient with CBS be able to have the dexterity to do that. So I must say, from what you showed me of this video, this does not particularly to me look like somebody with cortico basal syndrome.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Last summer I published the fact that nine neurologists who specialise in the condition had told me they didn't believe the disease could be reversed and that none of them had any experience of a patient patient with CBD surviving for 18 years. A couple of days later, Rainer Wynne responded by publishing a long blog post on her website. The suggestion that Moth has made up his illness is utterly vile, unfair and false. I have never sought to offer medical advice in my books or suggest that walking might be some sort of miracle cure for cbs. I'm simply charting Moth's own personal journey and battle with his illness and what has helped him. My books have become a record of his health through the movement issues to the times on our very long walks when those symptoms have improved. The effect of the suggestion that Moth has made up this condition has been absolutely traumatizing for him. Suggestions made by people who who do not know him, have never met him and have never seen his medical records. But even worse is the effect on those sufferers who have looked to Moth as a beacon of hope. The hope that maybe not now, maybe not for them, but at some point in the future we might find some answers to this condition that has no treatment and no cure. And she published three doctor's letters. The first letters dated 2015. That's two years after Rainer and Moth say Moth was diagnosed. One letter runs through his medical history suggesting that all his previous tests have come back negative. Interestingly, there's mention of Moth's horticulture degree, but no mention of any long Distance walking, something I imagine might be medically relevant to a patient with severe symptoms. But that letter does mention corticobasal degeneration. It also talks about paroxysmal symptoms, abnormal posturing on the left of the hemi body and bradykinesia. I needed to get a translation.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

So what's effectively said here is, I don't know what's going on. That's really what's being said.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

He's not giving him a diagnosis of corticobasal syndrome.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

No, it's really saying, I'm not sure what the cause of these symptoms is. It is saying the closest thing I could think of would be cortical basal syndrome. But then the caveat at the end there, but it's clear it's effective, very mildly, is acknowledging the fact that for the time course of the symptoms, how long they've been present, he should be much, much more affected by this point if it were cortico basal syndrome. So the longest person that survived from diagnosis that I have treated is eight or nine years.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

And were they quite disabled by the end of that period?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Very much so. So the patient towards really from I think their sixth year to their eighth year, they were wheelchair bound, they were unable to walk, they had no meaningful ability to move the lower limbs.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Would it be possible to do a medical trial where you could get patients to exert themselves physically in the way that Moth did in the salt path to see if it could have a potential positive effect on the condition?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Ethically, I don't think it would ever pass an ethics board. As we said, if you were attempting to get patients with a severe, debilitating, progressive neurological condition to try and perform. Perform physical feats which are clearly going to be beyond their capability on an ethical basis. That's not ethical. They would suffer. And so you couldn't ride a trial on that basis. So no, there's nothing that will ever improve cortico basal syndrome. It's not a treatable condition. It's certainly not curable or reversible in any way, shape or form.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Do medical miracles happen?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

No, it is dangerous to, with a condition which is as severe as this, promote an idea that strenuous exercise could reverse or cure it on two grounds, really. One, because it won't, and if anything, it'll be detrimental to the patient's health to attempt to do so, and they will suffer from it. But secondly as well, it will have a huge psychological impact upon them. So. And it can make a patient feel that they have in some way that they are responsible for their condition and for its worsening. It's because they have not done enough. And that would be wrong because it is no fault of the patient whatsoever.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Over the last six months, lots of people have written to me to tell me about their experiences with cbd. One woman told me that as she read my article in the observer questioning Moth's condition, relief washed over her because for years after reading the Salt Path, she wondered whether she could have kept her sick mother alive longer if she'd forced her to walk the coastal path, even though she knew deep down that her mother, who had cbd, could never have done it.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

I used to walk the fells and.

[John Todd]

I said one of my favorite walks.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Was the southwest coastal path, which is they now seem to call the Salt Path.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Chris Pleasby was diagnosed with CBD in 2022. He's gone from being an avid hiker to struggling to get to the end of his garden. I mean, I guess for you it was so obvious that it couldn't be true because.

[John Todd]

Blinding me off as far as their.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Walking, swimming.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

I can't swim anymore.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

I haven't got the coordination. I was a good swimmer.

[John Todd]

My wife has to do my laces.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

My wife has to do buttons.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

But for Chris, this illness isn't a fate he has to passively accept.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

I'm fighting back. Someone once said, tau disease is a bit like a storm in your brain.

[John Todd]

But there are measures you can take that will.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

You could put sandbags up against the storm in your brain. You know what I mean? So I'm putting sandbags in place against the storm.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

He's cut out all refined carbohydrates from his diet and that's already had a.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Benefit on my sleeping pattern. If you sleep well, you're reducing the jerkiness. You're reducing effect the CBD has on your body. It's not going to go away. It's still going to be progressing, but you're going to have some sort of defence against it.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

And he's taken up Sudoku and a new language and I'm learning Norwegian now. It's not about curing cbd. Chris knows nothing can help him do that. It's about improving and giving himself the best quality of life possible. Was he tempted to walk off his cbd?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

I couldn't pull on a rock so I could walk to the end of this house. Impossible. Yeah. It'd be cruel. You'll give them false, false hope. Give them false hope.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

It's.

[John Todd]

It's cruel hope.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

That's what lots of people bought into with the Salt Path. And it's something largely missing from the world today. If you're reading for pleasure or watching a film, it's understandable to want to walk away with a bit of positivity. But if you're sick and you have limited time left, false hope doesn't give, it only takes.

[John Todd]

I had no hope then. Just for a fleeting few days, I had hope. I was angry. Well, I didn't think I was, but I was. I knew it. In a way. I thought, no, actually, this is not right.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

John's told me he's been through a whole spectrum of emotions.

[John Todd]

I believed it. I wanted to believe it. Sometimes if you're desperate, I'm talking about really desperate. You're desperate to believe something, you will. You'll try to.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Reading the Salt Path, it had seemed simple. He just had to push through the pain and exhaustion and try harder.

[John Todd]

Had you not published your story then? Yeah, there's a severe danger that there'll be a lot of people out there who have grasped this sort of. This sudden salvation sort of thing that, oh, you're going to be all right, you know, and there's going to be a lot of people bitterly let down and relatives and show it's. It is a horrible, a really cruel thing to do.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

John might not be scared of dying, but he and Bridget obviously wish they had more time left. At least now he knows the truth. He also knows how precious times become for him.

[John Todd]

I'm glad I know you know, and I can start trying to put a few things in order. And we had a lot of stuff to do.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

So could Rainer, Wynn and Moth have just dreamt this whole thing up? Well, it's likely to be more complicated than that. Those doctor's letters published by Rainer Wynne on her blog had the name of the neurologist blacked out. But I had my suspicions about who it might be. I managed to track him down and talk to him. And he just so happens to be from Pulselli to the Welsh town where Rainer and Moth lived before they lost their house. I don't know if and how well he knew the couple before Moth arrived in his clinic. We spoke in general terms because he's bound by doctor patient confidentiality. But it's important to say he's not a specialist in corticobasal degeneration. He told me he hasn't read all of Rayna Wynne's books. And when I explained the details of Moth's recoveries, he said that wasn't something he could endorse. He was pretty clear that he had never come across anyone who has reversed the symptoms of CBD or even halted the disease's progress. In the end, I can't definitively say whether Moth has CBD or not because I haven't seen his medical records. They're private and for good reason. It's a very uncomfortable and intrusive thing, picking apart someone's health like this. And I wouldn't be doing it if Mothen Rayner hadn't already made the details of his illness public. And if I didn't feel that there was an important public interest reason for setting the record straight. All I can say is that his symptoms, the passage of his illness and the length of time he's had it, as well as the claims that he's reversed it, do not tally with what the CBD specialists in the UK that I've spoken to tell me they've witnessed among their patients. One thing suggested to me by several neurologists is that Moth might have functional neurological disorder. That's essentially a catch all phrase for the fact that some neurological symptoms don't have a physical cause. They might be brought on by stress or other issues in a person's life, but they can't be attributed to the brain. Some estimates say that up to a third of outpatients that turn up in clinics are diagnosed with this. So has his doctor given Moth a proper diagnosis of cbd? Not in the letters that Rainers published. But it's difficult to know what a doctor says to a patient in private. So it's possible that at some point Moth may have believed he had cbd. Wizzy told he didn't have long to live, as Rainer tells us in her books. Unlikely. Did he get two brain scans in a period of a year, one showing his brain closing down with CBD and the other post hike showing a normal brain. If it did happen, would you expect that doctor to be excited and to want to publish about it?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

Oh, absolutely. I mean, if I had somebody with cortico basal syndrome and I thought from something I'd done or the patient had done that I effectively changed its progression or reversed it, I'd be very excited. I mean, I want to publish it and more than that would be quite important to publish it.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

You haven't seen anyone publish anything about somebody with cortico basal syndrome suddenly reversing the condition?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

No, I've not. Not seen anything published.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Would you have seen it if it had been published?

[Dr. James Gratwick]

If that had been published, I'm pretty sure I would have seen It, Yeah.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

My investigation felt like it might be nearing a conclusion. Rainer and Moth hadn't lost their house as they claimed. The couple hadn't walked the coastal path as Rainer described in her books. And Moth didn't seem to be dying. And then yo yoing back to health. The Salt Path and its sequels weren't the unflinchingly honest books their publishers claimed they were. Rainer Wynne had stretched the truth to breaking point. End of story. Right? But just then, another message popped up on social media.

[Dr. James Gratwick]

The people behind the Saltpath books are not who you think they are. The real people, Sally and Tim Walker, my uncle and aunt, are pathological liars who have left a trail of destruction behind them.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Coming up in episode five. She just seemed like such a nice woman, you know, just a country girl who liked to walk. I don't think any of us saw it coming at all.

[Rainer Wynne]

I've been waiting for the story to.

[John Todd]

Come out, hoping it would come out.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

For years, because I thought, I have no proof. I don't think they had any idea that she could have. She could be capable or something like that. Raina Wynne responded to the Observer's investigation with the following statement. The Salt Path lays bare the physical and spiritual journey. Moth and I shared an experience that transformed us completely and altered the course of our lives. This is the true story of our journey. On her website, Rainer goes on to say, Moth was diagnosed with cbd. This is a fact. The suggestion that Moth has made up his illness is utterly vile, unfair and false. I have never sought to offer medical advice in my books or suggest that walking might be some sort of miracle cure. For cbs, I'm simply charting Moth's own personal journey and battle with his illness and and what has helped him. My books have become a record of his health through the movement issues to the times on our very long walks when those symptoms have improved. The effect of the suggestion that Moth has made up this condition has been absolutely traumatizing for him. Suggestions made by people who do not know him, have never met him and have never seen his medical records. Thanks for listening to the Walkers. The real Salt Path. It was reported by me, Chloe Hajimathe, with additional reporting by James Urquhart. The series producer was Matt Russell. Series artwork by Lola Williams. Music supervision was by Carla Patella and the sound design was by Rowan Bishop. The editor was Jasper Corbett.

[Advertisement Narrator]

My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends. But my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi Risankizumab RZA, a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototheistic therapy. With Skyrizi, Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year. After two starter doses.

Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.

Thanks to Skyrizi, there's nothing on my skin and that that means everything is everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.

It's 2026 and if you're still paying rent without BILT, it's time for a change. BILT is a loyalty program for renters that rewards you for your biggest monthly expense. Rent. I don't like paying rent, and I bet you don't either, but BILT makes it feel a little better. BILT is the loyalty program for renters that rewards you monthly with points and exclusive benefits in your neighborhood. Let me explain. With bilt, every rent payment earns you points that can be used towards flights, hotels, Lyft rides, Amazon.com purchases, and so much more. And here's something I'm really excited about. Starting in February, BILT members can earn points on mortgage payments for the first time. Soon you'll be able to get rewarded wherever you live and unlock exclusive benefits with more than 45,000 restaurants, fitness studios, pharmacies and other neighborhood partners. Personally, I'd use my built points for travel. Turning rent into flights feels like a win. It's simple. Paying rent is better with bilt, and soon owning a home will be better with BILT too. Earn rewards and get something back wherever you live. Join the loyalty program for renters at joinbuilt.com acasta that's J-O-I-N B I L T.com acast make sure to use our URL so they know we sent you.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Thank you for listening to the Walkers. We hope you're enjoying the podcast so far. You can listen to all seven episodes today by subscribing to the Observer. By subscribing, not only do you get all our podcasts before anyone else, you also get access to our Premium Food and Puzzles newsletter. Exclusive offers from our partner Mubi, free tickets to our events and much, much more. Subscribe [e-mail] subscribe or via the link in the show. Notes.

[Advertisement Narrator]

My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends, but my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyris Rizankizumab RZA, a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy with Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year after two starter doses.

Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.

Thanks to Skyrizi, there's nothing on my skin and that means everything is everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game? Well, with the name your price tool from Progressive, you can find options that fit your budget and potentially lower your bills. Try [e-mail] progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates price and coverage match limited by state law. Not available in all states.

If you're an H Vac technician and a call comes in, Grainger knows that you need a partner that helps you find the right product fast and hassle free. And you know that when the first problem of the day is a clanking blower motor, there's no need to break a sweat. With Grainger's easy to use website and product details, you're confident you'll soon have everything humming right along. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickgrainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done.

Guys, it's no use putting it off. The best time for an underwear refresh is now. Tommy John Underwear is designed for a perfect fit that stays put all day. There's zero chafe thanks to four times more stretch than competing brands and their innovative horizontal quickdraw fly is a game changer. With over 30 million pairs sold, there are thousands of men out there more comfortable than you. Don't settle for less. Go to tommyjohn.com today for 25% off your first order with code. Comfort. That's TommyJohn. Dot comfort. Tommy John Comfort.

[Chloe Hajimathe]

Perfect.