Mad Money w/ Jim Cramer 8/25/25

Summary

Mad Money w/ Jim Cramer – Episode Summary (8/25/25)

Podcast: Mad Money w/ Jim Cramer
Air Date: August 25, 2025
Host: Jim Cramer (CNBC)
Episode Focus: Navigating current Wall Street narratives, Q3 tech rotation fears, sector analysis, listener questions, and in-depth insights on recent earnings, with a special focus on investment discipline.

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Episode Overview

On this episode, Jim Cramer tackles widespread market skepticism about mega-cap tech stocks and delves into the persistent rotation narrative from tech to other sectors. He advises listeners on the pitfalls of short-term trading based on seasonal stories, underscores the value of holding quality growth names, and provides deep dives into Home Depot, CVS Health, and Pitney Bowes as key case studies. The episode features Cramer’s hallmark Lightning Round, and a detailed interview with new Pitney Bowes CEO Kurt Wolfe, plus analysis on the government’s recent investment move in Intel.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Tech Rotation Narrative: Why Cramer Isn’t Buying It

• Seasonal Tech Fear-mongering:
  Cramer addresses headlines claiming tech is losing steam and a rotation into small caps is due. He notes investors are “worried about the need to dump the mega cap tech stocks because everyone else is dumping them” ([00:56]).
• Trading on Seasonal Patterns:
  He admits to having played this game as a hedge fund manager, but says “trading because others are trading” is risky and difficult to execute:

  “You are not a hedge fund manager. And even if you are, I disagree now with the strategy, even as I adopted it... When you dump these tremendous growth stocks now, you have to figure out when you can get back in later. And that is much harder than it looks.” ([02:11])

• Cautionary Tale – Alphabet Sale:
  Cramer recounts selling Alphabet on news worries—only to see it pop 30 points, highlighting how “stories like the one in today’s Journal are the sotto voce enemy because they're based on seasonal factors that you have no control over…” ([03:48])

Notable Quote:

“The inability to reliably get back in is one of the reasons why I always say to own Apple, don’t trade it. Apple’s a great example.” ([04:23])

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2. Why "Owning, Not Trading" Wins – Lessons from Apple, Nvidia, and More

• Apple as a Hold-Forever Stock:
  Cramer describes a vacation scene where everyone is taking photos with iPhones—proof, in his words, that the iPhone’s ubiquity justifies holding Apple through thick and thin ([05:06]).
• AI Spending: Nvidia & The Hardware Shift:
  He rebuts skeptics doubting future Nvidia demand, arguing, “Just as software ate hardware, now AI is eating software... You can’t have generative AI without Nvidia.” ([06:47])
• Missed Timings & Investor Psychology:
  Markets aren’t tired or sleepy, he claims—“Stocks aren’t people. They aren’t animals. They don’t get sleepy. They don’t go down for nappies. The concept is per se ridiculous.” ([08:30])

Notable Advice:

“You made that money by sticking with them through thick and thin, not by trading in and out... you’ll be leaving the fortune—your fortune—on the table.” ([09:09])

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3. Lightning Round & Listener Q&A

Key Calls:

• Salesforce:

  “Enterprise software... the long knives are out. I need to see the quarter before I tell you.” ([10:00])

• Home Depot:
  (Detailed next section.)
• UNH (UnitedHealth):

  “Buffett buying doesn’t influence me. I want to hear from the company. They need to come on and answer tough questions.” ([28:24])

• Robinhood:

  “Extraordinary move... let it calm down a little, but don’t forget it’s an upstock.” ([39:19])

• Palantir:

  “Monster call. Thank you for all you do.” ([39:45])

• Power Industry:

  “Great industrial energy infrastructure stock... wish I owned for the trust. Wow, great call.” ([40:09])

• Apollo:

  “You just sold me on Apollo. I love the case... cheap stock, smart company, I’m a believer.” ([40:46])

• Ouster:

  “Lidar play... always come back to Tesla. I always will.” ([41:41])

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4. Deep Dive: Home Depot Earnings & Long-Term View

Nuanced Earnings Strength ([13:11])

• Headline Miss, Underlying Strength:
  Home Depot’s Q2 revenue and earnings missed expectations, yet shares climbed 3% the day of the release.
  • Momentum carried from 2024 into 2025; “strongest performance in over two years.”
  • Poor weather dampened spring sales, but month-over-month cadence improved sharply by mid-summer.

    “Cadence... hedge funds love to hear cadence because a stronger month-to-month pace can be extrapolated...” ([14:36])

• Pro Channel Growth:
  12 of 16 merchandising categories posted gains; professional business is 55% of sales, compared to 30% at Lowe’s.
  • Distribution center acquisitions (SRS/GMS) boosting job-site delivery capacity and returns.
  • Management: “Distribution centers are ‘generating higher returns on invested capital than an equivalent Home Depot store would at this point in its lifecycle.’” ([16:58])
• Outlook & Macro Factors:
  Lower interest rates (if enacted) would be a big tailwind for remodeling—and thus for Home Depot.
  • 50% of Home Depot’s goods are sourced domestically, cushioning tariff risk.

Bottom Line:

“Despite the softer headline numbers, the details we got from Home Depot show a business gaining strength... You ain’t seen nothing yet from Home Depot.” ([19:59])

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5. Sector Focus: CVS Health – The Surprise Standout ([21:06])

• Best Performer in a Bad Sector:
  While most health care stocks languish, CVS is up 58% YTD—thanks to a “major transformation.”
• Why?
  • Last major retail rival Walgreens is retreating, Rite Aid is bankrupt—CVS is “the last man standing.”
  • Managed care business (Aetna) has rebounded after last year’s pain.
  • Q2 saw nearly 12% revenue growth, 40% jump in operating income for health insurance; pharmacy business up 18% Y/Y; Caremark up 10%.
  • Company raised full-year guidance and pays a “bountiful 3.7% yield.”
  • Still trades at a cheap 11x earnings.

    “Has proven to be a port in storm for health care investors... fixing its most problematic business, managed care, and seeing real strength in other parts... Buy CVS.” ([27:29])

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6. CEO Interview: Pitney Bowes Turnaround with Kurt Wolfe ([30:44])

Key Highlights:

• Personal Skin in the Game:
  Wolfe: “I have virtually 100% of my own personal net worth invested in this company, just like I did with GameStop... We look for companies that are significantly undervalued and what we typically find is good businesses that are just being poorly managed.” ([31:03])
• Finance & Execution:
  In two years, interest on borrowing dropped from 13% to ~4%; free cash flow projected to rise to $350M this year (from $23M in 2023); share price moved from low $3s to over $12.
• Business Model:
  Presort business dominant in a slowly declining mail market, but still grew 11/12 years.
  Sentech business (mailing meters, shipping software, a bank for small businesses) has “hidden gem” aspects—a bank with 7% net interest margin, business loans for SMB clients.
• Strategic Focus:
  Currently focused on “blocking and tackling”—efficiency, operational discipline, divestitures, and turnaround basics before growth or acquisitions.
• Meme Stock Concern:
  “When we became a Meme stock [at GameStop], it completely changed what we were doing. That wasn’t my skill set... not what this is about. This is about business.” ([36:15])

CEO Takeaway:

“Right now... we need to fix our business… It’ll be a lot easier to grow when we’re back.” ([37:23])

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7. In Focus: Government’s 10% Stake in Intel ([42:32])

• Cramer’s View:
  The White House’s move is unorthodox, but necessary; Intel desperately needed capital after years of mismanagement and overreaching on chip foundries.
  • “President Trump’s actually using money from the CHIPS act that was already earmarked for Intel... We need a healthy, viable Intel because we can’t simply rely on Taiwan Semiconductor.” ([42:32])
• National Security Angle:
  Analogy to past government bailouts (Chrysler, TARP):

  “If it’s a national security issue and one of our important companies might be failing, you better believe it’s going to get get bailed out. Doesn’t matter if the President, Democrat or Republican.” ([45:21])

• Outcome:
  Cramer expects new CEO Lib Bhutan will restore Intel to prominence; government, public, and shareholders all stand to benefit.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Market Narratives:

  “Get out before everyone else gets out. Now that’s some genuine Wall Street homespun wisdom.” ([01:19])

• On Seasonal Trading:

  “Stocks aren’t people. They aren’t animals. They don’t get sleepy. They don’t go down for nappies. The concept is per se ridiculous.” ([08:30])

• On Small-Cap Mania:

  “You chow down on ETF and bet that others will do the same. Historically not really a great strategy. Just another greater fool thing.” ([08:17])

• On CVS’ Success:

  “It is good to be the last man standing.” ([25:45])

• Pitney Bowes on Operational Excellence:

  “A core business tenant is in the trenches. It’s getting the blocking and tackling right, and that’s what we need to do at Pitney Bowes.” ([37:23])

• Lightning Round Banter:

  “Quadruple. That’s a lot of booyahs.” ([42:31]) “Palantir? Monster call. Thank you for all you do.” ([39:45])

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• [00:56] – Main Theme: Tech Sentiment, Rotation Narratives
• [04:23] – Case for “Owning, Not Trading” Apple & Tech
• [09:52] – Listener Q&A: Salesforce and other stock picks
• [13:11] – Deep Dive: Home Depot Earnings, Strategy, Cyclicality
• [21:06] – Deep Dive: CVS Health’s Performance Amid Sector Rout
• [28:10] – Listener Q&A: UNH (UnitedHealth)
• [30:44] – Interview: Pitney Bowes CEO Kurt Wolfe on Turnaround
• [39:19 to 41:41] – Lightning Round: Rapid-fire stock opinions
• [42:32] – Analysis: Intel’s Government Bailout & National Security

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Conclusion

Cramer’s message for the episode is clear: don’t get swept up in Wall Street’s seasonal rush to trade in and out of dominant tech names purely on cyclical headlines—“own, don’t trade” remains his mantra. Through case studies like Home Depot and CVS, and in-depth interviews such as with Pitney Bowes’ turnaround CEO, the episode underscores disciplined, informed investing and skepticism toward “greater fool” narratives. The show ends with a strong defense of government intervention in Intel as smart policy, not politics.

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For more actionable insights, listen to the full episode or follow Jim Cramer on social media and at CNBC Investing Club for daily updates.

Transcript

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Stay ahead. Hey, I'm Kramer. Welcome to that money. Welcome to Crame America. I'm going to make friends. I'm just trying to make a little money. My job is not just entertain you but to educate, teach you. So call me 1743 CBC tweet me Jim Cramer. Here we go again. The headlines appear right about now as the summer runs out, as they always do. Tech rallies show signs of losing steam, says the Wall Street Journal. Doubts about artificial intelligence and a rotation to previously unloved sectors slow tech gains, end quote. Isn't that it in a nutshell? Sell, sell, sell, sell, sell, sell, sell. So on a day when The Dow shed 349 points, SB dip 0.43%. Although the Nasdaq declined just 0.22%. Everybody's worried about the need to dump the mega cap tech stocks because everyone else is dumping them. Yes, get out before everyone else gets out. Now that's some genuine Wall street homespun wisdom. Let me just say before I deconstruct this view that I used to actually live by this gospel. My old hedge fund. I reason that the summer's always pretty lousy for tech. Probably because there are plenty customers who go slow or close down for the summer, especially in Europe. Heck, you know, I used to short tech stocks at this point that you're figuring, well, what could possibly happen in the third month of a quarter other than a shortfall? Negative pre announcement. Plus you can always just buy back, right? What's the difference? The negative narrative continues. Nvidia Microsoft pick up almost 15% of the market. How ridiculous is that? That's the highest concentration ever. That can't last. Seems like a dangerous conference. One that has to unravel When Nvidia reports on more, the group is tired. But there's nothing tired about the small caps. They've been resting. They're ready. Sell mega cap, buy small. There I gave you the total textbook negativity. Now I'm going to give you the counterpoint. First, as I write in how to make money in any market, which comes out September 30, he said shamelessly, you are not a hedge fund manager. And even if you are a hedge fund manager, I disagree now with the strategy, even as I adopted it. You're just trading because others are trading. Now, why is that so bad? It's because of the precision needed to execute this kind of thing. Eventually, the money always comes back to growth. So when you dump these tremendous growth stocks now, you have to figure out when you can get back in later. And that is much harder than it looks. So I'm going to give you a textbook example. What happens, say, if you dump the stock of Alphabet, a former core position on my Chapel trust that I sold. Betting the Justice Department really hurt them. Now, the court ruled them, as a rule, monopolist. The stock went down for the price of a cup of coffee, right? I mean, and then on the news, it caused me to sell, and then it went up 30 straight points. Did I get back in? No. Did the Justice Department destroy them? Who knows? They haven't ruled. And even if they did, what are they going to do? Break it up? If you break up Alphabet, you get a bunch of businesses that would be worth more on their own. But Google, YouTube, Gemini, Google Cloud, the just part of Waymo, the just part would be doing shareholders a favor. I don't believe in what a shoulda could have, but as I tell club members, I do have tremendous remorse about this sale. And that's why when it comes to these mega caps, it's almost impossible to pick your moment to sell and then buy them back later at a lower price, as I wanted to do with Alphabet. Couldn't do it. The stories like the one in today's Journal are the sotto voce enemy because they're based on seasonal factors that you have no control over and you don't know how, when they're going to end. I regard them as no more valuable than a statistic. I heard on our air today that when you have nine to one upside to downside volume, as we had on Friday, you know, it's a huge day, 91% of the time, we're up big a year later, but maybe we're part of the other 9%. The inability to reliably get back in is one of the reasons why I always say to own Apple, don't trade it. Apple's a great example. Let's go into it. Think about the amazing company and its incredible stock. Sure, it's down this year. Okay. Bad. Yes. It doesn't have an AI strategy. That's yet self evident. Siri may be even less intelligent than Alexa, the living embodiment of a computer with a bottom eight. The new Alex is smarter. What say you, Siri? But then last week. Last week you're on vacation. You're off the coast of Croatia. You're going to some secret hidden places. The real blue lagoon, not the swimming pool. Somewhat blue lagoon off Italy. It's the much larger one near the UNESCO World Heritage town of Trogir. Okay. Trog T R O G I R. The one where you have to duck your head to be sure you don't have it sheared off by the small aperture that you need to get into the special place. And what happens when you get there? Well, how about everybody whipping out their iPhones to take pictures, boats and boats of people seeking to validate and remember using a product? That's the best there is. See? As long as the iPhone remains the best phone out there, then selling Apple to buy it back later is a mugs game. I couldn't believe it. Everybody. It's like it didn't happen if they didn't do it. That's my wife. Now let's deal with Nvidia and its earnings report this Wednesday. Are there some concerns? Sure. There's China demand. Which? The usual trash cyber rags. It's amazing. There are trash cyber brags. There used to be like yellow journalism. They got them. They tell us the demand is waning. Do you know when they're going to start shipping the new chips? I don't know. Maybe there's no demand for them. And most important of all, when do the big spending hyperscalers lose their appetite for these expensive chips? Soon, right? Soon. Soon, soon. It can't keep going on without a payoff, right? And then Nvidia will no longer be king of the hill. Top of the heap, Sinatra. To which I say we live in a biased world. We've loved enterprise software and disdained semiconductor stocks for decades. We like the evergreen nature of enterprise software, disdain the episodic nature of semis. When venture capital firms in Silicon Valley have pooled the resources for decades, they go for software, not hardware, right? Sure. Truly, that had been the case, but now Just as software ate hardware, now AI is eating software. As Kramer pal Ben Righteous put it over Melius as a research firm, hardware is the future as software used to be to the future. You can't have generative AI without Nvidia because we haven't seen generative AI yet. That is all that different from a souped up Google. Look at the next generation. We're more accurate, maybe much more, because the engines will have made deals with the intellectual properties behind the paywalls rather than just sourcing their answers off of Reddit with bigger media. I like both those sources, but I wouldn't exactly call my accurate. More important, the new Nvidia chips will allow the chat bots to reason. They'll actually be able to argue with you to get a better answer. Do you really think spending is headed lower, not higher, when Nvidia has chips that will allow you to ask your system questions and it comes back with questions to you to get the answer right? Reasoning will be the holy grail of this whole AI generation. Okay, that's it. And people are selling these stocks ahead of that change. That's downright unreasonable. I think anyone who refuses to buy invidious chips will be left behind in the great hyperscaler arms race. You can't afford to be left behind, Bing. Now let's step back and take and think about this small Captain. Sure as a whole they may be better, but if you take them apart, open the bushel of stocks versus Trust me, you don't even want to know what you're buying. So you chow down on ETF and bet that others will do the same. Historically not really a great strategy. Just another greater fool thing. Now you may say, well Jim, Jim, these big tech stocks are tired. They're jet lag. May I come back and say, well wait a second. Stocks aren't people. They aren't animals. They don't get sleepy. They don't go down for nappies. The concept is per se ridiculous. Will you let me know when Amazon's had a good night's sleep? Place or Microsoft as it had enough? Is it over that melatonin fix? Which of the Mag 7 is going a hefty dose of Seroquel? So let me give you the bottom line here. I will never try to stop you from selling. That's not my job. I just want you to remember how these individual stocks have generated tremendous wealth for those who have held on. You made that money by sticking with them through thick and thin, not by trading in and out of it. No one's that good people. And you will be leaving the fortune, your fortune on the table. Now, we're going to go. We're going to take questions. We're going to start with Stephen in Ohio. Steven.

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Hey, Jimmy. I used to live out of my car, too. Question for you. Is now a good time to get.

[B]

A position started in Salesforce? Okay, Salesforce, great question. I've owned the stock for, I don't know, more than a decade. Here's the problem. It is. It is. It's enterprise software. And right now, the long knives are out for enterprise software. I need to see the quarter before I tell you that we own a small position for the Chapel Trust. We used to have a very big position. I'm nervous about exactly what I just laid out, which is this enterprise software of which Salesforce is very much involved in. Even its agentix, which is marvelous, is part of the software cohort. All right, now look, I don't want to stop you from selling, but you have to remember how much wealth has been generated from holding holding these individual tech stocks from thick and thin. That's how to make the money. Oh, man. Money tonight, shares of Home Depot have moved higher despite reporting a top bottom line miss last week. So is this name on a solid foundation or is it in need of a remodel? I'm running through the quarterly numbers to find out. Then the health care sector has been taken to the woodshed this year, but CBS Health, no, it's managed to stay above the fray. I'm breaking that down. See what's fueled the rally for the drugstore chain. And everyone loves a comeback story. Tonight, I'm going to look at the transformation happening at Pitney Bowes with the company's new CEO. So stay with Kramer.

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While I was away last week, we got results from Kramer Faith Home Depot, a stock I'm very happy to own for the Chabot Trust. But the numbers confused a lot of people. Sell, sell, sell, Sell. See, at first glance, the headline results looked underwhelming. Home Depot's revenue came in a little light, and their earnings per share also fell a little shy of Wall Street's expectations, basically flat year over year. That's why when the Results hit at 6am sharp last Tuesday, the stock initially dropped nearly 2% on the news. Sell, sell, sell. But by the end of the day, Home Depot shares and climbed more than 3%. So what gave the buyers the confidence to rally behind this one after what initially seemed like a sub optimal quarter? Simple. The quarter was good. So you can't judge earnings by the headline numbers alone, something I've stressed repeatedly to you both on air and of course with members of the CBC Investing Club. When it comes to Home Depot, management painted a much stronger picture on the conference call than they did in the headlines, obviously giving investors plenty of reasons to stick around. There was nuance, and nuance favored the bulls. For starters, management emphasized that the momentum they saw in the back half of last year carried into the first half of this year. They even described last quarter's performance across the business as, quote, the strongest we've seen in over two years, end quote. So if last quarter's performance was that strong, why, why the shortfall versus Wall Street's estimates? Some of it was poor weather. Poor conditions in early spring, as I know as a gardener dampened sales at the start of the quarter, although those numbers improve later on. Which brings me to the second positive. What's known as the cadence C A D N C know this word of the quarter while Home Depot same store sales were up just 1% right? Not so great. Things look different when you examine them month to month to month. After being dragged down by a weaker May, that was that weather saw same store sales decline point 3.3% that improved to flat in June and then accelerated the plus sweet point 1% in July at the same time that was a sequential improvement from down.3% in the previous quarter. In short, things are getting better and better for Home Depot. By the way, hedge funds love to hear Cadence because a stronger month to month pace can be extrapolated and that was a huge part of last week's move. And you could see couldn't tell cadence from the morning headlines. Wait for the call people. Wait for the call. Imagine highlighted. They're seeing broad based strength in the business with 16 of their I'm sorry, 12 of their 16 merchandising categories posting positive same store sales. That's very positive. That includes important categories like storage, building materials, kitchen and my favorite, outdoor garden. Even better, some stores same store sales get this for professional contractors and do it yourself customers were positive. Good to see both. The professional business remains a key competitive edge for Home Depot as it represents 55% of the sales, which is much higher than Lowe's, which is about 30% professional. Rather than chasing regular consumers wanting to do it themselves. See, the despot has been making acquisitions to expand its range to to offering to contractors. So last year they paid $18.25 billion to buy SARS distribution. Some people thought that was too high, but it's really working out. It's giving them more exposure to roofers, landscapers, pool contractors. Earlier this year we learned that the SRS subsidiary will be acquiring a company called GMS which is their distributor Specialty building products ceilings. These two acquisitions something even more valuable distribution capacity. Once the GMS deal closes, SRS will will boast more than 1200 locations, over 3500 associates, nearly 8000 trucks that management says are capable of making quote, tens of thousands of job site deliveries per day. End quote. That's business Home Depot can't get enough of. Management is incredibly bullish on these distribution points because they've seen the numbers as they put on the conference call. These distribution centers are quote, generating higher returns on invested capital than an equivalent Home Depot store would at this point in its lifecycle. And quote, that is really impressive. I'll tell you why management said on the call a Home Depot store to us is almost like buying Treasuries and that as quote that as is as close to the most confident return we can drive this business. Yet as much as they like putting up new stores, it's the distribution centers for professional contractors that are an even better investment. I love that bit of detail. Home Depot's always had a great conference call, but that was one of the best moments. Now look, I get it. Last quarter management noted that they now have the most products in company history available for same day or next day delivery. That matters because customers who use these services spend or spend more and shop more often. Put it plainly, management says that the source acquisition quote has exceeded our expectations. But it's not just about the last quarter. On the conference, School management acknowledge that the momentum they see in July has carried through to the first two weeks of the current quarter. That makes me feel a lot more confident about say Halloween and Christmas. Sure, it might be early to start decorating for the holidays, but that isn't dampening management's excitement about the return of Halloween fan favorites like skelly, the 12 foot skeleton, a seven foot long canine skeleton, best friend Barclay, Ron Barclay for me. But if they look at they start selling 12 foot saquon statues, Count me in. Next Thursday is the opener. That's why, despite the headline miss for the quarter, Home Depot was still confident enough to reiterate the full year forecast. People love that. And that guidance doesn't assume any help from lower interest rates. Something is now very much on the table after we heard from Jay Powell last week. Anything connected to housing does better with lower rates. Anything. Remember, management said that since 2019, this is incredible. Home prices have now appreciated by 50%, which means that homeowners are sitting on home values that management estimates are worth roughly $11 trillion. But elevated interest rates have made it tough for homeowners to tap into that equity, which is bad for Home Depot. A lot of people can't remodel without a home equity loan and they won't take out that loan if the ratio and that's why Fed chairs Japan's dovish remarks on Friday sparked another 3% change rally in the stock as lower short term rates will translate into cheaper home equity loans which are based on the price of short term money. At the same time, management called out economic uncertainty as the primary reason for these delays in larger renovation projects. Yes, uncertainty. Now that's it. They're confident the one big beautiful bill with his tax cuts and Trump branded baby bonds could act as a powerful stimulus for the consumer. Great, great verbiage in the conference call about why that matters because a lot of people just kind of their eyes glaze over the bill. Now you might be worried about the impact of tariffs on Home Depot's profitability, but in the conference call management reminded us that 50% of their goods are sourced domestically. So there will be a tariff hit but it will be much more than you might have expected. While there will be some price movements, it likely won't be too broad based. As a result, management makes to see gross margin improvement the second half of the year. That was no one expected that, believe me. Here's the bottom line. Despite the softer headline numbers, the details we got from Home Depot show a business is gaining strength, especially the prospect of lower interest rates on the horizon. That's why I am confident that Home Depot's long term story and why the stock rallied response to the quarter that many investors wrote off immediately is just so intact. That's because they didn't listen to the conference call. Now if you're a member of the investing club, you would know we are holding this one for the long term and the move up that we saw last week, believe me, you ain't seen nothing yet from Home Depot. 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[B]

This has been a very good year for stocks in general, s and P, up 9% year to date. But it hasn't been a good year for the health care sector. The biopharma companies are struggling to adapt to the Trump administration, especially the Department of Health and human services under RFK Jr. They don't like the presidential brow beating on drug prices with the prospect of tariffs on pharmaceuticals either. Sell, sell, sell, sell, sell, sell. Meanwhile, the managed care sector is in shambles as people are simply getting much more health care than they're used to and their insurance companies haven't been charging them enough. But tonight I want to talk to you about one of the rare health care stocks has proven to be a port in the storm and it is a shocker people is CVS Health. Yeah, the drugstore chain with a pharmacy, benefit manager, caremark and a managed care business, Aetna this has been the best performer, get this in the health care sector in the S and P is up more than 58% for the year. How the heck did CBS pull that off? All right, now some of this because CBS has become the last man standing in the retail pharmacy space as its last major rival, Walgreens is set to be taken private and plans to close hundreds of stores in the process, while Rite Aid, suffering through its second bankruptcy by shrinking beyond all recognition. But some of it's simply because the stock of CV has already got pulverized. Last year it was down 43%, was the 10th worst performer in the SB. Problem came from Aetna, their managed care business, which was crushed by all the things that have wrecked the health care industry stocks this year. Specifically, the prices were too low in a world of higher than expected medical costs, especially with their Medicare Advantage plans. In other words, what they did really bad last year is what some other companies are doing this year. I bring that up because I have to because this year CVS is finally seeing a turnaround for the managed care side of the business. Now, it's not a great performance, but it's definitely a better one. When CVS reported at the end of July, their health care benefits division, which houses the managed care business, saw nearly 12% revenue growth with operating income up almost 40% year, year over year. Basically the health insurance side is doing much, much better. That's an index where lower, by the way, is better. CVS acknowledged that medical utilization rates remain elevated, but the company's finally getting its arms around the issue. CVS medical benefits ratio, which measures the cost of care as a percentage of total premiums received, clocked at 89.9%. Now that was up 30 basis points a year over year, but it was a full 80 basis points lower than Wall street was expecting. Crucially, that number included a large quote premium deficiency reserve charge that the company took to reflect higher utilization trends. And it covers their anticipated Medicare Advantage losses through the rest of the year. What a sloppy thing. But they all had to go through this. And that was only one part of overall though was a great quarter from CVS versus its other company, the other companies in the cohort. And that's something therefore that sent the stock soaring. Over the past month, drugstore chain posted substantially higher than expected revenue with all three of their businesses, the pharmacy, the benefits manager and the managed care division coming in ahead of expectations. On top of that, CBS posted a phenomenal 35 cent earnings beat off a $46 basis. Since then, the stocks rallied from the high 50s to the low 70s. It's cut more, I think. I don't think it's done. Now. This represents a major transformation for cbs. Now I want you to keep in mind, last year management had to cut their full year forecast multiple, multiple times, driving investors crazy, forcing many to abandon the stock along the way. But for the second consecutive year, CVS raised its full year forecast and this was a huge raise. They took the revenue guidance up by nearly $9 billion. Wow. And they boosted their full year earnings outlook by 25 cents at the midpoint. And it's not just because their health insurance business has managed to stem the bleeding. The drugstore and the pharmacy benefits manager are also doing great. The health service division, which includes the Caremark PBM business and the in store medical clinics, put up a 10.2% revenue growth. Very strong. As for the drugstore business, do you know that both the front of the store and the pharmacy, it delivered a $1.5 billion revenue beat. Operating income up 7.6% year over year. We haven't seen numbers like this from a drugstore chain in ages. Like I mentioned before, CVS is cleaning up because its main competitors have more or less surrendered. Walgreens is in retrenchment mode as it's being taken private, right? Or what's left of it, frankly. Just filed for Banksy again in May. Second time. That leaves the field to cvs, which is taking market share like crazy. Look, Amazon's in there, but brick and mortar, these guys are winning. It's especially true on the pharmacy side. Comparable pharmacy sales were up 18% year over year. I don't know about you. I had Rite Aid they sent me. When they closed, they sent me to cbs. It's happening all over the country. It is good to be the last man standing. Now that's something, by the way, you would have known had you watched the Bruce Willis movie of the same name. So from end to end, CBS business is simply doing much better than it was 12 months ago. The sore spot managed care business isn't exactly thriving, but it's much stronger than anticipated and seems to have gotten its arms around the most pressing problem, higher medical utilization rates. Meanwhile, the biggest division, health services, is powering forward as Caremark continues to perform well. An increasingly powerful pharmacy business is driving surprisingly strong numbers on the drugstore side because CVS no longer has any major rivals. I bring all this up because though the Stock's up over 58% for the year, you know, this thing only sells for just 11 times the midpoint of its new full year earnings forecast. 11. 11. That's ridiculously cheap. But by the way, the company pays a $2.66 annual dividend, stock supports a bountiful 3.7% yield. You got to hand it to CEO David Joyner, who's done some remarkable work in the first 10 months of the job. I really like this guy. He's sharp, he gets it. He knew where the problems are, quickly addresses them. And some of the other parts of the health care that we're working this year, like the medical device space prices, earnings multiples, they become really elevated, making the stocks much more risky simply because they've gotten ahead of themselves. That's not a problem here. Last year, CBS stock was priced like the company was good. I don't want to say go out of business, but you know what I mean? They had these. They managed to just kept cutting their full year forecast over and over and over again. Even though the stocks rebounded substantially from those levels, it's still super cheap. Now the numbers are going up higher. I'm clearly not alone in thinking this, by the way. Last Monday, analysts at UBS upgraded CVS to a buy following two strong consecutive quarters of execution and early signs that the health care benefits segment fixes are on track. I feel the same way. Let me give you the bottom line here in this very exciting story. Health care has been horrendous this year, but CVS, one of the worst performers the entire market in 2024. You need that preface. Has proven to be a port in storm for health care investors. Is up 58%, leads the entire cohort, fixing its most problematic business, managed care, and seeing real strength in other parts of the business, especially the pharmacy side, where it is the last man standing. Plus, given the cheapness of the stock, generosity of the dividend yield. Here's what I'm saying. Buy cvs. Summer in Connecticut is summer in Connecticut. Summer in Connecticut.

[E]

Hey, Jim, it's Sumner.

[B]

Hey, this Sumner. How you doing? How you doing?

[E]

Yeah, not a problem. The stock's down 40% on the year. It looks like it's stabilized. And with the likes of Warren Buffett buying it, do you think now is a good time to start a position in unh?

[B]

Okay, so I have these rules which say don't buy one of these things because it's done. It looks like it's. It's done a lot of things wrong. I'm. That Buffett does not. The fact that they're buying it doesn't influence me What I want to hear is from the company. The company comes on, the show tells the right story, I will be behind it, lock, stock and better. But they gotta come on and they gotta answer the tough questions, plain and simple. That's what you want. That's what I promise. The turnaround. CBS is well underway and given how cheap it is, is, well, that generous dividend. I bet this name has more room to run. Watch where I have money, I include my sit down. Oh, boy. This is going to be terrific with Pitney Bose pbi. It's a global mailing shipping company. This is a major transformation. I'm getting firsthand account of the turnaround here with the company's top risk. I got to tell you something. There may be something here too long for the federal government's deal with Intel. But I'll break down why I think this was an intelligent investment by the Trump administration that's also good for shareholders of Intel. And of course, order calls rapid fire in tonight's issue, the lighting. So stay with Kramer. All right, what do we make of this incredible rebound in the stock of Pitney Bows? It's up nearly 71% year to date. Now, a lot of people still see this company as a plate one male meaning old fashioned snail mill. Because their core business used to be mail meters and equipment that helped off send postage. As you might imagine, the stock spent decades in the doghouse. From its peak in 1999 to its lows in April 2020, Pitney Bows lost, get this, 98% of its value. Even in late 2022, the stock was still trading at just around 2 bucks and change. Then an activist stepped in, a guy named Kurt Wolf of Hesit Capital. He took his activist campaign public in December of 2022. Got himself on the board of directors after a proxy fight in the spring of 2023. Over the past couple of years with the activists on the board, Pitney Bowes has divested money, losing lines of business, reduce its debt, repurchase shares. And this company has now repeatedly raised its dividend. This past spring, Wolf took the next step, taking over CEO Pittie Bows and vowing to conduct, quote, a comprehensive strategic review, end quote, for the remainder of the year. And look, it's already paying off since Wolff got involved in the stocks, up more than 400%. So how this activist turned this business around. Let's take a closer look with Kurt Wolff. He's the new CEO of Pitney Bow. Find out. Mr. Wolf, welcome to Man Money.

[E]

All right.

[C]

Thanks for having me on, Jim.

[B]

Absolutely So first, Kurt, people should understand you took a position, you have a huge amount of money invested yourself. You saw a hidden gem, I imagine, but you also know it was hemorrhaging cash and you decide to not like when you got on GameStop or to say, listen, we got to stop the hemorrhaging, we got to turn this company around.

[C]

Absolutely, yeah. And so first off, you talk about having a huge amount invested. I do think it's important to note I have virtually 100% of my own personal net worth and invested in this company just like I did with GameStop. It has the capital we do is we look for companies that are significantly undervalued and what we typically find is good businesses that are just being poorly managed. That was the case with GameStop and we found that here with Pitney Bowes. And just to give some context of what we've done over the last few years, I appreciate the introduction. You know, if you take a step back and look two years ago we were, you know, we were borrowing at 13% interest rate. So you know, we are for severe financial distress now. We just issued convertible debt or convertible debt that even after a covered call strategy we are borrowing at less than 4%. So much more credit worthy on a free cash flow basis. We previously 2023, we had 23 million of free cash flow. Now we're projecting 350 million of free cash flow this year. And then finally our share prices you highlighted, we were down in the low threes just two years ago and now we're up over $12 a share. So and what that's really all those changes, what they've really enabled us to do is focus on our company which has two incredibly well positioned businesses and we can really focus on making the most value.

[B]

Let's talk about those two businesses because they are I think fabulous Centec and Presort. But also tell me about their growth because I know in some cases you're not that happy with the growth yet.

[C]

Right, Absolutely. So yeah, I'll go through the two of them. Pre sort is what we do there. In case some of the viewers aren't familiar with the company, we partner with the post office to make it more cost effective, lower cost for large mailers to, you know, to move mail to their customers. And within that space, we are the dominant player. We are the, the lowest cost player, we're the highest quality player, we're the highest service player. And as you talk about, mail is a declining industry. But you know, people may be surprised to hear we've grown 11 out of the last 12 years. And that's because in the presort space, the rate of decline is pretty slow. And we've been able to use our strong position to continue to gain share. So that's pre sart within sentech. You know, that kind of breaks into three pieces. We have a mailing meter business, which is an essential service provider to 95% plus of the Fortune 500 companies. Beyond that, the federal government. We're a partner with. We're a partner with most state governments and we're a partner with, you know, 500, 500,000 small and medium sized businesses. Businesses. And what we do is we help them run their business more efficiently. But that's kind of what people know about us.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And that is shrinking. Beyond that, we've leveraged what we do in the mailing space to get into the shipping software space. And people may be surprised to know we have over 200 million a year in shipping and shipping software revenue. And that's continuing to grow. And beyond that, maybe the most surprising thing to people is we do have a bank. So the Pitney Bowes Bank. It's one of 21 ILCS that exist. Exist. And it's an incredible. It's a, it's a hidden gem. We have net interest margin of over 7%. If anybody's a bank analyst, they know that's unheard of. We have very low loan losses. So it's just an absolute gem.

[B]

Who would you be lending to? Like a small business or.

[C]

Absolutely, yes. Yeah.

[B]

So you would make a small business that might otherwise, let's say, be eking out more margin. You might make it so that they have higher margins so they can stay in business and grow.

[C]

Yeah, we will lend to customers and then not to get into the complexities of it sure. Are postage meters. We do lease to our customers because they're considered mints. So customers can't typically own them. So we lease them to them. But beyond that, we take deposits from them for their postage. But we also make business loans. So if somebody's growing their business, they can come to us to get a loan to actually help grow their business.

[B]

Okay, so let's. Let me give. So I want people to have the perspective here because it's really important. Mark Lautenbach, terrific guy from IBM, took over the company many years ago. He came on 2017 when stock was at 13, and he said, look, we don't really have a lot of growth. So what we're doing is we're moving heavily into e Commerce now at the time E Commerce was growing really well, but that turned out to be not that great a business. You tell us what the denouement that was since the last our viewers heard was that it was going great guns.

[C]

Yeah. Again, the strategy there is probably hard to, to argue with. People supported it and I understand why people thought it was a good strategy. In the end, the problem was, and this is some of what we're changing within Pitney Bowes is the execution. So, so that business GEC used to be known as newgistics. And Todd Everett, who is now on our board, a phenomenal operator, he used to run that business profitably. We took it over and unfortunately because of the way we run, you know, historically have operated, we turned it into 150 million a year money losing business. So we just didn't have the operational efficiency we needed as a business. And that's one of the things we're focused on is fixing that. So I don't know. The strategy was flawed. The execution was absolutely flawed.

[B]

Okay, so how about the buyback, the dividend increase? Is the company strong enough to do that? And how do you feel about the idea that maybe that just. Are you worried at all about it possibly becoming something that I know you don't like? A Meme stock?

[C]

Yeah. Yeah. So as far as becoming a Meme stock, that's Game stock.

[B]

I know you, I know you resigned.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

From the board. I don't think you were happy with the way it became a Meme stock. As opposed to this cut, cut costs, do a good job and get better through growth that way.

[C]

Yes. Yeah. And when we became a Meme stock, it completely changed what we were doing and what we could do. I had run on a very clear strategy. Cutting costs, improving operational efficiency, investing in some new areas for growth. We had a very sound operational strategic plan when the whole Meme stock rally happened. It is what it is. That wasn't, you know, my skill set, not how we invest. So we moved on.

[B]

Now now, I mean, I know that you're doing the review now, so you're not sure yet about how to, where to put your chips yet for growth. Will you have enough money to do the growth when you come up with the game? But maybe it's an acquisition, maybe it's a new direction that we don't know yet.

[C]

Absolutely. Yeah, we definitely will have that. We're a 2 billion market cap company that generates 350 million of free cash flow a year. And I think we can, we can build on that over the over the coming years, you know, So I guess what I'd say is right now, as I mentioned, you know, the GEC business could have been the right strategy, but. Yeah, the E Commerce business. Yes. So that could have been the right strategy if we'd executed better. My concern is that we need to find. Fix our business. And I'd use an analogy. I know you're a big Eagles fan. You said you guys want a Super Bowl.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And that was based on having arguably the best offensive line in the league and one of the best defensive lines in the league. And that's, you know, I think a core business tenant is in the trenches. It's getting the blocking and tackling right, and that's what we need to do with impending both. So in the short term, we're focused on getting the blocking and tackling right. A year from now, six months from now, we'll be past that, and it'll be a lot easier to grow when we're back.

[B]

Well, this is a clean story. I think you're taking the right approach. Of course. Obviously, my best interest is I really want you to help those small businesses, which is what you're doing, because that's the backbone of America. But I really appreciate you coming on the show. There are not. There's not enough analysts coverage. You should have more. Yes. I think the turn sounds very for real because of the fundamentals and the cash. And I salute you for what you've done.

[C]

I appreciate. Jeff, thank you very much.

[B]

Absolutely. That's Kurt Wolfe. He's the CEO of Pitney Boast pbi. Look, there's just a ton of stuff. I mean, everything is available. You can find out yourself. You want to do it, including a very clear letter about what Kurt's up to. And by the way, I found an order story who said he just wanted out when they did all that meme stuff. I don't want this to be a meme stock. That's not what this is about. This is about business, man. Money's back in with it.

[F]

Coming up, Kramer takes your calls. And the sky's the limit. It's a fast fire lightning round.

[B]

Next. It is time. My step versus preferences by plan it sound. And then the lightning round is over. Are you ready, Ski dad to have a light round? Country lights come up with Mike. My bike in California. Mike. Booyah, Jim. Thanks for taking my call. Of course, Mike, but shaking. Yeah. What are your thoughts on Robin Hood? All right. Robin Hood's had an extraordinary move. And usually when you have these extraordinary moves, you Gotta let it kind of calm down a little. So I say let it calm down, but don't forget it's an upstock. Let's go to Ike in Georgia. Ike.

[E]

Booyah.

[B]

G. Extraordinary booyah to start today. What's going on?

[E]

Not much, man. Ike called you in September 2023 when Palantir was trading at 13 bucks. And you say you are Mr. Palantir? I ended it with Rudy McFaddy. That was a monster call. Thank you for all you do.

[B]

Thank you, man. Thank you very much.

[E]

Today I want to know your take on a company that has been delivering strong financial results, benefiting from infrastructure spending, grid modernization and growing demand for electrical equipment in energy and industrial projects. The company I want you to tell me what you take on today is power industry.

[B]

Oh, man. You know this guy. Ike, be the man. This thing is such a great stock. I saw it. It is the great industrial energy infrastructure stock that I wish I owned for the trust. Wow, Great call. Let's go to Jordan in New York. Jordan.

[E]

Hi, Jim. This name is trading at less than 15 times next year's earnings. A discounted peers and has long term growth tailwinds in the private credit space, 401ks and global investments. In my opinion, the analysts on the street are hugely underestimating its upside potential in this market. Would you recommend buying Apollo?

[B]

You just sold me on Apollo. I love the case. This is a guy. Listen to that guy. He knows more than one Wall street guys put together. I think Apollo's a cheap stock. I think this guy Mark Rowan, I invite him on the show what's coming to show I'm on the show. This company is a very smart company. I am a believer. I'm a believer. Let's go to Kenny in Florida. Kenny.

[E]

Hello, Jim. Welcome back and thank you for all you've done for us.

[B]

Thank you, thank you.

[E]

This stock involves life, radar and navigation systems and now with autonomous vehicles and robots. I have high hopes my small position has not increased over the past few years and until this year. And the stock, while not yet profitable, has 34% year over year revenue growth, a strong balance sheet and virtually no debt. The stock has quadrupled over the past five months. Non parabolically as oxymoron that seems. What's your opinion on ouster?

[B]

Yeah, look, I lidar play and I binge against lidar. I think it's a very expensive stock. It is fine as a spec, but when I talk about autonomous, you know, I always come back once again to Tesla and I always will. And that, Ladies and gentlemen, conclusion of the Lightning round.

[F]

The Lightning Round is sponsored by Charles Schwab. Coming up, intel warned of adventure adverse reactions to the White House's deal for a stake in the company. But Kramer's taking the opposite side of the argument. Hear why?

[B]

Next.

[E]

Booyah, Jim. Your integrity makes you the booyah saint of Wall Street.

[B]

Booyah, Jimmy Chill. Booyah, Jimmy chill.

[E]

Booyah, Jim.

[B]

Quadruple. That's a lot of booyahs. Let's talk about this intel thing. I know the White House is taking a 10% stake in a semi. It's unorthodox. But Intel's been a multi year disaster and our country needs this company to be on firmer footing. Everybody's focused on how Trump did this by taking an equity position. Nobody's focused on the real story, which is that intel desperately needed a large cash infusion. Now it's got it from the federal government so it can now start the great rebuild that can restore its greatness as the semiconductor manufacturer products along. We need a healthy, viable intel because we can't simply rely on Taiwan Semiconductor to manufacture our most advanced chips now when it's only 100 miles away from China. Unfortunately, intel has a heinous balance sheet as it committed to building a bunch of semiconductor foundries by a previous CEO could have bankrupted the company, hence the need for the infusion. I know it's unusual, but President Trump's actually using money from the Chips act that was already earmarked for intel just hadn't spent yet. They need that money, but we can't give them for nothing when it would mean a huge move for the stock without the US getting anything in return. Sure, intel may have had other sources of cash. Yes, the equity it gave the government was dilutive, but come on, the stock jumped huge when the deal was made. In one fell swoop, the President solved Intel's capital problems, bringing up CEO Lip Bhutan to raise the additional billions that intel needs to build semiconductor manufacturing infrastructure, challenge Taiwan semi and help get our country on firmer semiconductor footing away from the sphere of Chinese influence. It's very odd to hear complaints about how this president's picking winners and losers or adopting a socialist agenda. Kind of understand this is not about Trump, it's about the truly dire state of Intel. Look at the huge losses this company had to absorb thanks to the ill advised approach that the messianic former CEO Pat Gelsinger had taken to putting up these massive new fabs. Gelstner decided to build fabs with a model like Taiwan Semi meaning designed them for outsourcing. He did so though with a build it they shall come philosophy. But potential customers didn't come. They didn't materialize realistic numbers at the same time. Gals here made this commitment without any comprehension of the weakness of Intel's cash flow and its lack of capital to finish what he wanted to build. He was part of a long line of Intel CEOs who made suboptimal decisions. But his predecessors never rolled the dice like he did. And he saw, by the way, some industry veterans thought he was on the verge of bankrupting this company. You don't get fired for no reason when you're the CEO of a big cap tech company. Gelsing was fired because he almost destroyed Intel. New CEO and former intel board member Lib Boutan knew about these problems. He decided to become CEO to save the company. Not unlike what he did when he saved cadence design 2009. Joey gave you a 50 times your return when he from when he came in. Now he wants to do the same thing at intel. And after the government freed up those funds in return for 10% stake turning a grand equity, I think he's going to pull it off. I didn't understand the criticism of the President on this one. Why shouldn't the government take the stake and get the upside? This is hardly unprecedented. Not unlike when the government saved Chrysler in 79 reaped a windfall from Warren took when it guaranteed a loan that let management simply save the company. Government took stakes in many institutions that almost failed the Great Recession. It benefited from those stakes when the stocks went up. No one criticized those measures. To speak of intel is just as important as any of those companies. If anything, it actually may be more important from a national security perspective. As to those who would who say okay, who's next? I come back, I say look, if it's a national security issue and one of our important companies might be failing, you better believe it's going to get get bailed out. Doesn't matter if the President, Democrat or Republican. Remember Trump made this investment with money that was authorized under Biden. Intel could not be allowed to fail people. End of story. The President gave Intel new life by fixing his balance sheet. Now intel can recreate its greatness with a proven turnaround artist as CEO. Lip Bhutan is the government wins, the people and the shareholders win. What more did one I don't know. I like to say this always bull markets help my promise to find just for you right here on Man Money. I'm Drew paper. See you tomorrow.

[D]

All opinions expressed by Jim Cramer on this podcast are solely Kramer's opinions and do not reflect the opinions of CNBC, NBCUniversal, or their parent company or affiliates, and may have been previously disseminated by Kramer on television, radio, Internet, or another medium. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Jim Cramer as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his opinion. Kramer's opinions are based upon information he considers reliable, but neither CNBC nor its affiliates and or subsidiaries warrant its completeness or accuracy, and it should not be relied upon as such. To view the full Mad Money disclaimer, please visit cnbc.com madmoneydisclaimer it's not rocket science.

[F]

Grayscale has been educating investors on crypto for over a decade. Grayscale Invest in your share of the future. Investing involves risk and possible loss of principle. Visit grayscale.com for more information.