#406 — The Legacy of Christianity

Making Sense with Sam Harris

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Published: Mon Apr 07 2025

Sam Harris speaks with Tom Holland about his book, . They discuss the enduring influence of Christianity on the modern world, historical interpretations of crucifixion, the moral systems of ancient societies, Paul's letters, the impact of the parable...

Summary

Making Sense with Sam Harris: Episode #406 — The Legacy of Christianity

Release Date: April 7, 2025

In Episode #406 of Making Sense with Sam Harris, renowned historian Tom Holland joins Sam Harris to delve into the profound and enduring legacy of Christianity. This comprehensive discussion explores the historical rise of Christianity, its paradoxical symbols, and its foundational impact on modern secular ethics. Below is a detailed summary capturing the key points, discussions, insights, and conclusions from their engaging conversation.

1. Introduction to the Legacy of Christianity

Tom Holland begins by expressing his admiration for Sam Harris's work, particularly highlighting his book Dominion, which argues that Christianity is the most enduring legacy of the ancient world. Holland emphasizes the often-overlooked notion that even secular moral intuitions are deeply rooted in Christian ethics.

Tom Holland [04:09]: "You argue that so much of what we take to be natural to us in secular moral terms, is really the legacy of Christian ethics."

2. Factors Contributing to the Rise and Endurance of Christianity

Sam Harris outlines the multifaceted cultural influences that facilitated Christianity's rise within the Roman Empire. He points to the synthesis of Hebrew Scriptures, Greek philosophy, Persian dualism, and the Roman Empire's universalist outlook as critical elements that made Christianity appealing across diverse populations.

Sam Harris [04:09]: "Paul in this, I think is the key figure, a Judean raised with a deep knowledge of the Scriptures, but also he has a very, very keen awareness of the vastness of the world."

Harris emphasizes Paul's role in integrating Judean heritage with the expansive nature of the Roman Empire, making Christianity a universal religion adaptable to various cultural contexts.

3. The Paradoxical Appeal of the Crucifixion

The conversation shifts to the enigmatic central symbol of Christianity: the crucifixion of Jesus. Tom Holland and Sam Harris discuss how the image of a crucified, divine figure contrasts sharply with contemporary and historical expectations of divinity and power.

Tom Holland [07:18]: "It's incredibly strange. ... the fact that he had suffered a peculiarly horrible death."

Sam Harris elaborates on the initial Christian discomfort with the crucifixion, noting that early depictions of Jesus did not emphasize the agony and humiliation of the crucifixion. Over centuries, Christians became desensitized to this image, leading to its prevalent, yet paradoxical, acceptance.

Sam Harris [11:09]: "It may not be a coincidence that it is, of course, the most enduring symbol, probably the best known symbol maybe, in world history."

4. Evolution of the Cross as a Central Symbol

Sam Harris traces the transformation of the crucifixion image from an embarrassing symbol for early Christians to a revered icon over centuries. He notes that it wasn't until the first millennium that Jesus began to be portrayed as dead on the cross, gradually losing its immediate associations with suffering and humiliation.

Sam Harris [11:23]: "Just before the first millennium that you get Christ portrayed as dead on the cross."

This evolution signifies how Christians overcame their initial discomfort, allowing the symbol to become a cornerstone of Christian identity and theology.

5. Nietzsche’s Critique of Christian Morality

Tom Holland brings up Friedrich Nietzsche's profound repulsion towards the symbol of the cross, highlighting its clash with Nietzsche's values of strength, power, and beauty derived from Greek and Roman traditions.

Tom Holland [16:15]: "It's kind of paradox, a very Nietzschean paradox, that probably the most devastating to Christian faith ... should have felt the power of the cross so profoundly."

Sam Harris concurs, explaining that Nietzsche viewed the crucifixion as an offense against the values of his admired classical civilizations, perceiving Christianity as the "faith of slaves."

Sam Harris [11:09]: "Crucifixion is the fate that is visited on slaves... the most enduring symbol."

6. Personal Reflections: Sam Harris and the Islamic State

Drawing from his experiences, Sam Harris recounts his visit to Sinjar, a town ravaged by the Islamic State (ISIS). Witnessing the brutal crucifixions carried out by ISIS militants, Harris reflects on the deep-seated moral frameworks that underpin such acts of terror, drawing parallels to the Roman use of crucifixion.

Sam Harris [16:15]: "I think the idea that someone who is tortured to death has a moral value over the person who tortures him to death underpins my moral system."

This visceral encounter reinforced Harris's belief in the profound impact of Christian moral teachings on Western ethics, emphasizing the abhorrence of such brutality today.

7. Christianity’s Influence on Modern Secular Ethics

The dialogue explores how Christian ethics have seamlessly integrated into modern secular morality. Tom Holland challenges this notion, suggesting that historical Christian influences have shaped contemporary views without explicit recognition.

Tom Holland [17:36]: "That is a perspective that I would argue is shaped by 2000 years of Christian weathering."

Sam Harris agrees, positing that many of our moral intuitions, even in a secular context, are vestiges of Christian ethical frameworks.

8. The Interplay Between Christianity and Other Religions

Sam Harris touches upon his exploration of Islam in his works, particularly in In the Shadow of the Sword. He discusses how Islam, emerging from a milieu rich in Jewish, Christian, Zoroastrian, and Roman influences, diverged significantly from Christianity, yet remains intertwined in its historical and ethical legacy.

Sam Harris [21:48]: "Islam was a product of this, but one that had gone on a radically different direction from Christianity."

This analysis underscores the complex interrelations among major world religions and their distinct paths in shaping human civilization.

9. Conclusion and Ongoing Discussions

While the transcript provided ends abruptly, the conversation evidently sets the stage for a deeper exploration of how Christian ethics have permeated secular thought and how this legacy interacts with contemporary moral and philosophical landscapes. The discussion invites listeners to reflect on the often-unseen influences of religious traditions on modern societal values.

Notable Quotes:

Tom Holland [04:09]: "You argue that so much of what we take to be natural to us in secular moral terms, is really the legacy of Christian ethics."
Sam Harris [11:09]: "It may not be a coincidence that it is, of course, the most enduring symbol, probably the best known symbol maybe, in world history."
Sam Harris [21:48]: "Islam was a product of this, but one that had gone on a radically different direction from Christianity."

This episode of Making Sense offers a profound exploration of Christianity's enduring legacy, its symbolic paradoxes, and its foundational role in shaping modern ethical frameworks. Through the insightful dialogue between Sam Harris and Tom Holland, listeners gain a deeper understanding of how ancient beliefs continue to influence contemporary thought and society.