Making Space with Hoda Kotb:

Linda Cliatt-Wayman on Leading With Love to Transform a School

Date: September 3, 2025

Episode Overview

In this deeply inspirational episode, Hoda Kotb welcomes Linda Cliatt-Wayman, renowned educator and former principal of Strawberry Mansion High School in Philadelphia. The discussion centers on Linda’s extraordinary journey transforming one of the country’s most challenged and “persistently dangerous” schools. Her philosophy of radical love and high expectations not only changed test scores and safety outcomes but, more importantly, instilled hope and a sense of belonging in students who had long been written off. Linda shares practical insights, heartfelt stories, and hard-earned wisdom about leadership, resilience, and the power of loving every child. The conversation is a timely balm for educators and anyone invested in helping young people thrive.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Challenge of Transforming Strawberry Mansion

(03:56–08:49)

• Backstory & Context:
  • Strawberry Mansion High School was a merger of three under-attended, high-need schools in North Philadelphia, an area known for danger and poverty.
  • Linda, then assistant superintendent overseeing 61 high schools, could not find a candidate to take on the principal job, despite a generous offer.
  • The sense of danger was personal: Linda grew up in the same neighborhood.
  • Quote: "After I looked around at my 61 principals, it was one principal I was really sure that could do it... She said, 'You may send me there, but it just may kill me.'" — Linda Cliatt-Wayman (05:40)
• Her Calling:
  • Linda describes a powerful, almost spiritual moment where she realized she was meant to take on the challenge herself:
  • “All I could hear, my superintendent in one ear, ‘who was going to go into the school, it’s going to be a bloodbath’ ... I kept hearing this voice. Go. You go. ... and it dawned on me that it was my assignment. And so I resigned... to become the principal.” — Linda (07:04)
• At the time of her arrival, only three students were proficient in math and three in English.

2. Establishing Order and Culture

(08:49–11:32)

• Initial Chaos:
  • On the first day of the newly merged school, a massive drug bust occurred.
  • Students were used to absence of structure and consequences: “Miss, why do you keep telling us about your rules... Don’t you know we do what we want, you do what you want?” — unnamed student, recounted by Linda (10:03)
• Strategy:
  • Developed a clear discipline plan with both consequences and rewards; used weekly town hall meetings to communicate changes.
  • Focused on baby steps: “Most change, it’s not a giant step... it was all through communication.” — Linda (09:14)

3. Breaking the Cycle of Low Expectations

(11:32–13:26)

• Confronting Excuses:
  • Teachers’ empathy for difficult home lives translated to an acceptance of underperformance, which Linda challenged.
  • “They cared and loved them so much, but they didn’t realize it was excuses and low expectation for what they actually could do.” — Linda (12:30)
  • Shifted the narrative: “This is not a place to hang out. It’s a place to transform your life.”
• Persistence and Presence:
  • Being the fourth principal in four years, Linda faced students’ skepticism: "They didn’t think I was gonna stay."

4. Leading With Love: The Power of Affirmation

(13:26–15:31; 17:09–17:59)

• The Slogan:
  • Inspired by a student who’d never been told she was loved, Linda began announcing:
    "If nobody told you they loved you today, you remember? I do, and I always will." — Linda (14:09)
  • The phrase became a daily ritual, deeply embedded in school culture.
  • “When I would even forget to say it... they would track me down.” (15:18)
• Impact:
  • The affirmation changed the emotional atmosphere, affecting both students and teachers:
  • “The teachers would come to me and go, ‘Hey, Ms. Wayman, I think that's working. Say that again.’” — Linda (17:22)
  • This approach bred trust, accountability, and a sense of family. Suspension rates dropped, and students became more engaged.

5. Creating Hope and Vision

(17:59–21:59)

• Building Dreams:
  • Many students had never envisioned a positive future.
  • Linda recounted her own mother’s simple but powerful method—riding free buses on Sundays to see aspirational homes and cars—then replicated these “possibility tours” for her students.
  • “Look at what you can have if you just go to school.” (18:54)
  • For students used to thinking they wouldn’t live past 21, it was transformative.
• Practical Motivation:
  • "The most disruptive students would say... 'Ms. Wayman, you think I'm gonna get on that bus next time?'... And well, he had behaved enough to get on this bus." (21:31)

6. Hard-Won Success—and Its Fragility

(21:59–26:25)

• Results:
  • After the first year, Strawberry Mansion was removed from the “persistently dangerous” list—an accomplishment no one expected.
    "I did what I said I was going to do. I held my promise and I loved them to the bottom of my heart." — Linda (22:33)
  • Test scores improved dramatically.
  • Students noticed: “Ms. Waymond is the only person who ever told me they loved me.” (22:54)
• Leaving and Its Aftermath:
  • After 5 years, Linda left when a familiar inner voice said “it’s time”—a painful decision.
  • The positive culture unraveled after her departure:
    “Ms. Wayman, they’re destroying it... they just were not willing to do all the things we were willing to do.” (24:24)
  • Her deep personal pain led her to seek help, eventually realizing her calling had shifted to sharing her philosophy on a broader stage.

7. Spreading Hope Beyond Philadelphia

(26:25–33:13)

• Speaking and Advocacy:
  • Linda visited schools nationally and found similar root challenges: kids everywhere need hope, and teachers are often their only source.
  • “In these school districts where I go to speak... our kids are like your kids. They have no hope either. And we need you to come and give them some hope.” — Conference organizer relayed by Linda (28:43)
• Conversations with Students:
  • Her alumni often approach her, sometimes unrecognized by name, but remembering her message and impact: “Most of them will say to me, Ms. Waymy, we thought you was crazy, but Ms. Wayman, you saved my life.” (32:26)
  • Hoda: "What does that feel like?"
    Linda: "We are life savers, people. We’re life savers. And some you may not ever hear from... Just tell me if you’re happy. Are you happy?... That means all." (32:26–33:13)

8. The Formative Influence of Linda’s Mother

(33:13–39:34)

• Growing up in Poverty:
  • Her mother, a single parent and amputee, worked tirelessly to support three kids without assistance.
  • Education was the great hope:
    “Everything I thought about was, I gotta do this for my mother... my mother was extraordinary, the love of my life.” (34:10)
• Her Legacy:
  • Linda bought a handicapped van to drive her mother everywhere once she was able.
  • The pride and enduring influence of her mother’s love and vision shaped everything Linda achieved:
    “I am living a dream she dreamt for me.” (36:18)
• A Message to Teachers:
  • “If you love every child from the bottom of your heart, ... the windows of heaven are going to pour out blessings to you that you will not have room to receive.” (36:30)

9. Continuing the Mission: Life After Retirement

(39:34–41:10)

• Linda now runs her own consulting company and nonprofit, “Currently Trending,” focused on developing high school students into leaders ready to overcome challenges and live purposefully.
  • “Retirees, it's not over. ... you’re going to start something amazing.” (39:40)

10. Final Wisdom for Teachers

(41:18–44:02)

• On the Importance of Teaching:
  • “You are the most special, precious people on this planet... There is no president, there is no astronaut, there is no one without you. ... You look at someone in the eye, you tell them, I am a teacher and I change the world.” — Linda (41:25)
  • “Don't put your head down. ... Just say I get to change the world.” (41:53)
  • “If you love them from the bottom of your heart, the windows of heaven is going to pour out blessings to you that you will not have room to receive." (36:30)
• The Profession and Its Future:
  • “It’s a dwindling profession… Who best to tell people about how rewarding this profession is, besides yourself. ... Don't start with the paperwork now. ... Just say I get to change the world.” (42:02)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "If nobody told you they loved you today, you remember? I do, and I always will." — Linda (14:09, 15:18)
• “I'mma tell you, if somebody would have told me that I will be sitting here someday with Hoda, anything's possible.” — Linda (03:56)
• “They cared and loved them so much, but they didn’t realize it was excuses and low expectation for what they actually could do.” — Linda (12:30)
• “We are life savers, people. We’re life savers.” — Linda (32:32)
• "I am living a dream she dreamt for me." — Linda on her mother (36:18)
• “You are the most special, precious people on this planet... Do not put your head down... I am a teacher and I change the world.” — Linda (41:25)
• “Retirees, it’s not over. ... you’re going to start something amazing.” — Linda (39:40)

Useful Timestamps

• 03:56 — Linda describes getting “the call” to take over Strawberry Mansion
• 09:04 — The state of the school on day one; first drug bust
• 13:44 — The start of her famous affirmation (“If nobody told you…”)
• 17:18 — Impact of leading with love on teachers and students
• 22:06 — The school is removed from the persistently dangerous list
• 24:24 — Linda recounts the pain of watching progress slip after her departure
• 32:26 — Linda describes hearing from former students in adulthood
• 36:18 — On living the dream her mother had for her
• 41:25 — Final words of inspiration for teachers

Episode Tone & Takeaways

• Tone: Warm, passionate, candid, deeply personal—full of both practical wisdom and emotional resonance.
• Core Message: The deepest change in children’s lives comes at the intersection of high expectations and unconditional, expressed love. Educators have the power to save and transform lives, and their self-belief and compassion are essential.
• For Listeners: You’ll leave this episode remembering why teaching matters—whatever your role in life, you have the capacity to offer hope, love, and a vision of “what’s possible.”

(For the full experience and Linda’s vivid storytelling, check out her TED Talk and seek out her forthcoming book.)