Managing Your Practice | Dimensional Fund Advisors

Episode: Ingredients of Engagement: How Trust, Presence, and Values Make for a Winning Combination
Date: September 3, 2024
Host: Katherine Williams (Head of Practice Management, DFA)
Guests:

• Helen Learmonth (Director & Financial Planner, Wealth Flow, Edinburgh, Scotland)
• Matt Hall (Co-founder & CEO, Hill Investment Group, USA)

Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into what makes for a truly exceptional client experience in financial advisory—how the intentional integration of trust, presence, and organizational values can drive differentiated service, enhance referrals, and create lasting client partnerships. Through the perspectives of two industry leaders with distinct client bases, the discussion brings to life real-world tactics, memorable stories, and actionable strategies for improving connection and outcomes.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Understanding the Client Experience

• Katherine Williams opens by emphasizing that most advisory business growth comes from client referrals—making the client experience central to business development. Retaining clients is strong industry-wide, but the goal is further differentiation, particularly for unique or specialized client groups (00:11).

2. Meet the Advisors: Approaches & Client Niches

• Matt Hall: Hill Investment Group is a boutique, evidence-based advisory firm focusing on clients who appreciate their philosophy, like to delegate, and are enjoyable to work with (02:40).
  • “The ideal clients… have the capacity to understand our investment philosophy, they like to delegate and they’re very fun to work with.” — Matt Hall (02:58)
• Helen Learmonth: Wealth Flow serves clients with medical negligence or personal injury settlements—often people navigating wealth for the first time who need extensive education and support (03:22).
  • “Our clients… have never had money before. So it is an education for them. But it’s a much slower process… lots more nurture, lots more hand holding…” — Helen Learmonth (03:44)

3. Early Lessons: Empathy vs. Professional Presence

• Helen reflects on returning to planning after having children and encountering emotionally close scenarios (like families with disabled children). Her over-empathy was a wake-up call:
  • “The overwhelming feeling of empathy… was extremely unhelpful to the client actually. That, for me, was a real wake up call.” — Helen (05:15)
• Matt shares how early meetings were over-prepared, dominated by slides and advisor talk; the shift to listening and having team-based meetings proved more valuable (06:33).
  • “We were over-prepared, we talked too much, we had too many PowerPoint slides… We’re better listeners.” — Matt (07:13)

4. Values-Driven Practice: Mission Becomes Experience

• Katherine notes a renewed focus on mission, vision, and values. Matt describes Hill’s “Cheers and the Four Seasons” ethos: personal connection (knowing clients’ names) and “relaxed elegance” akin to high hospitality (09:10).

  • “We know you, we see you, we understand you. You won’t have to reintroduce yourself to us.” — Matt (10:29)

• This approach is ingrained in hiring, onboarding, feedback, and recognition. Values aren’t just posters—they’re daily habits reinforced and celebrated (11:31).

• Helen echoes the focus on service, shared values, and feedback. Her firm eliminates internal competition, collaborates in meetings, and conducts two-by-two feedback with clients for continuous improvement (13:24).

5. Coaching Mindset & Setting the Arena

• At Wealth Flow, every team member is a trained coach, using “setting the arena”—consciously choosing five qualities of being before client or team meetings.
  • “Before any meeting… we set the arena, calling forth five qualities—creative, empowering, generous, receptive, vulnerable. It just changes your perspective.” — Helen (15:19)
• Both guests highlight how professional preparation and presence—not just logistics—are essential:
  • “Very few people give another human being their full presence and we shouldn’t discount that value.” — Matt (19:20)

6. Building Trust: The Trust Equation

• Trust is systematically built, not accidental. Matt references the “trust equation” learned at DFA:
  Trust = (Credibility + Reliability + Intimacy) / Self-Orientation (27:21).
  • “Credibility is, do I believe you can do what you say you can do? Reliability is, do you do what you say you will do? Intimacy is, do you see me and understand me? But it can all be undermined by self-orientation.” — Matt (27:53)
• Simplicity is a virtue; avoiding jargon and meeting clients where they are is a key part of instilling trust and clarity.

7. Lifelong Relationships Over Transactions

• Advisors explicitly tell clients they’re starting lifelong relationships, not one-off transactions.
  • “We’re not transactional. I’m not going to meet you once or twice and not see you again. This is a lifelong relationship.” — Helen (31:59)
• They create resources like client-centric books and personalized onboarding to reinforce value.

8. Feedback Loops: Continuous Improvement

• Both firms actively seek and use client feedback—positive and negative—to refine experience.
  • “The right first response is always thank you… it already shows that they care about your organization.” — Matt (33:31)
• Helen points out that client misunderstandings (e.g., financial jargon) are teachable moments for advisors to clarify and improve communication (36:33).

9. The Role of “Love” and Attention to Detail

• Matt and Helen discuss how personal touches—knowing a client’s favorite team or making direct references to their lives—combat perceived indifference and create memorable connections.
  • “Attention to detail is, in my view, in some ways, love.” — Matt (39:23)

10. Organizational Intentionality & Culture

• True client experience comes from consistent training and reinforcement—beyond the founder/principal, the whole team must embody the firm’s values and presence.
  • “I pride myself in knowing every child’s name, every animal’s name… You have to train people that are emotionally intelligent for this work.” — Helen (42:45)
• Katherine: “Hire for the character, you can train for the competence” (45:00)

11. Practical Takeaways: How to Enhance Client Experience

• Matt: Use modern tools (like an AI notetaker) to assess speaking vs. listening ratios, and focus meetings on asking the right questions, not just providing answers. Leadership sometimes means guiding clients firmly, not merely answering every question (50:40).
• Helen: Develop a coaching environment at all organizational levels. Tools like “Life’s Intentions” uncover what’s meaningful to clients to guide the relationship beyond just financial planning (53:09; 54:47).
• Both: Consider the “residue” clients take with them after meetings; reverse-engineer from the desired feeling or perspective (54:03).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Client Experience:
  “Delivering an exceptional client experience is paramount to driving those referrals over time and certainly retaining clients as well.” — Katherine Williams (00:51)
• On Empathy:
  “The overwhelming feeling of empathy… was extremely unhelpful to the client actually. That, for me, was a real wake up call.” — Helen Learmonth (05:15)
• On Values Manifesto:
  “We know you, we see you, we understand you. You won’t have to reintroduce yourself to us.” — Matt Hall (10:29)
• On Coaching Preparation:
  “Before any meeting… we set the arena, calling forth five qualities—creative, empowering, generous, receptive, vulnerable. It just changes your perspective.” — Helen Learmonth (15:19)
• On Presence:
  “Very few people give another human being their full presence and we shouldn’t discount that value.” — Matt Hall (19:20)
• On Trust:
  “The trust equation is credibility plus reliability plus intimacy, all divided by self-orientation.” — Matt Hall (27:21)
• On Attention to Detail:
  “Attention to detail is, in my view, in some ways, love.” — Matt Hall (39:23)
• On Lasting Impact:
  “What’s the residue you want people thinking about in the parking lot?” — Matt Hall (54:03)
• On Hiring Values:
  “Hire for the character, you can train for the competence.” — Katherine Williams (45:00)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:11] — Opening theme: Growth driven by referrals and client experience
• [02:40] — Matt Hall introduces Hill Investment Group
• [03:22] — Helen Learmonth introduces Wealth Flow’s unique client base
• [05:00] — First client meeting stories; lessons on empathy and preparation
• [09:10] — Mission, vision & values; “Cheers and Four Seasons” at Hill Investment
• [13:24] — Collaboration & feedback at Wealth Flow
• [15:19] — “Setting the arena” and the coaching mindset
• [19:20] — Importance of presence & undivided attention
• [23:38] — Building trust & simplifying the client experience
• [27:21] — The trust equation explained
• [31:59] — Emphasis on lifelong rather than transactional relationships
• [33:08] — Using feedback (positive/negative) for continuous improvement
• [39:01] — Concepts of “love” and detail as antidotes to indifference
• [42:45] — Training the next generation and extending culture through the organization
• [50:40] — Practical takeaways: Use of technology, leadership vs. answer-providing, coaching
• [54:03] — Parking lot “residue” test and backward design of experiences

Additional Resources Mentioned

• Trust Equation (Charles H. Green)
• Radical Candor (Kim Scott)
• Unreasonable Hospitality (Will Guidara)
• Life’s Intentions exercise (Coaching tool)
• Two-by-two feedback (Craig Wortman)

Conclusion

The conversation covered actionable strategies to elevate the client experience—from mission-driven culture and feedback loops, to deep coaching, presence, and hospitality. For both boutique and niche firms, the secret sauce is not found on a checklist but in intentional, whole-firm commitment to seeing, hearing, and authentically connecting with clients.

Final Takeaway:
Whether your advisory practice is established or still growing, lasting success hinges on trust, presence, and values brought to life at every touchpoint. Ask: What do you want your clients to feel as they leave your care? From that, design everything else.

For further details about Dimensional Fund Advisors or to connect with the guests, visit dimensional.com.