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Marketing Vanguard
Beyond Brands: Creating a Movement in Women’s Leadership with Ilona Aman, CMO of Athleta
00:35:36
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- [00:01]
Jenny Rooney
Partnerize is the only partnership management solution powering profitable growth for marketers through an end to end software platform and comprehensive service practice. The Partnerize platform delivers a fully integrated, comprehensive suite of discovery, recruitment, optimization, payment, brand safety and fraud prevention capabilities supported by unrivaled service expertise. With Partnerize, you're in control of the entire partnership marketing lifecycle, all on a single platform.
- [00:31]
Ilona
The power of XI is the future. Women are the future. Girls are the future. The more that we invest in girls today and we look at how movement reinforces not only their confidence in whatever they do in sport, out of sport, they become better human beings. They become the full spectrum of themselves.
- [00:57]
Jenny Rooney
Hi everyone. Welcome to the Marketing Vanguard Podcast. I'm Jenny Rooney here at Adweek and actually this is a special edition. We're live on site at Brand Week 2024 in Phoenix, Arizona. I'm thrilled to be here with Ilona. Amen. Ilona, welcome.
- [01:11]
Ilona
Thank you so much for having me so excited. And thank you for putting so much air conditioning in given the temperatures outside.
- [01:18]
Jenny Rooney
We never said that brand week wasn't hot.
- [01:20]
Ilona
The heat is real and I'm here for it.
- [01:23]
Jenny Rooney
So, Ilona, you're the CEO of Athleta, so let's talk about that. For folks who aren't familiar perhaps with your career journey and where you were before this and how long you've been at Athleta, why don't you share that with our listeners?
- [01:34]
Ilona
Absolutely. So I started at Athleta at the end of January of this year. It feels like I've been with the brand for 20 years because there's been so many amazing things going on. But I actually started my career at Nike back in 2002. I was a little baby bear just trying to learn as much as I could as fast as I could. And I spent just a little under 12 years there working in different disciplines of marketing across multiple categories. As a big sports fan, it was really exciting to work on the sports that I loved most and having the ability to not only work on the business side, but also then enjoy the sports as a consumer. Having the ability to travel across the country and be a consumer and a fan and a business person all in one. After Nike, I went to Adidas unplanned. I originally just took some time off to actually teach bar method. I fell in love with the bar method community. That's so cool. I taught for about eight years, but I had an opportunity to work at Adidas across multiple categories versus just one vertical category. And I worked on our strategic business account, which was Foot Locker Inc. At the time. And having the ability to look at the North America business across multiple functions and look at both men's, women's and kids. It was so exciting to apply the fundamentals that I had learned at Nike into a different business model. I spent about eight years there. In my final role, I led marketing for Beyonce and Pharrell, which couldn't ask for a more exciting role from two people that I look up to that are such incredible visionaries. I felt like I learned so much not only about the business, but about myself. I tapped into emotions I didn't know I had. Like just the ability to persevere was one. And something that Beyonce taught me, which I still apply today, is there's not a no, it's a how. And I don't think I really applied that across sort of life and business. And so now I really think about whatever you can dream of, you can bring into reality. So it's never no, it's always a how.
- [03:45]
Jenny Rooney
I'm going to use that. I love that.
- [03:47]
Ilona
Yeah, It's a great mantra that I carry with me all the time. I started a family over Covid and based on rediscovering priorities and what was important, I took some time off and then accepted a role as a CMO at Fabletics. And that brought me down to la, which I was really excited about. I needed sun in my life. I had spent most of my my time in Oregon, but really blessed to be able to travel. And I spent about 16 months there. And then the opportunity for athletic came and it was so serendipitous because I was reflecting on what's next, where do I want to spend my time, where do I want to create impact. And as a mom to a daughter, I really started to think about the brands that were making an impact in the women's space. And not just because it started to become popular, but because they truly believed in making a difference. And as I did my homework and collected intel on Athleta, the thing that stood out to me was the inception of the brand was really about being in service of women. The inception of the brand came from a place of creating products and unlocking access to products for women in a way that big brands and little brands weren't doing yet.
- [05:07]
Jenny Rooney
When was with Fluta launched, so it.
- [05:09]
Ilona
Was back in 1996. 96, 97.
- [05:12]
Morgan Lehman
Wow.
- [05:12]
Ilona
And part of that ecosystem was recognizing that there wasn't performance product created for women. And so the brand started as a catalog business and it wasn't making its own product. Originally, it was actually creating a catalog with smaller brands that were creating performance products for women. And I thought that was such an interesting approach of saying, hey, we're not quite there yet, so what can we do in the short term to be in service of? And then you fast forward now and when we think about where we are in our reinvigoration of the brand and our commitment to the power of she and ultimately our mission around creating and inspiring women to find their confidence and their strength and their belonging through this notion of movement that just seems so authentic to where I am just in life and what I want to not only enable for the generations that come after me, but ultimately set the foundation for my daughter. Selfishly, like, that just sounds exciting to be a part of that.
- [06:15]
Jenny Rooney
I love that. So many things about what you just described are fascinating to me. Obviously, there's a connected thread throughout your career progression. Sports, athletics, fitness, that sort of thing. I'm really curious, what was your education in? Did you.
- [06:30]
Ilona
Marketing.
- [06:30]
Jenny Rooney
Marketing. Okay.
- [06:31]
Ilona
Yeah, I went to Portland State. Go Vikings. Small school. But I always knew I wanted to be in marketing. What I wasn't clear on is what discipline within marketing because I wasn't versed in all the different applications that could live under marketing. So originally I thought I wanted to be in sports marketing. As I understood what that required, I realized, mm, I don't know if I.
- [06:54]
Jenny Rooney
Really want to do that.
- [06:55]
Ilona
Then I leaned into advertising. As I got into Nike, I realized advertising meant something different than what I studied in school. So it took going through the process and working in different business units and categories and functions to really unlock, like, exactly what in marketing, I wanted to do and landed in brand marketing specifically.
- [07:14]
Jenny Rooney
So, I mean, you are the example of somebody who's been so intentional, right. About the choice that you're making. And certainly going to Athleta, there seemed to be such an intentional choice there. Obviously, it lines up with what you've always wanted to do just in terms of your career. Then more specifically the area of sports and athletics and fitness, and then obviously now having a daughter. Threading that into the purpose, frankly, your purpose as CMO of Athleta. I want to ask you and I. It is so fascinating. I did not realize that Athleta had been launched in the late 90s. Obviously, the power of she has become so. And that existed before you got there, that it's so arguably, it's close to just do it. I mean, people know that, right?
- [07:51]
Ilona
It's part of.
- [07:52]
Jenny Rooney
It's part of sort of our collective Lexicon that's associated with the brand, which is so cool and arguably very much on the cutting edge in early days of a movement that now we see persisting, which is great.
- [08:03]
Morgan Lehman
Yeah.
- [08:03]
Jenny Rooney
But nobody else can own that but you all. So you walk into a place where I'm sure, and you tell me you have to have reverence for what's gone before, what brought Athleta to this place. But also you're thinking about, how do I now lead the company forward? Because there's so much more competition in this space. It's just insane. So how are you thinking about that balance?
- [08:22]
Ilona
I mean, it's a combination of two things. One, I. And we believe in the philosophy of force, multiplication. So we're not here to do it by ourselves. We're here to have the right partners. Whether it's with individuals like Simone Biles and Katie Ledecky, which become great storytellers on behalf of the brand and reciprocated back to them, we become storytellers for them. But also then we think about the brands that we want to partner with where there's a really natural shared value system where we're going after the same cause, whether that's through media partnerships, whether that's through hospitality partnerships, whether that's through experiences, because there is power in numbers. And when we find those places and spaces where we share those common goals, we realize we're going after the same audiences. And why not be in service to them through the total sort of ecosystem that they live in, versus coming to them from just one singular angle of we can service you in this portion of your life. There is something about this notion of all tides rise, and we're really leaning into that because we don't want this to be a moment. We want this to be a movement, and we want to lead that movement because we feel so confident in how authentic we've been in our commitment to this conversation for multiple decades. And now it's as other people are joining the conversation. We're really excited about that. Like, why not? We want to invite as many people to join that with us. Yep.
- [09:47]
Jenny Rooney
As a practical matter, Athleta is owned by the Gap Company, correct?
- [09:51]
Ilona
Yep.
- [09:51]
Jenny Rooney
The Gap company has a portfolio, if you will, of individual brands. Old Navy, Banana Republic, all of them, including Gap. By the way, listen, that is a legendary company in terms of marketing leadership. Right. The individual CMOs who have held posts at Gap, whether it was Seth Farman back in the day, Old Navy, Banana, like, so my question is around. Obviously, marketing haft is so key and Historically, so important to Gap. How are you thinking about, though, separating yourself from that grouping and making sure that you're bringing that distinctive value and positioning vis a vis the other companies and brands that are in the portfolio in a way that's advantageous to everybody, quite frankly.
- [10:33]
Ilona
I mean, I love that question so much because there is so much behind the scenes that's unknown. We're at this very awesome turning point of bringing together four American brands, and that's an incredible statement in itself. Behind the scenes, you have four powerhouse CMOs who are all women and women minorities. So the fact that we can have that kind of representation when we think about propelling each of these brands forward in itself is already. That's the feature story, right. From a corporate standpoint, where we spend a lot of time is finding those points of differentiation based on the consumer that we're serving. So everything goes back to consumer centricity and the reality of each of our brands. While there might be some product category crossover, we all have unique consumers that we're in service of. And so every plan is built around that. The product is built around that. The storytelling is built around that.
- [11:34]
Jenny Rooney
So on that point, this is just an interesting nuance. On the one hand, you need to know what the other brands are doing, but at the same time, I would imagine you almost have to put blinders on and make sure you're just laser focused on, not be distracted or say, well, we can't do that because they're doing that, so we'll do this. You have to focus specifically on who your target market is, what works best for you, and then almost like pull back the curtain and see, well, okay, so actually, that does look very much like that, but it's almost like if you start from the consumer first. Do you know what I mean?
- [12:01]
Ilona
Absolutely. And it's a combination of, like, I always use sports analogies. Every single brand is a respective position on the court or on the field. Someone's a quarterback, someone's a wide receiver, somebody's a kicker. That's what each of the brands are. We're very specialized in our respective position, our respective consumer. But then when you see us on the field together, it's a very seamless field of play because everyone knows the plays that are coming, everyone knows the quarters, everyone knows the sequencing, and we stay very close in that communication so that we're not competing with each other or cannibalizing each other's business. We are on a similar retail calendar. So holiday is important for all of us.
- [12:43]
Jenny Rooney
Right.
- [12:43]
Ilona
As an Example, we're all targeting something during holiday, but based on the proximity of which we're working with one another, we all have a lane that we're coming at it from that's specific to our consumer and that consumer behavior, which is where we have synergy between all the brands.
- [12:59]
Jenny Rooney
I won't name them by names, but back to the competition piece. There is a lot of competition in the category. What do you make of that? And how, as a marketing leader do you need to push forward?
- [13:07]
Ilona
I mean, I love it because I thrive in solving the puzzle. And what makes marketing exciting is every day there's a new puzzle to solve. There is no consistency in marketing. You're always going for the next challenge.
- [13:22]
Jenny Rooney
Not know but how.
- [13:24]
Ilona
Exactly, not know but how. And looking at the brands that are entering the space, it forces you to be more innovative, it forces you to think more creatively. Because the days of just competing with the big brands, that's gone. Now you have a landscape of small brands. You have individuals who are brands based on what digital and social has unlocked. You have fashion brands that are leaning into activewear and streetwear. And so you're constantly having to refine the tools in your toolbox in order to stay competitive. And I think that's exciting because then as a consumer and as a executive, I always have options. There's never a time I don't have options. And that's very cool.
- [14:05]
Jenny Rooney
Couple quick questions that I ask in the Marketing Vanguard interview. You answered the question of why does the world need Athleta? But I'm going to ask you that again just so that you can concisely stated based on that question.
- [14:18]
Ilona
I mean, I can give you like here's the 50 reasons why. I would say the best way I would describe it is because the power of she is the future, Women are the future, girls are the future. The more that we invest in girls today and we look at how movement reinforces not only their confidence in whatever they do in sport, out of sport, they become better human beings, they become the full spectrum of themselves. There are studies done in science and in psychiatry, psychology of when movement is an underpinning discipline that exists in your life, you avoid depression, you become a higher performing individual in your respective craft, you become a better contributor to society. And if you think about all of those things, why wouldn't we want to invest in that as we look at what the future looks like? Because even if we think about the stats that have been done around women executives, there's a common thread that women who are in C level roles, played sports at some point in their life. And there's value in what they learned as a result from playing sport, whether they were a child or they competed at a collegiate level or professional level. So reinvesting in that notion and being a leader in that is so absolutely critical when we think about what the future looks like.
- [15:42]
Jenny Rooney
So that is a great segue into my next question. I ask this of every guest on this podcast. I played soccer actually all my growing up years, so this is a selfish question on my part. I use it as the analogy because I just love soccer. So trying to assess who you are as a leader, your leadership style, you're a player on a soccer team. Going with that metaphor, are you the striker trying to score the goals at all costs? Are you the midfield line trying to be that connective tissue between the defensive players and the offense? Or are you a defensive player protecting that goal from the onslaught of your competitor?
- [16:15]
Ilona
Oh, my God, what a great question. Can I be Ted Lasso?
- [16:18]
Jenny Rooney
Sure.
- [16:19]
Ilona
I would say that I'm the midfielder trying to have the connective tissue, but also leaning into the striker when it's necessary because I think there's the harmony that I try to toggle of, like when it's time to attack and when it's time to be a point of connection and be a catalyst.
- [16:37]
Jenny Rooney
Love that. As a cmo, what do you want to be known for?
- [16:40]
Ilona
The impact I have on people. Ultimately, I think marketing is marketing at this point in my life. Like, I've done every version of marketing. I love it. It wakes me up in the morning. But when I can make an impact in someone's life based on where they are, whether it's in their career or their personal journey, by sharing something with them or unlocking access for them or giving them a seat at the table, that, to me, is the most fulfilling thing.
- [17:06]
Jenny Rooney
Last quick question. In a sort of pay it forward spirit, who's next? Who's somebody that I should have on the podcast? Can be somebody who you know really well, who's a peer who's doing extraordinary things, or it can be somebody in the industry who you admire from afar. You have never had a chance to meet that person, but you think they're doing some extraordinary things.
- [17:24]
Ilona
Oh, my gosh. There's some phenomenal individuals at Athleta that have just done such incredible work. One, Michelle Goad. She's currently helping us in our digital transformation. Absolute rockstar. The knowledge of this woman's mind is just the most incredible thing I've ever seen. I literally want to plug in a USB drive and be like, transfer it to me. I want to know all of this. Another Michelle Shedoni, she just joined the Gap Inc. Brands as the VP of Communications. The level of brilliance that this woman has, to not only be a storyteller on behalf of communications and pr, but also her ability to be a marketer and understand how to tap into the hearts and minds of consumers is some of the best work that I've seen. I also think my co cmos across the other brands. Fabi Torres, obviously legend. I didn't get a chance to work with her directly at Nike, but have always looked up to her and so having the ability to be side by side with her now is tremendous. Mina from Banana Republic. I mean I feel like this is one of those like Grammy speeches where you're like rattling off the people you want to thank and they're like the music is starting off banaz, that Old Navy. But you know what I love?
- [18:37]
Jenny Rooney
You chose people who are within your organization. Mostly I ask that question and people refer to people out in industry elsewhere. And I love that you immediately went to the folks that you're working with. Internally I feel super blessed.
- [18:49]
Ilona
Like it's a pinch me moment where I'm like, is this my reality? Am I going to wake up and really this is the Truman show and they're going to pull down the curtain. I feel like this moment in time in my career, everything is clicking the way it's supposed to and I want to just hold on to that as long as I can.
- [19:06]
Jenny Rooney
Well, we wish that for you as well. Ilona. Thank you so much for joining me. There's so much more we could have dug into, but you know, from a leadership standpoint, it's lovely to hear your story and to understand where you've come from and where you're going with the brand. So thank you so much.
- [19:19]
Ilona
I appreciate that so much and thank you for having me. This has been an incredible experience. You and your team have been phenomenal. Thank you, thank you, thank you for.
- [19:27]
Morgan Lehman
All your meeting, event and workplace needs. Convene is a partner, not just the place. A preeminent global hospitality company within the meeting, event and shared workplace industries. The company and its portfolio of brands provide clients with concierge style service in house, food and beverage in house, event production resources and dedicated service staff all to ensure a seamless and memorable experience.
- [19:53]
Jenny Rooney
Partnerise is the only global partnership management solution powering profitable growth for marketers through an end to end software platform and comprehensive service practice. The partnerise platform delivers a fully integrated, comprehensive suite of discovery, recruitment, optimization, payment, brand safety and fraud prevention capabilities supported by unrivaled service, including the category's only in house support program. With partnerise, you're in control of the entire partnership marketing lifecycle, all on a single platform. Partnerise gives marketers a better way to partner.
- [20:35]
Morgan Lehman
The most innovative marketers are the ones who dare to ask the questions that matter and encourage a culture of curiosity in their organizations. That's the essence that distinguishes the 10 marketers who are being honored as winners of the inaugural Survey Monkey Curiosity Awards. The premise of the awards is simple. Celebrate extraordinary marketing professionals working at Survey Monkey customer companies who are driving innovation and shaping what's next for their businesses, industries and communities. So, as you listeners may have heard, we've been talking with the award winners from the SurveyMonkey contest, but today we are sitting down with Morgan Lehman, senior Director of Product and lifecycle marketing at SurveyMonkey to get a little bit of the inner workings over there. Morgan, hello and welcome. Hi.
- [21:20]
Unknown
Thanks so much for having me.
- [21:21]
Morgan Lehman
Yes, I mean, I see this in every conversation. It's been super rewarding to just kind of talk to people in different parts of marketing and how they use Survey Monkey, but of course we love to talk to you guys and kind of get a peek under the hood. But before we jump in, can you start by telling us a little bit about yourself and what you do at Survey Monkey?
- [21:41]
Unknown
Of course I can, yeah. And I'll also share that we're super proud of this awards program and it's been fun on our end to hear customers talking about the different ways that they're getting value out of the product too. So thank you again for hosting the awards and sharing everyone's insights with your community. So, yeah. I'm Morgan. I lead product and lifecycle marketing here at SurveyMonkey. I've been with the company for nine and a half years. So a bit of a dinosaur in the tech world, but am a real researcher turned marketer, which is what drew me to SurveyMonkey in the first place. Got my start in my career at Nielsen doing marketing effectiveness analytics for a lot of CPG companies. My main client was Procter and Gamble, so I got to know that world a little bit. And then Moving over to SurveyMonkey, I actually started in our sales organization as a research consultant and started to do more and more on the product marketing side. Getting that first initial start in our sales work really helped me understand our customers, what their pain points were, what they were Trying to achieve with an insights or feedback platform like SurveyMonkey and moving over to the marketing side, I've had roles in product marketing as well as now leading the team responsible for product marketing, solutions marketing, email marketing, customer marketing and demand generation. So it's been a fun ride here at Survey Months.
- [23:09]
Morgan Lehman
Oh my gosh. So I feel like you have just like a wealth of knowledge touching these different parts of the industry. And I'm guessing measurement is totally your thing if you start at Nielsen. Now you're here.
- [23:20]
Unknown
Well, it's funny because I used to provide that kind of analytics to clients and now I'm a consumer of it leading demand generation. I'm talking about multi touch attribution all day long. So it's funny because I've kind of done the 180 and become a client of what I used to provide. I love that.
- [23:36]
Morgan Lehman
And that probably makes you such a solid resource over there. So kudos to you for your trajectory. So about SurveyMonkey. So this brand is widely known, beloved. But can you talk about why specifically the product is good for marketers? I mean you're in this world so you can definitely speak to it. But why specifically for marketers?
- [23:56]
Unknown
We're a marketer, so we know it's a crazy landscape out there. Marketers have a tough job. The market's evolving, customer needs are shifting, there's more and more technology growth, AI is more prominent. It's just getting harder to stand out from competitors. So we know that for marketers to thrive in today's market, they need to connect with customers really authentically and drive those bold ideas that help drive growth for their company. And so in such a fast paced world, marketers really can't afford to invest in the wrong ideas or miss out on a moment or put out a poorly planned message into the market. And this still happens. And you guys are still reporting on brands who have launched campaigns that have either missed the mark or even straight up offensive. So getting regular up to date insights before investing in creative or before going all in on a specific target audience can really make or break the success of a campaign. And not all marketers have a research background like me or my colleagues in SurveyMonkeys. So that's why we've built research methodology right into the product. It makes it really easy for marketers to conduct high quality studies really quickly. So for example, last year we launched our new build with AI feature. You can simply describe the feedback you're trying to collect and we'll produce a custom survey draft in around 30 seconds. And so you can go from blank page to full survey draft in a matter of minutes. And it is insanely powerful for folks like marketers who aren't that savvy when it comes to survey design or research methodology. And then we've also over the years built up our audience panel so you can tap into people from all over the world for targeted market insights. So I think SurveyMonkey is really unique. We've got this 25 year history of research expertise and one of the OG survey online survey platforms. And we've just over the years been building more and more of our own proprietary knowledge and expertise and AI into our product to just make it really easy for people to do great, high quality research. And again, with this awards program, it's just been so fun to hear customers share how they're getting the value out of the product and the different ways that marketers are using SurveyMonkey.
- [26:15]
Morgan Lehman
Yeah, I think what's so fascinating to me about you guys over there, and I can tell from the conversations, I feel like SurveyMonkey does a good job of listening to its users and just kind of tending to those needs. Like even just incorporating AI now as a facilitator and more for like efficiency purposes is really telling.
- [26:34]
Unknown
Yeah, yeah. I mean, AI doesn't have to be that scary. It can just really help you get your work done well. And that's kind of the mantra we've been using at SurveyMonkey is like, how do we use all this knowledge and expertise, build our own proprietary tools and models to help you throughout that entire survey process, from creation to analysis. And it's been really fun to see how our customers have been able to use it.
- [26:59]
Morgan Lehman
Yeah, for sure. I love that. Now, what are some of the top use cases marketers should be using SurveyMonkey for?
- [27:08]
Unknown
Well, marketers are probably the biggest cohort of customers that we have at SurveyMonkey. So marketers are using SurveyMonkey day in, day out. And I'd say across, if I were to think about a typical marketing department or even through the customer lifecycle or funnel, there are so many different ways that you could be using SurveyMonkey at your company. So if I think about brand or creative teams, they're using SurveyMonkey to screen, creative ideas, testing, add copy, logos, imagery. Maybe they're using SurveyMonkey even earlier stages to help define that ICP or that ideal customer profile. And then on the flip side, using surveys to track their brand health, product. Marketing teams like the one that I lead are using surveys to do marketing and competitive intelligence, buyer Persona research. They're testing messages and claims. They're prioritizing value props. They're conducting win loss analysis. They're running surveys internally with the sales org to make sure that they are checking in on sales confidence across a variety of things around like really confident in their pitch or competitive Intel Content strategy teams are using SurveyMonkey to understand content consumption habits and preferences, get ideas for topics. They're doing thought leadership research. That's a big thing that we do at SurveyMonkey too is we're conducting studies all the time and publishing that research. That original research is thought leadership. We've got demand gen and field marketing teams that are using surveys for event planning, registration forms, a live attendee polling and then even post event feedback on our website. We've got web forms and our customer marketing team, if you think about once you've acquired customers are trying to drive advocacy and loyalty. We're using surveys to recruit customers into our champion program to gather testimonials at scale and even we've got a case study template where you could pretty much just create an entire case study with the use of a form or a survey without even really having to do a ton of the back and forth with the customer. So if you think about that whole life cycle, there are so many different ways that people can be using surveys in their marketing orgs.
- [29:21]
Morgan Lehman
Yeah, I feel like the competitive intel one is a big one at least when I was at agency side or just kind of always putting that together for clients and things like that. So that one stuck out to me a bit.
- [29:32]
Unknown
The biggest thing with competitive intel that's interesting with surveys is a lot of time you're collecting whether it's a customer satisfaction score or a net promoter score. But you don't know if that's good for in relation to the market. Like is our score good? And so a lot of ways people are using surveys to in the market and with competitors to benchmark some of those key metrics that they're tracking to just understand where they sit in relation to other players.
- [29:59]
Morgan Lehman
Yeah, that totally tracks. So now I'm curious, what about your team? Can you talk about a recent study or a survey your team at SurveyMonkey ran?
- [30:08]
Unknown
Yes, I mean we're running research all the time. We're lucky because we work at SurveyMonkey. So everyone's got an account, everyone's got the agency to run their own research whenever they need. And so I would say like we probably are an outlier when I think about the norm in terms of frequency of teams running research. But one does come to mind. We recently refreshed a Mac stiff study. And so, not to get too nerdy with your listeners, but it's a great way of prioritizing or getting a final stack rank of what's important when it comes to whether it's features or value, props or claims or even hr. Teams use it for benefits. But the way we used it recently was to understand which product benefits our target audience values the most. So we'd done this research several years ago. We'd been doing a lot of ICP research to refine our target audience. And when you're a product marketing team crafting messaging, there can be a lot of nuance in the priorities you place on certain value props. And we wanted to make sure that we were anchoring on the things that really, truly mattered the most to our specific target audience. So we're not appealing to the broad masses like some of the other free forms players out there. Like, we really have a more sophisticated business use at SurveyMonkey. And so we wanted to make sure that those people we were targeting that we were messaging the right things to them. So we ran a maxdiff study which essentially gives us a full stack rank of our product value props. And we actually learned one of the things that we were testing with this research was, hey, like, does some of the power and sophistication that AI can bring to survey research, do people care about that? Does that matter? Are they afraid of it, or are they really interested in that? And does that set us apart in terms of when people are shopping for their survey platform? And in fact, we found that it was pretty important. Now, we also learned in this study that power in service of ease or intuitiveness like that is what people really care about. So it's something that confirms or validates what we've been building, and now we can inject more of that into our message? So it was a really interesting study. The results are being shared broadly with the SurveyMonkey team, even up to the executive level. And so it's really helping us craft how we position ourselves in the market, which is kind of cool. And this is something that any brand or any marketing team should and can be doing is really making sure, if you're really certain about who you're going after as a target audience, making sure that you are positioning yourselves to be the best at the thing that they care about most. And so that's really important as marketers. So, yeah, I figured I'd share that one.
- [32:58]
Morgan Lehman
Yeah. It's super fascinating to just kind of like dive into this world for a little bit. And it's interesting to hear. I feel like at the crutch of it all, the basis you just said it, knowing who your consumer is, then from there you can kind of move forward and really know how to use survey monkey tools. So my last question for you is one that I've been asking everyone, but I feel like this question, you've kind of responded all wrapped into these past few questions. But what does curiosity mean to you? I mean, you're sitting on the research team, so naturally this is a part of you, it's a part of your day. But what does it mean to you?
- [33:34]
Unknown
So I'll share that. I am a mother of a toddler, so I do get to witness raw curiosity every single day. It's really fun to rediscover the world through her eyes and her questions. And when I think about how curiosity shows up in the workplace, is it too far off? That childlike sense of wonder, wanting to understand how the world works, why things are the way they are? But really what I think it comes down to is just being brave enough to ask the right questions. So is there an opportunity to refine our target audience further? Or what about our current messaging isn't holding up? Or how might we improve this process that is painful for everyone? Ultimately, I think curiosity is that spark that leads you down a path towards insight and some sort of resulting action that makes things better, whether that's for your customers or for your company.
- [34:27]
Morgan Lehman
Yeah. I'm going to go back to the first part of your response though, and I totally agree. I feel like even our lived experience outside of the workplace plays a role in what we do at work. So I'm with you. I have a toddlers too, and I just feel like it kind of teaches us to look at the world a little bit more closely and a little more mindful. So I totally hear you on that.
- [34:49]
Unknown
Yeah, it's almost like, okay, put yourself in someone's shoes who's brand new to the situation. Like a toddler experiencing something new and look at it from a totally outside perspective. What questions would you have? How would you change what exists today? Or what would you dive deeper into understanding? And we can learn a lot from our kids.
- [35:10]
Morgan Lehman
Oh, I love that. It's almost like also seeing the users is that way. Right? Like they come to SurveyMonkey and what are they seeing? What do they need?
- [35:19]
Unknown
There's something so powerful on that. I mean, curiosity just as an emotion only gets you so far. But once you take that leap to actually put your questions down on, I guess, digital paper, in our case, put your questions down, get them out there and they take some guts, right? Because like, you might get some responses back that you don't like, or exposing something that's broken or a bad experience. And you might not always get the result you want. But having that courage to go out there and ask the questions that matter can make a big difference.
- [35:53]
Morgan Lehman
I love that. Curiosity and courage just handshake together. That's so great. Well, thank you, Morgan, so much for giving us a look at the inner workings over there. And this has been such a treat to talk to you all. So thank you so much for joining us.
- [36:08]
Unknown
Of course. Thank you again for having me and for partnering with us on these awards. It's been a pleasure.
- [36:14]
Morgan Lehman
Yes, it's been great on our end too. And to our listeners, Be sure to tune into past episodes where we chat with the winners of the inaugural SurveyMonkey Curiosity Awards celebrating these extraordinary marketing professionals working at SurveyMonkey customer companies who are driving innovation and shaping what's next for their businesses. We will see you next time. Be sure to tune into those past few episodes. Thanks.
- [36:39]
Ilona
Thank you for listening to Marketing Vanguard, part of the Adweek Podcast Network and Acast Creator Network. This podcast was produced by Jordan Praetano.
- [36:47]
Unknown
Executive produced by Al Manarino and John.
- [36:49]
Ilona
Heil, and edited by Lane McGibney at Boutwell Studios. You can listen and subscribe to all of Adweek's podcasts by visiting Adweek.com podcasts stay updated on all things Adweek Podcast Network by following us on Twitter at Adweek Podcast. And if you have a question or suggestion for the show, send us an email@podcastadweek.com thanks for listening.