Leadership and Growth: Insights from Michael Kassan, Founder and CEO of 3C Ventures

Summary

Marketing Vanguard: Leadership and Growth with Michael Kassan, Founder and CEO of 3C Ventures

Episode Release Date: January 29, 2025

Introduction

In this insightful episode of Marketing Vanguard, hosted by Jenny Rooney of Adweek, Michael Kassan, Founder and CEO of 3C Ventures, delves deep into the evolving landscape of the marketing industry. The conversation navigates through key topics such as technological advancements, agency consolidation, the role of CMOs, and strategic growth opportunities. This summary encapsulates the pivotal discussions, shedding light on Kassan's visionary perspectives and strategic insights that are shaping the future of marketing.

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1. Embracing Technological Advancements: The Role of AI and 5G

Michael Kassan opens the dialogue by drawing parallels between the advent of 5G technology and the current surge in Artificial Intelligence (AI). He emphasizes that both technologies are transformative "technologies of yes," signifying their profound impact across various sectors.

"I look at AI as the same thing [as 5G]. It's a technology of yes. The question is, I'm not sure any of us know the right questions to ask yet. That's the challenge." [03:14]

Kassan reflects on his past experience interviewing John Donovan, then President and COO of AT&T, during the 5G rollout. This historical context underscores his belief in the necessity of formulating the right questions to harness AI's full potential in marketing—from creativity and content production to ad targeting.

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2. The Importance of Asking the Right Questions

Jenny Rooney highlights the industry's tendency to project an image of omniscience, stressing the importance of creating environments where even the most fundamental questions are welcomed.

"We have to figure out what the right questions are." [09:32]

Kassan concurs, sharing anecdotes about historical initiatives like "youth immersion," which provided senior executives with safe spaces to ask basic questions—underscoring the value of humility and continuous learning in leadership roles.

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3. CES and the Evolution of Marketing at Major Industry Events

Discussing his longstanding relationship with the Consumer Electronics Show (CES), Kassan recounts the genesis of docent-led tours at CES, aimed at enriching attendees' understanding of emerging technologies.

"I've been coming to CES for nearly 40 years. Twenty years ago, I saw an opportunity to create docent-led tours of the CES show floor." [05:22]

Through 3C Ventures, Kassan has significantly influenced CES's transformation into a pivotal tentpole event for marketers, increasing marketer attendance from virtually none to approximately 15,000 participants today. This shift highlights the growing recognition of CES as a convergence point for marketing, media, advertising, entertainment, sports, and technology.

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4. Navigating Agency Consolidation and the Future of the Agency Landscape

Kassan discusses the ongoing consolidation within the agency sector, attributing it to the industry's inherent fragmentation seeking efficiency through mergers.

"Fragmentation, consolidation, and efficiency. If you find me something that's fragmented that I can make more efficient through consolidation, someone's going to make money." [01:02]

He commends the anticipated merger between Omnicom and IPG, viewing it as a strategic move towards operational efficiency. Kassan also highlights the continuous interest from both strategic and private equity players in agency acquisitions, predicting further consolidation in the near future.

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5. The Rise of Independents and the Convergence of Brand and Performance Marketing

Addressing the impact of consolidation on independent agencies, Kassan argues that agility and flexibility give smaller firms an advantage, particularly in the burgeoning "brandformance" sector—a fusion of brand and performance marketing.

"Brandformance because I think the two are coming together. So I think that's a place where the independents have an advantage because they're better suited on performance." [14:05]

However, he notes that larger agencies are swiftly adapting to this trend, necessitating that independents continuously demonstrate their unique value propositions to maintain competitiveness.

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6. Content as the Driver for Commerce

Kassan underscores the pivotal role of content creation in driving commerce, asserting that brands increasingly recognize the necessity of owning and innovating content.

"I believe content creation is the driver for commerce. I don't think you see the word commerce any longer, not modified by the word content." [15:09]

Referencing historical milestones like the "Madison and Vine" panel and the "Content and Commerce" conference, Kassan illustrates the long-term vision of integrating content strategy with commercial objectives, a trend that has only intensified by 2025.

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7. The Evolving Role of the CMO

A significant portion of the conversation focuses on the shifting responsibilities and expectations of Chief Marketing Officers (CMOs). Kassan poses a thought-provoking question he was asked:

"What does the CEO not know about the role of the CMO?" [16:44]

He emphasizes the critical need for CMOs to have both responsibility and authority. Without the necessary levers to drive growth, the effectiveness of a CMO is severely hampered. Kassan shares insights from his experience, including a candid account of Jim Farley's tenure at Ford, illustrating that not all CMOs thrive as CEOs despite their marketing acumen.

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8. Strategic Growth and Future Outlook for 3C Ventures

Kassan provides an update on 3C Ventures, highlighting substantial growth in revenue, client base, and team expansion. He attributes success to a balanced approach combining consulting expertise with operational execution, differentiating 3C Ventures in a competitive marketplace.

Looking ahead, Kassan anticipates significant developments in AdTech M&A, exemplified by Media Ocean's acquisition of Innovid. He foresees these moves as steps towards creating comprehensive end-to-end solutions, catering to the holistic needs of clients.

"The M&A move in Martech and AdTech is going to be able to give publishers and others end-to-end solutions." [21:48]

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9. Vision for Cannes and the Broader Industry Intersection

Kassan discusses his aspirations for the Cannes event, envisioning it as a nexus for marketing, media, advertising, entertainment, sports, gaming, and music. He advocates for expanding the scope of such events to encompass diverse facets of the media landscape, fostering greater convergence and innovation.

"You bring it together. And why not? The fact that it happens to be in a lovely location in the south of France doesn't change the effectiveness of it." [25:48]

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Conclusion

Jenny Rooney wraps up the conversation by acknowledging the breadth of topics covered and expressing eagerness for future discussions. Michael Kassan reiterates his commitment to driving growth and innovation through 3C Ventures, highlighting the continuous evolution and strategic direction that will shape the marketing industry's future.

Notable Quotes

• "Fragmentation, consolidation, and efficiency. If you find me something that's fragmented that I can make more efficient through consolidation, someone's going to make money." — Michael Kassan [01:02]

• "I look at AI as the same thing [as 5G]. It's a technology of yes. The question is, I'm not sure any of us know the right questions to ask yet." — Michael Kassan [03:14]

• "Brandformance because I think the two are coming together. So I think that's a place where the independents have an advantage because they're better suited on performance." — Michael Kassan [14:05]

• "I believe content creation is the driver for commerce. I don't think you see the word commerce any longer, not modified by the word content." — Michael Kassan [15:09]

• "What does the CEO not know about the role of the CMO?" — Michael Kassan [16:44]

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About the Hosts and Guests

• Jenny Rooney: Host of Marketing Vanguard and a prominent figure at Adweek, Jenny Rooney is renowned for her in-depth interviews and strategic insights into the marketing and advertising landscape.

• Michael Kassan: Founder and CEO of 3C Ventures, Kassan is a seasoned marketing leader with decades of experience in driving industry transformation through strategic vision and operational excellence.

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Stay Connected

For more thought-provoking discussions and insights from industry leaders, subscribe to Marketing Vanguard and follow Adweek's podcast network on Adweek.com/podcasts and @AdWeekPodcast on Twitter.

Transcript

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[Michael Kasson]

I learned a long time ago that if you find a way to use the following three words in a sentence in the right way, someone will make money. And those three words are fragmentation, consolidation, and efficiency. If you find me something that's fragmented that I can make more efficient through consolidation, someone's going to make money. And I think the agency business was a bit fragmented, so consolidation will make it more efficient. Therefore, I think there'll be a good roi.

[Jenny Rooney]

Welcome to the Marketing Vanguard Podcast. I'm Jenny Rooney with adweek and I'm thrilled to be here with Michael Kasson. Michael, thank you so much for joining me.

[Michael Kasson]

It's a pleasure, Jenny.

[Jenny Rooney]

It's overdue, but it's great to have you here in this context. I know you've spent a lot of time with Adweek and we're thrilled as always to have you in conversation with us as we move forward. Because I think what we're trying to do in the industry is continue to make sure that we're having the conversations that matter and share them back out with our community.

[Michael Kasson]

You know, it's interesting when you say the conversations that matter when I was chatting earlier today about impact of AI and stuff that I'm sure we'll talk about. It continues to be the drinking game in our industry to get through a sentence without saying AI. If not, you need to have a drink and those that know me know that would be a martini. So I'm glad we're not subject to that during the working hours. But all kidding aside, what I said is I described technology. I used the backdrop of 5G when it was being launched here several years ago. And I had the good pleasure of interviewing John Donovan, then The President and COO of AT&T, when they were in the battle with Verizon about launching 5G. And John said to me then the technology of 5G was the technology of yes. And he said that because everybody would ask him a question. Will 5G impact this? Yes. Will it impact that? Yes. I look at AI as the same thing. It's a technology of yes. The question is, I'm not sure any of us know the right questions to ask yet. That's the challenge. So I know we're going to get there. But you just said conversations and questions about something here. We got to find the right question.

[Jenny Rooney]

Absolutely. And that's such a great point because, you know, I think there's a lot of assumption. I think this community wants to feel like they know everything. And the reality is we don't know everything and it's okay. And I think to your point, there needs to be more environments where people can ask questions. And by the way, the dumb questions, the questions that are like, I don't get this.

[Michael Kasson]

Jenny Fleischmann Hillard, a thousand years ago, launched something called. They weren't used the word youth, but it wasn't used in a pejorative way. It was youth immersion. And it was going to senior executives and corporations and allowing them the space, the safe space to ask the dumb questions. And I remember the example they gave is if you sat around with a group of senior executives, this was in the early aughts, and said something about a blog. And then if you asked the senior executives in the audience if they knew what a blog post was, the answer is probably most of them didn't.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Did not.

[Michael Kasson]

But it's always that I'm embarrassed to ask the question. You need to save space to ask the question.

[Jenny Rooney]

Well, I think it's you. You can enable. This industry is very much about. I know everything. I got it in hand. Like, you know. And by that I mean the marketing, advertising, media industry that, I mean, you have been leading so deeply and so dramatically many, many years.

[Michael Kasson]

Don't say how many years.

[Jenny Rooney]

I'm not going to say how many years. I was going to say. But I.

[Michael Kasson]

Well, I only say that because my wife and I just celebrated our fiftieth wedding anniversary. And I've told people that the only way that's possible is I only got married when I was five.

[Jenny Rooney]

There you go. Yes, exactly. No, it's true. But I mean, I do think having the context, having the history, having lived through everything that's gone before, obviously it's just stating the obvious enables us to understand sort of the where we are now. And I do feel like it's somewhat shaky ground, you know, and there's a lot that people don't know. And so back to your point about asking the right questions, we're going to get into that. I hope I ask the right question.

[Michael Kasson]

I have no doubt you will.

[Jenny Rooney]

And, you know, this can be a dialogue around this. And just for those listening, you know, we are at ces, just talk a little bit about the context of ces. I mean, you've been such a dominant force in the marketer community being at CES and making this a pivotal moment in our broader industry. Why?

[Michael Kasson]

So I'll be a bit tongue in cheek and suggest that whilst I'm not Al Gore, I did not invent the Internet. I will take a bit of credit for creating what is now the C space, but it originated interestingly enough, and it's. It's a little bit of a history lesson. But I've been coming to ces for nearly 40 years, and probably 20 years ago, I saw an opportunity and the opportunity was docent museum like training. If you come here and thinking of the show floor, the actual consumer electronic show.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah.

[Michael Kasson]

If you walked around on your own, you'd look around and go, oh, boy, there's a new big screen. Or boy, there's this new gadget. It was Irwin Gottlieb who used to just bring a group of us around, because Irwin, those of you who know him, know that he is probably one of the smartest people in technology that I've ever met in my life. And we'd walk around the show with Irwin and he'd stop at the booth and he'd give us direction and it made it meaningful. And I said, there's a business there. And we started to create the docent led tours of the CES show floor. Because if you had somebody no different than a museum who can give you background on the artist or whatever it may be, you're going to know more. And so that was the genesis of it. But I then saw an opportunity and 3C ventures, which we've launched last year. The middle C stands for Convene and Convene, to me, isn't just around event, it's around ideas and strategy and what whatnot, convening people. But in this context, I mean it against the backdrop of a live event. And what I saw was an opportunity to get the marketing community to pay attention to this, and I did. And CES then was run by the Consumer Electronics association. And the Consumer Electronics association launched something called Entertainment Matters because they wanted to get the entertainment companies to come to ces. They then came to me and we partnered to create Brand Matters, which was the original C space. And it was a way to get brand marketers to realize that if you cared what you need to about the intersection of marketing, media, advertising, entertainment, sports and technology, where better to do it than here, where you brought together consumer electronics. But even the CEA changed their name to the cta. So ergo, Consumer Technology association, because this is broader than just consumer electronics.

[Jenny Rooney]

Absolutely.

[Michael Kasson]

And that was the beginning of it. And what I'm proud of, I think, most in regards to ces, is it is now a major tent pole in the industry. So the 150,000 people that are converging on Las Vegas every January, I would say today about 15,000 of them are marketers. And that wasn't the case 20 years ago. Marketers didn't come here. You'd have Samsung send their tech people, but they wouldn't send their cmo. That was the flip.

[Jenny Rooney]

That was the flip. So let's talk about this year. You know, what is 3C Ventures doing here at Cesar? And what are some of the biggest Trends, certainly for CMOs, that you want to flag?

[Michael Kasson]

So from a 3cv perspective, we're doing what I've kind of written the book on immodestly, which is utilizing an efficient way to bring ideas, people and thought leaders together. And when you have the efficiency quotient because everyone's here, that makes more sense. So I understood that and understood how to tap into that, number one. So we're still using it as that place where you can bring disparate people, check your weapons at the door, get together in a room and get things done. It's the AdWeek roundtable that you've got going on now as well. So I think that's the opportunity, number one. Number two, the biggest story this year is obviously AI, and it has to be because it's on everybody's tip of their tongue. So that's what everyone is talking about. Where will the impact be felt in the creativity and, you know, all the way through the production and content marketing, ad targeting, everything. Where's AI Going to play that role.

[Jenny Rooney]

Sure.

[Michael Kasson]

Having nothing to do with electronics, having everything to do with technology.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah, absolutely. AI it feels like it's become too much of a buzzword. It's almost like a marketing question. Like, it's almost like we need to figure out how to reframe it to help.

[Michael Kasson]

Well, it's what I said. We have to figure out what the right questions are.

[Jenny Rooney]

Questions and terminology and language. Like, I just feel like there's an opportunity there.

[Michael Kasson]

Yeah, no, no, I think you're right. And look, I marvel at is having experience going through.com 1.0 and what I always felt that I had learned from that is one of the reasons there was an explosion and then an implosion was we were solving problems that didn't need to be solved in some cases. Boy, that's a great idea. But we don't actually need it. You know, the sock puppet was a great idea, but we didn't actually. Just going down that list. Now, I think we're addressing things in an entirely different way because we're actually addressing things that can be made more efficient, better, lower cost. And I'm a believer that at the beginning, it's going to enhance your job. Ultimately, it's going to replace your job. Yeah, I know that sounds like Chicken Little in the sky is falling, but I think there's reality there because if it just does one thing makes your job easier, the moment it makes your job too easy, you may not have a job.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah, well, I mean. And that's frankly a good segue, I suppose, to the next question, which is around. There's been so much happening in the agency world, holding company consolidation, recent merger that we saw, you know, what's your take on sort of the state of the agency world and especially against the backdrop of what you just said.

[Michael Kasson]

Yeah. So, not that I was prescient, but I anticipated as many people did. But I was pretty vocal about it as much as a year or so ago, saying that 12 to 18 months from then, the agency landscape would have a different look to it. Obviously it does.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yes.

[Michael Kasson]

And I think that's just the first of many moves. I'm not here to say which one's next. I didn't know which one was first, but I knew something was happening. And I knew it because it was obvious. But I also knew it because the private equity community was circling the holding companies and I was getting hired frequently to give my opinion of these different holding companies. And as a result of that, that obviously tells you there's interest in the space, both from strategic as well as from private equity. And I still think that's the case. So I think we're going to see more in that regard for sure. And I am a fan of the Omnicom IPG merger. I think it's a good idea and I think it will get done and I think we will see it close. Because I learned a long time ago that if you find a way to use the following three words in a sentence in the right way, someone will make money. And those three words are fragmentation, consolidation, and efficiency. If you find me something that's fragmented that I can make more efficient through consolidation, someone's going to make money.

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[Michael Kasson]

And I think the agency business was a bit fragmented, so consolidation will make it more efficient. Therefore I think there'll be a good roi. So I do believe that applies in this case. Some of these holding companies, God bless them, I was part of them in the 90s. They've gotten too big and yet you're saying, well gee, but if they're merging, they're getting bigger, but I think they'll get more efficient.

[Jenny Rooney]

Opportunity for the independents?

[Michael Kasson]

Yes, always. Every time you have Big Box, every time you have Saks Fifth Avenue merging with Neiman Marcus what happens to the boutique on Rodeo Drive? They probably will do better. So I think that same logic applies in our space. Have the ability to demonstrate agility and flexibility sometimes that the large players can't. And that's important, especially on the performance side, Jenny, because that's where I think you're seeing more of the sprouting of really strong independences and performance marketing. But I think this. I think we've talked about it before. I coined a phrase a couple of years ago called brandformance because I think the two are coming together. So I think that's a place where the independents have an advantage because they're better suited on performance. But the big players are catching up. They have to.

[Jenny Rooney]

What are you paying attention to? Obviously it's, you know, I just had the folks from Advolution up here, by the way. So what do you think about them? For example, what are you looking at right now? What holds interest for you as you think about this new universe in the landscape as it continues to evolve and new entrants come in?

[Michael Kasson]

I'm focusing on content in a meaningful way because I believe content creation is the driver for commerce. I don't think you see the word commerce any longer. Not modified by the word content. And so I'm really identifying 20 some odd years later. You will remember, Jenny, because we've been around.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah.

[Michael Kasson]

When Scott Donaton wrote the book Madison and Vine.

[Jenny Rooney]

Absolutely.

[Michael Kasson]

I take a little bit of a. Scott, my boss.

[Jenny Rooney]

Twice at.

[Michael Kasson]

Exactly. Scott and I did a panel on the marketing forum in 2000, and the panel that I moderated with Scott and four other people on it was called Hollywood Boulevard meets Madison Avenue. And he came up with Madison and Vine.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah.

[Michael Kasson]

And it was brilliant. But it grew out of that panel. And then I did one with Scott at NYU in 2001 called Content and Commerce. So when you think about those two stories, you're thinking about it against the backdrop of 1999, 2000, 2001, and here we are in 2025. And I believe brands are now really ready to understand the power of content and the creation of content and the potential ownership of content because interstitial ads are not going to work the way they did before. Full stop.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yep. There's so much to get through here. I know we don't have all the time in the world, but I just want to talk a little bit about. Because this is the marketing vanguard podcast evolving role of the cmo. I mean, we've seen a lot of continued movement there in the role some companies getting rid of it, some bringing it back. What's your take right now as we sit here?

[Michael Kasson]

So Seth Matlin's asked me a great question in October of 2022, and it really caught my attention and it was provocative and I've used it a lot. So I give Seth credit. He was interviewing me and he said, michael, what does the CEO not know about the role of the cmo? And I thought, that is a great question. And it's been a brilliant thought starter with CEOs, because I'll sit down and I'll say, so what do you think your CMO's job is? What do you mean? I said, well, have you looked at their job description? What's their job title? Is it chief marketing and product? Chief marketing and growth? Chief marketing and comms chief? Mark, you know, what is it? And if it's anything other than just cmo, which I don't think you'll be able to define, which you should be able to if you're a CEO, but if it's as we see more and more growth and CMO together, have you given that person the levers to drive growth if they have the responsibility? Because I always believe one of the greatest causes of ulcers and heart attacks in business is responsibility without authority. So if you look at your CMO and say you're responsible for driving X, Y and Z, does that person have the levers that they need to drive it? And if they don't, then you shouldn't give them the responsibility.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah.

[Michael Kasson]

So I think lining that up is the biggest challenge the CMO has today. Because more often than not, you talk to a CEO and they go, yeah, I don't. My CMO makes pretty pictures and makes sense.

[Jenny Rooney]

Unless you talk to that growing cohort of CEO who came up through the CMO role, which I think I'm numbering maybe 38 right now.

[Michael Kasson]

But I'll tell you one story that surprised me, and you're right about this. And I'm not picking on the man I'm about to because I'm a fan of his. But Jim Farley, when he became CEO of Ford, I thought, boy, this is great. I interviewed Jim Farley here in Las Vegas, the first keynote I ever did when he was the CMO of Ford, so 15 years ago. And I thought, wait, a CEO who was a CMO bodes well.

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah.

[Michael Kasson]

Didn't work out that way. If you speak to the people, God bless Jim. But if you speak to some of the people who worked for him at Ford, and we know many of those in common. He was more disdainful of marketing than you would have guessed. And I. And, and I want to be careful. I don't mean disdainful. But he didn't embrace it the way everyone thought he would. So there are cases where that happens. However, I'm always interested in looking at CEOs job history. You see a lot of people who started in product at Procter and Gamble. It's really surprising. I mean, all the way back. Steve Ballmer, his first job was in product marketing at Procter and Gamble. I mean, there's a list of people.

[Jenny Rooney]

Like that who I get fascinated by, looking at people's history, their educational backgrounds, their previous work experience, the sort of channels that came up through.

[Michael Kasson]

And so I started selling men's clothing when I was a kid. So, I mean, now I buy it, but I used to sell it.

[Jenny Rooney]

That's great. Is that your first job?

[Michael Kasson]

First real job?

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah.

[Michael Kasson]

Other than a paper route?

[Jenny Rooney]

Yeah. Well.

[Michael Kasson]

Well, I did a paper route.

[Jenny Rooney]

I asked Jerry V. A question. I said paper route or lemonade stand? I'll ask that.

[Michael Kasson]

And I bet you that Gary Vee said a lemonade.

[Jenny Rooney]

He did, as a matter of fact. But which would you choose? Paper route or lemonade stand? What's the better first job?

[Michael Kasson]

Oh, lemonade stand. Because you get to handle the money right there.

[Jenny Rooney]

There you go.

[Michael Kasson]

The paper route and throwing the paper.

[Jenny Rooney]

But, well, it's also customer.

[Michael Kasson]

I like resale. Yeah. I like retail.

[Jenny Rooney]

3C ventures. Company updates tell us about new clients, infrastructure, talent.

[Michael Kasson]

Well, we've been fortunate that we've hired about 24, 25 people since I first spoke with the Adweek back in June.

[Jenny Rooney]

Okay.

[Michael Kasson]

And I'm proud to say the team landed here at CES for our first kind of official public display, if you will. And it's been a brilliant couple of days. And so I'm very happy and very proud of the team that we've assembled. Similar to how I've always looked at it, it's not just a team of consultants. It's a team of people who have consulting background. And that's a good thing in some cases, but operational background, and I continue to focus on that as an important differentiator because consultants generally, not across the board, tend to give you high level advice and strategy, but then it's up to you to implement and execute. I've always felt because I'm an operator by trade, it's important to bring consulting. You need the consultative side, but you need the operational side to actually dimensionalize and execute. And so that to me is what we're looking at in terms of the clients. I made it a habit of never broadcasting who our client list is, but it's a pretty robust group of clients, large and small. It's all the main players, you'd guess platforms across the board.

[Jenny Rooney]

Have you realized your goals as you had laid out to us when you did our cover story back in?

[Michael Kasson]

Thankfully we've exceeded it thus far in terms of the revenue goals we set and the client goals and the team. So at this point we're ahead of schedule, which I'm always excited about. But that doesn't give me the ability to relax. I don't have that gene, so I'm motivated.

[Jenny Rooney]

Tell me about the state of AdTech M&A. Which companies in areas are likely to be acquisition targets?

[Michael Kasson]

We're fortunate to work with Media Ocean extensively on their purchase of Innovid. And then right behind that we got to create the structure and partner literally with Media Ocean as Omnicom, WPP and IPG created a consortium to invest because I've always been a believer if you can get your largest or amongst your largest clients as your partners in some way, that's a win. And in this case I think it was a good example of check your weapons at the door because you can't be more competitive. Now it's two of the three, but Omnicom, IPG and wpp. What was funny for me is we were negotiating the consortium of getting them together in the room to the right, they were negotiating Omnicom and ipg. And so it was very funny that I was negotiating with them as to become partners and they're negotiating over here. That was interesting. I think that is a good example because I think the M and A move in Martech and Ad Tech is going to be able to give publishers and others end to end solutions. They're trying to fill in the blank. So if you will, Media Ocean, Innovid gave them an end to end solution as opposed to a point solution. And I think that's what people are looking for.

[Jenny Rooney]

Okay, what can we expect to see from you?

[Michael Kasson]

I think great things. I mean, I know the pacing in terms of what they're looking at because I'm working with them and the new ownership in Forma which bought Cannes closed in October and they're feeling very strong and they should because the momentum is good even now and we start to feel it now. So I feel like can is in a very strong position and I think the exciting part of the Informa purchase is Cans a very successful operation. Already. But with the largest event company in the world, looking at how they're going to grow it, I think we're going to see a lot of interesting iteration. And I think there are areas, and I've been very public about this. It's not a secret. I did make a bid to buy can because I think, you know, I had some ideas around what I thought could be done to take it yet to another level. I'm blamed or attributed with taking what was a festival of creativity and building a conference around it. And I think that's probably a true statement. And those in the creative side of the business would give me a lot of guff about it. In the old days, they say, wait, this is a creativity thing, it's not a conference. And I go, yeah, it is. It's surrounding a festival of creativity. But why wouldn't you. Back to my efficiency point, why wouldn't you bring everything? Bring ad tech and martech and publishers. And so if you look at it and say, what are the areas that could build even better positioning on it goes back to what I said earlier about that intersection. I think there are areas like sports. Although a tribute to Stagwell, I think what they've done with the Stagwell beach over the last two years was brilliant. And I'm bummed that I didn't come up with that idea. So I give real credit to Mark Penn and the Stagwell team for that. But sports could be even built out more because it's such a critical part of the overall media mix. Gaming, hardly a moment where gaming is relevant in can, and I think it should be because it's an important part of the industry. Music. And I don't look at music as having concerts. I look at the business of music. Meetham, which was the music conference that went on forever, has lost its steam. I don't even know if it exists anymore. So the business of music could have a role at Cannes. And then entertainment. What I was successful in doing was bringing the entertainment companies to Cannes, except I brought the ad sales side. I'm talking about the entertainment side. And I think we're going to see that now more and more. The creator economy, the entertainment considerations, sports, gaming and music, those are areas that I think can and should expand into. So I think there's a void. And if you go back to what I said about ces, it applies even more to can, which is that intersection of marketing, media, advertising and advertising opportunities.

[Jenny Rooney]

Convergence, opportunity.

[Michael Kasson]

You bring it together. And why not? The fact that it happens to be in a lovely location in the south of France doesn't change the effectiveness of it.

[Jenny Rooney]

Totally. Last quick question. Bullet it out for me. You and I sit here a year from now. What do you want to have happen for 3C?

[Michael Kasson]

Oh gosh, I said this when you asked me or when? When I was asked that question in June in Cannes. So what do you hope happens in Cannes for next year? I said, well, I hope I'm not the main story. But in this case I'm going to say I hope we're the main story. Yeah, that the growth of C3C and you know, how we approach the tentpole events, I think that would be a good result for me, selfishly, next year. But I think a continuation of more of the same and realizing the opportunity to bring good things to life. I know that was somebody other than.

[Jenny Rooney]

Me, somebody other than GE came up with that. But that's okay.

[Michael Kasson]

It's okay. BBDO I think probably for ge.

[Jenny Rooney]

Probably, yeah. As a matter of fact, I remember the jingle. Michael, thank you so much. This was a pleasure. We only scratched the surface on so many things, but let's talk again soon. I would love that.

[Michael Kasson]

I would love that as well, Jenny. And thank you very much.

[Jenny Rooney]

Thanks.

[Michael Kasson]

Thank you for listening to Marketing Vanguard, part of the Ad Week Podcast Network and Acast Creator Network. You can listen and subscribe to all.

[Jenny Rooney]

Of Adweek's podcasts by visiting Adweek.com podcasts.

[Michael Kasson]

Stay updated on all things Adweek Podcast.

[Jenny Rooney]

Network by following us on Twitter @AdWeekpodcast.

[Michael Kasson]

And if you have a question or suggestion for the show, send us an.

[Jenny Rooney]

[e-mail] thanks for listening.

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