B (5:01)

This is going great. Thanks for having me on. I love, love what you're doing and supporting the real estate community, so I'm happy to be a part of it.

A (5:09)

Thanks, man. I appreciate that. I mean, I remember, oh, this was, this was a while ago. This is probably like eight, nine, maybe 10 years ago. I went to a CE class that you were doing. I think it was at the Salt Lake Board of Realtors. But that was the first time that I, that I came across you and I remembered your name. Right. Kit Bait. What a great name. If you're going to be.

B (5:28)

I had to change it when I started working in mortgages, so I won't tell you my previous name.

A (5:33)

Okay, so you did the Hollywood thing. I see. Smart. But, yeah, I've respected you for a long time. And when we got talking the other day, one of your zones of genius is that you do a ton of training for agents all around about generating referrals. So what are you teaching agents on how they can 10x their referrals?

B (5:57)

Yeah, it's not a lot of rocket science. It's just fundamentals and systems that are overlooked that nobody really has. And everyone says we want referrals and they tell people we want referrals, but nobody really does anything beyond that. So I teach systems for how to identify who those people are that you should be asking for referrals and then a lot of systems and scripts in particular towards during the transaction because we all have clients that we're talking to on a regular basis and then we typically wait until after the closing before we ask for referrals. Meanwhile, we spent six months, 12 months since we started talking to this person when we know they've been talking to other people about what they're doing and have those opportunities potentially to refer us. And so how to really train those clients on recognizing those opportunities because they're not always thinking about referring us, even though we're thinking about getting referrals all the time. We don't Realize people that we're talking to aren't doing our job. They're not marketing for us. They don't know to do that. And so scripts and systems and. And how to. How to teach around that is really, really the focus of those classes, of those referral generation classes.

A (7:12)

Okay, say more because this is. This is great. I. You're absolutely right. Most agents wait until the end. Or, you know, ideally, if they're waiting till the end, like at the closing table, is when they ask for referrals, when. When the clients are the happiest, right? Usually. Usually. But you're saying that there's this. The entire time you're working with the client is a wasted opportunity, right?

B (7:36)

Exactly. Yep. Yeah. During the process, that's when we're. When we're showing our value. That's when people are commenting and saying, oh, my gosh, you're amazing. I love this. This has been so great. We're just like, oh, thanks. Yeah, you've been awesome, too. And we move on. And we don't, like, we don't realize where those opportunities sometimes lie during the transaction. And so like you said at the closing table or when we're walking out to the parking lot and we're like, congratulations. So excited for you. If you know anybody else, like, this is hard close. I love it because we're all like, these massive closers. And our close on referrals is. If you talk to anybody else I can help, let me know. It's like, wow. Yeah, like, amazing. Like, we're gonna get tons of referrals now. And then we get all butthurt when we find out that they didn't refer somebody, that they could have referred us. And like, oh, I totally forgot about to mention that to you. Or, yeah, I gave them your number and I'm surprised they didn't call you. And we haven't really taught them what a referral looks like, what to do when they get a referral and really train them and remind them to be referring us. Because they're not thinking about it, especially during the transaction. They're busy thinking about everything else. They've got the logistics of what school district their kids are going to be in, how they're going to get stuff moved and their drive from work and commute times and things like that. So there's a lot of distractions from, oh, I just had a conversation and I should. With somebody that I can refer to Kit. And so I should let Kit know they're not thinking about that all the time. And so we Think that the one time that we mentioned, hey, if you talk to anybody during the transaction, if we're good, and we mentioned that in the beginning, we think that that's enough. And we're like, we don't want to bother them, we don't want to remind them because that'll sound super annoying. It'll sound unappreciative that we're not grateful for their business when really they're not thinking about it. And a lot of times it's just that realization of they don't think like us, we think we're being annoying, they're just not thinking about it at all. And so a lot of what I coach to is in the beginning, set the expectation. When you meet with a client and you go through your presentation, hopefully you've got a dialed in buyer packet or listing packet that you go through all the details of, here's how the transaction looks. And then during that, I let them know, here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to update you during the transaction, I'll update you. It could be whatever day you want. I'll update you. Every single Tuesday you're going to get an update from me so you know where everything is at. And during that update, I'll also remind you that I love referrals and see if you've talked to anybody during the week. Is that okay with you? So then you set the expectation and you give yourself permission to ask for referrals multiple times through the transaction. I like that. Yeah. And then it just tees it up. So it's super easy to go from there.

A (10:28)

Don't you think? It makes it so much easier rather than like if you don't let them know that you're going to be doing it, it could be a little cringy, it could be a little awkward or unnatural. Right. But you're letting them know, hey, I'm going to be doing this. So when they, when you do it, it's not a surprise. They're not, they're not caught off guard by it. So I really, I really like, I really like that aspect of it. So you know, what should agents be like, dive deeper. Like what should they be saying right after you let the client know that you're going to do that on a regular basis? How should you do that? You know, once every Tuesday comes, for example.

B (11:04)

Yeah. So what I do is in the beginning, you've got to set that expectation with them and let them know that they will be talking to people that they can refer to you, like the reticular activating system, right? Like when you buy a car. And this is, and I explained the car scenario to them, like, hey, when was the last time you bought a car? Oh, we bought a car two years ago. What happened when you drove off the lot and you thought you had this like super unique car that nobody else has? What happens as soon as you like pull off the car lot, all of a sudden all you see is the same exact car that you didn't realize before. And it's that reticular activating system part of the brain that recognizes those things. And so I say just like that, when you bought the car, now that we're in process of getting you into a new home or selling your home, you're going to start noticing all those conversations with people that they're that are also thinking about buying or selling a home. Those are people that I want to talk to, even if it's just game planning. So then you teach them what a referral looks like. It's those conversations. It's someone that's just game planning. Because a lot of times we teach and reward people that referrals are people that are ready to buy a house or ready to sell a house. And they've already gone through that whole education phase and they've talked to people and now they're ready, so now we can refer them over. But now they've also talked to the other five real estate agents that they know. And now you're competing and discounting and now your value shifts away from what you know your value truly is to a dollar sign. And when you can teach them in the beginning and say, hey, just let me know who you talk to and I can educate them even if they're a year out, two years out, whatever it's going to take, let me know. Those are great referrals for me. So now you're teaching what a referral looks like, then also teaching them. When you have those conversations, what I would love for you to do is send a group text intro. If you can just say, hey, Kit, meet Dustin. Dustin, meet Kit. He's going to take care of you for all your, all your lending needs and mortgage questions. He'll set up a time to do a consultation, answer any questions for free for you. If you'll just do that, that would be great. Because what happens a lot of times is I gave your number out to somebody. Did they reach you? No, I didn't hear from them. And then you never hear from them. And it's just like, it's not a strong referral. So we've got to teach what a referral looks like and how to refer, what to do once they have that conversation. So they're having that conversation at a barbecue and they say, oh, yeah, I've got a great lender. You should reach out to him. Here's his number versus, oh, I've got a great lender. Is it cool if I shoot you a quick group intro, group text? And they say, yeah, go for it. Send the text. Now I've got the contact information. I can be the one following up, building the pipeline up, and I can be the one in control of really converting that lead versus letting the clients be the one in control of converting the lead. And a lot of times, you know, we give, we give thank you cards or gift cards or whatever after we close, which is teaching them look for people that are ready to close. Right? Not just look for people that are mentioning real estate. That I can help.

A (14:12)

There's so much I love about, about this approach. So as you were talking, I'm thinking, like, you're right. If a buyer, for example, they're starting the process they, you know, they're working on, even if they're in like the credit repair stage, like, they're not even ready to buy, but they're working on it, they're planning. Once they really start that process, they're probably going to have conversations with friends and family like, hey, we're doing this, right? Because you're going to share like, hey, we're moving. You know, we're going to be upgrading, whatever, right? And so they have conversations and there's other people that'll be like, oh, we've thought about that too. And if they're not trained, like, I love that word that you used. If they're not trained to look for that, they're just like, oh, cool. Like, cool, you're going to do it too. Awesome. And they don't realize that there's a chance for them to help their friend.

B (15:03)

Right?

A (15:03)

Because what they're doing, it's not just giving you a referral. It's they are able to help their friend, give their friend a lifeline. Give their friend, you know, some resources to help them speed up their process, make it easier, right? Make it less confusing and stressful. So they, you're giving them a chance to be the, to be the hero for one of their people. And you have to train them to do that. And the next thing that I loved is how you clearly explain how to give a referral because if, if there's uncertainty around that, if they don't know what that looks like, they could make it a lot more complicated than it needs to be. And then it just never happens. So I love the group.

B (15:45)

Or so simple. Or so simple that they just say, hey, yeah, I'll send you his info. And then they never reach out because in the meantime, they've also talked to like five other loan officers or real estate agents. And now you're just, you know, another number, right?

A (15:57)

Not to mention, like, even if they do give you their friend's information and you call that friend, that's still a little bit weird. It's still a little bit awkward that you are reaching out without being introduced. Even if they tee them up properly. Like there's. There's a whole new level of. It works so much better, a whole new level of effectiveness when they, your client does a group text and says, hey, Johnny, meet kit. And now it's not weird, it's not awkward. It's just like it's a normal introduction and they're much less likely to throw up red flags or to, you know, to feel awkward. So I love this. Right? Keep going. Say more like, yeah.

B (16:37)

So the other thing to recognize too, and teaching them and feeling like it's okay to teach them how to refer is realizing that most people don't work on commissions. Most people aren't looking, aren't business owners. They're not looking for more business continually like we are. Most of most people we talk to are set salary, set hourly income. So all that, what their brain is programmed for is to punch a clock. Clock in, clock out. They get paid same amount every single time, every single week, and they don't have to find those opportunities. And so realizing that I think is super important so that when we think we're being annoying by asking or reminding or teaching them what referrals look like, this is all new information to them. They don't know how to do that. They don't know what that typically looks like. All that they know is maybe like, if someone says, throws up on like Facebook ISO in search of whatever, and they're like, oh, this person tag. And that's it. And that's all that they really ever get to sometimes. And so I think realizing that is an important thing to know that they are not thinking like us all the time, so you're not being rude or offensive by reminding them. So to alleviate that and help us feel okay with it because we get into real estate business because we're good with people, because people like us, they love us. We get our license and then the phone doesn't ring and someone tells us, hey, you should get work your database. Okay, I'll work my database. Dustin, it's Kit. Hey, you got any referrals for me? I'm in lending. Can you hook me up? You got anybody that's thinking about refinancing or buying a home and you're like, oh, sweet. That's good to know, dude. Like, yeah, I'll definitely keep it in mind. Cool. Next month. Hey, anybody you talk to, Dustin? Anybody you know, like, oh, no, dude. Like, thanks for calling. I still got you in the top of my mind. Okay, thanks. Appreciate it. Third month. Ring, ring, ring, ring, ring, ring. Voicemail. And that's how it goes. Because all you've done is ask for referrals and that's it. You haven't, like, added any value. You haven't taught them anything. And so educating them, setting the expectation of, hey, here's what's going to happen. Like, is it cool, Dustin, if I check in with you maybe like once a month? I know you're not always thinking about it and so is it cool if I just check in once a month and see if you've talked to anybody or if you're in process, you're in contract? Is it cool, like, when I update you with everything that's going on? Is it cool if I just also see if you've had any conversations during that prior week with anybody that I should be in contact with? You give yourself permission to do that, then it's not an annoying conversation.

A (19:19)

Right?

B (19:20)

Then the trick also becomes adding value. So once you've got the mindset of like, okay, I know what to. I know how to set the expectation. I know how to, how to ask, how to train them and teach them what a referral looks like? Adding value makes it so easy to ask for a referral. Because what happens a lot of times in any sales industry is we just ask and we become annoying and a nuisance. And we haven't really done anything to earn that referral. And so we've got to add value and focus on what is the value and simplify that. Because a lot of times we think the value is closing. Let's get to closing. That's our value. Now we have permission to ask. But during the process, we've been teaching them everything that they need to know. We've been holding their hand, we've been doing things that no one else has done. They've talked to other Realtors before, they've talked to other lenders before, and they've complimented us on what we do different. Like, oh, yeah, this didn't get explained to me last time. Oh, my other person didn't do this. Those are all compliments that are suggesting to you, if you're aware of it. I recognize your value. I recognize why you're different. And when you've. When you can see that and you know that you've given value, that's your cue to ask for a referral. And it's easy. It's an easy segue into asking for a referral when you get those compliments. Compliment equals ask.

A (20:51)

And in that situation, so you have. You have a buyer you're working with, and they're like, you know what? You've made this so much easier. You communicate so much better than who we worked with before. And then they just, you know, you go about the rest of your day. What should an agent say in that particular situation? You know, when it's brought up and you have that window, so to speak, to ask for a referral? Like, what's some of the scripting you'd use around that?

B (21:17)

So when you get a compliment, highlight that. It's not normal. It kind of sounds like egotistical, but in a situation of, oh, my gosh, you guys are so good at communicating. Oh, thank you for the feedback. So give some. Some thanks. I noticed early in my career that most Realtors don't communicate well. That's a common complaint. And so I try and focus with me, with my team on great communication, because not only do I want you to be happy, but I want you to feel comfortable referring anybody else to me. Do you know anybody right now that I should be talking to? I know I talked. I asked you last week, but have you talked to anybody else this last week that I should be in touch with or that maybe is having a bad experience right now or just trying to get the ball rolling on things? And so when you get those compliments, you can compliment them back, even. That's another script with that. Oh, you guys are so awesome. Oh, you're awesome, too. Like, you're our ideal avatar of a client. Like, if I could create all my clients, I would create one just like you. Do you know anybody else that's just like you, that's also thinking about game planning for buying or selling a home, and you start to get used to saying those things routinely, and it just becomes natural, and it's not this awkward, like, clunky conversation of like, oh, yeah. So have you talked to anybody else that I could be helping out? It's just like this natural flow of, like, go find a compliment, identify where you've added value, highlight that you've added value. You've got permission to ask if you can do that. That's really the thing that makes it difficult to ask for, to get referrals, is you haven't added value or you don't recognize that you have added value. So you feel like you're just asking and you feel annoying and then. So you don't. And that's why a lot of times people like making cold calls, because it's hard to call your database over and over if you're not adding value in their life. And it doesn't have to be professional value. It could be personal value. Oh, yeah. So sorry, Kit. Like, I know, I know I've been hard to get ahold of. We just, you know, we were dealing with some family stuff. Oh, what's the family stuff? Oh, well, it's kind of sad. We, you know, my sister, she was sick. It was kind of expected, but not. And she passed. And so the value could be, oh, I'm going to send a gift. I'm going to send some flowers, I'm going to send some treats or something to say, hey, so sorry to hear about your loss. And then they're like, oh, my gosh, my lender just, like, did something super cool for me. And when you've done that, then people love you and you've added value into their life and they call you up, oh, my gosh, that was so awesome. Thank you so much. Like, I told my whole family about you because we just barely met and you did something super awesome. And so now you're starting to build that rapport. And so it makes it fun to do business that way when you're just doing cool stuff, adding value. And a lot of times when. When people just ask and they feel super annoying, they. They don't do a good job of adding their value or explaining their value of. There's a difference between what your value is and what your perceived value is. And knowing that sometimes when you have a system in a process and it's really good and someone's buying their first home or selling a home for the first time, they might think everybody does it that way and they don't know it. And so you've got to. You've got to help them perceive what your value actually is. If they don't know and they're like, oh, okay, cool. Yeah, I do this because most realtors don't. This is the common complaint in the industry. So this is why I do it this way and help them know that. That they are in good hands with you, not with just anybody.

A (25:12)

Yeah, well said. Well said. And there's something that I think is worth mentioning here that you alluded to earlier, but I want to make sure we call this out like your. Your buyers and sellers, they're not in this industry. They likely don't work for commission. So they may think, like, not everyone knows that you want a referral. Not everyone knows that you want more clients to work with, right? Because at their job, they may have the mentality that, like, they don't want more work to do. Right? Like, why would they. Why would they want extra work? So you have to let them know that you do want more people to work with. It's so foundational, it's so basic, but we skip that often. We just assume people know that we do want more buyers and sellers to work with, and they may. They may think, why would. Why would you want that? Because they're coming from that W2 employee, I don't want a bunch more work on my plate type of mentality to. You got to help them understand. So, Kit, this is amazing. So, okay, we've talked a lot about, like, your. Your current clients. You know how to have the conversations with your current clients during the process. How, how then would you. How does it differ? How would you approach your database, your sphere of influence? Right? When. When you were just prospecting, you're doing your, you know, your coach told you you gotta do two hours a day of prospecting, so you're doing that. How does the conversation change when you're reaching out to a high school friend that you haven't seen in 15 years?

B (26:36)

I think kind of, it's, It's. It's very similar as far as adding value, but it shifts away. It shifts more away from the professional value that you're trying to identify to a personal value. And so when you're calling to check in on them, you've got to think ahead of just calling and winging it. Because this is something I'm super guilty of initially in my career was just like calling people. Like, I'd spend like, 15, 20 minutes catching up and talking to them, hoping that they would say, oh, what are you up to? I'd be like, oh, actually, I just got into the mortgage business. Like, do you know anybody I could help? And a lot of times those conversations don't get There. And they're like, oh my gosh, that's so cool that you're reaching out to me. And you're like, oh, yeah. And you kind of feel like an idiot where you're like, yeah, it's kind of for business, but maybe I'll just let it come up in conversation goes 20 minutes. And they're like, well, thanks so much for calling. I gotta grab this other call. And you're like, okay, bye. And you haven't mentioned anything. And so.

A (27:29)

Or you try to squeeze it in, which is even worse.

B (27:31)

Yeah, you force it. And then it feels like the MLM guy that you're just trying to make a buck on everybody and anybody. And you're just like. And you're not being sincere. Right. Like, we're all hustling. And if you can do it where you're being sincere, you're adding value and trying to build a real relationship with somebody, then they want to help you back. And they'll ask you. They'll be the ones that say, is there anything I can do for you? Like, oh, dude, no. You're like, I appreciate you even asking. If you talk to anybody that's thinking about buying or selling real estate, let me know, do you know anybody right now. And it can ease into those conversations. So a lot of times those conversations with your database, event invitations. So if it's like a client appreciation thing, if it's a class that you're teaching and inviting them or telling them, hey, you can use this to help somebody else identifying ahead of time what it is you're going to call them about. A lot of times it's a birthday call or a home anniversary call, or maybe it's a wedding anniversary call. Identify and know about those personal things. So you've got that value, that emotional value that you can give to them. And they're. And when they know you and they're in your database, they're gonna ask you naturally just be, hey, how's work going? Or, you know, what's. What can I do to help you? Those conversations will. Will come up. But identifying what you can do to help them on a personal level, you know, and recognizing things, you know, use social media because that's the highlight reel. The big things that are going on people's lives, like call them up to congratulate them on things on a, you know, if they graduated med school or they got married or congratulate them if they got divorced or whatever it is that they're going through in life. And they like that stuff and when you do that and you make somebody feel good, they want to help you as well. And you got to do that with. You can't do that with everybody, right? You can't be in a relationship with everybody. So you've got to identify and hone in on the top people in your database. Some people have a 5,000, 10,000 people database. You're not going to have those kind of conversations. So you've got a top grade and identify like the top 50 top 50 clients, the top 50 VIPs, the top 50, like business owners, people that you're already referring business out to. Identify a group of, you know, 100 to 200 people that you can have those conversations with on a monthly basis.

A (29:58)

There's something that just clicked for me finally, like as you were describing, reaching out, adding value. So, and maybe you've heard of this before, maybe, maybe this is new, but I just connected dots on something that I think would be really powerful. So my good friend Shannon Milligan, she's in Richmond, Virginia. She's been my sponsor at both of the companies we've been at. And she does this vip, like, MVP program for her clients. And so I think she had a storage shed that has a trailer and tools and like a power washer, ladders, like, stuff like that. And she's like, hey, you know, if you're, if you're part of my MVP program, you can just like go borrow this stuff whenever you need to. And I know a lot of agents have something like that where you can borrow a van, a moving van, a moving truck, something like that. But if you have, if you're doing that for your clients already, like, what a, what a way to add value to your entire database to say, hey, look, I'm putting together this program that anyone that we, you know, anyone that works with us can rent tools, borrow a trailer, borrow a pressure washer, whatever, and say, And I thought of you, like, do you need any of that stuff right now? Are you, do you have any need for a pressure washer? Because if you do, just let me know. And what you're doing is you're planting the seed that that's what you do for your clients. And you're also offering them value because they may be like, holy crap. Yeah, it's almost winter. I just, I want to power wash my house before winter starts or something. And they're like, yes, please. And that's a great way to get in the door. So, like, those two things finally clicked for me as you were talking.

B (31:28)

Love it. Yeah, yeah. It's just finding ways, like, add value. What is it that adds value? And even a lot of times people will ask me in these classes, you know, what about, how do I make the initial conversation? How do I make the initial call? Like, what do I say? It's been five, six years since I talked to my buddy from high school, and a lot of times we overcomplicate it. And if we've got like a VIP list and we're like, this guy from high school, he is a networker. I see him posting all the time. Like, he's super inspiring. Like, I would love to be in his database. And so just make the call and tell him that, like, that can be the initial call. Like, hey, dude, like, I'm ramping things up at work and I'm putting together a VIP list. You were one of the first people that came to my mind. I love what you do. Like, even though we haven't talked in a long time, you're super inspiring and motivating because I see, you know, I see your presence on social. And so I want to be more around you. I want to be more involved with you. Is it cool if I have you on my VIP list? And, like, instantly, like, they start to feel good. They're like, oh, what's that? Oh, it's just a name on a spreadsheet. But really it's giving that praise to them. It gives them some emotional satisfaction, which is the value add, and then gives you that opportunity to dive into a relationship with them and be like, hey, is it cool? As one of my VIPs, I want to make sure that I take care of you and do cool things. So I'm going to invite you to events that I do, even if you can't make it. Like, just know, like, I'd love for you to come. I do the. I have a tool truck or whatever. If you ever need anything. I've got, you know, a handyman that I have. Go help out people, whatever you need, anything like that. Those. It's for my VIPs, so just hit me up, let me know if I can be doing anything for you. And that can be the initial conversation. And then there's. You can ask those questions as a vip, like, is it cool? I can. Will you let me know? Like, when's your birthday? What's your favorite drink? Like, what do you. What's your favorite favorite candy bar? Or, like, things like that that you can dive into to start to gather a lot of personal information, throw it into your CRM system. So that, that way you can start to be more personalized as your, as your relationship moves forward. Do fun things for them. Buy, buy personalized treats. You don't have to spend a ton of money on people to be super impactful. You just gotta know them, be in a real relationship.

A (33:45)

That, that's fantastic. And something that I, that I picked up, that I'm reading between the lines here. It sounds like you're saying you don't need a giant database to get a ton of referrals.

B (33:55)

Right?

A (33:55)

And I don't. You talk to a lot of agents that, that's a huge objection in their mind. It's a big limiting belief that they're like, my database isn't that big. Like I can't really get referrals. What do you say to that?

B (34:05)

Yeah, so that's. You don't want a big database because you want to be in deep relationships. That's what you want. If you could have, for example, 150 people, if you had a real relationship, you can make 150 calls a month. Right? Like that's, that's not a, not a big deal, big task to take on 150 calls to these people, have real conversations. And if they were tight relationships, like say it was, you know, you think about like your siblings or your parents or your best friend or people that you're already referring business to and you're talking to people and you're in real relationships on a regular basis. 150 people once a month having a conversation. If you got one referral from those type of people every single year, what's your conversion ratio on those kind of referrals? Like you're 50% plus. What's 50%? 150. That's 75, 75 deals a year. That's a good business. And so it does. Sometimes it's overthinking things like, oh, well, I need to reach wide and have 5,000 people and maybe 100. I don't know who's going to refer out of those. You can still do those things. You can still do the drip campaigns and blast stuff out, but be in real relationships with 150 people. Get one referral from them every year and you'll close a ton of business just with those people. But you've got to be in a real relationship and adding real value to them. You can't just be annoying and nagging and always asking for, for business only.

A (35:39)

Right? Right. So I'm looking for this note. So when I was at the Real Rise event, a Couple weeks ago, one of my agents told me that she uses this gift giving automation service that she swears by. She loves it. So what do you, what are your thoughts on, like, the automated gifting platforms? You know that there's a bunch of them where, you know, you can say, here's my budget, send these things to these people. Sometimes they can even choose the gift they want. Like, what are your thoughts on those?

B (36:07)

I love them. It's a system. I love systems. Right. And automation.

A (36:10)

Yeah.

B (36:11)

If you can go personal with somebody and have it more automated so that it happens more frequently, I think that's great. Sometimes there's the opportunity as well to, to do things, do gifts that are more simplified and personally delivered. Like if you've got to get face to face with people and build these real relationships, I think that that is also a missed opportunity. I think the automation side is good to have and that helps you reach more people on a deeper level, on a wider level, on a wider scale. But I also think it's important to identify who are the, like, the top, top people in your database. And if they're your top people, you've got somebody sending you two deals a year or a deal a year. Like, that's worth a lot of money and time. And so if you. On their birthday, for example, this is something I teach with database stuff. These are important people. You show up with their favorite drink, their favorite soda or energy drink or whatever, and their favorite candy bar. So you might spend five bucks and a birthday card with the helium balloon. Maybe you're up to seven, eight bucks now. And you show up at their office and say, hey, happy birthday. Wanted to wish you a great birthday. Hope you got some fun plans today. They're like, oh, my gosh, that's so nice of you. Nobody's come by to drop me off anything at my office on my birthday in like years. And so now you're actually doing something that adds value to them. And you're also showing the rest of their database that's at their office that you're a rockstar real estate agent. And they're like, oh my gosh, who was that that just brought you this? Brought you a treat. And oh yeah, this is my exact favorite, my favorite drink and my favorite candy bar. They're like, oh, my goodness, who is that? That's my real estate agent. They're like, what real estate agent? Like, I haven't heard from my real estate agent since we closed on our house. Like, I need, I need, I need that guy's Information right now, because I'm actually thinking about it. And so you start to do things that become fun and meaningful and impactful for people and you get business from that. And that becomes your whole model where you just work off of referrals and make people feel good.

A (38:20)

So in that situation where you do like where you stop by their office, you stop by their house and like give them a birthday gift, are you asking for a referral at that moment?

B (38:29)

Absolutely not. No. On those personal days, on the, you know, if it's, if it's an anniversary or a birthday or something, you don't have to say anything. Do something cool for them and they're gonna, they're gonna say something to you. Oh, hey, by the way, I actually talked to somebody recently. They'll bring it up. But yeah, leave it, leave it at the. When it's personal, stay personal when it's business. And you can like, and have a rotation of like what you're going for. Like one of the scripts for when you're making those calls, you can just dive into. If you got somebody that's super chatty and you know it's going to be like a 30 minute personal conversation. If you don't control it and reign it in, you just dive into it. Say, Dustin, it's Kit. Hey, I'm just making a business call. Is now a good time? Oh, what's up? Hey, I wanted to follow up with you. I know I talked to you last month and you said that you might have somebody at work that was thinking about selling a home. Have you had any more follow up with them? Is that someone that I can reach out to at this point? You know, and you can dive in and you just tee it up. Is now a good time? I'm making a business call. Is now a good time? And then if you want to spend time after that talking personal, then you can. And it's just flipping the script because a lot of times we do the opposite where it's like personal, personal, personal. I hope it gets to business. Hope it gets to business. I'm going to force business in now. And nobody doesn't make us feel good doing that. So we, then we stop prospecting and asking for referrals. But if we just say, hey, it's a business call, it's now a good time. Yeah, what's up? This is what I'm calling about. Hey, by the way, how's your family doing? I saw that you were on a vacation. I saw you went up to Park City and we're hanging Out. That's super cool. Like, you have a good time. Where did you stay? You can have those personal conversations, but don't, don't undermine the personal conversation with business lead in. With business some of the time.

A (40:03)

I'm glad to hear you say that. I mean, agents ruin it so often by asking for referrals or making it about business at the wrong time. Like, if you're going to give somebody a nice gift, just freaking give them the gift and let that be it. Like, you ruin it and you spoil it. If you're like, oh, and by the way, like, do you have any referrals for me today? They're like, okay, now I see why you dropped this gift off. Right? Totally ruin it. So I'm glad to hear you say that.

B (40:30)

And if you're consistent, right, like, if you're consistent with these things, they're going to know you want business. So you don't have to say anything. And that's where the relationship side comes in, is, is they know. They know what you do for work. They know what you know, how you get business. And so then you do those personal things and you show that you're sincerely interested in helping them and making them feel good on a special occasion, then, yeah, they'll know.

A (40:57)

I know that there's some people listening that are like, oh, that sounds great, but I just don't want to overdo it. I don't want to be that agent that does it too much and becomes cringe. And then they don't answer my calls. So how do you define overdoing it with asking for referrals?

B (41:13)

Yeah, start off by kind of categorizing and labeling some. You can do like an ABC ranking of your database. Like A's. Like, you can totally overdo it. They love you, they're amazing, they support you, and you're in a tight relationship with them. Bs are kind of the ones that maybe occasionally you're talking to or seeing. And then Cs are ones that maybe you don't ever talk to or see, but you're trying to, trying to get a relationship with. So you've got to identify where they're at and what's appropriate and what's not. And so, you know, you get into somebody that's in a deep, you're in a deep relationship with them. They sent you two, three referrals that closed during the year. You can go, you know, buy them, buy them tickets to their, you know, they're an NBA game or whatever that, you know, that they love. And do something special for them. It's not going to be awkward versus if you did that and just were like, hey, I want to be in a relationship with you. Here's tickets to the NBA game. And they're like, oh, that's a little forward, but okay. And maybe that's your thing. But identifying where you're at in the relationship, like as a birthday gift appropriate, or is maybe a birthday message appropriate? Where you send a text message that's personalized or you record a video of yourself wishing them a happy birthday, telling them why they're. Why they're inspiring to you and kind of just like, you've got to ease into it, use some common sense and just those people skills that you have that drew you into a sales industry. And yeah. Just don't have systems within the system.

A (42:46)

Great point. I mean, yeah, I'm thinking of this, like, if there are certain people that came and stopped by my house with a gift, I'd be like, thanks, I appreciate it. But it'd be. It'd be weird, right? It'd be like, it would just be an unnatural thing. Like it doesn't fit the relationship that we have. So I like your idea of categorizing, you know, so that you don't overstep and you don't make it weird and overdo it and like, you know, give. Give NBA tickets to someone that you know you met once five years ago.

B (43:17)

Right.

A (43:18)

You know, that could be weird. Yeah.

B (43:20)

So it's got to be. Got to be recognized. Use that common sense and how you go about it and build. Ultimately you want to get to that where you've got a database of 150 people that you can do that with. But it takes some time to grow it to that level with everybody. But initially it's not going to be everyone.

A (43:41)

So the last. What I want to wrap this up with, and I think this is perfect. How would you recommend people start building that database? How should they start building that list if they're brand new to the industry or they've never really focused on referrals or they've just done it the wrong way? How should they start building their list in their database to do what you're describing?

B (44:00)

Love it. So I focus heavy on three lists that I mentioned earlier. VIPs, past clients. Obviously, if you don't have a list of past clients, then that list is really easy. If you had one or two, then those people are on it. But then business owners, people that you need to refer business to so that you can be Valuable, more helpful to your clients. You've got to know people. You've got to know. You've got to have a stager, a roofer, a plumber, a floor person, maybe a cpa, maybe a divorce attorney, and all these people that are involved to some degree when a real estate transaction can happen. And so for that list, that list becomes really easy to build. Just put together a category. You could make a list of categories of people you need to know and then put down people. You can start filling in the blanks of people you already know in those industries, and then you can just start talking to people. Or throw up a thing on social media that says, hey, I need a good recommendation for these types of people. And you'll start to get some recommendations. And then you just top grade, constantly top grading, like identifying, like, who would be the best divorce attorney that I could refer people to. Who would be the best CPA that also has a big business? Because if it's just a side hustle thing, like, that's nice, but you want to be in relationships with great people. But then you can also start reaching out to these people when you're telling them, hey, I've got you on my list to refer to. Who's your go to person for somebody that needs real estate needs or has real estate needs. And then you can kind of. That's the script you use with business owners. They say, oh, well, yeah, dude, you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours. Okay, cool. Here's what I'm going to do. I've got you on my list of preferred people. I'm going to refer everybody that needs flooring over to you when people talk real estate to you. Keep me in mind. I'll hit you up. I'll call you once a month, let you know who I've sent over your way and see if you've talked to anybody else that I can be helping. So that's. Owners. VIPs are easy to identify. Just go through. You can go through your contacts in your phone, go through your social media friends and start to identify who it is. Like, who are those family members, who are the big networkers, the movers, shakers, people that are in the community, religious leaders, people that have a big exposure to people's circumstances, that are going to have conversations eventually that say, hey, we're actually thinking about moving and those are the people that you want to be in relationships with. So I think starting with those lists, starting with like five people, just put five people. Don't try and get like 50 people on each list right away. Start with five, gets the wheels turning, starts helping you identify who it is that should be on those lists. And eventually you build it up to 50 and then you start top grading it so you get a Great take top 50 of each of those instead of having just people that you forced onto the list.

A (46:48)

Oh, that's good, dude. This was gold today. Kit, I really appreciate it. For anyone who wants to connect with you if they're local, if they want to attend some of your trainings that you do, you know, where can people find you?

B (47:01)

Yeah, if you just hit me up on Instagram @kitbait k I t B A T E. That's it. Just, just reach out. You can follow me on there. I'm posting stuff constantly about the classes. You can message me on there if you want to get on my mail list for invites to the classes that I'm doing. But yeah, just hit me up on Instagram.

A (47:19)

Awesome. And we'll make sure that we link to your Instagram in the show notes of the podcast and the description on YouTube as well. Make sure you guys go follow Kit. Bait. Very easy to remember a name like Incredible. Yeah, you'll have to tell me one day what your real name is before you changed it, before you got into mortgages. Dude, I appreciate it. This is really good stuff today.

B (47:39)

Yeah, happy to help. Thanks for doing something awesome for the community. You're a rockstar.

A (47:44)

Thanks, brother. I'll talk to you soon. Incredible tactical episode. I love that conversation. We will definitely have Kit back on another episode. Make sure that you follow him on Instagram. Make sure you follow Kit on Instagram. The link is in the show notes. It's in the description. If you're watching on YouTube, make sure you follow him. He's putting out a ton of great stuff. And then take, act like, implement what you learned today. It couldn't be more simple. It just takes some concerted effort. It takes intentionality. Right. You have to commit to doing these things and do it regularly and just add some of this stuff into your normal process. Like it. What I loved about what Kit shared. If you're just going after your sphere of influence to prospect using these new, these new methods, of course that's going to take some extra time. But to just start having these conversations sprinkled in with your current clients and then moving forward, it doesn't take extra time. It just takes some awareness and practice. And, you know, you really got to nail how you do this and do it with some conviction. So this is going to help blow up your business in a major way. I'm positive. So before we wrap it up, Last, last reminder, November 8th, midnight. The last chance to join the first phase, the first 12 weeks of the Massive agent business accelerator. If you are, if you are a burned out agent, if you are frustrated, if you keep hitting a ceiling, if you are working every waking moment, if you're tired of your wife texting you the video of your son taking his first steps while you were out showing houses like happened to me. And you're tired of that happening. And you know, you need a business. You need leverage, you need scalability, you need to be part of the massive agent business accelerator, where we have the business in a box. You just have to do. You just have to take the steps, you just have to take the action. We show you exactly what to do, hold your hand through it, and we're even there to help you troubleshoot when stuff goes wrong. So, massiveagentsociety.com founder, join us today before we close it up for a few months. Before phase two or before we. It's not even phase two. It's like before we do it again. Right? But we want you as a founding member, get the cheapest price, save yourself some money. And wouldn't you rather have the business now versus six months from now? I think you would. And before we wrap it up, big shout out to keeping current matters. These guys are such an incredible tool that agents should have it in your. You need to have these cakes. Wow, I'm struggling. You need to have KCM in your back pocket. Keeping current matters. It's a, it's a team of housing experts and, and economists and people telling you, here's what's happening with, with the market. Here's what the numbers mean, here's what the Federal Reserve is doing and how it affects sellers and buyers and investors. They give you graphics, they give you charts, they give you scripts on what it means, they tell you what types of content to do, what to do, what your video should be about. It takes so much of the guesswork out of being a knowledge broker, right? To take Byron Lezine's term, the knowledge broker, which is fantastic. You want to be a knowledge broker. You could spend an hour or two or three or four every single week studying this stuff. Or just get KCM and they'll just give it all to you in your inbox. Makes it very easy. Plug and play, save yourself some money. Try it out for free. Go over to trykcm.com SL BAM and the BAMX community. Their resources are incredible. The community is incredible. The referrals that the community cultivates with inside of it, the the trainings, the master classes, the discounts on their live events. Go check out BAMX right now and use Code Massive at checkout when you join them over@nowbam.com and save yourself some money. I'll see you guys next week for another episode of the Massive Agent podcast. Take care Sa.