How Poppi’s founders built a new soda brand worth $2 billion

Summary

---

Masters of Scale: How Poppi’s Founders Built a New Soda Brand Worth $2 Billion

Podcast: Masters of Scale
Host: Jeff Berman
Guests: Allison & Stephen Ellsworth (Co-founders of Poppi)
Date: April 30, 2026

---

Episode Overview

In this episode, Jeff Berman hosts Allison and Stephen Ellsworth, the married duo behind Poppi, a healthier soda brand recently acquired by Pepsi for nearly $2 billion. The conversation spans Poppi’s origins in their kitchen, scrappy growth strategies, an iconic Shark Tank appearance, pioneering TikTok marketing, and the emotional rollercoaster of selling their business. Listeners are treated to candid, practical startup lessons and behind-the-scenes stories of risk, persistence, and redefining a beverage category.

---

Key Discussion Points

1. The Poppi Origin Story

• Personal Problem to Product: Allison Ellsworth’s own health struggles (skin, weight, digestive issues) led her to experiment with apple cider vinegar drinks in her kitchen.

  • “Apple cider vinegar was just, like, a key ingredient. It was almost like it was, like, a reset detox type of vibe, but I hated the taste. So off to the kitchen I went.” — Allison (04:16)

• Early Reluctance and Support: Stephen admits he was skeptical at first but got on board as Allison perfected the taste.

  • “I definitely thought she was a little crazy… but if it’s something that I can drink and enjoy that’s also healthy, then I’m down.” — Stephen (05:24)

• From Farmer's Market to Whole Foods: Rapid early traction at the local farmer’s market—selling out every week and attracting a Whole Foods buyer (Kelly), which signaled the real business opportunity.

  • “Week after week after week, we kept selling out... and a Whole Foods buyer came by our booth... She gave us her card. That moment was just like a really reassuring moment...” — Allison (06:05)

• Going All In: The duo risked their life savings and began bottling at a larger scale to meet Whole Foods’ requirements.

2. Navigating Startup Growing Pains

• DIY Learning: With no background in manufacturing or compliance, they used Google, networked relentlessly, and displayed raw entrepreneurial grit.

  • “Google’s a beautiful thing... There’s templates online... As an entrepreneur, we were just so desperate to be successful and to share this product that we kind of just did whatever it takes…” — Allison (09:20)

• Partnership Strength: Being couple-founders helped them weather tough times and multiply wins as a team.

  • “I always say I love that I had a cofounder… the highs are so much higher, but the lows, you actually have like, support.” — Allison (10:43)
  • “In theory, a married couple has already committed 100%... I never thought that our relationship was challenged through the growth of Poppy. There were definitely moments where I didn’t think we were going to make it.” — Stephen (11:20)

• Sacrifices: They skipped personal celebrations, juggled new parenthood with the business, and powered through moments where they almost ran out of money.

  • “I was standing in the kitchen… it was a tax return from the government… we got a refund back, and it was almost for the exact dollar amount of our mortgage.” — Stephen (12:23)

3. Shark Tank: Transformation on National TV

• Strategic Decision: Opted for Shark Tank over taking “dumb money.” Allison discovered the casting call via Mark Cuban’s Instagram and auditioned while 3 months pregnant.

  • “We literally opened Instagram and Mark Cuban posted Shark Tank was coming to town... we just pitched our hearts out.” — Allison (14:34)

• “As Seen on TV” Effect: Getting a deal with beverage expert Rohan Oza led to a complete rebrand from Mother Beverage to Poppi.

  • “Your liquid's amazing, but your branding is shit.” — Rohan Oza, via Allison (17:01)
  • “We knew our baby was ugly.” — Stephen (17:13)

• Shark Tank Advice:

  • “Know your numbers. Don’t go on the show if you can’t answer basic questions about your business… go on with the intent to actually get a deal.” — Allison (18:49)
  • “For those going for marketing, there’s a little lift. But I don’t think it’s going to change their business the way that they think.” — Stephen (19:18)

4. The Power of Rebranding & COVID-Era Pivot

• Design Decisions: Playfulness and color were key; they leaned into a modern, vibrant brand. Launch timing coincided with COVID in March 2020.

  • “We knew Poppy was revolutionizing soda for the next generation. We want to give people the purpose to love soda again.” — Allison (22:16)

• Unexpected COVID Blessings:

  • Amazon pantry loading and a timely Shark Tank update re-aired as the world locked down, driving massive online sales.
  • “We hit Amazon’s hot new product list… March we did $9,000 on Amazon and I think the next month we did $250,000 on Amazon.” — Steven (24:34)

• Digital-First, TikTok-Driven Growth:

  • Allison went “all-in” with authentic content, sharing their founder story, experimenting with viral trends, and using TikTok as a primary driver of awareness.
  • “I always say, like, the most underexplored emotion for an entrepreneur is embarrassment. Get online and make a fool of yourself.” — Allison (25:46)
  • “That video now has like 300 million views... We did $100,000 while we’re sleeping that night on Amazon.” — Allison (26:20)

• Smart Marketing Hacks:

  • Captured customer data on their site before routing sales to Amazon (also using affiliate links to increase margin).
  • “Directing traffic to our website to Amazon… we actually made it an affiliate link. So Amazon was actually paying us.” — Steven (27:18)

5. Going Big: The Super Bowl Ad

• Bold, Last-Minute Decision:

  • Created a compelling “Future of Soda” ad, then acquired a last-minute Super Bowl slot just four days before the game.
  • The spot aired a minute before halftime—premium placement with massive impact.
  • “We tripled our awareness overnight. And that was the year that like Travis, Kelsey and Taylor, it was like one of the most viewed Super Bowls and we were like one of the most viewed super bowl ads at that Super Bowl.” — Allison (29:35)

• Huge ROI:

  • Forecasted $200–350 million in revenue, hit over $500 million post-ad.
  • “Our CMO actually signed the contract to buy the super bowl ad before we had the money to pay for the ad.” — Steven (30:42)

6. The $2 Billion Exit to Pepsi

• Strategic Sale:

  • Seeking broader distribution, they engaged in informal talks and ultimately accepted Pepsi’s offer quickly when it came.
  • “We really built this company so that we could pass the torch to a larger business that was going to be able to carry it forward and continue that mission.” — Stephen (31:30)

• 100% Sale, Emotional Aftermath:

  • The Ellsworths sold the entire company and became advisors, stepping aside from day-to-day management.
  • Experienced “mourning” and loss of daily purpose but grateful their team was retained.
  • “I can’t have a team reporting into me and I can’t, like, meddle like I used to. There was mourning that came with that... but I think where we are now, things are great. We’re getting creative.” — Allison and Stephen (34:23, 34:58)

7. What’s Next?

• Future Ventures:
  • The entrepreneurial itch remains. The Ellsworths tease another beverage concept in the works.
  • “We can’t say what’s next, but we will say the opportunity just kind of happened... but it is another beverage.” — Allison (35:50)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Donkey Kick of Entrepreneurship:
  • “I donkey kink him off the cliff… But the good thing is that once I’m in, I’m all in.” — Allison and Stephen (10:01)
• On Co-founding as a Couple:
  • “I never thought that our relationship was challenged through the growth of Poppy. There were definitely moments where I didn’t think we were going to make it [as a business].” — Stephen (11:20)
• On Taking Risks:
  • “Our CMO actually signed the contract to buy the super bowl ad before we had the money to pay for the ad.” — Steven (30:42)
• On Post-Sale Mourning:
  • “It was a really, really challenging time… not having like that purpose and like extreme focus on something to like, wake up and get after was really, really challenging.” — Stephen (34:23)

---

Timestamps of Key Segments

• 02:07: Stephen’s metaphor for entrepreneurial leap (donkey kick off the cliff)
• 06:05: Farmer’s market success and Whole Foods breakout
• 09:20: DIY learning, early struggles, power of partnership
• 14:34: Deciding to go on Shark Tank; audition story
• 16:39: The Shark Tank deal and rebrand to Poppi
• 22:14: Deep dive into rebranding journey
• 24:16: COVID pivot to digital—Amazon and TikTok strategy
• 27:18: Affiliate linking/Amazon hack
• 29:41: The Super Bowl ad—how it happened
• 30:21: Revenue impact and risk taking with Super Bowl ad spend
• 31:30: Deciding to sell to Pepsi
• 34:23: The emotional adjustment post-sale
• 35:50: Tease for next venture

---

Episode Takeaways

• Solve for yourself, then serve others: Authentic problem-solving led to Poppi’s initial spark.
• Grit, improvisation, and humility: Success demanded continual learning, relentless effort, and willingness to change directions—even to admit their “baby was ugly.”
• Branding and visibility matter: Strategic rebranding and bold marketing moves (especially digital and Super Bowl) created outsized impact.
• Smart partnerships, patient exits: Choosing wise investors and understanding the personal costs (and rewards) of selling set them up for life after Poppi.
• Transformation is ongoing: The Ellsworths’ story is far from over; their appetite to build is as strong as ever.

---

A must-listen for any entrepreneur, brand builder, or anyone fascinated by the interplay between grit, partnership, and luck in scaling to success.

Transcript

[Josh]

Hey folks, Jeff Berman here.

[Jeff Berman]

Exciting news. Applications are now open for the Masters of Scale Summit. It's happening October 20th through October 22nd in San Francisco and it is a really special event. Please join our curated community of founders, innovators and leaders shaping the future. Expect ideas that challenge your assumptions and connections that move your business and and maybe even your life forward. It's an experience that can change literally everything. Apply [e-mail] apply26 that's mastersofscale.com apply26

[Allison Ellsworth]

here's

[Bilt Sponsor]

something all founders know every dollar should be working for you. So why is your biggest monthly expense your housing payment just 6 sitting there? Bilt is the membership for where you live. Whether you're renting or paying a mortgage, every payment earns you points. You can redeem toward flights with United, Lyft rides, Amazon.com purchases, or even a down payment on a home. Bilt members also get access to a neighborhood concierge. It can book restaurants, fitness classes, and find new local hangouts, all while being rewarded at more than 45,000 merchant partners. It's like a personal assistant built into where you live. Join the membership for where you live at joinbilt.comscale that's J-O-I-N B I L T.comscale founders ship faster on deal. Set up payroll for any country in minutes, hire anyone anywhere and get visas handled fast so you stay focused on scaling. Deal takes care of onboarding, hr, it eor benefits and compliance so your team can grow without borders. It's why more than 40,000 fast growing companies trust Deal to move fast. Visit deal.commos that'S-E-E-L.commos.

[Steven Ellsworth]

I'm standing there on the edge of the bridge. I'm just like, should I jump? I know I should jump, but there's going to be all of these things that I have to do to figure it out. There's so much risk in all of

[Allison Ellsworth]

this stuff and I donkey kink him off the cliff.

[Steven Ellsworth]

She just so hard, just kicks me right off.

[Jeff Berman]

That's Stephen Ellsworth, his co founder. Allison is the one who gave him that donkey kick. The married couple took the entrepreneurial leap together to create a healthier version of soda, one that you've probably seen if you haven't picked it up yet at your local convenience store or grocery store. Poppy Pepsi bought the brand in 2025 for roughly $2 billion. But the road to getting there was not so easy.

[Steven Ellsworth]

While you're like in the dark building and grinding. Your friends are at great corporate jobs, taking trips to the Bahamas and taking trips to Europe, and we're just like,

[Allison Ellsworth]

grinding but also loving the grind.

[Jeff Berman]

This is masters of scale. I'm Jeff Berman, your host this week on the show, Allison and Steven Ellsworth. They're the married duo that started by selling homemade soda at their farmer's. Piper scaled Poppy to a truly gigantic exit and changed an entire category along the way. We talked about what it takes to juggle a growing company and family at the same time, how savvy social media strategy helped them stand out. And what happens when you decide to run a Super bowl ad four days before the big game.

[Josh]

Alice and Steven, welcome to Masters of scale.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Thanks for having us.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Thanks for having us.

[Josh]

I'm thrilled for you guys to be here. I want to start with a confession, which is I had my first poppy just a few weeks ago. I had the lemon lime version. And as someone who was, like, addicted to Coca cola for many years, and I'm now 16 years off of Coca Cola, wow, this was such a delight to discover Poppy. I love that. So thank you. Alison. It wasn't like you were, like, dying to go into beverage. Right? How did poppy come about? What's the origin story?

[Allison Ellsworth]

The fact that you just had your first poppy is very iconic. And what you said is the reason poppy exists is to give people the freedom to love soda again. That's our purpose. But to go back to the origin story, we didn't set out to be beverage connoisseurs. We just wanted to create something really incredible. But it came from a personal problem of mine. I had tummy issues. I was about 50 pounds heavier than I am now. My skin was a mess. I spent maybe seven years trying to go to doctors, trying to figure out what's going on, and they kept telling me it was, like, girl problems. I couldn't really, like, really figure it out. Going through that process. Honestly, it was really amazing for me to discover what worked for me. And apple cider vinegar was just, like, a key ingredient. It was almost like it was like a reset detox type of vibe. But I hated the taste. So off to the kitchen I went, Created a bunch of our first versions of it. It was called mother beverage. It was in these, like, little mason jars.

[Josh]

And so, Stephen, when Allison is sort of a mad scientist in the kitchen. Kitchen trying to figure out, are you like, I love you, but what are we doing here? Did you see the vision?

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yes. I definitely thought she was a little crazy. I would say that, like, for the first little bit, I begrudgingly sort of went along with this idea. As a supporting husband, I was really into health and fitness, but the things that I did surrounding health and fitness and the food that I ate, like, largely tasted pretty good. This was sort of too far out in left field for me. I think, as Allison said, when she started making it taste a little bit better, that's when I started to get more excited about it. I was, like, taking a shot of apple cider vinegar. Not for me, but if it's something that I can drink and enjoy that's also healthy, then I'm down.

[Josh]

And so what was the inflection point at which you said, maybe I've got a product here that's worth taking out to market?

[Allison Ellsworth]

I just was still just so obsessed with this idea, Almost so obsessed. I just wanted people to try it. So we signed up for the local farmer's market to do it as a hobby on the weekends. I think a lot of people start at the farmer's market, and we just started selling it, and week after week after week, we kept selling out. And then we would spend the week bottling it and making it in our kitchen and then selling it on the weekends while he's working a job to support the mortgage of the house that we just bought. And really quickly, a Whole Foods buyer came by our booth. Her name was Kelly. She's still at Whole Foods to this day. And she gave us her card. And that moment was just like a really reassuring moment of being like, you guys need to be in Whole Foods. And I think that was the first time we realized we maybe had a business and it wasn't a hobby. And I told Stephen. I was like, we're gonna do this. We're going all in. We're put our life savings into this.

[Steven Ellsworth]

I think it was like our third weekend at the farmer's market.

[Josh]

Wow.

[Jeff Berman]

So it's fast.

[Steven Ellsworth]

This was really fast. And friends and family had really liked the product, but how often can you trust friends and family to give you real feedback? And so this was an opt.

[Allison Ellsworth]

I love it.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah, it's so.

[Jeff Berman]

It's so good.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Oh, my gosh.

[Josh]

We love.

[Steven Ellsworth]

That's exactly right. Like Allison said, the forager from Whole Foods loved what we were doing. There was a big crowd around our booth. We were like the talk of the farmer's market, and so I think that was helpful. But tried the product, loved it, loved our story, and was like, you got to be in Whole Foods.

[Josh]

It's one thing to be bottling during the week in your home and showing at the farmer's market. But when Kelly shows up from Whole Foods and says, you should be in Whole Foods, is it like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Now we've got compliance. We've got supply chain. We've got a whole set of questions. We haven't begun to, like, what happens in that moment.

[Steven Ellsworth]

The nice thing about this local, forager program that Whole Foods has is they're there side by side with you to help these young and emerging products and brands sort of get up off the ground and get to retail. And so that was just a really great relationship that we developed over time with Kelly at Whole Foods in getting compliant and starting our own manufacturing facility. Not the wisest choice, but getting sort of all of that stuff dialed in. They were really helpful with it.

[Allison Ellsworth]

We even had, like, at one point, the bottles had this, like, metallic shine on it, and she was like, that's not gonna look good in grocery stores. And so we ended up going with, like, bright colors instead that we knew would, like, pop off the shelf. And I think, too, on top of it, it takes time. So from the time we got the, like card to the time we were on shelf was 10 or 11 months. Right. And so I love that we were naive enough to think it would happen quick because we did take our life savings and we did open a manufacturing facility, and we did start to grow even more locally. And the craziest thing that we went through all that, and then we finally got approval, and they're like, you guys have 14 stores in Dallas, Texas, and now you have to go sell each store individually. We strapped our babies in our back, and we sold into those 14 Whole Foods, and we were really successful in it that they started to believe in us. And we just started the flywheel, and I think we did, like, 500,000 in revenue. And then that's when Shark Tank came up.

[Josh]

Before we get to Shark Tank, neither of you had a background specifically in manufacturing and supply chain, in compliance and all the things that you have to deal with. How did you do it?

[Allison Ellsworth]

Google's a beautiful thing right now. There's ChatGPT, but I think that there's templates online. There's resources. You ask people, you network, you call, you beg. Like, other people are like, how did you guys do it? I think, like, as an entrepreneur, we were just so desperate to be successful and to share this product that we kind of just did whatever it takes. And it's almost like everyone wants that secret formula. It's just you have to just do the Work?

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah. I think the reason we work so well is because I'm standing there on the edge of the bridge and I'm just like, should I jump? I know I should jump, but there's going to be all of these things that I have to do to figure it out. There's so much risk in all of this stuff.

[Allison Ellsworth]

And I donkey kink him off the cliff.

[Steven Ellsworth]

She just so hard, just kicks me right off the ledge. But the good thing is that once I'm in, I'm all in. There's no turning back. It's just extreme focus and extreme intensity without looking back. Just doing whatever you have to to literally get the job done. And I feel like for the first two or three years growing the business, we just muscled through, it was just pure grit at that point. While you're, like, in the dark building and grinding, your friends are at great corporate jobs, taking trips to the Bahamas and taking trips to Europe, and we're just like, grinding. It's tough, for sure.

[Allison Ellsworth]

But also loving the grind.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah.

[Allison Ellsworth]

I always say I love that I had a co founder. I think it would be really hard to do it as a solo entrepreneur. Right. The highs are so much higher, but the lows, you actually have, like, support. And so if you don't have a co founder, find someone your first hire is probably going to be basically your co founder because you can feel really alone as an entrepreneur.

[Josh]

Yeah. And there's a growing number of stories of partners, husband, wife or otherwise, who found companies together and go on to have the success you all have.

[Jeff Berman]

It's also a decision that's fraught.

[Josh]

Was there a moment where you just said, like, I'm not sure this is worth it, or I'm not sure we're going to make it as a couple through this?

[Steven Ellsworth]

There's never a moment I didn't think that we wouldn't make it as a couple. I think maybe the reason that you start to see more married couples do this together is because in theory, a married couple has already committed 100%, whereas I think other co founders or partners. I feel like that conviction and partnership can sometimes waver in the face of animosity or any sort of challenge. So I never thought that our relationship was challenged through the growth of Poppy. There were definitely moments where I didn't think we were going to make it. I remember it was a slow month and we had all of this overhead and. And really no revenue to back it up. And our mortgage was due and we had our first kid at this point, and I was like, man, what are we going to do? I was standing in the kitchen. I opened up this letter. I didn't know where it was from, but it was a tax return from the government because we had had our first kid and we didn't claim it dependent on our tax return. We got a refund back, and it was almost for the exact dollar amount of our mortgage.

[Josh]

Oh, wow.

[Steven Ellsworth]

That was probably the time that I was wavering the most.

[Allison Ellsworth]

It was early on until, like, post exit with this story either, which I think is really interesting.

[Josh]

Why didn't you share that with Allison?

[Steven Ellsworth]

I don't know. For whatever silly reason. Yeah. There was a lot of things going through my head of sort of like saying, okay, exit door A, exit door B. Like, what's the deal?

[Josh]

Yeah, Well, I mean, ask that question in part because to your point about being a married couple and already, at least theoretically, and in your case, really being all in on it. Right. You don't have one foot out, but when you're in it together, you're experiencing those highs and lows largely together. And so I'm just curious, is there an element of almost protecting each other when the energy demands that?

[Allison Ellsworth]

We really like to win. Both of us have that drive, but we also wanted to have a family. Right. We didn't want to pick, and we did decide very intentionally to do it at the same time. And so we at that point decided that there's three things, marriage, kids, and business that we were like, hey, we're good. Let's not focus on the marriage so much. Like, I don't care if I get flowers for Valentine's Day or if you forget the anniversary or we don't have a birthday dinner. Right? Those things that I think a lot of people would probably need in a marriage to, like, build that trust. But we were building trust in so many other avenues that for the longest time, we didn't really need it. But I will say what's been interesting was, like, post exit, when we had this, like, same goal for nine years, Poppy. And then we exit, and now it's like, he's doing stuff I'm doing, and we now don't have the same goal. There was a little bit of a learning period to be like, oh, wait, we're not doing everything together. We have to, like, almost now go on those dates. I want those flowers. Don't forget my birthday. Right. With everything in life, there's waves and there's challenges and change, but I think we're pretty good with dealing it and addressing and having those Conversations.

[Josh]

And so what happens that you then decide it's worth it for us to go do Shark Tank rather than continuing to build sort of step by step in a more traditional manner?

[Allison Ellsworth]

I think we're finally ready to have help. Right. I think we had maybe gotten it to a really good business for us, but it wasn't, you know, 500,000. It's good, but it's not like gonna change our lives. And we had someone reach out. They were wanting to invest in us. I think they were gonna give us like $200,000. But they had zero connections, they had zero knowledge and beverage. And we've always heard of the old saying, like, don't take dumb money. Like, any entrepreneur knows that. And as we were like discussing if we needed it. Cause we needed the money. I literally opened Instagram and Mark Cuban posted that Shark Tank was coming to town that weekend and there was tryouts to be on the show. I was three months pregnant. So it was 2017 and we went and stood in line for eight hours. I think it was like the first time we got a real babysitter with our first. And we just pitched our hearts out. And they were like, this is gonna make it all the way.

[Josh]

Really?

[Allison Ellsworth]

They loved us.

[Steven Ellsworth]

They were pumped.

[Allison Ellsworth]

They were pumped. They loved. They loved our story. Yeah. But it still took six months from that moment to actually get on the show, which, you know, made me nine months pregnant.

[Josh]

Yeah. I'm not great at math, but I was going to say that puts you right there.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Nine months pre on. But I was. I was like, I'm going to be. I. I don't care. I will have this baby on tv. Like, that's how much we just. And Shark Tank absolutely changed our lives. We had resources, we had knowledge, we had network. We had access to more capital. I will say the recognition of the American dream of as seen on Shark Tank. Right. That stamp of approval. Like, it does so many things for a business when used in the right way.

[Josh]

Some people go on Shark Tank, I'm told, knowing they're not going to do a deal. It is purely a marketing play. Other people go on with a real clear idea of what they want to walk out with. Where were you on that?

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah, we needed a deal. As Alison said, we really wanted that strategic partner that could help sort of guide us and take us to the next level. And I think that we're relatively coachable. We wanted capital. We were eager for a partner. We were hungry to win, and we wanted to learn.

[Josh]

Tell us what happened on the show.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Spoiler Alert. We got a deal.

[Josh]

Okay.

[Allison Ellsworth]

So we got a deal with Rohan Oza and he has a vast knowledge and beverage right in the history, multiple exits and really had worked his whole career in the space. And so it was the perfect shark for us. And after getting a deal, we did a full rebrand. We were mother beverage and we went into poppy.

[Josh]

What did Rohan tell you about the branding?

[Allison Ellsworth]

Yeah, I mean, he was like, basically like, your liquid's amazing, but your branding is shit. And we as founders were not upset about it. We were like, well, what are we gonna do?

[Josh]

It wasn't like someone telling you your baby's ugly. That's not how it landed.

[Allison Ellsworth]

No.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Because I think we knew our baby was ugly.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Yeah.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah. But the inside is what matters.

[Josh]

The inside is absolutely what matters. Whether you can see sell the inside without the outside, different story. It almost feels like Rohan is the perfect shark to invest, not one who's a regular on the show. Did you get lucky or was it providence or was this part of the programming that they wanted you in front of him?

[Allison Ellsworth]

You know, contrary to what people believe, like the show wants you to get a deal and they do a lot of work in the back end to actually try to match you up. I know this cause I was a guest shark this season. So it was fun to see both sides of it. And I kept thinking, you guys, I am pregnant. I know you're filming for three weeks. Like I think we were like the last two episodes filmed of the pod and it was because they were trying to match us up with Rohan. We had no idea. You don't find out your sharks until literally, I think like midnight the night before.

[Josh]

Oh, wow.

[Allison Ellsworth]

So we had no clue. We find out, we go to bed, we're up at 4am for, for glam and to get to set. So like you don't really even have time to process it or really dig deep or look into them. So you just kind of have to go in there with an open mind. And I think Bethany Frankel was also on there and she had some experience in beverage, so we were excited to see her. And then Mark Cuban was Dallas, we were Dallas based, but I think that we would have done any deal with any shark, honestly, if it was a good deal and they weren't like totally being sharky, we definitely needed it.

[Josh]

If there's an entrepreneur who's listening who is either trying out for Shark Tank or is going to be going to record an episode soon, what's the advice you would each give that person?

[Allison Ellsworth]

Know your numbers, don't go on the show if you, if you can't answer just like basic questions about your business, go on with the intent to actually get a deal because they can see right through that. And I think, you know, nerves get people a lot. I saw that where it was a great product, they knew their numbers, but the nerves took over. So know that you are actually going on TV and you have to like be able to do that, which I think probably a lot of people struggle with.

[Steven Ellsworth]

I think for the people that are wanting to go on there for marketing, I think it's great marketing short term. I think there's a little lift. But I don't think that it's going to change their business the way that they think it's going to.

[Jeff Berman]

Still ahead, Allison and Steven on how they built one of the most effective TikTok playbooks in CPG history

[Allison Ellsworth]

Foreign.

[Jeff Berman]

The very best founders I know are brilliant at building systems. They connect teams, they remove bottlenecks, and they eliminate single points of failure. And yet, when it comes to their own wealth, most are running a disconnected stack. A tax accountant here, an estate attorney there. A wealth manager who doesn't talk to either one of them. Creative planning was built to fix exactly that. One integrated team of tax professionals, estate planners, investment specialists, all coordinated by a dedicated wealth manager who sees your full financial picture and keeps every piece working together. Proactive, tax efficiency, estate strategy, investments all under one roof. Creative Planning where wealth works together. Learn [e-mail] mastersofscale

[Bilt Sponsor]

whether you rent or own, your housing payment is probably your biggest bill of the month. So here's something worth Bilt is the membership that actually rewards you for it. Every housing payment earns you points that you can redeem toward travel with partners like United, along with stays at Hyatt hotels, Lyft rides, Amazon.com purchases, and more. And the neighborhood concierge feature can make restaurant reservations, book fitness classes, and find you local spots, all while racking up rewards at 45,000 plus merchant partners. So whether you're paying rent or paying a mortgage, Bilt works for both. Join the Membership for Where youe live at joinbilt.com scale that's J-O-I-N-B-I-L-T.com scale if

[Jeff Berman]

you're a regular here, you already know that the best business lessons aren't hypothetical, they are proven. That's why I love the Business History podcast. The show unpacks the real decisions and turning points that have shaped iconic companies from the long history of Humans trying to cheat death and sell the solution to the surprising origins of prediction markets. Hosts Jacob Goldstein and Robert Smith dig beneath the surface of how business really works and how much further back it goes than you might expect. Find business history wherever you get your podcasts or watch it on YouTube. Welcome back to Masters of Scale. You can find this conversation and much more on our YouTube channel. And be sure to check out the link in our show notes to subscribe to our newsletter.

[Josh]

So tell us about the rebranding journey.

[Allison Ellsworth]

When we decided to do the whole rebrand, we did try to keep a little bit of nostalgic touch of mother beverage. So at one point we were like, do we call it mom and pop? Because we knew we wanted to be

[Josh]

a soda pop being that's funny. It's like a dad joke.

[Allison Ellsworth]

But then we're like, is it a dad joke? Will people take us serious? And we really wanted to be a cool brand, and so we didn't rush it. We hired in different designers to come up with different designs. Do we stay in bottles? Do we go to cans? Do we do both? What is the brand? What is the vision? And really where we landed is we knew Poppy was revolutionizing soda for the next generation. We wanna give people the purpose to love soda again. I think at one point Steven wanted color. I wanted white cans. I will say I was wrong. I'm so glad we did color. Once we kind of figured out our north star of our mission, everything else kind of just like, landed in place on, like, what we were trying to do.

[Josh]

Help me with the timeline. So the Shark Tank episode actually airs December of 2018. December of 18, we take off.

[Steven Ellsworth]

2019 is the rebranding phase. We keep things in steady state.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Launch poppy the first week of COVID March 3, 2020.

[Josh]

Wow. So what happens when you're launching or relaunching a consumer brand with retail partners? I imagine you had pretty ambitious launch plans and then the world shuts down.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Yes, it was at the time devastating. But I actually think it did us well for a few reasons. We had loaded into Amazon. What is everybody doing during COVID Their pantry loading shelf stable products that, quote, unquote, can boost immunity. Everyone shopping on Amazon. So that business blew up on top of it. We had filmed an update on Shark Tank with the new brand. It aired the second week of lockdown. I think it was like, April 4th. So we had a national commercial with Poppy. The second month of business.

[Josh]

Wow.

[Allison Ellsworth]

And we hit Amazon's hot new product list literally overnight. It was wild. What we saw from that episode versus like our original episode.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah. That's when we broke the Internet trending higher than Kim Kardashian and Donald Trump. It was, it was a wild night order of magnitude.

[Josh]

What does that mean from a revenue perspective in that window?

[Steven Ellsworth]

So March we did about $9,000 on Amazon and I think the next month we did 250,000 on Amazon.

[Josh]

Wow.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah.

[Josh]

Were you able to keep up with the demand?

[Allison Ellsworth]

We were able to shift inventory into Amazon because we were ready for launches and grocery store. And then another huge piece that I said that was like a blessing in disguise. It made us think differently from the beginning of the way we marketed. Everything had to be digital first. And I do believe us being one of the first brands to really lean into TikTok to build that like community based really just helped our brand awareness. Because a lot in beverage, if you think about or really in a lot of better for you products, they grow really big in New York and la and those are your hubs and those are your big markets and you really focus on it. Because we were a digital first brand, I think our largest retailers were like Fargo, North Dakota and Cincinnati, Ohio and these like really middle America soda drinking places that it just allowed us to really blow up really quick. Because of how digital first we were

[Josh]

was the investment in TikTok content as marketing, inspiration, desperation. What drove that in those early days of COVID for you?

[Allison Ellsworth]

I think all of the above. I always say, like the most under explored emotion for an entrepreneur is embarrassment. Get online and make a fool of yourself. So I danced, I made taco videos, I put our kids in it. I was doing transition stuff. Steven was making TikToks. Honestly, what worked is one night I sat down, it was a Friday night, I just got in the shower, my hair's wet and I just told my story. And it connected on such another level that it went viral. Did a million views while we're sleeping. We did $100,000 while we're sleeping that night on Amazon.

[Josh]

Wow.

[Allison Ellsworth]

That video now has like 300 million views. It's just like wild. It was just like, hi, I'm allison. Poppy has 5 grams of sugar and I was on shark take nine months pregnant. Like it was just so simple. And so it also opened our eyes to the power of it. So then we shifted a lot of our paid over to the platform and really just focused on that as like our community building brand awareness channel, which I think was like really smart for us at that time. Our number one KPI was brand awareness for the first four years of business was brand awareness. I think until we did a Super bowl ad, we just were like never looking at the data. We used a. An interesting cause. Cause we were Amazon. We didn't have our. We didn't own our customer status. So we would run all of our TikTok ads to our website. We get their email and their phone. And then you'd go to add to cart and it would check out on Amazon right from our website.

[Josh]

So you're capturing the customer, you're getting their data so you can remarket to them. But you're leveraging all of Amazon's infrastructure.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Correct.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Another little crazy hack. This is like a pro tip. Because we were directing traffic to our website to Amazon, we actually made it an affiliate link. So Amazon was actually paying us.

[Josh]

That's so smart.

[Steven Ellsworth]

To direct traffic from our website to Amazon while also collecting the customer status. That's an ultra hack.

[Josh]

Yeah. I love that you referenced the super bowl ad. When did you do the super bowl ad and why?

[Allison Ellsworth]

You know, we just did things very differently at Poppy and just to like lay the ground, like for us to do a Super bowl ad in three or four years isn't crazy for a size of business that we were. What we'd done is the year before. We did a huge brand rework of really hammering in on, you know, what is our vision. We created an incredible anthemic ad that was called the future of Soda. And we got it and we started testing it and it was just such a beautiful piece of content that we're like, this is a Super bowl ad.

[Josh]

You had the ad before you decided it was. You were gonna do the Super Bowl.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Right.

[Josh]

The ad is what triggered this.

[Allison Ellsworth]

We fell in love with this creative wow. So we didn't ever make this to be a Super bowl ad. And I think that that's also really amazing. Cause people get into this cycle of you making like celebrity soup super at bowl ads where like everybody's in it and it's like, what did they just say? Right. But we really wanted to come out and just like who we were. And in the ad I think we said we were so to 17 times. And so we go, we want to do Super Bowl. We go to buy the Super Bowl. There's nothing for sale.

[Josh]

What year is this?

[Allison Ellsworth]

So that was 23, going into 24. I remember I was part of this TikTok collective. We were at dinner with a bunch of really incredible awesome people from like Wendy's to the NBA to Thrive Market to Wyden and Kennedy, like Just like incredible people, like at this dinner. And I remember had no idea who this guy was. And I was like, anybody have a Super bowl ad? And he's like, I think I do. And it was the M group. And at the time I called our CMO and I was like, I think I found us a Super bowl ad. This is the Wednesday before the Sunday game. Four days before.

[Josh]

Four days before the Super Bowl.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Four days before the Super Bowl. What was crazy about it too is it was a floater ad. So we had no idea when it was going to air. It's like depending on timeouts and injuries

[Josh]

because you can buy the first quarter, you can buy halftime, you can buy post game. But some of the ads are sold on a non specific basis. They're going to plug it in where they can.

[Allison Ellsworth]

All it had to do was air before. Thank you for watching the NFL. That's how risky it is.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Could have been a blowout. Everybody turned off the game and it

[Allison Ellsworth]

could have been the last AD.

[Josh]

29 to 7. Yeah, forget it.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Yes. And it costs the same for this, right? You don't get a discount for buying a floater out and not knowing. But I will say we just rolled the dice. It ended up airing one minute before Usher went on right before halftime, which is the most premium spot that anyone could ever ask for at the Super Bowl. We tripled our awareness overnight. And that was the year that like Travis, Kelsey and Taylor, it was like one of the most viewed Super Bowls and we were like one of the most viewed super bowl ads at that Super Bowl. So you could say our first super bowl was very successful.

[Josh]

And coming out of the super bowl, we were able to see beyond the awareness. We were able to see in the revenue number numbers.

[Steven Ellsworth]

The effect, yes, I think is the short answer. We were, I think, forecasting 350, 200 to 350 is really what that number was supposed to be for 2024. We hit over 500 north of 500 million that year. And so I would say, yes, it paid off. Our CMO actually signed the contract to buy the super bowl ad before we had the money to pay for the ad.

[Josh]

Wow.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Because we knew they would believe in this moment. It was just like such partnership the whole time.

[Josh]

So wait, you're calling Rohan and saying, look, we're going to need some cash infusion here to cover the cost of super bowl ad that we just bought

[Allison Ellsworth]

because it wasn't the plan for the year.

[Josh]

Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Allison Ellsworth]

And he's like, okay.

[Josh]

And an $11 million expense showing up overnight is not a trivial thing even on a business at the scale that you were at. Wow. It's also just a great callback to your point about not taking dumb money. Took smart money. Got someone who can help you with the branding, really think through. Has got deep experience in beverage. And when you say this is the opportunity, we believe we've already signed the contract to do this. They're like, I'm in. I'm with you on this.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Right.

[Josh]

Okay, so jumping ahead, you've made a decision to sell the company. You've now sold the company. As we sit here, what's the process that leads to a decision to sell this company?

[Steven Ellsworth]

Alison and I also knew that in order for us to truly revolutionize Soda and give people across the globe the freedom to love soda again, we were going to need a partner. We are the official soda of the LA Lakers. We can't be sold there at the stadium because of existing contracts. And so we had made that decision. We really built this company so that we could pass the torch to a larger business that was going to be able to carry it forward and continue that, that mission.

[Josh]

You're in a category where there are two 800 pound gorillas, right? There's Pepsi and there's Coca Cola. Did you start conversations with both of them early so that you knew that they're familiar with not just poppy, but with YouTube, et cetera.

[Allison Ellsworth]

So it's actually 3kdp when it comes to these things. And then yes, there's the option to go, I. But then you don't have a distribution partner. So it's just a really tough situation to be in in beverage. And so I think we did start dating. We started having conversations. We didn't actually do like official process where we were like we were for sale. It was like, hey, let's take some calls. And so I think we had been talking to Pepsi for almost a year and a half before like the actual like final offer came in. I think the reason they bought Poppy is for like our marketing and our team. And so I think when they finally gave us the offer, I think we said yeah, we went a little bit in negotiation, but I think we said yes in like three days. It was really quick. It was like February and then we like closed end of March. Pepsi bought poppy for $1.95 billion. It's so hard to not say two. So let's just say let's round it up. Almost 2 billion.

[Josh]

Let's just round it up. Which is a monster exit. It's A monster exit. And you said Pepsi wanted Poppy in part for the team, obviously the product and the branding, et cetera. Did that include the two of you?

[Allison Ellsworth]

It did not. I think what a lot of people don't realize is we sold 100% of the company. A lot of times you'll do a two step deal where I would say, if it was that situation, we would have stayed in our roles and kept going. But you don't sell your company for $2 billion and then say, hey, here's your Pepsi employee badge. It's just not the way those things work. And we were very aware of that going in and had lots of conversations now that the thing that I will say is they've kept us on as on advisory roles. You know, I'm still the face of the company. I still do a lot of ads. I was in the office two weeks ago. We were filming a Super bowl commercial with Charlie xcx. But I can't have a team reporting into me and I can't, like, meddle like I used to. Right. Like, you have to have boundaries and you have to have respect. And there was mourning that came with that. I would say that I think is very normal. I'm like, so happy. Everybody at Poppy got jobs that wanted to stay. They hired on 100% of anybody that wanted to stay. Some people did leave because they saw what happened with Poppy. They're gonna go get another job and get equity and hopefully do it again.

[Steven Ellsworth]

As Alison said, there's definitely this, this mourning period. I don't think a lot of people talk about it. It was a really, really challenging time. And it's like, oh, poor you, you sold your company for $2 billion, like, life must suck for you type of a thing. But it really is. I think not knowing what I was going to do that day, not having like that purpose and like extreme focus on something to like, wake up and get after was really, really challenging. I think we made the right decision. You rip the band aid, you separate. And so I think where we are now, I think things are great. We're getting creative.

[Josh]

A lot of folks in your situation would say, you know what? We climb the mountain. We're going to spend time making investments, guest judging on Shark Tank, philanthropy, whatever else is meaningful for you. Is there an itch to start another company and do this again?

[Steven Ellsworth]

Absolutely, 100%. I think, as Allison said, I think we allowed ourselves that time to really sit and be with ourselves and process. And one of the things that I missed the most was being with a team. Building a team and having, like, this really great outlet to be creative and to solve problems and to challenge yourself. And I also want my kids to see me work hard at something and accomplish things. I don't want to just be passive on the sidelines playing golf.

[Josh]

So can you tell us about what's next?

[Allison Ellsworth]

We can't say what's next, but we will say the opportunity just kind of happened. Right. And basically, if we don't do it, someone else will because it's so simple. And it's like we're like shaking ourselves, like, how has this not been done? But it is another beverage.

[Steven Ellsworth]

It is.

[Allison Ellsworth]

We're gonna do what we know.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Double down, double down.

[Allison Ellsworth]

And we're excited. We're working on naming and branding and packaging and just kind of that early

[Steven Ellsworth]

day grind, maybe not all the way back to, like, early stage. We'll skip manufacturing, skip the farmer's market, skip those, like, first three years.

[Josh]

I hope you'll come back when you launch the new thing to tell us about it. Thank you so much for being on Masters of Scale.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Thanks for having us.

[Steven Ellsworth]

Yeah, thanks for having us.

[Jeff Berman]

Thanks again to Allison and Steven Ellsworth for joining us. Poppy's scale story is an incredible example of how your toughest moments can become your biggest opportunity. A brutally honest investor told them that their bottles were terrible, but also invested in the rebrand that changed everything. Their retail launch screeched to a halt because of COVID but it kickstarted the digital first marketing that allowed the brand to blitzscale. Facing the obstacles head on so often can unlock just the right strategy.

[Josh]

I'm Josh.

[Jeff Berman]

Jeff Berman. Thank you for listening.

[Allison Ellsworth]

Humans will never be more intelligent than AI.

[Jeff Berman]

There's going to be two types of companies. Those who are great at AI and those that went out of business because they weren't.

[Bilt Sponsor]

How do we build a future that is human centered?

[Rana El Kalyubi]

Hi, I'm Rana El Kalyubi, and on my podcast, Pioneers of AI, we answer that question and so many more. As an AI scientist, entrepreneur and investor, I know what it takes to build AI that works for everyone. Every week I sit down with the pioneers shaping our future. And we take you behind the scenes of the AI that's transforming our lives. Find Pioneers of AI wherever you tune in.

[Jeff Berman]

Masters of Scale is a Wait.

[Josh]

What?

[Jeff Berman]

Original Our executive producer is Eve Trow. Our senior producer is Tricia Bobita. Associate producer is Masha Makatanina. Senior talent executive is Stephanie Stern. Mixing and mastering by Aaron Bastinelli and Brian Pugh. Original music by Ryan holiday. Our head of podcasts is lital molad. Visit mastersofscale.com to find the transcript for this episode and to subscribe to our newsletter. And please make sure to check out our YouTube channel.