John C. Maxwell (3:32)

Dan Cathy said leaders need to be self aware and situationally aware. If you grow in your awareness and if you develop your abilities and if you make the right choices, you got that? Grow in your awareness, develop your abilities, make the right choices, you can reach your capacity. Well, the advice that we're talking about is all about capacity. It's all about how can we reach our potential. Well I thought about the no limits book and how that awareness is so important in your life. I mean let's face it, you can't fix what you're unaware of. And that reminded me of one of my laws of growth in the 15 laws of growth book which says it's the law of awareness by the way, that you must know yourself to grow yourself. And then I began to think about my life and my leadership and the misses that I've had in what I've attempted to do. Cause I've had some hits, but I've had some misses. And not all of the misses I've had, but most of the misses have been misses because I assume something that I just really didn't know. In fact, I look back and I think maybe the mother of all mess ups in leadership is assumptions that we begin to assume things. That's why I say to leaders all the time, you need to find your people before you lead your people. The first responsibility of the leader isn't to lead others, we gotta find them first. But let me say this, I gotta find myself before I can lead myself. And I've gotta certainly find myself. I've gotta be self aware before I can be situationally aware. I've Gotta be able to understand me before I can understand you. And I gotta be able to understand both of us so that I can understand the. The mission that we're really trying to accomplish. I can still remember now my background. As you know, I was a pastor and I have a degree in counseling. I can still remember in my early years when I did counseling, I wasn't any good at it at all. I wore myself out. I wore the people out. It was terrible. And then I had somebody walk into my life and just absolutely turn the light on for me. I was unaware that counseling wasn't my gift. I was aware that I wasn't good at it. I was aware that it was exhausting me. And they walked in my life and they said, john, you should be an equipper, not a counselor. And then they defined the difference that changed my life. That person helped me become self aware. By the way. I don't think there's such a thing as self awareness. I think the awareness that I have that I didn't have before is not because all of a sudden I became brilliant. I think it's because somebody loved me enough to come alongside of me and help me with my blind spot. After all, they are called blind spots. So let's talk briefly about self awareness. Albert Einstein said, once we accept our limits, then we can go beyond them. But we can't go beyond our limitations until we accept them. And let me just say this. We can't accept them until we know them. I think COVID 19, because of the crisis, has brought an awareness to us. One of the things I tell leaders all the time is when difficulty and crisis comes, you're gonna very quickly on your team separate the players from the pretenders. That's what happens. And what Dan Cathy was saying is leaders in a time of crisis, leaders during this time, they need to be self aware and they need to be situationally aware. Because a crisis, we hear people say all the time that crisis will. That crisis will make you. That adversity will really make you stronger. And I always wanna stop saying no, not necessarily makes a lot of people weaker. Makes a lot of people give up. You see, adversity, crisis, it doesn't reveal who you are or I mean, crisis doesn't make you better. Adversity doesn't make you stronger. It just reveals who we are. Again, my friend Ed Bastian said when we were talking about values, Ed said to me, he said, John, when COVID 19 came, it was too late to get your values. You had to have them on the Front end. So when the difficult time came, you could stand, you could be strong. In other words, values on the inside have a way of showing up on the outside. Dan Cathy, that day was teaching me, as I'm passing it on to you, that leadership really is successful when we are self aware of. Of who we are because we have good stuff on the inside that allows us to be situationally aware and meet the needs of the people. Let me tell you a closing story about Dan. We were at my golf club and we were going to have lunch before we went out. And so I took Dan over to really, a nice buffet that they have every noon at lunch. And I said, we can order off the menu or you can have the buffet. He said, oh, this looks good. And so I said, well, go first. I mean, I'm the host. Go first. And so he filled his plate up and went over his table. And so now I'm going through the buffet, you know, filling my plate up. And while they're doing that, I notice that Dad's back over and he's standing beside me. And I looked at him and said, oh, I'm sorry, Dad. I said, here, did you forget something? Because I was going to let him back in and, you know, maybe there was something he wanted to pick up that he didn't get the first time. He said, oh, no, no, no. He said, I'm good, I'm good. He said, I'm just waiting on you. I said, okay, well, okay. So when I filled my plate up, I turned around to just take it, walk it over to the table, and there's Dan with his hands out like this, and I just handed him the plate because that's what he wanted. He turned around, took the plate over and set it there at my part of the table, placed at the table, Pulled my chair out, had me sit down, pushed the chair in, got the napkin, put it on my lap, sat down, and we started to eat. Now, don't miss this. Chick Fil a is known for the culture of serving, of adding value to the customer. My pleasure. But that's not a brand. That's just successful. That makes Chick Fil a be who they are. You see, it's who Dan Cathy is. Don't miss this. In fact, sometimes people come to me, they say, well, help me with branding. And I say, well, I'm probably not really good with that. We got a lot of people, the John Maxwell Company, that are good with that, but it's really not who I am. I'm not that good. But I do Say this to them. Why are you so concerned about branding? Why don't you just get good? Because if you're good, then the brand will really work. But if you're really not good, that brand isn't good enough to pull you through and keep the customer happy. You see, Dan lives what his company advertises. It's in him, it's who he is. It makes him authentic, but it also makes the message of his organization authentic.

Chris Goede (11:27)

Clinic.

John C. Maxwell (11:27)

And I think that's kind of a huge advice for me. I think it's huge advice for you. And very simply, are we living out our message that we advertise that we are. So that day on the golf course, dad and Kathy just simply said, hey, if you want to lead well during this time, be very self aware and be situationally aware. We can do those two things. We'll succeed. You can just bank on it.

Podcast Announcer (11:57)

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Mark Cole (13:06)

Hey, welcome back everybody. There's this quote that I love by Stephen Covey. He says self awareness involves deep personal honesty. It comes from asking and answering hard questions. I know, Chris, if we do this, if we do this application, well, we're going to come up with some questions that people can ask. But I think self awareness starts with questions. In fact, I told you right before we started recording, I said the foundation of self awareness is really asking questions so that you can find the blind spots that John was talking about in the lesson.

Chris Goede (13:37)

Yeah, you've heard people communicate. Whether you're a believer and you go to a church and you hear a message, you go and you listen to a leadership lesson. You've listened to something and then all of a sudden just it Pops off the page at you. Well, you didn't know this before you said that, but when I was listening to John's message when he said, self awareness only happens with other people. Yeah, I know that. And you just articulated really well. And I was like, oh my gosh, that's true. Like I cannot become self aware unless I'm able to have other people around me and ask questions to your point. And I thought, well, there's nothing self about self awareness. It takes the ability to be open to having people around you that will pour into you, that will give you very transparent answers to some of your questions.

Mark Cole (14:25)

Yeah.

Chris Goede (14:26)

And I, I never thought about that. Like, I mean, I, I've been in this world how long we does, and I'm like, that's the simplest statement ever. Oh my gosh, that's so true. I cannot be self aware unless I have people around me speak into my awareness.

Mark Cole (14:36)

Yeah, I love to say it. I love to say this. I love to say you can't become self aware without others. So becoming self aware requires others. But staying self aware.

Chris Goede (14:48)

That's true. That's great.

Mark Cole (14:49)

And, and I'm telling you, I've been given the gift of, of awareness to myself often. But the real discipline comes in staying self aware.

Chris Goede (14:59)

Yeah, that. So it just kind of just. I just need to say that because I felt a little convicted, like maybe I hadn't done my homework the last 30 years working together with you and John. What's really interesting about that is Harvard business review says 95% of people think they are self aware, but really only 10 to 15% are. Wow. So back to your point, does that mean 10 to 15% are the only ones asking questions of other people, Letting other people speak into their areas of growth and opportunity? And I think that's a challenge for all leaders. And Harvard's given us that data to back that up. And so you and I were talking. I think what we want to do today is we want to dive in and say, what does this practically look like? How do we get to a place to where we become more self aware so that we can ultimately impact and lead people differently, but take ourselves on a journey. And so I want to dig in with you a little bit and I want to get really practical around these two things. Around self awareness is kind of that internal dashboard. And then when we look external, which is a place where you get to the point where it's situational awareness, because you got to have both. If you don't have both, then you're a Little bit of trouble because one leads to one thing, one leads to the other. So let's dive in a little bit about that and let's start with this self awareness piece of where you're at now. You have been riding shotgun with John and your leadership growth has continued to go. We know John speaks into your life through self awareness. You ask great questions, but I want you to speak to that. But I also want you to speak to a little bit about also the other executive influences that you have in your life to where you just transparently go, hey, tell me, what am I missing? That's a great question. We always talk about, but where am I at? Where's, where's. To John's point? Where's my blind spots? And you just, you just, you sit back, you take notes and then you learn. How have you gotten to a point to be able to do that, Set your ego aside and let people speak into you so that you become more self aware?

Mark Cole (16:58)

Well, before I hope I have become that. Thank you for saying that. I have. That may be a statement of faith. You hope I'll get there one day. Maybe you've observed a little bit.

Chris Goede (17:09)

No, no, no. There has been a ton of that over the years.

Mark Cole (17:12)

Yes, but, but let me, let me say this. Just two days ago, I was with John. We had just completed a communication, kind of a boot camp thing. It was an incredible experience that we did here at Maxwell Leadership. And by the way, we're going to do it again in 2026 and I may end up invite some people off the podcast to be a part of it. But anyway, we're wrapping it up. John and I are talking about a leadership situation. And he starts telling me something about that situation. And he's going, now, Mark, this is what happened. And this is what you gotta do. And I went, John, I hate to interrupt you, but I've already done all that. I saw that. I saw it and I did that because I know that's what to do. I've watched you do that many times. And he came back and he tried to tell me again. And I went back and he came back. It was one of these back and forth. We don't have many of these. And here's why I don't have many of these. Because he is such a powerful voice and such an astute leader that he's almost like E.F. hutton. For those of you that remember that 21 laws that John used to have irrefutable. That we changed.

Chris Goede (18:14)

That we changed. That's right.

Mark Cole (18:16)

The law of E.F. hutton says when E.F. hutton speaks, when the leader speaks, everybody listens. Well, when John speaks, man, I'm really listening, except in this situation. And I'm going, I already know that. And it became this back and forth, literally saying the exact same thing. We were on an elevator, we went down, became silent in the elevator, went down, got in the car as soon as we got in the car. And I said, John, can you say it again, maybe a different way? And he said, well, I'm trying to say it a different way because this is what I'm really trying to say. But I'm needing to get a common denominator. And you keep telling me what you've already done and I need to show you what you've already done with was not all that you needed to do to get done. And I'm a leader that's very passionate. I'm a leader that's very self confident in decisions that I make. Therefore, sometimes it's hard for me to slow down if I feel like a conclusion's already been made going, I'm going, Yep. And I learned a valuable lesson that John had something to teach me, but I was not self aware that he was trying to teach me another angle at looking at what I had already concluded.

Chris Goede (19:27)

Yeah.

Mark Cole (19:28)

And the reason he needed me to see it from a different angle that would arrive at the same conclusion is so that how I entered that situation would give him an. Give me an exit that I had not figured out yet. And he couldn't get me to see the posture and the mindset that arrived at the conclusion because I was convinced I'd already made the right conclusion, which I had, but not from the right perspective, which he was trying to teach me. And I had this light bulb moment that went because I was so confident in a shared perspective of the conclusion that I was not self aware that I had came into the situation wrong. Therefore, I really hadn't handled the conclusion because it was going to come up again. It was an epiphany for me, Chris, because I thought self awareness was for the conclusion, but it's not always for the conclusion. It's for the context of how you got to the conclusion so you can continue on beyond the conclusion. And I went, and I went, how often do I get so confident in what I have decided that I miss a contextual point that will help me get further down the road? And I, and I said to John the next day, I said, how did I miss it for 15 minutes talking to you? He said, because when you feel like you're right and you have been validated by someone else that you respect that you're right, you get close minded. And I went, oh my gosh, it was a self awareness that I didn't. I get passionate to convince you that I'm right.

Chris Goede (21:04)

Correct.

Mark Cole (21:05)

But when we're saying that I'm right, I remove the desire to continue learning because we've already made the conclusion.

Chris Goede (21:11)

Yeah, we're on to the next thing.

Mark Cole (21:12)

We're on to the next thing. And I'm telling you Chris, it was a little bit of the epiphany of you going, wow, self awareness really comes from others. I'm going, wow, I'm always passionate to come to the conclusion, not passionate on how I arrived at the conclusion, therefore shortchanging what to do because of the conclusion.

Chris Goede (21:30)

Okay, okay, so we're gonna stay here for just a minute. Okay. So the question that you asked John when you got to the car, which I love the story knowing both of you really well with this silent elevator ride down. Exactly, I love it.

Mark Cole (21:42)

Exactly.

Chris Goede (21:42)

And he's just waiting for you, you know, he's sitting over there smiling, I love it. And he's like, Mark's gonna come, come around pretty soon. Gets in the driver's seat. You made a statement that's so true that I want make sure everybody picks up. Mark said earlier, he said, hey, self awareness is the ability, you know, to have other people. And then, and then the second step of that is for you then to internally continually question yourself on are you staying in those lanes? Right. Like so it's a combination of both the self reflection. So let's take this example for everybody because it's a great example. So you had that and I know you. And so that later that evening, the next day, maybe the next three, five days, you are reflecting 100% on that whole situation to dig really deep into it to figure out how do I not do that again? How do I not allow my wonderful leadership, God given traits of passion, decision moving, convincing to not show up in a meeting like that so that I have the right context for all situations. As you reflected on that, like what are some of the takeaways, like what are some of the things you go, next time I'm going to do this differently next time I'm going to. Because I think that's the real application out of this is you had someone speak into the self awareness because you were bold enough to ask the question, what do I need to hear you say to me right now that I'm not. And then you have to reflect on it, which is where the continual self awareness happens. Where, where in your reflection time. Where did you get, what are some things that you put in place? What are some questions? What are some guardrails that you're going to put up to be able in a situation like that to change the way that you show up as a leader on the outside right in front of other people?

Mark Cole (23:26)

So that night, thank you for asking that and I have a relevant. Because it just happened an answer for you. That night I did what I do most every night when I'm reflecting on the day, I go, what was the biggest takeaway of the day? And it was that one. How that the context of the conclusion I'm not self aware of because I just want to get to the conclusion overnight. I thought of three other scenarios that I did that I was doing the exact same thing right now. These are relevant. I called three people by 7am the next morning.

Chris Goede (24:02)

Did you really?

Mark Cole (24:03)

I really did. And I went, let me tell you what I'm doing to you right now. And they went, oh wow. One was Kimberly, my executive partner, one was Stephanie and one was another leader. And I said, let me tell you what I'm doing right now. We're agreeing on something, but we're not, we're still not in sync on what to do with it because we didn't arrive at the, at the thing if we didn't arrive at the conclusion with the same context.

Chris Goede (24:25)

Yeah, we're not in alignment. Right. We talk about you, you talk about this all the time.

Mark Cole (24:28)

We're in agreement, but we're not in alignment.

Chris Goede (24:30)

Which is wrong.

Mark Cole (24:31)

That's exactly.

Chris Goede (24:31)

Yeah, right.

Mark Cole (24:32)

Which is we always teach you don't have to be in agreement, but you have to be in alignment.

Chris Goede (24:35)

Yeah. And that's really.

Mark Cole (24:36)

We're in agreement, but we're not in alignment. And so I'm going, okay, so the first thing I do is I find other. When I get a revelation like that, when I become self aware, I find other areas to where it's true because I'm looking for patterns now. I can eradicate it if I can find patterns. Because here's what I did by calling those people. I got three accountability partners on my new lesson. Like that, Just like that. I got instant credit. Well, number one, I made it right.

Chris Goede (25:00)

Right out of the right thing.

Mark Cole (25:02)

I did the right thing.

Chris Goede (25:03)

Right, you're doing right.

Mark Cole (25:03)

That's exactly right. So that's what, when you get a, when you get a conclusion, become self aware about something you need to go make it right. Whatever you were doing wrong, you need to go make it right. Number two, you need to get accountability or you need to find patterns, you need to find other areas so that you can determine was this a one off or is this a problem in my awareness. Systemic.

Chris Goede (25:26)

Right, Right.

Mark Cole (25:27)

Okay, then get accountability and then pass it on. So that's what we always do with self awareness. We, we take it, oh, wow, this is true. Is this systemic? Oh, it is. Make it right. That gets accountability and then go pay the lesson forward. I did that this morning. This morning I was talking with a leader this morning of recording. I'm talking to a leader and they're buttoning up something that should not be buttoned up. They're not aware that they're trying to get to that conclusion and not aware that they're not getting enough context. So I'm telling the leader and the leader comes back and says, yeah, yeah, no, I've got it, I got it, I got it. And he cites about three books to me that he's read recently that underscores his position. And I went, let me tell you this right here. You need to do less reading and start asking more questions. You're doing more telling to me telling. You're doing more telling me right now of what somebody else's book says than asking me questions of how to get more relevant and effective in this organization I've been working in for 25 years. And I said, stop telling me all the content you're consuming and start asking questions to get content that's relevant. Exact words, I said. And it just shocked them. It was like kind of this moment. And I said, now let me tell you how I can teach you that lesson. This is what John Maxwell did to me two weeks ago or two days ago. And if I need it after 25 years, you need it after the tenure that you've had here. And it was this ability. Now here's what I can tell you. I can come to this podcast and as soon as you're asking me questions, I, I can speak with moral authority. You know why? Somebody gave me insight into myself that I didn't have. I thought about it and found other applications. I went and made it right. I got accountability. I am now paying it forward. So it's more than just learning it now. It's putting it into practice. And now it's multiplying it and sharing it to others.

Chris Goede (27:27)

What I love about this is leadership is about modeling the behavior that we expect inside our organization. And it becomes Contagious, right? Leadership is contagious. And so what you did, it's so funny. I was listening to your story and I'm going, this individual is doing to Mark what Mark did to Josh. Right. So Mark can't be mad at him for acting like Mark. But, but he wants to invest in, develop and pour in and model. And the best way to do that is authenticity. And I think with, with the, I, I think self awareness, I, I think is driven by being authentic to really who you are and, and letting other people speak into that, but then being authentic to say, man, I, let me tell you, I, I messed up and here's what I did. And because the awareness piece is also how other people observe you and, and, and experience you as a leader. And so that's where asking the questions, they can give you that feedback. And so you were able to do that for that leader, which is a brilliant example of how to practically live that out. We could, we could stay here because I got a couple other questions on this, but we'll do this another time. But I want to move to the other side because John brings up really two points on this side and he also mentioned in the podcast about how our capacity as a leader will not grow until we understand this. And really a self awareness comes first. The second one we're going to talk about is situational awareness. And I want to stop for just a minute because if there are leaders of teams, maybe even your family or an organization that are listening to us around the world, I just want to challenge you because your organization, your family, your circle will not outgrow your leadership capability and capacity. It's the law of the lid is what John's talking about here in this context. Oftentimes when I think about this, this is the external radar and you have a gift of reading the room. We may not even talk about this on this podcast before, but we, we know that Mark can read a room, but it's more than just reading a room. Cause that's an innate ability I think you just have. So that's just kind of God given. There are some things that you do that also help bring context to reading the room. Maybe not the situation we were just talking about with John, but there are things that you do, questions you ask yourself to help you notice things that are going on in situations. So that when you walk in, you have a lot of contact, especially with our team or other situations, meetings that you're in with John, you name it. What is that process for you as a leader? How Do I become more situationally aware of every different situation I walk into? Because you do it and you think about the eight streams of influence. Like you're in so many different environments and there's got to be a process and a system that you use as a leader to be able to say, I can situationally become aware of this. Can you unpack that? Can you put words to it for us so that we can then make it our own and become a little bit more situationally aware?

Mark Cole (30:33)

Yeah. One is. There's. Boy, there's three. Three different ways I want to go with this. And we don't have time for all three. There is a contextualization that I have made, a discipline of mine and how I lead and how I read a situation and how I make decisions. It's. It's all about context for me. A lot of times context is more important than content. A lot of times. A lot of times context is more important than conclusions. And oftentimes, as leaders, we want to make a conclusion. We want to make that decision. We got to go. And we don't understand the context, so we make a decision, but we create a wake of destruction behind you because we did not understand context before we made the decision. May have even made the best decision. So I would like. I kind of want to go context, but I'm not going to. I also want to go just this experience. I mean, after a while you realize through experience you just kind of know. And I kind of would like to talk about that because so many of us put pressure on ourselves to say, oh, my goodness, I gotta. I gotta know how to do this. I gotta do this. And I'm going, no, you don't. You just need to do it, learn from it and do it better next time. You're never good the first time. That's how John says that. And so oftentimes we get into a new situation and we go, oh, I gotta know what to do here. No, you don't. You got to do your best and make the situation make you better, not make the situation be the most epiphanous defining moment. Okay, I'm not going to do that one either. What I am going to do is go example. Many times we can read or we can become situationally aware by looking at models around us, by finding people that can help us with that situation. And I found way too many leaders that go, well, it's my decision. I've got to make this decision. The situation I'm trying to get situationally where it should come from. Within. And I think situational awareness comes from without, just like self awareness comes from without. The best model of situational awareness that I know of is I've been traveling around with one of the best leaders in the world for 25 years, 15 side by side, the old WWJD. For those of you that are Christ followers, you know that that means what would Jesus do? Well, there's a saying in my situational leadership, what would John do? Because I've been watching leadership from one of the most, the best thinking leaders in the world. And so there's times that I sit in a situation and I go, what would John do right here? How would John handle this if John was 20 years younger? If John was to walk into this situation right now, what would he do? And giving myself the permission to put myself in someone else's shoes helps me situationally all the time. Chris. I remember when John asked me, Mr. Leading of a non profit, no business experience to run his then three companies. And I'm going run companies. That's a global brand, we're doing global work. At the time I went and asked the same seven questions of global leaders to ask situational leadership. I wouldn't ask others. And for a while I did what Ed told me, I did what Dan told me, I did what Cheryl told me. I did these things that these people told me that they did in their situation and how I read the situation was just superimposing someone else's shoes on my feet. And I walked like they walked. And too often when we're the leader, we become so arrogant, so prideful, so something that we don't consider. There are options around us that are models and examples of how we become situational leaders. And so what I would tell all of us as we enter in the new year, find some mentors in your life, some people that have traveled a road that you're just starting out on and become a situational leader by modeling someone else's leadership in your situation. Because that ability, Chris, to lean and draw from keeps a humility that I think every leader has to have. Because let me tell you this, the last thing I'll say on situational leadership.

Chris Goede (34:58)

For right now, right now, because I got another question for you just real quick. Yeah.

Mark Cole (35:03)

What I would tell you is in situational leadership, the pressure we put on ourselves to get it right, to make sure that we're doing it, is an undue expectation. And that pressure oftentimes drives a wrong decision. The other way I handle situational leadership is I ask people like you people, that has been given me by a gift. I can't even imagine getting to lead beside you the last eight years. What am I missing? What am I missing right here as I'm getting ready to make the decision. So I pause a moment in any situation and I ask somebody else, what am I missing? If I make this decision like this.

Chris Goede (35:48)

And you do it not only in one on one, but you do it in team settings, which is great. You're again modeling this for, for the team. So I love it. The first one is you're putting yourself in other shoes that you trust. Second one is asking the question often, what am I missing? Let me add a third one to you that I just thought about. One of the things that you do as a leader that I think helps with situational awareness is instant feedback on situations that we've been in together. So it's more than what am I missing? It's hey, give me feedback on that meeting really quick.

Mark Cole (36:23)

Yeah.

Chris Goede (36:23)

Hey, what did you think right here. Because what you're doing is you are helping yourself to grow for future situational awareness by asking those around you that were in that same meeting for feedback to give you. Let's circle this all the way back to the illustration and then I'll let you comment and wrap it up with John, which is to give you additional context. I wrote this down self awareness only. So let's go back to that situation when you were already addressed that situation, right? You had self awareness. You're like, yeah, no, this is Mark, this is how I lead. I'm authentic. So situation awareness only. I mean, self awareness only is where you were authentic. But it was ineffective. You were effective in the moment. But John's like, you don't see big boy how far I see out. Right? Which he talks about. And so really long term wasn't. But if you were situational awareness only, you would have a strategic mindset, but it would probably be ineffective or unsafe. And that's why this is so simple. But deep in being able to have both in that situation. So talk about the importance of that feedback you get and then kind of wrap us up.

Mark Cole (37:36)

Yeah. So when I have found my best thinking is done by others, John has said that. And that's true for me for sure. I have found the best way to lead is with a multi dimensional perspective, from a diverse perspective, from different levels of leadership and responsibility, of experience, of expertise. And so when you go in and you allow people to collaborate with you in any situation, even the fact that you're being humble enough to do that, because every leader feels a responsibility to make the decision is a very attractive thing to the people. But then when you invite them in, the magic of their creativity, the magic of their buy in to the decision you make. The payoff of doing that, in my mind makes it a no brainer. I can't believe more leaders don't understand they will have more support post a decision if they would allow people to help them make the decision. That is like ABCs, but many times, including yours truly, leaders do not slow down and let people speak into the situation because we put a real expectation on ourselves. It's a real one that we have to make decisions. People are waiting for us to make decisions and sure they are, but they're not waiting for you to make it on your own. They're actually wanting to be invited into the decision making process and the buy in post will, will blow you away. We had one of our podcast listeners, I love this question said, how do I navigate a work environment that isn't in line with my purpose and calling? What I hope to do in this coming year, what I hope to do is to really dig into that in multiple podcasts. I have spent way more days than I want to consider of my life working on things that did not seem to fit me and my calling and my purpose. I can remember selling something that I didn't believe was helping people. I thought it was kind of being challenged, but yet it was an expectation of mine. And I remember having to go into myself podcast family and saying, okay, this is not about what I do, this is about who I am and I'm going to bring who I am to this situation so that who I am begins to influence what we do. And I did. And I'll tell you, when I changed that perspective within 30 days, we dropped that product and never sold it again. But we didn't drop it because I refused. This is not my calling, this is not what I want to do. I made a complete flip and every conversation I had with the decision makers at that time began to be this is what this makes me feel like when we're talking about this product. This is how it feels like I'm compromising a little bit. And when I began to do that, they began to see and I influenced the situation with who I was really designed to be. Because my dear podcast listener, my family don't ever allow what you do to define you and what you're called to do. Always let what you're called to do define you. And then therefore influence what you do. Thanks for asking that question. Thanks for listening. Let's make 2026 a great year together because everyone deserves to be led well.

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