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[00:00]
Empower Advertiser
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[00:26]
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[00:56]
Moderator
As you just heard from those incredible questions, we are going to be focusing this conversation and technology in education. And to have this conversation, I want to welcome Governor Spencer Cox of Utah. Let's have a big round of applause for him and Democratic Governor Jared Polis of Colorado. Thank you both so much for being here for this conversation. We're really excited about it. Governor Polis, I have to start with you because U.S. news and World Report found that Colorado was ranked number one in education. So congratulations to you for that. And this has really been a priority for you. So talk to us a little bit about how you got to number one. But what challenges remain that you want to tackle?
[01:49]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah. And as you know, during my time as NGA chair, we worked on let's get preparing all Americans for success before Spencer jumps in. Utah was number one overall. But on education, we did beat Utah.
[02:02]
Governor Spencer Cox
You did. I think we were number two.
[02:03]
Governor Jared Polis
There you go. And we really attribute it to six things we're doing in Colorado. One is we start earlier. When I ran for governor, we only had half day kindergarten. Parents had to pay for full day. We did full day kindergarten and now universal preschool. It moved us from 28th to third in preschool enrollment. 73% of parents do preschool. Number two, we expanded our leadership on school choice in Colorado. Over 270 charter schools were second for public charter school enrollment. And over 40% of the students in Colorado go to a public school of their choice. 40%. And I argue that makes neighborhood schools stronger because guess what? Neighborhood schools are Stronger when the kids actually want to be there and the parents actually want them to be there. So we really embrace that and expanded that. We've made historic investments in K12. We ended the underfunding of our schools and funded them at constitutional levels. We implemented a new school finance formula, better directs resources to where they're needed. We focused on measurable outcomes and data, high quality curriculum. We, we held up and lifted up bright spots. Schools that exceeded expectations had very high levels of math and reading. And we, we said, how can other schools implement some of those same practices? Here's another important one that often goes underrated. We really recognize that learning doesn't end at 3pm or middle of May when the school year ends. So we invested in after school programming for kids and helping kids afford summer programming. That's also one of the things I'm most excited about from the SGO tax credit that's coming online is the ability to fund quality after school programs and summer opportunities for kids who otherwise wouldn't afford it. And finally, we made higher education more relevant, accessible and affordable, including for families under $90,000, free community college, many more high school students getting dual and concurrent enrollment credit and even associate's degrees concurrent with their graduation credentials and meaningful occupational qualifications that allow people to earn a good job. So those are really the six things that we've done to get where we are and we certainly ain't done. We're doubling down on all of those.
[04:03]
Moderator
Well, we want to tease all of that out throughout the conversation. Governor Cox, as Governor Polis just said, you are the number one state, but education is an area where you are still working. What do you see as the biggest challenges? Where are you putting your focus right now?
[04:20]
Governor Spencer Cox
Well, I want to thank, I want to thank you for doing this. Thanks first of all. And I want to give a shout out to the earlier panel. Certainly better hair. I think we improved the personality a little bit in this panel, but it's all good. But more than anything, just I wish we could inject what you saw there into the veins of America.
[04:40]
Moderator
Yes.
[04:40]
Governor Spencer Cox
Because if people don't see this very often and it matters. So this competition, who's number one in education? Who's number two? What are we doing? How are we improving? We're learning lessons from each other. To your question, one of the things, and I would just say ditto to everything that Governor Polis mentioned, the great things that he's working on. We're really concerned about literacy in this country today. Incredible article recently in the Atlantic. There's Been a lot of talk about this that we're in kind of a post literate society. What does that mean? Reading scores across the country have been dropping, especially since social media and smartphones became ubiquitous with our kids. And I'm very lucky to be married to a teacher, Abby, sir, with me, a special education teacher. And this has been a true focus of our administration. And so on top of the things that you've already heard about, we're launching one of the biggest literacy initiatives in the country right now. That's our big focus over the next year. We know how to make kids read. Now the science of reading is real. And I hate to bring everything back to federalism, but we really learned that lesson thanks to one of our fellow states, Mississippi, who did some incredible things and moved from like 49th in literacy rates, third grade reading to top 10, which has never happened in our country. And so we all looked at that and said, okay, what are they doing that we're not? We passed two big bills around literacy, basically adopting the Mississippi model and we got some funding for reading coaches. Now again, kids reading at grade level and third grade is a policy choice. We know that with the right resources, 98%, 95 to 98%, kids can learn to read at third grade. Most of our states are not anywhere close to that. We're 50 to 70% somewhere around there. We can all do better. And that's one of our major focuses. Because everything else, if you can read at grade level at third grade, it turns out all the other metrics click into place, you're much more likely because that's when you stop reading to or learning to read and start reading to learn. So if you can do that, you're going to graduate from high school, you're probably going to have a good job. The American dream unlocks if you can read a grade level by third grader.
[07:04]
Moderator
And Governor Polis pick up on that point. You're talking about some of the investments that you made in literacy in after school programs. We are living in a world though, in which resources are in some ways challenged right now. How do you decide where to make the investments? Where do you see the biggest return on investments when it comes to education?
[07:26]
Governor Jared Polis
So we aligned our after school investment towards academic progress in areas so it's really aligned with math and literacy and particularly focused on students that are not achieving at grade level. So we know that it's, we want everything that can occur during the school day to occur. But we know that for some to catch up, they need that extra Time. And that's really. Will really deploy that. It's both after school programs at the school site itself. Also partnered with Boys and Girls Club with a dedicated funding stream for community centers and meaningful activities that again, are aligned with learning and achievement. This is not for childcare. It has to directly align with the academic progress that the kids need to make.
[08:06]
Moderator
Governor Cox, same question for you. Where are you finding. You talked about the importance of literacy. Where else are you investing and finding the greatest return?
[08:15]
Governor Jared Polis
Can I just add one more? We also. Did we also now have breakfast and lunch for every child in our schools, which is. Nutrition is a big. Nutrition is a big part of it. It's really hard to learn if you're hungry. Right. It's hard to do anything well if you're hungry. And you know, even if you have enough food, it's not always the right food. And so how do we make sure that kids get not just a full belly, but the healthy nutrition they need for successful intellectual and physical development? And we do that now by having universal breakfast and lunch for everybody. Also makes it easier administratively. Save school districts money, eliminates any stigma associated with it. For those who want it, it's there.
[08:48]
Moderator
I'm glad you brought that up because it is such a critical part of learning. You have to have a full belly in order to learn, in order to focus. The summer months become more challenging. Is that something that you're focused on?
[09:01]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah, we're excited. We were one of the first states to embrace summer ebt, which continues that through the summer months. We do have schools, especially in high risk areas, that continue direct service. Summer EBT has been a big step forward for families and obviously for kids that are enrolled in summer programs, there's additional nutritional resources. But absolutely, nutrition as a whole is an area that we as a society need to do better in because there's direct developments between nutrition and brain development. And it's absolutely important that we don't shy away from that, that we tackle that head on.
[09:30]
Moderator
Governor Cox, how do you assure that kids are getting the nutrition that they need? And again, where do you find the greatest return on investments when it comes to education?
[09:40]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yes, so. So we've had some investments again, helping kids, lower income kids be able to. We're paying for their school lunches, their breakfast, those types of things which are important. We call those especially our Title 1 schools. Sometimes we call them Maslow schools. It is, you know, Maslow's hierarchy of needs. If you're hungry, learning falls way down. Right. That's. That's not important to you. And so we, we're, we're working with private organizations as well to help fund that which we think is really important because there are limited resources. I will tell you though that the thing I'm most proud of when it comes to investments and the way we've changed things since I took office, there are two, but the, the most important one is investing in our teachers. I always say, look, if you give me two identical students, everything is the same about them. Their brain power, you know, their parental situation, everything else. And you let me choose the teacher and I let you choose everything else. I will win every single time. I just believe that the teacher is the most important part of that entire education system. You've seen it. You all know this. I mean, our kids in high school, we all knew who the good teachers were, who the bad teachers were. The kids knew it, the teachers knew it. Everyone knew that. And if you had the right teacher, they can make even the kid that struggles the most become the, the best possible student. And so we, we decided that we were going to invest in our teachers and we gave our teachers the, the largest raise in our state's history. We went from, you know, 35th, 36th in the nation for teacher pay up to top 10 now number one in the, in the region. And we're, we're really proud of that. It's, it's helping us retain the best teachers, which, which is really important. We were losing far too many of our great teachers and attract new teachers who maybe couldn't, wanted to be a teacher but couldn't afford to do it, so they went somewhere else. Now we're getting the very best and, and that's going to help kids for generations.
[11:26]
Moderator
Governor Polis, let's go back to your let's get ready initiative. You did start this when you were chair of the National Governors Association. Flesh that out a little bit because you worked with the other governors on that as well. How have you pushed that forward? And Governor Cox, I'd love for you to weigh in as well.
[11:45]
Governor Jared Polis
So first of all, the highlight, you know, let's get ready. It's let's get ready at the individual level for student success. But the aggregate of student success is economic success for a state and for our country. And it's really about let's superpower prosperity of our states of the nation. We have now launched through nga, a pilot project with eight states. Colorado is one of them, built on let's get ready to have a public facing dashboard showing the kinds of outcomes and Results, including of course, you know, people focus on test scores. But we always say test scores are part of it. Of course you want to show that. But the other outcomes of success and a public facing dashboard so that we can really be accountable for these metrics and moving forward. So this will be launching this fall. We're really going to have some cutting edge ways of longitudinal tracking and results reporting. It'll provide an exciting basis to make sure that we as states, the eight states that are participating, and hopefully more going forward will really up the bar on student achievement and success.
[12:40]
Moderator
Governor Cox?
[12:40]
Governor Spencer Cox
Well, we were really proud to support Governor Polis in his initiative because it's critical. We talked about the money piece of this and so often we think if we just throw more money at it, we'll get a better outcome. And that's just not that simple. Not true, right? I mean, again, Mississippi versus California are two really good arguments. You know, they spend less per capita, by far, California spending more. But the reading scores went the opposite way because you've got to spend it in the right ways. So these, these measurements and metrics and accountability pieces that Governor Polis is focus on is really important. We're learning and implementing those as well. One of the other things that we focused on, and the last panel already took it, so I'm not going to do it. But the apprenticeship piece of this. We've made a mistake as a country over the past 40 years, we separated work from education to our detriment. We built this model where education is the thing you do for the first 20 plus years of your life and then work is what you do afterwards. The modern economy does not support that. Work and education have to go together. We need lifelong learners, which means we have to extend education later into work. I'm sure we'll talk about that with AI and all the changes that are coming. And we need lifelong workers. We need to move work way up on the scale. We need kids involved at a much earlier age. We also have been over to Switzerland with our friends. Stadler Rail, which is a major Swiss train company, has their North American headquarters in Utah. They've helped us with this. We're doing much more on the apprenticeship side and that's going to be good for us. It's not often I say that Europe does something better than the United States, but that's the one thing that model is better for our kids. And this idea that every kid needs to get a bachelor's degree is not good for our kids. It's not good for our education. System. Some do, some don't. And we shouldn't have the stigma that I hate it when I ask a parent, hey, what's your kid doing? They're just graduating from high school and they kind of get embarrassed. And they're like, well, they're going to a trade or tech college instead of the University of Utah. I'm like, you should brag about that. The best jobs right now are plumbers, our electricians. We desperately need these. And you should never be embarrassed. You should be celebrating that.
[15:01]
Governor Jared Polis
There should be no stigma. We should celebrate all routes to success. There's a second thing Europe does better, Spencer, I'm sure you'll agree, and that's foreign language instruction.
[15:09]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah.
[15:09]
Governor Jared Polis
So.
[15:10]
Governor Spencer Cox
Well, I'll disagree because I get to brag about Utah, but go ahead.
[15:13]
Governor Jared Polis
In, in, in America, we generally do this at the high school level. In Europe, they generally are fluent in a second language by the time they're done with fifth grade. A simple matter of brain science. We should. It's wasted hours in many cases in high school. I mean, how many friends have you said, oh, do you speak any foreign language? Well, I took, you know, French or Spanish in high school for three years, but I'll speak a word of it. That's like a very common thing in this country. It's a waste of time. You should. And obviously some kids, you can and learn like, foreign languages in adult in high school. But for goodness sakes, we have dual immersion French and Spanish and German and Russian and Chinese schools. Every kid is fluent in the language by fifth grade. That's what we should do. And if you want to start a third language in high school or develop your academic proficiency in your second language, that's when you do it. But we really need to shift towards that European model of preparing kids with a second language during elementary school.
[16:01]
Governor Spencer Cox
And we did that 21 years ago in Utah. We have the largest dual immersion program in the country in those, in those major languages. Almost every kid who wants to in first grade gets all the way from
[16:13]
Governor Jared Polis
first grade to high school a half
[16:15]
Governor Spencer Cox
day of instruction in the foreign language. So half in English, the other half in Spanish, French, Chinese, German.
[16:22]
Governor Jared Polis
And you lead the country in that.
[16:23]
Governor Spencer Cox
And, and those teachers can't be just Americans who speak the language. They're, they're actually, that has to be their native language, and it's incredible. They're fluent by middle school, and it makes a huge difference.
[16:35]
Moderator
I'm so glad that you're bringing up both of these issues, Governor Polis. Part of what you're Describing, though, is a little bit of a paradigm shift in how we as society think about education, both when it comes to apprenticeships and when it comes to language. So how do you expand this beyond Colorado, beyond Utah, so that the entire country thinks about apprenticeships as something to be valued and pursued and celebrated? And let's get our kids in foreign language programs starting in first grade.
[17:05]
Governor Jared Polis
And that's what exciting is. What's exciting is a lot of these, these opportunities exist. Right. Spencer talks about kids spending half their day in foreign language. We, we have that in Colorado in, in not just Spanish, but German and French, and we have Russian and, and, and Chinese. But they're not universal. They're not everybody. For most of the kids in, in, in Colorado even, and certainly across the country, they are getting, you know, maybe, maybe one hour of nominal foreign language exposure or cult a kid, and they don't begin the earnest work of that till high school. Apprenticeships. We've scaled them up several times. We now have a tax credit that incentivizes companies to get at the table because we know there's a little bit of out of pocket cost those first couple of years. They recognize the benefit, it sells itself. But how do we get them to the table? So we've gotten advanced tech and advanced manufacturing companies at the table. We've modeled our behavior as a state. We're taking on apprentices in our agencies so that high schoolers are able to learn the work that the state does in different areas. But again, not every student encounters it. Far from universal. So it's really a matter of how we share what works in education, right? From from workforce experience to foreign language to math to reading. And then what can sometimes be even harder in education is change what doesn't work. So expand and replicate what works. And when something isn't working, have the moral courage to get in and end it or change it.
[18:26]
Moderator
So a big part of. And we talked about this in the first panel of our educational system right now, one of the hardest questions is how to grapple with how to incorporate AI and social media, quite frankly. So I want to tackle both of them. I'm a mom of two. I have little kids, but I spend a lot of time thinking about this. Governor Cox, how can schools both integrate AI so that our young people are learning lessons so that they can be competitive when they are in the workforce and at the same time not suffering the downside, the negative aspects of AI?
[19:05]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, so this is something that we've, we've talked a lot about, thought a lot about sometimes he and I have argued about this, but we care deeply about our kids. I know we all want the best for our children and I just think that the data, the research now is just overwhelmingly compelling that we have over indexed on screens that is not good for our kids. In fact it's terrible for their mental health. Anxiety, depression, self harm skyrocketed in 2012. I mean all of the bad stuff as you go back started around 2012 and that's when social media, smartphones, we started giving them to our kids way too early. Not just that, but just the technology in the classroom, one to one devices giving our kids that. I mean, you know we got kids in first grade that are supposed to be learning on a Chromebook and they're, you know, somehow they're, they're playing Minecraft like this is, this is happening all across the country. So we were the first state to take action to hold social media accountable, social media companies accountable. Working to get phones out of the classroom. Now many states, the majority of states have now gotten cell phones out of the classroom. Bell to bell, we know is the better plan. Most, again many of states have been able to do that. That's really important when it comes to AI. I think governor Stitt hit the nail on the head. He said it earlier and this is, this is where our focus is too. Having AI in the classroom for kids is not good all of the time. Now they need to learn how to use these tools. And I actually think that going back to an older model of having a computer lab, something where once a day or a few times a week where you go in and you focus on those tools and then you go back out and you start learning again the old fashioned way. Because we know this, that again if you learn the same thing on a screen versus having to write it out or read it the old fashioned way, you don't retain the same way. You retain much better the old way. So doing that, making sure they learn the tools. But here's where it does matter. AI has the ability to help our teachers have a real leap forward and they should have those tools, that individualized learning piece. It's impossible for a teacher to really dive in and grade 30 papers in an evening. It just doesn't work that way. But AI can really help with that and get the feedback that they need and enhance the ability of our teachers. So that's how we're looking at it. Let's not be afraid of it. Let's use it in the right ways. Let's make sure. All of our kids know how to use these tools because they're going to need to. But let's make sure that the computers are working for us and not the other way around.
[21:42]
Moderator
How do you see it and how are you addressing these challenges? And as a computer lab where you have a designated period every day, the right way to address this.
[21:52]
Governor Jared Polis
You know, this is the, the biggest discussion in tables around this country. How AI is affecting every sector. Right. Architects are saying, how's it affecting architecture? Accountants are saying, you're probably, how's it affecting reporting? Right. I mean, it's. So education is no different. How's it affecting education? Right. And, and just like all those other fields, there's excitement right. At the same time as apprehension. So excitement. Oh, my gosh. I can tailor a lesson to my students individual learning style. I can say I'm a visual learner. Can you prepare this lesson for me? Can you learn AI? I mean, it's for learners of all ages, not just students. The apprehension piece, how do we make sure there's not cheating, shortcuts, that you develop a deep understanding of things? So these are things that are being wrestled with in every profession there is. Right. Even in politics. Right. But education is no different. And I think it's very important that we devote that thought power to both the opportunities and the shortfalls that exist in a dynamic basis with regards to the utilization of AI.
[22:50]
Moderator
Is there a risk in overregulation? I spoke with someone in the AI field who said, look, it has the capacity to cure cancer and at the same time has the capacity to do incredible harm. How do you see the regulations more broadly?
[23:08]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah, I mean, I think that we need to have a light touch with regard to regulation, and we need to do it at a national level. And that's, that's almost the more important thing. If you do it at the state level, you have 50 different systems. That's a very good way of locking incumbents in and preventing any new startup or new consumer benefit from coming online. The big companies of the world that are involved with AI will be able to do 50 state compliance, but in many ways it entrenches them. So whatever protections you have, and I think we need baseline protections, we need to make sure we do that as a country. So I really think it falls upon Congress to do, to do a reasonable thing to protect the security and safety of the American people.
[23:43]
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[24:10]
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[24:39]
Carl's Jr. Advertiser
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[25:10]
Moderator
Governor Cox, I want you to weigh in. And we have talked before when we were focused on a segment on mental health on Meet the Press about the impact of social media on mental health, on our kids, on their education, their capacity to learn. Governor Cox, talk a little bit about age based, age based social media bans is what I'm trying to say. You favor them. Where's the cutoff though?
[25:39]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, so I do favor them. And in lieu of those things happening, you know, we passed some other laws as well that there should be age based gating and kids accounts. They should be very different. We become way too overprotective in the real world and way too under protective in the virtual world and it's causing serious harm. The thing we passed, I mean that law is on hold right now as lawsuits are moving forward, unfortunately. But these companies who are destroying our kids, they knew about it from leaks we've seen meta others especially knew what they were doing. They knew the harm they were causing and they hid it from us. Just like the tobacco companies did in the 50s and 60s, just like the opioid companies did in the 90s and the early 2000s. It's the same playbook with these guys and they're gonna sue and continue to harm our kids. All we're saying is turn off the most addictive features. If we're allow that, you don't need the endless scrolling, you don't need the constant notifications that are keeping our kids up all night. And the algorithms to me are the worst part of all of this. The algorithms, we've seen them, they're proprietary. Look, I don't think social media companies should be held accountable for what other people post, for what people put on those platforms. But if your algorithm is feeding that garbage to my kid, then you should be responsible for that. And fortunately courts are starting to hold them accountable for that. And we're seeing these verdicts that are, that are huge and there's going to be more of them and I welcome them until they get their act together and start and start again treating kids the way we should be able to protect our kids. That's going to happen. So yes, I think there's an opportunity for us. Parents should have much more control over what their kids do and see on these platforms. We've got to get back to just a rational, common sense approach.
[27:33]
Governor Jared Polis
So this is an area Spencer and I have some disagreements. I agree with the last piece. He said parents should have more. I favor more parent centric approach, family centric approach than the government centric approach because there's different parenting styles. There's not one that's more valid than others. Some parents let their nine year old kid go to the playground three blocks away by themselves. Others want to watch them every step of the way. Same with online media. It's there for parental control, but it's hard to use and there's too many ways around it. So a focus on that rather than the government saying how you should parent your kid well.
[28:02]
Moderator
And to take that one step further, how important is it that parents are working together? Because if one family says you can't have social media until you're 16, but your child's best friend is on the phone and on social media and your kid's going to their house, it doesn't really have an impact. I mean, does it need to be a broader community almost?
[28:24]
Governor Jared Polis
It's just like anything else. What movie is your kid watching at a friend's house? Are they letting them go at their on their bike at night with no lights? I mean, you know, it's all in that realm of parenting, right? And obviously depending on the age of your Kid parents have some say and should know whose house they're at and what they're doing when they're 6 years old, 10 years old.
[28:44]
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[29:10]
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[30:03]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah.
[30:04]
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[30:34]
Governor Jared Polis
Realistically, when they're 15, 16, they're probably going to be at someone's house sometime and the parent might know it. But it depends on your parenting style. So again, I put this in the realm of parents and family, not government. And social media is just one of those many things that is both a risk and has positive factors. Just like being on a bike or you know, going to the store alone or what movies they're watching.
[30:53]
Moderator
Governor Cox, how big of a role? I mean, obviously parents play a huge role, but how do you see that balance?
[30:58]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, no, no, look, parenting is critical to all of this and we have a collective action problem. And again, there are lots of things that we don't let kids do. We don't let them smoke, we don't let them drink until a certain age. And what we know is that social media is having the same impacts, maybe worse as some of those addictive drugs and addictive. So, yeah, turn off all the addictive features and then let parents be able to parent. I have no problem with that. I don't think that every parent or I don't think the government should decide when kids get phones, how kids communicate with their parents, how kids communicate with their friends. Again, I have no problem with that. That's not what we're talking about. We're talking about something that is much more insidious than this. And if parents want to enable all those features and make that happen. But that's not what.
[31:46]
Governor Jared Polis
There's one big difference. There's no benefit to cigarettes and alcohol. There absolutely are benefits, no matter how you weigh them, for social media participation. I mean, my son, 14, he likes the game of Go. That's a pretty obscure game. More obscure than chess. He likes it. He's unlikely to find people at a school that do that. He finds people online, they play Go. So, I mean, it's a little different than these other cities. It's not that it's without its risk, but it also has its benefits to be able to reach out to communities across the country and across the world.
[32:13]
Moderator
Well, you take me to my final question perfectly, which is I want you both to speak personally. Now, you are both dads. Governor Cox, how does being a father impact how you approach education in the state of Utah?
[32:29]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, well, look, it's everything, right? And it's not just education. You asked the last panel what surprised them the most about their job. And I will tell you that one of the things that surprised me most is I get to be in a room full of just some of the very best people on earth. And I hate today that we've become so cynical of government and politics because there are some bad actors out there. But we assume that everyone's on the take, everybody's making decisions for personal gain. That that is not true. As I look around this room, Republican, Democrat, I don't care what that, what that R or D is after, their name. We all got into these jobs because we have kids and because we care about our families and because we want the best for the next generation. This 250 year anniversary that we're celebrating, the American dream, we're doing this because we Love our kids and our grandkids and we want them to be better off than we are today. And it's a huge sacrifice and I'm so proud. We have a lot of these guys who aren't going to be with us. After six months, they're termed out, they're not running again and the nation's gonna miss them. The very best are here.
[33:39]
Moderator
Governor Polis.
[33:40]
Governor Jared Polis
Well, our daughter's 12 and she was watching a lot of cooking videos on Pinterest, these short little by cooking influencers. And so we took that interest and said, okay, Cora, why don't we put you in charge of making dinner for the family one day a week. And so she does that. Now she's making dinner for the family one day week. So I mean, it's like you find their interest. It's access to information. Our son, I mentioned he likes go. He also studies very obscure things like medieval Japanese history and we've supported that. He does tea ceremony work. He turned one little room in our house into a tea ceremony room and he puts on his kimono and he presents tea ceremonies to us. And he wouldn't have found out about that stuff if it wasn't for, you know, access to online and social media. And I totally get that other kids, and perhaps our kids can be exposed to dangers too. So it's just like a piece of the world, right? It has vast potential to unlock amazing things. And it's great that my daughter is at 12, is responsible for our family dinners once a week. And at the same time, parents should be fully cognizant of the risk of their daughter, of their son or daughter walking down the street to 711 and hanging out there or of what they're doing online. I mean, the world is full of both opportunities and risks. And you know what? They're going to need to to deal with that as adults and they need to practice as kids.
[34:51]
Moderator
All right, Governor Polis, Governor Cox, you have given parents like myself, educators, other governors, all of us, so much to think about. So informational. Thank you so very much.
[35:01]
Governor Spencer Cox
Much.
[35:02]
Moderator
Thank you so much.
[35:05]
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Summary7 min read

Podcast Summary: Meet the Press (August 2, 2026)

Episode: Full Panel: Govs. Jared Polis & Spencer Cox on Education and Technology
Host: NBC News / Moderator Kristen Welker
Guests: Governor Jared Polis (D-Colorado), Governor Spencer Cox (R-Utah)

Episode Overview

This episode of Meet the Press features an in-depth panel conversation with Governors Jared Polis of Colorado and Spencer Cox of Utah, focusing on contemporary challenges and innovations in American education. The discussion highlights best practices from the top-ranked states, evolving societal expectations, and the intersection of technology, particularly AI and social media, with learning. Both governors reflect on personal experiences as fathers and policymakers, offering candid, bipartisan perspectives.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Education Successes and Priorities in Colorado and Utah

Colorado’s Progress (Governor Polis):

Ranked number one in education for 2026 (01:00).
Six Key Factors for Success:
- Early start: Universal full-day kindergarten and preschool; preschool enrollment jumped from 28th to 3rd place.
- School choice: Second in charter school enrollment; 40% of students attend a school of their choice, strengthening neighborhood schools.
- Increased K-12 funding: Ended underfunding, implemented a school finance formula for more equitable resource distribution.
- Data-driven outcomes and high-quality curriculum: Focus on measurable results and scaling successful practices.
- Afterschool and summer programs: Expanded access via tax credits and funding to supplement learning outside school hours.
- Affordability and relevance in higher education: Free community college for families under $90K, dual enrollment, and meaningful occupational certifications.
Quote:
"Learning doesn't end at 3pm or middle of May when the school year ends. We invested in after school programming … helping kids afford summer programming." — Jared Polis (03:39)

Utah’s Focus (Governor Cox):

Literacy is a central concern given national declines (04:40).
Launching a state-leading literacy initiative modeled on successful approaches from Mississippi, aiming for third-grade reading proficiency.
Support for literacy as a foundation for all other student outcomes (06:32).
Quote:
"If you can read at grade level at third grade, it turns out all the other metrics click into place … The American dream unlocks." — Spencer Cox (06:43)

2. Investment Strategies and Returns in Education

Aligning Investments with Outcomes:

Both states target resources for interventions with the highest yield—such as afterschool programs tied to academic metrics and providing free meals to remove learning barriers (07:25, 08:14).
Nutrition recognized as integral for cognitive development (08:14-09:29).
Colorado: Universal breakfast and lunch; summer EBT for food security (09:00).
Utah: Focus on supporting "Maslow schools" (Title I) and partnering with private organizations to meet basic needs; heavy investment into raising teacher pay to top-10 nationally (09:39-11:26).
Quote:
"If you let me choose the teacher and I let you choose everything else, I will win every single time … the teacher is the most important part." — Spencer Cox (10:32)

3. Broader Educational Reform: Accountability, Apprenticeships, and Language

Let’s Get Ready Initiative (Polis):

Piloting a public-facing dashboard for eight states to track educational outcomes beyond test scores (11:44).
Promotes transparency, accountability, and data-driven reforms (12:39).

Rethinking Learning Pathways:

Both governors stress the need to destigmatize alternatives to four-year degrees, elevating technical training and apprenticeships (13:01-14:47).
Praise for the Swiss apprenticeship model, which integrates work and education.
Quote:
"Every kid needs to get a bachelor's degree is not good for our kids … Best jobs right now are plumbers, electricians. We desperately need these." — Spencer Cox (14:20)

Language Instruction:

Polis: Push to model European systems—fluency in second language by 5th grade (15:13).
Cox: Utah leads the nation with dual immersion programs starting in first grade, employing native speakers (16:01).
Both advocate starting foreign language early and removing high school “wasted hours” paradigm.
Quote:
"You should never be embarrassed. You should be celebrating that." — Spencer Cox (14:29)

4. The Role of Technology: AI, Social Media, and Screen Time

Integrating AI and Mitigating Harm:

Balancing Innovation and Well-being:
- Cox critiques excessive screen/device use in classrooms, tying it to declining literacy and mental health trends since 2012 (19:04).
- Advocacy for structured technology use (computer labs) rather than constant screen exposure. Emphasizes AI’s positive role in supporting teachers but warns against overuse for students (19:04-21:42).
- Quote:
  "We have over indexed on screens … It's terrible for their mental health. Anxiety, depression, self harm skyrocketed in 2012 … Let's use [AI] in the right ways." — Spencer Cox (19:10, 21:34)
AI Policy Approach (Polis):
- Opportunity and risk: Tailoring lessons and improving accessibility vs. potential for shortcutting learning (21:51).
- Cautions against fragmented overregulation—prefer national oversight with a light touch to avoid calcifying industry and stifling innovation (23:07-23:43).
- Quote:
  "If you do it at the state level, you have 50 different systems … it entrenches them. It falls upon Congress to do … a reasonable thing to protect safety." — Jared Polis (23:07)

5. Social Media and Student Mental Health

Policy Debate: Regulation vs. Parental Control

Cox supports age gates, turning off addictive features, and holding companies accountable for algorithmic harm. Compares tech companies’ tactics to tobacco and opioid industries, citing recent lawsuits (25:39-27:32).
Quote:
"We’ve become way too overprotective in the real world and way too under protective in the virtual world and it’s causing serious harm." — Spencer Cox (25:47)
Polis leans toward empowering parents to control access and moderation, recognizing diversity in family approaches and risks/benefits (27:32-30:33).
Quote:
"I favor more parent centric approach, family centric approach than the government centric approach … it's there for parental control, but it's hard to use." — Jared Polis (27:32)
Acknowledged the collective action problem for parents and the reality that some regulation is needed—as with alcohol and tobacco—but also that online communities can be positive and unique (30:58-31:45).
Quote:
"There's no benefit to cigarettes and alcohol. There absolutely are benefits … for social media participation … It’s not that it’s without its risk, but it also has its benefits." — Jared Polis (31:45)

6. Personal Reflections as Fathers and Leaders

Cox: Being a father informs all decisions; emphasizes policymakers’ shared motivation to improve children's futures, regardless of political stripe (32:28).
Polis: Describes fostering children’s interests through online resources (cooking, Japanese history, Go game). Recognizes online access as a double-edged sword, requiring parental guidance alongside freedom (33:40).
Quote:
"We do this because we love our kids and our grandkids and we want them to be better off than we are today. And it's a huge sacrifice and I'm so proud." — Spencer Cox (32:52)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On school choice (Polis, 03:18):
"Neighborhood schools are stronger when the kids actually want to be there and the parents actually want them to be there."
On teacher quality (Cox, 10:32):
"If you let me choose the teacher and I let you choose everything else, I will win every single time … the teacher is the most important part."
On integrating AI (Cox, 21:34):
"Let's use [AI] in the right ways. Let's make sure all our kids know how to use these tools … make sure that the computers are working for us and not the other way around."
On social media regulation (Cox, 25:47):
"We’ve become way too overprotective in the real world and way too under protective in the virtual world and it’s causing serious harm."
On student interests (Polis, 33:42):
"Our daughter is at 12, is responsible for our family dinners once a week … My son likes go … He wouldn't have found out about that stuff if it wasn't for, you know, access to online and social media."

Timestamps for Important Segments

Colorado’s approach to top ranking: 01:48–04:03
Utah’s literacy initiative and national trends: 04:20–07:03
Investment returns and teacher pay: 07:25–11:26
Let’s Get Ready Initiative/Longitudinal dashboard: 11:26–12:39
Apprenticeships and rethinking post-secondary education: 13:01–16:23
Language immersion best practices: 15:01–16:35
Expanding apprenticeships/language programs nationally: 16:35–18:25
AI, technology, and classroom strategies: 19:04–23:43
Social media regulation debate: 25:09–31:45
Parenting, policymaking, and personal reflections: 32:12–34:51

Conclusion

Takeaway:
This lively, bipartisan conversation spotlights education as both a state and national priority. The governors agree on the necessity for innovation—whether dual-language learning, data transparency, or integrating apprenticeships—while navigating with care the disruptive forces of technology. Their discussion paints a pragmatic but optimistic vision for American education that balances bold policy with deeply personal motivations.

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Transcript64 lines

[00:00]
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[00:56]
Moderator
As you just heard from those incredible questions, we are going to be focusing this conversation and technology in education. And to have this conversation, I want to welcome Governor Spencer Cox of Utah. Let's have a big round of applause for him and Democratic Governor Jared Polis of Colorado. Thank you both so much for being here for this conversation. We're really excited about it. Governor Polis, I have to start with you because U.S. news and World Report found that Colorado was ranked number one in education. So congratulations to you for that. And this has really been a priority for you. So talk to us a little bit about how you got to number one. But what challenges remain that you want to tackle?
[01:49]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah. And as you know, during my time as NGA chair, we worked on let's get preparing all Americans for success before Spencer jumps in. Utah was number one overall. But on education, we did beat Utah.
[02:02]
Governor Spencer Cox
You did. I think we were number two.
[02:03]
Governor Jared Polis
There you go. And we really attribute it to six things we're doing in Colorado. One is we start earlier. When I ran for governor, we only had half day kindergarten. Parents had to pay for full day. We did full day kindergarten and now universal preschool. It moved us from 28th to third in preschool enrollment. 73% of parents do preschool. Number two, we expanded our leadership on school choice in Colorado. Over 270 charter schools were second for public charter school enrollment. And over 40% of the students in Colorado go to a public school of their choice. 40%. And I argue that makes neighborhood schools stronger because guess what? Neighborhood schools are Stronger when the kids actually want to be there and the parents actually want them to be there. So we really embrace that and expanded that. We've made historic investments in K12. We ended the underfunding of our schools and funded them at constitutional levels. We implemented a new school finance formula, better directs resources to where they're needed. We focused on measurable outcomes and data, high quality curriculum. We, we held up and lifted up bright spots. Schools that exceeded expectations had very high levels of math and reading. And we, we said, how can other schools implement some of those same practices? Here's another important one that often goes underrated. We really recognize that learning doesn't end at 3pm or middle of May when the school year ends. So we invested in after school programming for kids and helping kids afford summer programming. That's also one of the things I'm most excited about from the SGO tax credit that's coming online is the ability to fund quality after school programs and summer opportunities for kids who otherwise wouldn't afford it. And finally, we made higher education more relevant, accessible and affordable, including for families under $90,000, free community college, many more high school students getting dual and concurrent enrollment credit and even associate's degrees concurrent with their graduation credentials and meaningful occupational qualifications that allow people to earn a good job. So those are really the six things that we've done to get where we are and we certainly ain't done. We're doubling down on all of those.
[04:03]
Moderator
Well, we want to tease all of that out throughout the conversation. Governor Cox, as Governor Polis just said, you are the number one state, but education is an area where you are still working. What do you see as the biggest challenges? Where are you putting your focus right now?
[04:20]
Governor Spencer Cox
Well, I want to thank, I want to thank you for doing this. Thanks first of all. And I want to give a shout out to the earlier panel. Certainly better hair. I think we improved the personality a little bit in this panel, but it's all good. But more than anything, just I wish we could inject what you saw there into the veins of America.
[04:40]
Moderator
Yes.
[04:40]
Governor Spencer Cox
Because if people don't see this very often and it matters. So this competition, who's number one in education? Who's number two? What are we doing? How are we improving? We're learning lessons from each other. To your question, one of the things, and I would just say ditto to everything that Governor Polis mentioned, the great things that he's working on. We're really concerned about literacy in this country today. Incredible article recently in the Atlantic. There's Been a lot of talk about this that we're in kind of a post literate society. What does that mean? Reading scores across the country have been dropping, especially since social media and smartphones became ubiquitous with our kids. And I'm very lucky to be married to a teacher, Abby, sir, with me, a special education teacher. And this has been a true focus of our administration. And so on top of the things that you've already heard about, we're launching one of the biggest literacy initiatives in the country right now. That's our big focus over the next year. We know how to make kids read. Now the science of reading is real. And I hate to bring everything back to federalism, but we really learned that lesson thanks to one of our fellow states, Mississippi, who did some incredible things and moved from like 49th in literacy rates, third grade reading to top 10, which has never happened in our country. And so we all looked at that and said, okay, what are they doing that we're not? We passed two big bills around literacy, basically adopting the Mississippi model and we got some funding for reading coaches. Now again, kids reading at grade level and third grade is a policy choice. We know that with the right resources, 98%, 95 to 98%, kids can learn to read at third grade. Most of our states are not anywhere close to that. We're 50 to 70% somewhere around there. We can all do better. And that's one of our major focuses. Because everything else, if you can read at grade level at third grade, it turns out all the other metrics click into place, you're much more likely because that's when you stop reading to or learning to read and start reading to learn. So if you can do that, you're going to graduate from high school, you're probably going to have a good job. The American dream unlocks if you can read a grade level by third grader.
[07:04]
Moderator
And Governor Polis pick up on that point. You're talking about some of the investments that you made in literacy in after school programs. We are living in a world though, in which resources are in some ways challenged right now. How do you decide where to make the investments? Where do you see the biggest return on investments when it comes to education?
[07:26]
Governor Jared Polis
So we aligned our after school investment towards academic progress in areas so it's really aligned with math and literacy and particularly focused on students that are not achieving at grade level. So we know that it's, we want everything that can occur during the school day to occur. But we know that for some to catch up, they need that extra Time. And that's really. Will really deploy that. It's both after school programs at the school site itself. Also partnered with Boys and Girls Club with a dedicated funding stream for community centers and meaningful activities that again, are aligned with learning and achievement. This is not for childcare. It has to directly align with the academic progress that the kids need to make.
[08:06]
Moderator
Governor Cox, same question for you. Where are you finding. You talked about the importance of literacy. Where else are you investing and finding the greatest return?
[08:15]
Governor Jared Polis
Can I just add one more? We also. Did we also now have breakfast and lunch for every child in our schools, which is. Nutrition is a big. Nutrition is a big part of it. It's really hard to learn if you're hungry. Right. It's hard to do anything well if you're hungry. And you know, even if you have enough food, it's not always the right food. And so how do we make sure that kids get not just a full belly, but the healthy nutrition they need for successful intellectual and physical development? And we do that now by having universal breakfast and lunch for everybody. Also makes it easier administratively. Save school districts money, eliminates any stigma associated with it. For those who want it, it's there.
[08:48]
Moderator
I'm glad you brought that up because it is such a critical part of learning. You have to have a full belly in order to learn, in order to focus. The summer months become more challenging. Is that something that you're focused on?
[09:01]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah, we're excited. We were one of the first states to embrace summer ebt, which continues that through the summer months. We do have schools, especially in high risk areas, that continue direct service. Summer EBT has been a big step forward for families and obviously for kids that are enrolled in summer programs, there's additional nutritional resources. But absolutely, nutrition as a whole is an area that we as a society need to do better in because there's direct developments between nutrition and brain development. And it's absolutely important that we don't shy away from that, that we tackle that head on.
[09:30]
Moderator
Governor Cox, how do you assure that kids are getting the nutrition that they need? And again, where do you find the greatest return on investments when it comes to education?
[09:40]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yes, so. So we've had some investments again, helping kids, lower income kids be able to. We're paying for their school lunches, their breakfast, those types of things which are important. We call those especially our Title 1 schools. Sometimes we call them Maslow schools. It is, you know, Maslow's hierarchy of needs. If you're hungry, learning falls way down. Right. That's. That's not important to you. And so we, we're, we're working with private organizations as well to help fund that which we think is really important because there are limited resources. I will tell you though that the thing I'm most proud of when it comes to investments and the way we've changed things since I took office, there are two, but the, the most important one is investing in our teachers. I always say, look, if you give me two identical students, everything is the same about them. Their brain power, you know, their parental situation, everything else. And you let me choose the teacher and I let you choose everything else. I will win every single time. I just believe that the teacher is the most important part of that entire education system. You've seen it. You all know this. I mean, our kids in high school, we all knew who the good teachers were, who the bad teachers were. The kids knew it, the teachers knew it. Everyone knew that. And if you had the right teacher, they can make even the kid that struggles the most become the, the best possible student. And so we, we decided that we were going to invest in our teachers and we gave our teachers the, the largest raise in our state's history. We went from, you know, 35th, 36th in the nation for teacher pay up to top 10 now number one in the, in the region. And we're, we're really proud of that. It's, it's helping us retain the best teachers, which, which is really important. We were losing far too many of our great teachers and attract new teachers who maybe couldn't, wanted to be a teacher but couldn't afford to do it, so they went somewhere else. Now we're getting the very best and, and that's going to help kids for generations.
[11:26]
Moderator
Governor Polis, let's go back to your let's get ready initiative. You did start this when you were chair of the National Governors Association. Flesh that out a little bit because you worked with the other governors on that as well. How have you pushed that forward? And Governor Cox, I'd love for you to weigh in as well.
[11:45]
Governor Jared Polis
So first of all, the highlight, you know, let's get ready. It's let's get ready at the individual level for student success. But the aggregate of student success is economic success for a state and for our country. And it's really about let's superpower prosperity of our states of the nation. We have now launched through nga, a pilot project with eight states. Colorado is one of them, built on let's get ready to have a public facing dashboard showing the kinds of outcomes and Results, including of course, you know, people focus on test scores. But we always say test scores are part of it. Of course you want to show that. But the other outcomes of success and a public facing dashboard so that we can really be accountable for these metrics and moving forward. So this will be launching this fall. We're really going to have some cutting edge ways of longitudinal tracking and results reporting. It'll provide an exciting basis to make sure that we as states, the eight states that are participating, and hopefully more going forward will really up the bar on student achievement and success.
[12:40]
Moderator
Governor Cox?
[12:40]
Governor Spencer Cox
Well, we were really proud to support Governor Polis in his initiative because it's critical. We talked about the money piece of this and so often we think if we just throw more money at it, we'll get a better outcome. And that's just not that simple. Not true, right? I mean, again, Mississippi versus California are two really good arguments. You know, they spend less per capita, by far, California spending more. But the reading scores went the opposite way because you've got to spend it in the right ways. So these, these measurements and metrics and accountability pieces that Governor Polis is focus on is really important. We're learning and implementing those as well. One of the other things that we focused on, and the last panel already took it, so I'm not going to do it. But the apprenticeship piece of this. We've made a mistake as a country over the past 40 years, we separated work from education to our detriment. We built this model where education is the thing you do for the first 20 plus years of your life and then work is what you do afterwards. The modern economy does not support that. Work and education have to go together. We need lifelong learners, which means we have to extend education later into work. I'm sure we'll talk about that with AI and all the changes that are coming. And we need lifelong workers. We need to move work way up on the scale. We need kids involved at a much earlier age. We also have been over to Switzerland with our friends. Stadler Rail, which is a major Swiss train company, has their North American headquarters in Utah. They've helped us with this. We're doing much more on the apprenticeship side and that's going to be good for us. It's not often I say that Europe does something better than the United States, but that's the one thing that model is better for our kids. And this idea that every kid needs to get a bachelor's degree is not good for our kids. It's not good for our education. System. Some do, some don't. And we shouldn't have the stigma that I hate it when I ask a parent, hey, what's your kid doing? They're just graduating from high school and they kind of get embarrassed. And they're like, well, they're going to a trade or tech college instead of the University of Utah. I'm like, you should brag about that. The best jobs right now are plumbers, our electricians. We desperately need these. And you should never be embarrassed. You should be celebrating that.
[15:01]
Governor Jared Polis
There should be no stigma. We should celebrate all routes to success. There's a second thing Europe does better, Spencer, I'm sure you'll agree, and that's foreign language instruction.
[15:09]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah.
[15:09]
Governor Jared Polis
So.
[15:10]
Governor Spencer Cox
Well, I'll disagree because I get to brag about Utah, but go ahead.
[15:13]
Governor Jared Polis
In, in, in America, we generally do this at the high school level. In Europe, they generally are fluent in a second language by the time they're done with fifth grade. A simple matter of brain science. We should. It's wasted hours in many cases in high school. I mean, how many friends have you said, oh, do you speak any foreign language? Well, I took, you know, French or Spanish in high school for three years, but I'll speak a word of it. That's like a very common thing in this country. It's a waste of time. You should. And obviously some kids, you can and learn like, foreign languages in adult in high school. But for goodness sakes, we have dual immersion French and Spanish and German and Russian and Chinese schools. Every kid is fluent in the language by fifth grade. That's what we should do. And if you want to start a third language in high school or develop your academic proficiency in your second language, that's when you do it. But we really need to shift towards that European model of preparing kids with a second language during elementary school.
[16:01]
Governor Spencer Cox
And we did that 21 years ago in Utah. We have the largest dual immersion program in the country in those, in those major languages. Almost every kid who wants to in first grade gets all the way from
[16:13]
Governor Jared Polis
first grade to high school a half
[16:15]
Governor Spencer Cox
day of instruction in the foreign language. So half in English, the other half in Spanish, French, Chinese, German.
[16:22]
Governor Jared Polis
And you lead the country in that.
[16:23]
Governor Spencer Cox
And, and those teachers can't be just Americans who speak the language. They're, they're actually, that has to be their native language, and it's incredible. They're fluent by middle school, and it makes a huge difference.
[16:35]
Moderator
I'm so glad that you're bringing up both of these issues, Governor Polis. Part of what you're Describing, though, is a little bit of a paradigm shift in how we as society think about education, both when it comes to apprenticeships and when it comes to language. So how do you expand this beyond Colorado, beyond Utah, so that the entire country thinks about apprenticeships as something to be valued and pursued and celebrated? And let's get our kids in foreign language programs starting in first grade.
[17:05]
Governor Jared Polis
And that's what exciting is. What's exciting is a lot of these, these opportunities exist. Right. Spencer talks about kids spending half their day in foreign language. We, we have that in Colorado in, in not just Spanish, but German and French, and we have Russian and, and, and Chinese. But they're not universal. They're not everybody. For most of the kids in, in, in Colorado even, and certainly across the country, they are getting, you know, maybe, maybe one hour of nominal foreign language exposure or cult a kid, and they don't begin the earnest work of that till high school. Apprenticeships. We've scaled them up several times. We now have a tax credit that incentivizes companies to get at the table because we know there's a little bit of out of pocket cost those first couple of years. They recognize the benefit, it sells itself. But how do we get them to the table? So we've gotten advanced tech and advanced manufacturing companies at the table. We've modeled our behavior as a state. We're taking on apprentices in our agencies so that high schoolers are able to learn the work that the state does in different areas. But again, not every student encounters it. Far from universal. So it's really a matter of how we share what works in education, right? From from workforce experience to foreign language to math to reading. And then what can sometimes be even harder in education is change what doesn't work. So expand and replicate what works. And when something isn't working, have the moral courage to get in and end it or change it.
[18:26]
Moderator
So a big part of. And we talked about this in the first panel of our educational system right now, one of the hardest questions is how to grapple with how to incorporate AI and social media, quite frankly. So I want to tackle both of them. I'm a mom of two. I have little kids, but I spend a lot of time thinking about this. Governor Cox, how can schools both integrate AI so that our young people are learning lessons so that they can be competitive when they are in the workforce and at the same time not suffering the downside, the negative aspects of AI?
[19:05]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, so this is something that we've, we've talked a lot about, thought a lot about sometimes he and I have argued about this, but we care deeply about our kids. I know we all want the best for our children and I just think that the data, the research now is just overwhelmingly compelling that we have over indexed on screens that is not good for our kids. In fact it's terrible for their mental health. Anxiety, depression, self harm skyrocketed in 2012. I mean all of the bad stuff as you go back started around 2012 and that's when social media, smartphones, we started giving them to our kids way too early. Not just that, but just the technology in the classroom, one to one devices giving our kids that. I mean, you know we got kids in first grade that are supposed to be learning on a Chromebook and they're, you know, somehow they're, they're playing Minecraft like this is, this is happening all across the country. So we were the first state to take action to hold social media accountable, social media companies accountable. Working to get phones out of the classroom. Now many states, the majority of states have now gotten cell phones out of the classroom. Bell to bell, we know is the better plan. Most, again many of states have been able to do that. That's really important when it comes to AI. I think governor Stitt hit the nail on the head. He said it earlier and this is, this is where our focus is too. Having AI in the classroom for kids is not good all of the time. Now they need to learn how to use these tools. And I actually think that going back to an older model of having a computer lab, something where once a day or a few times a week where you go in and you focus on those tools and then you go back out and you start learning again the old fashioned way. Because we know this, that again if you learn the same thing on a screen versus having to write it out or read it the old fashioned way, you don't retain the same way. You retain much better the old way. So doing that, making sure they learn the tools. But here's where it does matter. AI has the ability to help our teachers have a real leap forward and they should have those tools, that individualized learning piece. It's impossible for a teacher to really dive in and grade 30 papers in an evening. It just doesn't work that way. But AI can really help with that and get the feedback that they need and enhance the ability of our teachers. So that's how we're looking at it. Let's not be afraid of it. Let's use it in the right ways. Let's make sure. All of our kids know how to use these tools because they're going to need to. But let's make sure that the computers are working for us and not the other way around.
[21:42]
Moderator
How do you see it and how are you addressing these challenges? And as a computer lab where you have a designated period every day, the right way to address this.
[21:52]
Governor Jared Polis
You know, this is the, the biggest discussion in tables around this country. How AI is affecting every sector. Right. Architects are saying, how's it affecting architecture? Accountants are saying, you're probably, how's it affecting reporting? Right. I mean, it's. So education is no different. How's it affecting education? Right. And, and just like all those other fields, there's excitement right. At the same time as apprehension. So excitement. Oh, my gosh. I can tailor a lesson to my students individual learning style. I can say I'm a visual learner. Can you prepare this lesson for me? Can you learn AI? I mean, it's for learners of all ages, not just students. The apprehension piece, how do we make sure there's not cheating, shortcuts, that you develop a deep understanding of things? So these are things that are being wrestled with in every profession there is. Right. Even in politics. Right. But education is no different. And I think it's very important that we devote that thought power to both the opportunities and the shortfalls that exist in a dynamic basis with regards to the utilization of AI.
[22:50]
Moderator
Is there a risk in overregulation? I spoke with someone in the AI field who said, look, it has the capacity to cure cancer and at the same time has the capacity to do incredible harm. How do you see the regulations more broadly?
[23:08]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah, I mean, I think that we need to have a light touch with regard to regulation, and we need to do it at a national level. And that's, that's almost the more important thing. If you do it at the state level, you have 50 different systems. That's a very good way of locking incumbents in and preventing any new startup or new consumer benefit from coming online. The big companies of the world that are involved with AI will be able to do 50 state compliance, but in many ways it entrenches them. So whatever protections you have, and I think we need baseline protections, we need to make sure we do that as a country. So I really think it falls upon Congress to do, to do a reasonable thing to protect the security and safety of the American people.
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[25:10]
Moderator
Governor Cox, I want you to weigh in. And we have talked before when we were focused on a segment on mental health on Meet the Press about the impact of social media on mental health, on our kids, on their education, their capacity to learn. Governor Cox, talk a little bit about age based, age based social media bans is what I'm trying to say. You favor them. Where's the cutoff though?
[25:39]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, so I do favor them. And in lieu of those things happening, you know, we passed some other laws as well that there should be age based gating and kids accounts. They should be very different. We become way too overprotective in the real world and way too under protective in the virtual world and it's causing serious harm. The thing we passed, I mean that law is on hold right now as lawsuits are moving forward, unfortunately. But these companies who are destroying our kids, they knew about it from leaks we've seen meta others especially knew what they were doing. They knew the harm they were causing and they hid it from us. Just like the tobacco companies did in the 50s and 60s, just like the opioid companies did in the 90s and the early 2000s. It's the same playbook with these guys and they're gonna sue and continue to harm our kids. All we're saying is turn off the most addictive features. If we're allow that, you don't need the endless scrolling, you don't need the constant notifications that are keeping our kids up all night. And the algorithms to me are the worst part of all of this. The algorithms, we've seen them, they're proprietary. Look, I don't think social media companies should be held accountable for what other people post, for what people put on those platforms. But if your algorithm is feeding that garbage to my kid, then you should be responsible for that. And fortunately courts are starting to hold them accountable for that. And we're seeing these verdicts that are, that are huge and there's going to be more of them and I welcome them until they get their act together and start and start again treating kids the way we should be able to protect our kids. That's going to happen. So yes, I think there's an opportunity for us. Parents should have much more control over what their kids do and see on these platforms. We've got to get back to just a rational, common sense approach.
[27:33]
Governor Jared Polis
So this is an area Spencer and I have some disagreements. I agree with the last piece. He said parents should have more. I favor more parent centric approach, family centric approach than the government centric approach because there's different parenting styles. There's not one that's more valid than others. Some parents let their nine year old kid go to the playground three blocks away by themselves. Others want to watch them every step of the way. Same with online media. It's there for parental control, but it's hard to use and there's too many ways around it. So a focus on that rather than the government saying how you should parent your kid well.
[28:02]
Moderator
And to take that one step further, how important is it that parents are working together? Because if one family says you can't have social media until you're 16, but your child's best friend is on the phone and on social media and your kid's going to their house, it doesn't really have an impact. I mean, does it need to be a broader community almost?
[28:24]
Governor Jared Polis
It's just like anything else. What movie is your kid watching at a friend's house? Are they letting them go at their on their bike at night with no lights? I mean, you know, it's all in that realm of parenting, right? And obviously depending on the age of your Kid parents have some say and should know whose house they're at and what they're doing when they're 6 years old, 10 years old.
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[29:10]
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[30:03]
Governor Jared Polis
Yeah.
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[30:34]
Governor Jared Polis
Realistically, when they're 15, 16, they're probably going to be at someone's house sometime and the parent might know it. But it depends on your parenting style. So again, I put this in the realm of parents and family, not government. And social media is just one of those many things that is both a risk and has positive factors. Just like being on a bike or you know, going to the store alone or what movies they're watching.
[30:53]
Moderator
Governor Cox, how big of a role? I mean, obviously parents play a huge role, but how do you see that balance?
[30:58]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, no, no, look, parenting is critical to all of this and we have a collective action problem. And again, there are lots of things that we don't let kids do. We don't let them smoke, we don't let them drink until a certain age. And what we know is that social media is having the same impacts, maybe worse as some of those addictive drugs and addictive. So, yeah, turn off all the addictive features and then let parents be able to parent. I have no problem with that. I don't think that every parent or I don't think the government should decide when kids get phones, how kids communicate with their parents, how kids communicate with their friends. Again, I have no problem with that. That's not what we're talking about. We're talking about something that is much more insidious than this. And if parents want to enable all those features and make that happen. But that's not what.
[31:46]
Governor Jared Polis
There's one big difference. There's no benefit to cigarettes and alcohol. There absolutely are benefits, no matter how you weigh them, for social media participation. I mean, my son, 14, he likes the game of Go. That's a pretty obscure game. More obscure than chess. He likes it. He's unlikely to find people at a school that do that. He finds people online, they play Go. So, I mean, it's a little different than these other cities. It's not that it's without its risk, but it also has its benefits to be able to reach out to communities across the country and across the world.
[32:13]
Moderator
Well, you take me to my final question perfectly, which is I want you both to speak personally. Now, you are both dads. Governor Cox, how does being a father impact how you approach education in the state of Utah?
[32:29]
Governor Spencer Cox
Yeah, well, look, it's everything, right? And it's not just education. You asked the last panel what surprised them the most about their job. And I will tell you that one of the things that surprised me most is I get to be in a room full of just some of the very best people on earth. And I hate today that we've become so cynical of government and politics because there are some bad actors out there. But we assume that everyone's on the take, everybody's making decisions for personal gain. That that is not true. As I look around this room, Republican, Democrat, I don't care what that, what that R or D is after, their name. We all got into these jobs because we have kids and because we care about our families and because we want the best for the next generation. This 250 year anniversary that we're celebrating, the American dream, we're doing this because we Love our kids and our grandkids and we want them to be better off than we are today. And it's a huge sacrifice and I'm so proud. We have a lot of these guys who aren't going to be with us. After six months, they're termed out, they're not running again and the nation's gonna miss them. The very best are here.
[33:39]
Moderator
Governor Polis.
[33:40]
Governor Jared Polis
Well, our daughter's 12 and she was watching a lot of cooking videos on Pinterest, these short little by cooking influencers. And so we took that interest and said, okay, Cora, why don't we put you in charge of making dinner for the family one day a week. And so she does that. Now she's making dinner for the family one day week. So I mean, it's like you find their interest. It's access to information. Our son, I mentioned he likes go. He also studies very obscure things like medieval Japanese history and we've supported that. He does tea ceremony work. He turned one little room in our house into a tea ceremony room and he puts on his kimono and he presents tea ceremonies to us. And he wouldn't have found out about that stuff if it wasn't for, you know, access to online and social media. And I totally get that other kids, and perhaps our kids can be exposed to dangers too. So it's just like a piece of the world, right? It has vast potential to unlock amazing things. And it's great that my daughter is at 12, is responsible for our family dinners once a week. And at the same time, parents should be fully cognizant of the risk of their daughter, of their son or daughter walking down the street to 711 and hanging out there or of what they're doing online. I mean, the world is full of both opportunities and risks. And you know what? They're going to need to to deal with that as adults and they need to practice as kids.
[34:51]
Moderator
All right, Governor Polis, Governor Cox, you have given parents like myself, educators, other governors, all of us, so much to think about. So informational. Thank you so very much.
[35:01]
Governor Spencer Cox
Much.
[35:02]
Moderator
Thank you so much.
[35:05]
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Full panel: Govs. Jared Polis & Spencer Cox on education and technology

Full panel: Govs. Jared Polis & Spencer Cox on education and technology

Podcast Summary: Meet the Press (August 2, 2026)

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Education Successes and Priorities in Colorado and Utah

2. Investment Strategies and Returns in Education

3. Broader Educational Reform: Accountability, Apprenticeships, and Language

4. The Role of Technology: AI, Social Media, and Screen Time

5. Social Media and Student Mental Health

6. Personal Reflections as Fathers and Leaders

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Timestamps for Important Segments

Conclusion

Podcast Summary: Meet the Press (August 2, 2026)

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Education Successes and Priorities in Colorado and Utah

2. Investment Strategies and Returns in Education

3. Broader Educational Reform: Accountability, Apprenticeships, and Language

4. The Role of Technology: AI, Social Media, and Screen Time

5. Social Media and Student Mental Health

6. Personal Reflections as Fathers and Leaders

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Timestamps for Important Segments

Conclusion