Meet the Press NOW — June 3

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Meet the Press NOW — June 3, 2026

Host: Kelly O’Donnell (NBC News)
Notable Guests: Monica Alba, Sahil Kapoor, Courtney Kube, Steve Kornacki, Conan Nolan, President Donald Trump (audio/press Q&A), Secretary Ben Wallace, Daniela Diaz, Antwan Seawright, T.W. Arihi, Federal Judges Esther Salas & John Jones III
Date: June 3, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Meet the Press NOW offered robust coverage of three intersecting headline themes:

• The ongoing U.S.–Iran hostilities and diplomatic maneuvering, including the controversial U.S. naval blockade and prospects for a peace deal,
• Fallout and analysis from primary election night, with special focus on races in Iowa and California,
• A deep-dive discussion on the surge in threats and violence toward the judiciary, featuring two federal judges.

The show features vivid on-the-ground updates, sharp panel analysis, and a rare, emotional conversation about political violence against public officials.

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Key Segments & Discussion Points

1. Escalation in the U.S.–Iran Conflict

Timestamps: [00:42]–[11:57], [13:12]–[26:24]

• Fresh Hostilities: The episode opens with breaking news—Congress is preparing to vote on a War Powers Resolution that may force the president to withdraw U.S. forces from the ongoing conflict. This comes after the Pentagon confirmed a missile strike on an oil tanker violating the U.S. blockade, and Iran responded with attacks on Gulf partners (notably Kuwait’s international airport, killing one).
• Confusion Over “War Over” Claims: Despite Secretary of State Marco Rubio’s contention that “the war with Iran is over,” both U.S. and Iranian military exchanges continued. President Trump, questioned in a New York Post interview and during a live Q&A, delivers ambiguous statements about the timeline and goals of the blockade and peace negotiation progress:
  • “We're having a very great success in Iran militarily.” ([02:58])
  • “That's good. It's good if they're confused and the Iranians are confused.” ([03:31])
• Tense U.S.–Israel Relations: President Trump confirmed a heated call with PM Netanyahu, urging Israeli restraint in Lebanon to protect peace talks with Iran:
  • “You said, ‘Are you effing crazy? What are you effing doing? I helped you stay out of jail.’ Is that true?” – NBC’s Gary Grumbach ([03:56])
  • “I did. I wouldn't say angry. I was a little bit perturbed at his constantly fighting with Lebanon.” – President Trump ([04:12])
• Potential U.S.–Iran Summit: Discussion on Trump’s openness to meeting the Iranian Supreme Leader, a figure injured by a U.S. strike earlier—raising whether it’s a real strategic pivot or another distraction tactic.
• Ongoing Escalation: Courtney Kuby notes Iran's strikes are significant for targeting multiple U.S. allies simultaneously—Kuwait and Bahrain ([09:45]).
• U.S. Military Footprint: Kuby analyzes the costs and strain of maintaining a lengthy blockade and whether combat operations could quickly resume at Trump’s discretion ([11:04]).
• Criticism Over Appointments: Trump’s nomination of Bill Pulte—a housing expert with no security credentials—as Acting DNI is met with bipartisan skepticism.
• Trump's Press Q&A: Covers rationale for recent strikes, negotiations with Iran, critiques of media coverage and government weaponization, and the durability of the MAGA movement ([13:12]–[22:05]).
  • Memorable quote: “We can't let Iran have a nuclear weapon under any circumstances. We can't let that happen.” ([16:25])
  • Birthday wish: “Make America great again. That's all I want… I think it's the greatest in the history. I would say that's probably the greatest phrase in the history of the world.” ([21:24])
• Doubts Over Iran Nuclear Site Access: Trump claims at various times Iran has agreed to U.S. efforts to excavate and destroy buried nuclear material—but admits the status is ever-shifting ([22:21]).
• Israeli Demands vs. U.S. Negotiations: Trump comments on complex efforts to separate Israeli-Hezbollah conflict from Iran talks ([24:42]).

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2. Election Results & Analysis

Timestamps: [27:15]–[44:09]

• Iowa:
  • Businessman Zak Lon upsets Trump-endorsed Randy Feenstra in GOP governor primary—Trump’s first primary defeat of the 2026 cycle.
    • “Tonight the people of Iowa had something to say about that, that we're not going to wait anymore.” – Zak Lon ([28:18])
  • Senate: Moderate Democrat Josh Turek wins primary, positioning himself against Trump-backed Rep. Ashley Hinson.
    • “We have enough millionaires in D.C. looking out for billionaires. We need real people in Washington who have felt the consequences of a broken system…” – Turek ([28:55])
• California:
  • Governor’s Race: Tight 3-way, too close to call. Notables include Javier Becerra (D), Tom Steyer (D), and Steve Hilton (R). Analysts anticipate late Democratic mail-in ballots could shake up the results ([30:42], [32:23]).
  • LA Mayor: Incumbent Karen Bass advances; Spencer Pratt (R, reality TV personality) could challenge; leftist Nithya Raman underperforms ([29:23], [34:27]).
    • “Regardless of all the problems the city is facing and the catastrophic fires in the Palisades, [Bass] still is able to bring in a coalition effort.” – Conan Nolan ([34:27])
• Panel Insights: Roundtable with Daniela Diaz, Antwan Seawright, T.W. Arihi:
  • Limits of Trump’s endorsement—timing and alignment with local MAGA undercurrents matter ([36:48]).
  • Panel concurs: In Iowa, “loyalty to Trump” was key in the Republican primary ([39:07]).
  • In Alaska, the “multiple Dan Sullivan” candidate confusion could impact a unique Senate race, with Dems seeing potential due to affordability/economic pressures ([40:48]–[43:26]).

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3. “Common Ground” – The Crisis of Threats Against Judges

Timestamps: [46:46]–[59:09]

• Personal Testimony: Judge Esther Salas shares the harrowing account of her son’s murder and her husband’s near-fatal attack as a result of targeted violence ([47:17]–[49:10]).
  • “When someone sacrifices their life for you, you don't squander yours. My son's ultimate act of love was taking that bullet.” – Judge Salas ([49:17])
• Broader Pattern: Both Judges Salas and Jones decry an exponential growth in threats—564 recorded in 2025, over 300 already in 2026.
• Political Rhetoric as a Catalyst: Both judges connect irresponsible “top-down” anti-judiciary rhetoric—directly citing the President, Congress, and media influencers—as emboldening extremists ([52:01]–[55:21]).
  • “When you call us monsters and say we hate America…you are doing that for one reason, to erode the public’s confidence [in the judiciary].” – Judge Salas ([53:21])
  • “Judges are not his judges…there’s no greater evidence than that sort of ‘my judges’ than the President of the United States…to the Supreme Court of the United States and trying to stare down the Supreme Court. It shouldn’t happen.” – Judge Jones ([54:15])
• Call to Action: Both guests plea for a national dialogue on civility—starting in homes and communities and led by public figures ([56:59], [57:30]).
  • “It starts at home, and we start to demand more from ourselves and more from our leaders.” – Judge Salas ([57:30])

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Memorable Quotes

• On U.S.–Iran tension:
  • “That's good. It's good if they're confused and the Iranians are confused.” – President Trump ([03:31])
• On political strategy:
  • “He likes to sort of leave things hanging in the air, putting them in a little bit of a legal limbo.” – Monica Alba ([26:24])
• On hate and resilience:
  • “When someone sacrifices their life for you, you don't squander yours.” – Judge Salas ([49:17])
  • “You make us villains, you demonize us, and therefore we're not…worth fighting for.” – Judge Salas ([53:21])
• On the atmosphere of threats:
  • “The person that comes out of nowhere…in the current climate, it's one thing to complain about judges…it's another thing to [send] a dog whistle to that very small, but perhaps powerful, portion…that…will hurt or kill somebody because they think in their twisted minds…they're vindicating some belief.” – Judge Jones ([50:10])
• On hope:
  • “I think it's a return to love. I really do.” – Judge Salas ([57:30])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Wave of U.S.–Iran Hostilities: [00:42]–[11:57]
• Trump’s Press Q&A on Iran, Blockade, and Election Strategy: [13:12]–[26:24]
• Election Results (Iowa & California) and Analysis: [27:15]–[44:09]
• Discussion of Multiple ‘Dan Sullivans’ in Alaska Race: [40:48]–[43:26]
• Common Ground Interview: Federal Judges on Threats and Civility: [46:46]–[59:09]

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Notable Analysis & Takeaways

• White House and Congress are locked in a tense struggle over Iran strategy; both political calculation and reality on the ground are shifting daily.
• Trump’s Influence: His endorsements remain powerful, but timing and MAGA branding now weigh as heavily as his personal stamp—especially when challengers claim alignment with his movement.
• Democratic Prospects: Economic frustrations and campaign quirks may open up unusual opportunities in Midwestern and distant states (Iowa, Alaska).
• Judiciary at Risk: The episode's most poignant segment underlines the real, accelerating threat to judicial independence and security—linking trends in public rhetoric and eroding civic norms.
• Civil Discourse Needed: Final calls for a return to civility and dialogue echo as the episode’s moral center.

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For listeners seeking sharp insights on U.S. foreign policy, the state of American democracy, and the 2026 campaign landscape—as well as a deeply human look at what is at stake for America's judiciary—this episode is essential.

Transcript

[Kelly O'Donnell]

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[Kelly O'Donnell]

Welcome to MEET THE press. Now, I'm Kelly o' Donnell in Washington. We will dive into results from last night's primary elections in just a moment with some key matchups now set in the battle for control of Congress and two major races for California governor and Los Angeles mayor that are still uncalled at this hour as the vote continues be counted. But we begin with a wave of new hostilities between the US And Iran as the administration struggles to move on from the war. At any moment, the House is set to vote on a war powers resolution that would direct the president to remove US Forces from the conflict. Now remember, that same vote was abruptly pulled last month before the House left for recess, in part because of attendance issues on the Republican side and concerns about further defections. But today's vote comes after the Pentagon confirmed yesterday it fired a Hellfire missile at an oil tanker in the Arabian Gulf that it says was in violation of the US Naval blockade. And then hours later, Iran firing a wave of missiles and drone attacks at neighboring Gulf countries, including an attack on Kuwait's international airport that killed one person. Secretary of State Marco Rubio was back on Capitol Hill today defending comments he made yesterday that the war with Iran is over, despite these latest escalations. So is the war still on or

[President Donald Trump]

is the war off?

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

Well, epic fury has concluded on occasion. In order to protect our own forces, we don't just strike the drones. We strike the people who launch those drones.

[NBC's Sahil Kapoor]

These are completely defensive in nature, but they are happening in response to an Iranian action.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

If the war is over, I have a simple question.

[NBC's Monica Alba]

Who won?

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

First of all, epic fury is over, which is what you would consider the war.

[NBC's Monica Alba]

The American people are not stupid, Mr. Secretary.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

We all know that this war is not over.

[NBC's Monica Alba]

Just last night, the US And Iran exchanged fire again, this time over at Kharg Island. We still have not reached a deal, despite the president's promise that a deal

[Kelly O'Donnell]

is right around the corner today. In an interview with the New York Post, President Trump offered little clarity on his negotiating strategy or how long the naval blockade with Iran will remain in place.

[President Donald Trump]

We're having a very great success in Iran militarily.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

So you think the blockade will still be in place by Labor?

[President Donald Trump]

I don't know. I mean, I think it could be, but I think it's unlikely. I think that we'll have it. I think this will resolve itself fairly quickly.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

And are your tactics where you say something and then change it and then do a peace deal and, and then break the ceasefire or whatever, is that all about trying to keep the Iranians off balance? Are you sort of messaging to them? No, because people at home, sometimes you, I think they get anxious and confused.

[President Donald Trump]

That's good. It's good if they're confused and the Iranians are confused.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Right.

[President Donald Trump]

But no, it's just the way I am.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

In that same interview, President Trump also addressing the tense phone call he had with Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu earlier this week, during which he told the Israeli leader to scale back attacks on Beirut over concerns Israel could be derailing peace negotiations with Iran.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

Axios reported that you had a phone call with Bibi Netanyahu, the prime minister of Israel, in which you were angry with him. You said, are you effing crazy? What are you effing doing? I helped you stay out of jail. Is that true? Did you speak to him in those terms?

[President Donald Trump]

I did. I wouldn't say angry. I was a little bit perturbed at

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

his

[President Donald Trump]

constantly fighting with Lebanon.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Prime Minister Netanyahu also responded, trying to downplay the disagreement between the two leaders. President confirmed that he, that he said, you're effing crazy. How did you react to that?

[Daniela Diaz]

What really happened in that call?

[President Donald Trump]

Well, I'm not going to get into details of our conversations. We've had thousands. Well, a lot, a lot of them. Sometimes we have, as in the best of families, you have these tactical disagreements. We always find a way to work them out, and we do so at the end. We can disagree in the morning and by the afternoon we have common action.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

And joining me now is NBC News White House correspondent Monica Alba. NBC's Sahil Kapoor is on Capitol Hill and NBC News national security correspondent Courtney Kuby. All of you are here to talk about this. And, Monica, let me begin with you, because the president also suggested he would be willing to meet, presumably in person with the ayatollah. That is. That's unheard of. And obviously our viewers remember that the ayatollah was struck by US Action during this conflict. So that would be certainly a tense topic. Is this a sense of the president again shifting strategy, throwing additional things into the conversation to keep things off balance, or is there maybe no greater explanation of it?

[NBC's Monica Alba]

Yeah, it's something we have seen time and time again from the president, Kelly, where the president kind of muses about an idea, even though it may not really be based in the reality of it. And also it raises all sorts of questions about how that would work or whether anyone from the Iranian leadership side of things would agree to any such meeting where that would take place, any of those kinds of concerns. In addition to we don't really have the entire picture of how he is doing, the supreme Leader, given some of his injuries. And the president sort of spoke to that, saying that he was, quote, missing a lot of different parts, if you believe the story. So kind of making a nod to the potential challenges on that as well. And we should note, Kelly, that the president hadn't held an open event with the press pool of reporters in the last week or so. He's certainly been doing those interviews that you played, and he's been to the golf course. But just a few moments ago he did summon reporters to talk about his reflecting pool renovation and a couple of other things. So he is now potentially going to take some questions on all of this, since we haven't been able to see reporters press him on the latest and the status with the Iranian negotiations, if they're still ongoing, what the latest is there. So we'll see if we get anything from that.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

That's that could definitely be interesting. And I know you'll let us know, wave us down if that's happening. When we look also at the issue of Hezbollah and the prime minister of Israel saying that proxy groups have to be disarmed, do we get a sense that the president and the prime minister are on the same page on that point? Sure.

[NBC's Monica Alba]

And we have seen, and I thought that the prime minister put it in a way that perhaps the president would agree with that there can tactical disagreements. Certainly we know that over the course of the last few years, even though these two men are pretty close personally, certainly they have developed that close personal relationship. There's plenty that they disagree about. And they have engaged and gone back and forth in these fiery or tense phone calls pretty regularly. And it's not that it's something that kind of breaks the relationship apart or sets it back. It sort of just adds to the dynamic. And so the president did also confirm that there were some harsh words, but again, kind of implying that that is how they have been discuss. But the president, Kelly, as you know well, has stressed to Netanyahu that he wants him to do things, he wants him to change his approach, his strategy, only to be met with no such thing.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Perturbed is how he described it. So I bet that's interesting when you come across Donald Trump's sense of being perturbed. Sahil, let me switch to you. There is an important vote that is playing out today, the War Powers Resolution. Certainly Democrats and others have been pushing that. What are you watching? And does this ultimately really amount to symbolism?

[NBC's Sahil Kapoor]

Well, Kelly, that vote is expected to start in the House any minute now. Just waiting for the buzzer to go off here, just a few feet away from me. The main thing I'm watching is the vote of the centrist Democratic Congressman, Jared golden of Maine. The reason being he was the only Democrat to vote in the last one of these to block it, and that one failed by a vote of 212 to 212. He has indicated that he will support it this time around. So unless there are attendance issues, it should pass, although with the margins so slim here in the House, you never truly know until the vote is finished. So if it does pass, it would be the first one of these Iran war resolutions that has passed either chamber. I wouldn't exactly call it symbolic, Kelly, because in the Senate, it's on a knife edge right now. It just needs one more Republican to be able to pass the Senate. And there's a real chance then it could get to the president's desk. He could veto it, but that's a very politically uncomfortable place for him to be because it gives him, and by extension his party full ownership of this unpopular war right now.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

And certainly Congress is trying to assert the authority it believes it has to try to limit the president's actions in this way, which is why this is so compelling. Courtney, if I can turn to you now, we saw these new Iranian strikes. We saw how the Kuwait airport was affected. It caused death and destruction. How do you see this kind of escalation, if you would call it that, or action from Iran? Is that escalating or is it more of what we've seen in recent weeks?

[NBC's Courtney Kuby]

So we've had this tit for tat that's been going back and forth between the US Military and primarily the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, the irgc, as opposed to the more conventional Iranian military. What really stands out, though, in the last 24 hours? Number one. Exactly. We just mentioned Iran had A successful strike on the civilian airport in Kuwait, causing widespread damage and as you mentioned, at least one death and injuries. It's not just that, though, as this, these, these back and forths have escalated to both the US Military and the IRGC taking these strikes on one another. This is the first time that we've seen Iran or IRGC respond in two separate locations at once, and that was in the last 24 hours, both firing missiles, drones, projectiles, whatever they were in the various locations at Bahrain and at Kuwait. Now, the US Military has also taken a number of actions, several waves of attacks in the same 24 to 48 hours.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Kelly, another point that was discussed with the president today is his suggestion that the naval blockade the US Is imposing against Iranian imports could be in place all summer. Labor Day was thrown about what would that mean for the kinds of resources and the footprint of US Military needed in that region?

[NBC's Courtney Kuby]

I mean, they can maintain it, but it always has an impact. So think about something like the carrier strike groups. You know, they have normal road rotations around the world that they're supposed to make, and those are set in most cases several years in advance. If you have two carrier strike groups that are sitting there enforcing the blockade and basically being ready in case President Trump decides that he wants to restart major combat operations against Iran, that ultimately starts to have an impact down the fleet. So having an impact on other carrier rotations, they only have so many of them. And then you can extrapolate that or maybe move that out to other assets like aircraft, like the sorts of systems, and the people who have all been moved forward. Kelly, ever since the major combat operations ended now almost two months ago, the US Military has maintained a large footprint print in the region for the very reason I just mentioned. Donald Trump could decide to restart major combat operations anytime he wants to.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

And that's what makes it so we wait every word he says to try and get an indication of that. One of the things he's coming under criticism for right now, Monica, is the choice of Bill Pulte as the acting director of the Office of National Intelligence. And we saw the president talk about this, and here's what let me just remind people. Pulte is an associate of the president, an ally who has been working in the housing realm and now with really no experience in the national security space, is being put up for an acting role. Here's that description of that question when it was posed to Secretary Besant on the Hill.

[Steve Kornacki]

Did you actually tell Pulte you were

[President Donald Trump]

going to punch him in the Face.

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

No, sir, I actually said I was

[President Donald Trump]

going to kick his ass. Good. Okay, good. I share the emotion.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

Thank you.

[NBC's Conan Nolan]

And as I said, that was last summer, summer 25.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

And many teams have fights in the locker room and then go out and win for the team on the field. Monica, instead of tossing to you for a response to that, I understand the president is taking some questions. You've been monitoring that. Let's listen in and see what he's talking about.

[President Donald Trump]

At this point, when it was explained to me, I said, all right, so we'll do that. But we've been hitting them pretty hard a little bit. So there is a reason for certain things and there's usually a reason that very quickly, as we do with the greatest military in the world. But you can. Some people would say they were slightly provoked because we took a strong action for a different reason. So they were reciprocating.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Can you explain.

[President Donald Trump]

The negotiation itself has gone very well, actually.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Very well, Mr. President. Yes, it is.

[President Donald Trump]

I mean, if it happens, it might not happen, but if it happens, it could happen like over the weekend.

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

How do you define ceasefires or how do you define ceasefire?

[President Donald Trump]

Pretty much the way it is. It's a different part of the world. You know, I'd say in that part of the world, ceasefires, when you're shooting in a more moderate manner.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Mr. President, yesterday you signed. Mr. President,

[President Donald Trump]

yesterday you cease fire. There is much different than a ceasefire in other parts of.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Mr. Mr. President, can you explain why

[NBC's Monica Alba]

you decided to drop the anti weaponization fund?

[President Donald Trump]

So I love it. I think it's so important people were. This is a victim right here. But not only a victim, he was also a student of it. What happened to great people, great American people, the way they were victimized, the way they were savaged. You have suicides, they killed themselves, they went bankrupt. They were weaponized by the Biden administration, by a bunch of thugs, including Obama people. And like nobody's probably ever been. I mean, I can think of maybe two instances in this country where they've had it to somewhere that extent. I'm not even sure if it was so much. They were put in jail for long periods of time. They were accused of things that never happened. They had prosecutors that were radical lunatics and their lives were destroyed. And frankly, we had a lawsuit that against us on the, you know, on the weaponization, where the judge, a radical left judge, ruled against it. And we'll see how that all works out. But a radical left judge ruled against it. But these people, their lives have been destroyed, their Families have been destroyed. Many of them not. I'm not just talking about a few people. Many of them, them. I'm one of them. I look, they raided my house, Mar? A lago. That never happened. Nobody ever thought of anything like that. It turned out that it was a total fake. Everything about it was fake and corrupt. We have all the information. You know, the good advantage to sitting here is we can get information that you wouldn't get by what we have and what we are going to be showing over the coming weeks. I'm actually not even going to believe. Some of you will believe. Believe it like CNN will believe it because they knew what was going on. They're crooked as hell. CNN's a very corrupt organization, but with a corrupt reporter standing right there. Never smiles. She never smiles. A young, beautiful woman never smiles. I never see a smile off her face. I see her standing there with hatred in her eyes like she has hatred because we have borders, because we have a strong military, because we cut our taxes, because we do things that everybody wanted. And then we win our election in a massive landslide. We win 87% of the counties in this country. Nobody's ever heard of a thing like that. And that's because we're doing the right job. And we took a detour down to Iran because we can't let Iran have a nuclear weapon under any circumstances. We can't let that happen. So the reporters should be happy. They shouldn't be unhappy. They should be very happy. Because you know what we're doing with saving our country. Yeah.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Mr. President, two questions. One on Iran and then one on your birthday. You willing. The first one is, are you concerned at all that the IRGC could sabotage any potential deal? And then the second one is, you have a birthday coming up. I won't say which number, but it's a big birthday. So you're gonna blow out a candle. You're gonna blow out, you know, some candles on a cake, hopefully. What are your wishes that you'd like to see accomplish for the next year for the United States and your presidency?

[President Donald Trump]

Well, I'll go in your order. Anything can happen, you know, when you're dealing with Iran, but when you're dealing with other countries, but that's a very volatile part of the world. Probably the most volatile part of the world. It's very. The people are volatile. The leadership. You see what's going on. We've gone through three teams of leadership. It's been a. You know, we're military. There's no. Never been a military like what we have, we could go another two, three weeks and just wipe everybody. Like what we have, we could go another two, three weeks and just wipe everybody out. I'd rather not do that. Very easy to do. They're ready to do. They want to do it, they want to do it. But if we can get something down and writing which will accomplish the same thing without killing everybody, I'd like to do that. Most of my people, I think, would like to do that. Some people wouldn't, but most of them would. But we had to take a detour as far as wishes for. And I'm very proud of that detour, you know, by the way, just to finish off on that. We had the strongest stock market in history. And I said, we have no choice, we have to do it. I knew it would affect it, but I was very happily surprised when I saw that today we hit another stock market high. We have the highest stock market in history with a military conflict going on or what some people call war. Some people call it a military. It's not a big thing for us. We have a great military. It's not a big thing for us. But if I didn't do that, I spoke to people like Peter, great financial people, Scott and Howard and lots of others. I said, you know, we just hit the greatest stock market in history. Everyone's 401ks are the highest they've ever been. Everybody's making a lot of money. Costs are coming down. You know, we took over the highest cost and the highest inflation in the history of our country. Costs are coming down. Everything's good. And I hate to tell you this, but we've got to take a little detour and go down to a place called the Islamic Republic of Iran. And we're going to have to stop them from having a nuclear weapon. That's what we've done. And they've agreed to that. By the way. They, I mean, if they sign the agreement, they will have agreed to, we will not have a nuclear weapon or bomb. We will not. I said, what about if they buy that went into a two week negotiation, but in the end we got that. Now we got it. If they signed the paper, in theory, they're pretty close to signing a paper. We've actually gotten along with them very well. And you know what you saw for the last few nights, it takes two to tango. You understand that? We hit them very nice. It takes two to tango. You understand that? We hit them very hard on something else unrelated. And so they were responding, but. And not, not very strongly. As far as birthday, as far as wishes I wanted to see. We have a phrase. I think it goes down, I would think, in the history of our country, maybe the history of the world is the greatest slogan or phrase ever. Make America great again. That's all I want to make America great again. I think we've come a long way. I think we're the most respected country in the world right now. By far the most respected. President Xi told me, I was talking about. He's a friend of mine. He's a good man. I hate to say it because the press goes and they say, oh, he called him a good man. He is a good. He's. He's for China, I'm for the usa. You know, it's like one of those things. But we do very well now with China. When I came here, we didn't. We're not doing well with China. My first term, when I inherited that, it was like what China was doing to us was incredible. I don't blame China. They took advantage of stupid people. Really stupid people. So we're doing great. But the phrase make America great again, that's all I want. Very simple phrase to think of, and I think it's the greatest in the history. I would say that's probably the greatest phrase in the history of the world. Not only here. There's never been anything like it. Make America great again. That's what I've done. And we've made it great. In fact, in a way, I want to use it because I would never give it up. MAGA is too good. It's too good. It really is the Republican Party. That's why we're doing so well. That's why we. You know, if you look at the Republican Party from before I came until now, this is a much different party. It's a much bigger party. We have many, many more people. And I think the thought, the mind, the thought is much different than it was 10 years ago. It's been. It's amazing. A much more powerful party, much different party, and a much more impactful party. Thank you very much.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Two questions on Iran. First, you said last week that the US Would go in and dig out the buried nuclear material in Guam with them. Did Iran actually agree to that?

[President Donald Trump]

Well, it depends on what day you're talking about. They did agree, and then sometimes they agreed. Well, that's what I'm saying. It's one of the things we talk about. It's very overrated. I'm the one that overrated it. I thought, to me, it was important to other people. It's not important because those beautiful B2 right here, the B2 bombers, the obliterated. You know, when CNN said maybe it was an obliteration, they knew. I mean, before the pilots even came back home, before anybody saw the site. But then the Atomic Energy Commission, when they said it was obliterated. That stuff is buried underneath a mountain and virtually collapses. Very, very hard to get it. One of the. But nevertheless, I want to get it. We're the only ones. Us and probably China are the only two countries that have the equipment where you can do that. So, yeah, I want to get it. We have at different times, had different. I mean, they've changed their mind a couple of times. But as it stands now, we will go in sometime in the not too distant future. It's very safe down there. You know, we have, with Space Force, we have cameras. Every angle of that of those three sites are being watched at all times. If anybody went there, we'll see exactly what's happening and we'll. We'll blow it up a little bit further. But as far as getting it is very. The B2 bombers did a job like nobody's ever seen in the night with no moon dead darkness. At one o' clock in the morning or so, they dropped those bombs, the biggest, just about as big a bomb as you can ever find. And it hit, it went down air chutes. Hard to believe that they can do the technology. It followed a beam right into the air chutes, right. Exploded. Very hard to get that material. But I still nevertheless want it. And I don't want to do it if we're in conflict. I don't want to put men in that kind of danger. I remember Jimmy Carter had some bad problems in Iran with hostages. I don't want to ever put our people in that kind of danger. But when it's over, as of this moment, it's agreed that we will go in with them. We will get it and we will destroy it. It will be destroyed to get to

[Kelly O'Donnell]

a deal with Iran, whether to go in and do that or to open up the Strait of Hormuz without seeing an Israeli cessation of their hostilities in Lebanon.

[President Donald Trump]

Given what Iran is doing, we're trying to separate it. I mean, you know, it's a very different word. We're trying to separate it. I mean, you look. It's a very different kind of a thing. We actually spoke with Hezbollah for the first time ever. We didn't know they spoke and they agreed yesterday they're not going to shoot. Israel's not going to shoot. We're just going to see. But I'd like to separate it. I'd like to have a separate thing because it is, it is separate. But Israel, hey look, they've been a great partner. Bibi Netanyahu has been for me a great partner for other people, not so good for me. He's been very good. We were very effective what we've done and they needed us. They couldn't have done it without us, couldn't have even come close. But and they needed us and they got us to help them with a real problem because Iran was a real problem.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

We'll continue to listen to the president monitor this Q and A with reporters and come back if he makes any news. He did talk about the relationship with Iran as the desire to extract uranium from the site that he enriched uranium and also talked about frustrations that he has with certainly the back and forth with Iran and how it is negotiating. Can that be worked out? Monica, I know you've been listening carefully. You'll let us know if there are other things that stand out. The president was not all that definitive on the end of the anti weaponization fund. He did say that he loves that concept and that he would be seeing what the courts might do, but certainly the acting attorney general was more definitive that that was done. Do you see some daylight there?

[NBC's Monica Alba]

That's exactly what I was going to bring up, Kelly. That really stood out to me because in that New York Post interview as well, that was the same kind of language that the president used. Well, we'll see what happens. We have to follow the court ruling but did not close the door on it the way that the acting attorney general did on Capitol Hill yesterday, saying we are not going to pursue the fund, period. I think the language was be quite definitive about that and he even got some follow up questions during the course of his testimony and was pretty clear about it. So that again is something just to go back to how we started this conversation that we see the president do. He likes to sort of leave things hanging in the air, putting them in a little bit of a legal limbo, not closing the door definitively because it sounds like he personally would still like to see this become a reality even though the rest of the administration and certainly the Department of Justice has backed off of it. Kelly?

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Monica, thank you so much. We really appreciate it. We're going to now turn to election results. We're going to speed things up a bit because obviously we took some time to listen to the president. So let me just check in now and we've been talking about last night's big primary results are still being tabulated in some key races in certainly California. But there are also some definitive answers and we'll get to the outstanding contest in a moment. But let's talk about the notable races that have been called now. In Iowa, businessman Zak Lon defeated the Trump backed candidate, Congressman Randy Feenstra in the Republican primary for governor. And the president had endorsed Feenstra in the final days of the campaign. And this is really notable in the sense that it is the first primary defeat of a Trump backed candidate this year and we've seen the president have a long stretch of successes in the primary season. This is one of those where it did not go his way. Lon, who was supported by HHS Secretary Robert F. Kennedy's, portrayed himself as a political outsider in his victory speech.

[President Donald Trump]

I don't have to tell you this, but nobody thought this could be done. We were outspent, opposed by the establishment, told to wait our turn. Well tonight the people of Iowa had something to say about that, that we're not going to wait anymore.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Lon will face Democrat Rob sand, who ran unopposed in the general election. Meanwhile, Democrats hopes of flipping Iowa's open Senate seat will rest with State Representative Josh Turek, a moderate and a former Paralympian who defeated progressive Senate State Senator Zach Walz.

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

My whole life and this is what is needed in D.C. people who have gone through real struggle, who know what it's like to not have enough, who know what a gallon of gas cost, who have had to put groceries on a credit card. We have enough millionaires in D.C. looking out for billionaires. We need real people in Washington who have felt the consequences of a broken system because when you have gone through real struggle, you will have a different level of empathy and a different level of fight.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

A taste of the messaging from primary Knight Turek will face Congresswoman Ashley Henson, who was endorsed by President Trump in the general election. That is the seat to replace Joni Ernst. In California, the race for governor remains too early to call. There are three main former HHS Secretary Javier Becerra under the Biden administration, billionaire activist Tom Steyer and conservative commentator Steve Hilton. They're all competing for two spots in the general election race through to November, regardless of party there. And in the race for Los Angeles mayor, incumbent Karen Bass will move on to the November election, although it is still not clear if she will face Democratic City Council member Nithya Raman or Republican Reality TV star. Do we say star? It was a long time ago. Spencer Pratt, he certainly made a big impact in this race. And joining us now to talk about it, NBC News chief data analyst Steve Kornacki. He joins me from his home away from home. That's the big board. And also with me is Conan Nolan, political reporter for our Los Angeles station, knbc, and a good pal of mine from the old days when I was based in la. So good to see you both. Steve, your biggest takeaway, she had a little time maybe to catch your breath, have a cup of coffee, get a little rest. Where do you think things stand right now in California?

[Steve Kornacki]

Yeah, let's take a look out there because, I mean, I think we all kind of expected it might end up being a cliffhanger in California, but here in the governor's race, really, I see Becerra is in second place here. But you have to remember that the way these things go in California is what's to come are the late arriving vote by mail ballots, and there are a ton of them. There's, you know, just over half the vote counted here. And we know that those votes skew a lot more Democratic than what's been counted so far. So the key here is that among that between the two Democratic candidates, Becerra and Steyer, Becerra has been pretty significantly outpacing Steyer. Then you add into that again the expectation that the remaining vote is going to be much more Democratic than what we've seen. And Becerra is sitting in a pretty good shape. If you're him, you're very happy with where you are right now and certainly the possibility that he would leapfrog Steve Hilton here into first place as this, as those votes are tabulated, the suspense then would become if Becerra does indeed leapfrog Hilton, is that that gap between Steyer and Hilton is that remaining vote by mail so strongly and overwhelmingly Democratic that it doesn't just lift Becerra because Becerra is not far behind Hilton. Could it actually lift Steyer over Hilton, too? And you have a situation where Becerra and Steyer, the two Democrats finish one, two lock out the Republican from the general election. That's really the remaining suspense here. I will say, when you look at these numbers, you know, again, Steyer running their 400,000 votes by, that's an awfully, awfully steep hill for Steyer to climb if he's going to leapfrog Hilton here. But again, you have that reality in California that that late arriving vote by mail comes in very slowly and does tend to be overwhelmingly Democratic. So if it was extremely Democratic, that still could come into play.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

And if I can tap into your thoughts on Iowa, when you think of what is the message going forward, is it that the president had a bit of a loss, a narrow loss in the primary, or is it that this is an open seat and it could be one of the most watched for Democrats chances to perhaps try and get in there, or is it really about defending this terrain for Republicans? What's your sense of what Iowa means?

[Steve Kornacki]

Well, the governor's race, that Republican primary is really interesting because it is a loss for Trump in that he endorsed Feenstra. But I think there might be a little bit of nuance here because we talk about the power of the Trump endorsement. And one question this raises is, is that Trump endorsement more impactful in a Republican primary when he's endorsing against somebody? Right? When he's saying, like in Kentucky, Republicans, I want Massie out, Massey's a problem. Tom Massey, the congressman who was defeated in the primary there here, Trump came in and endorsed Feenstra. But his opponent who defeated Feenstra aligned himself very strongly with Trump, with the MAGA grassroots, with that sort of populist brand of conservatism here. So, you know, Trump wasn't coming in here telling voters, you've got to stay away from him. You've got to go with Feenstrate. So did the endorsement not. Was the endorsement not as impactful because of that? And then there's this, Kelly, I just would quickly point out, look at this margin. It was 1600 votes. Trump made the endorsement of Feenstra last Friday. There had already been tens of thousands of early votes cast when Trump made that endorsement. A margin that thin, did Trump just make the endorsement too late?

[Kelly O'Donnell]

So interesting. So interesting. You are the guardian of the numbers and you always teach us something. Thank you, Steve. Let me turn now to Conan. Been as plugged in as anyone I know on politics in your home state, and you've even moderated some of the debates. You really are on the front lines of all of this. So when you look at what's happening there, what is the big story coming out of this when it comes to these two key races, the governor and the L A mayor.

[NBC's Conan Nolan]

Well, keep in mind that this is a very blue state. Javier Becerra's campaign was popping champagne corks last night, but not that again. There is some drama as to who will be in the top two, but it appears that he has drawn Steve Hilton and Kelly Remember, it was like seven months ago, we had a special election In California, Proposition 50, redrawing the congressional districts to favor Democrats. That wasn't going anywhere until Gavin Newsom said, hey, if you want to send a message to Donald Trump, then vote yes. And it passed with 64% of the vote. So you're going to need millions of Californians to change their mind about Donald Trump in November for a Republican to win statewide in the race for mayor of Los Angeles. Again, Spencer Pratt, he's a remarkable figure. He's sort of now a national spokesperson for the Republican Party when it comes to urban affairs run by Democrats. But I think he has a ceiling because Karen Bass showed that regardless of all the problems the city is facing and the catastrophic fires in the Palisades, she still is able to bring in a coalition effort. The the more leftist, I should say, Social Democrat Nithya Rahman did far more poorly than we expected, frankly, a very blue city. Spencer Pratt says he's ready for the fight, but this is going to be a very difficult task for him to get past the percentage that he already has in this in this primary.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Well, he has certainly emerged as an interesting figure in this election season. And Conan, I know you'll be watching all of it. We will check back within you with you in the weeks to come. But in our abbreviated Trump influence newscast here from his Oval Office thing, we're going to move it along a bit and I'm going to bring in our panel. Joining me now is Daniela Diaz, politics reporter for notice Antwan Seawright, Democratic strategist and CEO of blueprint strategy and T.W. arihi, Republican strategist and vice president of Push Digital Group. Thanks all of you. You also snuck into the studio very quietly because we had to move some things around. So thank you for that. Daniella, let me start with you. When you look at the Iowa governor's race, do you see limits to the president's influence or do you see this as being as Steve told us? You know, it was timing. It was the narrowness of the divisions there. How would you describe it?

[Daniela Diaz]

I mean, he put it perfectly. I was listening to what he had to say. That's why he's hanging on everybody. He's so good at what he does. I really think that it was, you know, we didn't see an endorsement from President Donald Trump until last week. Congressman, Congressman Feenstra has normally been a very low profile House Republican who I have covered on Capitol Hill. But to see this Zach Lon come forward, say that he agrees with Donald Trump say that he would obviously line up with Trump. It spoke to the Iowa voters. And I do agree with what Steve said, where there is a message that Trump sends when he endorses against a candidate, that goes farther than a message. Of all the candidates that he's endorsed in the past elections, which I have lost count, there's been dozens of candidates he's endorsed in the Republican Party.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

And tw do you see the Maha influence maybe playing a bigger role here? Lon aligned himself with that. That has a lot of legs among many voters who are interested in those issues and followed it closely. Is that an undercurrent here or is there something else that you think stands out? Is it candidate quality, the differences between these two?

[T.W. Arihi]

Yeah, I think it was part of it. I think the Maha movement has brought so many more people into the conservative fold than were there previously. But look, Lon's a farmer and he ran as a farmer and talking about agriculture and more healthy eating. But it goes beyond that. Yes, the endorsement came very late for Randy Feenshard. He was a low profile member of Congress. He ran a low profile campaign. He also didn't debate. He wasn't really seen a lot on the campaign trail. I don't know if he was resting on his. It totally matters in a state like Iowa where you gotta be meeting people skin to skin. So that hurt him as well. And yes, the endorsement came too little, too late, but if it never came, that margin would be a lot bigger.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

We also know that Joni Ernst is not running again. That opens up the seat. And Josh Turek made an impact. He is going to be on the Democratic side and Hinson for the Republicans. What are you looking for? What do you think he brings to this race?

[Antwan Seawright]

I think he expands the opportunities and the potential coalition for Democrats in November. The people, Iowa sentiments are very reflective of most of America. They're frustrated. They're pissed off about the affordability crisis.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

He was talking about some of that.

[Antwan Seawright]

They're absolutely blaming Donald Trump and the Republican Party who's in charge of government in Washington. And so sometimes in a primary and a general election, it's easier to vote against something than it is to vote for something. But I will say this about primary night. On Tuesday night, the Republican primary was framed as a loyalty contest to Donald Trump. The Democratic contests were probably framed as a gener contest and the ideological contest. And I think that is how you're going to frame this. But when it comes to Trump, and I think you will probably agree with this, it's one thing when Trump endorsed. It's another thing when he offers his support. When he offers his support, it just means he sends a message via social media or sends a signal when he offers his endorsement. That means he's full throttle, full blast on to make certain that he wins or either defeats the opposition. And I think that's how you define what happened in Iowa.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

As we were waiting for you all to come join us on the panel today, we were talking about an interesting thing happening in Alaska and that is the multiple Dan Sullivan effect. This is a challenge for voters. I want to ask you about this, Danielle. So if you aren't aware of this, there are multiple Dan Sullivans on the ballot. So there is the incumbent Senator Dan Sullivan. And then in the choice of others, there's another Dan Sullivan. So you're now asking the voter to know middle initials, which is really a high, high bar. You do have an incumbent. We've just been tickled by this as a, as a really quirky thing and sometimes Alaska has quirky elections. There are the two Dan Sullivans. As an Irish person, I can tell you that is, you know, that's like John Smith in Irish Land. So there's a lot of Dan Sullivans. What do you think this does to the race, Kelly?

[Daniela Diaz]

There's a third Dan Sullivan in Alaska.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

The former mayor. A former mayor. Oh my goodness, yes.

[Daniela Diaz]

So, you know, he's not on the ballot to be clear. But it is interesting.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Might confuse people though.

[Daniela Diaz]

The senator Dan Sullivan was on Capitol today blaming Democrats for trying to muddle the waters in the primary to confuse voters.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

It's a tactic.

[Daniela Diaz]

It's a tactic especially because of the way the primaries work in Alaska. But it also shows that this could potentially be a high profile Senate race. I talk to Democrats all the time who say that we should be watching what's happening in Alaska. I mean, it's a country or, sorry, a state, I should say, very removed from the country, but a state that is really suffering from affordability where Democrats are really could have a response. Energy costs, energy costs are high. A huge population on Medicare and Medicaid and it's, and a lot of what's happening on Capitol Hill is affecting Alaskans directly. And so that could be a reason why we could see Mary Patola, who was formerly a congresswoman, surge.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

And what do you think of that? So Mary has, Mary Patola has run statewide 1, statewide before because of course it's population based. So you can have a House member who represents the whole state. What is your sense of her place in this moment.

[Antwan Seawright]

Well, let's talk about tax the same strategy that Republicans are frustrated about, the same ones they tried in Texas just last week in the congressional race when they were trying to uplift a congressional candidate who said some inflammatory things that Democrats distance themselves from. So what's good for thee has to be good for me too. But as it relates to Mary Fertola, look, I'm a big fan. I believe in freedom and fishing as she does too. I think she is relatable to the voters who will participate in that state. Look, you cannot run away from the affordability crisis, particularly from energy costs and a health care perspect and just making basic ends meet for everyday Americans or everyday Alaskans. And I think that is a good reason and a good platform, a messaging platform for mayor to run on and I'm sure T will agree with me.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Well, do you get a sense that there is a risk here for the incumbent senator looking a little unnerved by this tactical move to have another Dan Sullivan? Does that sort of weaken his stature in this moment?

[Steve Kornacki]

Perhaps.

[T.W. Arihi]

I mean it definitely is trickery, right? If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it is a duck. There's almost no doubt that there's some trickeration going on. And if he wants to sue to figure it all out, more power to him. But let's not forget this is the same state that Lisa Murkowski won in a writing contest. The areas where the votes are counted the most in suburban Anchorage, there's only a few population centers. It is possible to educate the population on how to vote in order to

[Kelly O'Donnell]

spell her name correct.

[T.W. Arihi]

And they had to spell which is a lot tougher than saying, a lot tougher than Sullivan. But so here's the thing. He has a really strong chance. He is not seen as a crazy person. He's quite popular in the state. He knows a lot of people in the state. And secondly, let's be care about Mary Pertola. She won in a three way first time ever ranked four ranked choice vote in 2022 with two Republicans. The next time she ran Sarah Palin stayed in the race to be the second Republican and basically said Patola's my second choice.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

We can't get through Alaska without raising Sarah Palin.

[T.W. Arihi]

Right. Exactly right. So there's a lot more to that. He'll be fine.

[Antwan Seawright]

I would caution you with the environment's totally different when she ran before when she is now. Republicans are to bring to blame for the crisis that every state are facing.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

I'll Let them keep talking about that in the commercial break. Daniela, Antoine and tw, thank you so much. Still to come, common ground in the courtroom. A pair of federal judges sit down with NBC News to speak about America's political violence problem and rising threats against the judiciary. That interview is next on MEET THE press. Now, game day at my place is kind of a big deal.

[Steve Kornacki]

If I'm grilling, chillin and watching hoops,

[Kelly O'Donnell]

my outdoor patio setup better be ready to play.

[Steve Kornacki]

That's where Wayfair wins.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

From patio seating and umbrellas to grills

[Steve Kornacki]

and grilling accessories, Wayfair's got it all

[Kelly O'Donnell]

and it shows up fast. I'm talking championship level, fast and easy to delivery. So level up your grill game and your outdoor chill game and head to Wayfair.com now to get your outdoor space ready for the season. A Beautyrest mattress gives you unparalleled motion separation, isolating movement with our pocketed coil technology while providing individualized support for every sleeping position. People at their best get their Beautyrest for 100 years. Hi, I'm Kristen Welker, moderator of NBC's Meet the Press. On our broadcast, I sit down with people who make an impact in their community. From actors to activists, they all MEET THE moment. Now. We're bringing the conversation to you in a live event. Join me June 29th in New York City for MEET THE MOMENT Live with special guest Taraji P. Henson. We'll discuss her journey from single mom to actress to mental health advocate. Hope to see you there. Get your tickets [e-mail]. Welcome back. We're turning now to the latest installment of our Common Ground series where we speak to leaders working across the aisle to solve some of the nation's most pressing issues. Our colleague Gary Grumbach sat down with two federal judges, Judge Esther Salas, appointed by President Obama, and retired Judge John Jones iii, appointed by President George W. Bush, to talk about threats of violence facing the judiciary. Now, Judge Salas experienced the that violence firsthand when her 20 year old son Daniel was shot and killed and her husband was critically injured by a self proclaimed men's rights lawyer who was targeting her and her home in July 2020. Now, in the first half of this year, there have been 324 investigated threats against federal judges, according to the U.S. marshals Service, the agency that is tasked with protecting federal judges. Last year there were 564 recorded threats.

[NBC's Courtney Kuby]

Threats.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

Our legal affairs reporter Gary Grumbach joins me now. And Gary, tell us about this pair and the very meaningful conversation you had

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

yeah, these two have very different upbringings, very different backgrounds. Judge Salus is still on the bench in New Jersey. Judge Jones retired a few years back and now he's the president of Dickinson College. But they came together for this rare on camera interview because they say it's too important to stay silent right now. Our conversation begins on that horrible day for Judge Salas family. July 19, 2020.

[Steve Kornacki]

2020.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

Daniel was swinging a wiffle ball bat, and he just said, keep talking to me, Mom. I love talking to you. And it was at that exact moment, Gary, that the doorbell rang. And my baby boy's face went from calm and serene to alarmed and concerned. And before I could get him to hold off, because dad was upstairs, he just bolted up those stairs to meet his fate. And at that door was a disgruntled lawyer who had an intention of assassinating me and my son, we know now from FBI debriefings, wasn't going to let that man in her house. And he, the FBI believe because Daniel fell back with his arms in a cross position, the FBI, pretty sure he blocked his entrance. And the guy shot him point blank. One shot in the chest. And then as my husband was turning the corner from the living room into the foyer, the gun just went. The shots went towards him. And Mark was trying to get at this guy and just kept getting hit, one shot after the other shot after the other shot.

[President Donald Trump]

Shot.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

So three bullets hit five different parts of my husband's body. And Mark fought for his life that night and continued to fight for his life in the months that followed.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

In the immediate aftermath of the shooting, did you think that individual was coming for you?

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

He wanted me. I was his intended target. And what he didn't expect and what the FBI has used, that the term he was met by superior forces. I'll never forget when the special agent in charge used that term, superior forces. And that was Danny and that was my husband. He didn't expect that.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

With what you've been through, how do you keep going? How do you put on the robe every day and walk into that courthouse in Newark and do your job?

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

Because when someone sacrifices their life for you, you don't squander yours. My son's ultimate act of love was taking that bullet. And I say that sometimes, and I can't help but get misty eyed, right? But when someone gives you a gift like life, you don't squander it. And that is one of the reasons I'm out here every day, just like Judge Jones is, right, banging this drum, that something awful is happening and we have to do something about it.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

So, Judge Jones, you have not been immune to threats as well. There's several decisions going back decades that you made where you got threats. But then all the decisions, I've read somewhere that you were surprised you didn't get threats for, for example, a gay marriage related decision you made. Where do you think the line is? Why do you think you got threats for some decisions but not others?

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

You know, there's no rhyme or reason to that, Gary. And the first thing I want to say is I'm awed by Judge Salas. I don't think that I would have it in me to carry on. Maybe I would, you know, under those circumstances. One of the reasons that I feel so strongly about these issues is because I get inspiration from my friend Judge Salas. I we need to talk about these things. And God bless her for doing that. Going back to your question, the most frightening thing about the threat environment and the U.S. marshals will tell you this is it's not the person that alerts you ahead of time, typically that you're most afraid of. It's the person you haven't heard from. It's the person that comes out of nowhere. And, you know, in the current climate, it's one thing to have members of the public who sort of cleave to a particular political philosophy complain about judges and their decisions and vilify judges. Judges have been criticized since the beginning of the republic. But it's another thing again to issue what I think is a dog whistle to that very small portion, but perhaps powerful portion of the electorate that are unbalanced, that will take up arms and hurt or kill somebody because they think in their twisted minds that they're doing the work of a benefactor or vindicating some belief that they have.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

How do those threats impact to you and your fellow former judges now?

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

So, I mean, my colleagues, my former colleagues with whom I've, you know, retained great relationships with, they feel like there's a target on their back. They just do. And so, you know, they're literally almost looking over their shoulder at this point when they're outside the courthouse.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

And one of the things that I think so incredible, and I'm going to say it, and I think, I think I've said it before, but I want to be very explicit today. I think this is intentional by those individuals from the top down who are rolling out this negative PR campaign. I think it's very intentional. I don't think this is sort of them just speaking their passion. This is an intentional act.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

What's the goal?

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

Well, I'll tell you, there are two. From my perspective, the first goal is, is they want to erode the public's confidence in the justice system. When you say something, Gary is broken over and over and over again. And it's not, you know, we're here to tell you it's not. We can look at opinions, we can look at jury verdicts that I presided over. Juries get it right. We have, in my opinion, the best legal system in the world. And I'm biased, but I believe it. Right, but when you say it's. It's broken. When you say that we're corrupt, when you say that we're rogue, when you say that we're monsters, when you say that we're engaging in legal insurrectionists, that we're legal insurrectionists, when you say all that, you are doing that for one reason, and that is to erode the public's confidence. But there's a more sinister reason, and I'm going to say it as Daniel's mom, I'm going to say it. The more sinister reason is when you call us monster and when you say we hate America, and you post that on a large social platform, and when you say it in front of the cameras day in and day out and when it's written and when people put up wanted posters, all of that. The secondary reason, from my opinion as Daniel's mom, is that if something happens to one of my brothers or sisters on the bench, they had a copy. You make us villains, you demonize us, and therefore we're not that worth. We're not worth fighting for.

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

You know, it's interesting. I see this president, and I have to get specific in this case, probably more than my colleague can. But, you know, when he refers to judges as his judges, as if he possesses those judges. Judges are not his judges. Judges are emancipated. Once the Senate votes them in and their right hand goes up and they're sworn in, there's no greater evidence than that, sort of my judges than the President of the United States. Astonishingly to me, although perhaps not knowing this president going to the Supreme Court of the United States and trying to stare down the Supreme Court. You know, Gary, there's a reason that no president ever did that before, because it shouldn't happen. It shouldn't be done. I thought it was one of the most outrageous acts of, you know, attempted intimidation. And then, of course, you see what happens when rulings or arguments go away, that he doesn't respect you know, it is. He calls out his judges by name loyalty.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

So hitting on that point, how did we get here to a point where the US Marshals Service said, says this year alone, there's been 300, more than 300 threats that they're tracking against judges, federal judges, and thousands, of course, thousands of nasty tweets online and posts online. How do we get here?

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

Because I think that our president on down have engaged in such irresponsible rhetoric that gives, really, the public, and in particular sometimes, sometimes the mentally vulnerable, a green light to go ahead and come after us.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

And it's not just Joe Smith on the street saying this, right? It is the President of the United States. And that makes an impact. Right?

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

It's not just the President. You know, in my view, I think we have a completely dormant United States Congress. So, you know, we've talked about Article 2, Article 1, you know, Article 2, the presidency, Article 1, you know, the United States Congress.

[NBC's Conan Nolan]

Where.

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

Where is the shame? Where are the voices? And by the way, you know, there are members of Congress that can be at risk, too. This is flashback, you know, on them as well. And yet. And yet, you know, I don't expect this President of the United States to say anything that's going to dial down the rhetoric, but shame on the members of Congress, shame on the speaker of the House.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

And just on that note, I want to be very clear. I mean, we have seen attacks on our President. We've seen attacks on members of Congress both on the right and left. I mean, this is. This is an inability for us to agree, to disagree.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

Where do we go from here?

[Secretary Ben Wallace]

We need a national dialogue. And I think it has to start with thought leaders, with people who have a voice, who have a platform, whether they're an elected office or in. Because judges are only going to be able to do so much. I think, you know, if we don't do something at this point, people are really at risk. Physical risk. This isn't just a risk to the institution in the third branch. It's a risk to people's very lives if we don't fix this.

[NBC's Gary Grumbach]

I think it starts with how we treat each other at home and how we treat each other and how we treat neighbors and strangers and everyone we come in contact. I think it's a return to love. I really do. And I think it's. I've become a lot more of a spiritual individual since my son's murder. And it's the one thing that keeps me going, Gary. And I think it starts at home and we start to demand more from ourselves and more from our leaders. And so I think it starts with a national dialogue, but I also think it starts right at the kitchen table.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

That was so powerful. And you really drew out of them some very blunt, very emotional comments about the state of where things are right now. What do you think happens next? Pick up on what you learned from that.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

Yeah, this was a 45 minute conversation, so we couldn't fit it all into that segment there. But I think one thing that talked about a lot was the ripple effect here. The idea that young people today are seeing these attacks from their leaders in this country and thinking that perhaps that's an okay thing to do. And the fact that this could have generational impacts going years beyond just 20, 26.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

People become numb to it.

[NBC's Keith Morrison]

People become numb to it. And this is a very not a theoretical thing. Right. This is really happening. Just last week, Justice Amy Coney Barrett had a swatting attack at her house. Police were called to her house because somebody said that there was arguments happening at her home. And the Fairfax county police went totally false reporting, Totally false reporting. These are things that happen every single day. Hundreds already this year. They're on pace to break the record for number of threats to judges. And so these two judges are sitting down saying that something needs to be done about it and something needs to be done about it right now, Kelly.

[Kelly O'Donnell]

It reflects on our society and it tests all of our security resources. And it's an important conversation. Thank you for bringing it to us. And that will do it for our time today on MEET THE PRESS now. But there's there is, of course, more news ahead on NBC News now. Thanks for being with us.

[President Donald Trump]

Such an ordinary thing to walk home from high school. Her name was Mickey Costanzo, just 16. She didn't have far to go. Seemed perfectly safe. Until it wasn't. What happened to Mickey? I'm Keith Morrison and this is Five Miles From Home, an all new podcast from Dateline. Listen for free starting Monday, June 8th, or subscribe to DATELINE Premium to unlock new episodes.