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Meet the Press
Meet the Press NOW – May 6
00:49:46
State Sen. Greg Walker (R-Ind.) joins Meet the Press NOW after many Trump-endorsed candidates oust several Republican incumbents in the state Senate primary race. NBC News Chief Data Analyst Steve Kornacki analyzes the election results and what they could mean for the midterms ahead. President Trump appears optimistic that a peace deal with Iran is within reach while also renewing his threat to bomb Iran if it doesn’t agree to a deal.
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- [00:00]
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- [01:14]
Kristen Welker
Welcome to MEET THE PRESS now. I'm Kristen Welker in Washington. And that was the closing bell on Wall street with markets seeing green up roughly 600 points about the possibility of a peace deal between the US And Iran, with both sides today signaling potential signs of progr oil prices also falling below $100 a barrel today in hopes that a potential deal could reopen the Strait of Hormuz. That's where, of course, 20% of the world's oil and gas flow through Gas prices just hit a new high of the war, $4.54 a gallon. But in the last 24 hours, President Trump has offered mixed messages about where things stand, telling NBC's Garrett Hake during an event in the Oval Office this afternoon he believes Iran wants to make a deal, but the US has won the fight.
- [02:04]
President Donald Trump
You're facing an opponent right now in Iran that has refused to submit. You seem optimistic. Now you may be closer to a deal. What's different about this moment now than in other moments where a deal has seemed close?
- [02:16]
Well, why do you say they refuse to submit? You don't know that. You don't know what's going on.
- [02:20]
They were firing on US Ships a few days ago.
- [02:22]
Yeah, no, a few days ago is a long time ago. You know, in the world of war, a few days ago. No, they want to make a deal badly and we'll see if we get there. If we get there, they can't have nuclear weapons. You know, it's Very simple. But what's not to submit? And their leaders are all dead. So I think we won. Now we have to get what we have to get. If we don't do that, we'll have to go a big step further. But with that being said, they want to make a deal. We've had very good talks over the last 24 hours and it's very possible that we'll make a deal.
- [02:59]
Kristen Welker
Would you expect to hear about never a deadline?
- [03:01]
President Donald Trump
It'll happen, it'll happen, but never a deadline.
- [03:05]
Kristen Welker
In a post on social media this morning, President Trump warning Tehran if it doesn't agree to a deal, quote, the bombing starts and it will be sadly, at a much higher level and intensity than it was before. For its part, Iran says it is reviewing the US Proposal, but has yet to convey its response to Pakistani mediators. All of this comes after President Trump announced yesterday he was pausing Project Freedom, that's the US Military operation to, to guide vessels through the Strait of Hormuz. Just two days into the operation, the president's top economic advisor trying to explain
- [03:40]
President Donald Trump
that decision today, the president showed with his resolve that we were willing to start escorting ships through. And I think that that was maybe the thing that pushed the Iranians one step closer to making a deal. I could tell you that I was walking around in and out of the building yesterday, seeing a lot of action in the Situation Room with negotiators, and it looked like the mood was high. It looked like the mood was that we'll have to see what happens. You never know with the Iranians. But absolutely, it looks like the folks that are negotiating these things seem to be feeling like they're making a lot
- [04:13]
Kristen Welker
of progress right now. Despite that optimism from the administration, the war remains unpopular with the president underwater on his handling of the war as well as his handling of the economy. The economic dissatisfaction in part driven by rising gas prices, with 63% of Americans blaming President Trump for the increase in prices, that includes almost a third third of Republicans. Joining me now is NBC News White House correspondent Monica Alba, NBC News senior national security correspondent Courtney Kuby, and Ken Pollack, vice president for policy at the Middle East Institute. Thanks to all of you for joining us for starting us off. Monica, let me start with you at the White House. What are you hearing from your sources about the status of peace negotiations at this hour?
- [04:57]
Monica Alba
Well, Kristen, there is a sort of sense of optimism, but it's something that I have to say we have heard time and time again throughout the course of this 10 week conflict where it Appears like the administration wants to project that there is perhaps more progress than there actually is. That is what this moment feels like. But the President again is saying he believes there has been progress over the last 24 hours. He believes Iran wants to make a deal very badly. Though we should say that whenever the President has said that in recent weeks, there have been signs from Iran that really point to the opposite where they have maintained and been quite resilient and quite defiant. So whether this time is different, that is the real question. But it does appear as if the President is implying that there is a discussion over these multi point plans that we have been talking about again for weeks. But the real central issue here is what might be different this time. And the President said again he feels that he's going to be able to solve this potentially through negotiation, but at the same time and in the same breath is continuing to make these threats and potentially considering resuming major combat operations. So it does still seem to be a juncture that we've been at before, only for the President to make that threat, to back down from it again, say that then in person negotiations maybe need to take place and then this process sort of all starts all over again. It feels like we're in that moment. Even though the difference here, Kristen, is that the President is saying it's unlikely that he will send his son in law Jared Kushner and special envoy Steve Witkop for any kind of in person talks. Right now it seems like all of this is happening more behind the scenes.
- [06:31]
Kristen Welker
Well Monica, let me follow up with you on these multi parts potential plans that are coming together. What do you know about what's in them? What would a potential agreement look like at this point?
- [06:42]
Monica Alba
Mon and according to the President, it has been what he has said from the beginning of this, that for the U.S. from the U.S. perspective, Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon, that it needs to abandon its nuclear programs. There is a lot riding on whatever Iran and the US May agree to when it comes to the enriched uranium. For as for today, our own colleague Kelly o' Donnell asked the President what the plan was going to be for the enriched uranium in terms of getting it out of Iran. The President told her, quote, we're going to get it. When Kelly followed up and said but how Mr. President would that work? He simply repeated we're going to get it. So that is still a major sticking point that is likely to be the subject of a lot of conversation as well as whatever happens with the Strait of Hormuz. The timing of all of this. And we should just remind everybody that back when the jcpoa, when that nuclear deal was negotiate with Iran years ago, that process took so much time. This is not the kind of thing that can really be hashed out in a matter of days. It's a much longer process. So is this the potential beginning of that? It's also unclear, but that certainly seems to be what the administration wants people to think. Again, we've been here before only for that to pretty much collapse.
- [07:54]
Julie Serkin
Kristen.
- [07:55]
Kristen Welker
Yeah, absolutely, man. And of course, all of this happening, gas prices continue to tick up. They're hovering close to $5 a gallon. As we mentioned, the majority of Americans bl President Trump for that increased price at the pump. The president's also set to leave on that trip to China next week. How does all of this, Monica, factor into some of the pressure that's building on the president to bring this war to an end?
- [08:19]
Monica Alba
And there is an absolute awareness on both of those fronts and they are major factors in any conversation and any discussion that the president is having around the war. Specifically, when you talk about that trip to Beijing, the president is supposed to be leaving about a week from now. And I am told that is such a priority for the administration that they are basically trying, trying to ensure that everything goes according to plan, that the president is going to be able to go on that trip. Remember, he already had to postpone it and move it once because of the war against Iran. So for now, that is a factor we know in these discussions and certainly that is something that has contributed to the President's timeline here, the way he's making these decisions. And certainly when posed to the White House about whether they would like this all to be wrapped up before he leaves for China, the president said, yes, that would be ideal. But in terms of how that would actually work, that's a far more complicated question.
- [09:09]
Kristen Welker
All right, Monica Alba, covering a lot of ground for us and starting us off today. Monica, as always, thank you so much. Courtney Kuby, let me turn to you. So of course, we've been talking about these tensions that are increasing in the Strait of Hormuz and the Pentagon today saying it fired on a ship that it believed was violating the US Blockade. What do we know about that and how does that fit into this broader picture?
- [09:29]
Courtney Kuby
So that answers one question. The blockade is definitely still in effect by the US Military. It was an Iranian flagged tanker that was making its way through the Strait of Hormuz. The US Military reached out to it it several times. They said, hey, you're in violation of the blockade. You better turn back around. They didn't do so. This is the first time that we're aware of anyway during this blockade where the US in this case launched an F18 off the USS Abraham Lincoln and it actually fired its cannon guns and took out the rudder of that ship that, that the US Said was in violation of the blockade. So it was able. It's no longer headed towards the port in Iran. According to U.S. central Command. That's the first time that we're aware of where there's actually been a fighter jet that's taken out the ship as opposed to other ways that they've firing directly from the ship down onto the, the ship that's in violation of the blockade.
- [10:13]
Kristen Welker
Well, it's just so significant because that's the focus of so much of the tensions that have been building. Court Secretary Pete Hegseth said yesterday that hundreds of ships are lining up to transit the Strait of Hormuz. And then President Trump paused the program. What's behind the thinking of pausing this?
- [10:32]
Courtney Kuby
Yeah, that's been the big question that we've been trying to figure out. It's not a, it's not a secret that this was a surprise to a lot of people who were involved. We do know that there were ships that lined up both physically and sort of getting ready to get in line to make their way through that passageway. As far as we know, the US has only announced or acknowledged that they brought two US Flagships through through that passageway. That was on Monday. We're not aware of any that actually went through yesterday. But the, the, the US Military was definitely ready to continue this and make this a passageway where they would bring ships through for the foreseeable future. It was cut off, I mean, only, but 36 hours into it. So only the two got through that we're aware of.
- [11:13]
Kristen Welker
Wow. And you have new reporting about that. What more can you tell us?
- [11:17]
Courtney Kuby
Yeah, we were trying to figure out ever since President Trump announced this on social media on Sunday afternoon, exactly what this was going to look like, even though it was, it was somewhat short lived. A U.S. official told us today that in fact, it's paused right now. It's not actually clear that it's not going to potentially restart at some point, but for now they're calling it paused. We knew that this involved U.S. navy ships that were somewhere inside the Gulf, somewhere in the Gulf of Oman. We knew that there were aircraft that were involved that were sort of flying overwatch as the ships would make their way through the passageway. We know that the US Military was involved with drones and, and, and robotics that were clearing the way of any potential mines in advance of this all starting. But what we learned yesterday is that in fact, the US Military also embarked US Military security teams on those first two ships that went through. They were Marine security elements. And that just shows how seriously they were taking this. And also it, it really ups the potential danger for the US Military now that both of those ships took fire in the form of Iranian cruise missiles, Iranian drones, and that at least six Iranian small, fast boats were making their way towards those ships, threatening them as they were making their transit.
- [12:23]
President Donald Trump
Wow.
- [12:23]
Kristen Welker
All right, Courtney, a lot to keep track of. Thank you so much for being here. We really appreciate it. Ken, let me turn to you. So the Trump administration, as Monica was laying out, appears to be striking a note of optimism about these peace negotiations. But obviously there's plenty of reason to be pessimistic. The President says Iran wants to make a deal, but it seems like they're leaning towards this short term solution. How does that address the broader problem of Iran's nuclear program?
- [13:00]
Ken Pollack
Apologies. You'd think by now I'd have learned to unmute myself. So first, I think that Monica's skepticism is well warranted. We've heard this from the Trump administration before. Let's also recognize the Iranian regime is badly divided to the least. We've heard all kinds of voices there. It's not entirely clear who is in charge, although so far we've mostly seen the hardliners as the ones who have been making the decisions out there. And so I think that we have to take all of this with more than a few grains of salt. That said, there are reasons out there that I think that we can say that this might actually be a moment where we could get a deal. I'll come to the nuclear issue in just a moment. But it's worth recognizing on the pro side, for the United States, yes, the, the US Military seems to have gotten to a point where they can protect ships coming through the Strait of Hormuz. That's going to be very frightening to the Iranians. On the con side, the Iranians may be behind the scenes blackmailing our Gulf allies if they're willing to pay to have ships go through, even if surreptitiously. That would be good for Iran, very bad for us. And then a last factor we should consider, the Chinese. The Chinese are clearly putting a lot of pressure on the Iranians. They may be putting pressure on us as well. Well, that's a mixed bag. But that too may be ultimately bringing us to some kind of an agreement, at least on the Strait. As for the nuclear program, as you point out, it's just not clear what we're actually going to get. The U.S. the Iranians seem pretty far apart on that. And you know, for President Trump, this is ultimately what that war was about. If the United States can't actually get a deal that deals with Iran's long term nuclear program over the long term, that may not be a satisfactory end to this war.
- [14:51]
Kristen Welker
Well, it'll be fascinating to see what develops with any negotiations over the next 48, 72 hours. Let me ask you, because according to analysts at S&P0 Ships have transited the Strait of Hormuz today. What do you make of the president's decision to pause that operation to guide vessels through the Strait? What are the implications of that?
- [15:11]
Ken Pollack
Well, first question, I'm as mystified as anybody else. I don't know exactly what's going on. Again, I can certainly create a narrative whereby the Iranians may have gone very quickly to the Pakistanis and said, you know what, we like the latest proposal from the United States. We like it enough that we're close to saying yes, but just ask the president to pause Operation Project Freedom and we'll get back to him. That'll be we'll take that as a sign of his seriousness if he's willing to do so. And again, because the US Navy and I think the entire US Government actually does feel like Project Freedom really is doing its job right, that this, this may be a real game changer in the Strait of Hormuz, I suspect that they were willing to take that pause to see if the Iranians are actually serious.
- [16:02]
Kristen Welker
And Ken, just quickly, before I let you go, do you see any evidence of Iran's nuclear program having been, as President Trump said, obliterated or significantly weakened?
- [16:13]
Ken Pollack
So, but no one actually knows, Kristen, because of course, the spikes back in June buried the vast majority of the program. And, you know, we just haven't had the kind of inspections that we would need to know for certain. That said, there is a high degree of confidence among, you know, a whole wide variety of experts all over the world believe that ultimately, yes, the program was extensively buried, the enriched uranium is buried. But that also, of course, creates the questions around, well, then why did we feel the need to start this war if the Iranian nuclear program had been so badly set back, which everyone seemed to believe it was?
- [16:54]
Kristen Welker
All right, Ken Pollack, thank you so much for your insights and great information today. We really appreciate it.
- [17:01]
Greg Walker
My pleasure.
- [17:02]
Kristen Welker
Coming up, President Trump and his allies ousted at least five prominent incumbent Indiana Republicans in last night's primaries as revenge for not supporting the president's redistricting agenda. We're on the ground in Indiana with the reaction and what it means for the Republican Party. Plus, Steve Kornacki is at the big board tracking all of last night's election results in real time and what they mean for November's midterm races. You don't want to miss his analysis. That's next. You're watching MEET THE Press now.
- [17:31]
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Kristen Welker
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- [18:32]
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- [19:01]
Kristen Welker
Welcome back. If it's Wednesday, we have election results, including the closely watched Republican state Senate primaries in Indiana where five of the seven incumbents who opposed the president's redistricting push were defeated by Trump backed challengers. At this hour, State Senator Greg Good is the only one projected to hold on to his seat. With the final incumbent still locked in a tight race separated by just a handful of votes, that race is still too close to call. Joining me now is NBC News chief data analyst Steve Kornacki and Shaquille Brewster on the ground in Indiana. Steve, let me start with you. Walk us through last night's results and what we know about the remaining uncalled race there.
- [19:40]
Steve Kornacki
Yeah, well, take a look, Kristen. Here is the map here highlighting the districts here in Indiana that Trump had targeted here, where Republican state senators had voted against him on that bid to redraw the state's congressional office. Where you see that pink color? That means those state senators lost. The Trump side won. And the margins where this happened generally were landslides. This is Lake county here. This is basically the Chicago suburbs. Republican incumbent here was absolutely clobbered who had voted against that redistricting plan. A loss here. This is another state senator who was defeated, Trump endorsing the challenger. This was a member of state Senate leadership, Republican leadership, who opposed Trump, who got beaten by the Trump back candidate. It was a landslide here. It was a landslide here. By the way. This is also, this district right here is a Republican state senator who voted against redistricting and who got drummed out last night. Trump, for reasons that are not well understood, did not actually endorse the opponent here. But it seems the Republican voters there understood the dynamic of the way they did in all these other districts and voted out that incumbent anyway. So, as you can see, as you said, there was one who survived down here in Terre Haute, one incumbent who defied Trump who survived, and then there's this one outstanding race. So the Trump forces in these, of these eight incumbents, six of them have been defeated, one survives, and then one's fate is still to be determined. And we can just zoom in here and show you that. Thought we could just zoom in. Here we go. And show you that race right here. I mean, it doesn't get much closer than this, but it's three points. Spencer Deary is the incumbent, Paula Copenhaver is the challenger. You're talking about West Lafayette, where Purdue is, some rural areas. And basically what's happening here is we're just trying to figure out how many provisional ballots there might be here. We're talking about potentially a dozen, two dozen ballots, something like that. Obviously, with the margin that, that close, this is not something we're going to be in a hurry to call, but this is the one incumbent, you know, left here who has a, a chance of hanging on potentially. So it's either gonna be 7 for 8 or 6 for 8 for the Trump side. And in that sense, the outcome of this almost doesn't matter because the message that Comes through from the Trump side. Very clear after this.
- [21:49]
Kristen Welker
Steve, I can't remember the last time we saw a race separated by three votes. That's just astounding. I think you're right. We'll take our time. Before we call that one, let me ask you about Democrats. They continued to overperform, including in Michigan state special election. Tell us more about that.
- [22:04]
Steve Kornacki
Yeah, I mean, this has been the story of Trump's second term. We've had these special elections. When I say special election, you're talking about like, not, not in November, low turnout. Only the most committed go to the polls. And the Democrats, the Democratic base has been more committed in those elections than the Republican base. They keep doing much better than they did in 2024. It continued last night. This was a special election for a state Senate district in Michigan. You can see here, this is Democrats had held this seat and they continue to hold it by a landslide here. Again, this is consistent with what we've seen in all these other special elections. The significance of, of this one is it preserves Democratic control of the state Senate in Michigan. With a win here, Republicans could have moved into a tie. Instead, the Democrats win. They win in a landslide. And again, it's just that story we've seen here, that Democratic base, there's a component of that base that is clearly showing it wants to turn out in any and every election. It's very motivated. It's very plugged in right now. And when Donald Trump isn't on the ballot in these low turnout special elections, the Republican base, you're just not seeing that same level of enthusiasm. So we keep seeing results like this in special elections.
- [23:10]
Kristen Welker
Remarkable. All right, Steve Kornacki, as always, thank you so much for the breakdown. We really appreciate it. Shaq, let me turn to you. You're on the ground there. You actually spoke to one of the Trump act winners, Trevor DeVries, before polls closed last night. How did he describe the president's influence on the race to you?
- [23:29]
Shaquille Brewster
Well, he said it's a big factor, Kristen, and just to kind of paint the picture a little bit, this was minutes before polls were close, closing and set to close, and he was still handing out flyers to people who were going into the polling locations. But you can tell from his body language how confident he was feeling. He knew he was in for a good night. He suspected that other challengers in these primary races were in for good nights. And he was right. And he won his race by more than 50 points. And for some color on the ground, when you look at his lawn Signs that have been around this, this district. He had Trump's name on top, and then it said, Trump endorses de Vries. So that just gives you a sense of how much he leaned into that endorsement. So I asked him, right before polls are closing, what do these Senate races say about President Trump's influence here in Indiana?
- [24:19]
Unidentified Interviewee
Listen here.
- [24:20]
He's the sitting active president of the free world. At the end of the day, it's an honor and a privilege to be endorsed by President Trump.
- [24:28]
President Donald Trump
And really,
- [24:31]
Unidentified Interviewee
he's been the driving force in the Republican Party for the past 10 years at this point. I mean, he's the one helping push for change and helping reform a lot of the things that people are upset about and been disenfranchised by the political systems over the past couple decades. So him, he won our district heavily and he's going to continue to move the needle in Northwest Indiana. It's a fire incumbent season right now, and people are just tired of, of
- [24:55]
Kristen Welker
feeling like they're being left out.
- [24:58]
Shaquille Brewster
Now, one of the incumbents who was fired in another district said that this was about retribution and retaliation. You had another Senate leader who's on the opposite side, a Republican, but kind of gets some heat from President Trump and other Republican leaders here. He said that it's about the outside money that came into these local state Senate races. But look, this was a good night for President Trump and his allies. They got nearly exactly what they wanted and what they were expecting heading into this primary.
- [25:31]
Greg Walker
Kristin.
- [25:31]
Kristen Welker
All right, thanks for bringing us that interview and that breakdown of the results overnight. Steve and Shaq really appreciate it. And joining me now on the phone is one of the Indiana lawmakers who lost his reelection bid, State Senator Greg Walker. Thank you so much for joining us, sir. We really appreciate it.
- [25:50]
Greg Walker
Thanks for having me.
- [25:52]
Kristen Welker
I want to start by just getting your reaction to last night's results, not just for you, but for your other colleagues who were defeated.
- [25:58]
Greg Walker
Did so I think many of us were surprised at the strength of the Trump endorsement. I've served my district well for 20 years. We have other long term incumbents that we're feeling positive that we're getting a lot of good reinforcement from people we talked to. I had an amazing volunteer team and we felt confident that our message was getting out that Indiana is Indiana and there were actions on the part of the Oval Office where they have no jurisdiction over choosing election maps for the state. That's our responsibility and we can act on that as we see fit for the, for the constituents that we serve and I was receiving 90% approval of support for rejecting midterm redistricting from my district. And it was from across the political spectrum. There have been many Republicans that told me how turned off they were by the pressure on the President of the United States to where we had members that were being swatted, myself included, bomb threats, et cetera. And it was just that sense of force and coercion and authoritarianism that really struck a bad tone in this in the Indiana Senate.
- [27:15]
Kristen Welker
So I do have to ask you, do you regret anything about voting against redistricting? It sounds like you don't, but I want to just let you.
- [27:25]
Greg Walker
I made the right choice. My very first words when I heard of this was this is ridiculous and this will backfire. And clearly on the national level, it has been a backfire. There have been no groundswell of Republican drafted seats. But given the climate of the Nation, Indiana's current 7 and 2 breakdown of the congressional delegation could very well be a six or three. Once we reduce some of the margins of safety in some of these districts, there clearly is room for two Democrat congressmen to represent the citizens of the state of Indiana, and they were elected by their peers. And I just, having heard the testimony and seeing the map itself, felt so strongly that Hoosiers were best served when we did our responsibility to the best of our ability. I believe the final bill was even unconstitutional in two different ways, and that apparently didn't ring a note with many who supported it. So it's an unexpected result, but I'm not upset about it, at least for me.
- [28:38]
Kristen Welker
Let me ask you, do you think there are broader implications or lessons for the Republican Party as November approaches?
- [28:47]
Greg Walker
Oh, yes. I think this was meant to be a clear message of retribution. I have described myself as a pawn on the chessboard of the Indiana Senate trying to protect my king. And that's the pro tem rod branch, a man of good character. Great character, great leadership, who can count. He didn't twist arms, he didn't try to force votes. And he knew this was such a personal issue for each one of us, where we had various reasons why we supported or rejected it. But it's clearly meant to be a message sent to the nation that you will pay a dear price. And I have to ask folks that voted here in District 41 or anyone in the nation, do you think that Indiana serves better when we're under coercion and threat, or do you think we serve better as legislators when we're allowed to have our own cognitive abilities and reason things out and use our best judgment. How do you think we're best served? And I think as you look at the approval level of Congress, that probably gives you the answer you need. It's a land of hyper partisanship and threats of primaries constantly and all the horde poll power and that's no way to govern.
- [29:59]
Kristen Welker
Do you think that the influence that President Trump showed in Indiana, in your race and other races there, do you anticipate that will be replicated in the midterms or do you think that these races in other states are more complicated at the statewide level?
- [30:21]
Greg Walker
Well, for one thing, at some point they run out of money. $9 million was spent attacking from within the Republican Party. You would think some of those funds might be useful to incumbents in Congress that would like to run for re election that currently represents a Republican Party. But I think because it will be interpreted as a success on the part of the Oval Office, that they'll do everything within their power to replicate it. But it's consistent with model. And that's my point. It's anyone that stands up and says we don't agree with the president, you're a rhino, you're a loser. Whether he he appointed his own cabinet members or had those in his own legislative party or judiciary, it's the same tired tune of rhino loser. And I don't understand why it continues to be effective. We can't all be right in one person wrong, can we? Can the whole nation be wrong and one person right? I don't think that's possible.
- [31:21]
Kristen Welker
Well, we certainly appreciate your joining us to give us your perspective and your reaction a day after these races. State Senator Greg Walker, thank you so much for your time today. Really appreciate it.
- [31:33]
Greg Walker
Thank you so much. Take care.
- [31:35]
Kristen Welker
You too. Please take care. Coming up next, we'll dive deeper into the political fallout from last night's elections as new polling shows the president and his party losing ground with voters in the battle for the midterms. The panel joins me right after a quick break. Stay with us on MEET THE press. Now, Who are you celebrating this Mother's Day. Shop Etsy for handmade planters for a plant mom or custom accessories for a pet mom. Celebrate all moms with unexpected Mother's Day gifts on Etsy. Shop the Etsy app.
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President Donald Trump
Breaking news just coming in moments ago.
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- [33:02]
Kristen Welker
Let's just take a step back.
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- [33:14]
Kristen Welker
Welcome back. The president's approval rating remains underwater across a slate of recent polls. A new polling shows Democrats with a midterm edge. According to a new NPR PBS Marist poll, voters say they are more likely to vote for the Democratic candidate in this year's midterms. Democrats also have an edge when it comes to which party's voters are the most enthusiastic about voting, though Republicans catch up when somewhat enthusiastic voters are included. Joining me now is our panel, Kate Santilliese, congressional reporter at Axon Antoine Seawright, Democratic strategist and founder and CEO of Blueprint Strategies and Rob Bluey, president and executive editor of the Daily Signal. Thanks to all of you for being here. Kate, I want to start with you. Let's talk about these results out of Indiana. Some people calling them the first stop of President Trump's retribution tour. Obviously, he was targeting these lawmakers who opposed his redistricting effort in Indiana. You just heard from State Senator Greg Walter Walker, defiant, unapologetic about opposing the president's redistricting plan. But what are you hearing from lawmakers here? What are they reading into the results last night?
- [34:21]
Kate Santilliese
I think what these results show is that President Trump's influence over the Republican Party still remains strong. I think we've seen a lot of coverage over the last few months about how the MAGA base is fractured or divided. But the fact that five out of these seven state Senate candidates, five of them that had Trump backed challengers lost their races. That's not a really great sign for that argument anymore. So we know that President Trump and his team spent over $13 million on these races. And these are races that typically don't garner national attention. They don't garner that kind of money. But it shows that if Trump wants something done, he's going to get it done. And it also sends a message to other Republicans, if you go against the president, there's going to be consequences for that. So that's a warning sign for lawmakers like Thomas Massie, Senator Bill Cassidy, who are both coming up in primaries with Trump backed challenges.
- [35:08]
Kristen Welker
Yeah, how is a Cassidy or a Massie looking at the results last night? I mean, $13 million is a lot of money. They have a lot of money to spend in their races as well, and a lot of groups who are supporting.
- [35:21]
Unidentified Interviewee
And Kristen, you know as well as I do that incumbents just naturally have the advantage in a lot of these races because the name ID and everything else that goes into incumbency. And so in both of the cases that you mentioned, I think Massie's counting on the fact that he has a constituent relations team that has probably helped bolster his image in that particular district. But ultimate, I think what you're seeing not only is the president's influence, but you're seeing the grassroots conservatives and Republican voters wanting people who are going to fight. They're frustrated by what happened in California with Gavin Newsom's redistricting. They're frustrated with what happened in Virginia. And they say why aren't these Republican lawmakers standing up and trying to create a level playing field?
- [36:00]
Kristen Welker
Antoine?
- [36:00]
Antoine Seawright
Respectfully, Rob, California and Virginia, the people made their decision by casting their votes at a ballot box. A lot different than what was trying to take place in Indiana and other places where Republicans redrew them. But there's some underlining things I think we have to look at with Indiana. $113 million is a lot of money for state legislative races that usually garner a couple hundred thousand dollars. I'm not saying that Trump has not hijacked the Republican Party and have turned it into the MAGA extremists. What I am saying is that every race is different. I would also add that in a primary election you get some of the more activated and extreme voices who participate. That's not a true sample size of the entire spectrum of, of the electorate. And I would say from a southern state like South Carolina, when you vote in a Republican or Democratic primary, most of the time that's the only chance you have to have your voices heard. So the dynamics are a little bit different. I think we have a lot more ball to play before we make an assumption about how the game is going to play out.
- [36:58]
Kristen Welker
Rob, do you want to respond to that? I see you.
- [37:01]
Unidentified Interviewee
I don't disagree that the primaries often are given the way that the districts are drawn, the time for voters to cast their ballot, and it's often when you see those conservatives or liberals come out. But ultimately I think that what it sends the, the message that you were talking about is that as these other states consider redistricting, whether it be a South Carolina or Florida or wherever the case may be, they are going to feel that pressure to follow what the president is wanting them to do.
- [37:24]
Antoine Seawright
But more and more people are becoming independent thinkers and a lot of people do not want to be guilty by association. So that means if you vote in the Republican primary, you're considered one of the MAGA extremists and a lot of people do not want that tag on their clothing, if you will, going into a general election where more and more people want to separate from the modern day Republican Party.
- [37:44]
Kristen Welker
Kate, let's talk about about the broader backdrop here to the midterms, the fact that you still have this war in Iran ongoing. It has dragged down the president's approval rating. The latest is this NPR PBS mayor's poll, which I think we can show you. It shows just how unpopular the president is.59% disapprove of the president right now in that poll, Pew found 64% disapprove. Washington Post ABC 62% disapprove. These are bleak numbers heading into the mid terms for the president and his party.
- [38:19]
Julie Serkin
Yeah, I, I would have to agree.
- [38:21]
Kate Santilliese
I don't think this is a great sign for President Trump or for congressional Republicans who have been begging him to talk about the economy, talk about affordability, tout the wins that they got in the one big beautiful bill that passed last year. But Trump has been increasingly preoccupied, especially with the war in Iran, which as we know, has caused these high gas prices that voters are unhappy with. So congressional Republicans among them, there's a lot of anxiety right now about whether they can run on the economy, whether they need to do more. A second reconciliation bill that folks focuses just on affordability measures. But as you know, that's a really steep ask. They're working on a tight timeline. It's not going to be easy to get done. But there's a lot of anxiety among them right now about this.
- [38:58]
Kristen Welker
Rob Kate brings up the point about Republicans wanting to be focused on the economy. Take a look at how many people blame President Trump for these high gas prices. 69%, 63% of respondents say they blame President Trump for these high gas prices. Is there enough time, time for Republicans to shift the narrative? We're not in the summer months yet.
- [39:19]
Unidentified Interviewee
Well, that's a good point. Yes. We can't remember what happened back in February we have such a short attention span as the American people these days. So yes, I think the President is counting on the fact that hopefully the American people will be focused on something else come voting time in in the fall. The President's numbers I should point out are not that different from the Democratic Party's disapproval numbers either as all of those polls you decide. So Antoine can can come back to me on that but I want to just pick up on the reconciliat think that now is the most important time for Congressional Republicans to be putting forward a positive agenda that's focusing on a lot of those domestic issues, namely energy and the cost of gasoline and whatever they can do, they need to get it done.
- [39:58]
Antoine Seawright
Rob, in reality magonomics has been a failure. Voters are expressing their disappointment by way of feelonomics economics they can feel.
- [40:06]
Kristen Welker
What about this point though that Rob makes which is the Democratic Party is as unpopular as Trump.
- [40:12]
Antoine Seawright
That may be true but is the people that they will vote for on the ballot in November not a party? And what you will find is when Democrats stay massive discipline on an economic agenda that speaks to the failures of the Republican majority including on health care, utility prices, gas prices, grocery prices, the cost of the basic necessities. We win that argument every seven days a week, ten times a day. And I'm fine with having an economic discussion on that. But the other thing I would just remind Rob is that just like the 20 healthcare is going to be a top down in this cycle. You have 25 million Americans, 18.2 million Americans in red states who are paying higher premiums, co pays and deductibles because of the Republican majority's lack of awareness to extend those ACA subsidies. That is going to make a difference in November.
- [41:04]
Kristen Welker
And Kate, there is a big debate inside the Democratic Party. Should it focus on economics? Should it focus on an anti Trump message message? What are you hearing about the contours of that?
- [41:15]
Kate Santilliese
What I've heard from Democrats is a lot of them do want to focus on this economy message and that's a public push that we've seen from them as well. They think that they can hit Republicans on high gas prices. They think that there are some flaws in the one big beautiful bill that they can also hit them on. They think that didn't go far enough. And Republicans are also feeling confident that they can message on that really well too. Some have acknowledged that there has been a little bit of flubbing there on the messaging side not fully explaining what was in that. But it seems like both parties do want to be talking about the economy right now.
- [41:45]
Kristen Welker
All right, guys, unfortunately, we're out of time. Great conversation, though. Thank you so much. Really appreciate it. Kate, Antoine and Rob. Coming up after the break, Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick on Capitol Hill as he faces pressure to explain his changing stories about his ties to Jeffrey Epstein. What we're learning about his testimony today to House investigators. Stay with us. You're watching MEET THE PRESS now. Welcome back. The House Oversight Committee is now turning to a top Trump administration official for answers as part of its investigation into Jeffrey Epstein. Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick testifying behind closed doors today. Lutnick was a longtime neighbor of Epstein in Manhattan and has given shifting accounts of his interactions with the convicted sex offender, initially claiming that he he had vowed in 2005 never to again be in the same room as Epstein. But the Justice Department's release of files then revealed that Lutnick visited Epstein's private island in 2012. Secretary Lutnick faced questions about his shifting accounts when testifying before the Senate in February.
- [42:54]
President Donald Trump
Secretary Lutnick, I think you understand the root of concern here. It's the way you describe, described very emphatically your first encounter with him in his apartment, said you were disgusted, would never have any contact with him again. Did you, in fact make the visit to Jeffrey Epstein's private island?
- [43:18]
Howard Lutnick
I did have lunch with him as I was on a boat going across on a family vacation. My wife was with me, as were my four children, children and nannies. I had another couple. They were there as well with their children. And we had lunch on the island. That is true, for an hour. And we left with all of my children, with my nannies and my wife all together. We were on family vacation. We were not apart to suggest there was anything untoward about that in 2012. I don't recall why we did it.
- [43:56]
Kristen Welker
What? Nick has denied any wrongdoing and he has not been accused of any impropriety tied to Epstein. NBC News Capitol Hill correspondent Julie Serkin joins me now. Julie, thanks so much for being here after a busy day on Capitol Hill. So what are Oversight Committee members saying about this closed door testimony?
- [44:14]
Julie Serkin
Well, like most things, Kristen, you're getting different narratives from the same people who are in that room. So Democrats came out, a number of them were in there for this testimony today even though they're on recess. And they told us that Howard Lutnick statements were flailing, that he was sweating, he had sweat on his brow because he appeared nervous in the room, that he really didn't give clear explanations for why he shifted his answers on his connections and relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. Take a listen to a little bit of what we heard from Congressman Khan and then you'll hear Chairman Comer on the other side.
- [44:43]
President Donald Trump
Now we know why that interview was not videotaped. If Donald Trump had seen the video transfer transcript, he would have fired Howard Lutnick. It was really embarrassing. He was asked very straightforward questions about whether he regretted misleading the American people. It was just contortions and lies and no acknowledgment that he misled the American public.
- [45:12]
House Oversight Committee Member
We asked some very substantive questions the first hour. The Democrats during their hour repeated the exact same questions because there's only so many questions you can ask Howard Lutnick, who live had a property next door to Epstein in New York, but talked to him three times over a decade. He was on the island with his family, with his wife and kids, six people in his family and six people in his friend's family family for lunch for two hours. And he has admitted that.
- [45:49]
Julie Serkin
So, Kristen, the long and short of it is over four hours, Howard Lutnick sat behind closed doors. It doesn't seem like we really got anywhere with his testimony today. And the question now for Democrats is do they push to have a public hearing now?
- [46:01]
Kristen Welker
Well, and the other question you heard Congressman Connor reference the transcript. Will the transcript be made public? If so, when can you anticipate that happening?
- [46:10]
Julie Serkin
It will be made public as the other transcripts for the number of individuals that the committee had interviewed over the last few months has been made public as well. It will take a couple of weeks. They have a lot of lawyers pouring over these documents. But the one thing the public will not see is a video version of his testimony. You heard Congressman Khan allude to that in there. Chairman Comer's response to that is, look, Howard Lutnick appeared voluntarily. He was not subpoenaed. We didn't have to depose him. And so our practice is not to record those individuals.
- [46:36]
Kristen Welker
And who else is expected to testify at this point, Julie?
- [46:39]
Julie Serkin
Well, the really big name that everybody's kind of waiting for on this committee is Pam Bondi, the former attorney general. She is somebody who sort of had oversight of this process in terms of these files, how they were handled, the back and forth that we saw, not just from Democrats but also Republicans who really want to see her in that hot seat even though she no longer has a role in this administration. She's expected to to appear voluntarily for a transcribed interview at the end of May. Again, no video expected with that as well. But this committee's investigation is not, you know, closing down anytime soon. They will continue to call people because they have that pressure, including from some of the president's voters.
- [47:12]
Kristen Welker
All right, Julie Serkin, thank you so much for being here. Really appreciate it. We do want to turn now to some sad news from the world media. Longtime media mogul and businessman Ted Turner has died after a long battle with a progressive form of dementia. Turner built a television empire back when cable TV was still in its infancy, and he transformed the way news and politics are covered, creating CNN, the country's first 24 hour news channel. His brash style and shrewd business acumen earned him several nicknames, including Captain Outrageous. NBC's Tom Brokaw asked Turner about that statement style when he appeared on Meet the Press back in 2008.
- [47:53]
Tom Brokaw
Throughout the course of your career, you have been known by a variety of nicknames. The Mouth of the South. I don't like that one, particularly Captain Outrageous. I don't mind that one. How much of that, however, is a true expression of what you're feeling at the time and how much of that is a kind of a marketing device to draw attention to Ted Turner and all of his enterprises? I never use those terms to describe myself. They just, you know, sometimes you get hung with that sort of thing. Is that part of hard to shake? Is that part of your past now? I would like to think so.
- [48:29]
Kristen Welker
Ted Turner was 87 years old. Welcome back. California politics will be front and center tonight with candidates for Los Angeles mayor and governor of California squaring off in a pair of debates tonight airing on our NBC station. In Los Angeles. In the LA mayoral race, Mayor Karen Bass will face off against challengers City Council member Nithya Raman and reality TV star Spencer Pratt. Then the seven top polling candidates for governor, both Democrat and Republican, will take the debate stage. It will be their second debate in as many nights. At last night's debate, former Health and Human Services Secretary Javier Becerra, who rose in the polls after former Congressman Eric Swalwell dropped out of the race, was the target of multiple attacks from his fellow candidates.
- [49:21]
President Donald Trump
We don't need MAGA values, but we also don't need more of the same. There's a lot of talk on this stage, but we should be honest. The experience we hear from Secretary Becerra didn't lead to better outcomes. It led to 85,000 migrant children who were lost. More fraud in our health care system. Being in bed with oil companies is a mistake. Javier Becerra has taken the max amount of money from Chevron and he has said they're good guys that we need.
- [49:47]
Kristen Welker
Yeah, it's a rich response from a
- [49:49]
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- [49:57]
Kristen Welker
NBC News correspondent Dana Griffin joins me from Los Angeles. So, Dana, we saw the candidates mixing it up there, of course, the backdrop to this, Eric Swalwell no longer in the race. What were the key takeaways last night?
- [50:11]
Monica Alba
Yeah.
- [50:11]
Dana Griffin
So, Kristen, I will say that at one point we thought that this was going to be a jump ball race because after Swalwell dropped out, it was unknown who was going to be the top contender. But I can tell you right now, there's a new poll out that shows the that's from the California Democratic Party and it shows that Democrat Javier Becerra and Republican Steve Hilton are now tied for first place in that race for governor, each with 18% support. The number of undecided voters has dropped from 24% in March to about 14%, which is a clear sign that voters are paying attention to this race. And then you've got the Riverside County Sheriff chad Bianco at 14% and billionaire Tom Steyer at 12%. So it is leaving this race pretty unpredictable. And they sparred over the biggest issues that are plaguing California from homelessness, cost of living, that billionaire tax, proposed tax that is going like to likely be on the November ballot, and also public safety, which is a major concern for California.
- [51:06]
Kristen Welker
Krista, let's talk about the mayor's race now. This is a fascinating one. You have Mayor Karen Bass. As I said, she's facing off against Nithya Raman and Spencer Pratt, an unlikely candidate, but there he is. What are you going to be watching for on the debate stage tonight?
- [51:26]
Dana Griffin
I'm going to watch for what we expect to see. What we expect are going to be fireworks, especially after this AI generated parody video that Spencer Pratt reposted showing him as Batman and the leaders of the state and and the city being tomatoed by some of the residents here in California. He's also getting some heat for another campaign ad. And let's take a quick look at that one.
- [51:53]
Spencer Pratt
This is where Mayor Vass lives. You notice something? Or here where Nithya Raman's $3 million mansion sits. They don't have to live in the mess they've created.
- [52:02]
Kristen Welker
Where you live.
- [52:05]
Spencer Pratt
This is where I live. They let my home burn down. I know what they the consequences of failed leadership are. That's why I'm running for mayor for my sons and the rest of us Angelinos that want to stop these corrupt politicians from destroying our city.
- [52:22]
Dana Griffin
Now, Pratt was also grilled on a local radio station for that particular ad, some questioning whether he's painting the full story because he is, in fact, renting a home through his insurance benefits after his home burned down during the LA fire. So the question of wealth and if he's painting the full picture will likely come up. And I'm sure there will be lots of questions on all the other hot topics that are plaguing the city of la, which are similar to the state issues, which are affordability, the economy, crime, and also that major issue of homelessness.
- [52:54]
Kristen Welker
Kristin Absolutely. Dana Griffin, thank you for covering all of the critical races for us out in California. We really appreciate it. And you can watch the California gubernatorial debate presented by NBC Los Angeles in Telemundo 52 tonight at 10:00pm Eastern, 7:00pm Pacific Time right here on NBC News. Now we are back tomorrow with more MEET THE Press. Now there's much more ahead on NBC News. Now,
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