Episode Overview

Main Theme:
This episode of "Mick Unplugged," hosted by Mick Hunt, features Dr. Darrell Stickle—an internationally recognized expert on trust in leadership. The conversation explores why trust is more vital than ever as a “leadership superpower,” how trust works in personal and professional contexts, why it’s so elusive today, and what practical steps leaders can take to foster a culture rooted in trust.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Dr. Darrell Stickle’s “Because”—His Deeper Drive

• Personal Motivation: Darrell shares how personal hardship and family drive his mission. He mentions growing up in a tight-knit, remote Canadian community, dealing with disability (legally blind), and suffering a traumatic brain injury as a teen.
• Empathy Rooted in Vulnerability: His own journey created empathy and a compulsion to help others understand and build trust. His two sons are a primary motivator:

  "I feel like I have an obligation to try to make the world a better place and a strong motivation. Because of my sons. I want the world to be a better place for them." (04:30)

• Professional Trajectory: Early work in crisis intervention, Indigenous land claims, and consulting (including at McKinsey) led him to deep academic and real-world engagement with trust.

2. Defining Trust—and Why It’s Risky

• Definition:

  "Trust is the willingness to be vulnerable when we can't completely predict how someone else is going to behave." (00:00, 11:36)

• Risk Equation:

  "Uncertainty times vulnerability gives us a level of perceived risk, and we each have a threshold of risk that we can tolerate." (00:00, 11:36)

• The Modern Challenge: Increased uncertainty in the world raises the “cost” of trust:

  "What we're seeing right now is that our vulnerability is fairly set, but uncertainty is bouncing all over the place." (11:36) "That's why our trust levels are so low right now." (12:58)

• Memorable Framing: “Trust is a risk. And it wouldn't be so rare if it didn't have the potential to be harmful.” (17:27)

3. Trust Destroyers—and What Most Leaders Get Wrong

• Most Common Mistake: A lack of awareness about trust dynamics; leaders overestimate their trustworthiness.
• Interesting Stat:

  "95% of people believe they're more trustworthy than average... The biggest gap we find is between how much leaders believe they're trusted and how much they actually are." (14:34)

• Key Practice:

  "The impact that we see is often around creating a vocabulary that people can use... actually having conversations with one another." (15:29)

• Practical Suggestion: Leaders should regularly ask, “What does great look like for you?” to bridge expectation gaps and show benevolence, integrity, and competence. (16:00)

4. The Modern Employee and the Changing Nature of Workplace Trust

• The Core Currency:

  "For the modern employee, trust is the number one form of currency today." (19:23)

• Rejection of Traditional Incentives: Younger generations value trust and transparency over pensions or benefits, especially in a world of side hustles and instability.
• Broken Social Contract:

  "It doesn't feel like any of that's true anymore. I believe the social contract is broken." (20:13)

• A Call for Safe Harbors:

  "As a leader today, I need to be able to think about how to build a safe harbor, create a place of stability for those I lead so that they're willing to work hard for a shared objective." (21:43)

5. Practical Steps for Leaders—Building a Culture of Trust (Especially for Small/Medium Businesses)

• Context and Incentives: “Be mindful of how they structure things, how they manage the context. Do they reward the right behaviors?” (22:36)
• Three Levers: Benevolence, Integrity, Ability
  • Benevolence: Show you genuinely have others’ interests at heart. Ask people directly what having their back would look like for them.

    “Now you've created a moment where there's a possibility for transparency.” (24:07)

  • Integrity: Follow through on both explicit and implicit promises. Check in frequently on progress and expectations.

    “We actually need to understand what promises people think we've made.” (25:54)

  • Ability: Establish what excellence looks like, both for yourself and in your employee’s eyes. Regular, open conversations help. (27:00)
• Anecdote: “If one of your employees says to you, I'd like to get promoted here ... I'm going to hold you to the standard of the next level up. I'm going to start giving you opportunities...” (25:30)

6. Trust & Remote Work

• Problem: Evaluating trust is harder without face-to-face contact.
• Observable Vulnerability: Consider how and when employees are willing to be vulnerable remotely: Do they share concerns, challenge ideas, admit mistakes?

  “How can their employees make themselves vulnerable to them? And then do they?... Do they push back against ideas, do they speak up in meetings?” (28:38)

• Cultural Rituals: Use intentional rituals (like mandatory cameras in virtual meetings) to simulate "eye contact" and connection.
• Better Questions: Instead of “Do you trust me?”, ask “Where's your uncertainty at?” or “What are you feeling vulnerable about right now with this?” (30:54)

7. Trust as a Learnable Skill

• Growth Mindset: Even seasoned leaders must continuously work at trust.

  “Even you, as skilled as you are, can get better. This is a skill that we can build.” (31:52)

Memorable Quotes

• Dr. Darrell Stickle:
  • “Sometimes a hard road can be a good teacher.” (03:51)
  • “The rules of the game have changed, and they [younger generations] have a better understanding of it than we do.” (21:05)
  • “I wrote the book so that if I disappear, what I know doesn’t. Trying to get the signal through the noise.” (38:59)
• Mick Hunt:
  • “For the modern employee, trust is the number one form of currency today.” (19:23)
  • “Everyone should be trying to get better. And I know that I can get better.” (40:23)

Notable Moments with Timestamps

• Definition of Trust & Its Risk: (00:00, 11:36)
• Darrell's "Because"—His Motivation & Background: (03:38–10:56)
• Academic Turning Point—Trust as a Doctoral Focus: (08:16–10:56)
• The Levers of Trust—Benevolence, Integrity, Ability: (22:36–27:19)
• Shifting to Remote Work and Trust: (27:44–32:14)
• Quick Five Segment (books, habits, favorites): (32:17–36:41)
• Why the Book "Building Trust" Fills a Critical Gap: (36:41–39:01)
• Contact Info and Next Steps: (39:01–40:36)

Quick-Fire Highlights

• Best Book on Trust: Darrell’s own Building Trust: Exceptional Leadership in an Uncertain World—recommended for “how” as much as “why.” (33:45, 36:41)
• Trust-Building Habit:

  "I try to have positive impact on somebody every day.” (35:32)

• Trust Building Meal: Steak—because the atmosphere of a steakhouse naturally breeds trust. (34:47–35:23)
• Remote Trust Tip: Create space for vulnerability, use meaningful questions, and mandate “face-to-face” (on cameras) when possible. (28:00–32:14)

Actionable Takeaways

• Leaders should actively discuss what “success” and “trust” look like with their teams.
• Trust requires deliberate vulnerability, transparent communication, and regular calibration of expectations—especially in a volatile or remote-first world.
• Everyone, regardless of experience, can strengthen their trust-building skills through curiosity, empathy, and honest self-reflection.

Resources & Ways to Connect

• Dr. Darrell Stickle’s book: Building Trust: Exceptional Leadership in an Uncertain World
• Website: trustunlimited.com
• Podcast: The Imperfect Cafe
• Contact: darrell@trustunlimited.com

This episode is essential for leaders who want to unlock the “human code” of modern leadership, with actionable guidance from one of the world’s top trust experts.