Mick Unplugged: Michael Tubbs – Governing with Heart, Elevating Stockton, and Fostering Inclusive Urban Progress

Released on June 16, 2025

Introduction

In this compelling episode of "Mick Unplugged," host Mick Hunt engages in an enlightening conversation with Michael Tubbs, Stockton’s youngest and first Black mayor. Tubbs, a national leader in universal income, shares his journey from overcoming personal adversities to spearheading transformative policies in Stockton, California. This discussion delves deep into Tubbs' motivations, leadership philosophies, and the significant impact of his tenure as mayor.

Discovering the 'Because'

Mick Hunt opens the dialogue by probing Tubbs' deeper motivation—the 'Because' that fuels his relentless drive beyond the conventional 'Why.'

• Tubbs on His 'Because':
  "I really feel a big responsibility to make stories like mine less rare so to really illustrate to people that you can find talent, you can find intelligence everywhere if we create more opportunity."
  (02:52)

Tubbs attributes his purpose to his personal experiences, including having an incarcerated father, growing up in poverty, and witnessing gun violence. These challenges instilled in him a desire to ensure that government serves everyone, respects the dignity of all individuals, and provides equitable opportunities.

Reflections on Mayoral Tenure

Tubbs reflects on his time as mayor, emphasizing both the honor and the intense focus it required.

• On Leadership and Responsibility:
  "I think it was not a burden, but a real responsibility and a real focus on, like, no, this is not for some other people. It's for me. It's for my family. It's for my neighborhood."
  (06:00)

He discusses how governing Stockton necessitated a different approach, given his unique position as a young, Black mayor from a challenging background. Tubbs highlights the importance of being bold and innovative to meet the community’s expectations.

Transforming Stockton: Then and Now

A significant portion of the conversation centers on Stockton's evolution under Tubbs' leadership.

• Stockton’s Diversity and Challenges:
  "Stockton is the most diverse city in the entire country. You have over 100 languages spoken in our public schools... But there was such different cultures all intersecting, interacting in a very interesting way."
  (07:41)

Tubbs paints a vivid picture of Stockton’s rich cultural tapestry juxtaposed with its socio-economic challenges, including high crime and low literacy rates during his upbringing.

• Achievements and Shifting Narratives:
  "We were named an All-American city two of the four years when I was mayor... People were coming to Stockton not to study the pathology of poverty or the pathology of violence, but to see how do we reduce homicides by 40%, or how do we do this guaranteed basic income thing."
  (11:00)

Under his leadership, Stockton gained national recognition not for its problems but for its innovative solutions, such as reducing homicides and implementing universal basic income programs. This shift in narrative positioned Stockton as a model for overcoming urban challenges.

The Importance of Community Engagement

Tubbs emphasizes the critical role of community involvement in effective governance and policymaking.

• On Partnering with Local Government:
  "Democracy is a team sport. I do think there's a role for everyone. So maybe it's not elected office, but can you be a planning commissioner?"
  (12:59)

He advocates for active participation in local government, whether through elected positions or community boards, highlighting that impactful change requires collective effort and support.

• Government Contracts as Opportunities:
  "There’s so much wealth created through government contracting... they go through an RFP process, but you’ll know about the RFP if they know you."
  (19:16)

Tubbs discusses how government contracts present significant opportunities for local businesses to contribute to community development while building generational wealth.

Coping with Public Scrutiny and Political Resistance

Addressing the inevitable challenges of public office, Tubbs shares his strategies for maintaining resilience amidst criticism and opposition.

• Mindfulness and Focus:
  "Having some sort of mindfulness and spiritual practice... just reminding myself that this is a moment, but this is not like a forever, forever thing."
  (24:13)

• Selective Engagement with Criticism:
  "I would try not to read the comments on social media... share with me critiques of the work. I'll tell my team."
  (25:12)

Tubbs underscores the importance of staying focused on objectives, seeking constructive feedback, and maintaining a support system to navigate the pressures of leadership.

Debunking Myths About Public Policy and Innovation

Tubbs challenges common misconceptions about the role of government in fostering innovation.

• Government Can Be Innovative:
  "One myth is that government can't be innovative... It just takes catalysts, it takes leadership, it takes activation, energy to push."
  (26:01)

• Not All Innovation is Beneficial:
  "Being in government taught me that no innovation can be good or bad. Like innovation in itself isn't a virtue."
  (26:01)

He cautions that innovation must be purpose-driven and critically assessed for its impact, rather than being pursued for its own sake.

• Policy Making Often Lacks Rigor:
  "Our public policy is based off vibes and biases... question everything, like research everything."
  (26:01)

Tubbs highlights the need for more data-driven and thoughtful policy formulation to ensure effective governance.

Advice for Young Leaders

Offering guidance to aspiring leaders, Tubbs emphasizes the value of starting small and building competence alongside passion.

• Start with Small Beginnings:
  "Do not despise small beginnings because the Lord rejoices in seeing the work. Start the work, begin the beginning of a process."
  (28:26)

• Marry Passion with Competence:
  "Passion without competence is irrelevant... you have to marry that passion with some knowledge, with some understanding."
  (31:28)

He advises emerging leaders to gain experience, develop essential skills, and combine their enthusiasm with informed strategies to drive meaningful change.

Current Endeavors and Future Aspirations

Tubbs updates listeners on his ongoing projects and future ambitions.

• Running for Lieutenant Governor:
  "I'm running for lieutenant governor of California... vice president of the second largest, fourth largest economy in the world."
  (31:39)

• Initiatives for Economic Equity:
  "I run a group called In Poverty in California... making the California dream real for everyone."
  "Mayors for a Guaranteed Income... ensuring everyone has a floor to stand upon."
  (32:52)

Tubbs is actively involved in initiatives aimed at economic upliftment and ensuring baseline living standards for all, reflecting his commitment to inclusive progress.

Connecting with Michael Tubbs

Listeners eager to engage further with Tubbs can connect with him through social media and his website.

• Contact Information:
  "You can follow me on Instagram or on X: @michaeltubbs. And you go to my website, michaeltubbs4ca.com."
  (33:06)

Conclusion

Mick Hunt wraps up the episode by reinforcing the central theme: unleashing one's 'Because' as a superpower for transformative leadership. Michael Tubbs' journey exemplifies how personal adversity, when coupled with purpose and effective leadership, can lead to significant societal impact. This episode serves as an inspiring blueprint for leaders and changemakers striving to make meaningful contributions to their communities.

Notable Quotes

• Michael Tubbs on Motivation:
  "I really feel a big responsibility to make stories like mine less rare so to really illustrate to people that you can find talent, you can find intelligence everywhere if we create more opportunity."
  (02:52)

• Michael Tubbs on Governance:
  "We weren't just focused on solving problems; we were focused on making sure our governance felt different because the people voted for something different."
  (07:14)

• Michael Tubbs on Resilience:
  "Having some sort of mindfulness and spiritual practice... just reminding myself that this is a moment, but this is not like a forever, forever thing."
  (24:13)

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