Podcast Summary: "Kejsi Hodo and the 'Invisible' Referendum to Change Italy's Citizenship Laws"

Migrant Odyssey — Hosted by Stephen Barden
Episode Date: May 25, 2025

Episode Overview

In this episode, Stephen Barden speaks with Kejsi Hodo, an Albanian-born activist now living in Bologna, Italy, about her personal migration story, her activism, and the upcoming national referendum aiming to reduce Italy’s citizenship residency requirement from 10 to 5 years. Kejsi is a leading figure in the campaign and shares firsthand insights into the struggles migrants face, the intricacies of citizenship law reform, and the broader vision for a more inclusive Italy.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Finding Safety and the Meaning of Home

[01:09 – 03:29]

• Kejsi’s Safe Space: Kejsi finds safety underwater in the sea, particularly the Albanian coast, or in intimate conversations with her two best friends.
  • "When I think of the safest place, it would be underwater, in the sea... but when I cannot go, it's my best friends. Our chats... are one of the safest places." (Kejsi, 01:47)
• Redefining Home: For Kejsi, home is not a single location. It is centered on people—family and friends in both Albania and Italy.
  • "Home cannot be just one place, but it's about the feeling and the people you are with." (Kejsi, 02:48)

2. Migration Experience and Early Frustrations

[03:50 – 08:19]

• Initial Emotions: Kejsi describes her first feeling after arriving in Italy as "frustration" due to language barriers, academic setbacks, and missing friends.
  • "First emotion that comes to mind... is frustration because I had to leave behind my friends, my school... and I couldn't understand what was happening around me." (Kejsi, 03:57)
• Welcoming Community, Unwelcoming Institutions: While her school and neighborhood in Bologna were supportive, public institutions (especially immigration offices) felt cold and bureaucratic.
  • "The people that surrounded us were really welcoming and kind... [but] public institutions, unfortunately, especially immigration offices... didn't feel welcoming at all." (Kejsi, 05:27)
• Rapid Adaptation: Kejsi became fluent in Italian within six months, driven by her desire to communicate and integrate.
  • "I studied, I swear, day and night... the language was the first thing, because I really hated not being able to communicate." (Kejsi, 07:04)

3. Privilege, Appearance, and Integration

[08:19 – 09:33]

• Kejsi credits her experience of rarely facing discrimination partly to her appearance, which fits in with Italy’s "mainstream" image; she acknowledges this is not the case for all migrants.

4. Civic Engagement and Social Work

[09:33 – 15:13]

• Early Political Interest: Kejsi's civic engagement began in middle school and has since spanned youth councils, social work, and academic pursuits.
• Work in Juvenile Prisons: Kejsi helped run identity-focused workshops for young men in Bologna’s juvenile prison via the association Next Generation Italy.
  • "It was... very confusing for me because... the guys, it felt like any other class... then you realize what they've lived through. You really accommodate the activity towards their needs." (Kejsi, 10:29–13:15)
  • Main goal: Help participants envision identities and futures beyond incarceration.

5. The Biografilm Festival Project

[17:05 – 18:30]

• The juvenile prison project evolved so inmates now judge biographical films at Bologna’s annual Biografilm Festival, further encouraging personal reflection and agency.

6. The Referendum to Change Italy’s Citizenship Law

[18:42 – 26:40]

• Campaign Rationale:
  • Italy’s citizenship law (from 1992) is outdated, rooted in “ius sanguinis” (citizenship by blood), which excludes long-term, non-Italian-resident contributors from full civic participation.
  • "This law... doesn't account for these people. So last year there was this idea of the referendum—let's see what Italian society actually thinks about this law." (Kejsi, 19:46)
• Signature Drive and Record Mobilization:
  • Over 500,000 signatures—gathered in record time and entirely online.
  • "We collected the signatures in September, within 20 days, a historical record for Italy." (Kejsi, 19:40)
• Barriers and Systemic Issues:
  • Non-citizens cannot vote at any level, remain “invisible,” and face complex, costly citizenship applications.
  • Even children must prove a “clean” criminal record from their country of origin—a process described as absurd and burdensome.
  • "You are asking if a 10-year-old is a criminal because they were born in Albania. And it's also very costly." (Kejsi, 23:15)

7. Government’s "Invisible" Response

[26:40 – 29:10]

• The current government has downplayed the referendum, providing no national promotion despite legal requirements.
  • "The news about the referendum is not being published anywhere, not even national television, which it should be by law... This is a huge problem for us." (Kejsi, 27:12)
• Kejsi frames the act of making the referendum invisible as undermining democracy.

8. Political Allies and Shifting Positions

[29:10 – 33:19]

• Supporters: Major labor unions, various political and social organizations.
• Forza Italia’s Shift: Initially supportive, Forza Italia later opposed the referendum once its momentum became apparent.
  • "Now Tyani has gone out to say that they won't support, they don't support the referendum, [and] invite people not to go to vote... it shows... how politics change." (Kejsi, 30:16)

9. Greater Vision and Movement Building

[33:54 – 37:20]

• The referendum is part of a broader push for “a more just Italy,” united by concerns about democracy, constitutional values, and rising neofascist rhetoric.
  • "If I have to say it in just two words... it would be a more just Italy. We want a more just Italy." (Kejsi, 33:54)
• Campaign alliances (with unions, activists, etc.) will persist after the vote, driven by shared concerns about justice and rights.

10. Campaigning Realities Across Italy

[37:20 – 42:21]

• Kejsi has traveled extensively but mostly engaged “the bubble” of supporters.
• Few direct confrontations from opponents but frequent moments of shifting perspectives when explaining the real-life impact of the current law.
  • "Even when somebody doesn't agree with you 100%... and they say, oh, okay, actually, you're right about that... that's very... amazing, actually." (Kejsi, 39:47)
• The campaign adapts to all venues—schools, concerts, workplaces, football matches.
  • "Any type of events, any type of places, because... we're being basically rendered invisible by the government and by the media." (Kejsi, 41:18)
• Passage of the referendum could immediately enable 2.5 million people to begin citizenship applications.

11. Personal Future and Ongoing Activism

[42:21 – 43:51]

• Kejsi has been accepted to Columbia University for a master's in Human Rights Studies and intends to continue her work at Dalla Parte Giusta della Storia, particularly on migrants’ rights and symbolic elections for non-citizen residents.
  • "It's a mixture of studying, working, activism. I mean, that's what my future looks like." (Kejsi, 43:39)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On being rendered invisible by law and institutions:
  "I've never voted. I'm not represented in any institution. I'm invisible to the institutions of this country because I cannot express my vote."
  — Kejsi Hodo [21:05]

• On changing personal perspective through conversation:
  "Whenever you tell people what this actually means for daily life, they start to understand. And that's... amazing, actually."
  — Kejsi Hodo [39:47]

• On the broad vision of the movement:
  "We want a more just Italy... Because even with this government, but not only this government... people are really afraid of the future of the country, because we have a lot of neo-fascists organizations."
  — Kejsi Hodo [33:54]

• On the symbolic and practical meaning of the referendum:
  "When the referendum passes, it means from 10 June onwards, people who come to Italy after five years, they can apply for citizenship. And it means that from 10 June, potentially 2 million and a half people can become Italian citizens."
  — Kejsi Hodo [41:43]

Important Timestamps

• [01:09] — Kejsi’s safe place and definition of home
• [03:57] — Emotions arriving in Italy and early frustrations
• [07:04] — Mastering Italian in six months
• [10:29] — Social work in juvenile prison
• [17:05] — Biografilm Festival and juvenile inmates as film judges
• [18:42] — Launch of referendum campaign
• [19:46] — Rationale for changing citizenship law
• [21:05] — Personal consequences of not having citizenship
• [23:15] — Cost and absurdity of the current application process
• [27:12] — Government's lack of publicity for the referendum
• [30:16] — Forza Italia’s political reversal
• [33:54] — Movement vision: “A more just Italy”
• [39:47] — Impactful conversations changing minds
• [41:43] — Potential immediate impact if referendum passes
• [43:39] — Kejsi’s future plans

Summary Tone & Language

This episode is reflective, personal, and deeply candid, drawing on Kejsi’s lived experiences to illuminate systemic challenges. Both host and guest maintain a thoughtful, often urgent tone, blending story and advocacy.

For listeners seeking to understand Italy's changing identity, citizenship laws, and the grassroots efforts to transform them, this episode offers insight, emotion, and a call to action.