Episode Overview

Podcast: Mike Birbiglia’s Working It Out
Episode: 194. Pete Holmes Returns: Vulnerability is Everything
Host: Mike Birbiglia
Guest: Pete Holmes
Date: December 1, 2025
Theme:
A candid, hilarious, and deeply insightful exploration of stand-up comedy, vulnerability, joke-writing, and the often unspoken emotional philosophy of performing. Birbiglia and Holmes “work out” new material, share war stories, challenge each other’s ideas, and delve into why authenticity and sensitivity are at the core of great comedy.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Comedians and Their Names

• Opening Bit ([00:00])
  • Mike observes that many comedians’ names perfectly fit their comedic persona ("Bill Burr is Bill Burr," "Stephen Wright is Stephen Wright," etc.).
  • Pete adds, "Were they born into these names, or did they grow into them?" ([27:25])

2. Philosophy of Stand-Up: Audience Connection & Vulnerability

• The duo discusses the myth that it's always the comedian’s job to make things work—sometimes, "it's the audience, too." ([07:19])
• Mike stresses, “I’m not doing this at you. I’m doing this with you. It’s different every time because of you.” ([08:17])
• Eddie Murphy Doc Reference ([09:04])
  Pete recounts Murphy’s emphasis on “sensitivity and vulnerability” being the true key to artistry:

  “He really hangs a lantern on that. ...Actually it’s him being like, no, no, no. It’s about sensitivity.” -- Pete ([09:23])

3. Blending New Material and Punching Up Jokes

• Both admit the podcast sometimes focuses less on punchline “workshopping” than advertised, and today’s goal is to change that. ([04:51])

4. On Cut Jokes and Comic Voice

• Mike discusses jokes that don’t make it because they feel inauthentic—despite their technical quality ([16:14]).

  “There’s a level of intuition ...it’s like looking at your whole show as a piece feelings, not just for them, but for you.” — Mike ([15:39])

• Story of a joke about his mother:

  “When it didn’t work, it was too costly. It made me feel like a bad son. So I just cut it.” — Mike ([18:10])

5. The Dynamics of Joke Context

• Both explore how a joke's success often relies on subtle audience setup and perceived justice ("comedy balance").
• Mike: “Justice is a big part of comedy...” ([19:35])

6. On Self-Perception & Competitiveness

• Pete: “You can’t see yourself. ...Dave [Chappelle] can’t tell how great he is.” ([11:42])
• Later, on being a bad athlete:

  “I’m a fierce competitor who loses.” — Pete ([47:27])

  • Mike reframes:

    “You don’t know what a disappointment it is to be fiercely invested in winning, and God made you like this.” — Mike ([47:55])

7. Joke Construction, Authenticity, and the Art of Editing

• Holmes and Birbiglia probe the fine line between a “good” joke and the right joke for a particular performer.
• Discussions about jokes being cut because they might send the wrong message or don’t fit their personal ethos ([23:15]–[24:20]).

8. Comparing Modern and '80s Parenting

• Pete’s bit on modern fathers being more anxious, multi-tasking parents versus the distant "monsters" of Pixar’s past ([36:02]–[38:04]).
• Analogies: “We're all iPhones with too many apps.” — Pete ([37:35])
• Mike: “In the '80s, it was a landline, and dad didn’t answer it half the time.” ([37:43])

9. Cinematic Coolness: Why Do We Want to Be Movie Stars?

• Explores the trope of “cool” in movies—quiet characters, swallowing pills without water ([40:09]), and how these markers of coolness are unattainable for “real” people.
• Pete:

  “There’s something more there...how are you never going to be the thing you grew up wanting to be?” ([44:03])

10. Storytelling: The “Massage Parlor” Story

• Mike shares an extended personal story about an awkward (but platonic) massage parlor experience in Canada ([53:35]–[59:51])—punctuated by physical comedy, and his pride in “being the Elvis Presley of not getting an erection” ([56:34]).
• Pete encourages weaving personal vulnerability and cinematic references together across stories for greater callback potential ([59:30]).

11. Vulnerability, Authenticity, and Growth

• Repeated theme:

  “Vulnerability is everything.”

  • Pete notes how Steve Martin, Eddie Murphy, and others succeed not by bravado, but emotional exposure and honesty ([09:04]–[09:39]).

12. Working Out for a Cause

• Pete highlights Homeboy Industries, a gang rehabilitation program, as a favorite charity ([64:51]); Mike praises its ethos of “unconditional love.”

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On artists' sensitivity:
  “There’s a point at which he [Eddie Murphy] says the key thing about artists is their sensitivity and their vulnerability.” — Pete ([09:04])

• On failed jokes:
  “If you were in the audience, you wouldn’t laugh. ...You haven’t found out how to make yourself laugh yet.” — Mike ([13:43])

• On authenticity:
  “Just because you thought it doesn’t mean you have to say it. ...Especially if it’s a joke. Yeah, it’s funny.” — Mike ([14:13])

• On joke selection:
  “There’s jokes that are good jokes...but for whatever reason, out of your mouth, people are like, no.” — Pete ([18:10])

• Mike on his all-time most worked-on (discarded) joke:
  "Have a God that's better than your manager at Applebee’s. But...could never make that work. ...It’ll be in 'Kill Your Darlings,' for sure. So it'll live." ([21:11])

• Self-definition:
  "I'm the Michael Jordan of losing." — Pete ([48:32])

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Comedians & Their Names: [00:00], [26:22]
• Discussion on Making a “10” of a Show: [07:11]–[08:17]
• Eddie Murphy Doc & Vulnerability: [09:04]–[09:39]
• Audience Collaboration & Regional Humor: [08:34]–[09:04]
• Cutting Jokes for Authenticity: [16:14]–[18:11]
• Parenting, Modern vs. Old School: [36:02]–[38:07]
• Coolness in Movies: [40:09]–[42:05]
• Massage Parlor Story: [53:35]–[59:51]
• Working Out for a Cause: [64:31]–[65:56]

Memorable Comedy "Workshop" Moments

• Hot Tub Story:
  Pete tells a story about a stranger offering up bad jokes in a hotel hot tub; Mike helps him punch up the exchange ([31:07]).

  “I also feel like I might get along really well with his wife. You’re my least favorite member of your family, and these are optimal conditions. We’re in a hot tub.” — Pete ([33:08])

• Pete’s “Losing” Bit:
  Hilarious brainstorming:

  “I think people give losers a hard time. ...You don’t exist without me. I’m your god… I’m the Michael Jordan of losing.” — Mike ([48:32])

• Denzel Taking Pills Without Water:
  Both riff on movie tropes about “coolness,” with Mike dreaming up a combination of cinematic habits to contrast with real life ([40:15]–[41:32]).

Closing Reflection

Pete:

“Vulnerability is everything.”

Mike:

"I listen to [Father Greg Boyle's] books before I do stand-up because I find opening my heart is more important than rehearsing the words." ([65:11])

Cause of the Episode:

• Homeboy Industries: Largest gang rehabilitation program in America; ethos of “unconditional love” ([65:36]).

Summary

This wide-ranging, sharp, and emotionally earnest episode epitomizes the blend of joke-craft, honesty, philosophical inquiry, and riotous friendship that defines Working It Out. Mike and Pete navigate the high-wire of writing true, personal material, all while interrogating what makes a joke land, what makes some jokes get “cut,” and why risking vulnerability onstage is, truly, everything.

If you’re a comedy fan, a performer, or just someone fascinated by what makes people (and jokes) tick, this episode is both essential listening and a masterclass in collaboration and self-examination.

Useful Links

• Pete Holmes: Instagram, You Made It Weird Podcast
• Homeboy Industries: homeboyindustries.org
• Mike Birbiglia: Website, YouTube Channel

Note:
For bonus content where Pete and Mike punch up listener-submitted jokes, subscribe to Working It Out Premium.