Mind of a Monster: The Cross-Country Killer

Episode 3: Hunting Grounds

Release Date: January 27, 2026
Host: Dr. Michelle Ward
Guests: Detective Jeff Bell, researcher Josh Hallmark, and army buddy Nate Lessard

Overview

In this gripping episode, Dr. Michelle Ward delves deeper into the double life and evolving methods of Israel Keyes — a family man by day, and a calculating, methodical serial killer by night. The episode focuses on the years Keyes spent perfecting his craft across the Pacific Northwest and, eventually, the entire country. Through interviews, confession tapes, and expert analysis, the show explores how Keyes selected victims, concealed his crimes, expanded his hunting ground, and ultimately confounded investigators — until a critical mistake brought his reign of terror to an end.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Israel Keyes' Modus Operandi and Double Life

• Vagueness and "Doing Stuff":
  Keyes uses ambiguous phrases like "do stuff" to obscure the details of his crimes, avoiding names, dates, and locations.

  • "It's his way of staying vague. He doesn't give names of victims, he doesn't give dates. He doesn't give the precise location…" — Dr. Michelle Ward (04:09)

• Outdoor Experience as Cover:
  Keyes’ reputation as an outdoorsman gave him plausible reasons for wandering in remote areas, helping to hide his predatory activities.

  • "That's where I get a lot of the ideas. Either fishing or out hunting." — Israel Keyes (05:27)

2. Victim Selection and Planning

• Randomness and Lack of a ‘Type’:
  Keyes broke the serial killer archetype by targeting victims based on practicality and vulnerability rather than consistent profiles.

  • "He was a very practical killer. For Keyes, the focus is, can I abduct and rape and murder this person without anyone seeing? That's the profile." — Dr. Michelle Ward (08:09)
  • "It didn't seem to matter... Were they light enough to carry? Were they by themselves?... Did they not have dogs?" — Detective Jeff Bell (07:52)

• Friend/Victim Dichotomy:
  Anyone Keyes interacted with meaningfully was no longer a potential victim; only complete strangers were at risk.

  • "As soon as someone talks to me and sees me, then that's kind of puts it on a different spectrum for me… Like I want to be their friend or something. But obviously, if I've already decided to take somebody, then I'm not their friend." — Israel Keyes (08:31)

• Body Disposal and Misdirection:
  Keyes prioritized ease of body disposal, preferring victims who traveled alone and had their own vehicle, to further mislead investigators.

  • "He would take their body, bury it, and then drive their car somewhere else. So when the search happens, it’s far from the real crime scene." — Detective Jeff Bell (11:06)

3. Cross-Country Travels and Expanding the Hunting Grounds

• Family Visits as Pretext:
  His frequent travels — ostensibly to visit scattered family — gave him opportunities and cover for committing murders in locations far from home.

  • "It's either a great alibi… or a way of creating distance between himself and his crimes. It’s paramount to his MO." — Josh Hallmark (21:17)

• Kill Kits and Caching:
  Keyes buried "kill kits" across the U.S., containing weapons and supplies for future crimes, further disconnecting him from any paper trail.

  • "Come on. Everybody loves buried treasure. I do. That’s why I started burying stuff." — Israel Keyes (25:42)
  • "So he goes to Vermont in 2009 and buys everything he needs to kill someone and then cashes them two years later." — Josh Hallmark (26:28)

4. Learning from Others & Avoiding Detection

• Studying True Crime:
  Keyes learned from the mistakes of other serial killers, consuming books, documentaries, and reports to hone his strategies and evade capture.

  • "I… got lots of those kind of ideas, like what not to do from books and movies, true crime TV. Yeah, there's no shortage of what not to do." — Israel Keyes (28:28)
  • "Keys was a true crime fan. He read Mindhunter, he studied up on BTK and Ted Bundy." — Josh Hallmark (28:40)

• Desire for Anonymity:
  Keyes sought notoriety only among the invisible elite of uncaught killers, valuing invisibility over fame.

  • "All of the famous serial killers failed because they got caught. The best killers… are the ones who nobody knows because they’re secretly getting away with it." — Dr. Michelle Ward (29:36)

5. The Couriers Case: Detailed Confession

• Break from Previous Patterns:
  The abductions and murders of Bill and Lorraine Currier marked an escalation: targeting a couple in their home, breaking away from his more cautious, single-victim abductions.

  • "It's exactly what I mean when I'm talking about taking things to another level." — Dr. Michelle Ward (38:54)

• Chilling Precision:
  Keyes recounts every minute detail, from cutting the phone lines to subduing the couple and his plans for their car, highlighting his lack of fear and clinical detachment.

  • "I already had my backpack with me… I guess you'd call it a rape kit." — Israel Keyes (37:40)
  • "There was a crowbar that was hanging in their garage. That's what I used to break the window." — Israel Keyes (40:49)

• Failure to Stay "Under the Radar":
  The Courier murders receive local media attention, conflicting with Keyes’ desire to remain unnoticed — a point that both thrills and unsettles him.

  • "I definitely got carried away with the publicity aspect of it. My entire goal up until the courier thing was to stay under the radar." — Israel Keyes (49:11)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On compartmentalization & victim selection:
  "In his own words, he has two modes of relating to people. Either friend or victim." — Dr. Michelle Ward (09:03)

• On randomness:
  "It didn't seem to matter… It mattered a little bit, but it was more: Were they light enough to carry after he killed them? Were they by themselves? Did they not have dogs… things like that." — Detective Jeff Bell (07:52)

• On the thrill of planning:
  "I think it was 50% the planning and the fantasizing about the act, and then also just the exertion of control and power during the act." — Josh Hallmark (23:39)

• On learning from crime:
  "I probably know every single serial killer that's ever been written about. It's kind of a hobby of mine." — Israel Keyes (29:13)

• On “kill kits”:
  "Come on. Everybody loves buried treasure. I do. That's why I started burying stuff." — Israel Keyes (25:42)

• On the Couriers' case confession:
  "I've had some confessions in my history, but nothing to that detail… you'll never get out of your mind. Never forget." — Detective Jeff Bell (36:16)

• On breaking his own rules:
  "Here he is breaking his own rules and reveling in the media coverage. Keys's focus is starting to shift…" — Dr. Michelle Ward (50:07)

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment / Quote | |---------------|---------------------| | 02:06 | Listener discretion warning; recap of previous episodes | | 04:09–06:34 | Keyes describes his hunting methods and victim selection strategies | | 07:52 | Detective Bell on Keyes having no victim type, but practical criteria | | 09:03 | Dr. Ward analyzes Keyes’ “friend vs. victim” dichotomy | | 11:06 | Detective Bell explains Keyes’ method of body and car disposal | | 15:01 | Nate Lessard recounts a chilling story from Keyes’ Army days | | 21:17 | Josh Hallmark discusses Keyes’ family trips and their link to his crimes | | 22:58 | Josh Hallmark on Keyes’ routines and routes during cross-country drives | | 24:19 | Hallmark explains “caching” and how Keyes uses kill kits | | 28:28 | Keyes admits to learning from true crime media | | 36:16 | Detective Bell on the detailed Courier confession | | 49:11 | Keyes discusses losing control over publicity after the Couriers’ case |

Additional Insights

• Psychological Analysis:
  Dr. Ward frequently references Keyes' unique psychological traits, such as compartmentalization and lack of fear/anxiety, which allowed him to perform and recall violent acts with clinical detachment.
• Sexuality and Secrecy:
  The episode discusses how Keyes' bisexuality and other taboo interests were deeply hidden, contributing to his double life.
• Escalation and Compulsion:
  As with many serial killers, Keyes began pushing the boundaries of his own methods — seeking new thrills, risking exposure, and ultimately making mistakes.

Episode Teaser

The episode ends on a tense note as Dr. Ward previews the next chapter:

• Israel Keyes' final victim, the murder that led to his capture, and the unraveling of his carefully constructed persona are set up as topics for the next episode.

This summary captures the depth, tension, and crucial details of "Ep.3: Hunting Grounds," offering a comprehensive understanding for listeners and newcomers alike.