Miss Understood with Rachel Uchitel

Episode: Pablo Escobar’s Cocaine Pilot: The Untold Story of TJ Dominguez – Part 2 of 3

Date: September 18, 2025
Host: Rachel Uchitel
Guest: TJ Dominguez, former pilot for Pablo Escobar’s Medellín Cartel

Episode Overview

This gripping episode continues the saga of TJ Dominguez, the American pilot who became a central figure in Pablo Escobar’s global cocaine operation. Rachel uncovers the untold details of TJ’s ascent to cartel stardom, the logistics of trafficking billions in cocaine, dealings with corrupt officials, and the fine line between survival and betrayal in the world’s most notorious drug network. As the conversation deepens, TJ reflects on the true nature of Escobar, the business acumen required to stay alive, and how it all unraveled.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. First Impressions of Pablo Escobar

• Rachel asks about meeting Escobar for the first time.
  • “Pablo's a really likable guy. Obviously, at that point, I don't know this, but… he was just very down to earth. Jeans, blue jeans, tennis, you know, loafers. Nothing extravagant. Not like you see in the movies. No Rolex, no gold chains, none of that stuff.” – TJ (01:54)
• On the ostentatious house:
  • “Huge. I think the first night... 500 guests slept in the house. You know, a stadium first for soccer at his house. Giant. Had a zoo… hippos, crazy stuff.” – TJ (02:33)
  • Rachel: “So he didn’t need the Rolex. He put it all into the house.”
  • TJ: “I think, Pablo, is the second, third, fourth richest man in the world back in the 80s… billions and billions.” (03:03)

2. Negotiating with the Cartel: Price of a Trip

• TJ explains his negotiation tactics:
  • “He says, ‘How much do you charge?’ I said, ‘$7,000.’ ... A few of the guys laughed at me… You got to go hunt these guys down and shoot them because they're amateurs. I'm not. I'm that good.” – TJ (04:48-06:18)
  • “I'm not in the [cocaine] business. I consider myself like UPS. I fly for you door to door. I don't care if it's cabbage, right? I just want to know that I’m getting paid in US currency.” (04:36)
• Settling the deal:
  • “We agreed on $5,000 a kilo... You put 700 kilos on this trip, $3.5 million. If you put under 700, I’m going to charge you for a base of 700.” (08:33)
• Earning compared to the industry standard:
  • “The average person in the business was getting what, a kilo?” - Rachel
  • “$3,500.” - TJ (09:32)

3. Building and Maintaining Logistics

• Investing in infrastructure and the perils of corruption:
  • Securing an airport to land cocaine involved paying off the customs head with cash:
    • “I want you to do nothing… when I land my airplane full of cocaine in your airport. $500,000, 250 up front, 250 when I leave.” – TJ (15:53)
    • “He started getting really stupid greedy… up to a million dollars every time. So, I buy the Hawk's Nest hotel for its strip and marina—now I got my own base.” (16:57)
• Dealing with betrayal:
  • When the customs head tries to extort him further, TJ outsmarts him by diverting work to other smugglers using the corrupt official, while keeping his own operations private. (18:17-18:49)

4. Working Exclusively for Pablo Escobar

• On exclusivity:
  • “It wasn't like I signed a contract… he was giving me more work than I could handle… I realized… Gigi [his plane]… needed maintenance. So I got three copies: one flying, one in the hangar, one being worked on. No downtime.” (18:55-19:34)
• Innovative smuggling techniques:
  • Altering cars used for delivery:
    • “They gave me cars… the bumper was dragging… I put air shocks and a level inside the glove compartment… now the car would sit level, even loaded.” (20:54)

5. Navigating Trust and Payment

• On trust and getting paid:
  • “You don't want to be misunderstood. When you owe cocaine, you either have the money or you have the cocaine. No ifs and buts…” (23:31)
• When Escobar tries to pay in product:
  • “Now I'm gonna collect $5 million in cocaine. Well, I'm not looking for that at all. Because now he’s gonna put me in the cocaine business.” (24:07)
  • “So we agreed I’d own 35%. On 1,000 kilos, 350 kilos are mine.” (25:05)

6. Scaling Up: Running a Drug Empire

• Becoming a distributor unintentionally:
  • “There’s no reason for me to slow down now. The problem is… what do I do with all this damn cocaine?... I had 3,000, 4,000 kilos in the house… mass accumulation because I don’t have an outlet for it.” (26:10-26:36)
  • On paranoia and security:
    • “When I take your car… my guy Q sweeps the car for bugs… then I drive it to the safe house… Only two people other than me knew this safe house.” (26:35-27:11)
• Possible near bust:
  • TJ recounts a day when federal agents surrounded the house, or so he thought, which turns out to be a false alarm—they were after someone across the street.
    • “[The feds said:] ‘We got an armed fugitive across the street from you.’ … So I said, we’re not counting anymore cocaine. We’re drinking beer.” (31:32-31:41)

7. Downfall: Betrayal, the Feds, and Surveillance

• How it came apart:
  • “I get done in by the guy taught me how to fly… Jack… Jack developed a really bad cocaine habit.” (33:35-35:01)
  • “I fired Jack… I was going to put him in rehab... The party level became so high that I didn’t want him around me. He ends up getting caught on his own and then decides to give you up to help himself.” (35:32-36:54)
• On being watched by the feds:
  • “They followed me with helicopters… They went to Europe with me. One of the arresting agents from back then is a very good friend of mine today.” (37:00-37:24)

8. Legendary Antics & Outrunning the Law

• Messing with law enforcement:
  • “I take the bottle of Dom Perignon, flip it upside down on my champagne holder… So now I'm leaning back… I call the authorities. These guys are feds that are watching me. Next thing I know, five, ten minutes later, they come swarming up in this car, get out… while I’m drinking my champagne, watching this whole show…” (41:24-42:24)

9. Facing Justice: Prison, Sentencing, and Adaptation

• Conviction and legal wranglings:
  • “I got indicted… for the big indictment… the 848 continuous criminal enterprise. It’s life to life, an automatic life sentence… I was indicted under the law before ‘88, so 10 years minimum.” (43:53-45:01)
  • “Reagan changed the law… Before ‘88, you could be paroled after 18 months on a 10-year sentence. After ‘88, you’d do almost nine years.” (45:16)
• On being denied bond:
  • “No, the judge said unlimited funds, worldwide contacts… $10 million bond would be like drinking a cup of coffee… facing life without parole. No bond.” (42:35)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On negotiating with Pablo Escobar:
  • “I’m not in the cocaine business. I consider myself like UPS. I fly for you door-to-door.” – TJ (04:36)
• On why he charged so much and took pride in professionalism:
  • “They’re flying around with a rosary in one hand and a Bible in the other. I don’t need any of that… I know what I’m doing and what I’m capable of doing with the tools that, let’s say, God gave me.” – TJ (05:20)
• On cartel honesty versus conventional business:
  • “There’s a lot more honesty in that business that we were in than in some of the business transactions I’ve sat in with a bunch of lawyers, which are just two-faced hypocrites.” – TJ (32:09)
• On Pablo’s true nature:
  • “Pablo was not the ruthless killer that people actually make him out to be. Pablo would quicker give you a second chance if you lost a trip... Did he kill a lot of people? Thousands, maybe… but he had very strong faith in family and friendship.” (32:09)
• On the law changing under Reagan:
  • “After ‘88, you do nine years, what used to be only 18 months in prison... it really became very scary under the new law.” – TJ (45:16)
• The moment TJ realized prison was a relief:
  • “When I got arrested, Rachel, believe it or not, it was actually a lot of pressure off of me, because don’t forget, I’m being followed by helicopters.” (52:43)
• On his mom’s heartbreak:
  • “The hardest thing that I had to really do… looking at my mom walking in through that door, and my mom looked at me and my mom said to me, ‘Tell me, son, what they’re saying about you is not true.’” (55:01)

Timestamps for Notable Segments

• [01:54] – Meeting Pablo Escobar for the first time: description and setting.
• [08:33] – TJ closes deal with Pablo, sets smuggling rates and conditions.
• [12:48] – Bribing airport officials in the Bahamas.
• [16:57] – Buying his own hotel and airstrip to avoid bribes.
• [19:34] – TJ maintains multiple planes to avoid downtime.
• [26:36] – Fears of a potential bust; “They’re surrounding us.”
• [31:41] – Moment of comedic relief: feds are after the neighbor, not TJ.
• [35:01] – Betrayal by Jack, the pilot.
• [41:24] – TJ’s Dom Perignon prank on feds surveilling his house.
• [42:35] – Denied bail due to flight risk and resources.
• [43:53] – Indicted on the 848 CCE charge.
• [52:43] – Relief TJ felt when finally arrested.
• [55:01] – TJ’s mother confronts him after his arrest.

Tone & Style

The conversation is frank, raw, and at times irreverently funny. TJ mixes street wisdom with logistical genius, revealing both the glamour and the anxiety of running one of the most dangerous smuggling routes in history. Rachel’s tone is equal parts journalist and confidante, drawing out both procedural detail and human vulnerability.

Episode Takeaways

• The high-wire act of professional smuggling required constant adaptation, infrastructure investment, and situational awareness far beyond mere criminal bravado.
• Pablo Escobar, while feared, was also seen as generous and pragmatic with trusted associates—contrasting public myths with personal reality.
• Betrayal and suspicion are daily realities, and the real danger often comes from within one’s own ranks.
• The U.S. drug laws profoundly changed lives, often retroactively, and led to harsh, mandatory sentences in the late 1980s and 1990s.
• Behind every criminal headline is a complicated, often surprising, human story.