Judge’s Apology to WHCD Shooting Suspect, Pastor’s Damning 911 Call, Mistaken Identity Rape Case, with Miguel Macias

Summary

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MK True Crime: Judge’s Apology, Pastor’s 911 Call, and Mistaken Identity – With Miguel Macias

Podcast: MK True Crime (Positively Legal episode)
Host: Jona Spilbore & Mark Eiglarsch
Date: May 6, 2026
Guest: Miguel Macias

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into three compelling true crime and legal topics: a controversial judicial apology to the suspect in the WHCD shooting, the suspicious 911 call from an ex-pastor accused of murdering his wife, and the harrowing story of Miguel Macias, a man wrongly jailed for 43 days due to mistaken identity in a rape case. With first-hand insight and legal expertise, the hosts question the criminal justice system, analyze behaviors, and discuss the fallibility of law enforcement and prosecution.

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Major Discussion Points & Insights

1. Judicial Apology to WHCD Shooting Suspect

(08:10–14:31)

• Story:
  Jona recounts hearing a news report about the judge in the Cole Allen case (suspect accused of attempting to kill the President during the White House Correspondents’ Dinner) apologizing to the accused for his "substandard" pretrial detention conditions. The judge noted the man had no prior criminal history and compared his case to January 6th rioters.

• Debate:

  • Jona is outraged, believing a judge apologizing to an attempted presidential assassin is inappropriate:

    "When you are a judge and you apologize on the record to somebody who tried to kill the president, you should not be presiding over the case." (12:28)

  • Mark injects balance, noting pretrial detention is not meant to be punitive and all defendants are presumed innocent until proven guilty, regardless of offense:

    "Bond or pretrial release, which is a form of bond, should not be punitive...you punish someone after they're found guilty." (11:44)

  • Jona objects that the suspect was clearly suicidal and that the judge’s comments about his background miss the point:

    "First of all, this guy is suicidal. You know how we know? Because of the so-called manifesto..." (11:49)

• Key Quote:
  Mark:

  "If you're being intellectually honest...the answer is, like every other defendant in that bond is not supposed to be punitive. You punish someone after they're found guilty." (11:44)

• Analysis:
  The conversation probes the controversial intersection of legal principle (innocence until proven guilty) and public emotion, especially when high-profile or heinous crimes are involved.

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2. Pastor Caleb Flynn: The Damning 911 Call

(15:56–27:11)

• Background:
  Mark and Jona analyze 911 and bodycam audio from the case of Caleb Flynn, an ex-pastor and former "American Idol" contestant accused of murdering his wife, Ashley Flynn, while their children were at home.

• 911 Call Analysis:

  • Both hosts immediately pick up on red flags in Flynn’s call. Flynn describes "two shots to the head," which Jona and Mark agree would be implausible for someone just discovering a bloody crime scene:

    "You would not possibly know that coming into a scene where your wife is dead on the floor." – Jona (17:50)

  • Mark challenges Jona to take the defense’s side, but she can’t even do so with a straight face.
  • Both agree that Flynn's affect (emotional demonstration) during the call seems forced and unconvincing:

    "I'm rating it as like sort of a D-lister in a Hallmark movie." – Jona (20:07)

  • Both note the dispatcher appears skeptical as well, detected in their tone and questioning.
  • They joke about "Perry Mason moments" from courtroom dramas, emphasizing the contrast with real-life cases.

• Bodycam Footage:
  When viewing bodycam footage, both agree Flynn’s physical behavior further undercuts his credibility:

  "Now it's even worse." – Jona (26:15)

• Possible Motive:
  The hosts speculate as seasoned attorneys: motive likely involves money, an affair, or both.

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3. "Legally Blonde" Moment

(27:21–29:10)

• Comic Legal Interlude:
  Briefly, the hosts play and lampoon the famous courtroom scene from "Legally Blonde," poking fun at how real trials so rarely generate Perry Mason-style confessions.
  • Mark: "And so the bar is so high." (28:56)

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4. Miguel Macias – Mistaken Identity Rape Case

(30:52–56:03, main story: 31:11–55:27)

• Miguel’s Story:
  Miguel Macias, guest and Mark’s former client, narrates his 43-day wrongful incarceration:

  • In 2014, a teen is kidnapped and raped after leaving a party.
  • She tells police her attacker’s name is "Miguel" and, searching Facebook, identifies the wrong "Miguel" from party connections.
  • Miguel, a young construction worker with no violent history, is arrested months later because his vehicle matches a description.

    "I was scared. Why am I being taken in if I haven't done nothing?" – Miguel (34:00)

  • He voluntarily gives a DNA sample, is held with no bond, and spends weeks in jail, terrified for his future.

    "Now what if I spend the rest of my life in prison for something I didn't do?" – Miguel (37:29)

  • His public defender is unresponsive; his family eventually finds Mark Eiglarsch online, who takes the case pro bono.
  • Mark reviews evidence, finds timeline/text inconsistencies, and learns Miguel is covered in tattoos the victim never referenced.
  • Mark struggles with dismissive prosecutors. After demanding, finally gets DNA rushed—results exonerate Miguel.

    "Every morning when I would wake up, I would call my mom... And then she's the one that told me, oh, you're coming out today. Your lawyer got you." – Miguel (47:27)

  • Charges are dropped, and Judge Block immediately expunges Miguel’s record from the bench.

    "That has never happened, ever." – Mark (48:18)

  • The actual perpetrator, Miguel Bustos, is later identified and convicted.

• Prosecution's Response:

  • Chief prosecutor told media: "This happens all the time." (49:09)
  • Both hosts sharply critique the lack of apology and systemic casualness toward such wrongful arrests.

• Impact:

  • Miguel still feels the trauma of nearly losing his life to a false accusation:

    "It hits me once in a while when I get to thinking about it...my feelings do come back." (52:52)

• Legal System Critique:

  • Discussion on hurdles to filing suit for wrongful imprisonment—it's extremely hard to win damages even in egregious cases; police/prosecutors rarely held financially accountable.

• Key Quotes:

  • "Believability and accuracy are two different things. She can believe all she wants that's Miguel, but be completely inaccurate as she was." – Mark (52:07)
  • "So many things. I'm thankful that your parents, Miguel, and landed on the ease in the phone book and got Mark. He's the reason. He's kind of magical in that way." – Jona (55:07)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• Mark on Prosecutor Resistance:

  "She cut me off. She goes, do you know what time it is? I said, no. Why? ...'If you have anything you want to send to me over the next few weeks, you could send it to me and I'll look at it.'" (42:57)

• Judge Block’s Open-Court Apology:

  "I apologize to what happened. For what happened to you, sir." (48:03)

• "This Happens All The Time":

  "Veteran prosecutor Kathleen Hogue told me testimony from one witness plus evidence were strong enough to charge and hold Macias for 42 days. But as soon as we found out, we did what we had to do and we released him. This happens all the time." (49:09)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 08:10 – Judicial apology segment begins
• 15:56 – Introduction to Caleb Flynn murder case
• 17:08 – 911 call playback and analysis
• 20:07 – Rating Flynn’s performance
• 27:21 – "Legally Blonde" scene discussion
• 31:11 – Introduction of Miguel Macias, his story of wrongful arrest
• 35:17 – Miguel details interrogation, voluntary DNA
• 41:02 – Mark recounts client intake, first jail visit
• 42:24 – Mark’s struggle with prosecution
• 45:39 – DNA test fast-tracked, Miguel’s release
• 48:03 – Judge Block’s courtroom apology
• 49:09 – Prosecutor’s “this happens all the time” quote
• 52:52 – Miguel’s lasting trauma
• 54:30 – Legal system’s lack of remedy for wrongful imprisonment

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Tone & Style

• Candid, fast-paced, and sharply witty—especially in exchanges between Jona and Mark, who balance irreverence with legal expertise.
• Empathetic and direct—particularly in the segment with Miguel Macias, allowing raw emotion and lived experience to come through.
• Critical but nuanced—the hosts do not pull punches in critiquing systemic failings, but preserve legal nuance and the presumption of innocence.
• Use of humor—even amid heavy subject matter, especially when analyzing suspect behavior or spoofing courtroom tropes.

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Conclusion

This episode highlights the devastating impact of system failures through Miguel Macias’s firsthand account, the dubious explanations of criminal suspects, and the often dicey intersection of justice and real-world procedure. The hosts leave listeners with an imperative: stay alert to judicial missteps, question smooth official narratives, and remember that legal principles protect all—even when emotions run hot.

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For listeners:

• Prepare for lively debate and personal stories as much as legal analysis.
• The episode is essential for anyone interested in the realities (and pitfalls) of criminal justice, the dangers of mistaken identity, and why nuanced thinking matters in due process.

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Notable Final Words:

"Gratitude is the antidote for stinking thinking." – Mark

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Transcript

[Jona Spilbore]

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[Mark Eiglarsch]

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[Jona Spilbore]

Hello and welcome to Positively Legal. I'm Jonas Spilbore, a criminal defense attorney and founder of Jona Spilbore Law.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And I am Mark Eiglarsch. I'm a former prosecutor, veteran criminal defense attorney, adjunct law professor, avid pickleball player. I love my three spectacular children and my wife of 25 years.

[Jona Spilbore]

We only have an hour, Mark.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah, I know. And I am a fan of Jonna Spielberg, by the way. She's fantastic. She cut me off. I was gonna do this whole bit on how fabulous she is. Anyway. Yeah, we gotta get to the topics, like murder. Going to talk about this guy, alleged murder. Caleb Flynn. He's a pastor, a former pastor, or maybe he's still pastoring from jail right now on a $3.5 million bond. He's a former American Idol contestant and he's accused of murder, murdering his wife, that is. And we're going to hear the 911 call and the body cam footage. And Jona and I are going to analyze what we see also. Yes, go ahead. What else are we going to do?

[Jona Spilbore]

Later, your former client, Miguel Macias joins us to revisit why he was unjustly locked in prison for 43 days and how deeply that affected his life and more importantly, how he got out. And who got him out. You're looking at him.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Well, hold on. Let's not jump ahead. We'll see what happened with that case. And I have never gone through the details with him. I'm going to ask him a lot that I want to know about, like what was it like being locked up? How do you, at that very moment, for what he thought was a crime he did not commit, will tell you what actually happened. But now I love this time on Positively Legal, we call it Happy hour. It really is an excuse for Jonah to drink. Really.

[Jona Spilbore]

I mean, come On, God, I wish. I wish I could.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You wish?

[Jona Spilbore]

Well, yeah. I mean, some days are very, very. You know. You know that you are so busy and stressed when you get a text from your Botox doctor checking on your well being. Which I did, by the way. My Botox doctor's like, hey, everything okay? Like, he literally did a welfare check because I haven't been there. Why? Because we're so busy. I'm busy, you're busy.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And I have mixed feelings about a Botox doctor. Really? Botox doctor? I mean, he's not your heart doctor. He wants to put stuff in your face.

[Jona Spilbore]

Okay, yes, yes, yes. And anywhere else that I'll let him put it. So. I miss him. So if you're listening, Dr. Rubenstein, he's.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay.

[Jona Spilbore]

I got you. Yes. I'm alive. I'm alive.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

What else happened today, Jonna?

[Jona Spilbore]

You know, it's just another day in paradise. Mark, I think you. Did you have a little bit of a rough day? You had a busy day, too?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I had a challenging day. It started great. I sent out a press release on Lawrence Taylor, former linebacker for the Giants. He's a client of mine. And it's another one since last week, since our last podcast. This time I announced he's out of the New Jersey hospital that he's been in because of the stomach issue that he had. He thanks everybody. The prayers and the support helped him get through a challenging time. He is back here in Florida and he is recovering and hopes to be on the golf course soon. So I dealt with media on that.

[Jona Spilbore]

That was your press release?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

That was a press release. I also dealt with setting up the alleged victim's deposition. We get to take depositions here in Florida and state court on the Antonio Brown case that I mentioned last week. He's facing a 30 year prison term with a 20 year minimum mandatory. And I can't wait to take the alleged victim's deposition. We filed a stand your ground motion in that case that I strongly believe in. And let's just see what he says in that deposition. So what.

[Jona Spilbore]

What evidence are you entitled to before you do the stand your ground motion? I'm just curious.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Everything. Oh, everything. You get everything it is. There's no trial by ambush. You love my cousin Vinnie, where he's like, they gave me the evidence. Yeah, because you're entitled, dickhead.

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

We go. I set you up for that. It just naturally flowed. I love how you do that. Yeah. We get reports, we get statements, we get video, we get body cam footage. The question is, what don't we get. So we get it all and then we analyze it and then we use that in a, in a stand your ground hearing against the alleged victim.

[Jona Spilbore]

Let me ask you, because I don't practice in Florida, if you get all the discovery before you do the stand your ground, I mean, the prosecutor obviously has the discovery too, right? Is it sometimes. Do you not have to do the hearing? Sometimes. Does the prosecutor say, yep, you know what?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yes, yes, yes. Reasonable prosecutors will do that. That's. That was the frustrating part of my day. Right before I just started this hearing, I took depositions online and, and we don't see eye to eye on it. I have a video showing two people attacking my teenage client. It's clear they got him around the neck and because of that, and because he can't breathe, he then uses a pocket knife and he stabs one of the persons. Clearly it's self defense. Apparently not so clear to the prosecutor. So no, that's why you have stand your ground hearings and that's why you have a neutral judge who's going to decide.

[Jona Spilbore]

That is, that's really interesting. Yeah, I dealt with. No, it is because you would think something that clear cut that the prosecution, you be on the same page without having to have the hearing. You know, but sometimes I find sometimes when you have victims in a case which they're allowed to, they have some say, but they're not the reason why a particular deal gets dictated. For example, sometimes you can have victims or victims families pounding their fist on the table and they try to hamstring the prosecution from being able to negotiate and do a deal and that can get in the way.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah, that happens. That happens. In this case though, to their credit, the prosecutors will say, well, we took it down from an aggravated battery down to a felony battery. My kid's like 15, 16 years old, honor student. He's not taking a felony. Not when they had him around the neck. And granted, just to put it in proper context, he, he did take something from the vehicle parked in front of a house that did not belong to him. That is relevant. Yes, I left that out. Hold on, hold on. And then he rode away from the scene and when these people approached, he put the stuff down. That's it. These people then came up and they were holding around the neck. I'll play the video the next podcast. Remind me, I'll do it. Because we have a stand your ground hearing next week. At some point I'm going to play it for you and you tell me whether was standing his ground or whether he was committing an aggravated battery.

[Jona Spilbore]

I cannot wait for that. Although maybe they had called the police and they were waiting for the police to arrive.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

They had called the police and they weren't waiting for them to arrive. They were definitely taking matters into their own hands by their own admission in deposition. So we'll. We'll. We'll cover that another time.

[Jona Spilbore]

We'll see.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You were bothered today by something that happened in court. Not on your case, but something else.

[Jona Spilbore]

Not on one of my cases. So, you know, every morning when I'm getting ready, I have the news on most people. Some people would be like, I don't wanna listen to the news. I know you probably don't listen to the news in the morning.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Well, I don't know. I like happiness. What's your reason for. Why do you.

[Jona Spilbore]

I just. Because I wanna. Because I wanna be informed, and I like to know that there are.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You wanna be outraged?

[Jona Spilbore]

I like to know that there are people more miserable than me.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Now we got to it. Now we got to it. You win.

[Jona Spilbore]

So, you know, while I'm waiting for my coffee to drip from the machine, I hear a story which is really unbelievable about the judge in the. The guy that attempted to kill the President of the United States last week at the correspondence dinner in Washington, D.C. alan Cole Allen. He's there, looking lovely, kissing the. Kissing the carpet.

[Miguel Macias]

Yes.

[Jona Spilbore]

So he's in custody. Rightfully so. Like, nobody's gonna be like, what. What's he doing there? Right.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

No dispute. Yeah. He belongs in custody.

[Jona Spilbore]

And as you know, when you have these types of cases, you're gonna make several appearances before a judge before you finally get to trial, et cetera. So he apparently had to appear yesterday. And the judge, Mark, in this case, apologized to Cole Allen, claiming that his detention is substandard. The conditions that he's in are not, I don't know, humane. And he actually said, whatever you've been through, I apologize and chastise the attorneys in the case because he thinks that just because. Just because this guy came this close to offing the president of the free world, there's really no need for him to be behind bars pending his trial. Are you freaking kidding me?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

That's what. Hold on now. Let's. Let's just report the facts accurately. I want to make sure.

[Jona Spilbore]

I heard. I am. I am.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

The judge, I understood was commenting on the conditions that the accused was facing in jail, which we could talk about. You just raised a fact that I had not heard, which is either not accurate.

[Jona Spilbore]

It's accurate.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Something that's new. The judge doesn't think he belongs behind bars. Did I hear you say that?

[Jona Spilbore]

He said, he noted that pretrial detention is not supposed to be punitive and commented that since this guy has no criminal history, like, oh, what are we doing here? And then he compared his actions to his January 6th. So now you know. This judge is suffering from Trump derangement syndrome and therefore should not be presiding over this case or any other case. If you ask me, how can you be fair and impartial? This is disgusting. Can you imagine if Cole Allen were out on the street pending his trial when he tried to kill the President?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I think. I think that you are distorting the facts or misinterpreting them incorrectly.

[Jona Spilbore]

I'm not.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

What the judge said was bond or pretrial release, which is a form of bond, should not be punitive. What he's saying is someone shouldn't be punished at that point when they, like every defendant enjoys the presumption of innocence. And let me go further. What was happening in this case, and by the way, hold on one second. Number one, let me make it clear so we can minimize the hate mail. Number one, the guy does not belong out. He should be in custody and he's facing decades in prison. Just so we're crystal clear, the question is how he should be treated. And the answer, if you're being intellectually honest, is like every other defendant in that bond is not supposed to be punitive. You punish someone after they're found guilty. So if he's not suicidal, which is what the judge I read wrote, then why are they holding him 23 hours a day on lockdown and. And treating him in ways that you wouldn't normally treat someone? Wait, we're going to change our position because he tried to kill the leader of the free world?

[Jona Spilbore]

First of all, first of all, I

[Mark Eiglarsch]

understand why you'd want to do that, but legally you should not. Yes.

[Jona Spilbore]

First of all, this guy is suicidal. You know how we know? Because of the so called manifesto, which was really just a fairly lengthy email. This guy wanted to die by Secret Service. Like suicide by cop, suicide by secret Service. So he's suicidal? Number number one.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Number two, he may be. And wait, wait, let's handle it one by one. If he's suicidal, then yes, that's exactly where he belongs.

[Jona Spilbore]

Exactly.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Our lockdown.

[Jona Spilbore]

But I don't disagree with this judge. But this judge said the conditions were inappropriate for a person with no criminal history. Come the fuck on, Mark. That's ridiculous.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Really? You got a curse?

[Jona Spilbore]

You Are a judge. When you are a judge and you apologize on the record to somebody who tried to kill the president, you should not be presiding over the case. I'm sorry. Not sorry.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Let me ask you something. Change. Change the charge. Let's say it was for, I don't know, trafficking in, jaywalking, cold substance. No, because it'd be in federal court. Trafficking in. In, you know, cocaine. Many, many kilos of cocaine. Would you take exception with a judge who says that person shouldn't be punished at this stage of the proceedings? And no, you'd be like, yeah, he shouldn't be punished because that's not what bond is for. It's not supposed to be punitive.

[Jona Spilbore]

Wait a minute, though. If the person who was trafficking the cocaine was clearly spotted on camera and had to be subdued by Secret Service and. And had a letter saying that they were going to kill everybody in the vicinity, yeah. I would say that that person also deserves to be treated, however. And what is so bad about Suicide Watch? You know, frankly, if I ever go to prison, put me in the hole. That's what they call put me in the hole. I don't want to be in, Jen, if I don't want to be there.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

If there's signs that you're suicidal, yes, that's where you belong. So we can have an intellectually balanced discussion. What I'm saying is, let's just say this guy was treated in a manner. Hold on, let me finish. In a manner that was punitive, meaning he's being treated differently than everyone else for no apparent reason other than he tried to kill the president, which is a bad thing. Trust me, this is not an easy position to take. But just listen to me. The question is, should he be punished at this stage? And the judge is just saying he should be treated not punitively, but to ensure that he doesn't get out. And he shouldn't be. Go ahead. You think he should be punished?

[Jona Spilbore]

At this stage, I don't think a judge should apologize to a man who was trying to kill the president. And if that's intellectually unbalanced, so be it.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

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[Jona Spilbore]

Okay, okay, let's move on. Okay, okay, let's move on. I'm going to be using intellectually balanced for the rest of my life now. I like that. That's a better. I like when people use these euphemistic ways to like call other people stupid. But it happens in our profession a lot. I like it.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You're doing the best that you can at your level of awareness.

[Jona Spilbore]

There you go. That's another one. So, all right, what are we moving on to? Let's. Oh, so let's talk about another person who's behind bars.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah, well, we're gonna do that. Aren't we gonna talk? Oh, yeah, we gotta talk about. Yes, Murder. Yes. Okay. Murder and mayhem. We're talking about Flynn, Caleb Flynn. Right? So this guy, he's 39 years old. Maybe you remember him from American Idol, which I don't. But yeah, I don't either because it was like season 12 and who was really watching then? I think the ratings went down. And his wife, 37 year old Ashley Flynn, who is a volleyball coach and educator. So we like her, right?

[Jona Spilbore]

We like her in that Beloved in a community.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yes. Apparently there's no question she was killed and no question was homicide. The question is who done it? And he's claiming armed intruders came into their home and killed her while his two young children were there in the house. Yeah, and so wait, hold on. He's innocent until proven guilty. John and I were not there, no matter how much he acts like she was. So let's listen to. Let's all objectively listen to the 91 1. All right. Okay. This is like Dateline 101. There's always a 911 call from the person who it turns out did it.

[911 Caller]

But.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

But let's just see. Let's see how he does. All right, let's roll the 911 tape. And. And we'll get J. Who's an expert. Queen of judgment.

[911 Caller]

Oh, my. Somebody. Somebody broke into my home. Somebody broke in my home and my wife. Are they still in there? I don't know. I don't know. Okay, what's the address? 932 County Ham Court, Pitt City, Ohio. Please, please hurry. Please, please hurry. What? What are you seeing? My wife is. She's got two shots to her head. It's been blood everywhere.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Oh, my God.

[911 Caller]

Oh, my God.

[Jona Spilbore]

That's where he's like. That's why we know he's lying.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Hold on. No, you and I both see it the same way. Hold on. Wait. You go first. I'll let you go first. Two shots to the head. Wait, what?

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah. You would not possibly know that coming into a scene where your wife is dead on the floor. Nobody is. You saw she's got hair. You're not going to know that she's been shot. Where? And maybe not even where she's been shot, certainly not how many shots she has.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right, hold on. Hold on. You're such a good lawyer. Watch how good she is. Jonna, you must accept this challenge. Flip it. Take the other side. Go

[Jona Spilbore]

defend the person who did it,

[Mark Eiglarsch]

who's calling 911 that did the two shots? Do it. But I don't want to do it. I want you to do it. I think it's more fun for you to do it.

[Jona Spilbore]

The only way. The only way that he would know there were two shots to her head is if before he called 911, or perhaps while he is on the phone with.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yes.

[Jona Spilbore]

He is simultaneously digging through her hair, counting bullet holes. All right.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You can't even do it with a straight face. You can't do it.

[Jona Spilbore]

Cpr. Not trying to, you know, whatever. Just, you know, looking to count. Because that's the most important thing when you're on the phone. I don't think so.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You couldn't do it. You couldn't convince me that you believe me. All right, let's keep going. That was great. Keep going.

[911 Caller]

Keep going. Sir, please. Ma', am, I need you to take a deep breath, okay? Ma', am, do you still see anybody in the house? No. The door to the garage was wide open. Please hurry. Please. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. My daughters are here. My daughters are here. Where is she at? She's in the bed. She's in the bed. Are you with her? I am in the room. I'm looking at her. Yes, please. You guys have the door Locked. We have the doors to the garage locked into the house. Yes. Please wake up. Where, where is that room at the house? My partner is getting.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Pause for a second. Just, just really quick, Jonna. Okay. Just on the effect alone, like the acting performance, assuming it's acting. Okay. We don't know. We don't know. There could have been armed home invaders. Although John and I, I think are both skeptical. Right, but just on the effect, like if you don't know anything else and you're listening to his voice, what are you rating his acting performance?

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah. Not very good. I'm. Yeah, no, I'm rating it as like sort of a D. Lister in a Hallmark movie.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Right.

[Jona Spilbore]

Like.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

No, this is the most important thing. He should have rehearsed this better. He sounds right.

[Jona Spilbore]

Let me ask you, let me ask you a question because as. Let's, let's suppose we're both sitting on a jury and we're listening and you know that the jury is going to listen to this.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yes.

[Jona Spilbore]

In addition to his affect, what do you make of the 911 dispatchers? Affect?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Oh my goodness. Well, first I have an open mind, like if I don't know anything more, I still keeping track, Mark.

[Jona Spilbore]

I'm going to start keeping track of all the digs. Okay, you have.

[911 Caller]

What do you mean?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

What are you talking.

[Jona Spilbore]

All right, wait a minute.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

That wasn't a dig.

[Jona Spilbore]

Hold on. And I, I have a. All right, all right. That's only two. That's only two.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

No, you asked. Hold on.

[Jona Spilbore]

Five minutes ago.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay, I'm sorry, you can't handle the truth. You asked me to comment on how I feel and, and I think it could go either way. I'm skeptical, but just from what I'm hearing from his voice, I wouldn't say he is the murderer. That's all I'm saying at this point.

[Jona Spilbore]

Wait, so, but you and I have both listened to countless 911 calls, right? Yes, I can detect a difference. When the dispatch thinks this is a genuine emergency and is trying to do their thing and when they are very suspicious of the caller.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah, he's suspicious. But I also think. Hold on. I think that we learned later on that he might not have caught that the woman was shot. It's really weird. Let's keep going. You'll see that. I think it goes. Wait, she was shot. Like it almost sounds like he picks it up at the end.

[Jona Spilbore]

I shot the clerk. Okay, Right.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Something like that.

[911 Caller]

Okay, but I need you to answer my question so I can get you help as fast as I Can. Okay, what question? Where are you guys at in the house? I'm in the bedroom with her right now. Okay, My daughter's in their room. So you're not. You are not with the children. I was with the children when it happened. Okay, but you're not with them now.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Setting up his alibi.

[911 Caller]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Sir, please. Please. They are heading that way. Okay, I need you to take a deep breath for me. No, I rubbed her leg and said her name. She's not answering. Okay, your daughter's not answering.

[Jona Spilbore]

Bullet holes.

[911 Caller]

Hold on, I'm putting on a shirt.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Hold on, I'm putting on a shirt.

[911 Caller]

What'd you say? Your daughter's not answering you. No, they're in the other. Across the room in their room. Okay, are you hearing any kind of noise inside the house? No. Her face is. Oh, sir, her face is white as good. Ghost, please. Okay, who's. Whose face? My wife.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Who's on first? What's on second face?

[911 Caller]

Yes. The one who was shot. She was what? Shot. I said. Okay, where was she shot at?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right, stop. Stop. Right? I don't think that the guy heard. What is going on here? I don't think the 911 guy heard. She was shot twice in the head.

[Jona Spilbore]

No, I do think he heard that. I think that he knows something's weird and he's just asking questions that he doesn't really even need the answer to it. Come on. If this 911 dispatcher thought that there was an intruder in the house with two little girls sleeping. Sleeping in the next room, this conversation that he's having with the crybaby with crocodile tears would be different.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Hold on. How dare a 911 operator if what you're saying is true, and I don't believe it? 911 operator make a decision that quickly that they are definitely not intruders, that he's the guilty one solely based upon how the guy sounds. Really? That's what you think?

[Jona Spilbore]

You know what? I hope in my next life, I want to come back as a 911 operator. Dispatch like, bitch, you're lying.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah, you would be that way. Come on, suck it up. Did you really love your wife? Come on.

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah, right. Come on. How many bullet holes did you just count? Give me a break.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right, keep going.

[Jona Spilbore]

Come out with your hands up.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Keep going with the 911.

[911 Caller]

Okay. Is she breathing? No, I don't think so. Ashley.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I would have covered that at the top.

[911 Caller]

Baby, please. Oh, my God. There's no, she's not. Okay. She's not responding to you. No, no.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Discussed already. Like, shouldn't that have been the number one thing, like maybe cpr? Right.

[Jona Spilbore]

No, I.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Everything was wrong with that. Everything was wrong with that.

[Jona Spilbore]

Jonna, listen, if. If that is the only thing that the jury were to hear in this case, you are guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Really? It's that bad for you?

[Jona Spilbore]

It's pretty. It's pretty bad.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

It gets me to probably. For sure. For sure. Probably. I don't think that's enough. Do we want to watch the body cam footage? Do we want to see that? A little bit? Maybe.

[Jona Spilbore]

Maybe real quick, because we all, you know, see his.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You got to see maybe. Maybe physically he looks more believable. Right? Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. Are you capable of doing that? Please.

[Jona Spilbore]

We're gonna. Real quick because we got a couple other things.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right. Yeah. I want to get to Miguel. All right, go ahead.

[Jona Spilbore]

Welcome.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Just look at him. Oh, look at that. They sent officer Dr. Phil. I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do.

[Jona Spilbore]

Is that cop hugging him? Is that a cop?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Just. No, no, no, no. Oh, that's some random woman. It's the cop is to the right. Do you want to see him? There. That's Officer Dr. Phil. You see him? How do you feel? Tell us how you feel. Okay. What do you make of that? Does that help you? Now you can see he's. He's bending over the appropriate effect. No.

[Jona Spilbore]

Now it's even worse. How many days did it take for them to arrest this guy?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Oh, I don't know.

[Jona Spilbore]

I don't see. I don't think it could be that long. Like, honestly?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah. I mean, an intruder, Really? I mean.

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah.

[Miguel Macias]

Yeah.

[Jona Spilbore]

She got two bullet holes in the head, and it was with a. A 38 special and. Oh, how do I know that? I don't know. Oh, sorry.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

What about the motive? I mean, what's the motive? Here.

[Jona Spilbore]

Oh, okay. Here's the mode. I'll tell you without even knowing anything about the motor.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You'll tell us?

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah, because it's either money or it's. They're having an affair and they need to get her out. Usually it's both, like.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And I just remembered. I just remembered someone at his church. Again, we don't know if she was having an affair. She immediately withdrew her position.

[Jona Spilbore]

She resigned.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Why? She resigned. So. So. Ding, ding, ding. Maybe do a little math there. What do you think?

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah. Yeah, there's a little cheating Math going

[Mark Eiglarsch]

on there, but we don't know. Everybody's innocent, blah, blah, blah, blah, and all that stuff. Okay?

[Jona Spilbore]

We don't know. All right, all right, all right. We had a couple of there. What about. Are we gonna do a. We gonna watch a Legally Blonde Saad, or are we going to move on to Miguel quickly?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

The Legally Blonde sod? Can we do that? We do that. Let's do that. Let's do that. This is something that we love to do. We see a lot of things on TV and movies, and John and I are both going, yeah, that's incredible. That's awesome. That's so true. Or oh, my God, that is completely unrealistic. Right? All right, so let's see how we both feel. I don't know how she feels about this. Let's watch this famous scene from Legally Blonde go.

[Commercial Voice]

And wouldn't somebody who's had, say, 30 perms before in their life be well aware of this race? And if, in fact you weren't washing your hair, as I suspect you weren't, because your curls are still intact, wouldn't you have heard the gunshot? And if, in fact you had heard the gunshot, Brooke Windom wouldn't have had time to hide the gun before you got downstairs. Which would mean that you would have had to have found Mrs. Windom with a gun in her hand to make your story plausible. Isn't that right?

[Jona Spilbore]

She's my age. Did she tell you that? How would you feel if your father married someone who was your age?

[Commercial Voice]

You, however, had time to hide the gun gun, didn't you, Chutney, after you shot your father?

[Jona Spilbore]

I didn't mean to shoot him. I thought it was you walking through the door.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Oh, oh, oh. Happens all the time in every courtroom that I'm in. Right, Jonna?

[Jona Spilbore]

That Perry Mason moment. Yeah, those rapid fire testimonial questions from the defense attorney or prosecutor, whoever.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And here's. Here's the problem, John. I don't know if I'm speaking for you, but jurors then expect when I cross examine someone that they're literally going to just. Okay, you got it. I ordered the code red or yeah, I did kill her. It doesn't happen. And so the bar is so high.

[Jona Spilbore]

I like. My favorite is, no, the defense is wrong.

[Miguel Macias]

Right?

[Jona Spilbore]

Do you know, I love that movie. And by the way, because I have not seen Legally Blonde in a long time. Was that Aubrey Plaza? Is that her name?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

No, it's a different actress. Who's. Whose name? She was in Green Book. She was in so many Other things. No, I'll get her name at some point. But anyway, yes, Miguel. Miguel Macias, my former client is generous with his time and he's. Let's get to him.

[Jona Spilbore]

Okay, without. Without further ado. When we come back, we're going to be talking with Mark's client, Miguel Macias, who's going to join us to share his very comprehensive, compelling story. Don't go away.

[Commercial Voice]

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[Mark Eiglarsch]

Another pina colada?

[911 Caller]

Yes, please.

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[Mark Eiglarsch]

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[Mark Eiglarsch]

Welcome back to Positively Legal. I'm here with my co host, Jonas Spilbore, and we are joined by a client of mine, technically a former client of mine, Miguel Macias. I am so grateful that you've taken time off to be with us, Miguel. Welcome to our second podcast. How you doing, brother?

[Miguel Macias]

Pretty good, pretty good. Can't complain. How you doing today?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay, well, I'm going to let you complain in a minute because you can't complain now. You went through a rough time and honestly, when I asked you, I didn't know if you were going to say yes or not because having to relive what you went through has got to be rough. But thank you so much for the courage you're showing.

[911 Caller]

And.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And thank you for being here. I'm extremely grateful. Okay, so I want to start off. First of all, what do you do for a living now?

[Miguel Macias]

I'm still in the construction business, but I became a general contractor as Of. Okay, a month or two ago.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right, let me take you back. And how old are you now?

[Miguel Macias]

31.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right. Back on December 2014, when a horrible crime was committed down in Homestead, Florida, which is. It's about. Probably about 40 minutes south of Miami in Florida, how old were you then? 20 would have been around the time you're arrested. Okay. Early. Okay. And had you ever been arrested or had any contact with the criminal justice system before you were arrested?

[Miguel Macias]

Minor. When I was in eighth grade.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay, so something minor, nothing major. Okay. So 2014 A. Let me set this up. I understood a teenager, I believe she was still in high school at the time, was at a party in Homestead, and then she was kidnapped by someone, taken to a remote location, beaten and then raped. And then for some reason, he let her go. And she wanted justice. So she reported this naturally to law enforcement. She knew only a couple of things. One, she knew what the guy looked like, knew that the name of the guy for some reason was Miguel, and knew the party from which she came. So she did her own investigation. And ultimately. Let's go to you. You were driving your vehicle and were stopped by law enforcement, correct?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Tell us what happened.

[Miguel Macias]

My uncle was driving.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

This was March 13, 2015. So tell us what happened. This is a few months after this incident occurred. You're in the vehicle and what happened?

[Miguel Macias]

No, I was at home and my uncle was driving the vehicle, which was under my name, and he got put over by law enforcement, and they. They were telling him that the owner of the vehicle needs to come pick up the vehicle or he was going to go to jail.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay.

[Miguel Macias]

So when I show up, he's. He asked for my id, I gave him my license, and he went to his police car, made a couple calls, and came back out and said I was had to go in for questioning.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

What was your thought at that point?

[Miguel Macias]

I was scared. Why am I being taken in if I haven't done nothing?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Did he tell you. Did you have any idea what this was about?

[Miguel Macias]

No. No idea whatsoever.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. Did you think of saying, no, I'm not coming with you. I'm going to get a lawyer. I'm not going to talk to you?

[Miguel Macias]

No, I had nothing to fear.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Say it again.

[Miguel Macias]

I haven't done. I had nothing to fear.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay.

[Miguel Macias]

I didn't do anything. So.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay, so you. So you go with him. Did he. Did he put handcuffs on you?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes, Yes. I mean, I had recently gotten a cut on my wrist at work, and I was bleeding on back of his car.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Jeez. All right.

[Jona Spilbore]

But he didn't. He didn't say, I need to take him for questioning on a kidnap and a rape. He didn't say anything like that.

[Miguel Macias]

No.

[Jona Spilbore]

He just left the cuffs on you and put you in the back of the squad car?

[Miguel Macias]

Yeah. He said how to go in for a question with detectives. That's it.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay, so they take you to a Miami police department. Yes, yes. And then tell us what happened.

[Miguel Macias]

Then they put me in the. In one of the rooms and wait for a couple minutes, and they come in and start questioning me. You know, good cop, bad cop.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay.

[Miguel Macias]

And they. They show me a picture of her and. And said, do you know her? I'm like, no. Never seen her day in my life. And like, no. Yes, you. You do know her. Like, no, I don't know. Back and forth, yes or no.

[Jona Spilbore]

And.

[Miguel Macias]

Well, she said, you. You kidnapped and raped her. And I was like, no, no, that's a lie. And we get to the point. So DNA, and I give it over my DNA voluntarily.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

They gave you, like, a little swab test in your mouth. They put a Q tip in your mouth or something. You volunteered, right?

[Miguel Macias]

Yeah, I volunteered. And that's when they took. They sent me into book. And afterwards, he said, if you're in, if you're innocent, you'll be out. And. Well, I think it was a couple days. I don't want to lie on days it's on because I can't remember.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. I have a bunch of questions. How long did they spend with you in that room before they arrested you and booked you for this kidnapping and rape?

[Miguel Macias]

Honestly, like, three, four hours.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. During the three to four hours, other than showing you a photo and asking you, you know, do you recognize this gal? And you said, no. What else were they doing during that time period?

[Miguel Macias]

I don't really want. I don't really remember, but they were in and out a lot. Like, they would switch. The two officers, the two detectives, they would switch back and forth and come back with questions.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Did they confront any other evidence?

[Jona Spilbore]

Did they read you your vehicle?

[Miguel Macias]

They did the Miranda rights. They did before they took me out.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right. Okay.

[Miguel Macias]

But they confronted me about the vehicle, which. I don't know if you remember, Mark. My mother had a similar vehicle at the same time. A big suv, black. So that's why, I guess they did to the. Yeah, it's him. Because the vehicle matches.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. All right, so you're. You're placed under. You're placed under arrest. You're charged with kidnapping. In fact, there were, like, seven counts. I Think it was like multiple counts, right? Yeah. What about your bond?

[Miguel Macias]

I don't think there was a bond.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I know. Question. Yeah, no, there was no bond.

[Miguel Macias]

There was no bond.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Nothing. You were held with no bond. It was. Because kidnapping is a life felony here in Florida. You are facing life. And I want to know what you're thinking as you're sitting there in jail.

[Miguel Macias]

That's when the thoughts started rolling in, the emotions, you know, tears. I was going crazy in there, especially when family would come to visit me and I would have to see him behind a glass, you know, now what if I spend the rest of my life in prison for something I didn't do?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And so initially, you had the public defender, did you not?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes. All right.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Because your family really didn't have much money, did they, to hire a top notch criminal defense attorney.

[911 Caller]

Correct.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. Like, what do your folks do further? What did. What did they do for a living at the time?

[Miguel Macias]

We're a construction family. Not everybody does the same business. Construction.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Hard, hard working morning till night, using your hands. Real labor, correct?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes, correct.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right. And so at some point, you're in there for a long period of time, like more than a month, and then your folks somehow come to me. Do you remember? I don't know the answer to this. Do you know how they found me?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes, I remember it at the back of my head.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Tell me. I don't know the answer.

[Miguel Macias]

My brother Google, the best criminal defense lawyer in Miami, and you were the

[Mark Eiglarsch]

first one, and he was unavailable. So then you found me somehow.

[Jona Spilbore]

The A's, the B's, the C's, and the D. Then they died.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

None of them would take your case. Then you got to me, right? Then you looked up on the. On the jail, the. The wall of the jail, and there said, tall eye gliders for a cheap lawyer.

[911 Caller]

Right.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right, so back to this. So your parents somehow got to me from Google. Wow.

[Miguel Macias]

Yeah.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. Wow. All right, now I'll tell you my part. I don't know if we've ever spoken about this. They came to see me, and there was almost nothing that appealed to me initially. I had a daughter around the same age. Right. And I just couldn't imagine taking on a client who had brutalized and raped someone like this. But your folks were very persistent, I'm telling you. Why I didn't say no. First they showed me, like, photos or convinced me that you had tattoos. Can you show us, like, the tattoos that you have just to hold it up? I mean, there were tattoos all over, Right. And I Figured maybe the victim didn't mention anything about tattoos. I didn't know yet because I. Again, I knew nothing about the case. The other thing was they showed me some text messages, which, if they were real, seemed to suggest you weren't even at the party at the time that you were supposed to have kidnapped her from. Do you remember about that?

[Miguel Macias]

I was never at that party.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I understand. But these text messages that they showed me got me to believe, you know what? This guy is either innocent or they're pulling my leg here. They're showing me some stuff, and I really believe that you likely were innocent and they didn't have the money to pay me. But I'm telling you, I wanted to be a part of the journey and visiting you in jail. Do you remember that first visit we had?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Tell me. I remember some of the things you said, but just share that first visit, when I came to see you.

[Miguel Macias]

Okay. When you first kind of visit, like you mentioned earlier, you couldn't imagine defending somebody with those charges, so you told me, I want. I want to shake your hand.

[Jona Spilbore]

Mark said he wanted to shake your hand or he didn't want.

[Miguel Macias]

No, no, no. He said he will not shake my hand, so I came out innocent.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Wait, say that again.

[Miguel Macias]

When you went. When you went to visit me, that. That you said that you wishing my hand if I was innocent because you have a daughter, and you can't imagine somebody doing that to your daughter.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. It's interesting. And. And.

[Jona Spilbore]

And you don't remember that, Mark.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

You don't know, because I don't know that it happened exactly. I wouldn't say to someone, you know, I'll only shake your hand if you're innocent, because that. That's not me, but I think that that's his recollection, so we'll run with it. Right. I. I know for sure I had reservations about taking this case, but my meeting at the jail changed everything. The. The. The things that his family showed me, coupled with looking at him in the eyes and talking with him, the way he's talking now. I said. I. I said, there's no lying in this guy. I think that there's a mistake. There has to be a mistake. Okay. Okay. All right. So I agreed to take your case. Did that make you feel any better at all? Because you had been over a month for sure. Yeah.

[Miguel Macias]

Yes, definitely felt a big relief.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah.

[Miguel Macias]

You had a good attorney defending me.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And you also. You also told me that you actually had been sitting back there so long that you believe that you may never get out of prison that you literally were going to spend the rest of your life. Those thoughts were in your head after you had been there for so long. Johnny, you had a question.

[Jona Spilbore]

Yeah, for you. So the. The meeting happens, the in person meeting happens, you change your mind, he's grateful, you're going to take the case, you walk out of there. What's the first thing you did? Did you pick up the phone and call the da?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Absolutely. That's where we are in the story.

[Miguel Macias]

Okay, I can vote for that 100%.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I couldn't wait to call her. Okay. And I've already mentioned her publicly. Her name's Christina Cabrera. And. And normally I wouldn't, but I'm going to tell you what she did. I started telling her, go, listen, I'm brand new to the case. I don't know anything. I don't have evidence. I don't have anything. But I've got some text messages which seem to suggest he wasn't even at the party. And could you tell me whether the victim talked about tattoos? Because my guy's covered in tattoos. And end. And she cut me off. She goes, do you know what time it is? I said, no. Why?

[Jona Spilbore]

Why you to let this guy out?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

She looked at me. She didn't look at me. She told me on the phone. She goes, it's almost 5 o'. Clock. I don't work after 5 o'. Clock. If you have anything you want to send to me over the next few weeks, you could send it to me and I'll look at it. Oh, my God, John. I thought I was spiritually fit. I mean, I've been meditating for years. I pride myself on being positively legal. Okay? That moment she pushed the buttons on me that launched some words that are reserved for the middle of the night when you stub your toe on a piece of furniture on the way to the bathroom. You understand those words that caused me to make amends to her? Only for the words that I used and not for the tone or. Or for the disdain that I had for her dismissing what could be a potentially innocent client. So what I did was for two days or so, while my client is languishing in jail, possibly innocent, I'm trying to call her, I'm emailing her, pleading with her to give me the attention that I needed. And I wasted. I wasted two days. I actually still feel a little guilty that I wasted two days of my client's liberty trying to deal with her. I would never do that. Today, you take a deep breath, you say, she's doing the best she can at her level of awareness. Who's your damn boss? That's exactly what I did right over her head. I went to her boss and I sat down with her boss. And she couldn't be more kind. And she looked at what I had. She goes, wow, wow, you might have something here. Well, we'll know definitively, she said, in months from now. I understood. Maybe six months when we get the DNA back. I went, wait, wait, wait, wait. There's DNA here. The victim they got DNA from. That's right. It's a rape case. So they've got the perpetrator's DNA from inside the victim. Okay, let's. Let's do the DNA test now. That prosecutor, that supervisor. She goes, no, he has to wait his turn. He has to wait his turn like everybody else.

[911 Caller]

Wow.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I said, no. She said, yes. I said, absolutely not. She said, yes. I wouldn't leave that office until she agreed to pull his test from the bottom and put it on the damn top. And we. We came to this agreement. We came to this agreement. It wasn't easy. She goes, I'll do it if you don't tell your colleagues that I'm doing it. Don't tell any other defense lawyer, because they're going to want the same treatment. And I said, I won't tell anybody.

[Jona Spilbore]

Fair enough.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Of course I told everybody, but I am not telling anybody. Okay. And Miguel. Okay, Miguel, I'm going to tell them what happened. But I want to know, you know, your perspective. We'll pick up the story with. With when you heard something. First of all, did you know that. That. Did I ever share with you that she agreed to then fast track your DNA. Did I ever tell you that you didn't know that?

[Miguel Macias]

No. I remember what you told me clearly. Told me, if you're innocent, you will be outside that jailhouse in 48 hours. And on the 47 hour, on the dot. I was outside that jailhouse.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Damn. So I didn't know what happened that quick.

[Miguel Macias]

And you stick to a 100%.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Wow, wow, wow. Well, I didn't think it happened that quickly, but I. I'll tell you this. We got you out, but it was on a presumptive test, meaning. Yeah, that they did some kind of quick test and it showed it wasn't you. But the final test wasn't fully done yet, but it wasn't 30 days.

[Jona Spilbore]

It took a month to do a presumptive. I'm surprised they can't do that.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

No, no, they jonna. They hadn't Even started it until I came into the case and told this prosecutor, you need to pull him from the bottom to the top. Then they just, like, fast tracked it. Like, acted like his life mattered for the first time and that this was like a murder case. And we need to know, you know, okay, let's go. And they. They did. They prioritized it. Okay.

[Jona Spilbore]

I can't wait to hear all the apologies that you got, Miguel, on your way. On your way out of jail.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Well, let's wait for that. Well, we did. Hold on. First of all, did you know anything before you were released? Like, did they just say, all right, come with us, you're leaving? Like, what. What did you hear? I don't know if I. Again, just so people don't think I can't pick up the phone and call him. Right. He has to call me or have to go visit. And I was busy working on his case, so I was going to travel and hours to the jail or whatever. I was hoping his family would convey that to him. Did you know that we had gotten the DNA and the results back before they let you out?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes, I knew because I. Every morning when I would wake up, I would call my mom.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Good. And I figured you were. Yeah.

[Miguel Macias]

And then she's the one that told me, oh, you're coming out today. Your lawyer got you. He said everything. You come out innocent, basically.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Well, well, let me just say this. The first part was getting you out. That didn't mean the charges were going to be dropped. They agreed to let you out on bond based upon the results. And then we went to court, like, right away, probably the next day or whatever, in front of Judge Block. Let's roll a clip from Judge Block. I love this judge. He's a wonderful human being. And what he said publicly was extraordinary. Let's listen to that.

[Narrator/Announcer]

The judge had these words for Macias,

[Miguel Macias]

I apologize to what happened.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

For what happened to you, sir. Yeah, right. And if I remember correctly, he agreed to expunge your record right away, didn't he?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes. He sealed the record.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

That has never happened, ever. You have to go to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement. You have to go to. Then to the state attorney's office. And I tell all my clients, no matter how much they pay me, and it will not happen unless you wait, like a year. It literally takes a year. This judge fast tracked it and just did it. Sua spontane, right from the bench, right from, you know, right in front of open court. That was a beautiful thing. John, I want to get your reaction And I want to get your reaction to Miguel. I don't know if you ever saw what the chief prosecutor like, this isn't the one that I dealt with. This is Kathleen Hogue, who I do admire. She's still in the office. Now, here's what she told the media about your case. Go ahead.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Veteran prosecutor Kathleen Hogue told me testimony from one witness plus evidence were strong enough to charge and hold Macias for 42 days.

[Jona Spilbore]

But as soon as we found out, we did what we had to do

[Mark Eiglarsch]

and we released him. This happens all the time.

[Jona Spilbore]

Okay. This is not the first time it's happened. It won't be the last. Oh, okay then.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah.

[Jona Spilbore]

So, hey, not to drive a little too fast in Miami, I guess, you know, you never know when you're going to get picked up and thrown in the clink for 42 friggin days.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Miguel. Miguel. Have you ever seen her? You ever seen that quote?

[Miguel Macias]

Yeah.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

What do you, what do you make of that again? I. I'm hesitant because I do like her. I'm friendly with her. She's been great on cases, happens all the time. I just, I couldn't believe that she said that to the media like that. And I know what she meant. Meaning you're not the only innocent guy. But the matter in which he said it, how does that make you feel when you hear that?

[Miguel Macias]

It makes me pretty mad.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah.

[Miguel Macias]

Because there's. There's other ways you could have said it, you know.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay, so. So yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry I interrupted you.

[911 Caller]

Go ahead.

[Miguel Macias]

No, no, there's other ways it could have been said in a different way. She is sitting right.

[Jona Spilbore]

I'm very sorry that this happened. In our system of justice, innocent people shouldn't be sitting behind bars for 42 days. I'm very sorry. We'll do better.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Well, there you go.

[Jona Spilbore]

Better. That would have been a nice way. That would have been.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

That's it. All right, so. So let's talk about why it is that you were arrested. What people don't know is that the victim, she went to Facebook and found the guy who threw the party. Yes, Facebook. This is, I think before Instagram was big. And she went and she looked through the guy, all of his friends, the guy who threw the party, she knew someone named Miguel and she found someone named Miguel. And there it is. That's the guy. That's the guy. Now let's show the folks who the DNA actually matched. Can we pull that up on the screen? Hang on. Take a look at that. Miguel Macias, who We've been speaking to is the one in the dark shirt. My dear client. My sweet, innocent client.

[Jona Spilbore]

Damn.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I know.

[Jona Spilbore]

Damn.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And then on the right is Miguel Bustos, who was arrested shortly thereafter in 2015. Pled to in 2000, I think was 22, in front of a judge who I. Who I adore. And he got 10 years in prison, and I think followed by lengthy probation. He's a registered sex offender, and I think he's still in prison now. But take a look at that, folks. I mean, I'll be the first one to say, miguel, I don't know what you're thinking, but, I mean, clearly that dude looks arguably like you. Would you at least concede that? Yes. All right. I didn't know. I didn't want to offend you or anything. Okay.

[Miguel Macias]

No, no, we do look at.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Yeah. So I don't blame the victim. I think the starting point is her going, hey, I think it's this guy. I get it. But then what other evidence is there, you know? And their position is, that's enough for us. And I say believability and accuracy are two different things. She can believe all she wants. That's McGill. But be completely inaccurate as she was. Now, Miguel, you lost a lot of money that you would have made during that time. This was so traumatic. In fact, I want you to sum up. Do you just put this behind you and move on, or do you still have lasting feelings from being locked up and thinking that you may spend the rest of your life in prison?

[Miguel Macias]

It's like a more come and go in others. So it hits me once in a while when I get to thinking about it. I'm like, wow, I could have really lost my whole life in prison for something I didn't do. And my feelings do come back once in a while.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

How rough was it in prison? Yeah, go ahead. Tears. What else?

[Miguel Macias]

And wasn't honestly wasn't bad. Nobody really bothered me. Number one, not everybody was. I wasn't a cell. I was really normal. Come. I don't think you.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Not bad. When you said not bad. Not bad for jail, you're not saying it wasn't a bad experience. I just want to make that. No, it wasn't.

[Miguel Macias]

It wasn't a bad experience, you know? You know, nobody bothered me. Nobody messed with me. So everybody stick to themselves.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. And so naturally. Naturally, we sued and we made millions and millions of dollars and you never have to work anymore. Right? I wish we tried, didn't we?

[Miguel Macias]

Yes.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

And what were you told? What were you told?

[Miguel Macias]

I can't really recover. I think since. Since there was evidence, there was nothing we can do. Right? Something like that.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I'll help you out. The. The standard is so high to win money on a false arrest claim that if it was easy to do so, police forces would be bankrupt. Okay, so the burden is so high that you got nothing. There was nothing that can be done for you financially. And all we can say is we're so sorry that you went through this. Jona, do you have any final questions?

[Jona Spilbore]

I just. I mean, there's so many things, Mark, I know this was 11 years ago, but the fact that they had DNA from the victim that they could have run through a database to see if it matched anybody, they didn't do that. The fact that they took somebody with the name Miguel, which. I'm sorry, very popular name, Miguel, right?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

In South Florida. Yeah.

[Jona Spilbore]

We were talking that maybe you should change it to something really unique like tirzepatide or something so that this never happens again. That they took that and that was the basis for the arrest, that they locked him up without a preliminary hearing or bringing it to a grand jury or anything like that. That would have also sprung him. Like so many things. I'm thankful that your parents, Miguel, and landed on the ease in the phone book and got Mark. I know that took a little bit of doing, but he's the reason. He's kind of magical that way. So you should be very, very appreciative. And we're very appreciative that we got to hear your story right from you because we don't get to do that very often.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Miguel, I need to thank you. I mean, your story I tell all the time in my keynote addresses. More so about how to change my thoughts, to change how I feel. Meaning from from now on, when I feel that same frustration with a prosecutor, I immediately let that prosecutor go. And I go, all right, who's your boss? And don't even waste the energy on that person because it cost us valuable time. But anyway, I want to thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to be here and sharing your compelling story. You'll remain a dear friend and I thank you. Thank you for the opportunity to be of service to you. Thank you, brother.

[Jona Spilbore]

Thank you, Miguel.

[Miguel Macias]

Thank you guys very much.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Be well. My love to your family. Take care, bro. Okay, so, Jonna. Wow. Right?

[Jona Spilbore]

Right.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

What a story.

[Jona Spilbore]

One other thing. One other thing, Mark. That judge did the right thing and apologized to your client. Unlike the judge I was complaining about earlier in this show.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay, way to Link it back. You're brilliant like that. That's so good. All right, coming up, we're gonna go off the record. Yeah, you want to stick around for that? Be right back. Premier hosts on VRBO deliver quality vacation rental stays with fast responses and clear instructions so you don't have to worry about surprises.

[Commercial Voice]

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[Mark Eiglarsch]

See, that's the premier host move right there.

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I wish I had a premier group chat. I asked them where we should have dinner last night and they left me on red.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I know you saw it.

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[Jona Spilbore]

Welcome back to Positively Legal. It's time for Mark and I to go off the record. This is going to be our time to do just that and rant about whatever is on our minds. Mark, what say you?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

All right, Jonna. This is always on my mind.

[911 Caller]

All right.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

We are constantly hearing about young people committing a disproportionate number of crimes, and many of them are extremely serious offenses. Now, our instinct is often to judge and condemn without ever considering how we could be part of the solution. Now, I understand that that reaction is something I still do from time to time. I certainly did it often as a young prosecutor. Thirty years ago, one particular case changed my perspective forever. I was prosecuting a 16 year old serial robber who had just killed a German tourist vacationing down here in South Florida. He asked for an opportunity to meet with us, the prosecutors, face to face in hopes of persuading us to give him a more reasonable plea deal. We agreed. So they brought him over with all his defense lawyers and the police officers were there and it was us. And we're like, okay, what do you want to tell us? I sat across from him and as he was speaking more articulately than I ever envisioned him doing, I immediately thought, what a tragic, dysfunctional childhood this kid had. Given the severity of his crimes, though, there was no chance that we were going to let him out of prison anytime soon. I couldn't help but imagining how different his life would be. As I'm sitting there, I'm looking at him, wondering if we can turn back the clock, how that would have changed the course of his life. The victims. What if a caring adult got into his life when he was younger and spent just a couple of hours with him as a child? I truly believed in that moment it would make a difference. Immediately after that meeting, I became a mentor to an at risk 11 year old through the Big Brothers Big Sisters of America program. Shamain, who's my little brother, my first little brother. He's now in his 40s and he raised his own beautiful children. And he credits me, to quote, making him the man that he is today. I can't believe that he really feels that way. I loved spending time with him and I still love being a mentor to him. For the past two years, I've had the privilege of mentoring Abel, my next little brother. He's 16 years old and he's preparing for college right now and then eventually law school. Those ambitions weren't even on his radar. When I first met with him, he was going to the Navy. He didn't think about college, he didn't think about law school. But he's come to so many of my law classes and he watches me teach, and now he wants to go to law school. Mentoring definitely works. I understand it's not for everyone. But if you want to profoundly impact the life of a child and in the process have that child profoundly impact your life, I encourage you to reach out and get involved today. Whether it's donating, totally fine. We need your money or giving of your time. Our children need you. It will change the direction of their future and it'll change yours, Jona. That's what I got.

[Jona Spilbore]

Well, Mark, we're gonna switch gears here a little bit. I love that. I love that you are a mentor. And I think that that is amazing. And those are profound words. Not to be minimized. Not to be minimized by what I'm about to complain about. Okay? Okay. So if ever I turn up murdered, someone needs to question my cats. I shouldn't even call them my cats. They are cats. Yes, and they reside rent free in my house. But they are far from the cute, cuddly, let me sleep on your head and curl up in front of the fireplace type cats on account of they entered this world feral and untamed. They remain. It all started innocently enough. First, one stray cat showed up at my door, Christmas Eve of all days. I fed it a few leftover meatballs or something, and that was that. Until a week or so later when that one cat brought a friend. I thought nothing of it really, but did invest in some genuine cat food at that point, because, well, food is my love language. It must have been theirs too, because it wasn't long before I caught these two stray cats committing cat porn in my backyard.

[Miguel Macias]

Radiant flower, you do not have to

[Jona Spilbore]

come with me to decaf bar.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

We are already. Yeah, we can spend the rest of our lives making love.

[Jona Spilbore]

Let's do the math, shall we? First they brought me three kittens. A few months later, five. And then six. Before I knew it, I was feeding enough cats to fill two baseball rosters.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Please, sir, I want some more.

[Jona Spilbore]

There is only one humane way to keep a feral cat from popping out kittens every 65 days. You gotta catch them and fix them. How hard could that be? It's fucking hard. My well meaning cat friends all told me to take these dirt cats to a shelter and don't look back. And I tried that. I did, only to be turned away like I was selling something nobody wanted because the shelters were all full. Hmm, wonder why. Plan B, which incidentally they don't have for cats, although they should, was to get them fixed at a cat clinic, bring them back to my house and set them free. It's called TNR Trap Neuter Release. And it sounded doable, I guess. Come to find out, cat clinics near me spay are neutered every third Thursday between 2 and 2:12pm in months that don't end in ER and only while Mars is retrograde in the year of the rat. So I ended up taking my dirt cats to the Taj Mahal of veterinarians who could schedule the sterilizations during my free time and also charge me nearly 1000 bucks a pop because they needed this test and that vaccine. And why not settle it all aside for their own little feline 401k? After all that, who could possibly let these little feral fuckers back out in the wild? I mean, I need proof of life to claim them on my taxes, don't I? Currently, these ungrateful fur balls live their best lives under a bed or behind a couch, emerging every so often to summon a snack. A couple of my older ones, like Prada and Jimmy Choo from batch number three, show themselves so infrequently that our only interaction is usually me Looking at them and wondering, how'd you get so fat? And them staring straight through my soul, as only a cat with criminal propensity can. As if to say, from eating dead people. Which brings me back to my original point. If ever I end up murdered, question my cats because they knock over a lot of. Scratch up a lot of my skin and puke up a lot of fur. But the one thing they don't try to do is escape.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Those animals will eat you really fast. Especially a cat. Cat will remove your head in 24 hours. Even cats that were loved by their owners. Or is it just cats? No, you think were had something with the owner and they're. And they're gonna say, this is my time. Yeah. No, they're. They're absolutely feeding on you. You know, I don't care how much you love that cat and that cat loved you. He's gonna eat you.

[Jona Spilbore]

Makes one wonder, doesn't it? Well, great job.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Great job. I'm so allergic of this All I was doing, how allergic to cats I am. You too?

[Jona Spilbore]

Me too. Yeah. But I do it anyway, Mark. I guess that's my mentoring. But can we say a big thank. Thank you to your former client and our guest, Miguel Macias. And thank you, thank you to my co host, Mark Iguar.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Well, thank you, thank you. But hold on. We do not leave Positively Legal without saying what we're grateful for. Jonah, I will not let you out until you at least. Right, because gratitude is the antidote for stinking thinking. So all of our viewers, at the same time, take a moment to think what you're grateful for. It could just be the last breath. You had my mother. My mother who passed away years ago, she would, I would say, kill for that last breath. But you know what I'm saying. Everybody should be grateful for the fact that we're here and all the wonderful things in our lives. Johnna, you got something you're grateful for.

[Jona Spilbore]

You're not going to go first?

[Mark Eiglarsch]

I'll go first. You go first. I'll tell you this right off the bat. I just got back last night from University of Florida, where my daughter Julia, so proud of her. She graduated with honors. All my three kids were there. My wife of 25 years, we had beautiful dinners together. We spoke eloquently and just lovingly about Julia and all of her accomplishments. She's headed to law school. I have no idea why. Wants to defend those guilty people, don't know why, but we're so proud of her. And I'm so grateful for her my family, my wife. I'm grateful to you. I'm grateful to these producers here. And I love Positively Legal. Your turn.

[Jona Spilbore]

I'm grateful that my Botox doctor texted me to do a welfare check. That means I'm really special. Yes. I want to say. And I miss you too, and I will. I'll be texting him back. I am grateful for that.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

Okay. And I'm grateful to you, John. All right. Take us. Take us home. Let's finish this.

[Jona Spilbore]

All right, so wait. Wait a minute. Gotta use these. Thank you for joining us. And remember, episodes of Positively Legal drop every Wednesday. We can't wait to see you again next week. Have a great week.

[Mark Eiglarsch]

We hope you choose happiness. Peace. Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well. Roof repair, done well. Kitchen sink install, done well. Deck upgrades, done well. Electrical upgrade, done well. Angie's been connecting homeowners with skilled pros for nearly 30 years. So we know the difference between done and done. Done well.

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[Mark Eiglarsch]

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