My Disability Makes My Sex Life Even Hotter

Summary

Modern Love Podcast: "My Disability Makes My Sex Life Even Hotter"

Host: Anna Martin, The New York Times
Guest: Kyla Harris
Date: July 22, 2026

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Overview

In this candid and deeply personal episode, Anna Martin sits down with writer, filmmaker, and disability advocate Kyla Harris to explore what it means to love, date, and have sex as a disabled woman. Harris shares her journey following a life-changing accident at fifteen, recounting the evolution of her relationships, the challenges and joys of navigating intimacy and desire as a disabled person, and how her experiences have led to creative, communicative, and even hotter sex. Through laughter, honesty, and vulnerability, Harris and Martin deconstruct stereotypes about disability and sexuality, revealing the exquisite complexity—and occasionally hilarious reality—of loving and living in a disabled body.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Life Before and After Disability

• Early Teenage Years

  • Kyla describes her fifteen-year-old self as “starting to really understand the power of sexuality,” feeling developed but not represented in the heroin chic era—“I had the tits and ass to rival J. Lo” (02:22).
  • First sexual experience happened on a school ski trip: “The first time that I was fingered was on a ski bus…” (03:22).
  • Anna jokes about the challenges of intimacy while in ski attire, to which Kyla laughs: “There was, like, the thrill of being on a bus… I loved the thrill of knowing I was a sexual being.” (04:11).

• The Accident

  • At 15, Kyla breaks her neck on a school trip—becoming a tetraplegic unable to walk or use her hands fully (04:54).
  • Instead of panic, she recalls, “I remember so distinctly feeling this unbelievable sense of calm and peace and feeling the light through my eyes” (05:10).
  • The reality hit with a doctor’s blunt statement: “He said, ‘You’re never going to be able to walk again.’ … My automatic thought was, ‘Well, then I don’t want to live’” (08:01).
  • Years later, she realized this despair stemmed from not knowing “anything about wheelchair users… what life might look like… if I wasn’t able to walk…” (08:33).

2. Teenage Sexuality in Rehab

• Horny Teen Ward

  • Kyla describes the young adult rehab ward: “I would say it was kind of like a mixed boarding school with mobility equipment… Teens equal. Horny as fuck.” (11:32-11:47)
  • Nurses gossip, cafeteria dynamics mirror high school, and everyone’s experimenting despite medical traumas: “Everything felt heightened. Every moment of joy was the most impossibly joyous… Every moment of difficulty was like experiencing a thousand heartbreaks.” (13:46)
  • Memorable quote: “There was a taste of death in your mouth when you weren’t tasting someone else’s tongue.” (14:45)

• Early Relationships Post-Accident

  • Kyla formed intimate relationships with both disabled peers and friends’ friends in the rehab ward: “Our first double date was essentially on a hospital ward.” (18:06)
  • “I was also making out with other disabled people as well, obviously… How could you not make out with all of them?” (18:13)

3. Intimacy, Desire, and Communication After Disability

• First Sexual Experience After Accident

  • Kyla recalls the first time she had sex after her accident: “I don’t really remember the sex… but… it gave me a sense of being back into my body.” (22:08)
  • Loss of control over her body turned pleasure into an act of reclamation: “Feeling desired [and] pleasure was a way of reclaiming part of me that I thought I’d lost.” (23:21)

• Communication in Sex

  • Necessity for caregivers meant Kyla became adept at communicating physical needs, which translated into sexual assertiveness: “I would then be like, I want to get on top of you right now… I had to communicate what I wanted them to do.” (24:40)

4. Caregivers, Boundaries & Friendship

• Managing Personal Assistants (PAs)

  • “I became an employer at 16 and had to…train all of the PAs to do my 24-hour care.” (26:22)
  • Care included everything—stretching, catheters, dressing, eating—but hiring friends as PAs blurred boundaries: “I felt like I would be less disabled if I had my friends doing my care.” (30:01)

• Friendship and Caregiving

  • With close friend Lee, Kyla developed a deeply intimate friendship with comic undertones: “She learned how to catheterize me in basically any situation you could imagine.” (31:22)
  • Their friendship inspired scenes for Kyla’s TV show We Might Regret This, including an alleyway catheterization gone wrong: “Was that pee mine? Yes.” (33:46)
  • Such situations lead to “an absolutely enhanced sense of intimacy.” (34:28)
  • The dual role created friction: “She was fantastic at doing my care… What she wasn’t fantastic at was not being a friend and just being a PA.” (34:44)
  • Eventually, Kyla realized she needed clearer boundaries and stopped hiring friends: “I needed to be more boundaried.” (39:45)

5. Romantic Partners and Care

• Negotiating Intimacy and Assistance

  • Romantic partners sometimes learn care tasks, especially for privacy: “It means that they would need to learn catheterization.” (40:11)
  • Some care boundaries required time to cross: “Let me help you take a shit. And I was like, absolutely not. Absolutely not. Like, that’s my boundary, which is now being removed.” (41:04)
  • One of the episode’s most poignant moments:
    • Kyla, feeling vulnerable during a bout of illness, expressed insecurity to her partner: “I don’t know how you can still find me attractive.” Her partner replied, “‘Are you joking? I feel like this adds to our relationship because it is just another level of intimacy that you and I are experiencing together.’” (42:23)

• Legal and Systemic Barriers

  • If Kyla marries or lives with her partner, she loses government assistance for care: “If I just move in with my partner… they see my partner as being able to provide the care…I would lose funding for my own PAs. And that’s incredibly dangerous.” (46:43)

6. Evolving Sex Life and Creative Adaptations

• Eight Years Together

  • Kyla’s relationship began with “gentle warmth,” and continues to be defined by mutual care, autonomy, and communication. (44:35)
  • Her partner helps with care during travel or alone time, but maintains boundaries in their day-to-day: “I have 24 hour care from the nine PAs that I have rotating… When we want to go away together alone, she does my care.” (46:43)

• Equality, Creativity, and Hotter Sex

  • On her relationship: “What [sex] feels like? Feels like fucking equality. That’s what sex feels like with her.” (49:44)
  • Disability requires creativity: “The thing I rely on most is creativity to exist in this world… If there’s a barrier, how do we get around it? Do we put a ramp on it?” (51:33)
  • Kyla experimented with BDSM, using adaptive equipment: “I called up an occupational therapist… I was wondering if you could help me modify a sex toy.” (52:21)
  • “She had a splint made for me so that I would be able to grip this flogger. And I was happy to report back to her that it worked.” (53:19)

• Direct Communication as Sexy

  • “It often seems like it comes in the form of demands and commands…‘Turn over, get on your knees, spread your legs, sit on my face.’” (55:44)
  • Kyla feels even more embodied and attuned to her body: “I am more embodied as a disabled person than most non disabled people I know… That makes better sex.” (56:17)

7. Advice and Reflections on Disabled Sexuality

• Words for Disabled Youth
  • “No matter what the world tells you, what society tells you, that you are intrinsically valued and that you are so worthy of care for yourself, care for others, loving yourself, and… joy and pleasure.” (57:24)
• On Hotter Sex
  • Harris asserts: “Being disabled has 100% made my sex hotter than it was or could have been.” (55:05)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Everything felt heightened. Every moment of joy was the most impossibly joyous thing you could experience. Every moment of difficulty was like experiencing a thousand heartbreaks.” — Kyla (13:46)
• “There was a taste of death in your mouth when you weren’t tasting someone else’s tongue.” — Kyla (14:45)
• “Feeling desired, feeling pleasure was a way of reclaiming maybe part of me that I thought I’d lost.” — Kyla (23:21)
• On sex as a disabled person: “Feels like fucking equality. That’s what sex feels like with her.” — Kyla (49:44)
• “I am more embodied as a disabled person than most non disabled people I know.” — Kyla (56:17)
• “No matter what the world tells you…you are intrinsically valued and…so worthy of care for yourself…and of feeling joy and pleasure…” — Kyla (57:24)

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Important Timestamps

• 02:22: Early teenage sexuality and body image.
• 04:54: Description of the accident and aftermath.
• 08:01: Doctor’s blunt news and its emotional impact.
• 11:32: Teenage sexuality in rehab, “horny as fuck.”
• 13:46: The heightened emotions of living in rehab.
• 18:06: Double-date on a hospital ward.
• 22:08: First sex after disability—reclaiming her body.
• 24:40: How communicating daily needs makes for better sexual communication.
• 30:01: Hiring friends as caregivers.
• 33:46: The reality vs. fiction of her TV show’s intimate scenes.
• 39:45: Realizing importance of boundaries with friend PAs.
• 41:04 & 42:23: Navigating care boundaries with romantic partners; partner’s perspective on intimacy through care.
• 46:43: Effects of laws on her romantic living situation.
• 49:44: What sex feels like now—“fucking equality.”
• 51:33-53:19: Creativity in sex: adaptive BDSM with an occupational therapist.
• 55:44: Direct, commanding sexual communication.
• 57:24: Kyla’s advice to disabled youth on self-worth and pleasure.

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Tone & Style

• The conversation is open, funny, and intimate, retaining Kyla’s candid humor and Anna’s curious, supportive interviewing.
• Sex and bodily functions are discussed with directness, without shame but with plenty of laughter (“Like, for example, I don’t know yet” [34:07]).
• The tone is warm, occasionally irreverent, but always underscored by mutual respect and a drive to challenge assumptions about disability and desire.

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Closing Thoughts

Kyla Harris’s story is a vibrant, necessary reminder that intimacy, sexuality, and joy are not only possible after trauma, but can evolve into something richer and more creative. Through her honest reflections and playful storytelling, Harris invites listeners to reconsider limiting narratives about disability, to value communication and creativity, and, above all, to remain open to the many delicious (and sometimes hilarious) ways that love and sex can be embodied.

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For more stories and episodes, visit Modern Love from The New York Times.

Transcript

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[Anna Martin]

Love now and did you

[Kyla Harris]

fall in love last fella I love but stronger than anything for the love of love. And I love you more than anything.

[Anna Martin]

You're still up love from the New York Times. I'm Anna Martin, this is Modern Love and my guest today is Kyla Harris. I hadn't been talking to Kyla for very long before the two of us were discussing her urethra. Now, talking about your urethra with someone you've just met might be uncomfortable for some people. I would say probably most people. But Kyla has lots of experience talking about how her body feels, how it works, what it needs. Kyla is disabled. That's how she describes herself. And her disability means that she needs someone there to help her use the bathroom, make food, take a shower. Everything she wants or needs to do is a group project. And that becomes especially interesting when, when it comes to her sex life. Kyla is super open about that too. And I will say we get pretty explicit in this conversation. She made a TV show called We Might Regret this that's full of funny, intimate scenes and it's inspired by what it's been like for her to live and love and get it on as a disabled person. Our conversation made me blush, which is not easy to make me do. It made me snort, laugh, which actually, unfortunately is kind of easy to make me do. And it made me totally rethink what intimacy can mean. Kyla Harris, welcome to Modern Love.

[Kyla Harris]

Thanks, Hannah. I feel very welcomed.

[Anna Martin]

Okay, Kyla, you had an accident that changed your life when you were 15 years old. But even before all of that happened, I want a picture of 15 year old you. What was happening in your world? Were you dating? Did you have crushes? What was going on?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh my gosh. Yeah. I think 15 year old me was this kind of nubile character that was starting to really understand the power of sexuality. And I was already incredibly developed. So I had the tits and ass to rival J. Lo N Bile and tits and ass. I'm loving the range here. Yeah, those are my references. I Love it.

[Anna Martin]

Okay. Yes. J.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Lo.

[Kyla Harris]

So, yeah, I mean, it was, you know, when I was growing up, it was an era of the kind of heroin chic, and I felt like I really wasn't represented out there. And I had this incredibly curvy body. I had, you know, large breasts, a large bum. And I was so relieved when I saw J. Lo come kind of twerking into the scene because it felt like I was finally seeing myself out there.

[Anna Martin]

Were you curious about sex at this point in your life?

[Kyla Harris]

So, yeah, I. I definitely had had sexual experiences the first time. The first time that I was fingered was on a ski bus when we were going on a ski trip.

[Anna Martin]

Isn't there so many layers of clothing involved in skiing?

[Kyla Harris]

I mean, this is. This is. This is next level, right? I. I just went in next level.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Really?

[Anna Martin]

I really don't ski. But in my imagination, a ski suit is like a onesie. Like, getting the fingers in there would be very difficult.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, yeah. No, it was. It. And I don't. I don't know, there was, like, the thrill of being on a bus because we were on a bus, like, with the other students, and. And I tried to give my first hand job, which was, I would say, not successful. I wouldn't ask him. I don't know.

[Anna Martin]

Don't be zoned yourself.

[Kyla Harris]

You're on a bus. Thank you. Yeah. And probably in a onesie. So. So I. I. And I loved, like, the thrill of that. Like, I loved the thrill of knowing that I was this sexual being and knowing that I could. Yeah, just. Just knowing that I could use my body in this way.

[Anna Martin]

I'm gonna transition to. No easy way to transition, but I will say you were on a school trip when you had this accident that I referenced at the top of our conversation. Can you tell me whatever you'd like about what happened?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. So I was on a school trip, and I. I broke my neck. And I knew something had happened right away. And when I was. After I'd broken my neck, I was lying there, and I remember so distinctly feeling this unbelievable sense of calm and peace and feeling the light through my eyes, the sunlight through my eyes. I kept my eyes closed, and it was almost euphoric. And then I said, can everyone just back away? Just give me. I'll get up. Just give me a couple minutes. I'm going to get up. But I. But I didn't. And I was. Because we were in a really rural area for the school trip. I was strapped to a picnic table and put in a boat and road ashore and put in an ambulance and went to the closest hospital.

[Anna Martin]

Thank you for sharing that. Your parents come, I assume quite quickly. Did you have awareness of what was going on?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, so my dad. Okay, so my dad was a builder and I'd spent that summer helping him paint exterior. The exterior of houses, do up stuff, whatever he was working on. And I'd saved up money to buy these board shorts that I absolutely loved. And I was wearing these board shorts and they said, we're gonna have to cut these off. And I was devastated.

[Anna Martin]

Listen, the 15 year old and me who also saved up to buy. I'm feeling that hard. Wait, just to sort of memorialize them. Do you remember what they looked like?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh, 100%, yeah. I'd say like a hot red with some obviously Hawaiian white hibiscus flowers all over. I mean, it was the 90s.

[Anna Martin]

God. Yeah. So I.

[Kyla Harris]

So the first thing I felt devastated by was my board shorts being cut off, not the idea that I broke my neck.

[Anna Martin]

Did you feel like indignation, disbelief? Do you remember what was running through your mind?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. Oh, completely, completely. You know, I felt absolutely indignation. And I also felt like immediately I was like, oh gosh, this is just a bone that's going to have to heal. I thought it's just going to be like a broken arm. It's just a bit more annoying because I'm probably going to have to wear a neck brace, but I'm sure I'll be fine in three months. And I remember calling my best friend and saying, in three months time we're going to be. Why don't you come around and let's do. Let's go skiing again, huh?

[Anna Martin]

So to the extent had not sunk in yet.

[Kyla Harris]

No. And, and, and then soon after this, this doctor came in who my mom and I later called Dr. Doom.

[Anna Martin]

Dr. Doom.

[Kyla Harris]

And he.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah, you get the sense in where this is going.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, yeah, you can imagine. And he came in and he, he said, you're never going to be able to walk again. To me and my mom. No, I'm sorry. No cushioning, no sensitivity, empathy that I was a young girl who had just had really not understood what was going on. And my automatic thought was, well, then I don't want to live. And it wasn't until I'd say, about 10 years later that I realized that the reason why I had that reaction was because I'd know nothing about wheelchair users. I'd know nothing about what life might look like or feel like or be like in. If I wasn't able to walk and, you know, I'm not able to use my hands. I'm tetraplegic. I can move my arms. But it was always this emphasis on walking, on standing, on running, on skiing, on swimming.

[Anna Martin]

I mean. I mean, that feels like. With that Dr. Doom. I'm glad. Now, it's a bit of a joke, but that is probably the worst way that someone could share this news with you. You're realizing in that moment that your life is going to be completely different. Right. Completely different from anything you'd envisioned about what your future would be.

[Kyla Harris]

Absolutely.

[Anna Martin]

That is such a heavy thing to carry. Were you sharing how you were feeling with your parents, or was this something you kept for yourself?

[Kyla Harris]

I'm not sure that I shared that with my parents, but I think it was one of those things that I. I ended up living. You know, it was day after day. It was just very much about being in the moment and being with my changing body and understanding what that meant. It was really like being in the Matrix and not being asked if you want to take the red pill or the blue pill, but it being shoved down your damn throat.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Dang.

[Anna Martin]

That's a way worse version of that scene, I would say.

[Kyla Harris]

Same result.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Same result.

[Anna Martin]

Same result. We started our conversation by talking about, you know, sex and crushes and that kind of, like, fizzy feeling of being 15. And also the discovery you were undergoing with your own body, with its power, I guess. I wonder, like, after this accident, were you worried about what your love life was going to look like? Like, did you worry about, well, will I have a partner? Or these classic teenage experiences of, you know, sex and romance? Was that running through your mind?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. So about 10 days after I was in intensive care, I went to a physical rehabilitation center. And I was on the. I don't know why they called it adult, young adult ward of this rehabilitation center.

[Anna Martin]

Like the teen floor?

[Kyla Harris]

Yes.

[Anna Martin]

Okay.

[Kyla Harris]

Yes. And I would say it was kind of like a mixed boarding school with mobility equipment.

[Anna Martin]

Tell me more about what you mean by that.

[Kyla Harris]

Okay. Teens equal. Horny as fuck.

[Anna Martin]

A hundred.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Oh, my God.

[Anna Martin]

Then you're all on this floor. We're all on this floor.

[Kyla Harris]

Okay.

[Anna Martin]

Can you tell I didn't go to boarding school? I was like, so you're taking classes. You're talking about, like, people are horny for each other and there's, like, sexual tension flying all over between rooms or.

[Kyla Harris]

Exactly, exactly. Okay, so there was a cafeteria, and there were, like. In the cafeteria, it was the exact same thing as high school. It would be like, there's a group of the cool kids. And I remember the nurses were also maybe only like 10 years older than us. Like, not. They were also all, like, total gossips. So I remember. I remember one of the nurses coming to me and saying, okay, I don't know if you know about the guy next door, but he was shot in the back. And guess what? And I was like, go on, go on, Jody.

[Anna Martin]

And she, this is like a total breach of the Hippocratic oath or whatever. But I'm like, I'm all for it.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, I'm gonna keep going. Tell me the deets. Give me the tea. And she. And she was like. So he. So one. One of the things that disabled people like, when you're paralyzed, you experience are spasms sometimes, like, which are like contractions of muscles. Muscles. So she goes, so he has some quite unusual spasms in that his penis spasms. And he will have an erection for hours. Like. Like Viagra free erections. You're like.

[Anna Martin]

You don't say.

[Kyla Harris]

And then she was like, and his girlfriend will come and ride him for hours. So this is what. This is. This is what the kind of boarding school experience I had.

[Anna Martin]

I am getting a picture, my friend.

[Kyla Harris]

Wow.

[Anna Martin]

Okay. God. I mean, is it. I mean, it sounds fun, actually. Which is probably a weird word to put to that.

[Kyla Harris]

Everything felt heightened. Every. Every moment of joy was the most impossibly joyous thing you could experience. Every moment of difficulty was like experiencing a thousand heartbreaks. So while there was this kind of, like, sexual experimentation going on and this horniness and this, what can I do in this body? And where am I? On the. In the kind of ranking of popular. Then there was this. You know, at one point I got pneumonia and one of my lungs collapsed and I had to go back into emergency, into the intensive care unit. So there was this incredible. There was a taste of death in your mouth when you weren't tasting someone else's tongue.

[Anna Martin]

Did you just come up with that now?

[Kyla Harris]

I did. That's for free. That's for you.

[Anna Martin]

Stay with us.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

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[Kyla Harris]

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[Anna Martin]

Hsbc, we are here. Well, I guess I want to know, like, specifically for you, in the context of this horny teen wing, were you exploring with someone? Like, what was your. What was happening with you?

[Kyla Harris]

Yes. Yeah. So I always had visitors. Loads of visitors.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

And it became this kind of group. And you'd see the regulars, you know, you'd be living with. With the other disabled people. And you'd see their. The regulars of their friends who would come by. Yeah, their best friend who would be there every week or, you know, my best friend flew in from Ontario, and there was this guy who was really good looking who was disabled and had had an accident a couple months before me. So he, you know, he. He felt a little senior to me on the. In the, you know, in the cafeteria.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

And. And my friend Caitlin had come over and they hit it off.

[Anna Martin]

Oh, your best friend hit us off.

[Kyla Harris]

My friend hit it off with him and his best friend who was visiting him. He and I hit it off. So our first double date was essentially on a hospital ward.

[Anna Martin]

Wow. Okay, so there was this. This guy's best friend you start hooking up with. Is that what it was? Okay.

[Kyla Harris]

But before that, I mean, I was also making out with other disabled people as well, obviously.

[Anna Martin]

Of course you were.

[Ad Council/Public Service Announcement Voice]

Yes.

[Kyla Harris]

Hello. I mean, there were loads of really hot people there. Like, we're like the outdoorsy risk takers. Right? Like, we're a type of. And they were all there, and it was 24 hours a day. I mean, we were all living together for months. How could you not make out with all of them?

[Anna Martin]

100%. But this friend you start hooking up with, what is that like for you? Because you'd had these sexual experiences as you mentioned, you know, how could we forget the ski trip? But now you're in this body that's changed, right?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. I think it felt like. A new life.

[Anna Martin]

Huh?

[Kyla Harris]

I think it felt like the life that I'd had had completely gone and would never be the same. Even though I was in denial, I still knew I would never be the same. Even if I started walking again, I would never be the same. And when I was with him and when we would be intimate in very kind of innocent ways, he gave me the hope that I would be loved again and that I could be sexy again and that maybe he wouldn't be the only one that would think that.

[Anna Martin]

Can I ask, like, is there a moment, a specific moment that sticks out when you think about him and your time together?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. So I, you know, I was a virgin up until this point. Although apparently virginity is a myth as well. It's just an expansion and contraction of the. Of the vaginal walls.

[Anna Martin]

Different episode, but. Hear that?

[Kyla Harris]

And. We'd been kind of seeing each other, he'd been coming around, we'd been making out. And I went back to my parents home and I was there for my birthday and it was the worst birthday I've ever had, my 16th birthday. But this guy came to visit me at my parents place and he. By that time I was kind of. I was less fragile, so I was able to be. He would just kind of lift me in like a wedding threshold style and throw me on the couch or I'd sit in the. Wherever.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

And I remember I was sitting beside him and he was wearing this white hoodie that I loved, obviously. The 90s, obviously. And I had my legs over him and I turned to him and I went, you, me, sex soon.

[Anna Martin]

That just came forth from where? I love that.

[Kyla Harris]

I don't know. I think it came forth from a sense of. From a sense of excitement, from desire and desire and joy. And to feel like I was safe with him and also safe in my body again.

[Anna Martin]

Again, only as much as you want to share. But did Yumi Saek soon happen?

[Kyla Harris]

Of course it did. I mean, who would refuse that?

[Anna Martin]

Oh my gosh. I mean, listen, again, as we've sort of referenced virginity kind of a construct, but how was it to have sex for the first time again, sort of as you're figuring out what your body can do?

[Kyla Harris]

I think at that point it felt like my virginity was just a bit of a tick box.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

You know, I. I don't really remember the sex that we had the first time I had sex or penetrative sex. But even though I was starting to feel like I had no control over my body and that it was, you know, I. I'd pee when I didn't want to pee, you know, shit, when I didn't want to shit. It gave me a sense of being back into my body.

[Anna Martin]

Huh. Because of the pleasure? Because of the. Because of how.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, yeah, the pleasure. And, you know, I think I realized just recently that I. To go to the bathroom, I need to catheterize. And that's just like plastic tube that you insert through the urethra. Pee comes out, you chuck it away. One use wonder. And to do that I need the assistance of personal assistants, which I know we'll get into. But I think that I disassociated from my genitalia in so many ways because it didn't feel like my vulva, didn't feel like it was my own. It felt like it was a medical transaction used for medical transactions. And I think feeling like I was desired, feeling desire, feeling pleasure was a way of reclaiming maybe part of me that I thought I'd lost.

[Anna Martin]

Before we sort of move on to the caregivers in that relationship in your life, I do want to know. I would say many of us, when we start having sexual intimate experiences are not perhaps the best at vocalizing what we want or what feels good for us. But it strikes me that you too would have to. Or you tell me. I would assume that there'd be a lot more communication necessary between you two in sort of intimate situations. And I. I guess, I wonder how. How were you learning to communicate in that way?

[Kyla Harris]

Well, I think as much as I felt I was sexually liberated at the age of 16, I also.

[Ad Council/Public Service Announcement Voice]

LOL.

[Kyla Harris]

I also very much wasn't. And I think I'd internalized a lot of. The man takes the lead and takes the initiative. I think that being disabled and being in my body and very much having to vocalize what I needed on a daily basis, whether it was like, oh, you've strapped my shoe on too tight, or this is pinching the back of my neck, or having to really attune to. To those moments and then vocalize them, I think helped me in the bedroom because I would then be like, I want to get on top of you right now. You know, pull me on top of you. Or like. I think the way that I then initiated sex was that I had to communicate what I wanted them to do.

[Anna Martin]

Okay, Kyla, we've been talking about how Your accident affected your relationships with your parents, with this guy. But there's this other kind of relationship that enters your life, that will be a part of your life. It's your relationship with your caregivers. These are people who you hire to come to your house to help you. Can you tell me, like, what kind of assistance did you need at this stage? Can you kind of paint a picture for me of the type of care required in a typical day?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, absolutely. So I needed 24 hour assistance. And I didn't know or have any sort of rule book or anything that could guide you on what that meant. But I essentially, I became an employer at 16 and had to interview, pick, train all of the PAs, which I call them personal assistants, to do my 24 hour care. And we often pick them. And I say we because my parents were also involved at times and because I was living with my parents, it became this kind of small community. And so they would also kind of work with my PAs too, to provide me with whatever I needed. Wow.

[Anna Martin]

And tell me what this meant, like the morning, the night routines, what was. Yeah, what did you need help with?

[Kyla Harris]

So, I mean, anything that you would need help with if you weren't able to use your hands or legs, that makes sense. Yeah, but that kind of breaks down into. I would have stretches every morning and evening. I needed help with catheterization, going, you know, going pee, also going poo. I needed help with that. Help getting dressed, undressed, preparing meals, driving me to appointments, places, school, whichever. So anything that you can think of, I would need someone there.

[Anna Martin]

I mean, you're talking about communicating with different PAs, and it strikes me that that is a ton of communication to handle. How did you, how was that for you, learning how to speak to all these different people and communicate with all these different people in this way?

[Kyla Harris]

I mean, it was a rocky road and still is to this day. I think that I never wanted to be an employer of PAs. And here I had kind of anywhere from six to nine people that I would employ that would be coming in and out of my house that I have to schedule and pay. And it felt, and still does feel like a lot of work. And that, you know, that I needed to be professional in the middle of the night at 3:18 when I needed to pee.

[Anna Martin]

You know, can you tell me, I mean, I'm just really curious what that means, like in action, because I like, how would you try to professionally communicate to a caregiver who's, you know, on the night shift or whatever. I need to Pee.

[Kyla Harris]

So I always use my phone and they'd have a cell phone and I'd call them or I'd have like a buzzer in the house and they would come and I'd say, I need to pee. And if I had someone sleeping beside me, they would try and do best to not disrupt them.

[Anna Martin]

Like the boyfriend, for example.

[Kyla Harris]

For example. They would. So then I'd, I'd have a catheter while they were, while whoever was sleeping beside me or not. And yeah, it just, it just became normal. And at the time I, I hired a lot of friends or friends of friends.

[Anna Martin]

When you were like a teenager at your parents house.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. I mean, even up until when I was about 25. Huh.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

Because I think that I felt like I would be less disabled if I had my friends doing my care.

[Anna Martin]

Explain that to me.

[Kyla Harris]

I mean, it doesn't make any sense really. Right. Like, it doesn't, it's not like my needs would change because there would be a different person doing my care. But I felt like it was a way that I could hang out with a friend, they could help me with everything I need and they'd get some money for it.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

So it seemed like a sweet deal.

[Anna Martin]

I feel like I, I, it actually does make sense at least like on an emotional level. To me I think it's like, you know, this is someone who would hang out with you, you know, without getting paid. And it just so happens that they're hanging out with you and they're helping you with some stuff. You know, we already have this intimacy. We're just sort of taking it to another level. As opposed to this person who you hire, who's a stranger you have to acclimate yourself to and them to you. You were mentioning using hiring friends as PAs, and there is, there comes a point where you ask one of your close friends to be one of your caregivers. Can you talk about that? How did that arrangement come about?

[Kyla Harris]

I went to film and TV school in Vancouver and I met a friend there called Lee Getty. And we just instantly clicked and hit it off. And I think even within like a month of meeting her, I'd already given her my house keys. I was like, just coming, whatever. When you know, you know, when you know Exactly. When you know, you know. And to be alone, to have fun, to do whatever we wanted to do, to go wild. She learned how to catheterize me in basically any situation you could imagine.

[Anna Martin]

You know, I ask about this too, as kind of a transition to a scene in your TV show which you made with Lee. This is a TV show called We Might Regret this. It is tragically not available in the US yet, but I've seen it. It's great. It's inspired by some of your experiences. The one I'm referencing is actually a catheterization that happens in an unlikely place. You need to explain what's happening in the scene. Can you do that for me?

[Kyla Harris]

Yes. So I play Freya, a character who has the same disability as me, and Elena Sorrel plays the character of Jo, who is my best friend and PA at the time. So you sure you remember how to do. Yeah, catheterization is my middle name. And we are in an alleyway and Jo is on her knees with my legs spread on either side of her body. Do you see the urethra? Yeah, of course I do. Oh, there it is. Sneaky little bugger. Slowly.

[Ad Council/Public Service Announcement Voice]

I know.

[Anna Martin]

And I would say there's a part of this in which your character's pee splashes into the best friend's eye.

[Kyla Harris]

Shit.

[Anna Martin]

What?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh, it really stings. Don't lick your lips. Oh, and it's salty. Yes, of course. Yeah. That's just so normal to me now that I just completely forgot to mention that.

[Anna Martin]

Is this. Is this clip. Is this scene in the TV show inspired by true events in your life?

[Kyla Harris]

So I would say that nothing in the TV series has actually happened. Like, none of the scenes have actually happened, however. Have I peed in an alleyway? Yes. Has Leigh had pee on her face? Yes. Was that pee mine? Yes.

[Anna Martin]

I mean, it's. You know, I'm watching this scene, to

[Sponsor/Announcer]

me,

[Anna Martin]

expands my idea of what a friendship can be like. You know, I love my friends. I feel like I'm really there for them, but I don't necessarily know what it feels like to have their pee in my eye. For example.

[Kyla Harris]

Like, for example, I don't know yet.

[Anna Martin]

Do these. I mean, in these moments where. Again, not exactly the scene, you know, you didn't live exactly the scene, but these moments of intense intimacy with Lee, did it feel like you were becoming closer as friends, or was it a different kind of closeness? I'm curious.

[Kyla Harris]

Absolutely. No. I think that whenever I have someone do my care, there's an inherent intimacy in that. But when you have someone that you know you're in a relationship with or you're in a friendship with, do feels like you're on. You're part of some unbeatable team, and you feel like that in the world when you know you're with your Best friend or your partner sometimes. But I think that there's this. Yeah. Just absolutely enhanced sense of intimacy that happens. And Leigh was like a bit of a PA ninja. I mean, she did kind of. She was fantastic at doing my care in so many ways. What she wasn't fantastic at was not being a friend and just being a pa. Wow.

[Anna Martin]

What do you mean by that? I'm curious about that.

[Kyla Harris]

So if I, for instance, had my day planned and I'd be like, okay, we're gonna go to this appointment and then we're gonna go. She'd be like, why are you doing that? Like, that doesn't make any sense.

[Anna Martin]

You mean like, logistically?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, yeah. Like any opinion that she could have about my life because, you know, your friends are there to give you their opinion. That's like the friendship job.

[Anna Martin]

So would it be like, you know, she's helping you get dressed and she's like this shirt for real? Like that kind of thing?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh, yeah. Like in all ways.

[Anna Martin]

What about dating?

[Kyla Harris]

Well, I didn't really date until like eight years ago or something. I'd always kind of like fallen into relationships with friends or friend of a friend. And so she was never there as someone who would come on a date, but she would be there if I was making out with someone on the dance floor. And we'd, you know, actually having her as a PA in those instances was great because we'd go to the bathroom and I'd need to pee and we'd just debrief about whoever I was making out with.

[Anna Martin]

You know, do you really, like, can

[Kyla Harris]

you see what they look like?

[Anna Martin]

And she's like, not really. The lights are too dark. What about, like sexual encounters? I mean, you mentioned a PA needing to come in at 3am you know, when a party continue that, like in the morning, you know, when you're having your kind of like maybe sexy coffee time or whatever with this person you've had sex with. Like, Lee's also there. What. What was. What was the morning after like?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh, my gosh. Well, I remember a lot of morning afters with PAs, when I would. When I would, you know, have one night stands here and there. I remember one night when I had a one night stand. I had unprotected sex. Obviously very hungover the day after. So hungover that I was like, I can't get out of bed to get the morning after pill. So I sent my paper to pretend that she had had unprotected sex to be able to get the morning pill after for me. And so they were asking her all about her unprotected sex.

[Anna Martin]

She's like texting you under the table. Like,

[Kyla Harris]

she did procure the morning after pill for me.

[Anna Martin]

This wasn't Lee. This was someone else.

[Kyla Harris]

No, this was someone else.

[Anna Martin]

This was because I feel like Lee would be pretty good at this, to be honest.

[Kyla Harris]

Lee would be great. Lee would have been great at that for sure.

[Anna Martin]

That's okay. So they're coming. PA is coming in handy. It is. So, I mean, we're talking about sort of Lee and this friendship. PA relationship. But I'm also curious if there was ever friction in this relationship between you and Leah. She's providing your care and also being your friend.

[Kyla Harris]

Oh, yeah, yeah. Loads of friction. Because if she was late for her shift, I would. It would be really frustrating, annoying. She would need to do my laundry and, you know, my washing, washing up and stuff like that. And she, you know, and sometimes she wouldn't because she'd be like, oh, it doesn't feel like doing that today.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah, well, that's weird because if it was like a. In a professional relationship, perhaps it might be easier to be like, listen, I really need you to come on time. Right. But with a friend, that feels different. Right?

[Kyla Harris]

Absolutely.

[Anna Martin]

Huh.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. And that's what complicated things. And, you know, we decided that it was best to not be in that kind of professional relationship, but it also. So we stopped it. But at the same time, every now and then, if I needed a PA over the years, I'd ask her to step in, to step in if she could. She was always kind of like my backup because I'd moved to the the uk, I didn't have anyone else really. And it kind of started feeling like sleeping with. With an ex that you shouldn't sleep with.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Huh.

[Anna Martin]

Did, did sort of the ending of that employer employee relationship, as it were, with Leigh, did that change how you thought about having a person who you love, a friend, otherwise be responsible for your care? Were you like, I'm not going to do this again from now on, you know, just pas I hire.

[Kyla Harris]

Absolutely. I think it made me realize in a sense how unboundaried I was and that in order to get the care and the autonomy that I needed, I needed to be more boundaried. And that meant not hiring friends any longer.

[Anna Martin]

Have you had romantic partners provide a significant amount of your care?

[Kyla Harris]

Yes. Yeah, I have. I do kind of negotiate with my partners about whether they want to learn or not. Romantic partners? Yes, romantic partners. Often it gets to a point where it's like we Want to be alone. We want to have time alone. And what does that mean if I want to spend the night, you know, the night with someone, with just the two of us, which is obviously what you want to do a lot of the time as romantic partners.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

It means that they would need to learn catheterization.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

And I remember one partner that I was with, they'd learned how to catheterize me, and we wanted to go away for a while, and they were like, let me help you take a shit.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

And I was like, absolutely not. Absolutely not. Like, that's my boundary, which is now being removed.

[Anna Martin]

Okay, noted.

[Kyla Harris]

But at the time, you know, you're

[Anna Martin]

like, that's a line. I'm not wanting that.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, I remember this time. My current partner. I've had a lot of problems with my bowels over the years and now have a colostomy bag, stoma bag, which is essentially where your waste or poo goes directly from your intestines into a bag, which actually makes it quite tidy and neat, to be fair. And I was alone with my partner, and I had diarrhea, and she needed to assist me with that. And as she was doing that, I felt. Because, you know, when you're feeling unwell, you also feel. You can feel not only really vulnerable, but pretty down on yourself. And I said to her, I don't know how you can still find me attractive. And she said, are you joking? I feel like this adds to our relationship because it is just another level of intimacy that you and I are experiencing together.

[Anna Martin]

She said that to you?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah.

[Anna Martin]

It's intensely romantic, and it spurs from diarrhea. I mean, what more could you ask for?

[Kyla Harris]

I swear I'm not just pissing and shitting all the time as well.

[Anna Martin]

I mean, we kind of all are as humans. We'll be right back.

[Ad Council/Public Service Announcement Voice]

Gun injuries are the leading cause of death for children and teens in the United States. Some people avoid talking about gun violence because they don't think they can make a difference. But every conversation matters when it comes to gun violence. We agree on more than we think. And having productive conversations about gun violence can help protect children and teens. Learn how to have the conversation@ agreetoagree.org, brought to you by the Ad Council. This podcast is supported by Ollie, your wellness partner for all things back to school. When the schedules get fuller and the alarm seems to go off sooner, Ollie. Sleep helps you fall asleep, stay asleep, and wake up feeling refreshed. Because kids aren't the only ones chasing big dreams. This year. Head back to class with the One Gummy supplement brand and stock up on olli.com today. That's O-L-L-Y.com these statements have now been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. This podcast is supported by BetterHelp. Have you ever had so many tabs open that your computer starts slowing down? Life can feel like that, too. BetterHelp's 2026 State of Stigma report found that 74% of Americans believe society still discourages asking for help. Therapy can help you sort through what's taking up space and quietly affecting you. With BetterHelp, connect with a licensed therapist online and switch anytime. Maybe it's time to close a few tabs. Visit betterhelp.com newyorktimes to get started.

[Anna Martin]

Tell me about your partner. How long have you been together?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh my gosh, we have been together for eight years. I, when I first met her, I felt this really gentle warmth. It felt like there was this innocence to it.

[Anna Martin]

Huh. Interesting. What do you mean by that?

[Kyla Harris]

I don't know. I suppose because I'd always known that I was queer from a very young age, from like 8 or 9.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

And I'd had, I'd never had a relationship with a woman, but I had a lot of experiences and so maybe it was just me being a baby gay that that was the innocence.

[Anna Martin]

Sure, sure.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. But there was there was this gentleness for sure to our, to us being together. Yeah.

[Anna Martin]

I'm curious to know, you know, eight years into this relationship, how involved is your partner in your care these days?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. So whenever my partner and I want time alone, she assists me with whatever I need. And I have always been guided by her. I'm never guided by, in a sense, what I think I need. And she was really uncomfortable to begin with, catheterizing when we were out because a lot of people thought that she was my PA or thought that she was a friend or a sibling, but, you know, which often happens in queer relationships. But that was very difficult to navigate to begin with because how do you reassure someone that it doesn't matter?

[Anna Martin]

Yeah. Yeah. What other people think. Yeah. So on a day to day she is not providing your care or because you have PAs or what's the sort of, how does it work, you know, on a day to day with her? Because you live together, right?

[Kyla Harris]

No.

[Anna Martin]

Oh, you don't live together?

[Kyla Harris]

No. Yeah. So I have 24 hour care from the nine PAs that I have Rotating in and out of my house when we want to time alone or to go away together alone. She does my care. But I would not be able to live with my partner or marry my partner without losing all of my government benefits.

[Anna Martin]

Okay, this is a really important point that I want to make sure we understand. If you marry. If you legally marry your partner.

[Kyla Harris]

If I just move in with my partner.

[Anna Martin]

Wow. Because why. Why would that then negate the benefits?

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah. It doesn't make any sense to me. Logically, financially, if they see my partner as being able to provide the care that I would need, they would then reduce the funding that I had for my own PAs. And of course, that's incredibly dangerous for a lot of people. A lot of disabled people are very much prone to abuse, specifically in relationships. And this law, unfortunately, I think encourages that.

[Anna Martin]

Wow. The system is built on this idea that if you have a romantic partner, you will rely on them for part or maybe even all of your care. But from everything we've been talking about in terms of relying on friends for care or romantic partners for care, that does not seem like the kind of life you want to live. Correct?

[Kyla Harris]

Absolutely. And I think that sometimes it does work for. For couples, sure, of course. And I think, again, like, disability and requiring care is not a monolith for me. I would never want that because I wouldn't feel like I had my full autonomy. Yeah.

[Anna Martin]

You know, we're at. Towards the end of our conversation, and we started our conversation talking about early sexual experiences, the boyfriend, the horny teen ward. And so it feels full circle to me to sort of end in a sexy zone as well. And this is a direct question, but it's modern love. So I am going to ask you, your partner of eight years, how is your sex life? What is your sex life like?

[Kyla Harris]

Our sex life is always evolving. And I think that's the same with any couple. I mean, yeah, we would, like, shag all day for hours, like, non stop at the beginning of our relationship, like every relationship.

[Anna Martin]

Did you really say shag?

[Kyla Harris]

That's not like, just in the movies. I did, yeah. It's. They say shag. They say snog as well.

[Anna Martin]

Okay, sorry. You were shagging all the time.

[Kyla Harris]

All the time. All the time. But now it feels like. You know what it feels? You know what it feels like?

[Anna Martin]

Huh?

[Kyla Harris]

Feels like fucking equality. That's what sex feels like with her.

[Anna Martin]

Tell me what you mean by that.

[Kyla Harris]

I think that maybe because I'd been with more men than women.

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

I hadn't realized that there's this performative aspect and this putting your sexual needs maybe not as front and center as your partners. And I think that that's unconsciously encouraged a lot. And when we have sex, it feels gentle and fun and hot as fuck, and it feels loving and communicative.

[Anna Martin]

Are there ways I don't. You've had to get creative to have the kind of sex you want. I mean, you've had these years to explore.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah.

[Anna Martin]

And I'm curious. Yeah. About getting creative.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, absolutely. I think that, like, I'm also. Because I'm not able to use my fingers and hands fully, I have come up with alternate ways of pleasuring her and different parts of my body and ways that I use different parts of my body to pleasure her. And she has said. And I don't think that this is. I don't think she'd make this up, but she. Or. Or do this for my ego, but she said it's the best sex she's ever had. So I think as a disabled person, the thing that I rely on most is creativity to exist in this world. Because, you know, if there's a barrier, it's like, how do we get around it? Do we put a ramp on it?

[Anna Martin]

Yeah.

[Kyla Harris]

And when I was younger, I was experimenting with bdsm, which I'm sure most of your listeners know is bondage, domination, sadomasochism.

[Anna Martin]

Thank you for defining Mel.

[Kyla Harris]

Anytime. And I was just like, okay, well, I want. I want to be able to dominate. I want to be able to, like, fog. And I'm not. I'm not a passive part in my sex life. And so I called up an occupational therapist, and I said, look, I. I was wondering if you could help me modify a sex toy. And she said, never had this request before, but come on in.

[Anna Martin]

You said, pleasure to be the first.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah, you're welcome. I went to the occupational therapist in her room, and I pulled out a flogger, and I said, how do.

[Anna Martin]

Wait, what? For those uninitiated, a flogger is like a.

[Kyla Harris]

Okay, so it's. I would say, like a gentle whip could be made of anything from rubber to leather that can increase that is usually used on the bottom of your partner or whoever you choose consensually or any other part of their body to kind of stimulate and arouse through the pleasure pain dichotomy.

[Anna Martin]

That's a beautiful freaking definition of a flogger.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Okay.

[Anna Martin]

You pull out a flogger, and I

[Kyla Harris]

say, how do I grip this? How do I. Yeah. Grip this tightly so that I'm not kind of like flogging and it flies out or that it's, you know, that I'm flogging.

[Anna Martin]

Well, how do I flog?

[Kyla Harris]

Well, with the flogging I want to flaw. Exactly. So she had a splint made for me so that I would be able to grip this flogger. And I was happy to report back to her that it worked.

[Anna Martin]

And now this occupational therapist, the next time someone calls with a flogger question, can say, you know what, we've already handled this, so I know exactly what to do.

[Kyla Harris]

She's prepared. She's prepared. She is now prepared.

[Anna Martin]

Oh, I mean, and I love that, that creativity is like a, I mean, superpower kind of a cheesy word. But I mean, it really does sound like that in a sexual sense, in a navigating the world sense. I mean, I guess I wonder in sort of a broader way, like, is there anything you've learned from having sex while disabled that you think you might not have learned otherwise?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh yeah. I mean so much. I mean, obviously I didn't experience sex before.

[Anna Martin]

That is true.

[Kyla Harris]

I was disabled. So this is all I have to go by. But I think it increases intimacy and communication and I think what is more sexy in a relationship or in a one night stand or whatever kind of partnership you want to have than intimacy and communication?

[Anna Martin]

I mean, it sounds, I'm just thinking about even at 16, you, me, sex soon. I mean, it's like the thing that people find difficult in sexual experiences, like is a necessity for you direct communication. And it does seem like that would increase. Yeah, I mean, I keep saying hot, but hotness. Do you think, okay, do you think in some ways your sex life with your disability is better than the sex you might have had as an able bodied person? That's kind of a difficult, you know.

[Kyla Harris]

Yeah.

[Anna Martin]

Question. But I'm curious.

[Kyla Harris]

I mean, I would use the term non disabled rather than able bodied because I think that refers usually just, you know, to the body, almost able bodied. And so I'd say non disabled is also involves like the body and mind and is more inclusive. And I would say that, yeah, being disabled has 100% made my sex hotter than it was or could have been

[Anna Martin]

because of the communication and the intimacy. Like what are the things you have to communicate about in sexual situations?

[Kyla Harris]

Well, it can often seems like it comes in the form of demands and commands. You know, turn over, get on your knees, spread your legs, you know, sit on my face.

[Anna Martin]

Yep.

[Kyla Harris]

I feel like you're blushing.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Anna.

[Anna Martin]

I'm getting a picture.

[Kyla Harris]

Thank you.

[Anna Martin]

And that's why you always ask a

[Kyla Harris]

follow up, isn't it?

[Anna Martin]

Yeah, uh huh. Uh huh. And that kind of like. Yeah, well, demands in like a sexy way. Yeah, totally, totally.

[Kyla Harris]

Exactly. And I think I am more embodied as a disabled person than most non disabled people I know.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

Huh.

[Kyla Harris]

I am so in tune with if something is a little bit awry or feels a bit off or, or I'm very, very aware of my sensations and my needs, my gut feeling, my intuition because I've had to be. And I think that makes better sex as well. It's like really being present and in your body in those moments.

[Anna Martin]

You know, Kyla, I'm thinking about younger you in the hospital getting to know this new reality and this changed body. And I'm wondering if looking back now from, from where you are, if you'd have advice for, for someone who might be younger, dating, falling in love, being intimate, having sex, someone who has a disability. Do you have any advice?

[Kyla Harris]

Oh my gosh, yes. So much that it's going to be hard to fit it into a soundbite. But I would say that no matter what the world tells you, what society tells you, that you are intrinsically valued and that you are so worthy of care for yourself, care for others, of loving yourself. And of feeling joy and pleasure and that it's there.

[Anna Martin]

Kyla Harris, thank you so much for talking to me today.

[Kyla Harris]

Anna Martin, it has been an absolute pleasure.

[Anna Martin]

The Modern Love team is Davis Land, Elisa Gutierrez, Lynn Levy, Reeva Goldberg and Sarah Curtis. This episode was produced by Reeva Goldberg. It was edited by Lynn Levy. Our mix engineer was Daniel Ramirez. Original music in this episode by Alicia Be Itup Marian Lozano and Dan Powell. Dan also composed our theme music. The Modern Love column is edited by Daniel Jones and Mia Lee is the editor of Modern Love Projects. If you'd like to submit an essay or a tiny love story to the New York Times, we've got the instructions in our show Notes. I'm Anna Martin. Thanks for listening.

[Ad Council/Public Service Announcement Voice]

Gun injuries are the leading cause of death for children and teens in the United States. Some people avoid talking about gun violence because they don't think they can make a difference. But every conversation matters when it comes to gun violence. We agree on more than we think. And having productive conversations about gun violence can help protect children and teens. Learn how to have the [e-mail] brought to you by the Ad Council.