Modern Wisdom #1030 – Brett Cooper – Inside the Conservative Civil war

Release Date: December 8, 2025
Host: Chris Williamson | Guest: Brett Cooper

Episode Overview

In this thought-provoking episode, Chris Williamson welcomes commentator Brett Cooper for a candid, incisive discussion on the ongoing “conservative civil war” within the American right. Together, they explore the roots and consequences of internal fracturing in the conservative movement, analyze the challenges faced by both young and established voters, discuss generational anxieties about affordability and opportunity, and reflect on broad cultural and political shifts—both in America and globally. Brett also shares frank insights on motherhood, balancing career with family, and the real-world impact of cultural messaging on men and women. Throughout, the conversation blends humor, vulnerability, and unflinching critique, offering listeners a nuanced view into U.S. political and cultural dynamics as 2025 draws to a close.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The “Conservative Civil War”: Roots and Realities

(00:00–04:34)

• Nuanced In-fighting: Brett frames the conservative split as complex, with good-faith actors on all sides, motivated by genuine visions for America, but prone to hypocrisy, especially regarding free speech.
• Cancel Culture Parallels: Brett points out the right is engaging in the same cancel tactics they railed against when executed by the left:

  “Like, we celebrate when somebody, you know, refuses to bend a knee to the mob... And then the same thing is happening on the right... They’re demanding that somebody be cancelled and deplatformed because that person platformed somebody you don’t like.” —Brett Cooper (01:08)

• Example: Recent demands for Tucker Carlson’s son to “disavow his father” are compared to progressive attempts to police family associations.
• The Streisand Effect: Suppressing dissenting voices leads to greater curiosity and wider audience reach—especially amongst Gen Z:

  “There’s a bit of a Streisand effect going on... The more we say ‘don’t listen to this,’ the more my generation wants to go see what's happening.” —Brett Cooper (03:00)

2. Power Dynamics & Factional Fracture

(03:29–08:14)

• Shifting Cohesion: Chris posits groups are unified by mutual opposition, but once in power, in-group differences come to the fore—mirroring previous Democratic infighting.
• Complacency & Critique:

  “I think people got a little bit complacent… we had so many independents come over. It really felt like there was this unity... Come January... Everything imploded.” —Brett Cooper (04:34)

• Brett sees scrutiny of those in power as healthy but warns that disunity risks ceding ground to the left (references to Mamdani’s NYC win as indicative of potential GOP troubles).

3. The MAGA Movement: Ideas Beyond Trump?

(06:12–07:39)

• MAGA’s core ideas may survive Trump’s personal presence, though how they manifest remains to be seen if/when he steps aside (or reduces his public profile).
• Discussion of possible party power vacuums and need for unity post-Trump.

4. Mapping Conservative Factions

(08:14–10:27)

• Brett’s breakdown:
  • Establishment Neocons: Long-standing politicians.
  • Younger Pro-Israel Right: E.g., Babylon Bee, Ben Shapiro.
  • Far-Right/Populists: e.g., Nick Fuentes, anti-Israel.
  • Middle Ground/Unifiers: Megan Kelly, Charlie Kirk, working for unity but catching criticism from both sides.
• Quote:

  “Often the people in the middle... get criticized by people further right ... and also aren’t pro-Israel enough for that faction. So she’s constantly ping-ponging back and forth.” —Brett Cooper (09:55)

5. Generation Z: Frustrated with the Status Quo

(11:29–17:55)

• Gen Z’s Disillusionment: Brett notes many feel let down, anxious about jobs, homeownership, and the economy despite doing “everything right.”
• Affordability Crisis:

  “I want to be able to buy a home. I am worried about student loan debt... The average age of first home purchase is now over 40.” —Brett Cooper (13:24)

• Chris observes that comparative hopelessness—both real and perceived—is corrosive:

  “It’s not just what is the reality of the economy... It’s what do people think the reality is.” —Chris Williamson (14:42)

• Personal Agency vs. Systemic Brackets: Even if individuals are constrained by broader conditions, effort and mindset matter inside those constraints—a ‘two-step flow’ of Destiny’s theory.

  “The bracket might be in different places, but your movement within it is all you.” —Brett Cooper (21:42)

6. Populism, Personality, and Authenticity in Politics

(22:38–31:40)

• Discussion of Mamdani’s NYC win, with Brett attributing his success not to socialism but to economic messaging and personality-based “pop culture politics.”
• Viral Politics:

  “Politics is personality... Mamdani loves doing the same thing [as Trump]... He is the entertainer. He’s connecting in the same way that Trump connects with voters.” —Brett Cooper (26:09)

• Critique of establishment candidates as “stiff” and unrelatable.

7. The Challenger’s Advantage & Economic Promises

(27:15–31:40)

• Challenger candidates can promise things incumbents failed to deliver.
• Mamdani’s rapid walk-back on free promises becomes a meme—“his victory party had a cash bar”—serving as an allegory for overpromising in politics.

8. The “Shiny Object” Culture War

(38:33–45:16)

• Chris outlines the “culture war shiny object cycle,” where outrage, counter-outrage, and meta-commentary distract from substantive issues:

  “All of our collective minds are held hostage by an endless cycle of shiny objects…” —Chris Williamson (41:44)

• Brett’s Approach: While she enjoys poking fun at cultural absurdities, Brett is moving toward focusing on what truly matters and using humor to defuse tension:

  “I found that humor was the best way to navigate that...” —Brett Cooper (44:15)

9. Economic Anxiety > Culture War Fatigue

(33:48–36:51)

• Brett argues young people “care more about owning a house than owning the libs.”

  “I don't think my generation cares as much about owning the libs. They care about owning a house.” —Brett Cooper (36:31)

• Culture war stories, while clicky, are losing primacy to bread-and-butter issues.

10. Familial Fracture, Loneliness, and Boundary-Setting

(50:53–55:23)

• Social trends advise more radical personal boundaries:

  “Telling people to walk away or cut contact with someone... is the most popular tip in the relationship advice subreddit.” —Chris Williamson (51:28)

• Brett links this to political/cultural rifts:

  “That's a complete parallel to what we're seeing in politics—just cut off your family, disavow your parents.” —Brett Cooper (51:37)

• She recounts the celebration of boundary-setting in media, but notes the backlash in audiences and the real dangers of extreme isolation.

11. The Paradox of Body Positivity & Ozempic Culture

(57:26–64:20)

• Chris and Brett dissect how Ozempic (weight-loss drug) exposed the contradictions and fragility of the body positivity movement.
• Brett describes betrayals and schisms within influencer communities when someone loses weight:

  “It was like the quintessential like female hatred... Is anybody else feel so betrayed that she built this brand and... now she's skinny on our body positivity backs?” —Brett Cooper (62:03)

12. Changing Narratives: The Alex Cooper Transformation

(64:26–72:17)

• Brett and Chris discuss Alex Cooper’s pivot from the “sleep with him and don’t catch feels” Call Her Daddy persona toward marriage and more traditional aspirations—highlighting how internet certainty can be misleading, and how public figures can evolve and wrestle with their legacies of advice:

  “It must be very difficult to hold a position ardently... The ability to u-turn on that is really tough.” —Chris Williamson (66:01)

13. Regrets and Lessons from Chasing Independence

(74:01–84:10)

• The Kelsea Ballerini example: After prioritizing career and freedom over family, success brings a different kind of longing and potential regret—a story resonating widely with women online:

  “Now she's sitting here and going like, did I wait too long?” —Brett Cooper (77:19)

• Cultural influencers (Taylor Swift’s engagement, Millie Bobby Brown’s early motherhood) are shifting narratives against anti-family/anti-child messages.

14. Motherhood, Meaning, and Modern Life

(86:09–98:00)

• Brett describes how motherhood radically reprioritized her life, deepened her capacity for surrender and humility, and made her less anxious about external distractions:

  “I give less of a fuck about things now... because you have this incredible life that you’ve created. When you bring your baby home... it’s like, ‘this is the only thing that matters.’” —Brett Cooper (86:13)

• She pushes back on “have it all” feminism, asserting, “You can have a lot. You can have most things in life. You can't have them all at once. It's about priorities.”
• Chris and Brett stress the vital need for political and cultural support for mothers and families, not just exhortations to “fix the birth rate.”

15. The Value of Real Life: Tour, Community, and Tangible Feedback

(109:48–END)

• Both Chris and Brett reflect on the joy of meeting their online audiences in person, and how community-building, shared laughter, and authentic human connection bring their work to life.
• They discuss the future: Brett’s plans to keep building her independent show, do more live events, and enjoy balancing motherhood with meaningful work.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Conservative Hypocrisy

  “We’ve spent so many years railing against purity tests... And now the same thing is happening on the right.” —Brett Cooper (01:04)

• On Gen Z Frustration

  “I did all the right things... now they’re coming out, they can’t get jobs... And now I'm not even gonna be able to buy a home and, God forbid, be able to support a wife and children.” —Brett Cooper (14:12)

• On Culture War Fatigue

  “I get captured by it. I see a bank rewriting classic fairy tales into a boss bitch remake... It’s cathartic. Calling out insane ideas... It’s like being a cocaine addict with Pablo Escobar as a neighbor.” —Chris Williamson (41:44)

• On Young Women & Career Regret

  “She wrote an EP about her divorce... now she’s released a surprise single called ‘I Sit in Parks’... she says, ‘I wanna be a mother, and I wonder if it’s too late.’” —Brett Cooper (76:18)

• On the Birthrate & Cultural Influence

  “Taylor Swift will have a non-zero impact on the West's birthrate... I think you are going to see a tick up.” —Chris Williamson (83:45)

• On Modern Parenthood

  “I give less of a fuck about things now... It radicalizes you in a way, because so many other things in life seem less meaningful because you have this incredible life that you’ve created.” —Brett Cooper (86:13)

• On Cultural Shifts in Family Formation

  “That's something that actually, I think JD can do a great job at if he runs, is that he's a bit more populist in that regard, and he's very pro family.” —Brett Cooper (102:11)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:00–04:34 – Conservative civil war: causes and hypocrisy of both right and left
• 08:14–10:27 – Breakdown of new conservative factions by ideology and generation
• 13:24–16:16 – Gen Z disillusionment: affordability and agency in the US
• 22:38–26:09 – Personality-driven politics: Mamdani vs the GOP establishment
• 33:48–36:44 – What Gen Z wants: less culture war, more economic progress
• 50:53–55:23 – Advice culture: from Reddit to Teen Vogue—radical boundaries and isolation
• 57:26–64:20 – Body positivity’s collapse & Ozempic: community betrayal and signaling
• 64:26–72:17 – Alex Cooper, transformation, and internet certainty vs real change
• 74:01–84:10 – Kelsea Ballerini, career vs family, and the quest for fulfillment
• 86:13–98:00 – The realities and sacrifices of motherhood, postnatal vulnerability, and navigating ambition
• 109:48–END – The meaning of live shows, connecting with community, and the future

Overall Tone & Takeaways

The conversation is dynamic, at times humorous, and unsparingly honest. Brett’s voice is candid and warm, Chris’s is probing and philosophical. Both blend realism with optimism, aiming to extract practical lessons for both individuals and movements facing uncertainty. Deep cultural frustrations—be they economic, relational, or political—are explored, but both express hope for authenticity, community, and the emerging shifts among a new generation.

Whether you’re seeking insight into the inside-baseball of conservative politics, wrestling with generational anxieties, or just looking for some hard-won wisdom about modern adulthood, this episode is a rich and wide-ranging listen.