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- [00:00]
A
Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to do@mintmobile.com.
- [00:18]
B
Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month Required intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full terms@mintmobile.com this episode is brought to you by Lifelock. It's tax season and we're all a bit tired of numbers, but here's one you need to $16.5 billion. That's how much the IRS flagged for possible identity fraud last year. Now here's a good number. 100 million. That's how many data points LifeLock monitors every second. If your identity is stolen, they'll fix it. Guaranteed. Save up to 40% your first year@lifelock.com podcast terms apply. How to buy and own your time.
- [01:07]
A
Brian I am so excited about this because this is one of those concepts that I feel like if you really understand it and you dive into it, it can reframe the way that you think about the decisions you make on a day to day basis. And you know, one of the very best things that you can do with your time. Make sure you subscribe right now to the channel to keep up with all the content that we put out there every single week.
- [01:30]
B
I've often daydreamed that we would show our content meetings to the public because this one was dynamo. I mean it was all the different angles we talked about. If we just wish people understood how valuable their time was. How valuable the concept of money intersecting with time that we went in so many different ways, we realized, oh my gosh, we gotta wrangle this thing back. So we have tried to distill this down to some of the most key concepts so that you know when you should buy your time and when you should actually work on maximizing the time you have on this planet as well. There's a lot to cover today.
- [02:12]
A
Well, a lot of us understand that time is actually one of our most valuable, yet also most finite resources. You often hear people say this all the time. You can't buy extra time or you can't buy more time, or you can't add your time. And while that's true, you are actually able to own the time that you do have. So we want to walk you through how can you do that? How can you actually own your time? And how can you own your time today and how can you own your time tomorrow?
- [02:42]
B
So we brought this and I like how we flipped it on its head a little bit. We're going to talk about the most common way that everybody thinks about time value of money. But what is the time value of money?
- [02:53]
A
Yeah, time value of money is simply this idea that money today is more desirable than money money tomorrow. We can buy more things with our dollars today than we'll be able to buy with them tomorrow. We wanted to do a very simple example of this. We know that back in 2004, $1 would buy you three rolls. And I think we even did like Charmin Ultra Plush. We did the good stuff. $1 would buy you three rolls of toilet paper. But now you fast forward all the way to 20, 25. Three rolls of toilet paper now cost you triple that amount. It cost over $3 for that same 3 rolls. Our money is not nearly as powerful today in terms of consumption and purchasing power as it was 20 years ago.
- [03:40]
B
By the way, when I question why in the world are we talking about toilet paper on a personal finance show, you quickly to bring it down as everybody uses toilet papers. But isn't it interesting that you Fast forward this 20 plus years? What could buy you three doesn't even buy you one anymore. So there is something to be understanding of the time value of money. And we've also tried to show this in a different way that takes out.
- [04:06]
A
The consumption more about the growth of.
- [04:07]
B
It is the wealth multiplier. We like to show people that yes, when you're young, every dollar that comes into your possession has the opportunity to become $88 if you invest it. If you spend the money when it's a dollar, it never gets the opportunity to be maximized and turned into dol. And even those small decisions, if you think about, I think about my Morrow moment where he told me in high school, I had the teacher, Mr. Morrow, who said if you could just save $100 a month, you could be a millionaire. Life savings actually, 20 years old, $95 a month. 20 years old. $191 is $2 million by the time you retire. These are very valuable concepts when it comes to dime value of money.
- [04:50]
A
And if you've not played with this, you can go to moneyguy.com resources. You can actually play with this tool and see what your money multiplier is. And it's something we talk about all the time on this show. But remember, we said that we're going to break time down into two different components. The one that we are often most familiar with is the time value of money. But there's another concept that's worth exploring, and that's actually the money value of time. And stated simply, this just means that time has a real monetary value associated with it and also has a cost associated with it. And that value and that cost changes as your life progresses.
- [05:30]
B
Yeah, this is, this is one where I'm hoping I don't go too far into the weeds. But it really is so interesting. I think about my own journey in life. When you're young and you're broke, you have no money.
- [05:41]
A
That's right.
- [05:42]
B
But you are a billionaire of time. And you're like, how does, how does that get maximized? And that's kind of what we want to talk into is let people really have the field vision to understand not all time is created equal. The decisions you're making in your 20s, 30s, and 40s is going to be different than the entire decision matrix you'll have in your 50s and 60s, potentially. So you've got to retrain your brain to maximize this powerful concept.
- [06:09]
A
Okay, so let's think about this, right? We have time today and time tomorrow. We're going to do this in sort of reverse order. Let's talk about time tomorrow first. And even though this might seem backwards, this is a little more straightforward because this is mathematically easier to walk through time today. When we talk about that, that's about how we spend our time, and we're going to talk about that. But ultimately we can't tell you how to spend your time, but what we can tell you is how do you buy your time? How can you purchase time from tomorrow with the decisions that you're making today?
- [06:42]
B
Well, and it's pretty easy to convince somebody to buy time once you watch this type of content, because we're going to show you guys, literally, and this is why we've talked about the wealth multiplier and other things, is you can buy big chunks of your future time at a huge discount. I mean, this is something. When you see how valuable your purchasing power is, if you'll just make a little bit of today for that great big beautiful tomorrow, you're going to be in a great place.
- [07:08]
A
So let's walk through some assumptions we use to base this analysis on. Let's walk through a case study. Let's assume that you have a 25 year old and let's assume that 25 year old has a gross annual income of $55,000 with an annualized wage growth of about 3% per year. Let's also assume that this 25 year old is able to invest and they can earn a 9.5% annualized rate of return on their investments compounded monthly. Let's then assume that this 25 year old is going to have a normal working career and they're going to plan on retiring at age 65. So we know that if their goal Is to replace 80% of their pre retirement income, based on what their income has been inflated to, that their first year of retirement, they would need to replace about $143,500. Now you track they start their working career at 55, they work all the way from age 25 to age 65 and age 65, they want to replace 80% of their pre retirement income. And that 80% represents $143,000. Said a little bit differently, one year of retirement for this person costs $143,000 when they get there. So the question becomes, well, how can we buy this? How do those costs change over time? Well, you can see that if we begin backing into the amount of money required to get to that cost at age 60, if you have $89,000, it'll turn into that 143. At age 55, $21,000 will turn to that 143. And if you back it all the way back down to age 25, do you realize that to buy a single year in retirement, a year being defined as $143,000 of income for a 25 year old, it only costs 32.
- [09:06]
B
Yeah, but there's an easier way to think. He said, man, I hope we threw out a lot of math. There's a lot of assumptions, a lot of calculations. I think the easier way to think about is that if you went to the average 25 year old and said, hey, would you be willing to Give me invest $272 a month if it would allow you to have replacement? You'd be like, wow, I make 55,000. I only have to save $272 a month. I can do that. That is very close to what I call my morrow moment is when somebod that I thought was elusive and impossible and told me in this small incremental decision, a small amount of today I could have something that just seemed impossible. It becomes much more doable. It breaks through the barrier in your brain that Says I can do this. And it gets even better than this because we bowled it down. Because like I said, lots of math just went into that assumption and that payoff. But think about this. We went ahead and did the nerdy stuff for you. If you thought about buying your time at a discount, we really. This same concept allows you to buy future time for the 25 year old at a 98% discount.
- [10:16]
A
That's exactly right. You recognize that $3,200 today, buying you $143,000 in the future, that one year of retirement is basically on sale at a 98% sales price. And what's great though, you might say, okay, well that's great for the 25 year olds, that's great for the young people. Look at what happens. Even as you get to 40, every year of retirement is still being sold to you, you 40 year old at a 91% discount. So for a lot of people who say, man, I didn't get started in my 20s, I messed up my 30s, I got in the messy middle, I'm just now catching on, we want you to recognize that it is never too late to start building, it's never too late to start saving. And you still have, even if you're in your late 20s, 30s, even 40 years old, you still have a tremendous opportunity to build wealth for the future because your time is still being sold at drastic price reduction.
- [11:15]
B
Now I will say we're going to get into this, I won't go too far off course on it, but it is something worth notating is that I know like right after Easter when Cadbury eggs go on, like where there's 90% off, I run the tendency that's when.
- [11:30]
A
You buy your Cadbury, I want to.
- [11:31]
B
Go buy a bunch of Cadbury eggs. And I think that's why as financial mutants we realize, man, if I can go buy my time at 98% off, I need to get in there and get that. And by the way, for 40 year olds, you can still get in there and get a 90% discount because this should be infectious. It really should. Now fortunately, this is much healthier to over consume than Cadbury eggs. Sure, but it is, hopefully we're making the point to drive you to actually create action in your own financial life.
- [12:01]
A
And then again, even if you, as you begin to move through time, okay, for a 45 year old, one year of retirement, now they can get it at an 85% discount. For a 55 year old, it's a 61% discount. And then by the time that you get to 60, it's still on sale, but it's not the same opportunity that you had in your 20s, in your 30s, in your 40s. Now don't mishear us, we're not suggesting that you need to wait until later to save the earlier you do it. The earlier you figure it out, the more valuable it will be. But we also want to encourage you, if you're not where you want to be or you don't feel like you've done the things that you should have been doing, it's okay. You still have tons of opportunity. Time is still on sale for you right now, today.
- [12:46]
B
And look, as I said, I want this to be so powerful, it drives you to action. But a lot of yours, you get so overwhelmed, you can't eat the elephant all with one bite. And you go, well, how do I do it? What's my next step? How about just start with 1%, 1% more. What can it do for you? We've actually created a great resource. If you go to moneyguy.com resources, you can see that 1% decision, that 1 small incremental decision can create huge results for your future self.
- [13:12]
A
And you know that we talk all the time on this show that we want you saving 25%. We want you hitting that marker for your savings rate. And so the question becomes, okay, well what, what does 25% actually do for me? If I'm thinking about this concept of time, how valuable is that? 25%. Well, think about this. If you are a 30 year old and you can start saving 25% today, and again we're going to assume that you can earn nine and a half percent rate of return. Do you realize that a 25% savings rate just this year buys you over three years in retirement? The work that you do as a 30 year old right now is covering your 66, 67 and 68 year old self just one single year. For a 40 year old, saving 25%, one year buys you a year and a half, one and a half years in retirement. And for a 50 year old, it still buys you almost a full year in retirement. So the earlier you figure this out, the earlier you can wrap your head around this, the more time that you get to buy for your future.
- [14:18]
B
Well, I want to bring some, some things full in full, full circle is that we've already shown that even for people who start saving and investing at 40 years of age, they're still getting a 90% discount on that future time.
- [14:32]
A
That's right.
- [14:34]
B
It's not Necessarily that discount that's costing you, it's the actual missing the stacking of these years. Because if you're a 25 year old who starts saving and investing the 25%, you're getting over four years a year of retirement for, for that savings rate and you see 30 years, it drops down to 3, 40, close to 2.50.1. It's the stacking of all those good decisions and that's. It goes back when I, like I said to full circle, 1% more is going to make a big change for you because you will get addicted to seeing how this, all this positive behavior does positive things for your financial life. Don't sleep on this. Make something happen today. And that's why to motivate you, we've actually created a resource on how much should you save if you go to moneyguy.com resources because maybe you're somebody, like I said, you're 23 years old or 25 years old and you just got your first job that you feel like is a career, not just the job that you're paying hours, you know, getting paid by the hour on. And you say, brian, I can't do 25%. That's okay. If you do the cross intersection here of seeing what your age is with the different savings rates starting at 10% all the way up to beyond 25%, you'll see what that means for your future self and we want you to get motivated by it.
- [15:51]
A
All right, so we've talked about time tomorrow and the mathematical concept of how do I buy that? Well, now let's shift a little bit and let's talk about time today. Because one of the difficulties is assessing value of your time today is not straightforward. We don't know perfectly how to do that. But we do know again, based on the money value of time, that our time today, the moments that are passing right this moment have a real monetary value and they also have a real monetary cost. And that changes through time. So you have to begin to think through, okay, what is my time today actually worth?
- [16:35]
B
Yeah, this is one. I mean we spent a lot of time on this and I was thinking about how it's interesting, like in your 20s. Yeah. You don't have a lot of money. I was broke as a joke in my 20s. But also, but I did have a lot of time. It felt like I didn't have a lot of obligations, I didn't have kids, I didn't have a wife in the beginning. So it felt like I could trade my time, which I had A ton of opportunity. I had a lot of, you know, slack in the system. I could sell that time. And yes, it wasn't paid as much as it is now, but I was. But a little went a long way. Because Remember, we're getting 98% discounts on future time. So that's why you can make big decisions with just not a lot of effort when you're early. Now then I want to transition to the messy middle because there's a lot of you guys who are watching this. You have children, you have changes in your careers, you have a lot of things pulling at your back pocket or your purse, and you're like, I'll just put it off. Don't do. You can't. You don't get away with that either because there's a value to your time that you, you, you have to make something happen. And then I want to fast forward to people who are in their 50s and 60s because you get caught in a completely different way. This is, this is going. Showing you the full circle on how your time will change over your life is you will start making your peak earning years in your late 40s, maybe even early 50s. But now you're like, but I want to enjoy life more. I don't want to actually work even though my time is so valuable from a paid per hour. How do you offset all that? So that's why we've tried to break this down. I don't know if I did a good job of distilling down the conflicts that are within us all, bo, but I think that we ought to have a discussion on this so people can understand that money value of time. Time today is different than the future. And how you balance all that is exactly right.
- [18:20]
A
You said one of the things you recognized early on in your 20s was that you could trade your time for something. You could use your time to buy something. I think there are people on the other end who their 20s, they kind of squander it, they kind of waste it. They don't do the things that you said. And we recognize that the value of time today depends on how you spend it and what you spend it doing. I want to ask this question for all of my financial mutants out there, does this sound familiar? Have you ever found yourself working through this exercise where you say, you know what? I can't do this thing. I can't enjoy this purchase. I can't have this trip, I can't experience this event because I recognize that if I don't do this, that that thing could turn into $20,000 by the time I retire. If I don't stop at the local coffee shop today, that $5 coffee could compound over the next 40 years and it would turn into X. So because of that, I'm not going to do it. Does this sound like you Potentially, I think Brian, has that ever, have you ever subscribed to that methodology?
- [19:28]
B
This is why there's a difference between financial mutants and financial misers is because you can realize you get addicted to being good at saving and building wealth. But there's a balance. This is the analytical side of the exercise. You also, we are emotional, spiritual creatures that also need to, you need to make sure you're in the moment, that you're maximizing everything. So it's not just are the analytics here. We've got to make sure we understand and I love Beau, that when we kind of looked at this in the show meeting, we said let's throw a relationship question in here to kind of really give context to this, you know, counterbalance. And how do you figure out how to navigate this?
- [20:07]
A
Well, yeah, would you think about this? Would you make this trade if I told you right now for a 30 year old, the cost of one year of retirement? We already went through this earlier. One year of retirement for a 30 year old cost you about $5,200. And I say, okay, hey, I'm going to give you $5200 today and you're going to invest that and that is going to buy you one full year of retirement, that singular purchase. But here's the caveat. You can't go on a date with your spouse for a full full year. Like you have to avoid all of the dinners, all of the coffees, all of the lunches, all of the dates so that you could put that $5200 together so you can buy a future of time. Would you, financial mutant out there listening, take that trade, Would you? I hope the answer is no. The answer should be no. The answer should be no. No, no. Of course I would not avoid that. Because we all recognize that the time that we have today is precious and it is valuable and there are things that we don't want to sacrifice. While we talk all the time about deferred gratification and sacrificing and making the most and deferring into the future, we recognize there are moments that we cannot get back and there are some things that are not worth sacrificing.
- [21:21]
B
Well, that is what we've talked about, this difference between mutants versus misers. And I have you Guys, write me. And it's also why if you go to learn.moneyguy.com, we have the know your number course is because I have so many financial mutants that might be more into the financial miser category where they're in their 40s, they've built a large sum of investment assets, but now they're finding out that they can't get their kids to go on vacation with them because they don't like piling into the room or they don't like doing a 12 hour road trip. And you're like, well, are there solutions to this, maybe that you could buy so that the experience or the time is better spent. That's why I think it's a balancing act that we all, instead of losing the relationship side, this is why when I wrote Millionaire Mission, we focused on bedazzle. Your basic life, you still have to pay a lot of attention to building the relationship, not being a miserable person to be around and enjoying your 20s, your 30s, your 40s, and not having regrets just because you're trying to do everything. So your 60 year old version of yourself is the happiest they can be. But there ought to be some other ways that you can sacrifice. Once again, it's that back to that saying, bo, can you give a little bit of today? Maybe it doesn't have to be with your spouse because that should be at the top of the food chain of what's important to you, but maybe it comes in other things that you just don't value so much. But society's out there whispering your ear, you ought to spend more on this, spend more on that.
- [22:49]
A
That's exactly right. There are things you should cut out. Brian, in the show meeting we were talking about when I was younger, I have this affinity for coffee. I like going to coffee shops and one of my favorite things in the world is to get to drink a cup of coffee in a non to go cup. You know what I mean? Like, you go somewhere, you get your like central perk, your big mug, you get to drink out of that. It just makes me so happy. And I look back when my wife and I first got married, I didn't want to go spend five bucks on a cup of coffee. And now when I have the money to do it, I can, I have no time, I literally don't have time to go do it. And I recognize, man, there was some stuff I wish maybe I would have done. More coffee dates, I wish I would have spent more time doing that. But instead I think there are things I could have cut out. I think there were things and I think this is where you're going. There are sacrifices that we ought to make it. Maybe instead of sacrificing that time or those moments, those memories, maybe you don't need the nicer car. Maybe driving that luxury Automobile in your 20s is not quite as valuable as it should. Maybe it's cutting out something like doordash. Maybe it's going to be more valuable if you need to have as a 30 year old $5200 to buy a single year in retirement. Maybe you don't cut out on the trip, the memory, the experience, the relationship, the emotional thing. Maybe you cut out on the, hey, I'm just gonna have someone else bring me a burrito instead of me hopping in the car and going to get my burrito myself.
- [24:13]
B
Yeah, I mean this is the part, I mean these are, these are the easy ones for me is because I think so many Americans are faking it until they make it. Guys, we're telling you, it's so much better to be rich than to look rich.
- [24:25]
A
Yep.
- [24:26]
B
And that's why some of these little decisions, whether it's the don't fall into the trap that everybody else is doing it. And I think of that with lifestyle purchases we mentioned, with the car, it could be the apartment that you're living in. It could be even these convenience things that people are doing now with doordash.
- [24:43]
A
How about streaming services?
- [24:44]
B
I mean the streaming services out there, I mean it's one of those things where cutting the cord started off in a noble cause as a cost savings measure. Now it seems like somehow the market once again has gotten the best of us.
- [24:55]
A
How about retail therapy and impulse shopping? Because Amazon has made it so easy to buy anything in the world right at our fingertips. It takes like discipline and wherewithal to not do that. And those are the kinds of decisions you can cut out to actually begin building up the resources to buy your future time.
- [25:13]
B
So we kind of talked about it in the show meeting. Also the good news is you get to choose what you sacrifice. And that's a very valuable concept because like I'm not a big soda drinker. I mean sweet tea sodas. So at restaurants there is no value loss if I'm drinking water at a restaurant. So you have to ask yourself, and I know that sounds ridiculous, are you focusing on the miners to try to build it? No, this is how easy it is in the beginning is you can just choose little things that you don't even value and you get to make that choice, to maximize your future self as well.
- [25:51]
A
And as you're making that choice, what you recognize about time today is that it ends up losing value if you don't spend it wisely. Brian talked about how he bedazzled his basic Life in his 30s and he looks back and those moments that he spent bedazzling were amazing. Or he thinks about the sacrifices he made in his 20s so that he could prolong his career and move along in this financial trajectory. Those were valuable uses of his time and he spent it wisely. So his time is incredibly valuable. So our financial mutants ask us all the time, well, guys, I love this and this makes a ton of sense, but I don't know how to do it. I don't know how to, like, how do I know where the right threshold is? How do I know the right thing to do? That's one of the reasons why we come up with a 25% saving metric.
- [26:39]
B
We've done the math for you. We've made this as easy as possible. What I like about the saving and investing 25%. Now look, I get it. When you're in your 20s, even when you go look at how much you should save, if you go to our resource page, you'll see if you discover our show content. When you're in your mid-20s, maybe it doesn't have to be 25% for you. We've done the hard math for you. But for a lot of Americans, they don't discover investing and saving until their mid-30s. 25% is going to be that freeing number that if you can just make that decision, set it and forget it, you then don't have to put any more calories or mental horsepower into what should my savings rate be? What sacrifices? Because you get to spend everything above and beyond that savings rate. We, like I said, we've done the heavy lift for you. Now it's just put the money to work, put your army of dollar bills so you can live your best financial life.
- [27:34]
A
So, okay, how. How do I make my time as valuable as possible? How do I make my time today as valuable as possible? And how do I make my time tomorrow as valuable, as valuable as possible? Step one, Know your why. Understand the reason behind the things that you're doing. What's the thing you're saving money for? What's the reason you're spending your time today pursuing that activity? Is it learning a new skill that's going to turn into a hobby, that's going to turn into a pastime or Is it just doom scrolling and wasting time and not actually doing a valuable exercise? Know your why. The second thing you can do is be intentional with your time and your money. When you choose to spend a dollar or when you choose to invest a dollar, when you choose to spend a minute or use a minute, make sure that there is intentionality behind it. Because when you lose intention, Brian, that's when things get pretty costly.
- [28:29]
B
Well, I was. It's gonna sound weird to say fortunate because bad things happening don't look, they're horrible. Sometimes you. But you can get clarity from trauma sometimes. And I realize at a young age there's two things that happened in my life as my dad was laid off when I was in middle school. And what's interesting about that is that those are some of the happiest days of my life, which was the hardest times for my parents. Life financially was some of the happiest days for me, and it was because my dad was always around. So I quickly realized time with family was maybe even more important than the goods and stuff and the trips and things that my parents. I think that was a very valuable thing for me to discover at a young age. And then of course, when he passed away when I was in my mid-20s, it really brought everything full circle to where I realized how limited our time on this planet is. So you need to be very deliberate. You need to be very purposeful. You need to spend a lot of time figuring out what makes you tick, what makes you happy. It might not be money. It might not be the stuff that you buy. It might be just spending time with people you care about. Actually be intentional with every moment you have so that you can do more of it. And that's the big thing I think a lot of people focus on is that a lot of financial mutants who are really dabbling into the financial miser category will say, hey, I'm going to sacrifice all of today so that I can live my best life when I'm 55 years old. Don't have those regrets. I want you. I'm just telling you, take the thought exercise of figuring out what makes you happy, what gives you purpose. You know, if you need to go back and watch our episode on the five levels of wealth, because we really dive into knowing. You know, a lot of people think that financial independence, of doing what you want, when you want, how you want, is what you're looking for. I think if you really got into fulfillment, it's kind of knowing who you are, what you value, and where you want to spend your time and money. Those are the things that's going to make you the best version of yourself.
- [30:31]
A
Yeah. What wasting time for financial mutants and otherwise is actually can be a lot more expensive than wasting money. So as a financial mutant, if you're going to be a good steward and a good commander of your army of dollar bills, you should treat your army of minutes the exact same way. Make sure you understand what your time is worth and spend it wisely.
- [30:53]
B
Guys, I encourage you. We've done it all through this episode. Go to moneyguy.com resources. We're going to load you up with tons of calculators, downloads, tools, all kind of things that you can use to kind of make sure you're maximizing this moment and get you on the right track. If you go to learn.moneyguy.com we have a brand new financial order of operations updated course that we've even dropped the bottom out of the price because we're trying to. Our goal for success is to get as many people to discover how powerful your time is and to live your best life. Because remember, money is only a tool. It's not a goal. So I want you to maximize every moment and there is definitely a better way to do money. I'm your host, Brian Preston. Mr. Bo Hansen. Money got team out.