He Sold For $1.5B But Will Never Retire

Summary

Moneywise Podcast: "He Sold For $1.5B But Will Never Retire"

Host: Daniel Burke
Guest: Mike Wisetrack (Co-founder of Freshly)
Date: July 1, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Moneywise features Mike Wisetrack, the founder of the meal delivery company Freshly, who went from a million-dollar debt and $15 in the bank to selling his business for $1.5 billion to Nestlé. Despite extraordinary financial success, Mike hasn’t retired—instead, he reinvested his payout into new ventures, including a veterinary services company with his sister and a $75 million VC fund. The conversation explores themes of entrepreneurial resilience, the realities behind ultra-high net worth lifestyles, philosophies on wealth and spending, emotional fallout after an exit, and Mike’s enduring motivation to keep building.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. From Debt to Billion-Dollar Exit

• 2014: Mike had $15 left and a million-dollar personal judgment against him after his restaurant failed.
  • "[I had] a negative million dollar balance sheet. That was 2014." (00:10)
• Freshly’s Genesis: The idea came from solving personal health issues while running his failing restaurant. A doctor's advice led him to develop ready-made healthy meals, which sparked consumer interest.
• Growth: Freshly grew rapidly, reaching half a billion in revenue by 2020.
• Acquisition: Sold Freshly to Nestlé for $1.5B in 2020—with significant up-front and earn-out components.
  • "Fast forward 2020, we're doing half billion of revenue and we sold that business to Nestlé for one and a half billion." (04:15)

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2. Wealth: Impact, Philosophy, and Emotional Reality

• Liquidity Moments Matter Most at Lower Levels:
  • "Wealth is different in different levels… It's not the most impactful at the highest numbers… the most important million was the million that cleared me back to zero." (04:42-05:20)
• Secondary Liquidity Before Exit:
  • Mike’s early liquidity during fundraising rounds lifted financial pressure and set a strong foundation before the larger exit.
  • "First time I wasn't living paycheck to paycheck… that was the most impactful." (07:37)
• Lifestyle After Exit:
  • No ostentatious purchases: "I drive a GMC Yukon… I'm not a car person, I'm not a watch person. Just doesn't excite me." (08:49)
  • Some splurges: Private jet to Aspen, trips with team and family, house in the Hamptons. (08:14, 09:42)

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3. Debt, Negotiation, and Lessons Learned

• Paying Off Burdens:
  • Mike negotiated his million-dollar judgment down to $700k with help from his dad and paid it off early.
  • "He was like, sure, bird in the hand versus two in the bush… I just wanted that done. I needed to get it done for my dad." (11:10-11:22)

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4. Acquisition Structure & Reflections

• Upfront vs. Earnout:
  • The sale structure included $950M upfront and up to $550M in earnouts.
  • "Would I do it that way again? Probably not… Earnouts are hard, they have a lot of complexity." (11:44-12:18)
• Emotional Impact of Exit and Company Being Shut Down:
  • "If it's your baby, you don't… sell your kids… if you really are that passionate… But when you sell something, you are handing it over." (13:10)
  • Mike accepted the closure of Freshly without personal animosity. "I didn't leave that, like, upset… I was upset for the team that was still there. That was, like, the thing." (14:16-14:37)

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5. How Wealth Is Managed Today

• Post-Tax Payout & Portfolio:
  • After taxes and payouts, his personal net worth from the Freshly sale was ~$50–$60M. (16:33)
  • Portfolio includes:
    • Significant investments in new ventures (Petfolk, a vet clinic platform)
    • Real estate (primary home bought for $2.4M, Hamptons vacation home, parents' ranch; aims for 20–30% of assets in real estate)
    • A $75 million venture fund (Cutting Horse) for operator-led investments. (17:00–18:12)
• Spending & Lifestyle Choices:
  • Lives well below his means, estimates annual living costs under $500k. (20:10–20:19)
  • Focused on asset appreciation and utility value; prefers illiquid assets like real estate.
  • "Your freedom is set by your living costs." (19:32)
  • “I like illiquid [assets] for many reasons.” (21:37)

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6. Never Retire – The Drive to Build

• Why Keep Going?
  • Mike finds fulfillment in building, not spending.
  • “If the only goal is the outcome, the money, you’re going to wake up and feel like this wasn’t worth it. You’ve got to really enjoy the journey.” (24:07)
• New Ventures:
  • Petfolk: Vet clinics with his sister, focusing on transforming veterinary medicine for providers and customers.
  • Cutting Horse: An operator-led VC firm making concentrated, high-touch investments.
• Philosophy on Evergreen Businesses:
  • “Next business, I want an evergreen business… really be in and see the compounded wins of that.” (15:10, 24:57)
  • "...If you don't sell, you don't pay taxes, you don't redeploy that capital. So how do you keep a steady stream growing for a long time? That ultimately allows you to really get outsized returns." (30:04–30:13)

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7. Advice to Founders & Wealth Creators

• Liquidity Strategy:
  • “A lot of the time, selling the whole thing is the worst thing… Sell 10%... get a ton of capital—go grow that business for another 10, 15, 20 years.” (36:57–37:25)
• Compounding and Operating:
  • “If I averaged a 45% return on capital… compounding that over time, without selling… that allows you really outsized returns.” (29:29–30:13)
• Identity and Fulfillment:
  • "If all you're doing hiking is to get to the peak, you're going to quit hiking. You got to really enjoy the journey.” (34:22)
  • “I always try to continue to grow… then I take on new challenges where I have to learn.” (35:25–35:31)
• Work Ethic:
  • “No substitute for hours in the gym… Just reps. If you're worried about work-life balance, do not be a founder.” (41:33–41:47)
• Parenting and Money:
  • Strives to instill work ethic in his children, balancing privilege with responsibility.
  • “The secret power you can give kids is work ethic… There’s no better way to learn.” (41:33–41:39)

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8. Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Earnouts: "The challenge always with an earn out is… it creates a lot of complexities." (12:04)
• On Selling Your 'Baby': "If it’s your baby, you don’t… sell your kids… you have to be mature on that." (13:10–13:29)
• On Post-Exit Spending: "People always anchor: ‘Oh my God, what did it feel like when you had the money?’…I just spent so much more time thinking about the bonds, the people we created." (00:23, 46:50)
• On Work Ethic: “If I'm going to put in 12 hour days and you're going to put in 10, at the end of the week I have an extra day of work…” (41:51)
• Philosophy on Retirement: “I'm never retiring. I'm going into the grave, like, on fire.” (36:22)
• On Wealth Levels: "10 million is a life changer number. It's not a retire-forever, but it will fundamentally change your life." (28:33)
• On Legacy: "The people who I only care remember me is that I'm a great husband and a great dad." (50:45)

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Important Timestamps

• [00:00] – Mike’s lowest financial point & Freshly’s origin
• [04:15] – Selling to Nestlé, details of acquisition
• [05:06] – Paying off life-changing debt
• [07:32] – Early liquidity, shifting lifestyle, first impactful $2M–$5M
• [08:49] – Philosophy on spending, personal values
• [11:00] – Debt negotiation strategy
• [11:44] – Opinions on earnouts and learning from mistakes
• [13:09] – Emotional impact of selling Freshly & the loss of one’s “baby”
• [16:43] – Net worth after sale, spending/investment philosophy
• [19:32] – Expense control and financial freedom
• [24:07] – Why Mike doesn’t retire; the importance of loving the journey
• [28:33] – $10M as the "life-changing" number
• [29:29] – 45% return on capital average
• [35:13] – Pursuing continuous growth, new ventures, and personal development
• [36:22] – “I'm never retiring. I'm going into the grave, like, on fire.”
• [41:33] – The value of work ethic, teaching it to the next generation
• [50:45] – What Mike wants to be remembered for

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Takeaways for Listeners

• Reframe Your Relationship with Wealth:
  Early financial wins often provide the greatest sense of freedom. Beyond comfort, fulfillment often comes from the work rather than the payday.
• Invest in What You Know:
  Continuous reinvestment in operating businesses and domains of expertise provides higher long-term returns (and more meaning) than passive investing or consumption.
• Choose the Right Exit Structure:
  Founders should be wary of complex earnout agreements and understand that selling your company is also an emotional handover—not just a financial one.
• Keep Building:
  Purpose and identity are forged in the work itself, not in the zeroes in your bank account. If you love what you do, retirement is moot; you’ll keep going not for the money, but for the craft—and the people it brings.

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Notable Quotes (with Timestamps & Attribution)

• “Negative million dollar balance sheet. That was 2014. Fast forward 2020, we're doing half billion of revenue and we sold that business to Nestlé for one and a half billion.”
  —Mike Wisetrack (00:10, 04:15)

• "Debt is just like a thing that just hangs on you… the first million—most important million… that cleared me back to zero."
  —Mike Wisetrack (05:16–05:20)

• “First time I wasn't living paycheck to paycheck… that was the most impactful [moment].”
  —Mike Wisetrack (07:40)

• "If it's your baby, you don't… sell your kids… if you really are that passionate… But when you sell something, you are handing it over."
  —Mike Wisetrack (13:10)

• “If the only goal is the outcome, the money, you're going to wake up and feel like this wasn't worth it, because like you got to really enjoy the journey.”
  —Mike Wisetrack (24:07)

• “I'm never retiring. I'm going into the grave, like, on fire.”
  —Mike Wisetrack (36:22)

• "There’s no substitute for hours in the gym… just reps. If you're worried about work–life balance, do not be a founder."
  —Mike Wisetrack (41:33–41:47)

• "The people who I only care remember me is that I'm a great husband and a great dad."
  —Mike Wisetrack (50:45)

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Final Thoughts

Mike Wisetrack’s story is about scrappiness, resilience, and an unwavering focus on the craft and the people alongside him. For founders and high-net-worth listeners, his experience offers lessons on debt, the reality of major wealth, why not to stop building, and how to keep both family and work ethic as centerpieces no matter the numbers on a spreadsheet. His philosophy: the journey—and what you build with others along the way—is far more valuable than the payout.

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For those who haven't listened, this episode delivers raw, transparent guidance on wealth, hard knocks, and how to keep your purpose alive long after financial success.

Transcript

[Mike Wisetrack]

Now the downside of that is I had about $15, my bank account and I had personally guaranteed a 20 year lease.

We get sued, we lose, I get

a judgment against me for a million dollars.

So I've got 15 bucks in the bank. Now I've got a negative million dollar balance sheet. That was 2014.

Fast forward 2020, we're doing half billion of revenue.

[Daniel Burke]

What did you do that day? You got a wire for $100 million.

[Mike Wisetrack]

You know, people always anchor were like,

oh my God, what did it feel like when you had the money?

I was like, man, like I just

spent so much more time thinking about like the bonds, the people we created.

[Narrator/Producer]

In 2012, Mike Wisetrack had $15 in the bank and a judge had just ruled he owed his former landlord a million dollars. He started the meal delivery company out of the wreckage of that restaurant and eight years later, Nestle bought it for $1.5 billion. But after Nestle bought Freshly, they shut it down. The thing that Mike had spent nearly a decade building was gone. And I wanted to know what that does to a person when they've already made life changing money from the exit. I also wanted to know where did all that money go and where does it still go? Because Mike did not retire. He didn't even take six months off. He started a veterinary company with his sister and put serious money into it. And then he raised the $75 million fund to back other founders. His entire payout went right back out the door into new bets. So the question I had going into this conversation was at what point do you actually stop and do you want to? Money Wise is a podcast where we talk with ultra high net worth individuals and many of them are part of Hampton, a private network for high growth founders doing 3 million or more in revenue or who have already had an

[Daniel Burke]

exit of 10 million or more.

[Narrator/Producer]

If that's you, go to joinhampton.com now. Here's our episode.

[Mike Wisetrack]

I'm Daniel Burke, your host.

[Narrator/Producer]

This is Mike Wisetrack.

[Daniel Burke]

Mike, thanks so much for joining us today on Money Wise.

[Narrator/Producer]

How you doing?

[Mike Wisetrack]

Thanks. I'm excited to be on. Thanks.

[Daniel Burke]

Me too. Me too. I would love to hear a little bit about the, the Freshly story. Tell me kind of what led to the start of that journey and then the acquisition and some of the payout. Tell me that, that journey of yours.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah. Give you a quick recap. So started that business.

I think fun part about Freshly is it's kind of like the, you know, the, the, you know, the ashes of the phoenix, like it Was started that business in 2012, I started a business, a restaurant. That business was failing.

I, it had had really like I

was working my, my ass off just like in, in the restaurant, non stop trying to save it. And so I wasn't as healthy as I wanted to be, wasn't working out. I'm generally like pretty fit, you know, gym rat.

And so I asked a good buddy

who's a family dog, family doctors, just Dr. Frank Comstock, genius in like on food and early writer in the Paleo diet.

So I was like, what should I be doing?

He's like, you got to eat better. And I was like, I don't even know what that means. Just draw me up like a list of things I can eat.

And, and I'm going to have my

chefs at the restaurant because I'm there nonstop, just cook a bunch of stuff and then make to go. So fast forward 60 days back saved my life. I feel great. My energy levels are high and I. People start asking, what are you doing? I'm like, oh, I've got like, I've got this, you know, this doctor who made all this, you know, made all the ingredients. My chefs just cook it, I just eat it. And they're like, you do for me.

So, so here I've got a feeling business.

And all of a sudden people are like, you do for me. And I was like, like, I wonder if this is like a business.

So I sent out an email to

Like 50 of my friends, this is in Tucson, Arizona. And I hacked together like a website. And next morning I wake up $2,000 in sales, which was like all I needed to be like, okay, we got something here.

So. So the restaurant continues to tank and this business continues to go up.

And I kind of had like a jumping like I had, I had to make a decision like, is this like,

hey, this is going to fail and

you just got to be okay with that and then put all your energy in there.

So I did that. So now the downside of that is

I had about $15 in my bank account and I had personally guaranteed a 20 year lease.

So we get sued, we lose.

[Daniel Burke]

Nice.

[Mike Wisetrack]

I get a judgment against me for a million dollars.

So I've got 15 bucks in the bank now I've got a negative million dollar balance sheet. Now the goods and bads of that is like now it was like, like

all the bridges were burned.

Like I was like, this is like this has to succeed. So that was 2014. Fast forward 2020.

We're doing half billion of revenue and we Sold that business to Nestle for one and a half billion. So it was an absolute phenomenal story.

And you know, it was super cool.

Now I know we're going to talk about a lot about finance.

One of the big questions I get

is like, you know, you know, how,

you know wealth is different in different levels. Yeah. And I always think people think like it's the most impactful at the highest

numbers and it's not, it's actually the most impactful, I think at least at lower numbers.

But so people said what's the most like impactful thing?

And so I said the most impactful or series B. We took a million dollars liquidity ourselves and then we made our early founders, which were my co founders, parents and

a few people, we made them take

all their money back.

We made them because we were like, no matter what happens, we want so, so they took their money. But that million dollars I paid off, I paid off all of the debt

that I had on that.

So that was like, so I was back to break even. So that was, which was kind of like, you know, for those of you in debt for, you know, it's like debt is just like a thing that

just hangs on you. Right.

So it's just like. So that was like people always say

is like that was the first million. That was the most important million. That was the million that, you know, cleared me back to zero.

[Daniel Burke]

So you went from 15 in your bank account and then how many years until the acquisition when you sold?

[Mike Wisetrack]

So we, you know, we kind of say there's different numbers we give. But that was like when we, when

we really went full steam, it was like 14 six years later we sold. So 2020, we sold October 31, 2020 was when the money hit the bank.

[Daniel Burke]

So how did that feel? The money hit the bank? I mean, you personally got a wire for how much money got a wire.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Well, so I did it in, we

did it a few tranches.

Net, net I plus minus my total

amount I made on fresh, it was just under 100 million. So Plus Minus got killed on taxes.

But that, that part pre tax or post tax. That was post tax, post tax. So we, we give, you know, and this is always like the, we raise

a lot of capital. We came out of Arizona, which at the time was so like the dilution fact for us was pretty big.

Would I do it the exact same

way all over again? Absolutely. Because it put me in a position that I was at, you know, what

if I did it today, I would

do it probably a little differently. But like hindsight's always 20 20.

But so on that I think when we, we sold, I'm.

I'm guessing plus minus. But like the actual wire for me was plus minus, probably half that.

[Daniel Burke]

What did you do that day you got a wire for $100 million in your bank account?

[Mike Wisetrack]

You know, I was, I was fortunate. Again, this kind of goes back to

like, different levels of like wealth. So I was fortunate. A year before that I had a secondary.

My advice, a good one of our

board members, a very close friend, a guy named Jason Finger, the founder of

Seamless, was with us and he sat

me and my co founder down and said, guys, every chance, at every round you get chance to do secondary, you need to take secondary.

And his whole point was like, look, if this business kills it, yes.

You're going to look back and you say, oh, if I didn't sell, I could have.

He's like, but the problem is, is

you don't know that.

Like you always think so. He was just really good. So I took secondary in the series

B and I later took secondary on like the series like C, like plushish.

But it was like about two years later and that was, that was 5 million. And the, the, well, I took actually on the million, I took 2 million.

So I took one that I paid off and then one that I had

in my bank account that was the most impactful because like now I wasn't

living paycheck to paycheck.

Sure. And so first time I wasn't living paycheck to paycheck.

People always say like the first level of wealth when you're not living pay is like you go out to eat and you're not worried about how much.

[Daniel Burke]

You don't look at the, the price.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah. You're not like, you don't have like

a panic attack when like the bill comes and it's like $500.

Oh, fudge. So that was that. And then the second one was when you could buy a house. And I think like to me, I was getting married, I had a kid,

got the 5 million, bought our house,

and that was, that was really cool. So by, so this is a long

story to answer your question was like

by the time we had the, like the, when that wire hit, I wasn't like that.

Like, oh, there's anything I want to buy.

I think I did a cool, a

few really cool trips that were really fun. We chartered jet to Aspen.

[Daniel Burke]

There you go.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And I brought my cto, my, my

executive assistant, who was, who, who started

as my executive Assistant, but then grew to be our VP of our, our

part of our ops team.

And then a few family and friends on that. And that was awesome.

That was really cool.

You know, you know that like a

few of those trips took the boys

down to Phoenix Open and then we did the master.

So, you know, those were like big things. But I wasn't like, you know, I wasn't.

I still am not. Like I drive a GMC Yukon. I've got like, you know, I'm very in that. Just like I'm not like a car person, I'm not a watch person. Just doesn't excite me.

So there weren't any like crazy asset purchases.

[Narrator/Producer]

The thing I've noticed doing this show is that the people who've actually made hundreds of millions of dollars talk about it quite differently than you'd expect. They don't always lead with the car or the watch. The type of wealth you see performed on Instagram is. And the version you see when someone actually has a ton of money, it's pretty different. These types of wealth conversations happen in Hampton constantly. It's a private network for high growth founders. I get to peek behind the closed doors where successful operators and wealthy founders talk about their real numbers. Much of money wise I attribute to the conversations founders are having in Hampton every day. If you're running a company doing at least $3 million in revenue, check out join Hampton.com.

[Mike Wisetrack]

we did. Ended up.

The wife did get a good purchase which is. We did get a house in the Hamptons which was a good one as well.

[Daniel Burke]

That's, that's a great.

[Mike Wisetrack]

But that came a little later.

That was.

Yeah.

[Daniel Burke]

And I'm interested in the million dollar debt payoff that was, that's interesting to, to, to pay off debts and to, you know, early on, obviously you should always pay off your debt. That's my opinion. But to do that as early as you did. Walk me through your thing.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Well, so when we did it, we got a million dollar judgment.

My dad is a phenomenal negotiator and my dad. So basically we didn't have. It wasn't like a loan that we had a judgment. So it was like the alternatives were like file bankruptcy or like. So my dad basically negotiated a timeframe with this and it was a three year clicking talk like clock.

So the challenge was my dad was like, can you do this?

Cause like.

And I was like I can do it. But like it was kind of like no.

Like I, you know, I didn't want to go through filing personal bankruptcy nor did Nor did he. Yeah, or my parents.

So I, so that I paid off a year and a half into that three years. So like I just wanted now with that I basically, I knew I had

the money to pay him, but I then was going to negotiate with him.

So I said, hey, here's the deal. I know I owe you this and it's million.

I can't pay a million.

But what I can do is I can borrow.

He didn't need to know all the

facts, but I could say I can borrow.

I have someone will give me and

I can, I can pay you today. But the only way I'm going to

do this and take on more risk is I can pay you 700 today.

I can write you, I can wire

you check within two weeks of this. I can wire your check 700.

And so he was like, sure, you

know, bird in the hand versus two in the bush.

I think he was, he was writing that like he knew that like if

I did like a BK, he was screwed.

So yeah, that saved me 300. So that was like, I just wanted that done.

I needed to get it done for my dad. So it was just, it was great to get that done.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah, yeah. And the freshly acquisition, you had some up front and then there was an earn out period, right. Of about 500. 550 million.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah. So we didn't the way and I

can only share what's public on this,

but we, it was 950 exit and

then there was an earn out of up to 550 on the earn out.

[Daniel Burke]

Would you do it that way again?

[Mike Wisetrack]

Probably not. Well, I don't know. I mean I look back hindsight and there's, there's learning lessons and everything.

I mean we sold at the perfect time. Yeah.

Would I like what if I change anything?

No, because we sold the perfect time.

Yeah. You know, the challenge always with an earn out is, is, you know, it

creates a lot of complexities. So I wouldn't say would I ever do it again. I would advise people that like, you know, but we had a lot of advice on it. Like earnouts are hard. So I just advise people like, hey, earnouts have a lot of complexity.

I think, you know, the challenge always

with founders and what makes me good is like I always think I'm going to be different.

That's the only reason founders do, you

know, do things is because they're like, no, no, no.

The odds are, yeah, not me. So, you know, and sometimes you got it, you know, sometimes you got to

get punched in the face to be

like, but so I think, you know, I'd say like, each situation is different

a lot of times, like I advise founders but like you can make a lot more in an earn out so

it and founders done well can.

Can make a lot, lot more in or now. So I'd say like, would I ever do it again? Probably. I don't always learn from all mistakes.

[Daniel Burke]

The acquisition led ultimately to freshly getting shut down. And um, I'd love to hear the. There's the story that you tell everyone on a podcast, but then there's the way you talk about how you feel when your pillow's on your head at night or your head's on your pillow at night and you're talking to your wife. I mean your baby is freshly.

[Mike Wisetrack]

I mean, look, I, I think this

is the big part about selling a business.

Like, if it's your baby, you don't. Like, you don't sell your kids. And if you do sell your kids, you're a bad. So like, if it really is your baby, then don't sell it. Like if you really are that passionate.

But like when you sell something, you are handing it over. It's a little bit like crying. When you sell your house and someone pays it a different color.

It's like if you didn't want to like, so I think you have, you

have to be mature on that.

You have to say like, look, I. I'm.

It's not my business.

The, the new, the new buyers, Nestle

paid a lot of money for it. They were going to run it the

way they thought was, was, was right. And I think the end of the day, I, I respected that.

I respected that.

I. I think, you know, for. For me, we had a different vision.

I ultimately felt like I have to be careful, careful.

And I can't talk too much about

it because there's now litigation going on.

But like, for me is like I,

I felt like I wasn't the right person to continue leading the business in that direction.

And, and like, I would generally say

with like Nestle is like, never for me was like a personal thing. And I don't, you know, I don't think it was for them. I think they were trying to make the right decisions. And, and I, I had to basically say, look, I'm. I'm either, you know, I didn't feel like I was the right person, but

I never, I didn't leave. I didn't leave that, like, upset.

I didn't leave it being like these guys are, you know, a holes or anything like that. I left it being like, look, it's, it's not now. At the time, you know, the business was going and still thriving and doing well. So I didn't see that turn and really, you know, I had no involvement after that.

So you know, I was, I was

upset for the team that was still there.

That was like the thing. And we worked, you know, and so did Tennessee's credit, like work to get

everyone re employed and see what we could do. And I helped out on that to where I could.

But you know, it's always a bummer when you see sign that like, you

know, doesn't continue because you put a lot of energy in that.

But you know, fortunate for me, I

was already onto the next thing and I like my energy was put somewhere

else and you know, you know the next one. But part of that was like, there's

lots of good things with selling and there's lots of negative things with selling. That is you hand over the reins.

And I think the, the one thing that I really.

And the next journey that I did was like, I want to own something for a really, really long time and I really want to be in and see the compounded like wins of that.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And that wasn't our goal with freshly. That wasn't like we really did want more kind of liquidity. It was my first win. So. But like again, goods and bads about it.

Yeah. And you know, I. Hindsight.

What have I done anything different? No, because I think we exited at the perfect time and we did great and I learned a lot and I

think on all these things, like you learn a lot. Like when I, when I shut down

a restaurant and it cost me a million dollars and not only the money

we lost in that, like would. Was I super stoked that. No. But I guess what I never did

from that point on, sign a personal guarantee.

I've never ever signed it. So like that 1 million probably saved me a ton of money. And so like, you know, I just think you got to sometimes take these

things and kind of say like, what did I learn here? And you know, hopefully move on.

[Daniel Burke]

It's all part of the journey. Yes, I think you're absolutely right.

[Mike Wisetrack]

100%.

[Daniel Burke]

So the sale was 100 million personally?

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah, yeah. Billion.

And then, you know, the 550 million earn out. Yeah, my portion was plus minus right around there.

[Daniel Burke]

So what does your personal finance situation look like now? Walk me through net worth. Your monthly spending. Let's call it, you know, your personal balance sheet.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah, I mean, I mean, so taxes

was probably plus or minus, because a lot was like in like ended up getting taxed in like income tax. So I have to say, like plus minus.

You know, when.

When all was said and done after like all the payouts, you know, don't have an exact number of plus minus like 50, maybe 50, 60. It's.

It's so. And then I went. So I kind of think about. So 1. I think there's kind of different ways

of thinking about like spending.

Right. So spending you, like for me is

like, is ultimately about cash flow. But I would say most of my negative cash flow is going into some degree of some investment.

So I don't.

I mean, outside of like, you know, like things like, you know, food, grocery services, vacation. But like, that's a relatively small portion. I'm not a big fan of like designer clothes design, like watches, things like that. I would rather spend things on assets. And so to me, like, as I think about assets. So immediately started another company, put a ton of money in that, started a venture firm, which is. I put a ton of money in that.

So those are, you know, I guess

cash flow require like cash is. When you're building those is going out. So that's kind of a cash drain. Now they're getting cash positive.

But to me, those are investments. And. And then property is the same thing.

So like, I like owning real estate. I like. Because like, you can, you know, for us that. My rationale when we bought the Hamptons

place is like, you know, one.

I'd love to own that house for a really long time.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

But ultimately you're paying for your vacations.

[Daniel Burke]

Sure.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So if you can cover it. Because when you sell that, you're gonna. You. You should. If you have, you know, appreciation on

that needs to be north of 4%.

And then I basically had a free

vacation home for like.

So I always like to try.

[Daniel Burke]

Still own that house.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Still in the house.

Yeah.

[Daniel Burke]

What did that one cost?

[Mike Wisetrack]

I'm not gonna give that one because I don't want to link on that. But, but, but yeah, I mean, it's,

you know, it's a nice.

It's not like an over the top.

[Daniel Burke]

Sure.

[Mike Wisetrack]

But for me it was like always

about managing cash flow and then managing that.

Just looking and saying like, what are. What are my.

Like what are my downsides?

So like, I just don't like for me personally is like, you know, you

go buy a fancy shirt.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

It's a massively depreciating asset.

There's very little utility value.

You buy a house, you're going to get a ton of utility value for.

[Daniel Burke]

You're going to get it and you

[Mike Wisetrack]

get to use it, but then you also get like the resale value. So like to me that's the same

thing as like a car is like I get the utility value car but

my gmc, like my whole thing with

the cars, I don't want it to break down.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And it's got to be functional.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

But like, like you're going to get

more utility value out of my GMC than I would if I had, you know, whatever. McLaren or whatever.

Now McLaren is just going to create

a bunch of headache and even if you can argue well it's going to save price. It's like now with taxes and your insurance cost and you're going to. It's a depreciating ass maintenance.

So you know, I just try to

invest in things that I'm doing and then, and you know, our living costs are relatively, you know, I would say like below our. Well below our means.

That's always like I would say to

anyone is like your freedom is set by your living costs.

[Daniel Burke]

Sure. Like what are your living costs roughly?

[Mike Wisetrack]

Oh, I mean I would say our living costs are probably. I mean I don't have an exact. Because I look more cash flow is.

[Daniel Burke]

Is the mortgage. Let's start with the primary house mortgage.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Oh, primary is pretty low.

I mean we are, our house is. You know, we bought that house for 2.4 million. Okay.

[Daniel Burke]

And that's one of the two houses. Or do you have more real estate?

[Mike Wisetrack]

I bought, I bought my parents ranch so I have that as well. So yeah, I love real estate. I think it's, you know, if you have. I'd like to keep, you know, 30% of assets in real estate. 23%.

But yeah, I mean, you know, I don't know.

Probably, I mean probably under living cost is probably under a half million. Like would be my guess. I'd have to factory or.

[Daniel Burke]

Annually.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Annually. Annually, yeah. So relatively low. I mean we don't like, I mean, you know, I think when you, when

you, you first get a transaction you

kind of think like okay, like, but then you start spending money and for

me, like we flew private. We flew private and that was really fun.

But then I was like, okay, that's

such a waste of money.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah, like every now and again. But not.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah. So like we really don't occasionally now

but like that you know that would

be like to me was like I

would rather just reinvest that money now.

Now if you get to A certain

point where you're at breakout wealth, which probably, you know, for most people is like, my guess is like for most people, like 3,400 million is.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah. Hundreds of millions.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Well, it's very hard like to outspend your.

Unless you're doing a lot of investing.

Like it's. Yeah, it's like, it's like Brewster's Million at that point. It's like difficult to spend so wastefully

that you're not making money because then your assets are making money.

Um, so yeah, for me is, is.

And then what do you get like a lot of value from?

[Daniel Burke]

So 500 a year. So 40, 42amonth, give or take. And you mentioned a lot of your

[Mike Wisetrack]

math is real time here.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah, well, you know, four to four, four times 12 is 480. So it's not that good. Don't, don't put me on the spot with any more math questions, but the, the real estate is interesting. A lot of people would look at 20 or 30% real estate as having a lot in illiquid asset.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So. So first of all, I like illiquid for many reasons.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah, I mean that's what I'm picking that up.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So I mean a lot of mine,

I kind of think about portfolios is, is high risk alpha and then liquid.

So like liquid almost always is going

to be better for taxes. Almost always. You have a lot of different tax structures in real estate. I also think like, you know, to

me is like, you know, real estate

has traditionally been very inflation proof. You can't make more real estate. You can make, you can print a lot more dollars as we've seen. So I think at the end of

the day, and then, you know, we were for.

I was fortunate on, you know, three of the properties to finance those at like rock bottom rates. So that was like, you know, 2.25 to 2% interest rates. So when you're able to borrow 2% interest rates on real estate, it's gonna have it. You're have a tough time not making money over long term.

[Daniel Burke]

Free money.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah. And I think that was like. So now at 7, 8%, the economics

get a lot harder to like back into what you need, but at 2%.

And that's why we, we loaded up

a lot more on real estate there because it was like a 2% that.

Now what you then need to make

sure is you don't get caught in a down cycle where you have to sell. You don't want to be a seller in the down cycle. But if you look at real Estate like you can ride out the bat. You have to. It may take a while to write it out. As long as you don't buy Peak Parabolic, you're generally going to do really well.

And then also like for me is like, you know, if you're like, if

you're going to vacation and that's a big thing you want like you're better off for multiple reasons like owning the asset. I mean just for like again multiple like reasons on that first like being like we, you know, you vacation all over the place. So that was kind of like the rationale with, for us with getting a place in the Hamptons is it's our vacation spot.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Well now I think that assets going to continue to appreciate.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Hopefully if New York Hampton.

[Daniel Burke]

Hampton seems like a safer place than the whole state of New York might be. But you know, I would, I would feel okay with that. Tell me more about what you're doing now. You, you are obviously no longer involved with freshly.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah.

[Daniel Burke]

And you mentioned you have a fund of your own. You started another.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah.

So I think again for me is like, like, you know, I really like and I think this is the key.

Like I love business, I love doing things. I'm an operator. I'm fascinated in all aspects of business.

So like I think and I just

say this so much to founders is

like if the only goal is that the like the outcome, the money like you're, you're going to wake up and

feel like this wasn't worth it because like you got to really enjoy the journey.

I think the money certainly it adds

a lot to the journey for, for sure.

But so for me it was like

the minute I left, which is about a year after we sold, I already had my next thing lined up and I was, I didn't take a day off. I was into pet folk, which is,

which is a veterinary platform.

We're building modern vet clinics primarily based out of the southeast and Southwest right now.

But the thesis there was. I was, when we sold, I was

like the next business, I want an evergreen business. I want a business that I can be in for a really long time.

And at that time we bought a

puppy and I was going to the vet clinics in New York and I was like, God, this is like so, so antiquated. Like even human healthcare at the time was one way better. And my sister is a 30 year practicing vet.

[Daniel Burke]

Okay.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And so she. So I was getting a lot of

help with, with her and she was, she was basically being my like remote vet. She was living in Texas at the time. And so she's going through some challenges with a partner she has in, in some vet clinics.

And so I get a lot smarter on vet clinics.

I was like, whoa, this is amazing business.

And so then she shares like, her vision.

And her whole vision was like the,

in her, her vision was like veterinary

medicine had declined from like a joy standpoint for vets for the last like 15 years.

And so I was like, she tells

me her vision and I was like, audrey, we should do, we should build this. Like, I just, I'd had some liquidity in that 5 million and so I was like, I'll be your first investor. Like, let's go, let's do this.

And so I've now deployed a lot

of capital in that and I'm.

[Daniel Burke]

What's your stake?

[Mike Wisetrack]

So I have a big stake.

I don't really, I don't tell exactly what that.

[Daniel Burke]

More than 50 and less than 50.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Less than 50.

But combined, I think we're, we're both north that.

But so we built that together. And to me, this is really a

platform that I would love and she would love to own for a really long time.

We love. So the whole, the whole idea is

like, how do we make veterinary medicine great for vets? Bring the joy back in vet med. It's built by vets for vets.

Now the great thing about, like, if you have happy, it's a service industry. So if you have happy vets, there's

no better service to walk in than if you're, if your service provider is happy. We built gorgeous clinics.

We would say that we have the

best clinics in, in the space. And that business has been phenomenal and it's growing as quickly, almost as quickly as freshly.

But that one, when we set out to do that was like always, like,

I want to own that business for a long time.

So we, we did that.

[Daniel Burke]

What, what is the thinking behind that? You've said that a few times and I'm curious. It sounds like you. Is that just. You just want to spend the next 10 years, 20 years.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Well, so if you can. So I, again, I think there's like always, like, like, what's the goal? And if you've, if you have no balance sheet or no, like, you've never

gotten liquidity, the first goal is to

get like I always tell people, the

first goal is the first 10 million.

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[Daniel Burke]

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[Mike Wisetrack]

Because 10 million is where like that to me is like that is a life changer number.

It's not a retire forever, but it will fundamentally change your life.

[Daniel Burke]

Was that your threshold number, the one that you hit and you're like, I don't need anymore.

[Mike Wisetrack]

The 10 to 10 million was ultimately like if I look at, we try

to live like within the bounds of

outside of things that we see investment.

It's just like in that bound level because now I'm heavily deployed back in. So we kind of look at like

generally like our life now. Then you go to like the next boundary is kind of to me is

like that 2 to 300 million where that's like then. Then you're now at the next level where it's like like.

And then from there it's like it really is just like to be candid,

just more headache like at like the

billion in these things is like you

[Daniel Burke]

can own more stuff with all that money.

[Mike Wisetrack]

But one of the things you do see and so this was so one of the things is you have to now deploy capital back.

So you sell your business. So first of all you get killed on taxes.

Then now you have to go deploy. So I've averaged over the last 20

years of, of building business, I've averaged a 45% return on capital.

[Daniel Burke]

Wow.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So, so when I look at like the alpha is like I want to

be investing in what I do, which

is, is build businesses.

And that, that ultimately has been very good for our investors and very good for me.

So now if you can do that,

compounding that over time, without selling and without.

So the problem is when you sell, you obviously have like, you pay the

taxes, so you restart.

But then also if you sell, you

have to go redeploy that capital, so you have to find it.

So I was like, look, if you don't sell, you don't, you don't pay

taxes, you don't redeploy that capital.

So how do you keep a steady

stream growing for a long time? And that ultimately allows you to really get outsized returns.

I mean, if you look at again,

I think like any law musk is

in selling, but like, I think people underestimate like the, like it goes like

this, this, this, and then all of a sudden searching.

So that was there. And then with. So then we also started cutting horse. And cutting horse was like one of

the things that I really wanted to do is I love startups, I love investing in startups. I like being part of the startup

neighborhood and really being part of the

whole, the whole network. And so I wanted to redeploy back into startups because I think again, when I was looking at like, what is my alpha is I'm an operator, so I can give a lot of advice and I get asked all the time to be on, you know, advisors and stuff. So I was like.

But like, what I don't like is

being a passive advisor. I like to be like, I've got

skin in the game. But when we, we said, okay, if we're going to do this, I want to do it right.

Which meant we have to have a team.

So what we then said is, okay,

well let's build a venture capital firm that is really focusing on doing this differently and really operator focus and how do we come in and really help founders?

Which I started seeing over the last,

like, I've raised over 300 million in

venture capital and I've seen this like

progression that there's less actual operators investing and it's more like professional investors.

[Daniel Burke]

You want to be the operator.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So we want it. So we want to be that. We want to be the person at

the table that is actually has real tactical advice.

It's not someone who's like, I read

a book on this and I think

we should do this. And what I found is like I had two very different types of board members.

I had an actual operator and then I had a investor who'd been an investor.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And both, all of you know all of them.

I've been fortunate to have great investors.

But what I found is that that operator sits you down and talks more

tactical and most of the time they're actually giving opposite advice. So the operator is telling you like,

hey, no, we need to not do another thing.

We need to get a little more focused on this.

You're not going to hire your way.

Like the non operator is always like, oh, we need to hire a big CMO and they're going to solve all of our marketing problems.

And the operator is like, look, could work. I've never had it work. There's no way, like you got to get, you got to get in the weeds.

You're going to have to get this. No one's going to come in and solve your problems.

In fact, the CMO is just going

to hire and they're going to make it a lot worse.

So a lot of that advice is that like I've just found that that

tactical advice, it's just so much, it's so much impactful and especially if you're a first time founder, you know, 90%, 80% of businesses is like, you don't need to be an innovator on.

So we really, yeah, we did that and that's been a ton of fun.

We have an awesome team doing. We invest in companies doing 1 to 10 million in revenue. We can, we flex up or down

a little bit, but then we make concentrated investments.

So we have a $75 million fund,

but we'll only make, you know, 10 investments out of that max. So two to three a year. And, and so are you looking at

[Daniel Burke]

each of these companies personally?

[Mike Wisetrack]

We have a team. Yes, we have a great team of

operators and analysts and, and yeah, so we're looking but we're also making sure

like we're, we're also like what I wish I saw from the VCs is

like, hey, here's who we are.

Yeah, this is how we show up. This is kind of our expectations. And if that's a good fit, then like let's, let's do this. And if it isn't, then let us

help you find someone else.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah, it's interesting. I, when I think of your story and the story of freshly and coming out of the restaurant business and now what you're Doing. I talk to founders every day, as it sounds like you do as well. A lot of them have had life changing exits and what I hear resonates with a lot of those founders is that some of their like personal identity was left with that acquisition. Like there I, you know, we called it a baby earlier. I don't really, I don't really get that from you. I get, I get like, I had the exit and like you weren't lost at all in the.

[Mike Wisetrack]

I mean I also get that a lot that I'm like my, it's also

a little, my, I'm like a little robotic on.

[Narrator/Producer]

Not robotic at all.

[Daniel Burke]

I just thought, oh, like you weren't, it doesn't feel like you're emotionally negatively impacted by the acquisition.

[Mike Wisetrack]

No, I feel like. So I think, first of all, I

think one of the challenges people have is that like, I think one of the things founders get in trouble with is like founders is a personality type

and successful founders is like they're grinders. They're in and they're in. And that does get exhausting. But the mistake they make is that,

that also the fulfillment is in the job.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So I think what people don't get is like the, like the reward is, is, is the money at the end. But it's a little bit like I always, my analogy is always like hiking. Like if all you're doing hiking is to get to the peak, you're going to quit hiking because you've got to really enjoy the journey of hiking because the peak's great. But it's never as great as you think and it's short. Right. And then guess what? Like, and so the problem founders have is like, it's like, be careful, you know, achieving your goals. So like one, you achieve your goals, what's next?

So I've always just been like a what's next? What's next? What's next? So I've already got my list and,

and for me I look at this as like, I want to get better

as a founder, as a CEO, as an entrepreneur.

And so I'm learning every day and like there's, I never get to the end of that. And like, I think the reward, you

know, it's like kind of like scoring points. It's like the reward, the chalkboard or the scoreboard on businesses, is money.

So at some stage you're measuring that, but at some point you're also like,

well, that's also just a little bit of a fake number to some degree.

But what is real is like am

I getting better at the craft? Am I getting better at managing people? Am I getting better at process? Am I getting better at this?

So I was just. I always try to continue to grow

and just say, like, am I?

And then I take on new challenges

where I have to learn.

Like, you know, I. I know being

a CEO of a startup pretty well at this point. Being a GP and a managing member of a. Of a venture firm is a.

Is a new skill. So, like, for me, it's like, we're. We're doing a lot, and then now

we're doing the advantage, which is really, like, building kind of more of a media presence.

And it's our newsletter and podcasts, and that's a whole new skill. And so, like, for me is like. But I think the mistake founders make is they think, like, okay, I'm just going to chill. Yeah, and then you're just left with yourself. And then it's like this void and this emptiness and, like. And, you know, I was like, I

grew up in a ranch, and, like, the ranch was pretty simple. Like, every day, sun came up, you got up.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And like, it was just like, repetitive

tasks, but you found value in the work. And I think that's what I would say is, like, for anyone doing anything, find value in the work and.

And then do the work.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And then, like, don't think, like, you

know, I've always told people, like, I'm never retiring. I'm going into the grave, like, on fire.

And so. But, like, because I find value in the work.

And I think where founders get in

trouble or, like, you know, they.

They sell their business, and then that's

like, that was it.

That was like, their thing. And then now they're trying to figure out the next thing.

And to me, it was always the craft. And then. So what I would say to people,

and this is where we always say to founders as well, it's like, look, you can get different levels of liquidity all over the place, and don't feel

that, like, like, a lot of the

time, selling the whole thing is the worst thing.

And so, like, sell 10% and then. And then keep going, sell to.

If you really do love your business and you want to be with it

for a long time, like, just sell a small piece because, like, at some

point you get a ton of capital.

Guess what?

You just got to go redeploy that.

So, like, just like, you know, again, like, you know, for most people, if you sell and get 10 million in the bank, like, you're going to get

Like, a lot of the benefits that

you would have if you sold the

whole company, your reinvestment's not as much.

But then go grow that business for

another, you know, 10, 15, 20 years. You're going to probably make a lot more doing that. But you also don't have that, that gap or that void. Like, remove money.

Like, and I got this, actually, this

is stealing directly from Tony Robbins.

But like, don't.

Let's not put, let's not start with money.

Like, what is the goal?

Okay. I want freedom. You can have freedom right now.

You can. Like, freedom is about controlling your expenses.

It's actually not about how much you make. It's just about controlling your expenses.

So what does that even mean to

you is like, wow.

Like, and so for me is like,

I, I love work.

I'm, I'm.

I get up at 4:15 every morning. I go to bed at 8.

8.

Like, I, I love being in the office.

I love that very close to bed. But like, that I love routine.

It's how my brain works.

So like, I know myself to know

that, like, I hate vacation on the second, third day of vacation.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Like, I need to do something. Yeah. And so, but like, how are you wired? And I think like, I have a twin brother.

We're exact opposite.

[Daniel Burke]

Really?

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah.

[Daniel Burke]

Identical twins, fraternal. Okay. So are you even Mike, maybe. This is.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So he's a. No, he's, he's. I mean, you have him sit in front of you. So he's, He's. He should. Now he. So his. He's a musician. His band's Midland. Very. You know, you're going to look. If you search Weisstrack, you're going to see him.

[Narrator/Producer]

I actually saw the brother I just

[Daniel Burke]

missed somehow that he was a twin.

[Mike Wisetrack]

But we're, we like our, the things that we like doing are very different.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

He is amazingly successful doing what he does.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Because he. But like, I would be very poor at that and he wouldn't do my job. So, like, what. So I just think like, you've got to know who you are. You got to try to find something that is going to scratch. Like that you're going to love to do every day. And then you should never want to retire. And like, I always think like, like if, and if you want to be a vacation and that's like, you want

to just go live in the beach, then go find a job that you can just go live in a beach

and that becomes your life. And then guess what?

You never have to retire.

[Daniel Burke]

You just Be a lifeguard.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah, exactly.

[Daniel Burke]

You know, pay your bills. That's so cool. What's the. So growing up on a farm is interesting. And. And. Or a ranch, rather. I don't know if they're the same thing.

[Mike Wisetrack]

They're different. But I was gonna. I was gonna correct it.

[Daniel Burke]

I was gonna say.

[Narrator/Producer]

I know I said the wrong word.

[Daniel Burke]

Let me.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Ranchers are snobby with farmers. The farmers are Saudi ranching.

[Daniel Burke]

All right, so ranch, not farm. For those listening, does your relationship with your family now look different than it did back then? Now that you've, you know, made substantial amounts of money and are.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Yeah, I mean, for sure.

I mean, me, my wife, both grew up in, like, fairly, you know, kind of humble backgrounds and, you know, so it's always that challenge of, like, how do we.

How do we, you know, make sure

that we're not spoiling them, but then also making sure that we're, you know, we're giving them the things that, you know, we think are going to enhance their life?

So I wouldn't.

My oldest is six, so I'd say, like, we're. We're early in that journey. It's one of those things you're kind of constantly balancing.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

You know, I do think one of

the things, you know, I hope to instill that I think my parents did an amazing job is work ethic.

So, like, you know, we're already talking

about potentially buying some small businesses, you

know, just so we can have the

kids in those and then the businesses

just in the business. Like, we. We grew up with a bunch of

small business in Iran. So we. My parents had a restaurant. My parents had a ranch.

And it was just like. It was never asked. It was just like, assumed like, you grew up just being like, you're gonna

work in the ranch.

That wasn't like. And then when you're old enough, you

go work in the restaurant.

And like, that was just like the family business. It was just like. It wasn't like, you know, we didn't

see that as, like, it was just normal.

And. And we learned.

And I learned everything I know about business from my being around my parents and being around them, talking and being around, like, you know, how you're doing these things and.

And then them letting me do things.

So, like, I was running payrolls when I was, you know, 16 to help

my parents, but then it was like, oh, cool. And they were like, great. You know how to do this. Now you're the pay. Like, so a little bit of that is, like, which is. Which is which is great for us is like, you know, you're, you're, when

you're running a small business like there's never enough hands.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And then the minute you can prove yourself is like able to do something like my like all of a sudden that's your job. Right. So it's like double edged sword.

But yeah, I mean I learned a ton of my parents were great on

like you know, letting us just like

punch way beyond our weight.

So I hope to do the same thing with my kids because I think

there's no better way to learn.

And then I do think that like the secret power you can give your

kids is worth it, I think.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

Like I just, I always tell people

there's no substitute like for, for hours in the gym.

Like just tell people like it look, it's really simple. And Elon says it's, everyone says this and I can't say it enough.

It's like if you are worried about work, life, balance, do not be a founder.

Like if it just reps, it's, it's just ultimately like if I'm going to

put in 12 hour days and you're

going to put in 10 at the end of the week, I'm going to have an extra day of work. And so if I'm going to work like so at the end of the day that compounding means like I don't actually have to be as good as you.

I, over time I will compound and get better and it's just more reps and I think that's, that's work ethic. And I, I really think my parents did a phenomenal job with all of us. I might like no matter what we, we all do very different things.

There's six of us, but I do

think we all have this kind of like work just work ethic that like we just have to stay busy. And I think that came from like just the way our parents Racist.

[Daniel Burke]

I do love the, the, the adage of, you know, teach a man to fish or give them a fish and the way you're thinking of your kids even and having them work and the way that you grew up and learned some of these really business, you know, skills, but also just how to be an entrepreneur, how to take ownership of what you're doing and make it valuable. How do you think of what you pass on to your kids when you think of the business? Obviously that's, that's one component. Is there a big endowment coming someday? Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So you think about, I mean try to balance that. I mean we definitely want our kids, I think, like, which is tough, which

is both the blessing and the curse. And I think this is what you, like, you realize in life is like,

the things that you maybe wouldn't do to your kids are the things that made you great. So like, I had dyslexia.

Would I want my kids to have like, dyslexia? Absolutely not.

But like, dyslexia made me hone all

these other skills, made me learn all these things.

So like, like, for me it's been

a superpower because it's really heightened my other skills. Would I, like. It was also like, extraordinarily painful when you're young and you can't read and all these things and, and at least

grew up in a bit of a

different time where it was, you know, standard that you get made fun of for that. But.

But like, so part of that is the challenge.

You know, I was, I was fortunate that my parents, you know, we were able. My parents paid all of our college, but my parents were not like, you know, they were.

We lived very like, we never wanted

for anything, but there wasn't like an abundance of like, oh, everyone's just like taken care of.

And so that meant you had to self serve.

Like, that will be the challenge with our kids is like, as we make more and do more is like, how do we get that balance?

But I do think, like, again, I

would say the one thing like my parents were so good with all of

us and I hope to do this

is like, my parents never had like, goals or expectations on like, hey, you need to be successful or what.

The whole thing was like, figure out

what you want to do and go do it.

And I was before, you know, I was before I made any money.

I was 40 before my brother started doing anything.

And my brother, I was, you know, 35. I'm like nearly bankrupt.

And my brother is. Is at that point, like bartending, right?

So fast forward five years, my brother

has the number one country single in the country. And I've just sold my business for amazing.

So. So. But my parents at. At that stage when we were 35,

you'd be like, were they str.

No, they were like, like, yeah, just like, you know, figure it like, there

was no pressure on that.

I think that's what I like, my

parents have been very like, they celebrate our wins, but I think they also are like, very fine with us figuring our own navigator. They're not like helicopter parents.

And I, I hope to have that as well, because I think that's A little like what I think allowed both

of us to find our past was like being able to explore without feeling like, oh, we gotta figure something out.

I do think that's like, again, I

always stress with everyone is like, I

think there's just, just too much focus

on like feeling like you have to figure out when you're like, like 30

and like it's a long journey, have

a lot of fun, life short.

Yeah, you're gonna realize like, you know,

the Instagram reels are all fake.

Like they're just. My point is, is like, it's like

all the, like, oh, the money is gonna make you happy. It doesn't like it just.

And so, but experiences do, learning, being

able to explore a lot of these things.

So I just, you know, I think it's, I love founding things.

If you want to build things, you should build, you should build early to

really enjoy that journey because I think you learn.

So it's like MBA on steroids. Yeah, I would, I mean if you're

thinking about an mba, I would strongly

advise just go start a company or work for a startup because you're going to learn more than you will. An mba.

Agreed strongly. You know, but it's, it's about like enjoy every day you wake up. Yeah, that's the whole key for me is like, you know, when we were grinding it and there was no money,

it was like, wasn't clear freshly was

going to even work. We had a ton of fun and

like we had great people around the table and we like, yeah, there were stressful days but like we had a ton of fun. So working, you know, 12, 14 hour days didn't feel like a grind. It felt like, man, this is what else is doing.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

So that's, that's the fun. And when you look at those great

startups, that's always the thing is, is

like, like we, we wanted to watch

football and we wanted to get.

And we couldn't like, so we got

NFL Sunday ticket for the office and

then everyone worked on Sunday and so we all had. So it was like, it was Great.

We'd worked 12 hours on Sunday watching football and getting work done and it

was like those were all the things

that I think like you'll build the world you want to, you want to

live in that you would like.

And then you're like, the whole journey's fun and then the payday is amazing.

But like when I look back, it's

all about the stories, it's about the people, it's about the things we did that's like the thing that I glow about.

It's like, you know, people always anchor like, oh my God, what did it

feel like when you had the money?

Is like, man, like, I just spent

so much more time thinking about, like, the bonds, the people we created.

So that's just kind of all the stress.

And now again, now I'm in business. So like the scorecard is this and I'm as you know, certainly venture capital. Like, our whole scorecard is like returns.

So, you know, it's. It is, it is the name of the game. Like, you know, don't be a basketball

player if you think it's stupid to

put a, you know, pigskin in the, in the hole like that. That is the game. Like, so if you don't, if you think it's stupid, don't play it.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love it. I think it resonates with me that you should just go make a bunch of mistakes instead of. NBA is a great example. I think MBAs have a time and place, but I think there's a difference in learning how people successfully or unsuccessfully build something and going and doing that thing successfully or unsuccessfully learning by trial and fire and is. Is just nothing replaces it.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And putting yourself.

And we were, we had a common.

I was with Josh from Street Talk Yesterday and yet 23, he's out there, but he's like, it's. It's not like he's putting himself out

there and he's just learning so much.

And you're like, that is like, what if you're going to be young and

you're going to do these things, like

put yourself in areas where you're just learning, you're absorbing, you're getting. Because like, that is just the opportunity.

So I would say like young founders, again, I'm a big fan.

Like, get. But like, really think about this is like an mba.

Think about it as like learning, absorbing.

And then thinking about it is like to me is like, you know, I always think about.

That's why I say compounding returns. But like, I'm going to be in this game for another. You know, I'm 46. I'm going to be in this game for at least another 40 years.

[Daniel Burke]

My two things that I think you just mentioned, founders surrounding themselves with people one step ahead of them, they can advise, be mentors, be peers, but also being willing to just be dumb, try a bunch of stupid stuff that you know is out there and wild and crazy. But the first thing that works is like, why didn't someone else think of this.

[Narrator/Producer]

Well, they didn't.

[Daniel Burke]

You did.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And you got.

[Daniel Burke]

That's why it's doing so well.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And what you realize is, like, in anything you start.

And we were just talking about this on, like, you know, Media Net, whatever

you start, it's like, you're gonna learn a lot and, like. But the whole point is, like, you got to get in. And then you'll realize you didn't know

what you didn't know. And, like, you'll laugh, looking backwards, being like, oh, my God, I was so stupid. I was so naive.

But, like, I think the greatest thing, like, we were just, like, me and

my co founder were just so bullish that, like, you know, we just had this vision of, like, we're gonna build a huge food company.

And to us, that really meant, like, a business.

Our dream was like, to get to 100 million revenue. That was kind of the threshold that we were like, if we can get 100 million revenue, like, that is it.

And so meanwhile, we blow through it. But, like, so. But when you're at zero in revenue and you're like, we're getting to a

hundred million, people just laugh and they're like, yes, there's.

But we were like, we. It wasn't even like a debate.

It was like, you're all idiots. We're 100% getting there.

And. And we, you know, we had no

idea how we're gonna get there, but we were like, we're just gonna grind our way through this.

[Daniel Burke]

Yeah.

[Mike Wisetrack]

And certainly there was days it was like, well, shit, maybe we were wrong.

But like, like, over, I think, overwhelmingly,

like, but then you learn around that way.

You have that belief that dead set, and you have a ton of fun doing it.

And I'd like, you know, that's. That's just, you know, if there's. Take away one thing from this podcast, the big thing here is like, you got to marry passion with what you're doing in some aspect. I'm a business guy, so I can find passion in pretty much any business. That's my love.

But, like, everyone's different. Like, find the thing you want to do. Do it really well.

Do it relentlessly. Do it for a long time. Give yourself a really long vision and horizon and.

And compounding wins will pay off. Stick with the thing you're doing.

Stick with it for a really long time.

Work harder than anyone else in the game. Just absolutely kill. I don't care. Again, like, my brother's in country music. Yeah, you got to work. You got to work harder than anyone

else and over time that'll pay off. But then you got to do it for a long time.

[Daniel Burke]

I love that. That's a great place to end. I think I have one final question. We can bring the plan in for landing here. We both get hit by a car and we die tomorrow. What do you, Mike, want to be remembered for?

[Mike Wisetrack]

Wow, that's a good one.

Well, I mean I hope most important

to me is that I'm, you know, the people who I only care remember me is that I'm a great husband and a great dad.

And I think you know, from there

is like everything else is kind of

a little doesn't matter.

Hopefully a good friend as well to the people. You know, I'm not a big person on like my legacy beyond that, you know, the reality is in, you know, one generation, very few people know you. In two generation, no one knows you.

So I hope my, you know, I

hope my wife and kids and, and my friends say, wow, he's a great guy. I still got some work to do there, but I'm, I'm working every day on it.

[Narrator/Producer]

Mike started this with $15 and a million dollar judgment against him and he's going to keep building until the day he dies. He already sold a company for $1.5 billion. And he has even greater ambitions moving forward. Hampton is where founders like Mike have conversations like the one we just had, except they never leave the the room. If you're a high growth founder doing 3 million or more or you've exited for 10 million or more, apply [e-mail] and please subscribe to Moneywise. Wherever you're listening, leave us a review and tell me DanielCburke on X. All your thoughts. The good, the bad, the ugly.

[Daniel Burke]

I want to hear them. I want to improve.

[Narrator/Producer]

This show is for you.

[Daniel Burke]

See you next time.