Other Victims, Other Places

Summary

Monster: Hunting the Long Island Serial Killer

Episode: "Other Victims, Other Places"

Release Date: June 15, 2026
Host: Josh Zieman
Featured Guests: Sarah Wyman (crime journalist/author), Joe Jackalone (retired NYPD, Bronx Cold Case Squad), Mary Murphy (veteran NY journalist)

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Episode Overview

This gripping episode explores the unresolved mysteries surrounding the Long Island Serial Killer case following the arrest and guilty plea of Rex Heuermann. While Heuermann admitted to eight murders, many believe the true number of victims—and possibly other killers—remains hidden. Josh Zieman, alongside journalists and law enforcement veterans, investigates cases that sit uncomfortably at the edges of the “official” story, including unidentified and often overlooked victims, and challenges long-held assumptions about the breadth and nature of the case.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Lingering Questions After Rex Heuermann's Confession

• Timestamps: 03:52 - 06:23
• Heuermann admitted to eight murders, but bodies found near those victims remain “omitted.”
• Quote: “Three bodies, all found on Ocean Parkway, all found in the shadow of victims Rex had claimed. Yet all three, absent from his confession, omitted from the story he wanted to tell.”
  — Josh Zieman (05:06)
• The episode begins by questioning whether Rex told the whole truth—or just enough to minimize his risk.

2. The Overlooked Victim: 'Asian Doe'

• Timestamps: 06:23 - 16:33
• “Asian Doe” is the only unidentified individual found among Gilgo Beach victims.
• Evidence is sparse: biologically male remains wearing women’s clothing, likely Han Chinese ancestry, and possibly a transgender or gender non-conforming individual.
• Sarah Wyman’s investigation:
  • Suggests that Asian Doe might have been overlooked due to prejudice within law enforcement at the time.
  • Connects Heuermann’s online searches for “Asian twink porn” and “TS escorts” to potential victimology, but warns against drawing firm conclusions.
  • Quote: “Before we figure out the perpetrator, we have to figure out who they were.”
    — Sarah Wyman (13:09)
  • Law enforcement remains cagey, providing noncommittal responses to direct questions about Rex’s involvement.

3. Shattering Old Assumptions: The Case of Peaches and Baby Doe

• Timestamps: 17:00 - 30:48
• Identification of “Peaches” as Tanya Denise Jackson and her daughter “Baby Doe” as Tatiana Marie Dykes changes the case’s trajectory.
• In 2025, not Heuermann but Andrew Dykes, a former Florida state trooper, was indicted for their murders.
• Suggests what for years was believed to be part of the Gilgo pattern might in fact be an “unbelievable coincidence.”
• Quotable Moment:
  • “If I was driving my car, I would have probably drove it off the road...it was one of those like, oh crap moments.”
    — Joe Jackalone, on hearing of the indictment (23:39)

Skepticism Remains

• Joe Jackalone expresses uncertainty regarding the strength of evidence against Dykes and whether the true killer is in custody.
• The discussion highlights the improbability of multiple killers using nearly identical disposal sites, yet evidence remains circumstantial.

4. Additional Unsolved Cases: Carmen Vargas and Others

• Timestamps: 33:55 - 44:53
• The case of Carmen Vargas—a sex worker murdered in 1989 and found near an apartment connected to Heuermann—raises questions over other potential victims.
• Mary Murphy notes a long-standing family suspicion that serial killer Joel Rifkin was responsible, but Rifkin denied involvement. Now, Vargas’ proximity to Heuermann's associates is under renewed scrutiny.
• Quote: “She [Carmen’s niece] saw her aunt get into a car, a dark colored car with a white man that had glasses. And of course, Carmen was never seen again.”
  — Mary Murphy (40:36–41:32)
• Discussion expands to other cold cases, many involving sex workers and dismemberment, that remain unresolved and potentially unconnected to Heuermann.

5. The Limits of the Legal System and Investigation Tactics

• Timestamps: 36:00 - 46:55
• Plea deals sometimes contain facts; the episode questions how much truth survives courtroom negotiation.
• Uncertainties over whether Heuermann’s DNA in CODIS (Combined DNA Index System) will “light up” other cases, especially given his known preference to operate close to home and in controlled environments.
• Other jurisdictions (Nevada, South Carolina) may receive attention, but local unsolved murders are more likely to yield connections—or not.
• Quote: “We want every victim identified, every murder solved, every family given justice. But serial murder doesn’t work that way. It’s messy. It’s chaotic. And it defines the very logic we use to understand it.”
  — Josh Zieman (47:00)

6. Trial Strategy and the Prosecution’s Reluctance to Broaden Charges

• Timestamps: 42:48 - 43:35
• DA Tierney limited charges to avoid endlessly expanding discovery obligations and trial delays.
• This narrow focus may have left other victims’ families in limbo, as without indictment or confession, many cases languish.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “For years, their identities remained a mystery, until April 23, 2025, when investigators revealed that Peaches was Tanya Denise Jackson, and that the toddler, her daughter, was Tatiana Marie Dykes.”
  — Josh Zieman (22:30)
• “Just because they did that and she was found dead, that does not mean that he’s the one that did it...try to get a confession out of him. That would have probably been the best thing you can get.”
  — Joe Jackalone, on the challenge of proving Andrew Dykes’s guilt (25:08)
• “How many killers dismember [their victims]? Maybe it’s more than we realize, but to me, there’s a lot of work involved in that.”
  — Mary Murphy (45:41)
• “Somewhere inside those unanswered questions, the truth is still waiting.”
  — Josh Zieman (47:55)

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Important Timestamps by Topic

• Rex Heuermann’s Omitted Victims: 03:52–06:23
• ‘Asian Doe’ Investigation: 06:23–16:33
• The Peaches & Baby Doe Twist: 21:10–30:48
• Questioning Andrew Dykes's Guilt: 24:04–28:37
• Carmen Vargas Case: 33:55–35:43, 40:29–41:32
• Trial Strategy & Unsolved Murders: 42:48–46:55
• Final Reflection: 47:00–48:40

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Conclusion & Final Reflections

Even after a confessed killer is behind bars, the Long Island Serial Killer case leaves behind more questions than answers. Some victims—like Asian Doe, Carmen Vargas, and others—may never be linked definitively to any killer, and even recent legal developments complicate, rather than clarify, the narrative.
Josh Zieman and his guests drive home the messiness of truth-seeking in serial murder cases: “Maybe when Rex’s DNA is entered into CODIS, we’ll finally get some clarity... Or maybe it won’t. And maybe that’s the hardest part of all of this. Knowing the answers may never come. That’s the risk. But it doesn’t mean we stop asking. It doesn’t mean we stop searching.” (47:55)

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Thematic Takeaway

This episode underscores the enduring complexities of high-profile serial murder investigations—the missed clues, shifting narratives, and the haunting possibility that some answers remain forever out of reach.

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Want More?

• Continue listening to binge the rest of the season with IHeart True Crime Plus.
• For deeper dives, find Josh Zieman on YouTube at Sinister with Josh Zieman.

Transcript

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[Interviewer/Host]

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[Sarah Wyman]

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Pie Strange Seasons 1 and 2 are available now. Listen for free on the IHEARTRADIO app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Season three of High Strange is coming June 26th. For ad free listening, subscribe to Tenderfoot [e-mail]

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New episodes are released weekly absolutely free, but you can binge the entire season now with iHeart True Crime plus, exclusively on Apple Podcasts. You'll also get ad free listening and exclusive bonus episodes, so head to Apple Podcasts, search iheartru Crime plus and subscribe Today. You're listening to Monster Hunting the Long Island Serial Killer. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely those of the individuals participating in the podcast and do not reflect those of Tenderfoot TV or iHeartMedia. This podcast contains subject matter which may not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised.

[Josh Zieman]

When the world first heard that Rex Heuermann had admitted to being the Long Island Serial Killer, many people believed the nightmare was finally over. But there were others, some sitting in that very same courtroom who believed differently. And I was one of them. Because Rex had only admitted to eight murders. Eight victims, a number that for some of us, simply didn't make sense. What about the others? The bodies found along Ocean Parkway that many of us had long assumed were part of the story? Like the body found directly between two women Rex had just admitted to killing, less than 1200ft from Megan Waterman on one side and a half mile from Jessica Taylor on the other. Or the body found only 212ft from Valerie Mack, another victim Rex had just admitted to killing. 212ft, the length of a prison cell block. Or a brisk 30 second walk. And then there were the remains found on the other side of Ocean Parkway, roughly two miles from the skull of Karen Vergata, yet another woman Rex had just admitted to killing. Three bodies, all found on Ocean Parkway, all found in the shadow of victims Rex had claimed. Yet all three, absent from his confession, omitted from the story he wanted to tell.

[Narrator/Host]

But why?

[Josh Zieman]

Was it because one of these victims was biologically male? Or because the other was a child? Or because the third was that child's mother? Which raises the question, did Rex tell us everything? Or just enough? Because when you look beyond the eight victims he's pleaded to, a different picture emerges. One that stretches beyond Ocean Parkway, beyond Long island, and maybe even beyond New York. But to understand that story, we have to go back to the beginning. To the body that's haunted this investigation right from the start. The victim found squarely in the middle of this pattern, but who just never quite seemed to fit. The only victim found along Ocean Parkway. Who still remains unidentified, a lost soul known only as Asian Doe.

[Mary Murphy]

The remains of an unidentified male were found on Long island more than a decade ago in April of 2011, and is being referred to as Asian Doe. He's believed to have been another possible victim of Gilgo beach serial killer Rex Heuerman.

[Josh Zieman]

I'm Josh Zieman, and this is Monster Hunting, the Long island serial kill.

[District Attorney Ray Tierney]

Good afternoon. Thanks, everyone, for coming. With the defendants pleas of guilt today, it means we can turn to all of these same people and say Rex Uerman will be held responsible for the deaths of these women.

[Josh Zieman]

The task force has asked for help.

[Mary Murphy]

Identified some other remains found out there.

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So how could this case actually close?

[District Attorney Ray Tierney]

We'll continue to work all the other. Unfortunately, many cases in Suffolk County. Doesn't matter what I believe. It matters what I can prove.

[Josh Zieman]

And that's the problem with Asian Dough. Looking at a map and seeing where their body was found, it's easy to believe they're one of Rex's victims. But as DA Tierney suggests, what you believe and what you can prove are two very different things. Because to prove a case, you need evidence. And when it comes to Asian Doe, evidence is in short supply. Unlike the other victims connected to Gilgo beach, we still don't even know who this victim is. No name, no identity, no family history, no clear victimology. Just a body found along a remote stretch of road and a handful of clues. Clues that raise more questions than answers, which is why we turn to author and journalist Sarah Wyman.

[Interviewer/Host]

Were you always taking a look at the case? Where was that something that was always on your radar?

[Sarah Wyman]

It was always on my radar. I mean, I'm a crime journalist, so it couldn't not be on my radar. But I read Bob Kolker's Lost Girls, which I still think is an outstanding book, and a look at the lives that several of these women led before their horrible demises. But then Rex Heuerman got arrested and he was charged with the murders of more women. And it just felt like looking at that map of Gilgo beach and the remains that were found, it's like, as you know, you had Tanya Jackson, who was then known as Peaches, on one side. You had Tatiana Dykes, her daughter, on the other side, known as Baby Doe. And then sort of in between, you had these women. And somewhere in there were the remains of who we know as Asian Doe. So as I talk to you right now, Asian Doe is the only unidentified person in that entire cluster. And I'm always interested in who is overlooked, who is neglected, who is forgotten.

[Interviewer/Host]

But you've done a pretty significant deep dive into Asian Doe to try and flesh out, even in a background sense, of who this individual might be. Right.

[Sarah Wyman]

Well, we know that their remains were found at gilgo beach on April 4, 2011. And the remains, when they were tested, were deemed to be biologically male, but they also were determined to be, quote, wearing women's clothing. And investigators believe that this person, quote, lived as a woman. And that could mean a whole bunch of different things. It could mean that they identified as male but wore women's clothing. They could be trans. They also released some information about the kind of clothing that they were wearing, like some of the brands, I think it was Rafaella and Bill Blass for the jeans and the bra. And, you know, looking at the brands, you can make certain assumptions about potentially socioeconomic status, if they may have been living potentially a transient life or not. So looking at these telltale clues, the fact that they were of Asian descent, I believe of Han Chinese descent, is what the genetic typing pinpointed. But that could mean anything. We don't know if that means that they were an immigrant from China or if they were born in the US Or Canada or elsewhere. So there's still a lot of room to figure out who this person might be. I mean, there were so many issues with the LISK investigation as a whole that I felt like that how they looked into Asian do was just a tiny blip of, you know, rank prejudice that was getting in the way. But, I mean, there were, as, you know, there are so many issues with James Burke and, you know, everybody. It felt like crooked people all the way down. And then once Rex Heuerman was, you know, once the task force started in earnest, and then Rex Heuerman was identified and then arrested. And then more names of women, some at Gilgo, some outside of it, were added to his potential kill roster. And it still felt like Asian Doe was getting lost in the shuffle. But one thing that I think is also worth discussing that may or may not tie into this is that when he searches were discovered, a couple of them seemed to possibly correlate to Asian dough because he was talking, he was writing or searching for Asian twink porn. And that just seemed to be a very specific reference in a sea of very specific and horrible references that he was looking for online. And it's still intriguing and troubling.

[Interviewer/Host]

And not just that. Correct. There's also a T.S. i think the initials T.S.

[Josh Zieman]

were used. Correct.

[Sarah Wyman]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Host]

Transsexual, I think. Was. Is the designation of what that porn would be or something to that effect.

[Sarah Wyman]

Right. And also, of course, in 2011, the word transgender, while it was used, it wasn't as common. And you, you know, you heard more like transsexual or.

[Interviewer/Host]

Right, exactly.

[Sarah Wyman]

Transvestite and the like.

[Interviewer/Host]

And I believe. And I could check back, it was also ts. Escorts.

[Sarah Wyman]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Host]

I mean, what does that tell you?

[Sarah Wyman]

Well, it can tell us a lot. It's also important not to necessarily think that the blinking neon sign is as blinking a neon as we think.

[Interviewer/Host]

In your opinion, based upon the research that you've done, do you believe Rex Uhman is responsible for Asian Doe's death?

[Sarah Wyman]

Right now, I would say I don't know. I know from talking to people that whenever I would straight up ask them, they would get a little. They would start to climb up on me. They'd be like, well, that's an interesting question. Or, we're not really sure. But it's a similar thing to their Asian Doe's potential identity, which I think is, you know, before we figure out the perpetrator, we have to figure out who they were.

[Interviewer/Host]

I mean, would you not say, based upon Rex's Google searches and knowing that the. That those Google searches, because there's so many, that they are specifically put on the bail document. Very specifically. You know, it's not randomized that those are put on the bail document. And therefore, we were. We were always inferring that the DA Was somehow giving us a little bit of a kind of wink and a nod.

[Sarah Wyman]

Right.

[Interviewer/Host]

This is going on here very specifically.

[Sarah Wyman]

I mean, to me, he's still the likeliest suspect. But all I know is that when I asked certain law enforcement sources straight up, so, is Rex responsible for Asian Doe? And generally, the answer I got back was, that's a very interesting question. What an answer. What am I going to do with this? As of right now, I guess we might wait to see what he may or may not admit to. I didn't realize until recently that admitting to Karen Vergada was significant because her remains were found in Nassau. So Suffolk wouldn't have been able to necessarily prosecute. So admitting to that and then Nassau may or may not do something about that seems significant. So it's also looking at that in that context, that not admitting straight up to Asian Doe. Well, if Rex is responsible, is he using that as leverage? Is he going to admit to it later? Does he want to hold onto it as some.

[Interviewer/Host]

I don't know.

[Sarah Wyman]

For whatever misbegotten reasons he may or may not have sure, you know, did something go wrong? Because it doesn't fit a certain pattern. That Asian Doe was beaten and the other women were strangled. Did something happen or is it an alternate suspect and Rex had nothing to do with it? So there are all sorts of avenues of possibility that until somebody either comes forward or we finally get a concrete identification of who Asian doctor was and then victimology can hopefully lead to a viable suspect, we're just trafficking in speculation. Until then,

[Josh Zieman]

that was Sarah Wyman with the hard truth about the Asian Doe case. While geography may point in one direction, without a name, without a history, even the strongest suspicions can only go so far. That's what Dhea Tierney was trying to tell us. And it matters because if this case has taught us anything, it's just how dangerous assumptions can be. Especially when it comes to the two other victims found along Ocean Parkway. A woman who for years was known only as Peaches and her daughter, a toddler, known simply as Baby Doe. For years, Suffolk county investigators believed they were part of the same pattern, the same dumping ground, the same killer. Until a shocking announcement called into everything we thought we knew about these two victims and exactly who may have killed them.

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[Josh Zieman]

for years it was one of the most baffling mysteries of The Long island serial killer case. A Jane Doe known only as Peaches, named for a distinctive peach tattoo found on her left breast. Her torso was first discovered in 1997 inside a cooler found in Hempstead Lake park on long Island. Then 14 years later, more of her remains were found miles away along Ocean Parkway as part of the Gilgo beach investigation. And then came an even more devastating discovery. The remains of an unidentified toddler found wrapped in a blanket, also along Ocean Parkway. DNA would later reveal the child was Peach's daughter. A mother and child, both nameless, both pieces of the same horrifying puzzle. For years, their identities remained a mystery until April 23, 2025, when investigators revealed that Peaches was Tanya Denise Jackson and that the toddler, her daughter, was Tatiana Marie Dykes.

[News Reporter]

Police today announced that Peaches is Tanya

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Denise Jackson, a 26 year old army veteran and single mom originally from Alabama.

[News Reporter]

Her two year old daughter was Tatiana Marie Dykes.

[Josh Zieman]

But then in December 2025 came the twist that changed everything. An announcement not from Suffolk County District Attorney Ray Tierney, but from District Attorney Ann Donnelly in Nassau County.

[Mary Murphy]

I am here to announce the indictment

[Podcast Host]

of Andrew Dykes, a 66 year old

[Mary Murphy]

army veteran from Florida for the murder of Tanya Denise Jackson in 1997. A former Florida state trooper is now being indicted for one of Long Island's most haunting and disturbing cold cases.

[Josh Zieman]

The arrest of Andrew Dykes sent shockwaves through those following the Long island serial killer case. Because if prosecutors in neighboring Nassau county were right, then one of the most haunting pieces of this Gilgo beach mystery, the fact that Tatiana's remains were found just 212ft from Valerie Mack, a victim of Rex Heuermann, was simply an unbelievable coincidence. And Tanya and Tatiana's killer wasn't the Long island serial killer as we had suspected for years, but somebody else entirely.

[Joe Jackalone]

If I was driving my car, I would have probably drove it off the road. If I was listening to that, I mean, it was one of those like, oh crap moments, like when you hear it. Because I think that the case is

[Josh Zieman]

difficult and complex enough to better understand this stunning development and whether it truly rules out Rex Heuermann. I spoke with former commander of the Bronx Cold Case squad, Joe Jackalone.

[Joe Jackalone]

I guess I was just like, wow, right? Like holy cow. I mean, listen, when they came out with their identification, I was up here. And then after the arrest and the announcement, I was a little skeptical at first about it. Like you said, I was waiting for to come on and say, okay, they got their man. Now I'm questioning, do they have the right guy, or do they even have enough evidence? Do they have the right guy? Probably. But the question comes down to is, do they have enough to convict it?

[Josh Zieman]

I don't know.

[Interviewer/Host]

You know how I feel. There's just things that continue to nag me as. As to whether they got the right guy. And then it's like, oh, my God, do they have the right guy? Do they have the evidence? You know, do they have the right guy? And do they have the evidence for the right guy? And seeing as you're the expert, I've kind of presented my. I have my evidence to present to you.

[Joe Jackalone]

Well, listen, when we first. When this story first broke, I have my questions about this, and we actually laid out why we thought, or I thought that there wasn't enough evidence as

[Narrator/Host]

far as I was concerned.

[Joe Jackalone]

As a matter of fact, I even said, if I would have presented this case to the Bronx District Attorney's office, they wouldn't have gone with it. They would have told you, listen, you got to have more evidence than that. They have a child in common. They have relationships. People get back together all the time. Just because they did that and she was found dead, that does not mean that he's the one that did it. Right. So they would probably have told me, try to get a confession out of him. That would have probably been the best thing that you can get. And at that point, so, you know, did they move too quickly? Did they. Did they get into a thing where they need to do something? I mean, I hope that's not the case.

[Interviewer/Host]

Right?

[Joe Jackalone]

Like, we got to do something, so let's do it.

[Interviewer/Host]

That is an interesting point. If you had brought this to your superiors with what they. With their evidence, Right. Number one, he is the father of the child. They had a. Not the greatest relationship. And obviously, as we're going to look, they did find his semen inside her. Would that be enough? And I guess the, The. The knowledge that he had some medical experience, would that have been enough for your D. A to move forward?

[Joe Jackalone]

No, I'm telling you right now, they wouldn't have. They would have said, okay, you got something, they would have told you, but we need more. We need something else other than that. And it's the fact. I mean, if they were total strangers, this wouldn't be an issue. Right. If they were total strangers and, you know, they never. They never knew each other beforehand, then I think you have a much stronger case. But because they have a child in common, they have a previous relationship, she moves to New York just to be with him. And DA Donnelly even says that she moved to New York to be with him.

[Interviewer/Host]

So we have this evidence of this continued relationship and evidence that he had been with her within 72 hours of her being killed.

[Joe Jackalone]

How does he know about Gilgo? I mean, he's from Texas. He's stationed in Brooklyn. And I've said this a hundred times, there were people that lived on Long island that didn't know where Gilgo was until this case broke, you know, 13 years ago, 14 years ago. As simple as that.

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[Interviewer/Host]

Now, some people say, well, you know, it's just on the southern state, but still, I'm from. I live in Staten island and Long Island. I had no idea. Like, I'm North Shore guy, you know, not South Shore.

[Joe Jackalone]

Right. As I said, there are people that had no idea where Gilgo was.

[Interviewer/Host]

That. That's a very good point. So what would have had to happen is he dumps Tatiana Dykes here, and then three years later, Rex comes by and somehow dumps Valerie Mack here, 211ft away. Why did they pick this area? I don't know. There is literally nothing. Nothing to indicate why.

[Joe Jackalone]

The only. The only consideration there would be that there's a turnaround there. So if they did come down, they would have to turn around at that location.

[Interviewer/Host]

Okay, so coincidentally, they both. One guy turns around here and dumps the baby in 1997, tragically. And then Rex comes around and dumps Valerie Mack 211ft away, coincidentally. Unbelievable coincidence. The coincidence there is that Andrew does that, and then Rex, three years later, happens to do the exact same thing. Okay, now goes all the way there.

[Josh Zieman]

I don't know why he's going all the way there.

[Interviewer/Host]

I don't know how he knows about it. But he's got all this area to dump on Ocean Parkway, but drives all the way down to Jones beach and dumps the rest of Tanya here. Ironically, he only happened to be two miles away from where Rex had dumped Karen Vergata one year earlier.

[Narrator/Host]

That's just unbelievable.

[Interviewer/Host]

So, again, just to reiterate my case there, Sarge, he drops one body in Hempstead and then drives 28 miles to drop Tatiana and then drives six and a half miles to randomly go over here and then goes home.

[Joe Jackalone]

It's a hell of a trip.

[Interviewer/Host]

Hell of a trip.

[Joe Jackalone]

It has everything to do with the publicity. It has everything to do with the fact that. That a guy named Rex Heuerman was arrested and charged with, you know, the killing of seven women. All found, you know at Gilgo in Manorville. Why?

[Narrator/Host]

Just give me.

[Interviewer/Host]

I. I just need to know why.

[Josh Zieman]

Why? That's the question I keep coming back to. Why does a map seem to tell us one thing and the indictment tells us another? For so many years, so many of us believed that Tanya Jackson and her daughter Tatiana, found on either end of this trophy garden, were bookends to a nightmare. But maybe we were wrong. Maybe Rex Uman didn't kill Tanya or Tatiana. Maybe he didn't kill Asian Doe either. And if that's true, then maybe we're wrong about another victim as well. A young woman whose profile echoed many of Rex Heuermann's victims. A sex worker whose body wasn't found along Ocean Parkway, but a different parkway in Long island, the Meadowbrook Parkway. A woman found years before Gilgo beach even became a headline. A victim who. That was never officially tied to Rex. At least not yet.

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[Josh Zieman]

her name was Carmen Vargas and her murder has never been tied to the Long island serial killer, at least not officially. But within hours of Rex's arrest, her case was at the top of our list. Carmen, age 29, was a petite woman

[Interviewer/Host]

who at times worked as a sex worker.

[Josh Zieman]

On September 11, 1989, her badly decomposed body was discovered just off the Meadowbrook Parkway. Looking at a map, Carmen's body was found surprisingly close to a location connected to Rex Heuerman.

[Mary Murphy]

The victim was Carmen Vargas, and she was found tied up at the side of the Meadowbrook Parkway in Freeport in 1989. This is eight miles from where accused Gilgo killer Rex Heuermann has lived his entire life.

[Josh Zieman]

But if this episode had has taught us anything, it's that maps and news reports can be misleading. Yes, a map may tell you that Carmen Vargas was found only 8 miles from Rex Heuermann's home. But a map doesn't speak to human behavior. It doesn't tell you where Rex probably spent most of his time. At 93 Bedell street in Freeport. The apartment of his then girlfriend, the woman who would soon become his first wife. An apartment that was likely far more appealing to the young couple than Rex's home over in Massapeco park that he still shared with his mother. And while a map may not tell you that story, it will tell you something else. That this apartment sat less than two miles from where Carmen Vargas body was found. So was Carmen just another victim who slipped through the cracks? Was she part of a much larger story that we're only just beginning to uncover?

[District Attorney Ray Tierney]

So, with regard to other investigations, those potential investigations are not covered by the plea in this case. So we'll just have to see how that unfolds. But the plea and the coverage pertains to the eight women that were discussed in court today. That's it.

[Josh Zieman]

The consequence of Rex Herman's guilty plea is that it forces us to confront a difficult question. What about everyone else? The victims he didn't confess to, the cases that were never charged, and the murders that even now still don't make sense? Tanya and Tatiana Dykes or Asian Doe or Carmen Vargas or the dozens of other cases still out there? And to better understand what happens to those cases now and whether Rex Heuerman's plea brings us any closer to the truth, I spoke with veteran New York journalist Mary Murphy.

[Interviewer/Host]

So we're going to be talking about the repercussions of Rex Heuermann changing his plea to guilty. What are we going to learn from this plea? Or what aren't we going to learn?

[Mary Murphy]

Sometimes people plead guilty because they want to contain the facts. There has been a lot out there already. We know a lot more than I ever knew before any other trial took place. I've covered a lot of trials. You know, what I'm interested in is the whole CODIS thing. A lot of people seem to think once Rex Uhrman's DNA goes into codis that, you know, it's all these cases are going to light up. Ding, ding, ding, ding. And they're going to solve all these cases. But one thing that I've been hearing from someone pretty high up in the investigation, he liked allegedly to do his thing close to home, within his home. You know, there is the chance that the people that were killed, some of whom we haven't seen the evidence for yet, there is a chance that those people are in New York State and within the confines of Nassau and Suffolk Counties, just a chance. We know that Rex Uhrman has had a home or he had property in South Carolina. We know he had property in Las Vegas. So, you know, potentially those places could be, of course, of high interest. But don't be surprised if a lot of the victimization happened in his home.

[Interviewer/Host]

Well, I think one thing, control is very important to Rex. Not getting caught was very important to Rex. There's so many clues if you look at the hunting kill planning document. And as much as there's missing victims, for example, missing individuals, five who were dismembered that they were looking at him for in Las Vegas, a timeshare does not give you the opportunity to do all the terrible, horrific things that he did to individuals in a controlled scenario. You know, a timeshare is basically a hotel room, you know, and Rex, tragically, again, really liked to have his victims there for a long time and torture them as part of his sexual sadism. So I'm not going to be surprised if we don't, unfortunately, see a lot light up from codis.

[Mary Murphy]

Well, you know, there are other unidentified victims, and no one has stated that they're definitely connected to the Gilgo beach serial killer. But there are three John Does. Well, now I think most of them have been identified, except one. There are three John does in Manorville, very close to where Valerie Mack and Colleen McNamee, who's with the Bittrov case, and where Jessica Taylor was found. So there are like nine of them on the cold case part of the website from the DA's office. So what happens to those cases?

[Interviewer/Host]

So there are other victims found along Ocean Parkway that had been attributed to Rex that he has not been charged with. Originally, we thought that was going to be Peaches as well, but now Andrew Dykes has been charged with Peaches. And of course, the fallout from that and the. The terrible consequence is now the baby, Tatiana may never get any justice because that is a Suffolk county case and Peaches is a Nassau county case. So tragically, that baby may never get justice. That's really upsetting.

[Mary Murphy]

I mean, unless they can in some way prove that mother and child were killed during the same event, and the mother's body was found initially in Hempstead Lake State Park. If they can prove that it happened in the course of the same event, maybe they could wrap it in Carmen Vargas. We've spoken about her before.

[Interviewer/Host]

You interviewed Carmen Vargas niece, is that correct?

[Mary Murphy]

Yes. Yes.

[Interviewer/Host]

So tell me about that.

[Mary Murphy]

Well, she was the last person to see her aunt Alive. This was 1989, and it was in the East Harlem area of Manhattan. And they had gone to the Central park pool, I think it was in August of that year. And she saw she was only 12 years old, Denise. And her aunt Carmen, unfortunately had turned to sex work because she had a drug problem. She saw her aunt get into a car, a dark colored car with a white man that had glasses. And of course, Carmen was never seen again. The niece spent about 17 years at least or more thinking that Joel Rifkin might have been the killer. He's a serial killer from Long Island. But when Joel Rifkin confessed to about 17 murders after he was arrested, when they asked him about Carmen Vargas, he said, that's not mine.

[Josh Zieman]

Yes.

[Mary Murphy]

So I, I think, you know, there is a chance that Carmen Vargas will be tied to Rex Fjorman.

[Interviewer/Host]

Let's talk about another case that you and I have talked about quite a bit. Tanya Rush.

[Mary Murphy]

Yeah, Tonya Rush. You know, she did the stroll in East New York. She also, you know, wonderful mother to her three girls, but she fell on hard times and became a crack addict. And so to support her habit, she used to streetwalk in East New York. She lived in the Van Dyke Houses. And she was found dismembered about five days after she disappeared. And so, you know, there are so many years involved in these unsolved cases, but it was either like 2007 or 2008. But, you know, the state police never revealed which body part was found in this suitcase. You know, my guess, it was a torso, but no one ever came out and stated that. So, Tanya Rush, if you believe the proposition that Rex Uhman, back in the day before there were these Craigslist and escort services, you know, did he pick people up on the street? And I believe investigators think he did.

[Interviewer/Host]

Which brings up an interesting point. We remember that in a kind of trial strategy, Tierney didn't want to keep adding victims onto the seven that Rex had been indicted for that.

[Mary Murphy]

Well, because the judge wanted the trial to go forward. He said it can't go on indefinitely, just collecting more evidence. Then you have to deal with a whole host of more, you know, discovery material. The discovery material took ages and ages, you know, to get through. So the judge wanted a trial to happen. So, I mean, I don't know if they would announce results from other material that they gathered, other evidence that they gathered. Are you allowed to announce that if there's no indictment?

[Interviewer/Host]

That's. That's a good question because, you know, we. Othram had been doing quite well in terms of its findings. And so I think that that's a really good question. If they do have information that could mention Rex, what do they do with that. That information? What. What's the result of that information?

[Mary Murphy]

Well, you know, you have to go back to what is the DA's office going to do? You know, I want to know if he's connected to any other cases in Suffolk County.

[Interviewer/Host]

Yeah.

[Mary Murphy]

Just as a starting point, because there are a lot of unsolved cases there. Yeah. So I want to know, did he do any of those other cases? And I had done an article on Route 27, you know, which. Which covers Sunrise highway and Montauk highway going east. Right. And like, one exit after another, you know, there was someone associated with an unsolved case. You know, there was the Sag to Coast. There was the woman found on the beach, Heck, your state park. But that dates back really far. You know, I think the late 70s. You know, sugar Bear was found near Forge River. That's not so far off that exit, you know, from Montauk on Montauk Highway. So I want to know about the other victims that happened. Gotten answers yet?

[Interviewer/Host]

Yeah, I mean, that's a great. That's a great point and a great question, which is, even though there may be a sentencing, there are still so many questions that we all need to figure out. 1. And you brought it. I think you bring up an interesting point, which is there's the CODIS question, Right. Of whether he's connected to all these other victims or these other murders, tragically, of women across the country. But that actually may not answer the question of what about the ones locally? What about the ones that we still think he may be connected to, the other ones on Long Island? What's going to happen with those cases? You know, obviously.

[Mary Murphy]

Well, you know, the whole thing with dismemberment. How. How many. How many killers? Dismember. Maybe it's more than we realize, but to me, that's.

[Interviewer/Host]

It's not.

[Mary Murphy]

There's a lot of work involved in that.

[Interviewer/Host]

Yeah.

[Mary Murphy]

You know, so, you know, we have the. Tanya was in that little black suitcase by the Southern State Parkway in North Belmore. And then cherries, you know, some of her was found, you know, across Long Island Sound in Mamaroneck, Westchester County. But then her legs were found in. Some of her extremities were found in Nassau county on the North Shore, and some were found in Suffolk county on the North Shore. But she. But. But her torso was in a little black valise suitcase, not probably not so different from the valise used for Tanya Rush. So those cases stay with me, too. You know, because of the. The containers involved, the type of vessel that was used to contain the body parts.

[Interviewer/Host]

And Carmen Vargas and Asian Doe.

[Mary Murphy]

But they were all deposited in different ways. I mean, Carmen Vargas was intact. Yeah, Asian Doe was intact.

[Interviewer/Host]

Right.

[Mary Murphy]

Tanya was not. She was not intact.

[Interviewer/Host]

Yeah. So there's so many questions.

[Josh Zieman]

So where does this leave us? With a killer who's confessed, but only part of the story. Story with a narrative that feels carefully constructed but probably incomplete. With a search for answers that only raises more questions. And yet. This is the paradox of serial murder. We need to make sense of it. We want every victim identified, every murder solved, every family given justice. But serial murder doesn't work that way. It's messy. It's chaotic. And it defines the very logic we use to understand it. Maybe Rex killed Agent Doe. Maybe he didn't. Maybe Tanya and Tatiana Dykes were victims of the Long Island Serial killer. Maybe they weren't. Maybe Carmen Vargas is part of this story. Or maybe she's part of another one entirely. The reality is, we still don't know. Maybe when Rex's DNA is entered into codis, we'll finally get some clarity. Maybe another case of lights up or a victim gets a name or another piece of this puzzle falls into place. Or maybe it won't. And maybe that's the hardest part of all of this. Knowing the answers may never come. That's the risk. But it doesn't mean we stop asking. It doesn't mean we stop searching. Because somewhere inside those unanswered questions, the truth is still waiting.

[Narrator/Host]

Ready to keep listening. Remember, you can binge the rest of the season right now with an I Heart True Crime plus subscription, available exclusively on Apple Podcasts plus. You get exclusive bonuses and ad free listening. So head to Apple Podcasts, search I Heart True Crime plus and subscribe today. Hunting the Long Island Serial Killer is a production of Tenderfoot TV and I Heart Podcasts. Hosted, written and executive produced by me, Josh Zieman. Produced and written by Caitlin Colford. Donald Albright and Payne Lindsay are executive producers on behalf of Tenderfoot tv. Matt Frederick and Trevor Young are executive producers on behalf of Iheart Podcasts. Original music by Alex Lacarenko, David Little and makeup and vanity set. Our supervising producer is John Street. Editing and writing by Daniel Lonsberry. Additional voiceover provided by Rachel Mills. Additional production provided by Ghost Robot. Sound design, mix and master by Dayton Cole. Cover Design by Byron McCoy. Interns Arnetta Fontenot, Shelby Hanson, Alec Walker and Fox Williams. A and e Television Networks LLC. Audio from the Killing Season used under license Copyright 2025 A&E Television Networks, LLC.

[Interviewer/Host]

All rights reserved.

[Narrator/Host]

Special thanks to the team at United Talent Agency, the Nord Group, Brad Abramson, Todd Leibowitz, Rich Perillo and Jigsaw Productions, Rachel Mills, Zachary Mortensen, Jen Beagle, David Baker, Joe Jacquelone and Evan Krause, as well as the teams at iHeart Podcasts and Tenderfoot TV. Find us on social media at MonsterPod. For more podcasts like Hunting the Long Island Serial Killer, search Tenderfoot TV in your podcast app or visit Tenderfoot tv. And if you want to keep following my hunt for the Long Island Serial Killer for a deeper dive into my other true crime content, join me on YouTube at Sinister with Josh Zieman.

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