Morning Brew Daily – September 22, 2025

Episode title: $100K H1-B Visa Fee Upends Tech Sector & Murdochs Involved in TikTok Deal?

Hosts: Neal Freyman & Toby Howell

Overview

In this episode, Neal and Toby break down two seismic moves in the tech and business world: the Trump administration’s surprise $100,000 H1-B visa fee, and the latest developments in the U.S.-China TikTok deal, with a cameo from moguls like the Murdochs. They also highlight lighter fare, including nostalgic Hamburger Helper sales and this year’s IG Nobel Prizes, while previewing key events for the week ahead. Mixed with sharp analysis and cheeky banter, the show makes sense of today’s dizzying news landscape for business-minded listeners.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. $100,000 H1-B Visa Fee Throws Tech into Disarray

[02:37 - 07:18]

• Shock Announcement:
  President Trump signed an executive order imposing a $100,000 fee on new H1-B visa applications, triggering panic across major American tech companies.

  • The rule was announced Friday (with little warning), effective just after midnight Sunday.
  • Companies scrambled to ensure employees weren’t stranded overseas; some like Amazon, Microsoft, Google, and Goldman Sachs sent urgent advisories to staff.

• Immediate Fallout:

  • One software engineer reportedly paid $8,000 for last-minute flights from India back to the US (05:10).
  • Initial confusion: Details clarified later that the fee would only apply to new applications, not renewals, but uncertainty persisted.

• Administration’s Reasoning:

  • Trump has long criticized H1-Bs for allegedly disadvantaging American workers in top tech jobs. This move is his boldest yet to discourage companies from hiring foreign talent.
  • Neal:

    “Trump has been beating this drum since all the way back in his 2016 campaign, saying that the H1B program deprioritizes American workers.” (04:15)

• Industry & Economic Impact:

  • Heavy users: Amazon with 14,000+ H1-Bs; Microsoft, Meta, Apple, Google each with 4,000+ at fiscal year 2025’s end.
  • Only 85,000 H1-Bs are issued by lottery each year, with over 400,000 applicants.
  • Notable tech leaders who arrived via H1-B: Eric Yuan, Sundar Pichai, Satya Nadella, Indra Nooyi, Sanjay Mehrotra (05:10-06:00).
  • Threatens US competitiveness in the global tech race—especially with China.

• Favoring Big Tech over Startups:

  • Toby:

    “It’s going to favor Big Tech. It is much more difficult for a startup... to pay $100,000 to get a high-skilled worker. It is much easier for Amazon, for Apple.” (06:09)

  • Potentially cements Big Tech’s dominance by pricing out startups and smaller companies.

• Scale of Economic Consequences:

  • Previous fees: $215 to enter the lottery, $780 for application; $100K is a massive upcharge.
  • Could cost companies $14 billion more annually—possibly scuttling the program.
  • Neal:

    “Paying $100,000 for just a single worker just may not be feasible... Not only for startups, certainly for startups, but also even for the biggest [companies].” (06:45)

2. Murdochs, Oracle, and Others in the TikTok Deal Home Stretch

[07:18 - 11:43]

• Deal Nearing Finalization:

  • An agreement for US investors to take over TikTok’s algorithm is reportedly close. High-profile names potentially involved: Larry Ellison (Oracle), Michael Dell, Lachlan & Rupert Murdoch.
  • ByteDance would retain less than 20% of the new US entity; the rest overseen by American investors and a majority-US board, complying with legislation passed earlier in 2025.

• Complicated Structure & Political Twist:

  • Still unclear: exact ownership breakdown, leadership, price, and operational control.
  • ByteDance would own <20%, 30% owned by existing ByteDance investors, and 50% by new American investors like Oracle and Andreessen Horowitz (08:40–09:48).
  • There may be a new, separate TikTok app for US users; technical details TBD.

• Trump Administration’s Unprecedented Role:

  • The administration is demanding a substantial (multi-billion) fee for brokering the deal—a move unprecedented for a US government.
  • Toby:

    “This is now the Trump administration saying, ‘We’ve basically acted like investment bankers in this regard. Where is our fee?’” (09:48)

  • Cites similar moves: taking a 15% cut of Nvidia’s AI chip China sales, buying a stake in Intel.

• China’s Calculated Concession:

  • Neal speculates China’s willingness to cede TikTok is a tactical gamble, aiming for bigger economic or geopolitical wins.
  • Neal:

    “[China is] willing to part with [TikTok] in order to score much bigger wins later… What they really want is a meeting with Trump... to project power on the global stage.” (10:38)

• Political Objectives:

  • Trump angles for three wins: punish China, enrich US investors, and keep TikTok alive to woo younger voters (11:30).

3. Winners of the Weekend Segment

[11:43 - 16:12]

a. Neal’s Winner: Hamburger Helper

• Sales are up 14.5% year-over-year (“when the going gets tough, the tough buy mid-century One Pot Meals”) as Americans look for cheap, filling food in the midst of persistent inflation and a slowing job market.
• Hamburger Helper’s history: launched in the 1970s, has gone through ownership changes, now updated with quicker prep times (down to 20 minutes) and spicier flavors for the modern palate.
• Modern pop culture boost: a cameo in the TV series “The Bear” has revived interest.
• Toby:

  “I am curious to see which trend wins out—healthier eating or just rising food costs. But... bang for your buck—it’s always historically represented bang for your buck.” (12:50)

• Fun fact: one serving is 27% of your daily sodium!

b. Toby’s Winner: The IG Nobel Prizes

[17:09 - 19:57]

• The “silliest of serious" science awards, recognizing research that “first makes you laugh, then makes you think.”
• Standouts from 2025:
  • Japanese team: painting stripes on cows reduces fly bites.
  • Italian researchers: precise starch ratios for perfect cacio e pepe.
  • West African study: rainbow lizards have a pizza preference.
  • Teflon powder proposed as a zero-calorie meal filler (!).
  • German experiment: being slightly drunk actually helped native Germans speak better Dutch (18:14).
  • Fruit bats: alcohol impairs their flying and echolocation.
• Fun moments: Award-winning scientists dress up, stage playful “please stop, I’m bored” interruptions for overlong speeches, and even present a mini opera about gastroenterologists.

4. What to Watch This Week

[19:57 - 24:23]

• Global Affairs:

  • Hundreds of world leaders arrive for the UN General Assembly’s 80th anniversary in NYC, with hot topics like Palestinian statehood, Ukraine, and Sudan.
  • Neal:

    “President Trump will address the UN gathering on Tuesday, while plenty of important meetings between heads of state will take place in the background.” (21:14)

• Local NYC Color:

  • Expect horrendous Midtown Manhattan traffic due to UNGA—“try to find non-driving modes for getting around” (Toby, 21:14).

• Sports:

  • Ryder Cup kicks off Friday at Bethpage Black—Team USA vs. Team Europe. Neal’s attending; Toby laments missing out.

• Pop Culture:

  • Fat Bear Week launches early at Katmai National Park, Alaska. 747 “Bear Force One” clocks in at ~1,400 pounds.
  • Friday: Release of Paul Thomas Anderson’s “One Battle After Another,” starring DiCaprio and Sean Penn. Anticipated as an “American masterpiece.”

• Seasonal and Personal Notes:

  • Autumn Equinox: the first day of fall.
  • Neal is out for Rosh Hashanah; backup host Kyle steps in.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On H1-B Fee Shockwave:

  “There’s a lot of question marks all over this. We’re still flying in somewhat foggy conditions.”
  —Immigration attorney, via Neal quoting New York Times (03:55)

• On US Tech Leadership, Thanks to H1-Bs:

  “Top execs... have come [to America] through the H1-B program. Proponents say, well, this is how we bring in talent... If we’re locked in this fight with China for AI... we’re just kneecapping ourselves [with this fee].”
  —Neal Freyman (05:50)

• On Big Tech vs. Startups:

  “It might tilt the playing field even further in the favor of Big Tech when it comes to competing with smaller startups.”
  —Toby Howell (06:09)

• On the TikTok Deal’s Glacial Pace:

  “Harry Styles ran a marathon faster than how long this deal is taking place.”
  —Neal (08:40)

• On the Administration Demanding a Fee:

  “We’ve basically acted like investment bankers in this regard. Where is our fee?”
  —Toby (09:48)

• On Fat Bear Week:

  “These guys are bigger than Jordan Davis. Past champion 747... weighs 1,400 pounds. That’s a lot of salmon he’s guzzling down ahead of hibernation.”
  —Neal (22:22)

• On the IG Nobel Prizes Ceremony:

  “After a minute goes by and you accept your award, a man wearing a dress over his suit appears... and just yells, ‘Please stop. I’m bored.’”
  —Neal (19:57)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:37] – H1-B visa fee announcement, immediate effects and company responses
• [04:15] – Trump’s rationale; implications for American workers and competitiveness
• [05:10–06:09] – H1-B program details; Big Tech vs. startup impact
• [06:45] – Cost impact and possible program demise
• [07:18] – TikTok deal structure, players, and US government’s unprecedented “fee”
• [08:40] – How the deal is being finalized, new app structure
• [09:48] – Trump administration’s pattern of “demanding a cut”; further examples
• [10:38] – China’s calculation and bigger-picture geopolitics
• [11:43] – Winners of the Weekend intro; Hamburger Helper’s comeback
• [17:09] – IG Nobel Prizes and quirky science research
• [19:57] – Week ahead: UNGA, Ryder Cup, Fat Bear Week, autumn equinox, “One Battle After Another”

Tone & Style

Maintaining their signature blend of wit, business smarts, and pop culture playfulness, Neal and Toby turn dense policy and global business into funny, accessible conversation—never pulling punches on either the serious impacts or the absurdity of it all.

This episode is a must-listen for anyone tracking the intersection of tech, policy, and global business—especially as US immigration and China relations hit new, headline-grabbing extremes. Plus, you’ll get lighter stories that make the news cycle a little more delicious, weird, and human.