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James Clear Explains How to Set Goals and Instill Habits for 2025
00:31:49
James Clear, the author of ‘Atomic Habits’, explains how to set goals for the new year
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- [00:00]
Neal Freyman
Hey Fidelity, what's it cost to invest with the Fidelity app?
- [00:05]
James Clear
Start with as little as $1 with no account fees or trade commissions on US stocks and ETFs.
- [00:12]
Neal Freyman
That's music to my ears.
- [00:14]
James Clear
I can only talk Investing involves risk, including risk of loss. Zero Account fees apply to retail brokerage accounts only. Sell order assessment fee not included. A limited number of ETFs are subject to a transaction based service fee of $100. See full list@fidelity.com commissions Fidelity Brokerage Services LLC Member NYSE SIPC.
- [00:31]
Neal Freyman
Good Morning Brew Daily Show I'm Neal Freyman.
- [00:34]
Toby Howell
And I'm Toby Howell.
- [00:35]
Neal Freyman
Today we're serving up a classic from the MBD archive, an interview with the.
- [00:39]
Toby Howell
Author of Atomic Habits, James clear. It's Wednesday, December 25th. Merry Christmas and let's ride. Hope you all are settling in to open your presence right now. Maybe some MBD swag if you're lucky. We also hope you're enjoying some time with friends and family. And if you are, thanks for carving out a moment of your day to spend with us as well.
- [01:05]
Neal Freyman
Today's episode is one of our all time favorites. James Clear, the author of the bestselling book Atomic Habits, joined us to talk about setting some goals ahead of the new year. No more vague hand wavy declarations like read more books or get in shape. This episode teaches you how to make resolutions that are actually achievable.
- [01:24]
Toby Howell
James is a deep thinker about all things self improvement. He will help you learn the right and the wrong ways to set goals, how to actually get yourself to the gym, and whether my old soccer coaches motivation techniques were brilliant or bogus. This was originally recorded last year, but the wisdom in it holds true to this day and we think you'll get a lot out of the conversation. Enjoy.
- [01:46]
Neal Freyman
James, thanks for joining us.
- [01:47]
James Clear
Hey, happy to do it. Thanks for having me.
- [01:49]
Neal Freyman
Many people listening to this are probably thinking about their New Year's resolutions, but before they think too hard about them, do you believe this exercise is even worthwhile? Does it even make sense to set goals on New Year's at an annual cadence?
- [02:04]
James Clear
Yeah, it's totally fine. You know, there actually is some research that shows that. I think they call it like the fresh start effect, but basically beginning of the day, beginning of the week, beginning of the year, beginning of the month. Anytime that you kind of have this feeling of rebirth or of starting anew, there is a little bit of a rise in motivation. So it's a natural thing. I mean, you know, we all do it because we're all kind of thinking about how can my next year be better than my last year? And, you know, what am I hoping to achieve? And so on. So it's a very natural thing. I don't think there's anything wrong with using that momentum or using that motivation for you. There also isn't any reason to wait if you feel like making a change earlier in the year or at a different time. There's nothing special about waiting until January, but certainly momentum is a powerful thing, and if you feel like you have some now, then go ahead and take advantage of it.
- [02:51]
Toby Howell
Speaking of kind of last year, last December, you post this thought starter to your newsletter readers. It's one year from now. The habit you were hoping to build during the year didn't stick. What is the most likely reason it failed? Why is predicting the reason a habit failed in the future worth thinking about in the present now?
- [03:09]
James Clear
Well, there are many examples of this kind of thing in business and in life. You know, there's kind of like failure pre mortem as they call it. But basically it's so unlikely that you will stick to a habit and just do it forever. Everyone is going to fall off course at some point and there's going to be some interruption of life that weasels its way in. Maybe it's your kids get sick or you have to travel for work, or you need to do something for your parents or whatever it is. But we all have things that come up. And when your habits fall off track, it's helpful to have a plan for how you go, how you're going to get back on track quickly. And I think actually as I have studied more and more people who build habits and looked at people who are kind of top performers, so to speak, in their particular domain, these people are human just like everyone else, right? They make mistakes and they fall off course. But one pattern that they do tend to share is they get back on track quickly. And if the reclaiming of your habit is fast, the breaking of it doesn't matter that much. So you get to the end of the year and it's just a little blip on the radar where you slipped up two or three times. So for all of those reasons, it's very helpful. And of course, I think we all know that having some kind of consistency has power. And so if you can get back on track quickly, then you can often get the results you want without needing to be perfect.
- [04:26]
Neal Freyman
Is the process of getting back on track with your habits the same as starting out in the first place? Or is it kind of like riding a bike where you can pick it up a little easier.
- [04:34]
James Clear
Yeah, that's a good question. You know, I think broadly, we could break a habit into two different kind of core problems. The first problem is getting started, and the second problem is sticking with it. Now, at some level, what does it mean to stick with something? Well, it basically means that you get started each day. So we could say ultimately this boils down to being good at starting. And if you can just do that day in and day out, then you are consistent. And there are a variety of things that you can do to make starting easier. You can optimize your environment. You can scale the habit down to make it easier to get going. There are ways to track progress and kind of try to build up a feeling momentum. And we can talk about all that stuff in more detail if you want. But you do, in the beginning, I think, need to have a couple things in mind that maybe you don't need to worry about as much once you're already going with a habit or once you're picking up a habit that you've done consistently. And I would say two of the core things to think about when you're starting to build a habit for the first time. The first one is, what would this look like if it was fun? You know, what would it look like if it was fun to meditate every day? What would it look like if I enjoyed exercising? What would it look like if it was fun for me to write? And there are not a thousand ways to do everything in life, but there's almost always more than one way. And it's worth it to think about what is the version of this habit than I am most genuinely excited about. You know, the most common New Year's resolution is to do some form of exercise. And I kind of feel like a lot of people go to the gym in January just because they feel like they should be going to the gym or like society wants them to go to the gym. And you should choose the version of that habit that's most compelling to you. You know, yoga, rock climbing, kayaking, go for a run. Like, we could come up with a very long list of ways to live an active life, and you should choose the version of that that's most appealing to you. So I think it's worth leaning against this question of what would this look like if it was fun for me? That's a really good place to start.
- [06:28]
Toby Howell
Speaking of stuff that is fun for me, I'm going to be selfish here for a second and use you while we have you. I want to get better at golf. Neil does as well. I can tell in his face. But I live in New York City. How would you set up kind of a get better at golf system? What should step one be for. For us?
- [06:47]
James Clear
Yeah, that's an interesting question. I mean, I think you have to play with or sit with the question of, like, how good can you get at golf if you're not on a golf course? Um, and so at some point, this might come down to prioritizing your time and figuring out how to actually get out to a course more consistently. But assuming that that's not possible and you are going to be in the city more, you got to come up with, like, a list of all the things that you could potentially do, whether it's, you know, getting to a simulator or installing some kind of putting green in your apartment or whatever it is. And then I think there are a lot of. Once you figure out what the actual behavior is going to be, there are a lot of things you can do to optimize it. So, like, let's take the putting green in the apart. Um, I had one reader who. He would go to a. He would go to his guitar lessons, and he would practice and play with his instructor, and then he'd go home and he wouldn't really do anything throughout the week. And they go back the next week, and his instructor be like, you didn't practice. You're not going to get better at this. And so he took his guitar stand and put it in the middle of the living room where he'd pass it 30 times a day, and now he's much more likely to play. So that's one simple example of environment design. And we could think about doing the same sort of thing for golf. If you're only practicing when you're going to see an instructor, you might improve a little bit. But if you're not going every day or practicing every day, it's going to be hard to really get better. So making it more obvious is one example. And then I kind of think, given the environmental constraints of this one, it's going to come down to being creative and figuring out, like, how can you tack on around a golf to every work trip, or how can you tack on around a golf to every time that you, like, leave the city to visit your family. Basically, anytime that you're getting out to somewhere where it's more likely to. To be able to actually get onto a course.
- [08:28]
Toby Howell
James, you have no idea how much ammunition you're providing me right now. Because, listen, James Clear told me I have to go practice golf. Mom, I'm so sorry that I'm home for Christmas and I'm hitting the course. So thank you for all that. That was. That was actually very enlightening as well.
- [08:42]
Neal Freyman
Sure.
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Toby Howell
So sticking in the sports category, My old soccer coach always used to say he was British, so this is my British accent. Toby, do you love to win or do you hate to lose? I never had a great answer for it, so I'm turning it over to a more effective motivator. Positive or negative reinforcement.
- [09:04]
James Clear
That's interesting. Do you love to win or do you hate and lose? Okay, so there are two thoughts that come to mind. Your. The last part of your question. What is a more effective motivator? They are both effective motivators. I find that in the long run, it is often better to have some kind of positive motivation to pull you forward. In the short run, negative consequences for sure will shape your behavior. And, you know, you touch a hot stove once and burn yourself, you don't do it for most of the rest of your life unless it's an accident. So, like, that negative consequence certainly has shaped your behavior, and we can think of many examples of that throughout life. However, there is an interesting strategic piece to this, which is in some cases, you can actually win by avoiding loss better than you can by chasing victory. So the classic example of this is if you're playing tennis at the amateur level, if you're playing tennis in high school or against somebody in your neighborhood or something like that, almost always the way to win that match is to just have fewer unforced errors. Just keep the ball in play, keep going until your opponent makes a mistake. And so in that case, avoiding failure is actually the best path to win. However, at the high level, you know, if you're playing in your Roger Federer or Serena Williams or something, the pros have to play to win. They can't play to not lose because their opponent will keep the ball and play all day long. And so I think it's worth asking yourself, at what level am I playing? And, you know, what am I actually working on here? In a lot of cases, you can make a great deal of progress by avoiding mistakes, but when you're at the top of your field, you often have to play to win. And so there's a strategic side of this. But then there's also the question of, like, do positive reinforcements or negative reinforcements work? The answer is yes, but I think positive is better in the long run.
- [10:50]
Neal Freyman
Sorry to take us off, Toby's. Coaching, personal coaching track. But accountability. Accountability partners are another popular mech mechanism for forming a habit where you rely on the peer pressure of someone else to keep you on track. Do you believe in accountability partners? And is there ever a world in which they could become a crutch in a bad way?
- [11:11]
James Clear
So the short answer is, yes, I believe in them, But I actually think that they are much more common than they realize, and they take a much different shape than. Than we realize. And they for sure work in both positive and negative ways. The way that I would describe this, you know, most people think about an accountability partner, and they think about, like, actually sign up with a group or enlisting a friend to, you know, keep track of whether they did their workout or something. I would say if we just broaden this a little bit to say, what is the social dynamic? And how do. So how does your social environment influence your habits? The answer is in a great and very meaningful way. So we are all part of multiple groups. Some of those groups are large, like what it means to be American. Some of those groups are small, like what it means to be a neighbor on your street or a member of the local CrossFit gym. And all of these groups, large and small, they have an influence on your behavior and habits. And when actions are aligned with the expectations of the group with, like, the social norms, habits are pretty attractive. And the social environment will really help, like, usher you along. And when habits go against the grain of the expectations of the group, when they kind of add a little bit of friction between you and your social relationships, that's a form of accountability, too, sometimes, not always the kind that you want. And habits will be very hard to build. And ultimately, this comes back to one of the, like, deepest human needs that we all have, which is a desire to bond and connect. You know, we all, we're humans, are social creatures. We all want to be a part of something, even if it's just your little family unit. And so if people have to decide between, you know, I have habits that I don't really love, but I fit in, I belong, I'm part of something, or I have the habits that I want to have, but I'm cast out, I'm ostracized, I'm criticized a lot of the time. The desire to belong will overpower the desire to improve. And so, as best as possible, you need to get those two things aligned. And I think the punchline is you want to join groups where your desired behavior is the normal behavior. Because if it's normal, in that group, then it's going to be really motivating to stick to it.
- [13:17]
Neal Freyman
Yeah. So if your New Year's resolution is to drink less, then maybe you want to stop hanging out with people who drink a lot and start hanging out with people who go camping on the weekends.
- [13:27]
James Clear
I mean, you could do it, but you're just playing the game on hard mode, you know, and it's like, it's so much easier if you're surrounded by people who have the habits that you want to have, and then you can rise together. This is something that I talk about in Atomic Habits. There's a chapter called the Secret to Self Control. And one of the surprising things about a lot of the research regarding willpower is that when you look at people, elite athletes or someone who, you know, you aspire to be like, and you think, oh, if I just had the discipline that had. Or I just had the willpower they have. Certainly people can have varying levels of willpower, but the primary finding from a lot of this research is that the people who appear to have great willpower are the people who are tempted less frequently. And so they are the benefits of favorable situations. Sometimes they're just lucky, but sometimes it's a situation they design. And I always think that's an interesting way to think about it. If you. In the long run, your willpower will almost never beat your environment. And so it's up to you to design an environment and hang out with a set of people and put yourself in situations that serve the habits that you want to build rather than hinder them.
- [14:34]
Neal Freyman
Speaking of your book, Atomic Habits, it came out five years ago at this point. So is there anything in there that you've changed your mind about or anything that you've learned recently that you wish you could put in there?
- [14:45]
James Clear
Yeah, there. Well, there are two things that I wish I would have either emphasized more or added. And actually, we've touched on both of them briefly. So the first. First thing that I didn't write about that I wish I would have is what would your habits look like if they were fun and finding the version of the habit that is most genuinely appealing to you in a lot of ways, I feel like that is, like, maybe the most enormous hurdle to cross. Because if you're genuinely interested in a habit, there are, like, endless ways to improve it. But if you're not actually interested, if you're just kind of forcing the issue or making yourself do it, even the obvious improvements are going to feel like a chore. So that's the first Thing. The second thing is I talked about the influence of family and friends on your habits and how that can kind of shape things. But I think I undersold the importance of social environment. If you're. If you look at habits that really last, like, in some cases, years or even decades, like, let's say I walk outside my home in the summer and I see my neighbor mowing their grass, I might think, oh, I need to cut the grass, too. And, like, you'll stick to that habit of mowing your lawn for 5, 10, 30 years, however long you live in the house. And, like, we wish we had that level of consistency with a lot of our other habits. And it's like, why do you do it? Partially, you do it because it feels good to have a clean lawn, but mostly it feels good to have a clean lawn because you want to be judged by the people in the neighborhood for being the sloppy one. And so it's actually the social expectation, the social norm for what it means to be a neighbor on your street that helps get that habit to stick. And so many of our habits are socially driven like that. So those are the two things that I wish I would have emphasized more.
- [16:19]
Neal Freyman
So maybe if my goal is to read a lot this year, the first thing I should do is create a goodreads account, because then my. My entire, you know, reading history will be online, and I'll be judged by my peers about whether I hit my goal or not.
- [16:33]
James Clear
Sure. So that's one way to do it. You know, picking two friends that are also interested in reading and starting a book club is another way to do it. You don't even have to start one. Like, you could just join one that's already going. There are. There are tons, tons of ways to be part of that. You know, start browsing, browsing subreddits with people who love books and just, like, engage there and leave comments. And then now you're kind of, like, surrounded by other people who are reading and feel like you have a little bit of momentum there. There are many ways to do it, but the core idea is, like, how can I build connection with people who already have the habits I want to have? And the more that those people start to become your friends or start to populate your thoughts, the more that you're going to feel compelled to do those things as well.
- [17:12]
Toby Howell
This is just making me reconsider each other. Because we spend so much time with each other hosting these daily podcasts, we better rub off in each other in the best ways. Neil, so you mentioned Social media a little bit in that last answer. And I want to talk about your social media account. Your profile picture is someone, it might be you looking up at this seemingly infinite ice wall or glacier. Is nature kind of one of those things that helps put things into perspective for you? How does nature kind of fit into your philosophy and outlook on life?
- [17:43]
James Clear
That's interesting. Yeah, I think to a large degree many of the themes and concepts I write about originated in nature or you could be inspired from them there. Like, if you think about building habits or making positive change, what we're talking about is some kind of transformation or evolution. And of course, you know, evolution is this huge driving force in nature. And so there, there's a lot of inspiration and crossover there as far as, like, what my profile picture is and why I chose that. I have very odd social media accounts, you know, like, I never show my face. My Instagram account is just like blocks of text and, you know, different quotes and sayings. It's a very strange feed, but my, my way of thinking about it is like, I don't really care about being front and center. I want the ideas to be front and center and I want a brand that's known by name, not by face. So like Calvin Klein or Kate Spade or something like that. Like, you know, some people might know what Calvin Klein looks like, but the vast major people know the name but not the face. And I think that's fine. Like, James Clear can be like that too. And I also feel like it's a useful handicap, you know, like, I always think I. I don't have anything to hide behind. Like, it's just the ideas. So they better be good because otherwise people are going to stop paying attention.
- [18:53]
Toby Howell
We'll be back with more James Clear right after this break.
- [18:58]
D
This episode is brought to you by Google Gemini. With the Gemini app, you can talk live and have a real time conversation with an AI assistant. It's great for all kinds of things, like if you want to practice for an upcoming interview, ask for advice on things to do in a new city, or brainstorm creative ideas. And by the way, this script was actually read by Gemini. Download the Gemini app for iOS and Android today. Must be 18 + to use Gemini Live.
- [19:24]
Toby Howell
Neil, you've had the chance to work with plenty of strong leaders in your career. What traits do you think are the most important?
- [19:30]
Neal Freyman
In my experience, a few things do stand out, like leading by example, taking risks, and being passionate.
- [19:36]
Toby Howell
And for all those influential leaders out there, there's the Range Rover Sport.
- [19:40]
Neal Freyman
That's definitely A match made in heaven.
- [19:42]
Toby Howell
Each model strikes an ideal balance between on road performance and world renowned off road capability of sophisticated refinement and visceral power. And you can build a Range Rover Sport that matches your leadership style at Range Rover Sport. At land Rover USA.com that's Land Rover USA.com you have talked to lots of different Fortune 500 companies. Capital one, Cisco G, Honda, the list goes on. What do these Fortune 500 companies want to know? What are they looking for from you? The quote unquote habit guy?
- [20:21]
James Clear
They're looking for the same thing everybody else is looking for, which is consistency. You know, most of the time they know the things that they want their team to do. They're just trying to get them to do them more frequently. So you know, we all, I think we all could do this. If you were going to just do like a classic 8020 analysis on your job. You're going to write down everything that you do and then we're going to draw a line at the top 20% and you're not allowed to do the bottom 80% of tasks. But if you really crush it on the top 80% if you like, or top 20% if you just totally knock it out of the park, you probably still have a job because those are the things that really move the needle. We all sort of implicitly know what some of those things are. And all these companies are the same way, like they know what really matter. And so what they're trying to do is to get their team there. You know, I'll speak to 800 salespeople or their top 300 executives or something like that. They're trying to get people to direct their attention towards those things more and to do them more consistently.
- [21:17]
Neal Freyman
Is setting goals for others like you would do in a business environment, similar to setting goals for yourself? Or is there different calculus that you would need to take?
- [21:26]
James Clear
At some root level it is the same, but I do think there are some meaningful differences. The primary difference is that when you set goals for yourself, you're the one who's setting them and you're the one who's in control. In business, often as the executive or as the leader or whatever, you're setting goals for a bunch of other people who didn't choose that goal and then are asked to, you know, fall through on it. And that often does not go well because people want to be in control of their time and attention and, you know, energy and so on. I think the key in either case is that it's really Helpful to be able to draw a through line from the goal that you're asking people to follow to the type of person that you're asking them to be and how it serves them. So in the individual case, I call this identity based habits. And the core idea is that you don't start by asking yourself, what do I wish to achieve? You start by asking yourself, who do I wish to become? And by focusing on the type of identity that you want to build and the type of person that you're hoping to become, you can see how your habits are reinforcing a particular action. So, for example, rather than worrying about like, oh, I want to lose 30 pounds in the next six months, you focus on building the identity of, I'm the type of person who doesn't miss workouts. Now, in the team context, this becomes a little broader because often when we talk about identity in a business, we're talking about, like, what is the culture? And so you need to be really clear about who are we and what are we trying to achieve. And if you can get people to buy into that vision or that shared identity, then it becomes a little easier if you can connect the goal to that and you can say, hey, listen, we all said that we're in on this. We all said we want to become this. Here's how these goals kind of feed in to that bigger picture. So I think that helps with some alignment. There's one more thing that I want to mention that I think is particularly important with business goals and just driving results in business, which is getting incentives aligned. And this is one of the trickiest things with companies, because incentives are hard. But there's this story that illustrates, I think, this well. So in the early 90s, somewhere around that time frame, Boeing, the airplane manufacturer, the story is that they were switching from manually driven planes, manually driven wings by the pilots, to software driven. And on the first test flight where they were going to test this software, they required that the engineers who designed the software be on the flight. And partially there was a reason for that. Like, you know, they're going to test things out, they may adjust some things on the fly and so on. I wanted to see how the system responded. But also I always think, like, man, better get it right. You know, like, what a beautiful alignment of incentives. The person who designs the thing, their neck is on the line too. And I think if we ask ourselves honestly, are the incentives that cleanly aligned in most of our businesses or institutions, a lot of the time, the answer is no. I always think you should Ask yourself, like, first, who is doing the work? Who reaps the rewards? Who bears the consequences? And when the incentives are aligned, it's often the same person for all three. And when there's any incentives are misaligned, somebody else is doing the work, somebody else is bearing the consequences, and somebody else is reaping the rewards. And so, as best as possible, you need to figure out ways to get the incentives aligned. And people will naturally want to do things that serve them and avoid things that punish them.
- [24:42]
Neal Freyman
That reminds me, it's kind of curious why Jeff Bezos goes up in his company's rocket but Elon Musk doesn't.
- [24:47]
Toby Howell
Oh, interesting, Neil. He's trying to start something.
- [24:50]
Neal Freyman
All right, James, we. You are pretty smart, but I assume that not all of your ideas, this just kind of sprang out of your head one day. Who are some of the people, writers, thinkers that have been a source of inspiration for you?
- [25:02]
James Clear
Oh, man, there are literally hundreds. I actually keep a list of sources on my website, so if you have James clear dot com. Thanks. It's like a thank you page to all the people that have been various inspirations and sources of ideas to me. I. It would be impossible to list everybody there. You know, hundreds of sources in atomic habits alone. And. And I feel like I'm always looking. I don't even really read books anymore. I kind of, like, read chapters or read sentences. Like, I'm just, like, looking for a little bit of insight where I'm like, oh, I really like how that was phrased, or, oh, I really like how the way that they unpack that maybe I can take that and make it my own or use that in some way. So pretty much everything that I share, two things are true. The first is pretty much everything is a reminder to myself. So, like, I struggle with all this stuff too. And it's just a way of me trying to pull myself back to center. And then the second thing is almost nothing that I share is something that I originally thought of. I feel like my value is that I try to put it in a way that it's easy to understand and easy to apply, but the idea is almost all originated elsewhere. And I think we have this somewhat incorrect view of creativity, that creativity is origination, that it is like the creation of something from nothing. But actually, I think almost every form of creativity is synthesis. It is the connecting of ideas that were previously unconnected. It is the sharing of something that has already been out there, but has never quite been put that way or has never quite been delivered in that fashion and that I feel like is my job is to come across the very best ideas I can and then to deliver them in a way where you think, you know what, I always have kind of felt that, but I just didn't have the way to the language for it or. I've always believed that or seen that in my life too, but I've never heard it put that way. And if I can do that and try to deliver ideas in a more useful or a more actionable or practical fashion, then I feel like that is a lot of value and I'm happy to play that role. And other people can play different roles.
- [27:04]
Toby Howell
That's our job too, actually, at Morning Brew. That's we are synthesizers of information. So that definitely preaching to the choir there. All right, I'm sure for our final question of the day, there's someone out there right now who is debating whether to follow through on their newly minted New Year's resolution. Maybe they're deciding whether to go to the gym right now. What would you say to them to get them on track to start the year off right?
- [27:32]
James Clear
So two things. One big picture, one tactical. So big picture. A lot of the time I feel like the two best time frames to focus on are 10 years or one hour, you know, so like 10 years is think about any big meaningful thing in your life that you'd like to achieve. Creating a successful marriage, raising kids that you're proud of, getting in the best shape of your life, launching a successful business, finishing a book. Like whatever it is, it's probably like a multi year thing. And so you can keep that big picture 10 year vision in your mind and then scale it down to one hour. What can I do in the next hour that moves me toward where I want to be 10 years from now? And if you can do that, then I think you start to see how small changes can really add up. How these small actions day in and day out and can accumulate into something meaningful. And it really doesn't take much to feel good about yourself or to feel like it's moving forward. You know, like all you really need is five good minutes. Five good minutes of exercise can reset your mood for the day. Five good minutes of conversation can restore a relationship that's been shattered or has been, you know, fragmented. Five good minutes of writing can make you feel like the manuscripts moving forward again. So it doesn't take much. So that's the big picture view 10 years or one hour. And then the tactical thing is utilize what I call the two minute rule. So very simple, just says, take your habits and scale it down to something that takes two minutes or less to do. So read 30 books a year becomes read one page or do yoga four days a week becomes Take out my yoga mat. And. And sometimes I mention this and people resist a little bit, you know, But I had this reader, this guy named Mitch, mentioned in Atomic Habits and he started going to the gym and he's lost over £100 now. Kept it off for more than a decade. And when he first started going for the first six weeks, he had this strange little rule where he wasn't allowed to stay for longer than five minutes. So get in the car, drive to the gym, get out, do half an exercise, get back in the car, drive home. And it sounds ridiculous. You know, it sounds silly, like this is obviously not going to work work. But what you realize is he was mastering the art of showing up. And this is this deep truth about habits that people often overlook. Which is a habit must be established before it can be improved. You know, it has to become the standard in your life before you can scale it up and turn into something more. You need to standardize before you optimize. So I'm reminded of that quote from Ed Lattimore where he says the heaviest weight at the gym is the front door. Like there are a lot of things in life that are like that, that. So think about the big 10 year vision. Scale it down to the next hour or five minutes or two minutes. Make it as small as possible and cast some little vote. Make some little action today that moves you toward that big picture view that you have for the future.
- [30:11]
Toby Howell
James, thank you so much for joining us. I can't imagine listening to you speak and not wanting to become the absolute best version of yourself possible. So I hope everyone listening at home feels the same. If you want more of James, you can find his book Atomic Habits, his habit journal, and his newsletter@james clear.com or on social at James Clear.
- [30:31]
James Clear
Thanks guys. Appreciate it.
- [30:32]
Neal Freyman
Thanks James.
- [30:39]
Toby Howell
Wait, wait. Before you go, Neil has one more thing to tell you.
- [30:43]
Neal Freyman
It's time to come clean. Hosting Morning Brew Daily isn't my only job.
- [30:48]
Toby Howell
Wait, are you Batman?
- [30:49]
Neal Freyman
No. When I'm not here sitting next to Toby, I'm also the executive editor of Morning Brews, free daily newsletter. If you love the pod, you'll love the newsletter. Not only does it give you your daily dose of news, but it also has crosswords and trivia and jokes written by people way funnier than me and Toby.
- [31:05]
Toby Howell
I hate to admit it, but it's true. I read it every day and I think you all will love adding it to your routine as well.
- [31:11]
Neal Freyman
Subscribe now at Morning Broadcom or head to the link in the Show Notes.