Jimmy Kimmel seeks to smooth tensions and takes aim at Trump in first show since ABC suspension

Summary

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Morning Joe – September 24, 2025

“Jimmy Kimmel seeks to smooth tensions and takes aim at Trump in first show since ABC suspension”

Hosts: Joe Scarborough, Mika Brzezinski, Willie Geist
Notable Guests: Mike Barnacle, Donny Deutsch, David Ignatius, Katie K.
Episode Focus: Analyzing Jimmy Kimmel's emotional return after suspension, the wider implications for free speech and late night comedy, and President Trump’s shifting posture on Russia and Ukraine at the UN.

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1. Overview of Main Theme

This Morning Joe episode centers on two major stories:

• Jimmy Kimmel's return to ABC following his show’s suspension after controversial remarks related to Charlie Kirk’s assassination, and his pointed monologue defending free speech while criticizing the Trump administration’s attempts to silence dissenting comedians.
• President Trump’s unexpected pivot on Russia’s war in Ukraine, signaling support for Ukrainian victory and advocating a tougher stance on Russia at the United Nations.

Both segments are discussed through the lens of American freedoms, the role of government, bipartisan responses, and the evolving dynamic of political and cultural leadership.

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2. Key Discussion Points and Insights

A) Jimmy Kimmel’s Return & Free Speech Debate

Kimmel’s Monologue Highlights:

• Kimmel opens with self-deprecating humor about his suspension and Disney’s corporate heft, pivots to a serious reflection on the role of comedians and freedom of expression:
  • “A government threat to silence a comedian the president doesn't like is anti-American.” (Jimmy Kimmel, 01:50)

Thanking Unlikely Defenders:

• He notably thanks right-leaning figures who defended his right to speak (Ben Shapiro, Ted Cruz, Mitch McConnell, etc.), despite disagreeing politically:
  • “Even though I don’t agree with many of those people...it takes courage for them to speak out against this administration. They did, and they deserve credit for it.” (Jimmy Kimmel, 06:19)

Apology & Clarification on Controversial Remarks:

• Expresses remorse for any perceived insensitivity regarding Kirk’s assassination, clarifies his intent:
  • “It was never my intention to make light of the murder of a young man... I get why you’re upset. If the situation was reversed, there's a good chance I would have felt the same way.” (Jimmy Kimmel, 08:36; 49:34)

Acknowledgment of TV’s Broader Role:

• Stresses the importance of shows like his for democracy—not about his own career, but about keeping airwaves open for dissent.
• “What's important is that shows like these can be on the air...mocking politicians and people in power all the time without the fear of being taken off the air.” (Joe Scarborough, 11:11)

Erica Kirk’s Forgiveness as Moral Guideline:

• References Erica Kirk’s act of forgiving her husband’s killer as an example of grace and what America should emulate. (Jimmy Kimmel, 10:06)

Panel Takeaways:

• Cross-ideological unity: “This is not Republican against Democrat...This is big government versus the people.” (Joe Scarborough, 12:39)
• Legacy of late night: Late night hosts have always ridiculed sitting presidents, left and right alike, without government retaliation (Joe Scarborough, 14:27–15:25).
• The public and bipartisan backlash against silencing Kimmel demonstrates enduring support for free speech. (Joe Scarborough, 51:04; Mike Barnacle, 52:44)

B) Trump’s Shift on Ukraine and Russia

Trump’s New Stance:

• Trump now asserts Ukraine could defeat Russia with sufficient EU support and encourages NATO countries to shoot down Russian aircraft violating their airspace— a sharp turn from his earlier talk of territorial concessions. (Mike Barnacle, 24:52)
  • “Ukraine would be able to take back their country in its original form, and who knows, maybe even go further than that.” (Trump statement cited, 24:52)
  • “If Russia sends aircraft or drones over your land, shoot them down.” (Summarized, 28:21)

Analysis & Skepticism:

• Panelists note European leaders are whiplashed and cautiously hopeful but await actual policy follow-through.
  • “Donald's policy has needed consistency and organization from the beginning…If he follows through on what he said yesterday, this war is going to have a different trajectory.” (David Ignatius, 28:29)
• Skepticism remains over whether this rhetoric will translate into increased U.S. aid or long-term support for Ukraine. (Jonathan Lemire, 34:12)
  • “With Trump, the key is to watch what he does, not what he says.” (Jonathan Lemire, 35:23)
  • European leaders learn to flatter Trump to secure support—deals with the U.S. are “run through that ego, through the flattery.” (Donny Deutsch, 46:33)

C) Media Business Context & Trump’s Reaction

• Several ABC affiliates (Nextar, Sinclair) did not air Kimmel’s return, potentially due to pending business deals requiring FCC approval, highlighting the political-economic intersections. (Mike Barnacle, 15:25)
• Trump responded on Truth Social, calling Kimmel’s show an “illegal campaign contribution,” threatening legal action—a move widely ridiculed by the panel. (Mike Barnacle, 15:50; Joe Scarborough, 16:44)
  • “At what point does he understand this only makes him look like a loser?” (Joe Scarborough, 16:44)

D) Cultural & Personal Reflections

• Panel reminisces about the tradition of presidents being roasted: “Never once did these Republicans or Democrats ever even think of suggesting they’d be taken off the air.” (Joe Scarborough, 20:19)
• Anecdotes highlight contrasts—George W. Bush famously laughed at Will Ferrell’s SNL impersonations at his own library event. (Donny Deutsch, 21:01)

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3. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Kimmel:
  • “A government threat to silence a comedian the president doesn't like is anti-American.” (01:50)
  • “If Ted Cruz can’t speak freely, then he can’t cast spells on the Smurfs.” (Jimmy Kimmel, 06:19 – humor)
  • “The president of the United States made it very clear he wants to see me and the hundreds of people who work here fired from our jobs. Our leader celebrates Americans losing their livelihoods because he can't take a joke.” (09:13)
  • “If you believe in the teachings of Jesus, as I do, there it was. A selfless act of grace, forgiveness from a grieving widow. It touched me deeply, and I hope it touches many.” (10:06)
• Scarborough:
  • “This is not about left wing against right wing. This is big government versus the people.” (12:39)
• Ignatius:
  • “Trump senses weakness more than any politician I can think of. And my sense is that he feels that Russia is weakening.” (29:36)
• Jonathan Lemire:
  • “If there was a pan-European word for whiplash, it would have been used a lot yesterday.” (34:12)
• Mike Barnacle:
  • “Freedom of speech is the core of the United States of America.” (52:44)
• Donny Deutsch:
  • “Maybe what I said was poorly timed …but what we shouldn’t be debating is whether or not the President, United States or the federal government can use its power to shut down voices it disagrees with.” (54:20)
• On presidential character:
  • “Every president has an ego, but this is something completely different where you have to run it through that ego, through the flattery…” (Donny Deutsch, 46:33)

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4. Timestamps for Key Segments

• Jimmy Kimmel’s Monologue (Kimmel returns, apologizes, defends free speech):
  • 01:03, 05:23, 08:36, 09:30, 10:06, 47:52, 49:34
• Panel Breakdown of Free Speech/Bipartisan Defense:
  • 11:09, 12:53, 14:27, 51:04
• Trump’s Social Media Response to Kimmel:
  • 15:50, 16:44
• Comparison to Late Night Treatment of Past Presidents:
  • 18:02, 20:19, 21:01
• Trump’s Policy Shift on Ukraine (from appeasement to support):
  • 24:52, 26:09, 28:29, 29:36, 32:14, 34:12, 35:49, 37:07
• How EU leaders “manage” Trump:
  • 43:28, 44:28, 45:59, 46:33
• Reflection on Kimmel’s Message and Broader Implications:
  • 52:44, 54:20

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5. Tone and Style

The tone blended sharp critique, wry humor, and earnest reflection, mirroring both Kimmel’s and the hosts’ approaches. The conversation oscillated from biting satire about political overreach to sincere musings on forgiveness, bipartisanship, and the foundational role of free speech.

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6. Conclusion

This Morning Joe episode used Jimmy Kimmel’s dramatic late night return and President Trump’s policy flip-flop to engage in a larger debate about American values—chiefly the importance of free speech in democracy, the dangers of government overreach, and the power of cross-partisan solidarity in defending those ideals. The discussion was rich with historical perspective, humor, skepticism toward power, and a palpable sense of what’s at stake for American public life when entertainment, politics, and civic responsibility intersect.

Transcript

[Joe Scarborough]

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[Jimmy Kimmel]

He tried, did his best to cancel me. Instead, he forced millions of people to watch the show. That backfired bigly. He might have to release the Epstein files to distract us from this. Now, Disney has asked me to read the following statement and I agreed to do it. Here we go. To reactivate your Disney and Hugo account. We talked it through and at the end, even though they didn't have to, they really didn't have to. This is a giant company. We have short attention spans and I am a tiny part of the Disney Corporation. They welcomed me back on the air and I thank them for that. Look, I never imagined I would be in a situation like this. I barely paid attention in school. But one thing I did learn from Lenny Bruce and George Car is that a government threat to silence a comedian the president doesn't like is anti American. That's anti American.

[Mike Barnacle]

Some of Jimmy Kimmel's monologue last night, returning to ABC for the first time since his show was pulled off the air last week. We'll have much more from last night's highly anticipated show. We'll also go through a big day at the United nations with President Trump taking a notable pivot on Russia's war in Ukraine.

[Joe Scarborough]

Boy, that was notable.

[Mike Barnacle]

A big one. Washington Post David Ignatius and the BBC's Katie K. Are standing by with their analysis on this big change. Also ahead this morning, former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton will be our guest and will be joined by Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer as the deadline to fund the government is now less than a week away.

[Joe Scarborough]

And of course, when Chuck Schumer is here. Willie, the first thing we're going to be forced to talk about is the New York Yankees.

[Mike Barnacle]

Oh, really?

[Joe Scarborough]

One game out now.

[Mike Barnacle]

I mean, we don't have to.

[Donny Deutsch]

You're doing some good work up there in Boston, doing God's. Helping yourself against the Blue Jays.

[Mike Barnacle]

All right?

[Joe Scarborough]

Yep.

[Donny Deutsch]

And helping your brothers, the New York Yankees. Yankees now one game out of the division league.

[Joe Scarborough]

Isn't that something?

[Donny Deutsch]

Behind the Blue Jays for all the hand wringing, for all the fire, Boom. The Yankees are one game out of the best record in the America.

[Joe Scarborough]

And what have I said all along?

[Donny Deutsch]

They're going to the World Series.

[Joe Scarborough]

And what are they going to do there?

[Donny Deutsch]

It's swept by the Dodgers.

[Joe Scarborough]

They're getting. Nope. They're going to win in five games. They're going to win five games. Look at that, though. No, it's got. It's. This is so exc. It's like one of these rare times where every game matters. And for us, we're actually looking at the Tigers and Cleveland. Yeah, the Tigers, really. I mean, they lose a 15, 16 game. I like. I've always liked Detroit. I feel so bad for them. So I have friends who are big Cleveland fans and are just beyond themselves. This is. This is crazy. But this last week for the wild card, you know, you've got the Red Sox fighting, you've got Cleveland fighting, you got the Tigers fighting, You got Houston fighting. Houston lost last night. I mean, it's crazy. It can go any way.

[Donny Deutsch]

Yeah. I mean, the Tigers were dominant all season in that division, have lost seven in a row, and they are now the wild card team. The Guardians own the tiebreaker. The Guardians now are in first place. Just a stunning turn, but right here you see Yankees in good shape, Red Sox, Tigers, Astros fighting for two spots. Somebody's going to get left out.

[Joe Scarborough]

Yeah, exactly.

[Mike Barnacle]

Okay.

[Joe Scarborough]

Very exciting. Nick, would you like talk any more about baseball?

[Mike Barnacle]

Know how you know all this stuff? Just what, what happens to you? Okay, moving on.

[Joe Scarborough]

Jimmy, live outside of politics, I don't sit and watch TV all day. Go, like, I could do that if you'd like me to, but I'm not. Well, no, I won't do that.

[Mike Barnacle]

A lot of people were watching TV late, late, late last night. That's where we begin our news this morning. Jimmy Kimmel Live returned to late night lineup last night, nearly one week after ABC pulled the show off the air amid controversy over Kimmel's comments about the assassination of Charlie Kirk. In an emotional opening monologue, Kimmel addressed the remarks that led to his suspension while fiercely defending free speech, criticizing the Trump administration over what he called anti American attacks on the First Amendment, and thanking those who supported him.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Maybe most of all, I want to thank the people who don't support my show and what I believe, but support my right to share those beliefs anyway, who I never would have imagined.

[Katie K]

Like.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Ben Shapiro, Clay Travis, Candace Owens, Mitch McConnell, Rand Paul, even my old pal Ted Cruz, who, believe it or not, said something very beautiful on my behalf. I hate what Jimmy Kimmel said. I am thrilled that he was fired. Oh, wait, no, not that. The other part. But let me tell you, if the government gets in the business of saying.

[Joe Scarborough]

Well, we can't say what you, the.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Media have said, we're going to ban you from the airwaves if you don't say what we like, that will end up bad for conservatives.

[Joe Scarborough]

Bad.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

I don't think I've ever said this before, but Ted Cruz is right. He's absolutely right. All of us, including him. I mean, think about it. If Ted Cruz can't speak freely, then he can't cast spells on the Smurfs. Even though I don't agree with many of those people on most subjects, some of the things they say even make me want to throw up. It takes courage for them to speak out against this administration. They did, and they deserve credit for it. And thanks for telling your followers that our government cannot be allowed to control what we do and do not say on television and that we have to stand up to it. I've been hearing a lot about what I need to say and do tonight, and the truth is, I don't think what I have to say is going to make much of a difference. If you like me, you like me. If you don't, you don't. I have no illusions about changing anyone's mind. But I do want to make something clear because it's important to me as a human. And that is, you understand that it was never my intention to make light of the murder of a young man. I don't. I don't think there's anything funny about it. I posted a message on Instagram of the day he was killed, sending love to his family and asking for compassion. And I meant it, and I still do. Nor was it my intention to blame any specific group for the actions of what it was, obviously a deeply disturbed individual. That was really the opposite of the point I was trying to make. But I understand that to some that felt either ill timed or unclear or maybe both. And for those who think I did point A finger. I get why you're upset. If the situation was reversed, there's a good chance I'd have felt the same way. I have many friends and family members on the other side who I love and remain close to, even though we don't agree on politics at all. I don't think the murderer who shot Charlie Kirk represents anyone. This was a sick person who believed violence was a solution, and it isn't. This show is not important. What is important is that we get to live in a country that allows us to have a show like this. I've had the opportunity to meet and spend time with comedians and talk show hosts from countries like Russia, countries in the Middle east who told me they would get thrown in prison for making fun of those in power. And worse than being thrown in prison, they know how lucky we are here. Our freedom to speak is what they admire most about this country. And that's something I'm embarrassed to say I took for granted until they pulled my friend Stephen off the air and tried to coerce the affiliates who run our show in the cities that you live in to take my show. That's not legal. That's not American. That is un American. The President of the United States made it very clear he wants to see me and the hundreds of people who work here fired from our jobs. Our leader celebrates Americans losing their livelihoods because he can't take a joke.

[Joe Scarborough]

He was.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Somehow able to squeeze Colbert out of cbs. Then he turned his sights on me, and now he's openly rooting for NBC to fire Jimmy Fallon and Seth Meyers and the hundreds of Americans who work for their shows who don't make millions of dollars. And I hope that if that happens or if there's even any hint of that happening, you will be 10 times as loud as you were this week. We have to speak out against this.

[Joe Scarborough]

There was.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

A moment over weekend, a very beautiful moment. I don't know if you saw this on Sunday. Erica Kirk forgave the man who shot her husband. She forgave him. That is an example we should follow. If you believe in the teachings of Jesus, as I do, there it was. That's. That's it. A selfless act of grace, forgiveness from a grieving widow. It touched me deeply, and I hope it touches many. And if there's anything we should take from this tragedy to carry forward, I hope it can be that and not this.

[Joe Scarborough]

That was beautiful. And in parts, biting in parts. It was a really strong message. That guy used to be the host of the Man Show. By the way.

[Donny Deutsch]

Trampolines and pitchers of beer.

[Joe Scarborough]

That was a long time ago. Yeah, exactly. That was a long time ago. But there were a couple things I loved about what he said. One was this is not an important show. He said it's not about this show. What's important is that shows like these can be on the air. Right. And, you know, 10 years, 20 years from now, somebody else will be in that position, just like we had Carson and we had Letterman. But it's having those sort of shows that can mock politicians and people in power all the time without the fear of being taken off the air. That was beautiful. I love what he said about Erica Kirk there. And I also loved, really loved, him talking about Republicans that he disagreed with in almost every issue. And it was framed perfectly. And what this last week has shown is, and I hope some other Republicans can start thinking this way, this is not Republican against Democrat in so many of these cases. It's not left wing against right wing. It's none of those things. This is big government versus the people. This is a centralized state versus individual rights. And there have been times, and we've talked about it over the past decade, where the left has seemed to not care as much about that. There have been times that the right has not seemed to care as much about that. But in this case, the left and the right came together, a lot of them did, to say, wait a second, we can object to the speech, but government stay away from what we watch. It's none of your business. And especially if it's political speech, which is the most sacred, protected speech in the First Amendment.

[Donny Deutsch]

Yeah, I mean, there's a lot to digest there. And what Jimmy Kimmel said last night, which was said very well, I agree with you. First of all, I think he was good to highlight Erica Kirk's message at the service the other day, which was of grace and mercy and forgiveness. I hope some others will adopt that, because it was in stark contrast to the message a lot of other people on that stage delivered, unfortunately. Another point to make, Jimmy Kimmel, whether you like him politically or you think he's funny or not, is objectively a good guy. And that comes from everybody who's worked with him, everybody who knows him, from his staff, the people around him. He, as you said last night, was not and never would mock the murder of Charlie Kirk or anyone. Were his comments in poor taste? Were they poorly timed? That's up to the audience to decide. Perhaps they were, as he even conceded last night. But I think his message and the Larger message that many of us will take from this is these things we take for granted that comedians can mock people in power. In fact, why they exist is to mock people in power from those positions in late night TV or stand up St we assumed would always be there until it was challenged over these last several months with Stephen Colbert and has to be fought for. And I think Jimmy was right to commend the support of the people who love him, but also the people like Ted Cruz who don't love him. And that was a very, and I know it was a minority and it was a small group of Republicans, but Ted Cruz's voice was very important in this story.

[Joe Scarborough]

When you're the most powerful person in the United States Senate on this issue and the Commerce Department. Yeah, Commerce Committee. Yeah, that's an important voice. That's not a backbencher, just trying to grab a headline. It actually matters. And you look at all of it and you look at the fact that what he does is what Johnny Carson did, what David Letterman did, what Stephen Colbert's done, what Jack Par did, what all of these late night comedians have done, what Saturday Night Live has done. They have ridiculed unmercifully presidents in the past. I mean Bill Clinton, my God, I mean George W. Bush. David Letterman had a gag on George W. Bush every single night. It was. But, but again, the right for people to laugh at that, it seems to me extraordinarily important.

[Mike Barnacle]

Yeah. And many households across America were unable to watch Kimmel's return last night. Nextar and Sinclair, two major TV station own partners who together account for roughly 70 ABC affiliates in the US continued to preempt the late night show despite Disney bringing it back nationally. Both groups are also pursuing major business moves that would require FCC approval. Sinclair is exploring merger options while Nexstar is trying to close a $6.2 billion merger with another big station owner, Tegna. Meanwhile, about an hour before last night's broadcast, President Trump took to social media to rail against Kimmel's return and issue a threat to abc. The President posted in part, quote, the White House was told by ABC that his show was canceled. Kimmel is yet another arm of the dnc and to the best of my knowledge, that would be a major illegal campaign contribution. I think we're going to test ABC out on this. Let's see how we do. Last time I went after them, they gave me $16 million. This one sounds even more lucrative.

[Joe Scarborough]

Well, you know, the last time they gave $16 million, there were attorneys on both sides saying this could go either way. Nobody would say that banning a late night host or trying to ban a late night host actually would again, be a proper way to go forward. I just wonder how many of these lawsuits that get thrown out is he gonna do. At what point does he understand this only makes him look like a loser?

[Katie K]

His appetite for these seemed pretty endless right now.

[Joe Scarborough]

Yeah, I mean, New York Times thrown out. Thrown out because of a stupid, stupid, I don't know, 80, 90 page pleading, calling Donald Trump, basically everything short of his majesty. I mean, how much longer? How much longer were the threats?

[Katie K]

Yeah, the judge in that case noted that the actual complaint didn't come till page 80 of that thing. And he threw the whole thing out. He said it was nonsense and a waste of time. I mean, this you would think would be too. But I think the underlying message here is, first of all, per my reporting, no one at ABC communicated to the White House the show was canceled. That simply, it was off the air indefinitely. That was the statement that ABC put out publicly. You know, we don't know if there's a private conversation the President's alluding to, but certainly we have not uncovered that that was.

[Joe Scarborough]

Where does this come? He grew up watching late night comedians make fun of Richard Nixon. He grew up watching late night comedians make fun of Jimmy Carter, make fun of Ronald Reagan. Just unmercifully made fun of Ronald Reagan for eight years. Made fun of George H.W. bush. I could go to Bill Clinton. My God, he himself made fun of people. You know, that has happened every year over the past half century, of course. So why does he think that things change today for him? They don't.

[Katie K]

No, they don't. David Letterman gave an interview the other day in which he noted he went after every president while he was in office. Republican while he was in his job, Republican or Democrat, no one once tried to stop him. They complained, of course, they publicly joked about it, but no one even lifted a finger to try to stop him. But President Trump has shown time and time again how, how thin his skin is. We know when he was a guest at the Correspondence Dinner 15 odd years back that that was certainly, he was at the butt of those jokes, didn't like it. This is the same tactic where he uses, where he complains about fake news. If it's something negative, he goes after it and suggests that the person who wrote it report it, said it shouldn't have the right to do that. That is a threat to free speech. That the Post last night before Kimmel went on air. Willie, can only be perceived as a threat to three speech. And again, him suggesting he's gonna use.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

The LE.

[Katie K]

After his foes. We have seen that over the weekend, directing the attorney general to go after political foes. And in this case it would sure seem to be the FCC or others. And the nonsensical claim about the DNC to go after his foes in the media, too.

[Donny Deutsch]

And suggesting in that post that Kimmel's part of some Democratic Party conspiracy. Making a link again, we've talked about when the shoe's on the other foot. Do you want these rules to apply when Democrats are in power? Should they go after Fox News hosts that they believe are in concert with Republicans? You can see where that would go. And to your point about thin skin, Donald Trump was aware of all those past comedians, but he wasn't the butt of those jokes. And now it's about him and he doesn't like that. I'm remembering you mentioned George W. Bush.

[Joe Scarborough]

Who every night, every night, late night.

[Donny Deutsch]

Comedians, cable news hosts every single night.

[Joe Scarborough]

I gotta say, two, two stand out the door in China. Letterman love that. And of course, the second one that he always would go back to is dribbling the deflated basketball every single night. And never once did George W. Bush never once did George W. Bush say they need to be taken off the air. Every night he was unmercifully ridiculed. Every night, Bill Clinton, the Democrat, unmercifully ridiculed. Never once did Ronald Reagan unmercifully ridiculed. Never once did these Republicans or Democrats ever even think of suggesting they'd be taken off the air. Not one.

[Donny Deutsch]

To illustrate the contrast, I was doing an event a few years ago at the George W. Bush Library at SMU with Lorne Michaels. George W. Bush is in the front row of this event. They play a clip montage for about 15 minutes of will Ferrell mocking George W. Bush. And I look over and President Bush, not polite laughter, has his head thrown back in laughter, holding his gut because he thinks it's so funny. The contrast of that with what we're seeing now.

[Mike Barnacle]

Okay, we've got a lot more to get to this ahead on Morning Joe, President Trump blasts the United nations, accusing the organization of creating problems instead of solving them. David Ignatius and Katie K. Standing by with analysis of Trump's address to the General Assembly. Plus, former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton will be our guest as we mark 20 years of the Clinton Global Initiative. We'll talk with her about the group, Trump's critical work, the second Trump presidency and much more.

[Joe Scarborough]

And I'm going to say also, the big news yesterday had to do with Russia. I mean, there's massive news. We've got David Ignatius and Katie K standing by. We're going to be talking about that issue as well, because it's big.

[Mike Barnacle]

And a reminder, the Morning Joe podcast is available each weekday, featuring our full conversations and analysis. You can listen wherever you get your podcasts. You're watching Morning Joe. We'll be right back.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

This podcast is supported by the Obama Foundation. Real change doesn't happen from the top down. It starts at the ground level with young leaders, organizers, and everyday folks who have the power to bring change home to their communities because the challenges we face are real. But with your support, the next generation is stepping up to meet them at the Obama Foundation. We're helping lift up young leaders with the tools, training and support they need to make a lasting, positive change around the world. Donate [e-mail] youth businesses that are selling through the roof, like Untuck it make selling. And for shoppers, buying simple with Shopify, home of the number one checkout on the planet. And with shop Pay, you can boost conversions up to 50%. Businesses that sell more sell on Shopify. Upgrade your business and get the same checkout Untuck it uses. Sign up for your $1 per month trial period at shopify.com podcastfree all lowercase. Go to shopify.com podcastfree to upgrade your selling today.

[Joe Scarborough]

Come to DSW for the shoes. Stay for the fun. Because let's be honest, if shoe shopping isn't fun, are you even doing it right? So go ahead, try something new. Try something different. Good different. Try something that feel like you, you know, the real you. And then definitely brag about it later. Because at dsw, you've got unlimited freedom to play. Find the shoes that get you at prices that get your budget. At DSW stores [e-mail] let us surprise you.

[Mike Barnacle]

Gorgeous, beautiful shot of New York City as the sun comes up this morning. So, President.

[Joe Scarborough]

No, tj. I'm up here. Yeah, I got you. How are you doing, T, tj?

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Good, good, good.

[Joe Scarborough]

It looks beautiful up here this morning. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome, man. That's little traffic this morning, but we're doing all right. Yeah, that's fantastic. Weather and traffic on the nines with tj.

[Katie K]

Back to the show, guys.

[Mike Barnacle]

Wow.

[Joe Scarborough]

Sound effect. That's pretty clean. TJ's actually in the control room right now.

[Mike Barnacle]

It's okay now.

[Joe Scarborough]

Okay.

[Mike Barnacle]

All right. President Trump is shifting his stance on the war in Ukraine saying Kyiv could actually defeat Russia. Trump wrote on Truth Social yesterday that Ukraine could win with support from the European Union, adding, quote, ukraine would be able to take back their country in its original form, and who knows, maybe even go further than that. The comment marks a stark difference in Trump's approach to ending the war. Last month, he flirted out the idea of a territorial swap between Ukraine and Russia, saying it could be beneficial to both sides. Now, a senior administration official tells NBC News the president is trying to exert maximum public pressure on Russia to get the Kremlin to negotiate a ceasefire. The official did not outline any specific policy changes that may happen, but says the next steps depend on how Russia responds. In another surprising statement, Trump said European allies should shoot down Russian drones. He also doubled down on his comments about Ukraine's strength during meetings with Zelensky and French President Emmanuel Macron at the United nations headquarters yesterday.

[Joe Scarborough]

Mr. President, do you think that NATO.

[Mike Barnacle]

Countries should shoot down Russian aircraft if they enter their airspace?

[Joe Scarborough]

Yes, I do.

[Mike Barnacle]

Would you back them up?

[Katie K]

Would the United States help them out in some ways?

[Joe Scarborough]

Depends on the circumstance. But, you know, we're very strong toward NATO. You got to hand it to the Ukrainian soldiers and everybody involved. It's still going on. And that's, that's not a good thing for Russia. This was supposed to be quick. And so, you know, Russia doesn't look very distinguished, having taken three and a half years now. Right. So about three and a half years of very hard fighting. And it looks like it's not going to end for a long time. So we'll see what happens. But the other side can fight, too, and they've proven that. Maybe it's a. It could be that Russia is a paper tiger. I don't know what they are. But three and a half years of fighting and killing Everybody, of killing 7,000 people a week for nothing. For nothing. So it's a very sad situation. But most of you have seen the recent statement I put out a little while ago, and I'm glad you got it, but I feel that way. I really do feel that way. Let them get their land back. Yep. So we'll see how it all works out. You know, David, this is a complete about face. I will say about three weeks ago, the president also put out on Truth Social. How do you win a war if all you ever do is get attacked and you can't attack the other. Well, well, we saw a couple of weeks later, President Trump follow up, saying to NATO countries, if Russia sends aircraft or drones over your. Over Your land, shoot them down, and then saying something else. That again, just a complete turn. And yes, the New York Post is praising this. Murdoch's New York Post, obviously, the Wall Street Journal has been pushing for this for a very long time. But to go from a position where you're saying, because you think it'll end the war, hey, Ukraine's going to have to give up land, and they're going to have to figure out how to do it to now saying, hey, maybe they can get their land back. Talk about that shift and talk about how significant that is not just to Ukraine, but also to Europe.

[David Ignatius]

So, Joe, it is a big shift. Russia has been moving toward a confrontation with Europe, Europe whose consequences could be unpredictable. They've been violating the airspace of Estonia, Poland, even Germany. And the moment was coming when those countries would shoot back. And we had Donald Trump yesterday saying that he thought it would be appropriate to shoot back if Russia continued to cross those borders and that the United States might support it. In effect, the president was drawing a red line, something he rarely does, and you have to take that seriously. My friends in Ukraine overnight have been trying to understand just exactly what the president's statements yesterday mean. They're extremely pleased with the language. But to quote one of them, we want to know how long this will last. They've seen strong statements of support from Trump before that didn't. And we want to know exactly what this means in terms of will this mean new missiles? Will it mean new freedom to use those missiles? But my takeaway from what happened yesterday is, first, Donald Trump loves a winner. And what he's seeing in the toughness of President Zelensky and the Ukrainian people, I think has impressed him. He said it pretty directly. These are brave people, and they're fighting for their rights. Second thing is Donald Trump senses weakness more than any politician I can think of. And my sense is that he feels that Russia is weakening. You know, he has the best intelligence in the world. And when he says, I think the Russians are having trouble with their economy, I think they're having trouble with their gasoline supply, I'm assuming he's basing that on real information. The final thing, Joe, I would say, is that Trump's policy has needed consistency and organization from the beginning. You can't say one thing, one day and a week later, it's different, and expect to have a coherent policy. If he follows through on what he said yesterday, this war is going to have a different trajectory and one that I think Europeans will celebrate in, you know, with real passion. But President Trump does need to organize his administration and deliver on the things that he said pretty forcefully yesterday.

[Joe Scarborough]

You see what, you can go back to Anchorage and you can move forward then to the White House meeting, and you can keep moving forward. And him talking about two weeks here, two weeks there. You know, we used to all make fun of two weeks until he said 60 days for Iran on the 61st day, Iran was bombed. So he said two weeks. That's dragged into more three, four weeks. But at the same time, you've been writing about this for months now. Donald Trump has grown wary of what he called and what Saul and Homeland called Russia's bullshit. And he's in this case, it's making him look weak and he doesn't appreciate it. And I think yesterday volunteers. David's right. And I saw you shaking your head. I think of all the things that Donald Trump understands is, again, weakness in opponents and the weakness of an economy. And what did he lead with? Their economy is tanking. Talk about that and talk about how, again, Putin had a chance. Trump gave him a chance to get a great deal, but he keeps mocking Trump, keeps mocking the presidency. And now Donald Trump is doing this.

[Katie K]

Yeah, Homeland. Great show. First of all, we miss Homeland. There's a lot of things at play here that's really interesting. First of all, to David's point, I am told, also speaking to White House officials last night, President in part motivated by the weakness and rapidly increasing weakness of the Russian economy, he does see that he's also continues to grow angry, humiliated, even about how President Putin has treated him, that he thought he could get a deal early. We know, of course, that has not.

[Joe Scarborough]

Can I ask you this question? And maybe, you know, but why is it that even when Donald Trump was trying to have closer relations with Russia, RT would make fun of him and make fun of his family. Why did they do that?

[Katie K]

I'm not as well in read in on Kremlin state propaganda as I should be. But no, you're right.

[Joe Scarborough]

It makes no sense.

[Katie K]

It doesn't.

[Joe Scarborough]

He's reaching out. They're mocking him. They're mocking his family.

[Katie K]

Yeah. My sense of. I mean, my guess would be that they're just trying to establish Putin, Putin's superiority in this conflict over Western leaders. And that would include President Trump, who for the most part, of course, has been very deferential. So there are a few other things we should note here. President Trump, as we know, is often susceptible to the talking points of the last person he speaks to. This post came right after he talked to Zelensky. He was also pulled aside by Macron, by European and Ukrainian diplomats here in New York for the U.N. also back home. They are both thrilled by this statement. Katty K. But also sort of puzzled. They didn't. They're not sure they welcome it, but they're not sure what it will really mean. Because we should also note that there is a path. There has been for a while now, people in the White House, in the diplomatic community who think that at a certain point Trump is just going to wash his hands of this. And even in that truth social statement, there were some clues that he might where he says he wishes both countries well. And though he pledges to keep selling arms to NATO, he's not saying that there'll be any increase, increased aid, nor is he saying that he'll help broker any kind of peace talks.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Yeah, I mean, if there was a pan European word for whiplash, it would have been used a lot yesterday because all these European leaders had to sit through an hour of being kind of over an hour of being excoriated by Donald Trump for everything they believe in and all of their policies. And then he turns around and does this. And you could even see Volodymyr Zelenskyy looking at him like, are you being serious? He didn't even really believe it himself. I've reached out to a couple of people here in Washington up in in the Senate who saywho sound pretty skeptical frankly, that this language is going to be followed up with what it would take to give Ukraine the means to do what the president is talking about. I mean, to give Ukraine the means to take back their entire country. I don't know if he's thinking of including Crimea in that, but at least take back what they've lost in this war would mean a huge more amount of assistance from the United States, a lot more in the way of secondary sanctions. And at the moment, that sanctions bill that has broad bipartisan support up in the Senate has still not been brought to the floor. So what does this actually mean? I think we've seen so often President Trump say things. The key with Trump is to watch what he does, not watch what he says. It's possible that he's planning to follow this up with giving Ukraine the means to actually achieve these efforts, but it's going to take a lot. It's going to take a lot of American assistance and a lot of more of the secondary sanctions. So if he follows through on that, then I think he will deliver. But at the moment, this is rhetoric that Donald Trump is putting out there. Let's see where it goes.

[Donny Deutsch]

He was asked if he trusts Vladimir Putin anymore. And he said, I'll let you know a month from now, coming on the heels of the two weeks. Anything can happen in that month. President Zelensky, as Caddy just said, was sort of stunned by this turnabout from President Trump and was asked why he thought it happened in an interview yesterday on Fox News.

[Joe Scarborough]

I think we have a better relation.

[David Ignatius]

Than before, and I think we didn't have close relation because we didn't have maybe time.

[Joe Scarborough]

I don't know. I don't know other reasons. It's good that we have often phone calls and meetings.

[David Ignatius]

And I think the fact that Putin was lying to President Trump so many times also made difference between us.

[Donny Deutsch]

David, this development is made all the more stunning when you consider where the relationship with Zelensky was in that Oval Office meeting back in February when the president and vice president of the United States called in cameras and of course, friendly press corps to just attack President Zelensky. Now a different tone. Is there hope? I know there's hope, but is there belief among our allies in NATO and around the world that he means at this time that he is standing behind Ukraine?

[David Ignatius]

I'd say there's hope. There's not yet confidence. That's the question that I'm seeing in my messages overnight. There's a fear that, as the Russian deputy ambassador to the United nations said yesterday, don't get too excited about one tweet or in this case, one true social post. I mean, that's not a change in policy. And to truly execute a change in policy that would allow Ukraine to win, to take back territory, there'll have to be significant changes in how the U.S. and Europe supply weapons, the nature of the weapons that they supply. Those are all questions for the future. But you could see in the series of statements from Trump his frustration, his anger, and his sense that Vladimir Putin, in addition to insulting him in his mind, also can be had, is weak enough that he can be, he can be rolled.

[Mike Barnacle]

All right, we've got a lot more to get to still coming up. We're going to go through the key issues. Holding up a deal to keep the government funded as the deadline to avoid a shutdown is quickly approaching. We'll discuss that with Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer. He joins us on set this morning. Morning, Joe. We'll be right back.

[Joe Scarborough]

Also talking about the president at the U.N. yeah, come to DSW for the shoes, stay for the fun, because let's be honest. If shoe shopping isn't fun, are you.

[Donny Deutsch]

Even doing it right?

[Joe Scarborough]

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[Katie K]

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[Joe Scarborough]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Mike Barnacle]

That's a good one, too.

[Joe Scarborough]

Tj can we hear the helicopter? Hold on one second.

[Mike Barnacle]

He's driving.

[Joe Scarborough]

That's not.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

That's not me and the chopper this time.

[Donny Deutsch]

That's the chopper.

[Joe Scarborough]

The chopper. See? Okay, so next time you're in the chopper, we want to hear Shattered as you're. As you're flying over the city, over Gotham. Because I gotta say, Willie, it's one of the strange things. Keep this up music up for a second. One of the craziest things. And I know Mika wanted me to talk about this.

[Mike Barnacle]

No, I really did.

[Joe Scarborough]

If you want the album that encapsulates the west coast of the 1970s, it's Hotel California. No doubt about it. Not a close second. Weirdly enough. If you want to get the album that encapsulates. Yeah. New York city in the 1970s, it's this one by a bunch of guys from Britain.

[Donny Deutsch]

I know. Bunch of London boys.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Keith.

[Donny Deutsch]

Mick. This is a great song. Is it?

[Joe Scarborough]

Shattered is unbelievable. Don't you know the crime rate's going up, up, up, up, up, up. Yeah, yeah. So wait, hold on. We're not.

[Donny Deutsch]

We're just listening.

[Joe Scarborough]

What's your. What's your. What's your favorite.

[Donny Deutsch]

Well, on some girls.

[Joe Scarborough]

Some girls.

[Donny Deutsch]

This is. This Is up there.

[Joe Scarborough]

This is really.

[Donny Deutsch]

This is really up there. Some girls.

[Joe Scarborough]

Yeah.

[Donny Deutsch]

I go. I go.

[Joe Scarborough]

Shattered.

[Donny Deutsch]

This is it. It's just kind of gritty and New Yorky.

[Joe Scarborough]

I think it's shattered and respectable. I love respectable. Don't you love that.

[Donny Deutsch]

That great song?

[Joe Scarborough]

If you can't get up in the morning and you want a song to get you out of it, just.

[Donny Deutsch]

I mean, Beast of Burden, obviously.

[Joe Scarborough]

Burden's amazing.

[Donny Deutsch]

In a league of its own.

[Joe Scarborough]

No, no, we're. But we're talking deep.

[Donny Deutsch]

Beast of Burden is the obvious choice. I was trying to go down.

[Joe Scarborough]

Well, miss you. Whatever.

[Donny Deutsch]

Yeah, Miss you. Obviously. I was trying to go deeper.

[Joe Scarborough]

Cut. But it's Beast of Burden. That's what I'm trying to do, too, right here.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Yeah.

[Joe Scarborough]

Dis and shattered.

[Mike Barnacle]

So guess what, guys?

[Joe Scarborough]

And respect the respect. We're talking the President. It's a problem boy. Anyway. Good.

[Mike Barnacle]

It appears even world leaders are not immune to New York City traffic.

[Joe Scarborough]

Oh, really?

[Mike Barnacle]

While the UN is in town. It is really bad when the UN is in town. After giving a speech at the General assembly on Monday night, French President Emmanuel Macron made a surprise call to President Donald Trump while stuck on the street waiting behind a police barricade.

[Joe Scarborough]

Who is this, actually?

[Donny Deutsch]

How many people?

[Joe Scarborough]

No, I have. I have 10 people with me. I go to the French Embassy. I'm sorry.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

I'm president.

[Joe Scarborough]

I'm really sorry. It's just that everything's in closet right now. There's a border kit coming away. That's why. I'm sorry. How are you? Guess what? I'm waiting. Just think, because everything is pleasant for you. He's so funny. David Ignatius. I've got to say, one of the. You know, a lot of people comparing the first and second terms of the Trump administration. One of the things that's not talked about so much is the fact that Donald Trump actually this time around has some pretty good relations with European leaders, regardless of what he says at the United nations or at other places. He and Emmanuel Macron speak on the phone all the time. And they, they. They get along very well this term. I think he likes talking to him. Same thing, obviously, with Keir Starmer, same thing with the German Chancellor. It is. It's really quite a shift from the first term. Yes.

[David Ignatius]

He's come a long way with the Europeans. It's also a demonstration of Donald Trump's absolute power in the second term, that he can control the traffic flows that, you know, if you need a guy who's gonna. Who's gonna clear this street you call Donald and it's gonna, it's gonna get taken care of because he's the man.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

So.

[David Ignatius]

Okay, just as long as Macron understands that.

[Joe Scarborough]

Yeah, exactly. Caddy, just circling back to this president, again, does have, and obviously not just by this phone call, but our reporting tells us that he does have a, a much warmer relationship with the French president, a very good relationship with Keir Starmer, which is very interesting because of course, many people in those countries may not approve of the president's foreign policy. But talk about those closer bonds and if, if they may eventually get us somewhere where a lot of people in the west want to be on Ukraine.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Before the, that I'm still feeling sorry for that New York cop. He's thinking, oh, my God, they didn't teach me this in cop school. I've got the President of France, the president, the traffic has to be stopped. What do I do here? He need a little bit of skilled diplomacy, carried it off. Well, you're right. Joey does have better relations with them. And I think that, I mean, some of it may be genuine warmth. Although people around Keir Starmer quite often roll their eyes when I ask them how the meeting went. I think there's also a realization that the, that they have learned from Trump one, how to get the best for their own constituents out of Trump, too. And the way to get the best out of their, for their voters is to flatter the president, to be nice with him, to make jokes with him, to use a charm offensive on him. It's not to kind of get angry and robust and snippy with him. That just doesn't work. Now, whether that means, means genuinely thatand we all know, you know, the stories of Donald Trump being charming in private. It's quite possible, as you sounded like on that phone call, that Macron called him up knowing that he was going to be kind of funny and in on the joke so he can be charming in public, in private as well. Other people have said it too, who don't agree with him. But I think most of this is a realization of what they need from America, how high the stakes are for their own countries when it comes to specific issues like tariffs, like Ukraine, as we were talking about earlier. And they've got, got to swallow whatever animosity they have and find a way to deal with him in a more effective way than they did the first time around.

[Joe Scarborough]

Yeah. And more than any other president I think I can think of. And everything's personal with Donald Trump. That includes whether it's late night hosts or whether it is diplomatic deals with foreign countries or tariffs, you go down the list. It is personal. So these European leaders are learning how to better build a personal relationship with Donald Trump. And it seems to be working for several of them in pushing him to do certain things, even behind the scenes.

[Donny Deutsch]

Every president has an ego, but this is something completely different where you have to run it through that ego, through the flattery that seems to get people everything. So Macron knows, Jonathan, that a phone call continues the relationship a light moment. Zelensky knows that if he wants to save his country, he has to flatter President Trump. He has to take his lumps in an Oval Office meeting back in February. They understand the man. They understand the game. They understand the transaction that has to take place to get what they want out of the deal.

[Katie K]

Yeah, that's the takeaway there that Macron has learned lessons from the first time around and other leaders have as well, even if there are sharp policies, agreements. In fact, one European Cabinet official, and I can't reveal which country said that their leader is trying to take up golf in order to try to build their play with the president and therefore improve relationships because they see how to.

[Mike Barnacle]

Do it to an extent. Okay, up next we'll get into.

[Joe Scarborough]

By the way, you just tell them to take up something else.

[Mike Barnacle]

Okay.

[Joe Scarborough]

Don't take that game of play.

[Mike Barnacle]

Okay, up next, we'll get into the president said to the General assembly yesterday we'll also have the latest on the telecommunications threat thwarted by the Secret Service in New York City. What we know. We'll have the very latest. Morning Joe is coming right back.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Disney has the following statement and I agreed to do it. Here we go. To reactivate your Disney plus and Hulu account.

[Joe Scarborough]

Open.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Open the Disney plus app on your smart TV or TV connected device. I've been fortunate to work at a company that has allowed me to do the show the way we want to do it. For almost 23 years, I've done almost 4,000 shows on ABC. And over that time, the people who run this network have allowed me to evolve and to stretch the boundaries of what was once traditional for a late night talk show. Even when it made them uncomfortable, which I do a lot every night, they've defended my right to poke fun at our leaders and to advocate for subjects that I think are important by allowing me to use their platform. And I am very grateful for that. With that said, I was not happy when they pulled me off the air on Wednesday. I did not agree with that decision. And I told them that and we had many conversations. I shared my point of view, they shared theirs. We talked it through. And at the end, even though they didn't have to, they really didn't have to. This is a giant company. We have short attention spans. And I am a tiny part of the Disney Corporation. They welcomed me back on the air, and I thank them for that. I've been hearing a lot about what I need to say and do tonight. And the truth is, I don't think what I have to say is gonna make much of a difference. If you like me, like me. If you don't, you don't. I have no illusions about changing anything, anyone's mind. But I do want to make something clear because it's important to me as a human. And that is, you understand that it was never my intention to make light of the murder of a young man. I don't think there's anything funny about it. I posted a message on Instagram on the day he was killed sending love to his family and asking for compassion. And I meant it, and I still do. Nor was it my intention to blame any specific group for the actions of what it was. Obviously a deeply disturbed individual. That was really the opposite of the point I was trying to make. But I understand that to some that felt either ill timed or unclear or maybe both. And for those who think I did point a finger. I get why you're upset. If the situation was reversed, there was a good chance I'd have felt the same way. I have many friends and family members on the other side who I love and remain close to. Even though we don't agree on politics at all. I don't think the murderer who shot Charlie Kirk represents anyone. This was a sick person who believed violence was a solution, and it isn't.

[Mike Barnacle]

Wow. Joining the conversation, we have MSNBC contributor Mike Barnacle, host of the podcast on Brand with Donnie Deutsch. Donnie Deutch, senior writer for the Dishpatch and a columnist for Bloomberg Opinion. David Drucker is with us. Jonathan Lemaire, David Ignatius and Katie K. Are still with us as well.

[Joe Scarborough]

Donny, talk about Jimmy Kimmel last night. You know, there are two points you brought up that I think are really important. Number one, he said this is not about him. And then he also referenced the Republicans that stood up for him, Ted Cruz and Rand Paul. And the reality is, and this hasn't been talked about a lot, this is not popular with the majority of Americans, 68% of Americans, when asked that it's unacceptable for a broadcast for the Government to get broadcasters to protect, to take.

[Katie K]

People off the air they don't views.

[Joe Scarborough]

They don't agree with. And I think Americans spoke up for free speech. So I think Disney was smart bringing him back because the popularity of free speech is something that I don't think we should ever really question, but that this was an unpopular political move. And I thought Kimmel had every right note. And it's interesting in talking to a lot of my Republican friends, a lot of my friends are Trump supporters, almost to a person, they came out and said, no, no, no, this is not right. Yeah, agreed, Mike. And again, a lot of reasons to be discouraged. There are also some green shoots when you have Jimmy Kimmel, Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, you know, other people all across the ideological spectrum coming out saying, no, no, no, no, no. This is not about left versus right, Democratic against Republican. This is about big government versus free speech. And even if we don't agree with Jimmy Kimmel or like him, we support his right to speak. Well, it would be hard not to admire Jimmy Kimmel after watching him last night in that performance. It was heartfelt, it was sincere, it was personal, it was moving, and it was genuine. And it was about something that affects everyone in this country. We have something that very few people in the world have. We have the right to speak. We have the right to say what we want to say when we want to say it, with very few restrictions. And that goes from late night comedians to what we do here in the morning, to what you say on a bus or in a school room or whatever. Freedom of speech is the core of the United States of America. Well, and a lot of people have believed it's been under siege for a decade. And now a lot of those same people are leading the war against free speech on college campuses and other places right now. Cancel culture seems to be back, but this time with the vengeance for the right. Willie. But this was definitely a victory for free speech. A victory, again, not just led by Democrats, but led by Republicans as well. And I really loved Jimmy, talking about him sending his love to Erica Kirk and the family. Talking about Erica Kirk and what she said, the forgiveness, talking about how he has people in his family and people that he knows he loves that are Donald Trump supporters and they still love each other, they still talk to each other, they still get along with each other. It was just, I thought it was very, you know, it wasn't an us against them. Look at me. I am, you know, whatever I am. Spartacus. It was saying, hey, let's figure out how to do this together.

[Donny Deutsch]

Yeah, there was humility in that statement last night, basically saying maybe what I said was wrong. Maybe what I said was poorly timed. Given that the murder of Charlie Kirk was so fresh, we can debate that. But what we shouldn't be debating is whether or not the President, United States or the federal government can use its power to shut down voices it disagrees with. That's just not a road that this country wants to go down.

[Katie K]

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[Mike Barnacle]

Are you kidding me?

[Joe Scarborough]

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[Jimmy Kimmel]

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[Joe Scarborough]

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[Mike Barnacle]

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