Morning Joe 4/1/25

Summary

Morning Joe Podcast Summary – April 1, 2025

Hosted by Joe Scarborough, Mika Brzezinski, and Willie Geist, Morning Joe delivers in-depth political analysis and discussions with key newsmakers and insiders. In the April 1, 2025 episode, the hosts delve into major political developments, including President Trump’s controversial remarks about a potential third term, the high-stakes Wisconsin Supreme Court race influenced by Elon Musk, pivotal Florida special elections, impending tariff resolutions on Canadian imports, and the ongoing investigation into the Signal Group chat controversy. Additionally, the podcast features a special segment on sports, highlighting Tiger Woods' remarkable career.

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1. President Trump’s Third Term Consideration

Timestamp: [01:30]

The episode opens with a heated discussion about former President Donald Trump’s recent comments indicating he is “considering his options” to run for a third presidential term, which directly contravenes the Constitution’s two-term limit.

• Joe Scarborough highlights the gravity of Trump's statements:
  “President Trump says he's considering his options to serve a third term in office, a breach of the Constitution's two-term limit for presidents.” ([04:49])

• Mika Brzezinski responds with skepticism and humor:
  “I'm sorry, considering the option? What are you trying to order off.” ([01:41])

• Charlie Sykes underscores the constitutional barrier:
  “The Constitution forbids it.” ([02:03])

• Eugene Robinson emphasizes the seriousness of Trump's intentions:
  “President Trump said in a new interview that he is not joking about seeking a third term.” ([02:08])

The discussion swiftly moves to Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer’s announcement that Democrats will devise a plan to block Trump’s potential bid by 2032, reinforcing the bipartisan consensus against such a move.

2. Wisconsin Supreme Court Race and Elon Musk’s Influence

Timestamp: [04:49]

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to the intensely contested Wisconsin Supreme Court race between conservative Brad Schimmel and progressive Susan Crawford. Elon Musk’s unprecedented financial backing has transformed this into the most expensive judicial race in American history, with over $21 million poured into the campaign.

• Charlie Sykes introduces the topic:
  “Voters head to the polls today in Wisconsin's hotly contested Supreme Court race.” ([04:49])

• Mike Allen criticizes activist judges influenced by political motives:
  “These judges are undermining faith in the legal system because they're supposed to be objective, but they're clearly not being objective. They're being just politicians.” ([05:38] - [06:07])

• Joe Scarborough analyzes the implications of Musk’s involvement:
  “Elon Musk is flexing his muscles. He wants to show the rest of the Republican Party that he is the biggest stick in the country, that he is the number one enforcer.” ([06:42])

The episode explores how Musk’s financial intervention is perceived as both a power play within the GOP and a direct challenge to the independence of the judiciary. The potential shift from a liberal majority to a conservative one could have profound impacts on key issues such as abortion rights and congressional redistricting.

3. Florida Special Elections

Timestamp: [10:09]

The podcast shifts focus to Florida, where voters are also heading to the polls in two special congressional elections. These races, located in traditionally Republican districts, have garnered attention due to the substantial fundraising advantages held by Democratic candidate Josh Wheal over Republican opponent Randy Fine.

• Jonathan Lemire outlines the candidates and stakes:
  “In Florida's First District, Republican Jimmy Petronas is running to replace Matt Gaetz against Democrat Gay Vellomont.” ([10:09])

• Eugene Robinson discusses Republican anxieties:
  “The race to replace Mike Waltz has raised GOP anxiety levels, as some feel it could be really close.” ([11:22])

• Mika Brzezinski highlights the Democrats' hopes:
  “Tonight matters for Democrats as it’s a chance for them to get off the mat with a big showing that could bring in money, coin, energy.” ([12:33])

The outcome of these elections is seen as a bellwether for the Republican Party’s strength heading into the 2026 midterms, with potential implications for Dem momentum and GOP control in the House.

4. Tariffs on Canadian Imports and Liberation Day

Timestamp: [16:20]

A critical economic issue discussed is the proposed reciprocity tariffs on Canadian imports, dubbed “Liberation Day” by President Trump. The tariffs are projected to act as a significant tax increase, with the Wall Street Journal labeling it a “$6 trillion Trump tax increase.”

• Joe Scarborough reflects on public sentiment:
  “If you go to coffee shops and truck stops in the Midwest, you won't find many people saying, hey, I wish we could go back to the McKinley years.” ([21:40])

• Charlie Sykes cites the Wall Street Journal’s critique:
  “Financial markets have the shakes as President Trump prepares to launch big tariff salvo… Americans are being told to accept the pain of higher prices, a slower economy, and shrinking 401k balances.” ([20:16])

• Jonathan Lemire details Senate Democrats' actions:
  “Top Democratic senators are expected to force a vote on a resolution to eliminate President Trump tariffs on Canadian imports.” ([17:00])

The tariffs have sparked bipartisan concerns, with some Republicans like Senator Rand Paul supporting the resolution to end them. The tariffs are criticized for harming local economies, particularly in Maine, and for creating unnecessary economic strain on American consumers.

5. Signal Group Chat Controversy

Timestamp: [28:26]

The podcast delves into the ongoing controversy surrounding the Signal Group chat, where national security officials allegedly involved journalist Jeffrey Goldberg in discussions about attack plans. This breach has led to bipartisan calls for a special counsel investigation.

• Charlie Sykes summarizes the issue:
  “More lawmakers are calling this morning for an investigation into the Signal Group chat where national security officials added a journalist Jeffrey Goldberg.” ([27:08])

• Mika Brzezinski expresses concern over the impact:
  “This story transcends politics and cuts into the culture because it's such a relatable story.” ([28:14])

• Eugene Robinson critiques the White House response:
  “The Department of Justice has made clear they want nothing to do with this. The FBI as well, they're not going to look into this matter.” ([29:00])

The mishandling of sensitive national security information has eroded trust among military families and the broader defense community. The White House’s dismissive approach has further compounded frustrations, with calls for accountability and systemic changes to prevent future breaches.

6. Special Segment: Tiger Woods’ Iconic Shot and Career Longevity

Timestamp: [36:33]

Transitioning from politics to sports, the podcast features an exclusive interview with former caddy Steve Williams, co-author of the new book "Together We Roared: Alongside Tiger for His Epic 12-Year, 13-Majors Run." Williams recounts the unforgettable moment when Tiger Woods executed one of golf’s greatest shots at Augusta in 2005.

• Charlie Sykes introduces the guest and the story:
  “Our next guest was with Tiger for three of those Masters wins as well as nine other major victories… Can you tell me about the conversation leading up to that shot?” ([38:26])

• Steve Williams describes the shot’s precision:
  “Tiger actually landed exactly on that pitch mark. He could stand there for the rest of his life and probably never hold that shot. So, yeah, it was a pretty special moment.” ([40:07])

• Mika Brzezinski emphasizes Tiger’s mental toughness:
  “One of the best things I've ever heard… Tiger shut that out because you knew tomorrow was another day.” ([45:33])

Williams highlights Tiger’s relentless dedication and unparalleled focus, attributes that have defined his extraordinary career. The discussion underscores the deep trust between player and caddy, and how personal and professional relationships evolve over time.

7. Additional Headlines and Closing Thoughts

Timestamp: [25:09] – [37:52]

The hosts briefly touch on other major news stories, including:

• Israel’s Airstrikes in Lebanon: Military actions targeting Hezbollah, raising concerns over the fragile ceasefire.
• Johnson & Johnson’s Bankruptcy Case: Rejected $9 billion settlement over talcum powder lawsuits due to flawed voting processes.
• Sam Mendes’ Beatles Movies: Announcement of four separate films, each focusing on a different member of The Beatles, set for release in April 2028.

Joe Scarborough wraps up the episode with a reminder to stay connected through the MSNBC app for continuous news coverage and to subscribe to their various podcasts for ongoing insights.

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Notable Quotes:

• Charlie Sykes:
  “The Constitution forbids it.” ([02:03])

• Joe Scarborough:
  “Elon Musk is flexing his muscles. He wants to show the rest of the Republican Party that he is the biggest stick in the country.” ([06:42])
  “If you go to coffee shops and truck stops in the Midwest, you won't find many people saying, hey, I wish we could go back to the McKinley years.” ([21:40])

• Mika Brzezinski:
  “This story transcends politics and cuts into the culture because it's such a relatable story.” ([28:14])

• Steve Williams:
  “Tiger actually landed exactly on that pitch mark. He could stand there for the rest of his life and probably never hold that shot.” ([40:07])

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This episode of Morning Joe provides a comprehensive overview of pressing political issues and offers insightful analyses from seasoned journalists and commentators. From constitutional debates and judicial battles to economic policies and national security concerns, the hosts ensure listeners are well-informed about the factors shaping today's political landscape. The special sports segment adds a refreshing perspective on resilience and excellence, exemplified by Tiger Woods' enduring legacy.

Transcript

[Mika Brzezinski]

This podcast is supported by Planned Parenthood Federation of America. Planned Parenthood Federation of America exists so all people can get access to the sexual and reproductive care and education they need. Planned Parenthood organizations advocate for health equity and policies that allow people the freedom to control their own bodies, lives and futures. More than 2 million patients a year rely on Planned Parenthood Health center services like STI testing and treatment, birth control, gender affirming care, abortion, cancer screenings and more. Reproductive healthcare and rights are under attack from public officials who are out of step with the will of the vast majority of Americans. The constitutional right to abortion has been stolen and politicians in 47 states have introduced bills that would block people from getting the sexual and reproductive care they need. Planned Parenthood knows that equitable access to healthcare, including safe, legal abortion, is a human right.

[Joe Scarborough]

Right now, Planned Parenthood needs your help.

[Mika Brzezinski]

To protect access to healthcare. Donate today by visiting plannedparenthood.org Protect Thometac.

[Jonathan Lemire]

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[Joe Scarborough]

In some of his strongest comments yet, President Trump says he's considering his options to serve a third term in office, a breach of the Constitution's two term limit for presidents.

[Mika Brzezinski]

I'm sorry, considering the option? What are you trying to order off.

[Charlie Sykes]

Menu from the Constitution?

[Mika Brzezinski]

Who cares what he won't rule out? I won't rule out lying down on the Krispy Kreme conveyor belt and letting the glaze just take me. But that doesn't mean it's going to happen.

[Charlie Sykes]

The Constitution forbids it.

[Jonathan Lemire]

President Trump said in a new interview.

[Eugene Robinson]

That he is not joking about seeking.

[Charlie Sykes]

A third term and added, quote, there are methods. In response, Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer.

[Mika Brzezinski]

Announced that Democrats will have a plan.

[Charlie Sykes]

In place to stop him by 2032.

[Jonathan Lemire]

All right, some late night hosts making fun of President Trump. President Trump considering a third term in office. We have a lot to cover this morning except that story right now. We're following key elections today. Voters are headed to the polls in Wisconsin, where there is a high stakes Supreme Court race taking shape, and in Florida, where the outcome of two special elections could further narrow the GOP's House majority. We'll break down what to expect, what to watch for. Plus hours from now, a group of Democratic senators will force a vote on a resolution to end tariffs on Canadian imports. And some Republicans are now considering joining them as they scramble to shield their states from the looming impact. Also ahead, top Senate Democrats are calling on Attorney General Pam Bondi to appoint a special counsel to investigate the Signal Group chat. But will she listen and open up a DOJ probe? Good morning and welcome to Morning Joe. It is Tuesday, April 1, April Fool's Day.

[Charlie Sykes]

The worst.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Anybody have an April Fool's Day?

[Charlie Sykes]

Never would I.

[Eugene Robinson]

Now, let's just.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Maddie did a really mean one to me. Do you want to know? She works for us.

[Eugene Robinson]

We all got him.

[Charlie Sykes]

That's great.

[Jonathan Lemire]

She told me that they discontinued my coffee.

[Charlie Sykes]

Maddie. John, what was yours?

[Eugene Robinson]

She said it was her last day.

[Charlie Sykes]

That's awful. That is awful.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Yeah.

[Charlie Sykes]

And then she said to me, it's my birthday. And so I actually moved in. My dear friend Maddie who gets us going and runs this show behind the scenes. And then she said, I'm just kidding. It's not my birthday.

[Jonathan Lemire]

I'm sorry. Mine was the worst. It was at sick and offense, actually. I don't know if I'll ever get over it. We're very vulnerable at this hour. You really can't do stuff like that to us, right? All right. With us we have the co host of our fourth hour and contributing writer at the Atlantic, Jonathan Lemire, Pulitzer Prize winning columnist and associate editor of the Washington Post. Eugene Robinson is with us this morning, co founder Axios, Mike Allen is here, NBC News national affairs analyst and a partner and chief political columnist at Puck, John Heilman and MSNBC contributor and author of the book how the Right Lost Its Mind. Charlie Sykes is with us. So we've got a lot to get to this morning, but I think we start today, Willie in Wisconsin.

[Charlie Sykes]

And Charlie's the right man to have with us because voters head to the polls today in Wisconsin's hotly contested Supreme Court race that is drawing national attention. Conservative Brad Schimmel, a former state attorney general and current circuit court judge backed by billionaire Elon Musk, is facing off against progressive Susan Crawford, a former prosecutor who's also a current circuit court judge. Musk has become a main character in this race, if you will, holding rallies in support of Schimmel while he and groups he funds have combined to spend more than $21 million on this race, which is now the most expensive judicial contest in American history. During a telerally last night, Musk bash judges whose rulings have impeded the policies of President Trump.

[Mike Allen]

But we've got this issue with judges that are activists. They're not judges. They're just pretending to be judges. They're just politicians wearing judges robes.

[Joe Scarborough]

And that's a huge problem. In fact, I think that's just generally a problem.

[Mike Allen]

It's not just a challenge with tomorrow's election in Wisconsin, but with the federal.

[Joe Scarborough]

Judges, where it's like, hey, guys, you're really undermining faith.

[Mike Allen]

These judges are undermining faith in the.

[Joe Scarborough]

Legal system because they're supposed to be.

[Mike Allen]

Objective, but they're clearly not being objective. They're being just politicians.

[Joe Scarborough]

And this is not right. We should have an independent judicial system where it's not a matter of politics.

[Charlie Sykes]

So, Charlie Sykes, we can put that larger argument to the side. It just so happens, coincidentally, that only the judges who disagree with Donald Trump on constitutional grounds are the ones that Elon Musk and Donald Trump believe are somehow violating their duties. So let's talk specifically about Wisconsin, why this race is getting so much attention and so much money. What are the stakes here?

[Joe Scarborough]

Well, first of all, the irony. It burns because virtually every piece of literature supporting the conservative candidate has Donald Trump's picture on it, saying, we need to support the Trump agenda. We need to provide Donald Trump a support network. So, so much for independent judiciary. Look, the stakes in Wisconsin, of course, are very, very high. Objectively, this election will determine control of the court. It's got a liberal majority. If Brad Schimmel wins, it will flip to a 4, 3 conservative majority. Huge consequences for abortion rights, for congressional redistricting, public employee rights. But the reason we're talking about this is because it's been nationalized. It's a proxy race now between Trump and the Democrats. And, you know, quite frankly, it has become a referendum on Elon Musk and his money. And it's become a referendum on the first 60, 70 days of the Trump administration. You know, we're not California, we're not Florida, we're Not New York. $100 million in a state like Wisconsin is extraordinary. It would be extraordinary for a Senate seat, much less a judicial seat. So I think that what you're seeing here is that Elon Musk is flexing his muscles. He wants to show the rest of the Republican Party that he is the biggest stick in the country, that he is the number one enforcer. That he is. That he is the number one influencer. And so he's got a lot riding on this, which is why he's putting so much money into this race, wearing.

[Charlie Sykes]

The cheese head there on stage at a rally that's serious. So we know this presidential race a few months back was razor thin in the state of Wisconsin. So what are the sort of betting odds here? How are people predicting this might go tonight?

[Joe Scarborough]

Oh, look, nobody knows. I mean, everything in Wisconsin is always on a razor's edge. Almost every major race has been decided by 20,000 votes. And the Musk folks and the Republicans are testing their theory that they can turn out low propensity Trump voters, the kind of voters who would normally sit home during a low turnout judicial race. And so they're trying to get them to come out like they did in November. The Democrats are testing the theory that they can make this a referendum on Elon Musk and Elon Musk's attempt to buy a seat in Wisconsin. So, you know, we have these dueling theories here, and because they've never been tested out before in an election like this, nobody really know. Polls have been close. Elon Musk is not particularly popular in Wisconsin. Poll taken earlier last month showed him Underwater with a 41% approval rating. 53% disapproved. But that was before a lot of things have happened, right? I mean, that was before we had the stories about Social Security and Medicare. That was before signal gate. So this race, again, big, you know, has big consequences for my home state, but I think it's really going to shape the national narrative about the popularity of the Trump agenda. It will play into either play into Republican jitters about the economy and about congressional races, or it will be the moment in which Elon Musk says, you know, I am the master of the universe. You can send me anywhere in America with my big stick and my $26 million, and I can determine the outcome of races in swing states. So it's going to be, I think the significance will be the way it will shape the national narrative over the next few days.

[Jonathan Lemire]

So voters in Florida are also heading to the polls today for special elections in two traditionally deep red congressional districts, amid growing concerns from Republicans that both races may be much closer than anticipated. In Florida's First District, the state's chief financial officer, Republican Jimmy Petronas, is running to replace former GOP Congressman Matt Gaetz. Petronas is facing off against Democratic candidate Gay Vellomont, a former activist with the group's Mom's Demand Action for Gun Sense in America. And in the 6th district, GOP state Senator Randy Fine is running to replace former Republican Congressman Mike Waltz, who is now Trump's national security adviser. Fein is facing off against Democrat Josh Wheal, a public school Teacher Wheal has outraised his Republican opponent by millions of dollars. Republic. They expect to win both races. But some are concerned a Democratic outperformance could fuel a narrative that Democrats have the momentum going into the 2026 midterms. This could be tough in Florida, don't you think? In these districts?

[Joe Scarborough]

Yeah.

[Eugene Robinson]

I mean Florida, of course, in recent elections has become more and more red. It's become certainly pretty safe Republican territory. But the race to replace Mike Waltz in particular. Mike Waltz, man, the news of late has gotten tight and has sort of raised GOP anxiety level. Yes. That they speaking to some Republican operators last couple days, they feel like they're going to win, but that one much more than the other district in Florida could be really close. And John Hamond, we're at the this is sort of political in some ways silly season, right. Where it's we're still very much in the president's first hundred days. And those the first election that we see after a presidential contest, we always try to draw sort of outsized meaning to them. And often that's the New Jersey and Virginia governor's races. Those usually come the year those come the year after a presidential election. And that still will apply a few months from now. But today we have this test. The seats in Florida, to be sure, but in particular the one in Wisconsin where I think a lot of national Republicans and Democrats are looking to see what kind of meaning can we withdraw from this referendums on Trump but Musk and also just where are Dems going after November's disaster?

[Mika Brzezinski]

Yeah, Jonathan, it's true. There's always a lot of focus on these off year elections and on special elections in the president's first term. I think it's, it's, you know, if there's a large trend emerges over the course of the year, it's, it's not unfair. And history would support the notion that you look at that large trend and say that it's telling you something. It's way too early this year to come to that conclusion. But I got to say, this Wisconsin race, you know, you could talk about all the various ways in which it's seen as a proxy for a lot of things. But the, I mean really the Musk factor here is it's really much more of a referendum has been turning a referendum on Elon Musk even more than it is the Trump agenda. And I can tell you that there are Republicans all over Washington who quietly would be perfectly happy to see the Republican lose that race in order to take some of the wind out of Elon Musk's sails. There are a lot of Capitol Hill Republicans who are concerned about having an increasingly unpopular Elon Musk put around their neck like an albatross going into the midterm elections. And they would like to be done with him and give the president, President Trump, a sense that perhaps it's not in his or the party's best political interest to be seen as the party of Elon Musk. And losing this race in Wisconsin would have various negative implications for the Republican Party, but it would also take Elon Musk down a peg. And I can tell you, as I say, there are a lot of Republicans who wouldn't mind that happening.

[Charlie Sykes]

So, Mike Allen, as we talk about these Florida races, we should manage expectations. Democrats aren't going to win them. They want Republicans won by 37 and 30 points. Trump won those districts by 37 and 30 points. But they could, Democrats could cut into those margins. Wisconsin, for all the reasons Heilman just laid out with the Elon Musk factor, is there. We had that surprising result in Pennsylvania last week, a Democrat winning a state level race in a Trump district. Where are Democrats focusing right now? What are their hopes? I guess they hope some of the polling shows up in these results, which is that Americans, it turns out, don't like tariffs, that Americans, it turns out, don't like mass layoffs, chaotic layoffs, where people they know, their neighbors, family members themselves, are losing their jobs with the chainsaw guy, the billionaire. So what are you going to be looking for tonight? But broadly, what are we looking at here nationally in terms of how Democrats might do?

[Mika Brzezinski]

Yeah, thank you, Willie. And first, welcome to April and happy unbirthday to the team up there in New York. Why tonight matters for Democrats is this is a chance for them to get off the mat. Like a big showing, a big win tonight that's going to bring in money, coin, energy. And I can tell you that in Wisconsin, the White House behind the scenes feeling terrible about how that looks. Charlie, of course, is right about Wisconsin always being a razor's edge. But I can tell you, you that inside the Republican Party, not a lot of optimism about Wisconsin. Down in Florida, feeling great about the seat that Matt Gaetz used to occupy there in the first district in the sixth District in Florida, really getting nervous about that Mike Waltz seat despite that remarkable 30 point margin that you just mentioned. A little behind the scenes story for your viewers. This is from Axios, Mark Caputo, who lives down there in Florida. And he said behind the scenes Mike Waltz, of course, now the President's national security adviser, which is why they're having to fill this seat. Mike Waltz is saying to colleagues behind the scenes, Randy Fine, the Republican candidate you just saw there, he said, if Randy Fine wins, I'm definitely getting fired.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Okay. President Trump is expected to unveil his sweeping plan for reciprocal tariffs tomorrow. And while many details are still unclear at this point, Trump says his tariff plan will be inspiring.

[Mika Brzezinski]

It's a rebirth of a country because what, how we could have afforded to do what we did, we help everybody and they don't help us. I really, the term I like best.

[Joe Scarborough]

Probably is the liberation of America.

[Mika Brzezinski]

It's the liberation of this country because it's incredible. Look, we have 36 trillion in debt for a reason, and that accumulates over a long period of time.

[Joe Scarborough]

So I think what you're going to.

[Mike Allen]

Be seeing over the next couple of.

[Joe Scarborough]

Days will be very inspiring to a lot of people.

[Mika Brzezinski]

They're reciprocal. So whatever they charge us, we charge them. But we're being nicer than they were.

[Joe Scarborough]

We have a lot of countries friend and foe.

[Mika Brzezinski]

I always say friend and foe, but the friend in many cases is worse than the foe. But we're going to be very nice, relatively speaking. We're going to be very kind.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Some top Democratic senators are expected to force a vote today on a resolution that would eliminate President Trump tariffs on Canadian imports. The resolution, led by Senator Tim Kaine, would end the emergency declaration President Trump declared in February, citing fentanyl trafficking and illegal immigration. The vote could be a true test for Republicans. Senator Rand Paul has already indicated he supports the measure, and according to Politico, Senator Susan Collins plans to back the resolution as well. Senator Thom Tillip also vote in support. The resolution would only need a simple majority to pass in the Senate, but it's not clear whether it would get enough support in the House. Gene, let's talk about Liberation Day, which has a lot of different contexts, different countries celebrate it for different reasons. It has history. But in this case, is there anybody who thinks there will be a positive outcome to these tariffs? And Susan Collins, that makes a lot of sense because Maine on the border with Canada is really suffering right now.

[Mike Allen]

Yeah, that's right. Maine, you know, used to get thousands and thousands of tourists across the border from Canada who are not coming now because of this administration's antipathy, its hostility toward our Canadian neighbors, which is no one understands except Donald Trump and, I guess, Peter Navarro. And they're the only ones who think that Liberation Day in quotes is going to be a positive thing for the United States. The only people I can find who really believe that, you know, the stock market is not the economy. But look at how unsettled and how pessimistic the stock markets have been over the last few weeks in anticipation these tariffs, which by every economist's light, every respectable economist says, this is just insanity. This makes absolutely no sense. It's going to needlessly raise prices for Americans. It's going to start a trade war that the Wall Street Journal called the dumbest trade war in history. But here we go. Unless, of course, the President decides to pull the rug out from everybody once again at the last minute and say, oh, well, you know, we'll forget about this. We'll postpone them. He likes to do that. He likes to play Lucy in the football.

[Charlie Sykes]

Yeah. The Wall Street Journal's editorial board continues this morning as Jean mentioned its steady criticism of these proposed tariffs. The new piece titled a $6 trillion Trump tax increase. The Journal writes this. Financial markets have the shakes as President Trump prepares to launch big tariff salvo on Wednesday. And nerves are appropriate since Mr. Trump's chief trade adviser, Peter Navarro, is boasting about what he says will amount to a $6 trillion tax increase from the tariffs. In the real economic world, a tariff is a tax. If you raise $600 billion more a year in revenue for the federal government, you are taking that amount away from individuals and businesses in the private economy. By any definition, that is a tax increase. And the $600 billion figure would be one of the largest in U.S. history. Americans are being told to accept the pain of higher prices, a slower economy, and shrinking 401k balances in the name of Mr. Trump's project to transform the American economy into what he imagines it was like in the McKinley era of the 1890s. The I couldn't care less, quote Charlie Sykes that the President gave to Kristen Welker over the week when she raised the prospect of Americans having to pay more al more for their cars because of these tariffs, saying he couldn't care less. How is this playing in a place like Wisconsin?

[Joe Scarborough]

Well, I have to tell you that, you know, if you go to coffee shops and truck stops in the Midwest, you won't find many people saying, hey, you know, I wish we could go back to the McKinley years. I wish we could be more like the 1890s. This is not what people voted for. And it's really interesting that he's being hit from the. From the right. From the Wall Street Journal, which is pointing out that he is about to impose unilaterally one of the large tax increases in American history, if not world history. And think about that in terms of what conservatives used to claim that they were in favor of what Republicans used to say about massive tax increases. And yes, it's all a show with Donald Trump. And he may impose it one day, he may impose it another, but he can't have it both ways. He can't count on the revenue from the tariffs at the same time that he is on and off. So what we're seeing here, of course, is just tremendous uncertainty, small business businessmen, investors who just simply do not know how to plan. And uncertainty is really deadly to an economy because nobody knows what to invest in, how to plan, what their prices are going to be. And so you're seeing this showing up in consumer confidence as well as the stock market. So again, I don't think a lot of people had on their business, on their bingo cards that in the first hundred days of the Trump administration that he would push this country this far toward a word that we hadn't heard in years, stagflation. Whether we have a recession or not, you're hearing more and more people talk about stagflation. And that was not what was on the agenda last November.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Charlie Sykes, thank you. Always good to have you on. We appreciate it. And still ahead on MORNING joe, the White House is trying to turn the page on the signal group chat controversy, even though a growing number of lawmakers, including some Republicans, are calling for an investigation since this pertains to our national security. Plus, a behind the scenes look at the 2024 election, including what propelled Donald Trump into the Oval Office and Democrats into the wilderness. The authors of the new book Fight Inside the Wildest Battle for the White House, join us ahead on Morning Joe. We're back in 90 seconds.

[Joe Scarborough]

Stay connected with the MSNBC app bringing you breaking news and analysis anytime, anywhere. Watch your favorite shows live, read live blogs and in depth essays and listen to coverage as it unfolds. Go beyond the what to understand the why. Download the app [e-mail] app MSNBC presents a new original podcast hosted by Jen Socket. Each week, she and her guests explore how the Democratic Party is facing this political moment and where it's headed next.

[Mika Brzezinski]

There's probably both messaging and policy issues, but as you look to kind of where the Democratic Party is, do you.

[Charlie Sykes]

Think it's more a messaging issue, more a policy issue?

[Joe Scarborough]

The Blueprint with Jen Psaki. Subscribe to MSNBC Premium on Apple podcasts for ad free listening and bonus content. The first 100 days, bills are passed, executive orders are signed and presidencies are defined. And for Donald Trump's first 100 days, Rachel Maddow is on MSNBC five nights a week.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Now is the time. So we're gonna do it.

[Joe Scarborough]

Providing her unique insight and analysis during this critical time.

[Jonathan Lemire]

How do we strategically align ourselves to.

[Mika Brzezinski]

This moment of information, this moment of.

[Charlie Sykes]

Transition in our country?

[Joe Scarborough]

The Rachel Maddow show, weeknights at 9:00pm Eastern on MSNBC.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Welcome back. Time now for a look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. It' the Hour. Israel's military says it carried out an airstrike inside Lebanon this morning. The attack targeted a member of Hezbollah on the outskirts of Beirut. It's the second attack near Lebanon's capital in less than a week. Renewed fighting has prompted fears that the cease fire between the two sides could unravel. A federal bankruptcy judge rejected Johnson and Johnson's request to approve a $9 billion settlement. Ten tens of thousands of people are suing the company over its claims that its talcum powder caused cancer. The court said the company used a flawed process to solicit votes to accept the deal. The company has maintained that its talc products are safe. And Oscar winning director Sam Mendes is making four separate Beatles movies. Each will follow a different member of the band. Paul Mescal is playing Paul McCartney, Joseph Quinn is starring as George Harrison. Barry Keoghan will portray Ringo Starr, and Harris Dickinson will play John Lennon. Mendes says the Beatles story was simply too huge to fit into a single film. All four movies will be released in theaters in April of 2028.

[Charlie Sykes]

I know someone who's going to be very interested watching all four in succession.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Oh my gosh, that's a lot of Beatles. A binge movie.

[Mika Brzezinski]

That's a lot of Beatles.

[Charlie Sykes]

All right. More lawmakers are calling this morning for an investigation into the Signal Group chat where national security officials added a journalist Jeffrey Goldberg to a discussion about attack plans. But the White House is trying to say the case is closed. Senate Democrats sent a letter to the attorney general yesterday asking for a special counsel council to look into the national security breach. House Democrats on the Intel Committee made a similar request to the director of national intelligence. Some Republican lawmakers also voicing concerns. On Sunday, Senator James Lankford of Oklahoma said an independent investigation is, quote, entirely appropriate. A number of House Republicans also echoing that sentiment. But the White House maintains there's nothing more to do here.

[Mika Brzezinski]

I mean, it's real. I think I think the words speak for themselves. I mean, it's been made public. I. I do think. I know Senator Roger Wicker has requested an IG investigation into this. And I think the real question is, were any American lives put at risk by this?

[Jonathan Lemire]

Do you think they were?

[Eugene Robinson]

I don't know.

[Mike Allen]

I don't know.

[Mika Brzezinski]

But I think that's as the President has made it very clear. Mike Waltz continues to be an important part of his national security team. And this case has been closed here.

[Jonathan Lemire]

At the White House.

[Mika Brzezinski]

As far as we are concerned, there have been steps made to ensure that something like that can obviously never happen again.

[Jonathan Lemire]

And we're moving forward.

[Mika Brzezinski]

And the President and Mike Waltz and his entire national security team have been.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Working together very well, if you look.

[Eugene Robinson]

At how much safer the United States.

[Mika Brzezinski]

Of America is because of the leadership of this.

[Charlie Sykes]

So, John, you have some Senate Democrats suggesting this needs to go to the Attorney General and that Xi Pambani needs to do something about it. The problem is she has said a couple of times now that this was just a mistake and it's time to move on. Acting more like a White House spokesperson than the Attorney General.

[Joe Scarborough]

Yeah.

[Eugene Robinson]

The Department of Justice has made clear they want nothing to do with this. The FBI as well, they're not going to look into this matter. We heard there, that was White House Press Secretary Karen Levitt gaggling on the driveway yesterday, suggesting that the White House considers the matter closed. You know, as I reported last week, there's certainly some deep unhappiness in Trump world, particularly about Mike Waltz, the national security adviser, that they feel like this has been. This was sloppy, it was a distraction. But the President doesn't want to give in his words, a scalp to Democrats and particularly the media. He doesn't. He was reminded of how many. How chaotic his first term was. A lot of early exits, including his then National Security Advisor, Mike Flynn. They don't want to go there, that down. Go down that road again. I don't think Waltz's job security is, I think, still somewhat tenuous. But Mike Allen, he's not going anywhere, at least not yet. And we're seeing the White House try to turn this desperately, try to turn the page. And tomorrow they're gonna get a lot of headlines from Liberation Day because the economy's probably gonna react very poorly to that. But talk to us about how what you're hearing from Republicans, because there does a sense. I talked to some Trump advisors. We talked about this in the show yesterday. This is the first story they feel like. Well, this one's stuck. This one has done some damage. And their efforts to turn the page quickly, it may not work.

[Mika Brzezinski]

That's right. And a big factor in that is the fact that the national security advisor, Mike Walz, already had some people who didn't like his style, didn't like some of his personnel choices. There was a feeling that there's a former Green Marais, a former congressman who's used to being the star and he's now national security adviser is a staff role and he has a big boss, Susie Wiles, the chief of staff and a very big boss, the president. And so Axios reports that behind the scenes, flying back from Greenland, the vice president Vance, Mike Walls, both in Greenland. On the way back, the vice president had a little talk with Wallds about working collaboratively and that's why he's there for a while. And the president who behind the scene considered firing him but cooled down, talked himself out of it and he is keeping this team for a while, does not want to give a win to critics.

[Jonathan Lemire]

So interesting. Not only has this stuck, it's the style in which the White House went to push back the Signal story that I think really turned a lot of people off. Sort of the arrogant pushback back, blaming the reporter. Lots of different reasons. Look over here, look over there. And especially for military families, the Signal chat scandal, the revelation as to how they were so flagrantly communicating about an imminent attack, all CAPS emojis for military families, that really cuts deep because, because they need to know that they can trust the defense sector, the foreign policy experts, the national security advisors, the defense secretary and those who run our military, John Heilman, in a way that makes them feel know that this country is doing everything they can to keep their family members safe. And that clearly was such a brief reach. It, it's chilling. And so the pushback for them especially, and this is what I've heard personally, was even more upsetting because they don't know what to believe now.

[Mika Brzezinski]

Right. And you know, Mika, obviously I think that's that is something there's been reporting on this in a bunch of places, including the New York Times about the ripple through active duty, the families of active duty military currently and in the veterans community. This is one of these things where Donald Trump has over the course of his time in public life done a lot of things, said a lot of things, is reported to have said a lot of things that people thought on the face of them should have alienated the community, the constituency of veterans and military, including some things that Jeff Goldberg reported in the past. And yet none of them have really stuck to Trump. This is a little different. And I think you may be onto something because unlike some of those cases where it was still the case that if you. Trump claimed fake news, he even said a hundred times, even though there have been lots of corroborations of it, that he never referred to people in the military as suckers and losers. If you wanted to believe that that was fake news, there was no recording of it. You could believe, you could be convinced by Donald Trump that that was fake news. This is one of these stories that really has transcended politics. And it's one of those stories that's really cut into the culture because it's such a relatable story. And maybe this is the kind of thing that will have more of a lasting effect on the way that people in the military and veterans of the military look at Donald Trump and the people around him. Because this is the thing that no one's really denying that it happened. You can't deny that it happened. And the way the pushback is being handled, as you said, is very, I'd say, not just, not just disingenuous, but disrespectful.

[Jonathan Lemire]

Yeah. And to add to that, John, just one other thing. I don't think it's specifically Trump. I think it's the people around him that they are really questioning. Mike Waltz opened the chat, included Jeffrey Goldberg, and then proceeded to defame him and accuse them of somehow sneaking into the chat, which is losing. But then you have Pete Hegseth and you have the Secretary of Defense seemingly excitedly announcing these attack plans on signal in all caps, and really seeming to enjoy being able to release this information to a large group of people in a number of places over a commercial app, which is just beyond irresponsible for anyone. And you don't have to be in the intelligence community to know. Then add to that the recent reports that he's bringing his wife and other family members to high level meetings. It just doesn't feel serious. And if you're a member of the military or you're a family member of someone in the military, this is as serious as a heart attack. And nothing about it is money and nothing, no excuse that is given is enough. They want answers. They want changes in policies and procedures. They want to know this isn't happening right now and it will never happen again. And nothing that the White House or Pete Hagseth or Mike Waltz has done has helped with that at all. John Eilman and Mike Allen, thank you both very much for coming on this morning. Coming up, we'll take a break from politics and turn to sports and the latest success by a major League baseball player using a trendy new torpedo style bat. Morning Joe will be right back.

[Joe Scarborough]

Stay connected with the MSNBC app bringing you breaking news and analysis anytime, anywhere. Watch your favorite shows like read live blogs and in depth essays and listen to coverage as it unfolds. Go beyond the what to understand the why. Download the app [e-mail] app hey everyone, it's Chris Hayes.

[Mika Brzezinski]

This week on my podcast, why Is this Happening? Author and YouTuber John Green on his book Everything Is the History and Persistence of Our Deadliest Infection.

[Joe Scarborough]

I think of the story of human health as like this long staircase that we're walking up. You know, you start out with Hippocrates telling people like, don't even bother treating this. It's totally impossible. And Then eventually in 1882, Robert Koch figures out it's infectious. And then we develop chest X rays and better diagnostics and then we develop really good antibiotics. And now people are able to be cured of tuberculosis. And we're walking up and up and up the staircase. And I want to be clear, like we didn't take like two or three steps down the staircase, we fell down the staircase. That's what's happening right now.

[Mika Brzezinski]

That's this week on why is this Happening? Search for why is this Happening Wherever you're listening right now.

[Joe Scarborough]

And stay up to date on the biggest issues of the day with the MSNBC daily newsletter. Each morning you'll get analysis by experts you trust, video highlights from your favorite shows.

[Jonathan Lemire]

I do think it's worth being very clear eyed, very realistic about what's going on here.

[Joe Scarborough]

Previews of our podcasts and documentaries, plus written perspectives from the newsmakers themselves, all sent directly to your inbox each morning. Get the best of MSNBC all in one place. Sign up for msnbc daily@msnbc.

[Mika Brzezinski]

Oh my goodness.

[Joe Scarborough]

Oh wow.

[Mika Brzezinski]

In your life, have you seen anything.

[Charlie Sykes]

Like Vern Lundqvist with the Call, not just one of the greatest shots in Masters history, but in Golf History. 2005 at Augusta. Tiger woods dropping that chip as he battled for what would be the fourth Green jacket of his career. Our next guest was with Tiger for three of those Masters wins as well as nine other major victories. Joining us now is former caddy Steve Williams, who you saw in that high five at Augusta. He was on the bag Tiger from 90 to 2011. He's the co author of the New book. Together we roared alongside Tiger for his epic 12 year, 13 majors run. Steve, thanks for being on the show. We appreciate it so much to ask you here, but just watching that shot. Can you tell me about the conversation leading up to that shot, that iconic shot at Augusta in 2005, what the two of you were thinking there?

[Mike Allen]

Yeah, Tiger, he got up to the shot there and had a pretty good look at it, obviously, and tried to pick out a spot where the ball wouldn't. Where you landed on the green, where it sort of wouldn't go too far up that hill, where it gathered too much speed and then come racing back down the hole. And amazingly, he pointed out a pitch mark which was on the green and said, you know, Stevie, do you think if I land it somewhere near that pitch mark, that'll won't gather too much speed in that? It was amazing because he actually landed exactly on that pitch mark. I mean, he could stand there for the rest of his life and probably never hold that shot. So, yeah, it was a pretty special moment, obviously.

[Charlie Sykes]

Wow.

[Eugene Robinson]

So, Steve, obviously, Tiger woods, one of the absolute greatest. We're not quite sure when he'll play next, coming off of another injury, but just talk to us a little bit about the longevity here. Obviously, his career has had some. Some real ups and downs, but it's to have another act here in his recent years, you know, your run with him, and he continues to go speak to us about just what you saw all along. Did you have hints that he would be this good for this long because the. The duration of his career is part of what makes him so remarkable?

[Mike Allen]

Yeah, look, in professional golf, there's probably nobody ever that's had the amount of desire to continually to improve throughout his entire career and just keep working hard to do well. And, you know, in professional sports and golf, there's lots of fortune and fame come your way as you gain success. And sometimes that success and all that fortune and fame can make your career slow down a little bit and you take your foot off the gas a little bit. But this, this guy Tiger, is a very special individual in the golfing, in the golfing world, because he just kept wanting to get better and better and better and keep working towards getting better and better and better and never took his foot off the gas. So his desire, his dedication and his focus to keep getting better is unlike anyone we've ever seen in golf. And yeah, and, you know, he's a student of the game, a massive history historian of the game, and he just wanted to keep break all the records and get better and better. So remarkable mental ability to block everything out and just try and get better and better all the time. Steve, this is Gene Robinson. When I think of that epic run with Tiger and you on the bag, I think of him making shots that no other golfer would even attempt. Shots out of the rough, shots out of fairway bunkers especially where you, you had to put spin on the ball from a place where you can't really spin it, or you had to keep it low, but it had to still land softly. It's just stuff that nobody would even try. And yet he pulls off. In your pre shot conversations, did you suggest that he do the impossible or was that more Tiger? Yeah, over a period of time when you get used to working for a player and that and you, you end up with a sense of, you know, when they're going to try something, when they're not going to try something. And I was always well known for walking at a pretty quick pace. So when I got up to the ball ahead of Tiger, I'd be a good 30 seconds ahead of him generally. And I'll have an understanding straight away whether this was a shot that he was to attempt or not. And yeah, look, he pulled off. If you had a highlight reel of all the shots that he pulled off that were remarkable, yeah, it's pretty amazing. But yeah, he, he had complete trust in himself and, and to be fair, you wouldn't realize, but a guy like Tiger, he practiced a lot of these shots out of the rough and from time to time, a lot of these big hooks, big fades, high shots, low shots, impossible shots, even shots where you sometimes, you know, you get on your hands and knees and hit a few balls on the driving range on your, on your knees. So, you know, whilst some amazing shots, a lot of there's a, and to be fair, there's always a bit of luck in some of these shots, but also those shots that sometimes you'd actually practice and you know, the skill set was amazing.

[Charlie Sykes]

And Steve, you mentioned the word trust, that he had so much trust in his ability, but also so much trust in you. For people who don't really know golf at the level that you all competed, there has to be that trust your brothers in some way to get the right club, to get the right shot, to get the right distance, to know that you'll keep your relationship private and all of those things. And at some point that trust went away for you too. You had some harsh things to say about Tiger in your previous book. And when he had the car accident in 2009, and this all opened up. You said in this new book you had didn't hear from him for months. So at what point did that trust start to go a little bit sideways? And where are you today with him?

[Mike Allen]

Yeah, look, you worked alongside a guy like Tiger, who's obviously an amazing athlete to work alongside now, had an incredible relationship, and obviously through the scandal and things, we didn't connect as much as I'd like to connect. And when I went back to work for Tiger following his scandal, things just weren't the same. There wasn't the same connection between the two of us. And that happens. You know, you totally understand the relationship between a player and caddy, that things change from time to time and that so. And, you know, through time, everything. Everything. There's an old saying that time heals, and it's very true. The last time I saw Tiger, a couple years ago at a tournament in Los Ang. Although I don't care anymore. I was just filling in for a couple of weeks for a friend cadding and that everything was good. So, yeah, look, Evan and I are hugely proud of the book, and we've sent Tiger a copy of the book, and I really feel like if he read the book, it'd be a great memory down memory lane for him as well as. As well as myself. So we, like I said, Evan and I are hugely proud of the book. There's some sort of never heard before stories behind the scenes of Tiger and ice and, you know, some great memorabilia shots in there, photos of different memorabilia, Billy that was able to collect from Tiger and some personal notes and stuff. So, yeah, it's a great book, and even I'm really proud of it.

[Mika Brzezinski]

You know, Steve, Willie, Willie talked about and John talked about Tiger being able to sort of push aside all the distractions. You look at the great ones in many sports.

[Charlie Sykes]

What a.

[Mika Brzezinski]

One of the best things I've ever heard. Like, you know, his story. Mariana was Rivera, you know, the greatest of all time. Relief pitcher gives up a home run in a crucial spot. His teammates expect him to be crushed. They go into the plane, he's got his headphones in and he's back and he's singing and whistling, eyes closed. It's like, you know, he shut that out because you knew tomorrow was another day. Tiger from. From the second he stepped onto the.

[Charlie Sykes]

Golf course, he had all these distractions.

[Mika Brzezinski]

All the world was looking him all the time. And I'm just curious how. Talk about the mental tough, toughness. Talk about the routine with with all the distractions he always had from the earliest of ages when he stepped on the golf course, how did he, once he step on the course, shut all of that out and just focus on the next shot?

[Mike Allen]

Yeah, that's an incredible skill to have. You got to be able to compartmentalize and I don't think anybody's been ever, you know, in golf has been better at being able to compartmentalize like Tiger has been able to, to do. You know, I, from a very young age, Tyler Tig was, you know, had huge expectations on him and you know, he learned very quickly from his amateur days and that what, what was expected and what was likely going to happen when he got onto the Tour and the fanfare he got when he got onto the Tour. It's just a skill set that he was able to develop very quickly and he was, you know, be able to put everything behind him and focus every day on what was ahead of him. You know, he had a good team of people around him all the time and that, that enabled him to focus on his job and separate, you know, to be able to go to the golf course and you know, I played somewhat of a bodyguard, enforcer type role to enable him when he was at the golf course practicing and to keep people away so that he could focus on his job when he was going to the golf course. That was his work office, that's his space and he wanted to dedicate his time efficiently every time he came to the golf course. So yeah, that's a skill set that's worthy of any major champion in sport.

[Jonathan Lemire]

The new book together we roared alongside Tiger for his epic 12 Year 30 Teen Majors run is on sale now. Co author and major winning caddy, Steve Williams. Thank you so much for coming on the show this morning. Congratulations on the book. Good to have you.

[Mika Brzezinski]

Great, great to have him here. And you know, Lemire, who else has that talent?

[Jonathan Lemire]

Who?

[Joe Scarborough]

Rafi Devers.

[Eugene Robinson]

Rafi Devers.

[Mika Brzezinski]

But you're thinking he's going to have to hit the 92 mile an hour fastball floating across the center of the plate. But he remains focused on striking out.

[Charlie Sykes]

And he's done an extraordinary job.

[Eugene Robinson]

He has the ability to strike out, put his head down, go back to the D, gather himself, come back to the plate, strike out again.

[Joe Scarborough]

Five immersive worlds, one amazing theme park. Get ready to explore the all new Universal Epic Universe featuring the wizarding world of Harry Potter, Ministry of Magic, Super.

[Mika Brzezinski]

Nintendo World, how to train your Dragon.

[Joe Scarborough]

Isle of Burke and Dark Universe. Epic Universe opens May 22 at Universal Orlando Resort. Our universe will never be the same. Tickets and packages on sale now at universalorlando.

[Mika Brzezinski]

Com.