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A
This episode is brought to you by Venmo. With the Venmo Debit card, a taco in one hand and ordering a ride in the other means you're stacking your rewards. Nice. Get up to 5% cash back with Venmo Stash on your favorite brands. When you pay with your Venmo Debit card, pick a bundle with your go tos and start earning cash back. Do more Stash get more cash. Visit venmo.com to learn more. Venmo Stash Bundle terms and exclusions apply. See terms at venmo me terms max $100 cash back per month.
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The AI revolution has taken the world by storm, rapidly reshaping the job market, the stock market and geopolitics. Along with triggering a technological arms race with China, AI is already heavily influencing the vast majority of people on a professional and personal level.
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The revolution has come so quickly that few have had a chance to ask crucial questions about it, including who's really making the decisions behind the scenes, what's actually driving them, and where exactly all of this is heading.
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In this episode, we sit down with Wynton hall, who spent several years working to answer those crucial questions and is now sounding the alarm about the need to take action now. I'm Daily Wire Executive Editor John Bickley with Georgia Howe. This is a weekend edition of Morning Wire.
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Joining us now to discuss the questions about the AI revolution that many haven't yet asked or are afraid to ask is Wynton hall, social media Director for Breitbart News and author of the new book Code Red, the Left, the Right, China and the Race to Control AI. So first of all, thank you so much for joining us. It's great to see you.
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E
It's great to see you. It's always good to see you.
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B
We're really interested in this on a lot of, a lot of levels. The AI revolution has been dramatic. It's been shocking. I think for a lot of people. It's scaring a lot of people. And your book looks at this from a very particular angle. And this is from a political angle. Can you, you know, big picture, can you unpack that for us?
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Yeah. I really wanted to look at AI as not just a tool. We often hear it said it's just a tool. It's actually political power. And the I wanted to do that is because I spent two years deep diving into this world. And you realize that a lot of Americans just really don't know much beyond the obvious names and certainly don't know the donation histories, the ideologies, the backgrounds of the AI architects that are remaking this world. You know, I think 99% of us use AI even though 64% of Americans don't realize when they're using AI because it's baked into the algorithms of our weather apps and our streaming services and our gps. So we're already using AI. We don't get to opt out of this. And I think that the conservative movement has got to have a one stop shop in a sense. And that's what the sort of idea was, Code Red. The title was actually a double meaning. Code red in the sense of an alarm or an alert flare, but also a code, a set of principles for the red political side of the ball, the conservative movement to be able to have to guide us through this. Because, John, it's going to be the decider between what erases jobs or creates jobs. Indoctrination versus education and education, whether you come home alive or dead on the battlefield with our AI warfare accelerating right now. And so I really wanted to help to shorten everybody's learning curve and really learn who these people are and what is their real ideological agenda.
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B
Yeah. And so to that question, first of all, it does strike me, most of us don't realize we're using AI. Like you said, 64% don't realize we're using it. So the people that are behind this, in terms of the names that we do know, what don't we know that's behind the scenes?
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E
So it's a great question. So first of all, Peter Thiel famously said that Silicon Valley is a one party state. And he's right. 85% of all political donations in Silicon Valley flow to the Democrats. There are obviously notable exceptions and a lot of heroic and sort of courageous libertarian conservative people that inhabit that space, even though they're outliers. And there are sizable ones, the obvious, Marc Andreessen, Elon Musk and Peter Thiel. But the reality is that the people at the real forefront of this race, most of them have a very deep ideological slant toward the left and have put their money where their mouth is. And they don't just view AI as a product or a tool. They look at it as a way to bring about a reset either economically, globally, certainly even down to the transhuman humanism merging of, you know, moving us past, toward the singularity, moving us past just regular human life. And so what I want to do is look at that and I think one example I'll just give you. So in 2016, there was a young man, he was in his early 30s and he went on a blog and he said, I want to do a longitudinal study and I want to give $1,000 away to low income people with no Strings attached, no strings attached. This is what you and I would call Universal Basic Income. Right? Ubi. And he says, I want to do this because I think in the future technology may require some kind of UBI. Now, he spent $60 million, the largest American UBI study ever done in American history. Okay. And then he dropped the mask. He said, I also think that one day we will look at it as silly and odd that we ever thought that using fear of not eating should be the motivation for human flourishing and work. That's a paraphrase. That's known as the Protestant work ethic. Right. That's known as the thing that has driven free market capitalism. And that young man's name was Sam Altman.
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B
Yeah.
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And Sam Altman was doing that in 2016. When was ChatGPT released? November 2022. Now, why is he thinking almost six years ahead about massive wealth redistribution and Universal basic Income? It's because he has been a very dedicated Democratic support and donor for many, many years, until the most recent Trump inauguration. And there are many stories like that. And so I really just go through this, got 80 pages of endnotes. It's very nerdy. I know. You're a.
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You're always very thorough. We love our footnotes.
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That's right.
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Try it today at Starbucks.
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You know, I think one of the questions is, are these individual actors, individual companies working individually, in isolation, or is there a sense that there is a network forming that's mutually beneficial for some of these players? In other words, this can turn into something truly global and truly influence all parts of life easily. Is there what, you know, which is it? Is this silos or is this a network?
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E
Yeah, it's more toward the network. And there are different ecosystems. So within Anthropic, which is Dario Amade's company, this is the one that we've recently seen with the War Department and this battle over the contracts, they gravitate towards something called the effective altruist movement, the EA movement. And this is a very large and well funded group. And their primary aim is to bring about something called global AI, global governance. And what they want is to have supranational globalist control of sort of the wef, like World Economic Forum or you know, a UN style global enterprise to regulate everything from DEI mandates inside of AI. So that when you ask, I'll borrow your colleague Matt Walsh's, famous phrase, what is a woman? When the AI comes back, if that is not giving the proper sort of DEI response, is that hate speech? And therefore should that not be allowed? So they want to bring about global governance, not just on that kind of a level, but also with compute, meaning access to GPUs, graphics processing units, the brain, if you will, the chips that drive so much of AI innovation. And so you have that ecosystem. You also have others who are more toward transhumanism, not transgender, but transhumanism, which is moving toward what they believe is the singularity, which is this moment when human and machine will become one and will be transcended into almost a different species. This sounds like some craziness out of sci fi, but this is very real. Ray Kurzweil and many of them, the technologists really do want to accelerate AI in that direction. And so I have a whole discussion in Code Red about faith. And right now there are churches where they are setting up AI as a God.
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TikTok Aurelia
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head to worship. There are confessionals of AI Jesus where you confess in a confessional booth to an AI avatar and have it respond as, you know, a religious leader. It is going very far and very fast. And what I really think we have to do is coach ourselves up because like I said, we don't get to opt out of this. I think the conservative movement, one of the big challenges, we're not in a lot of these rooms because Silicon Valley is such a. A one sided place.
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B
Yeah, let's get to that. What do conservatives need to do? What does that look like in the next few years?
- [11:54]
E
That's really great question. First thing is we have to learn the lexicon and understand, not at a tech level. You don't have to be a technologist to understand this. And what I really try to do is make it simple without being simplistic so people can really understand the concepts. Second, I think we have to understand the backgrounds and motivations of these people. A lot of these are new names. I mean, all of us know who Bill Gates is, right? Us know sort of, you know, Mark Zuckerberg. But you know, most people don't know who Mustafa Suleiman is at Microsoft AI. They may probably never even heard of that name. Well, he's one of the most important people. Or you know, Demis Hassabas or, you know, Geoffrey Hinton or a lot of these people they don't really know. So we need to get acquainted with the characters, the cast of characters, and really just listen in their own words to what their motivations are. And then what we really need to do is understand this, and I think this is the most important thing, John, is that the policy matrix that the conservative movement has known is about to get completely remade in seismic ways. Let me give you an example. If I say abortion, we all know, you know, I've been a movement conservative my whole Life, you know, 9010. We know where the conservative movement is. Tax cuts or tax raises, we know where they are. Pro military, pro national. If I say AI policy.
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Yeah.
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I mean, we don't even yet have a common grammar as a movement. So if we don't know the lexicon, but also we need to have a family discussion and debate, you know, we need to do it the good old fashioned way in the conservative movement and think it through and argue it out. But we better get moving fast. Okay? Because this is moving very quickly. Let me give you how quickly. Dario Amade at anthropic just two months ago said that within the next 12 months, not way off in the wild future 12 months, you're looking at 50% of white collar entry level job replacement because of AI that's otherwise known as our kids who graduate college. I know you're a professor. You and I both are kids who played by the rules. They took out a bunch of loans and now they're coming into a workplace. And that career ladder, those first two rungs are getting hacked off potentially if that comes true. Second, Mustafa Suleiman is the Microsoft AI CEO. He says that within the next 12 to 18 months, 100% of white collar tasks will be able to be automated. Now, that doesn't mean that all those jobs will go away. What he's saying is that over time, if those companies start to automate, they could go away. There are some people who think that this is just a lot of hype, marketing, and they say, look, during the Industrial revolution, yes, the candle went away, but the electric light bulb came. The free market will solve it. The argument they make though, John, is that this time is different. And here's why. We're scaling human cognition. We're not scaling moving atoms in blue collar work. And so yes, new jobs will be created in an AI economy, but those jobs will also potentially be able to be done as a Gentic AI, which is text to action. AI comes on. So this is a 5D chess game and we got to get coached up real quick.
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B
Yeah, we've seen it here. I mean, I've been amazed at the transformation of our workplace by the Accessibility, the ability to use AI in all kinds of different tasks. One person maximized in their capacity to do a lot more work than we could before as a single individual. I think most of us are starting to realize this is not just hype. Final question, pretty open here. From your experience in doing this research, what was one of the big shocks for you? Was there anything that just kind of stopped you in your tracks and you were surprised to learn?
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E
Yeah, I try to be very balanced. I call it roses and landmines. There are going to be a lot of opportunities and this I didn't want to write a doomer apocalypse book. There's a lot of hopeful solutions and I think great things. I think young entrepreneurs are going to have more ability than they've ever had. If you have fire in the belly and you're a young person, you don't have a lot of money, but you got a lot of grit and heart and you got dreams, you're going to be able to scale your little idea into something very big. So there are positives. The one that really stuck out to me though, John, would be this. What I consider and what we call, and I say it in the last chapter is a potential crisis of meaning. And by that I mean if we do see this erosion of jobs and it's not just hype to try to build support for the universal basic income, either way it can be used for political leverage. I am very concerned about how that affects people at soul depth. When you and I go to a party or a social setting or a Christmas party with our family and we're talking to a new person, what's one of the first things we, you know, what do you do for a living? Right. And especially for men, you know, our ability to feed our family and take care of our children and to, you know, serve our community and our family, that is a part of our identity. And when men don't have that sort of meaning and structure, that again, the Protestant work ethic that has sort of served us for so long, they become very self destructive and you know, all kinds of addiction and you know, depression and worse. So I think this crisis of meaning is a very real danger. I think it's an opportunity for honestly people of faith because people are going to need community and reaching out. And so I try to end on that hopeful note. But I think that we've just really got to understand how fast this is changing and that we really have to understand the matrix, such an important topic
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B
affecting all of us in so many ways, so rapidly. Thank you so much for talking with us. Really excited about the response to your book. It's already it's been out for a week now. Can't wait to see the impact it has. Appreciate it.
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I'll always appreciate you. Thank you so much.
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That was Wynton hall, author of Code the Left, the Right China and the Race to Control AI and this has been a weekend edition of MORNING Wire.