Navigating Youth Travel Baseball in 2025 - Truths You Need To Hear

Summary

Most Valuable Agent with Matt Hannaford

Episode: Navigating Youth Travel Baseball in 2025 – Truths You Need To Hear
Release Date: August 6, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode is a comprehensive guide to the evolving, complex world of youth travel baseball, designed specifically for young players and parents seeking clarity amidst a $40-billion youth sports industry. Matt Hannaford curates the top advice from interviews with seasoned coaches, travel team leaders, former pro players, and college recruiters. The collective wisdom focuses on youth development, competition, and the sometimes harsh truths about exposure, recruiting, and the realities of modern travel baseball.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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The “Exposure Trap” vs. Real Player Development

[00:12–10:00]

• Many families mistakenly treat youth baseball as an investment, believing maximum exposure is the fastest path to scholarships or pro contracts.
• Craig Holman (ex-pro, travel coach, father of 2024 draftee Luke Holman) emphasizes that exposure should be a byproduct, not the goal:
  • “Development. I preached just development. It doesn't matter...No one cares who won the 15U travel tournament in New Jersey in two years.” — Craig Holman [07:08]
  • “Be ready for the exposure. If you’re not ready, it’s not good exposure.” — Craig Holman [08:31]

Reframing Priorities:

• Matt Hannaford urges families to flip the usual hierarchy:
  • Typical order: Exposure → Competition → Development
  • Recommended order: Development → Competition → Exposure

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The Reality of Talent Evaluation and Parental Roles

[02:33–06:00]

• Parents often struggle to objectively evaluate their own child’s ability.
• Craig Holman encourages honest appraisal:
  • “Sometimes we get caught up that this is my kid... I’ve never met one dad that didn’t think his son was the best player.” [03:41]
  • “What I did very well was I saw the flaws in my son... Said look, you don’t do this well. We got to work on that.” [03:55]
  • Importance of seeking feedback from others and “being a dad first.”

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Embracing Adversity—and Why Losing Matters

[11:26–14:47]

• Young players must face struggles to foster improvement:
  • “If you wish to never struggle for your child, you’ll never be good. You’ve got to enjoy the struggle…” — Craig Holman [12:12]
• Losing in high-level tournaments is seen as essential for growth:
  • “I really took them to good tournaments hoping they’d get their ass beat...when [your kid] gets his ass handed to him on the mound, be happy because I promise you he’s going to put in more work.” — Craig Holman [12:14, 12:44]

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The Modern Travel Organization – Structure, Growth & Philosophy

Growth of Travel Teams: The “Chain” (Now Five Star National) Model

Andy Burris [15:08–25:44]

• Began as a local, locally-funded team; expanded to 52 locations in US, Canada, Australia, Puerto Rico.
• Andy Burris: Emphasis on collaboration and local coach partnerships to bridge gaps between “small town” talent and national exposure.
• On development vs. showcase reputation:
  • Burris shares he prioritized individual development at home rather than constant team practice:
    “From my perspective, I don’t think that practice with a team ... is a necessity. Because I saw it happen.” [25:22]

Responsibility Shifts:

• Focus is on players’ individual work, not just team activities.
  • “What are you doing in the interim to make sure you’re getting better? ... The onus falls on the player.” — Matt Hannaford [25:44]

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National Programs and Talent Identification

Jeff Petty, Canes Baseball [26:39–36:15]

• Early travel teams were always local; over time, national scope became the model for elite travel programs.
• The Canes adopted a “best player, regardless of region” philosophy.
  • “If you’re really chasing the best prospect you can get, you can’t stick to a three-state area.” — Jeff Petty [30:54]
• Canes pride themselves on honest talent evaluation even if it means losing players:
  • “We’re not one of those groups that takes the check and says, oh man, we’re going to...call all these Division 1 schools when we don’t think you can play at that level.” [31:46]
  • “Can you handle being told the truth?” [32:52]

On Two-Way Players & Specialization:

• Truthful conversations with families about realistic roles:
  • “There’s a kid right now who I think is one of the best arms...he wants to play shortstop...he’s not going to play shortstop for this team...” [33:28]
  • “If you want to go hit your last summer, go hit. He doesn’t need to play for us.” [35:24]

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The Recruiting & College Choice Process—What’s Changed

Matthew Maniscalco [36:15–48:43]

• Explains the “old way” (American Legion, local teams, 20-25 summer games), with less exposure and slower recruitment.
• The recruiting process once centered around fit and campus visits, not early commitments or showcases.
  • “For me, kind of growing up...I was always fighting to be the best player in the city parks...there was always somebody bigger, faster, stronger than me.” [39:13]
  • “I’m grateful that my dad made me take all my visits...I’m grateful that nobody pressured me into a quick decision.” [44:05]
• Advocates for rule changes that delay recruiting and allow players to mature:
  • “That’s the best thing [the NCAA] have done...the August 1st after your junior summer, it protects those young kids and it protects those coaches.” — Maniscalco [46:00]
• Early commitments are problematic for both players and coaches (decommits, evolving rosters, scholarship limits).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

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Parental Perspective & Player Mindset

• “Be a dad. Be a dad. There's so many people around us as fathers that can help us.”
  — Craig Holman [03:01]
• “Are you ready to be seen?”
  — Craig Holman [08:32]
• “The more reps that you put in, I think you kind of become that person. You can't just think about it...but everybody wanted exposure until they got it and they didn’t do well.”
  — Craig Holman [09:38]

On Adversity

• “The wolf is always at the door... You’re never, ever comfortable.”
  — Craig Holman [14:16]
• “The introduction into success...was this agitation and strain.”
  — Sean Casey (referenced) [12:44]

Real Talk about Travel Baseball

• “You don’t have to do everything. You can be selective.”
  — Matt Hannaford [10:00]

Travel Team Philosophy

• “I said, I’ve got to form a relationship with that guy, you know, because 1 there’s no need not to. 2. He may have another guy that comes through, you know.”
  — Andy Burris [19:13]
• On brand standards and growth:
  “You have to do things a certain way.”
  — Matt Hannaford [19:13]
• “We have a lot of players that end up not playing for us because we're so diligent about telling the truth in the evaluation process.”
  — Jeff Petty [31:18]
• “If a kid wants to go hit his last summer, right, go hit. He doesn’t need to play for us...”
  — Jeff Petty [35:24]

Old-School Recruiting Wisdom

• “You will take all five of your official visits. You will not tell any of these schools that you're committing...until you take all five of your visits.”
  — Maniscalco's father [43:20]
• “I'm grateful NCAA instituted this new rule where... it protects those young kids and it protects those coaches.”
  — Matthew Maniscalco [46:00]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:01] – Parental objectivity and “being a dad first”
• [07:08] – Why development trumps exposure in the long run
• [08:31] – The dangers of seeking exposure before readiness
• [12:12] – Why struggling and losing are essential for growth
• [15:09–19:13] – The origins and expansion philosophy of five star/Chain travel baseball
• [25:22–26:16] – Individual responsibility for development
• [26:39–31:18] – Canes’ transition from regional to national, talent-driven team building
• [31:18–35:24] – Brutal honesty in player evaluation and specialization
• [36:15–44:30] – Then vs. now: Recruiting, commitment, and making the college choice
• [46:00–48:43] – NCAA recruiting rule reforms and final parental advice

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Episode Summary

This episode delivers a much-needed reality check on youth travel baseball in 2025. The experts and coaches hammer home the message that genuine athletic development—not hype, politics, or early exposure—is what builds long-term success. They urge parents to maintain perspective, remain honest about their child’s abilities, and prioritize personal growth and adversity over chasing every tournament. Travel organizations are evolving, but the core truths remain: be selective, embrace struggle, accept honest feedback, and let development—and readiness—lead the way to success and higher-level opportunities.

If you're a parent or player navigating youth baseball, this episode is an essential listen for cutting through noise and setting a path toward sustainable achievement.

Transcript

[Andy Burris]

Foreign.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Today, we are diving deep into a topic that resonates with so many families. What seems to be this ever evolving and often overwhelming world of travel baseball. Now, this is a landscape. It looks vastly different from even a decade ago, obviously. National program showcases and a ton of early recruiting going on. The Aspen Institute, they estimate that the youth sports industry generates $40 billion a year. You heard that right. 40 billion. Parents are starting to reconcile this reality of these rising costs by viewing youth sports as an investment. So it begs the question, what is all this really for? What's the end game? Parents sometimes mistakenly think that the only pathway to realize their investment is getting as much exposure as often as possible for their son. Now, our guests today, they're all deeply embedded in the game. As a former pro player, themselves, coach, coaches and leaders of major travel organizations, their perspectives challenge conventional wisdom and offer invaluable insights to young players and parents who want to be a part of the solution. So please join us as we explore the essential pillars of development, of competition, and the hard truths required to truly succeed in youth baseball. All right, welcome back to the podcast, everybody. This compilation episode, it's my ultimate travel baseball guide for young players, where we've chosen to feature all our best pieces of advice to date in really one episode. Now, I want parents and young players to have access to more truth, more wisdom that you really might not get just on the field alone. This is my strategic blueprint for maximizing player development, all within the ever evolving youth baseball space. Now, I'm going to let my guests speak for themselves, though. We're going to hear from Craig Holman. He's a former pro player himself who guided his son Luke through the college process and through the draft. Luke started at Alabama, transferred to LSU, became the Friday night starter at LSU before becoming the 71st overall pick in the 2024 draft. I got to know you through your son, Luke. But one of the things that I think is important for us to talk about, that I know that the listener will want to know about is, so you're somebody who played professional baseball yourself, right? You're somebody who helped your son go through the college choice. You're somebody who even helped your son navigate the draft almost. I wouldn't say, like, from the standpoint of an agent, but in a sense, you were almost acting as if, like, look, you're essentially representing him through that whole journey.

[Craig Holman]

Educated father.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

That's right. So I say that all the while knowing, you know, you did all this stuff, but at the same time, you were a dad? Yes. How do you. What advice would you give a lot of the families and the parents today who have a son that they see has a lot of potential? Right. They obviously want what's best for them. What advice would you give them as they're kind of getting into this crazy world of travel baseball and youth baseball?

[Craig Holman]

And the biggest advice I give today, I get a lot of phone calls, is be a dad. Be a dad. There's so many people around us as fathers that can help us. There's two or three pro guys in your neighborhood. There's two or three pro guys that can give you advice around. Reach out to them. They have no problem getting it, giving you advice. The good thing about me is, like I said, I played 10 years of professional baseball, college, All American, and I had all this stuff, but I was still a father and he was still my son. Sometimes we get caught up that this is my kid, and I've never met one dad that didn't think his son was the best player.

[Andy Burris]

Right?

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

No, it's true.

[Craig Holman]

It is. And unfortunately, I say this, and being a Christian man that I am, is we love our kids tremendously. We love them so much that sometimes we don't see the flaws. And I'll be honest with you, what I did very well was I saw the flaws in my son and my daughter, and I said, look, you don't do this well. We got to work on that. Stuff that I struggled with in professional baseball. I had a tough time holding runners. You know, in college, it didn't matter. Strike out most of the guys. Not a lot of great hitters through college lineups, you could pitch around traffic and pro ball. You guys got on and they took bases, they could run. I needed to work on holding runners better. And then after I retired through Tommy John, I went, what were the things that I struggled with? I didn't want Luke to struggle with that. So we spent hours doing pickoffs and things like that. Those were educational things.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

So take us back to. At what point did you start to see something in Luke where you said, you know, this is different, Right. This is not just he has a chance to maybe go play at the next level in college. I think he has a chance to maybe get drafted even out of high school. Like, at what age was that?

[Craig Holman]

14.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Okay, so. And what was it that you saw?

[Craig Holman]

Command and a curveball.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Okay.

[Craig Holman]

His curveball at 14 was better than my curveball at AAA level.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Oh, wow.

[Craig Holman]

It was. And I was catching it, and it had tight spin, and he would throw and I could still catch very well. I'd put on gear and you'd throw it and it hit on top of my foot and. And I'm not a bad guy athlete. And I went, wow, that's. It was almost too, too plain. Break. And I went, that's different. So I had a couple of guys Gene Shaw loved. No. I played Pro bowl with Gene a long time. He was in the Phillies organization, brought him up to my place and I said, I want you to watch my son.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Like, give me someone else's eyes.

[Craig Holman]

Yeah, I didn't want to be that dad, but he was 6 foot, he could throw anything for a strike. He was little and Little League. That's why tell the parents, if your kid's the best 12 year old on the team, great. Be happy. If he's average at 12, be happy. Because you have no idea what they're going to be. Sixteen, it doesn't matter.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

So it's interesting. So I just had someone ask me actually on the YouTube channel a question, and it was a kid who's a 14U shortstop. And he specifically asked, he goes, you know, I get invites to all these different things, whether it's this college baseball camp, whether it's, you know, one of these showcases. What advice would you give me on how I should vet these different events? And my answer essentially was, I think, you know, it's a long winded answer. But number one, it depends on what your goals are. Right. If your goal, I would make the assumption that it's, you want to maybe get a college scholarship one day or get drafted and play professionally if you're lucky, God willing. Right. That's the goal. What I would challenge you is, I think a lot of times the, what I would call kind of the hierarchy of the focus is upside down. So a lot of families or players say, all right, the number one focus for me is exposure. I want to get exposure because if I get exposure, then, you know, I'm going to be ranked high, then scouts will come find me, then colleges will come offer me a scholarship. Right. And then second to that is competition on some level. And then the third focus is development. And my thing to everybody is always, we'll turn that upside down. And this is what I told this player. I said, turn that upside down. If your focus is development, right? And then naturally after you develop, you're going to go compete. And then the byproduct of doing both of those things well eventually will be exposure.

[Craig Holman]

Correct?

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right. But development being the number one piece.

[Craig Holman]

Development. I was a passive Father that I didn't care about winning. I had travel, I had a travel organization. We had 12, 13 teams at one time, a couple of softball teams, maybe even 15 total. I preached just development. It doesn't matter. No one cares who won the 15U travel tournament in New Jersey in two years. Matter of fact, three weeks later, we couldn't name who won it if we lost. So I constantly focused on that with the parents is I never overthrew my kids. I had Saturday throwers and Sunday throwers for my travel team and I had nine D1 pitchers.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

What age is your team?

[Craig Holman]

I coached Luke all the way up through and I coached that main team and I hired other coaches to do the other team. So I went from 10 to 18. I coached him every year. We would add some tracks, some kids would move away, Some kids that weren't getting a lot of playing time would bounce over to another travel team. But it continued to get better. I funded my team most of the time for the medical company that I have. So, yeah, I didn't force the parents to pay me a lot of money. I had a facility, they could practice for free and do those types of things, but it was a lot of charity. I gave a lot of my time, but I wanted them to focus on development. When you talk exposure, I tell people this, be careful about the exposure because if you're not ready for the exposure, it's not good exposure.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right, Exactly.

[Craig Holman]

And so that's the big thing that people miss. I gotta get seen. I gotta get seen. And I would always ask the kids, are you ready to be seen? And they go, what do you mean? Are you at the highest level you possibly can be right now, as a 10th, 11th grader? Because if you got flaws and you get seen and you get the exposure and they see those flaws, they may not want to look at you again.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

That's right.

[Craig Holman]

So I keep telling parents, love the kid. And once again, I can go off this side and I'm a big mental guy. I believe in thinking about things and focusing on things and dreaming about things and life and death is in the tongue and speaking that I'm going to be a great pitcher. And those are things that I used to preach to my kids. Say it, believe it, and it happens. So a lot of parents didn't buy into that. But the key for me with all kids was repetitious work. If you want to be a good fielder, fill 200 ground balls every other day. If you want to hit, hit not 50 balls. I'm talking about get a tee, hit 100 balls, get on a machine, hit 100 balls.

[Andy Burris]

Work, work, work.

[Craig Holman]

And the more. More reps that you put in, I think you kind of become that person. You can't just think about it. And they go, well, I'd love to be a great hitter, but you put in the work, it eventually comes. But everybody wanted exposure until they got it and they didn't do well, and then they may move on. And that was what I preached, is be ready for the exposure.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Well, and I think, look, there's a time and a place for the exposure, right? Is the time and the place at 12? Probably not. Now, here's the thing is, that doesn't mean that players shouldn't go to events at 12 because there's an element of a play against better competition. It's just a matter like when parents are trying to make decisions and there's limited resources and they're wanting to know, hey, my son's 12, what events should we go to? My pushback is always, what are our goals? If our goals are, we want this kid to have fun with his buddies and to ultimately become the best version of himself as a player. You don't need to go to all of these different events every single weekend. I recognize that the coach on the team may say, you need to come to everything, but that doesn't necessarily mean that that is the best use of your. Of your funds. So again, for me, in this answer I gave this player was like, turn that, that, that hierarchy upside down. Focus on development. Get to a place now where maybe you're 16, 17 now. Now let's pick and choose what events to go to. Where do I want to go to be seen. Because, you know, you've seen it, I've seen it. Kids get to the end of their senior year in high school, and they have been running around like crazy. Families haven't taken vacations in years, and they have dropped all this money into the baseball thing, which is fine. But I believe that parents and families need to know going into it, look, this is what it looks like. You don't have to do everything. You can be selective.

[Craig Holman]

Unfortunately, the travel industry makes money off tournaments.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Craig Holman]

And I tried to weave through that. My rule was I like to work 70% of the time, played 30. And a lot of. What do you mean by that? Well, we're going to work during the week. We're going to do workouts. We lifted, we threw, we hit field, the ground balls, and then we get to show out on the weekend. But we go play Three or four games and I'm like, hey, we're good. These are the things that. And I love the big tournaments. We go down to Georgia and PG over and Jupiter and all over, they're great. But what I focused on at a young age, and this is going to be funny to you, but I really took them to good tournaments hoping they'd get their ass beat.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Craig Holman]

And that's a tough thing to say.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

No.

[Craig Holman]

Because, oh, you don't get better. I tell every parent, if you wish to never struggle for your child, you'll never be good. You've got to enjoy the struggle. When he gets his ass handed to him on the mound, be happy because I promise you he's going to put in more work. If he's going out punching out 12, 13 kids and everybody's patting him on the back, that kid doesn't work. He's facing no adversity. The kid that faces adversity has some struggles. And I think that's what helped Luke. I mean, I always talk about Luke. He struggled early.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

No, I mean, look, you bring up a good point. I had Sean Casey on the podcast last week and he literally says he goes the introduction into success for him was this agitation and strain. When you went through it, right. You had your teeth kicked in. Yeah, it's like, welcome. This is what it's going to look like. If you want to play at this level, this is what it's going to look like. So you either going to get comfortable feeling this way or maybe you need to choose something else.

[Craig Holman]

And I never liked in my career, I'll be honest with you, I never felt comfortable. And most of the players that I played with felt the same way. Pro guys, they never felt good. I was rooming with Scott Roland and I hope he gets a chance to hear this. A Hall of Famer. We were rooming together and AAA went out. Now I'll never forget. And he was a second round draft pick. He was just a poster child for the Phillies. We're in AAA and I think he's 1 for 7, 1 for 8. And he's sitting over there watching TV and he's like, I'm gonna get sent down, I'm gonna get sent down. And I looked at him over there and I went, what are you talking about? But he was really concerned. Even those type of guys are concerned. And the best compliment I ever had in many things, baseball, business, I've been very successful in business, was a guy told me this about eight years ago and he said, you know what? I love about you, Craig, the wolf is always at the door. I didn't even know what he meant, so I said, I don't understand. And he goes, you're never, ever comfortable. When you go to the door and you hear a knock, you think the.

[Andy Burris]

Wolf could be there.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Oh, wow.

[Craig Holman]

So he said, and it's me. It's totally my personality. And he'd been dealing with me in orthopedics for a long time. And he said, you're just never comfortable. And he said, from what I've seen, and he's very successful in orthopedic business in the country. And he said that the great ones. And he never played sports, just very good at business. He said, the great businessmen that I've dealt with, they're never comfortable. They're always. And so the athletes. And I went, I was that way in baseball. I was never comfortable. I, when I had good years, I was uncomfortable.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

We're also going to hear from Andy Burris. He runs the very successful five star national travel organization. I want to talk about the travel organization a little bit, if we could you. If I'm not mistaken, actually the travel organization used to be called Chain. Right, right. And so you played for that travel organization.

[Andy Burris]

Right, right.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

So at what point did you figure out, you know, I want to talk to those guys and see if I could maybe get involved in this.

[Andy Burris]

So, you know, obviously, you know, coming through high school is really in the state of Georgia in, in the 90s, early 90s, you know, wasn't a whole lot of travel baseball. It was chain baseball, which was Mr. Buddy Myers. And Buddy had a chain and sprocket company. He was from Mississippi, loved baseball. And he just started kind of funding a team because he just enjoyed baseball. And it was a little advertisement for him, you know, hey, what does Chain mean? You know, it's kind of a weird.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Andy Burris]

Odd name, you know. And it was from. It was Buddy's company. It was Chain. And so what he did was he would go in these big meals, you know, all these lumber mills and, and he would go in and he would, you know, they'd have all these architects and engineers and they couldn't figure out how to fix something. He'd go in there and he'd go back to his shop, manufacture something and come back and, and so everybody loved him.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Andy Burris]

He was just, just a big spirit, just great guy. But he ended up passing away. I, I played for him, kind of kind of jumping ahead. But, but when I, when we came back and opened up an indoor facility, One of the guys. You don't want to do teams, man, it's gonna mess up your lesson business.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Oh, interesting.

[Andy Burris]

And I'm like, so for a year or so.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Why?

[Andy Burris]

Because as soon as Johnny didn't get to hit in the third hole.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Oh, he didn't want to get. He don't want to do lessons with you. Yeah, got it.

[Andy Burris]

Yeah. So we, you know, which. There was some sense, there was some sensitivities there. Yeah, so. So it was, it was. Which. Which was odd because I. I love the on the field stuff. You know, I, I enjoyed the. The. The in the cage time, individual stuff, one on one stuff. But I love the being on the field, you know, because as busy as we are, you know, that was my little time. I didn't, I didn't have to speak. No, I didn't have to speak to anybody. It was just. It was kind of like when you, like when you're playing, you got one thing to do.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right?

[Andy Burris]

You know? And so I, I didn't have to worry about my phone ringing. I didn't have to worry about, you know, because, you know, you ended up having several other businesses. I kind of walk you through. But. But so blame for, you know, we started my indoor facility and picked up the phone and called and was like, hey, you know, I got some guys that, you know, man, we'll come play for you guys. This was an O2 we got back in Eastman, Georgia, and Savannah was where Chain was hit, where Mr. Buddy's business was, and where he ran Chain out of. And so it was like, yeah, you know, send some guys. You know, we start sending some guys down there. So kind of like four years later, I get a call from the guy that was originally Shannon Snyder, who was originally down there at Savannah, and he was up in Peachtree City. He says, hey, man, I want you to help me coach a team. Let's put a team together. You. You do six things, I'll do 17. All right, so it was. And Lloyd Thompson, who is at home plate, I coached. I ran his first ever 16U team in. In 06. I think it was 05.06. Somewhere in that range. And so we, you know, we. We did it for one year and we thought, why are we coaching for home plate?

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right?

[Andy Burris]

I mean, I like Lloyd, but I mean, we're Chain guys, right? So that's when. That's when Chain started. And I think it was 07. Okay. And then we really started, you know, 08. And then in 09 is when I moved to Warner Robbins and opened up facility there.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

And so you guys have a facility in Warner Robbins.

[Andy Burris]

Yes.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

And you also have like satellite teams in a bunch of other places.

[Andy Burris]

We have 52 different locations.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

52 different locations?

[Andy Burris]

Yeah. Canada, Australia and Puerto Rico is included in those.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Wow.

[Andy Burris]

That either, you know, partner locations, you know. And for us, I mean we, we just don't let you set up shop just anywhere, you know, you have to have a place to train.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah, I would imagine. And correct me if I'm wrong, there needs to be this expectation if you're going to represent the chain brand or in this case the five star national brand. Like. Yeah, you have to do things a certain way. True. Right.

[Andy Burris]

Yeah, we, we have and we like anything. You know, Dairy Queen was some Dairy Queens coming up. And so Dairy Queen was the first ever franchise fast food restaurant. And. And they'll tell you. Yeah, and they'll tell you, you know, that they, they made some mistakes, you know. And so the same thing, you know, we're the first one to really kind of go out and expand and, and, and the reason I did it was, you know, so you got a little small group in Northern Iowa, just say, I mean Burlington, Iowa, we'll just, you know, played there. So I remember the name right. And you gotta, they got a really good player there and he, and he's playing on the local team and we, somebody sees him, a scout coach or somebody sees him, says, hey man, this tells him or, and, or tells us, hey, you need to get in touch with this kid. He really fly, you know, he needs to go, he needs to get out of Iowa and get into some bigger stuff. Yep. So we reach out, we talk, you know, talk to the parents, man, they're excited, the kids excited. His local team there where, you know, the guy probably ex pro player or something, has been hitting with him, gets mad because he's leaving the team, you know, so now he's not hitting it. He's not hitting in that same facility because they're all mad at him because he left the team, you know. And so what I started doing, I was like, this ain't gonna work, you know, I said, so I gotta form a relationship with that guy so that we work together on this thing, you know, so. And what would happen, he starts struggling a little bit and he wouldn't have anybody to go hit with, you know, he'd been hitting this guy since he was 8, you know, in Burlington, Iowa, you know. And so I said, I've got a formal relationship with that guy, you know, because 1 there's no need not to. 2. You know, he may have another guy that comes through, you know, and I can, you know, I can, you know, help him, you know, and. And he can help me. And so that's where this all kind of got started at. And so. And then they were like, well, why don't I just call my team? You know, at the time, it was chain, you know, And I was like, that's fine, you know, and then you buy the same jersey. So when he plays with you on the weekends or weekdays or whatever, then all he does is it's the same jersey, only comes plays for the national team on the weekends. And so that's kind of how all this cast, you know, I never. I'll tell you a funny story. Drew, my son, when we were about. He was 14, 13, 14, there was a team out of Texas, and. And the. The coach of the team started, you know, like, they all, you know, like they do, you know, hey, Drew had a good game against him. He was, you know, shooting Drew a message. And Drew's like, dad, you. You need this guy. You need this guy. I'm like, I can't help nobody in Texas.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Andy Burris]

You know, why? I mean, I can't. Why? You know, and so for a year, I fought it, and now Nico Moran is. Is. He's one of our best guys. I mean, he's actually on our. On our national program. And. And, you know, I laugh. I said, well, I should just listen to Drew. Yeah, Right.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah. He should run that team when he's done.

[Andy Burris]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Okay. So help us understand, as a travel organization, where is development in kind of the grand scheme of things? Because I think travel teams get this. It's not reputation, but I feel like there's this stigma of, like, oh, it's just showcasing. It's just, come play with us. Let's go win this tournament. And in so saying that, a lot of people, I think, draw this conclusion that, like, oh, yeah, you don't care about developing my son or our player or whatever it is. What would you say about that?

[Andy Burris]

So I have a unique perspective on this because when Drew was coming up, I didn't really want him. You know, I'm 100 miles south of here. I didn't really want him coming up here, you know, and I didn't want him playing local because, you know, what would happen was, you know, because I own the organization, and he'd be playing for one of our teams, and I'd show up and he'd be able to, you know, half Assing around or something. I'm like, you know. And they were like, he's fine. I'm like, no, he's not fine. You know. And so anyway, so I started taking him to Tampa.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Five hours away.

[Andy Burris]

So we. From 8. From 8 to 13, every Friday, we'd get in the car and we'd drive down. And he played with his team, but he didn't practice much with them, you know. And you say, man, you know, I mean. I mean, you know, some of them haven't the best player in his class, right? I mean, so you go, well. And he didn't practice with his team. How'd he become this player? Because we were working back home, you know, and it was. You know, it was funny. My wife. Kind of a crazy story. And parents will relate to this. My wife was a school teacher. Well, we knew he wasn't going to that school. And so, you know, PG profile, you know, unless you put on where he's going to school. So, like, from the time he was, like, 12, we had IMG on there. So. So. And all it was was just to keep from my wife having to catch crap, you know, while he wasn't going to school, you know, she was at Veterans High School, which is a crosstown rival from Houston County. Houston county just had a better baseball program, and it ended up working out because the coach that was there, he ended up leaving about the time that Drew had made that decision. So it kind of made a little easier. But. But, yeah, parents relate to that, especially parents of school teachers, because usually, you know, as a school teacher, kid, you can go anywhere in that district, right? So. So that was. That was one of the things. But talking about development at a young age, he never practiced with his team. You know, that. A great, really good team. I mean, you know, and. And you go, so. So from. From my perspective, I. I don't think that practice with a team, I mean, you gotta throw the ball at first base, okay? You gotta catch a fly ball, you know, you gotta receive it behind the plate, you know, and there is some camaraderie that that was. That I did. I get from a team. But from a development standpoint, it's not a necessity because I. I saw it happen.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Oh, got it. So. So you're. You look at. You look at, like, the responsibility, in a sense, that falls on the kid. Like, how are you getting better every single. Which, by the way, also makes sense because you may be playing in tournaments every weekend, but let's assume it's not every weekend, and it's every couple weeks. Unless you're going to their facility every day, they're not going to have their hands on you until you see them for the next tournament. So what are you doing in the, in the interim to make sure that you're getting better. So the onus falls on the player.

[Andy Burris]

Yes.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

To make sure that he's continuing to develop. We're also going to hear from Jeff Petty, the head baseball coach of Canes Baseball, and he's going to share how his organization has evolved. Not just keeping it local, but identifying pro prospects nationally and wanting to move beyond the three state, you know, local program.

[Jeff Petty]

I'll be the first to say there was no, there was never some grand master plan.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

Of, of how things have kind of come together, you know, over the, over the course of the last 20 years and everything that's happened.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Well, and I think what's interesting too is, you know, going back in time to 2005. Yeah. I mean if, if there were travel teams, there were few and far between. Right.

[Jeff Petty]

Not many.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Most of the travel teams, it was all kind of regional.

[Craig Holman]

Yes.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

All local stuff. So you. And correct me if I'm wrong, you seem like you were the first kind of national program when you've. Was that like a conscious thing?

[Jeff Petty]

Yeah. So it was in 2009, we won the world wood bat, 16 year old world bat. In 2008 we were on the field with, it might have been 07. We were on the field with your Jason Haywards and like East Cobb, they were Goliaths. And we put a team together of guys from Virginia, Maryland, North Carolina, South Carolina. That was kind of our area. And we, we hung with them, but we couldn't, we couldn't really hang with them top to bottom, you know, and I think it was 2000 and then 2010 we won it again. But we could never win Jupiter like that was back then. Everybody went to Jupiter. There was no shutting down.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

All the arms through. And what's ironic is it was in late October, not early October like it is now. All the agents want to shut all the arms down, you know, get the deal.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Fair point.

[Jeff Petty]

Back then there was no, there was no such thing. I mean, all the agents were there, all the scouts were there and it was just everyone pitched, everyone played in Jupiter and it was the best players there were in the whole country and we could never get over the hump. I remember we went toe to toe with Marucci Elite in 2011, I believe, or 12. And we had a kid named Jamie Callahan from South Carolina. He Ended up making to the big leagues with the Mets. I believe he. He pitched a full. He pitched, I think a complete game that night. And we got walked off on in the bottom of the seventh. But they threw a kid from California that was committed to ucla. He went in the first round. I don't remember the name. I just remember getting on the bus that night and I was looking at their roster, Maruchi Elite. And Chad, really during that time, he was getting guys from everywhere.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah, he was.

[Jeff Petty]

And I was looking at his roster. I'm like, here we are. Like, we were very good. But this club that he has over there, they've got guys from California, Arizona, Texas, Indianapolis, New York, Georgia, Florida. And. And then I started really thinking about it and I was looking at the names and all the guys he had were prospects. They were professional prospects. He didn't care where they were from. Like Max Schrock made it to the big leagues. He was hitting in a three hole that night.

[Andy Burris]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Oh, Lou, right.

[Jeff Petty]

Brandon Lau was on that team. He's an. He was an all. He's been an all star. He's had a great career. But the difference was, is they had like seven of those guys, you know, we had four.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Jeff Petty]

And they could match it top to bottom on the mound. And they won that event. And I think they won it the next year too. And I remember saying that to our guys in Evo Shield. I said, we got to figure out a way to like branch out. And Evo Shield reached out that off season and they wanted to strike a deal. And I was. And I thought, well, this might be our end to like branch out all over the country. Because everyone in the country at the time knew what Evo Shield was. They didn't know what the Canes were per se, across the whole country. So then I put a budget together and I started going to area code games. Probably, you know, spend some time with you out there. Right. I mean, that's where I really started to meet a lot of agents and scouts and. And we went to California and we went to area code games and we went to the All American game and we started attacking the whole country and really focusing on. We wanted to put prospects on that team. And then it turned into a national team because if you're really chasing what you feel the best prospect you can get, you can't stick to a three state area.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

And that's how it happened.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Really. And so as I look back now and I saw it on your guys website, you know, if you like, how many first round picks have you guys had now?

[Jeff Petty]

It was something like, it's like almost 40, right?

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah. So I think it's at 40 plus. And then it was, you know, 4,000 plus. Kids have gotten scholarships. On your website, you have, do you have what it takes to be a cane? And I'm curious, like, what does that mean?

[Jeff Petty]

Well, it, that's twofold. It's. Obviously you have to be a good player, but I think you have to be okay with someone telling you the truth. We have a lot of players that end up not playing for us because we're so like diligent about telling the truth in the evaluation process. We, we're not one of those groups that takes the check and says, oh man, we're going to pick up the phone.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

We're going to call lsu, we're going to call, we're going to call all these Division 1 schools when we don't think that you can play at the Division 1 level. We'll tell you, we don't think you're a Division 1 player right now. This is what you probably need to get to, to get to that level. If you want to commit to that, then, you know, we'll get you a plan in place.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

But there's nothing wrong with Division 2, Division 3 baseball, junior college baseball, NAIA baseball, all of that is great. But I think what we do a good job of is telling the families the truth. And we have reach at all levels. So, I mean, if you can't handle someone telling you what we feel is the truth. And we've seen a lot, we've seen a lot of kids play at different levels. And now in this landscape is, it's crazy now.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Jeff Petty]

So there's some kids that probably would have, you know, committed to Division 1 schools years ago. They can't, they can't get it right now just because it's so backlogged and with the portal and everything, you know, you, you're very familiar with the whole process. But I think that that's the piece. Like, can you handle being told the truth?

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Which is ultimately what everybody needs. I mean, let's be real.

[Jeff Petty]

I mean, please.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Yes. And it doesn't always happen, clearly. How do you handle a parent, you know, and I know these situations exist. A parent calls you on the phone. Let's say it's a, it's a kid who, maybe he's a two way guy. There's one skill that's clearly night and day better than the other. And let's just say he's A bat, but he also wants to. Or I guess the more common one is the reverse. Right. He's an arm, but he probably still wants to hit. How do you handle that conversation with the parent? And does it ever result in like, hey, man, if you want to be a two way guy, it's not going to be for us. Like, for us, you're, you're an arm.

[Jeff Petty]

Yeah. Well, there's a kid right now who I think is one of the best arms in the class and he wants to play shortstop. And I mean, he's not going to play shortstop for this team. I mean, we've got three, four guys that can play shortstop over there as good as anybody that there is in this class. And as a result of that, you know, we don't get the arm. But I think when you look up in next year's draft, I think he's got a chance to be drafted and ultimately that's what's going to happen. He's, you can't tell the parents that. You can and I did.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

But when a big league team comes calling and they're like, yeah, you can take your bat and put it in the closet.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

And I'm going to draft the arm. What are you going to do? Not take, you know, not take the money and not go start your professional career and like, no, I'm going to go hit down the road at, you know, wherever.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Of course, yeah, legit.

[Jeff Petty]

I'm a travel team. I understand.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

I'm where I'm at in the pecking order. You know, some people don't, they're like, who, who are you to say, you know? Well, I mean, who I, who I am is someone that has seen it time and time again. And my evaluation is not just my evaluation, but our staff's evaluation is probably accurate.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Well, and I think parents also could assume, oh, well, it's because you have a short stop. Our kid actually can play short. He may be just not as good as this kid. So we're gonna go to this team, right. Where he can do both. And yeah, I think, I think a lot of moms and dads, you know, if the, if the, they don't necessarily have the best ability to judge talent. So they'll see a kid out there and get a couple knocks and they're thinking, oh yeah, this kid can still play short, he's still a hitter. When in reality. Yeah. When you're evaluating, you're looking at it from the standpoint of, I know what a pro hitter looks like. Like, that's not a pro hitter. So why don't we just focus on throwing? Because the arm is legit.

[Craig Holman]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Shouldn't that be more the focus?

[Jeff Petty]

I think so. But I also know, like, to your point, if a kid wants to go hit his last summer, right. Go hit. He doesn't need to play for us.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right.

[Jeff Petty]

To get the exposure, you know, I mean, they're going to find you no matter what team you're on. And I'll be the first one to say that. I think if you're a dude, you're going to get picked up. You could not even play travel. Like, you could pitch in high school and work out in the summer. I think. I think it's important to go to east coast pro if you're an east coast kid or go to area code games if you're. Because then you're getting around the pro scouts for sure. Like, I think that that's important. The travel stuff is not 100% necessary, but if you love to compete and you want to get around the best players, I think that that's going to start advancing your career.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

And then finally, we're going to talk to Matthew Maniscalco, a former Mississippi State player and minor league baseball player for the Rays, who's going to share his personal experience of his playing days and what were the most important recruiting factors for him that helped him choose the right college program. For everybody listening, we were just talking about the. The rigors of growing old, but one of the things I want to kind of jump into. So for everybody listening, not only are you somebody who's still around the game of baseball, but you actually were someone who played the game at the pro level. I want to talk about your career, but kind of before growing up. So we're the same age. We're both 44. When you were coming through high school, I know for me on the west coast, we really didn't have travel baseball, right. It was like a lot of American Legion. And I remember there was one team in the Northern California area that was a travel baseball team, but it wasn't this thing that it is today. What was your experience like, you know, at 16, 17, 18, a lot different.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

Than it is today. I mean, a lot different than it was a couple years after I got out of college. For me personally, growing up in Oxford, Alabama, football number one. I mean, that's. That's where we are. But with baseball, we would just have an American Legion team that was basically our high school team. That dad or granddad. We had a granddad one of my best buddies that would sure would coach us. His name was One Eye Fulton. Long story.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Shout out to One Eye.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

Hey, One Eyes the man.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Love to send this to him.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

Legend. He's such a legend. But now he, you know, he would coach us. We had a blast. We would go play any other American Legion team, which I never quite understood the league or whatever, but we would, we would drive to Birmingham. We go to just across the state line. Where we are in Oxford is about 30 minutes from the Georgia, Alabama state line. And I don't know exactly when east Cobb, kind of the whole travel ball circuit started taking off. I know it, it had started then, but I didn't, I didn't know anything about it. And so, you know, at 16, 17 years old, we play what, 30, 35 games in high school, and then in the, in the summer, we 20, 25 games and then be on to football.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Right?

[Matthew Maniscalco]

So it's, it's a totally different setup than.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Do you remember Chad Durbin?

[Matthew Maniscalco]

I do, yeah.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

So funny story. So I'm obviously an agent at the time. Chad Durbin was one of our clients. And I was out eating with him one day and he told me about his idea towards the tail end of his career. And it was essentially what Perfect Game has become. You know, this travel baseball thing is starting to pick up. I want to create kind of a. An organization that puts all these games together. And I remember at the time thinking like, well, that sounds like a lot of work. Like, I'm not sure how you're gonna do this. And then it's funny because now fast forward to look to see what actually Perfect Game in some of these other organizations have become. I mean, it's, it's truly all encompassing. Right? So, okay, so back in high school, obviously you played a lot of American Legion ball as you were going through kind of, you know, figuring out what you were gonna do at the next level, where you wanted to go. You ended up in Mississippi State. But what were the colleges that you were considering? What was that like?

[Matthew Maniscalco]

I mean, for me, I'm the fourth of five boys. My dad was a college football coach at Jacksonville State. My older brothers were athletes and played. I was fortunate when I was a freshman and sophomore in high school to get to play shortstop next to my older brother Tony, who was a junior and senior. Those two years, he, he played second base, so it was super cool. He went to Jacksonville State to play. He got a scholarship to play there. For me, kind of growing up, I didn't know. I mean, you don't you know, nowadays 11 and 12 year olds are told how good they are. I didn't. I mean, I knew I was a solid player, but I was always fighting to be the best player in the city parks, in the city leagues, and there was always somebody bigger, faster, stronger than me. And so I was always just fighting. I was a younger brother too, so I'm just fighting to get scraps at the table. That kind of, that kind of mindset. But I remember coming up through, I remember the first time I was kind of thinking about, man, it'd be really cool if I could go to like an Alabama, Birmingham, uab. It was only an hour from home. I didn't know anything about them, but I just, you know, it was no way for us to get educated on colleges. And the SEC was all around. Alabama was really strong at the time. Auburn was solid. I didn't know what I didn't know at the time. And then I had a couple of, I guess, breakout seasons my sophomore year. Kind of had a good season in high school and then had a good summer, couple of bigger schools. Alabama, Auburn started kind of reaching out with some letters and that kind of stuff. That's how old I am. I remember thinking, like, in my head, I'm one of those guys. I was thinking, like, am I really good enough to play at that level? Like, I don't know what those baseball players look like because I was still. I mean, I was a quarterback in football and I loved it equally to baseball. I really did. So it kind of started that, started it. And then I got told how, you know, you start getting told how good you are, and if you believe it, then you won't. You. You won't make it very far. And I never really believed the hype, but for me, the big break was I had to make a really tough decision. After my junior summer, I got invited to the east coast pro workout, which back in the day, there wasn't the, There weren't the tryouts. It was just, you got invited by a scout, you went straight to Wilmington, North Carolina, and it was seven or eight teams of just dudes.

[Andy Burris]

Yep.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

And we were the Mets. I was number 55. I remember it like it was yesterday. And I remember just being like, I did. I didn't know I was short until I got to that. I didn't know I was going to be on the shorter end. That's how naive I was. But I got to that and there were just, just athletes everywhere, you know, bigger, faster, stronger, and went there and ran a good 60 time, had a solid arm, had good rounds of BP. I remember not, you know, 90 now. My 14, 15 year old kids in the program, 90, it's okay, you know, 90 then we had never seen it. I mean, it looked like a ping pong ball coming in there to me. And I faced it every single, every single at bat. And all these guys were trying to throw, you know, as hard as they could. And I got hit a bunch. I didn't think I swung a bat very well, but I remember some coaches telling my dad, you know, like, hey, on, I think the day was maybe August 1st, I don't remember exactly. They said, hey, on that day he's going to start getting tons of letters and calls and all this stuff. And I still didn't really believe it because I didn't think I played that well at it. But that was where Mississippi State happened to be there. I didn't know much about them. Coach Tommy Raffo was a guy who introduced himself to my dad, one of the best human beings I've ever met. But I still wasn't sure where I was going to go. And so then we took my dad being college football coach looked at me and said, you will take all five of your official visits. You will not tell any of these schools that you're committing to them until you take all five of your visits. So we did. And you know, Mississippi State was in there because of Tommy Rafo, the conversations. He was a great guy. Ended up coming down to Mississippi State and Alabama. For me, coach Mitch Gaspard is one of the main reasons I was considering Alabama and think the world of him. And so I narrowed it down. But then, man, it took me a while. Like, it took me about a month to try to figure it out because I didn't. I was blown away when I went to Starkville. I've never been there in my life. If you haven't been there. They treated baseball like we treat football in the state of Alabama. And it blew me away. I didn't know so many people would show up to a college baseball game. And coach Pat McMahon was the head coach. Coach Jim Case, Coach Tommy Rafa, Coach Ron Polk was the assistant athletic director at the time. And man, it just kind of, kind of blew me away. And it just felt, it felt right. But I couldn't believe I was about to just go over to Mississippi. I didn't know anything about that state. I mean, I'd never really spent any time over there. And man, when I tell you I'm grateful that my dad made Me take all my visits. I'm grateful that nobody pressured me into a quick decision because, you know, it gave me time to pray about it, to talk to my. My family. They wouldn't give me any advice. I kept looking at my mom.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Oh, interesting.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

Oh, I was like. I was like, hey, what do you guys think about. They're like, hey, wherever you want. And they told me straight up. They were like, hey, financially we can handle whatever, man. I'm the fourth of five boys. We didn't have money, right. And so I wanted to get the biggest scholarship for my family to make it easier. And fortunately, the offers were the exact same. And that was. That was fortunate. But then it was unfortunate because it made my decision even harder between the two.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Sure.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

And so, you know, like I said, a lot. A lot of thought and prayer and decided to that Mississippi State was the right choice. And it was kind of crazy, though. Like, Alabama was kind of wide open on the infield. They had lost Andy Phillips, who was an All American. He was a senior of the. It was kind of wide open. Mississippi State had a senior coming back at shortstop, second and third, like, each one of those positions. And I just kind of was like, I wasn't trying to look for, hey, a handout of, like, I'm guaranteed to get to play. I wanted to go earn it. And that's. That's how I made that decision.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

Do you feel like part of that was because I've. One of the things that I've always tried to help guys understand is there's so much emotion going on when you make these decisions. Right. So if you get recruited by a number of different schools, you're trying to like, okay, how do I remove the emotion, Go through this process logically and then make a logical decision. Do you think that when you ultimately chose Mississippi State, it was like. I can't really describe it. It just feels right.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

Yeah, it was a lot of that. Because they're really like, if you started thinking logically, Alabama, right?

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

You'd say, Alabama with the opportunity.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

Opportunity to come in. I mean, they had, you know, all coaches tell you this, but they had said, hey, you would be the front runner for shortstop. You know, Mississippi State said, they, you know, I was a huge prospect and they wanted me and all that stuff, but I wasn't stupid. Travis Chapman, who was an All American, he's first base coach for the Yankees now. He was. He had played short the year before and hit.400. And so I was like, I don't. I'm not sure. I'm going to go into the SEC and hit 400 right out the gate. But I think on the logical side it probably would have made more sense to go to Alabama, but it just felt right. The and that's what I don't like when kids get rushed. I don't like when kids feel like they have to rush to make a decision. And, and that's why I'm really grateful over my time of doing what I've done, you know, since playing pro ball and starting the baseball Academy. I'm grateful NCAA instituted this new rule where they can be the August 1st. That's the best thing they've done since I've been in this position where I am the August 1st after your junior, you know, your 16 year old summer, it protects those young kids and it protects those coaches. Man, everybody looks at like the kids as a villain or the coaches as a villain. Man, they're all put in really tough positions. Like if you don't, if you're a coach and you don't go after these 14 year olds who are studs, somebody else is and you're going to miss out on them. And so like I think it's a great rule that has been, that has helped these kids be more mature another year more mature to make a wiser decision and you know, where they want to go and you know, get their degree and play the game of baseball well.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

And I, we've all kind of heard of the numbers where you know, back in the day when you could actually commit kids when they were in eighth grade and ninth grade, you would see these kids commit at that age and then you know, three, four years later it's, you know, the guy decommits because the coach is gone or you know, the player hasn't developed quite like they expected. And so yeah, it became apparent that it's not necessarily what's best for the kids to be able to commit them that early. And to your point, it's also not best for the schools. I don't think anybody looked at that and enjoyed that process. So I couldn't agree with you more.

[Matthew Maniscalco]

Yeah, I always feel for those coaches, like college baseball coaches, you know, when a kid has to be, you know, released or his off his scholarship offer cut or you know, he has to decommit. Everybody goes after the college and, and they immediately go after those coaches and man, they are in such an awful spot with the, with all the changes happening now but with the lack of scholarships, the roster changes constantly. They like, they truly don't know exactly what they're going to have. And now these, these guys, I feel for them. I think they, I think their jobs are some of the hardest jobs in America. I truly, and I think that I don't like when people act like, man, they're awful. I can't believe they quit on that boy. The truth is like, it's just like if, you know, like I tell my kids, like if you're in a relationship with somebody and you think it might not work out, you need to go ahead and do that. Then you're trying to be nice and hold on to it. But the truth is, if you truly respect them, end it now. Yeah, you know, it's hard. It's hard to do that. And that's what those college coaches and those colleges have to do. But it really frees up these players to be able to go and play and get into a better situation than what they were going to have.

[Podcast Host / Interviewer]

All right, guys. So it is clear that the path to success isn't always paved with early exposure or endless tournaments. What our guest consistently highlighted today is the non negotiable importance of fundamental development, of embracing adversity and really the hard truth that is talent evaluation. And to the parents out there, what did Craig remind us of? Be a parent. Be a parent first. It's okay to see your kids flaws. To understand that if player isn't ready for exposure, you got to recognize it's going to be bad exposure. I hope this episode helped you cut through the noise to focus on what truly builds long term success and character in young players. But I want to know what resonated most with you from today's conversation. Are you a parent who's had to choose development over immediate exposure, or a player who's had to embrace uncomfortable truths in order to improve? Share your experiences and insights in the comments below. We'd love to hear from you. We want to hear your perspectives. Ultimately, what our goal is to help connect all of you guys in the youth baseball journey. So please don't forget to like and subscribe to the podcast. If you have any specific topics that we haven't covered yet that you would like us to address, please let me know. DM me. Send me a message. I'd be happy to talk about them. So thanks for listening guys. We'll catch you next time.