Loading summary
Transcript261 lines
- [00:00]
A
Right now get up to 15% off select storage solutions put heavy duty HDX totes to good use, protecting what's important to you. The solid impact resistant design prevents cracking and the clear base and sides make items easy to find even when the totes are stacked. Find select shelving and Tote storage up to 15% off at the Home Depot. To organize every room in your home
- [00:23]
B
from your garage to your attic, visit
- [00:26]
A
homedepot.com how doers get more Done
- [00:31]
C
Lululemon's new drop of daily essentials feels like a deep breath of fresh air. Breezily is a collection of drapey pants, shorts and tanks designed to mix and match with your wardrobe as the weather warms up. It's all made in our lightweight, stretchy, swift fabric. Throw on these everyday staples after practice and bring an airy feel to your daily moves. Shop the Breezily collection now@lululemon.com hey friends, Olivia from Ollie between new routines and the ultimate group project known as parenting, you need science backed solutions that work with your life. That's where Ollie comes in. Start your mornings off right with multis made to support nutrition and immune health. Choose from our lineup of gut supporting probiotics and we've got occasional sleep support to help the whole fam chase their big dreams. Head back to class with the number one Gummy supplement brand. Stock up on ollie.com today. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.
- [01:26]
D
What is the most scandalous thing you have uncovered about me to date?
- [01:31]
A
I've got some pictures of you you're embarrassed by. So those are like my lead of the book to really entice people.
- [01:36]
D
Haven't those been shared online?
- [01:40]
A
Welcome to mugglecast, your weekly ride into the world of Harry Potter. I'm Andrew.
- [01:44]
E
I'm Eric.
- [01:45]
B
I'm Micah.
- [01:46]
D
And I'm Laura.
- [01:47]
A
And we're your Harry Potter friends, here to talk about the books and the movies and the upcoming TV show. So follow us in your favorite podcast app if you're new here and for new episodes every Wednesday this week, keep your eyes wide open because we're discussing Chapter two of Deathly Hallows in Memoriam, where Harry catches glimpses of a Dumbledore. But first, this week's Quizzage question.
- [02:17]
E
This week's Quizzage question After Hogwarts, Alpheus, Doge and Dumbledore planned to travel and see the wizarding world in our world. What is the term for this period of time? Fawn following secondary education where students are encouraged to travel, particularly in the UK and Commonwealth countries. That's the question. We'll repeat it at the end of this episode.
- [02:40]
A
Listeners make this show possible. So if you love Mugglecast as much as Rita Skeeter loves to hear gossip, head over to patreon.com mugglecast and support us today. To thank you, you'll receive bonus episodes of the show, ad free episodes, a yearly physical gift, a month monthly zoom hangout with the four of us and your fellow Potter friends. It's a great community we have on our Patreon, and lots more. We can't do this without you, so thank you so much for your support. And if you're looking for other ways to support us, we would love a review in your favorite podcast app or if you told a fellow Muggle or Witcher wizard about the show. And visit mugglecastmerch.com to buy official show gear. All right, without further ado, it's time for chapter by chapter. This week we're discussing chapter two of Deathly Hallows in Memoriam. And we'll start with the scariest game in podcasting, the seven word summary. All right, let me gather my thoughts here, Charity.
- [03:33]
E
Just kidding. I should have said that last week.
- [03:38]
A
Rita.
- [03:43]
E
Maliciously
- [03:46]
B
attacks
- [03:50]
D
Dumbledore
- [03:55]
B
back
- [03:58]
E
in
- [04:02]
B
media.
- [04:03]
D
Oh, okay, we gotta bring back asking our patrons to grade our seven word summaries. Yeah.
- [04:11]
A
Oh, yeah. Well, and don't forget, at the end of the series, we're gonna read all of our seven word summaries and we'll see how good of a summary we did across the whole book.
- [04:21]
E
And then we get to take one back, right? Because I already have one in.
- [04:24]
A
Oh, yes, yes. So before we get into the main section of the chapter, the chapter opens up with Harry accidentally cutting himself. And in our reread of Half blood prince, chapter 30, the white tomb, remember, y', all, we were talking about how silly it was for Harry to think that he could go on this big journey in Deathly Hallows alone, without even Ron and Hermione. So at the outset of this chapter, Harry's bleeding. He's cut his hand on the mirror piece in his school trunk. And he realizes that even if he was allowed to do magic at the Dursleys, he doesn't know the spell to fix this bleeding. And he even tells himself that he needs to ask Hermione. So right at the outset of this book, he is realizing, oh, wait, I actually do need Hermione. He's thinking a little more clearly now for the road ahead.
- [05:17]
E
Yeah, in fact, maybe he should be questioning whether or not going back to Hogwarts is the right call. You get another year of education in before you like Harry's anti intellectualist nature. I mean he leaves most of his textbooks behind when he packs at the end of this chapter. So like he's not learning any lessons of what he's, he knows that he doesn't know a lot of stuff but he's not really solving for that.
- [05:41]
D
But what's the quality of what he's going to get at Hogwarts this year?
- [05:45]
E
Yeah, not this year.
- [05:47]
B
Worse than a little cut.
- [05:48]
D
And also he's like a sitting duck at Hogwarts right now.
- [05:51]
A
Right, so then the chapter quickly pivots to Harry reading Alpheus Doge's tribute to Dumbledore. And in Alpheus's opening paragraph he describes the two friends as having a mutual attraction to one another. And Alpheus says this is undoubtedly due to the fact that we both felt ourselves to be outsiders. So look, I'm really not trying to make Elpheus gay here but it is an interesting phrase to use mutual attraction. Maybe it's just kind of old timey language because Alpheus is a older fellow but imagine Ron or Hermione writing we had a mutual attraction to Harry knowing now that Dumbledore is gay. Does it seem a little, maybe they had feelings towards him?
- [06:39]
E
A little, you know, Yeah, I feel like yes. But it's interesting because it's, I think there's a, a very nice part where it could be antiquated like maybe, maybe they had like actual like feelings for each other. But I also wonder if it's more of an age thing where you would never use this language for each other when you're young. But if you're looking back over 60 or 100 and whatever years of life you would then say oh yeah, we were attracted to one another's charisma.
- [07:10]
D
What I like about this is I think it's very open to interpretation and I think one thing you could interpret from this is perhaps that there was something romantic between the two of them. Perhaps it was unrequited. For Alpheus's part I could see an argument being made that maybe he felt more strongly towards Dumbledore than Dumbledore felt towards him. But it is well documented that historically, like when you look back, I think it's like at the. God, I'm really bad with era names but I'm thinking like Victorian, Edwardian era where when you're reading old works of Fiction. It was a lot more common for male characters who were heterosexual and totally platonic to just be more affectionate with each other. I know this is a pretty common read. Some people get off of like old Sherlock Holmes stories where, where people, you know, have interpreted that maybe Holmes and Watson were an item. And there's a lot of like, you know, slash shipping of that and I think that's fine and good. I will say there are a lot of like traditionalists in the Sherlock Holmes community who would be very quick to step up and say, hey, at that time period it was very common for men to just be more affectionate with their friends than they are now.
- [08:42]
A
Bring that back.
- [08:43]
B
Yeah, I know the line before the mention of the mutual attraction says that they met each other at the age of 11. So I'm not, I'm not trying to imply anything around age in terms of feelings or anything like that, but that does seem kind of young to equate romantic feelings towards somebody.
- [09:04]
E
Maybe they metal Mahogworth Express.
- [09:06]
B
I'm not saying that it didn't grow over time exactly, but you know, I do think here the author is implying the mutual attraction was due to the fact that they were outsiders and they connected with each other as a result of that. Now what happened in the years following that? We don't know. Right, right. But anything's possible.
- [09:30]
A
He met Grindelwald. That's what happened. Elfius really writes this all encompassing tribute to Dumbledore and it's great to have this out, especially with what Rita is going to be publishing, which we'll get to in this episode. Another aspect that Alpheus writes about is Kendra and he says that when Kendra died, Albus was the sole breadwinner. Now this stuck out to me because he didn't have a career yet. So how was he earning money? There is no canonical explanation for this. So maybe he was like a Transfiguration Today contributor. Maybe he was like doing private teaching lessons. He could have been working with Nicholas Flamel during this time. Discovering the 12 uses of Dragon's blood baking at Jacob's Bakery. I don't know. There's some options. Both serious and playful. What do you guys think? How was he the breadwinner in the family?
- [10:22]
E
I thought maybe an underground chess ring. After all, he's the chess master. Also, that would make his. His approval of Ron Weasley's best played game of chess at the end of year one would be a real compliment coming from. From Dumbledore, the chess master.
- [10:39]
B
I think he could make some money tutoring other students. Yeah, it's pretty smart.
- [10:43]
E
Another thing is that with Nicolas Flamel and the Sorcerer's Stone. Sorry, Philosopher's Stone. We know that you can turn any metal to gold. And so Nicholas Flamel has an infinite supply of gold and so he probably helped Dumbledore out.
- [11:01]
D
Do they know each other yet, though? I mean, this is. Dumbledore is like 17. He just finished Hogwarts, right?
- [11:07]
E
Yeah, well, Doge's. I keep saying Doge. It usually means something else these days. Alpheus's letter of also talks about how within his first year at Hogwarts, Dumbledore got these correspondences with famous switches.
- [11:23]
A
He's a man of many talents, so he could have had multiple income streams.
- [11:27]
E
Honestly, he has so much passive income. Honestly.
- [11:31]
A
Yeah, he's an Etsy store. He sells an app. He sells.
- [11:35]
D
I was thinking that, you know, given that he's in Godric's Hollow, we also know Bathilda Bagshot is there. We know she's the connection to Grindelwald. I'm wondering if maybe he was assisting her with any research that she was doing. She's a historian.
- [11:52]
E
The real question, it's so funny from this write up that Elvius does, but like, Dumbledore did all these amazing things, discovered the 12 uses of dragons. But it's like what were wizards doing with their lives before Dumbledore came along and discovered all this stuff for them? Like, really though, he's like kind of op. He's kind of overpowered here.
- [12:10]
A
Only other guess is he could have been a stripper.
- [12:12]
E
Definitely.
- [12:13]
A
I don't know.
- [12:14]
B
I'm so glad you said that, Andrew, because I asked AI. Oh, no. To give us some names that Dumbledore could have earned money under.
- [12:24]
A
Do I have to have the BLEEP button ready for this?
- [12:26]
B
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Nothing like that. All right, here we go. Dumble.
- [12:32]
E
Listen, I could have come up with that. Yeah.
- [12:35]
A
We're going to need the button.
- [12:36]
E
Next time. Just ask me, dude.
- [12:39]
B
No, no, no. There's, there's, there's some good ones there, Daddy Dumble.
- [12:43]
D
Okay.
- [12:43]
B
Al Bear, Glitter Door. Professor Lap Dance. The Headmaster of Seduction. Wizard of Oz, the Elder Wand, Velvet Beard. Sir Strips a lot.
- [13:02]
A
Add music to this scene.
- [13:04]
B
Bearded Temptation, the Grand Enchanter, Merlin Monroe.
- [13:11]
A
Mike is going to sit here for an hour reading these.
- [13:15]
B
Abra Kadam Hexapeel, Juan Solo, the Spellbinder, Enchante and Velvet Phoenix.
- [13:27]
A
Wow, great job, Micah.
- [13:30]
D
I feel like Dumbledaddy is the best one.
- [13:32]
A
Yeah. Which I feel like we've come up with ourselves.
- [13:35]
D
Yeah.
- [13:35]
E
I mean, the headmaster is classic. I will say, for the wizard of Oz. Is it like, ahs. The wizard of Oz?
- [13:43]
B
A H, H, H, exclamation point.
- [13:46]
A
Thought you were doing Oz.
- [13:48]
E
Okay, that one's not bad.
- [13:49]
A
Wow. All right. Well, with those names, I'm sure he was making plenty of money, so. Elpheus also notes Albus's battle against Grindelwald. And I love how he described it. He says, those who witness it have written of the terror and the awe they felt as they watched these two extraordinary wizards do battle. Dumbledore's triumph and its consequences for the wizarding world are considered a turning point in magical history. Now, something I love about this being mentioned is that the first time we learned about this battle and the only other time we've heard about it in the series so far, was actually back in book one on Dumbledore's chocolate frog card. And Alpheus also notes that he is recognized for discovering the 12 uses of Dragon's blood in his tribute. This is another thing that was noted on his chocolate frog card. And here we are at the end of the series hearing about these two things again, which I was looking into it, and as far as I can tell, they've only been mentioned in books one and seven, these two things specifically. So I just love the symmetry here.
- [14:52]
E
Again, it's great. And, you know, these things are such turning points in wizarding history, but the books never concern themselves with what it means. Like, what are the 12 uses of Dragon's blood? We don't know. And it's just like, for me, I find it, It. It leaves me wanting more. Not in a like, oh, the books are deficient sense. But the world is so big. The world is so big. The Harry Potter books never even tell you what the uses are, but they exist. Presumably there's some utility to them. And they made Dumbledore all that money, or, sorry, Professor Head or whatever he was called. But yeah, it just.
- [15:28]
B
That wasn't on.
- [15:30]
E
Really makes the world feel bigger.
- [15:34]
A
Well, the last time we did this, chapter by chapter reread, we were probably saying at the time, in 2007, well, don't worry, Eric. You'll find that out in the upcoming Harry Potter Encyclopedia that's definitely going to be written.
- [15:46]
B
I feel like we've probably brought this up before when we've talked about this battle between these two, but I've always thought about it in the way that Grindelwald was defeated, in that his magic was removed somehow. And I think that speaks to the power of Dumbledore, that somehow, some way, he was able to extract whatever magical ability Grindelwald had. And that's how he was defeated. That's why he didn't rise to power again. Or if we're gonna go a totally different route, knowing that love plays such a role in the series. Love won out in the end. That's how it ended.
- [16:27]
D
Probably something to do with the blood pact. I feel like that's what they wanted to do.
- [16:30]
B
I forgot about that.
- [16:31]
E
I forgot about that. You know, it's not stated that Grindelwald is still alive and out there somewhere, which is the interesting part that you break up Micah about, like, oh, what happened to his magic? And why didn't he come back? I wonder how many people know he's still alive until later in this book.
- [16:49]
A
And, of course, reading this again is just a reminder that the Fantastic Beasts film series was supposed to end with this legendary battle. That's where they were going with it, and we never got it, but hopefully we will in the TV series. And speaking of maxing things, I feel like Elphys's tribute is just one big max, that scene. We could get lots of flashbacks here, glimpses of Dumbledore's life, including. Maybe this would be the opportunity to see that battle between Dumbledore and Grindelwald. Could be a good way to fit Dumbledore into this season of the show, because he's otherwise going to be less visible. Right, Laura?
- [17:24]
D
I agree. I think what would be cool, too, is we could see various ages of Dumbledore. You know, in the movies, for example, when we go back in time to see, like, the memories and such, and we see younger Dumbledore, it's just Michael Gambon. He looks the same, pretty much. So it would be cool to see Dumbledore at various ages because we know that he does consequential stuff across his life.
- [17:53]
E
By that point, technology will be possible to give us just like young John Lithgow, you know, walking around, like, maybe
- [18:02]
A
they might do that. I mean, they did that with Michael Gambon, like, not with technology.
- [18:08]
E
For a guy that's been on film for 50 years. Yeah. Oh, whatever. Like that, too. It's got to be pretty easy.
- [18:14]
B
Yeah. Didn't they do it with Richard Harris as well when they did the Chamber of Secrets flashback?
- [18:19]
E
I don't know what they did. I didn't think it looked particularly.
- [18:23]
A
Was it then black and white, too?
- [18:24]
D
It was, yeah.
- [18:26]
B
Yeah.
- [18:26]
A
So maybe they just used, like, black and white to make it look.
- [18:29]
E
I will Say, if we've gotten to the point by the time that Alphias Doge's eulogy comes around, if we've gotten to the point in the Harry Potter TV series where contemporary music plays over the show, I would prefer to have two of Us by the Beatles playing during the montage, a really great song about friendship.
- [18:48]
A
Well, speaking of friendship, reading this tribute in the Prophet makes Harry wish that he had asked Dumbledore about his own life rather than always focusing on his own. And like I said about Taco Bell's cheesy Gordita crunch a few weeks ago. And by the way, I had one that following weekend. After all this talk, you don't. Delicious. You don't know what you have until it's gone. That's what Harry is experiencing right now. And Harry acknowledges, too. If Harry had tried to ask Dumbledore about his life prior to meeting him, would Dumbledore have been forthcoming? As Harry recalls, he did try one time to ask him a personal question. What do you see in the mirror of Erised? And Dumbledore just said, a woolly woolen pair of socks and just kind of shrugged it off. It's true now.
- [19:38]
E
Yeah.
- [19:38]
A
Just quickly, to play devil's advocate, do we think Dumbledore would have been more willing to open up to Harry in the later books? Remember, just last book he was saying, I am not worried, Harry. I am with you. The relationship is way different than it was in book one. He trusts Harry with his life now. So would Harry have been able to get more information out of him by. Towards the end?
- [19:58]
D
I don't think anything consequential because ultimately I think Dumbledore would have continued to sidestep getting into anything that would have actually been insightful or deep with Harry. And I think specifically about his relationship with Grindelwald and how things went with Ariana. He specifically calls out in this book that he counted on Hermione to be the one to slow Harry down on this front on connecting those threads. So, yeah, I don't know. Like, I don't think. I mean, of course, like, Dumbledore maybe could have said, oh, yeah, my sister died, but I don't think he would have given much more than that, you know? No, he played everything very close to the vest for a reason.
- [20:49]
E
Yeah. And Harry, I would say, like, what's the equivalent of kind of being friend zoned? Harry was like hero zoned. Right. So, like, anything that didn't relate to Harry's mission, Dumbledore wouldn't have confided in him because it would have distracted Harry from the mission. And it's, it's partly as a trauma response because Dumbledore doesn't want to like re. Traumatize himself telling the story or whatever, but he prevented Harry from, he prevented himself and he's admitted as much from growing closer to Harry. And one way to grow close to somebody is to share more of yourself, right. More of your own lore, more of your stories. And because Dumbledore had to constantly prevent himself from getting closer to Harry he never would have told the truth about any of this stuff. So unfortunately it's. What I love about it is it's very nice that Harry feels bad about not asking but I think the clues are here that Dumbledore really wouldn't have told him anything.
- [21:43]
D
Right.
- [21:44]
B
And it's part of the grieving process for Harry that he's going through this moment and he's reading this article and he's basically blaming himself for not being a better friend to Dumbledore. And I think that's probably something that all of us can identify identify with to some extent. He's learning a lot more about Dumbledore's life and Dumbledore intentionally shielded him from a lot of these pieces of information that, that he's going to find out about over the course of, of Deathly Hallows. But what it reminded me of just a little bit and especially because Dumbledore was Harry's teacher. It's kind of like when you realize that your teachers are real people too. As he's going through and reading this tribute by Doge that you know, Dumbledore, if you were a Muggle, you would have gone to the grocery store, right? He probably would have had a partner and maybe you had had a family. It's like these are things that you don't think about when you're a teenager in, in high school basically which is what Harry was. And you don't think about the other aspects of your teachers or your professors lives. But they certainly, you know, they're real people too at the end of the day.
- [23:05]
E
Well what shocks me the most too is the ages at which all of this is, is said to have happened. Like Dumbledore was 10 when his dad attacked the Muggles. So and that like cast a shadow over his school age. And when he was 17, his mother died. Ariana like fell ill when she was probably like 6 after that and died around age 13. Everybody's so freaking young. Aberforth, who's like a few years behind Dumbledore. I always pictured them fighting and like Ariana getting killed, like when everyone's 40. But no, it was much, much, much younger. And that's the thing that shocks me the most about Doge's tell all is it really jars me but also shows how sad it is that all of those things happened to Albus so young. So he's been living with that grief for like 120 years.
- [23:54]
A
Yeah, it's a miracle Alpheus is still alive too. How many gins would it have taken Harry to get Dumbledore to open up? I'm guessing four.
- [24:03]
E
Yeah, but only three tequilas.
- [24:06]
D
I was going to say. I think Dumbledore can handle his liquor a little better than that.
- [24:10]
A
Oh, more than four. Okay. He is a tall fellow. So he's, you know.
- [24:14]
B
Yeah, he's 150. So you know, it probably impacts him a little bit more quickly than somebody who's a little bit younger.
- [24:26]
C
Experience a membership that backs what you're building with American Express Business Platinum. Enjoy complimentary access to the American Express Global Lounge Collection and apply to find out your welcome offer, which could be as high as 300,000 Membership Rewards points. American Express Business Platinum. There's nothing like it. Terms apply, welcome offers vary and you may not be eligible for an offer. Learn more@americanexpress.com Business Platinum this episode is brought to you by State Farm. Listening to this podcast instead of doom scrolling Smart move. Another smart move getting help from one of State Farm's 19,000 local agents when you choose to bundle home and auto bundling. Just another way to save with the personal price plan. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state. Tomorrow morning is knocking. Stock your fridge now. How about a creamy mocha Frappuccino drink? Or a sweet vanilla smooth caramel maybe? Or a white chocolate mocha? Whichever you choose, delicious coffee awaits. Find Starbucks Frappuccino drinks wherever you buy your groceries.
- [25:41]
A
Another big revelation in this chapter is we learn Rita Skeeter is going to publish the life and lies of Albus Dumbledore. And before we get into the details, I just want to share. I loved the COVID art of this book in the movie. I don't know if that makes me sick, but I bought the print version from Minalima and this is like their deluxe edition, so it's actually signed by them in the corner.
- [26:05]
B
Oh.
- [26:05]
A
And it's like, it's got like holographic elements to it, so I just love it. And I have it up on my wall when I'm not showing it off
- [26:15]
D
on the podcast right now.
- [26:16]
E
That's really cool.
- [26:17]
D
Now that was really cool.
- [26:18]
B
It was.
- [26:19]
E
Yeah.
- [26:19]
A
Purple and green cover. Dumbledore on the front, Rita on the back.
- [26:24]
E
It looks like a teenage girl's diary, kind of, but that's why I love it. But it's that gossipy and I love it.
- [26:31]
B
So.
- [26:31]
A
Yeah. So Harry learns about this new biography that Rita is rushing to print. This book promises to reveal the disturbed childhood, the lawless youth, the lifelong feuds and the guilty secrets that Dumbledore carried to his grave. Why was the man tipped to be Minister of Magic content to remain a mere headmaster? What was the real purpose of the secret organization known as the Order of the Phoenix? How did Dumbledore really meet his end? Find out by pre ordering today for how much.
- [27:02]
B
Yeah.
- [27:02]
E
And hey, if you call in the next three hours, you'll receive our accompanying leaflet. Love letters from Nurmengard. Scandalous professions of love between the two wizarding world's most powerful men. Star crossed lovers, Girls on fire.
- [27:17]
A
Sign me up for that.
- [27:18]
E
I know.
- [27:19]
A
So, yeah, this is a pretty big revelation and so frustrating for Harry to see.
- [27:25]
E
You know, it's crazy that Rita's whole framing here is that. Why was Dumbledore content to remain a mere headmaster? As if Dumbledore wasn't the headmaster of the School of Britain of Magic in Britain and like the most famous wizard in the world still. So like Dumbledore wasn't hiding out, secretly avoiding things.
- [27:50]
B
Why doesn't she want to be more than a gossip columnist?
- [27:53]
A
You know, that's.
- [27:54]
E
Rita has no ambition and so she's accusing others of having ulterior motives.
- [27:59]
B
Right.
- [27:59]
A
Well also, I mean, he had other stuff going on. It's not like he was just the professor or the headmaster of Hogwarts and that was it.
- [28:07]
B
He's a busy guy.
- [28:08]
A
Yeah, he was on the Whizzingamow. Right, yeah.
- [28:12]
E
Chief Mugwumper.
- [28:13]
A
Supreme. Chief Warlock.
- [28:14]
E
Yeah. Chief Warlock, Yeah. Supreme Mugwump.
- [28:18]
A
Yeah.
- [28:19]
D
Yeah. But that doesn't support the angle she's trying to take here.
- [28:22]
E
Right, right, right.
- [28:23]
A
It is a selling point. Like. Oh, that was a good question. Why did he just stay Headmaster of Hogwarts?
- [28:29]
B
Well, now we know why she was at Dumbledore's funeral.
- [28:31]
A
Exactly. We talked about that. Yeah.
- [28:34]
B
Now for me, when you're kind of comparing these two articles, Doges and now Skeeters, this is a bit like watching Fox News after having listened to Ms. Now or CNN or whatever, Order you want to. You want to flip that around? Flip it around?
- [28:54]
A
I flip it around?
- [28:55]
B
Yeah, yeah. You know what I'm saying, though? It's like. It's like, yeah, what you want to believe, that's where you're going to go, right? If you're somebody who love Dumbledore, you're going to believe what Elphias Doge wrote. If you're somebody who did not like Dumbledore, then Rita Skeeter is, you know, your cup of tea.
- [29:20]
E
Oh, yeah. Especially if you're inclined for conspiracy theories. Right. If you're, if you're inclined to believe them or be taken in by this whole Dumbledore is evil. And what's funny is the truth is in the middle somewhere. Right. The things that, like Rita's book really has a toll on Harry throughout this entire book. And. And yet it gets him, you know, the contents of the book really get him to come to a fuller picture understanding of the headmaster that he loved and then also answer or gets him to ask some really important questions I think that Dumbledore had left out. So it's almost like the work wasn't complete until somebody like Rita comes along and tries to poke at the established story. So there's some value. I don't agree with the way she does it, but there's some value in the having a second or a dissenting voice a little bit.
- [30:15]
A
Well, yeah. On the other hand, I think I remember reading this for the first time, reading about this book and reading the details in this book for the first time. And I think, to your point, Micah, it's shocking for Harry and the reader to realize, oh, wait, maybe not everything that I thought I knew about Dumbledore is true. It's like this whole interpretation you've had on him is suddenly, like, stripped away. That's a shocking and sad and scary realization to make. I mean, we all experience this in our lives, too. You, you, you find out some terrible secret about somebody that you never could have expected, and it's. It's horrible.
- [30:50]
D
Yeah. And you're confronted with the reality that people are imperfect.
- [30:56]
A
People are imperfect. Nothing is what it seems. You're like, oh, you thought. I thought they had such a perfect life. No, their relationship was horrible. They were on the way out the whole time. I'm not projecting. So in a Daily Prophet interview with Rita in advance of the book's publication to promote the book, we hear that Alpheus and others were calling into question the accuracy of her book, particularly because it was rushed to print. And this is a Great point. Inherently, this must be true. How accurate can a book be if you're rushing to get it to source shelves? You're not pulling from multiple sources, you're just. Presumably, this is Rita Skeeter we're talking about. She's grabbing the first sources she hears from and just believes it. She's not checking second or third sources, which you're supposed to do in journalism. And I mean, it had only been a month since Umbledore died. This is the modern equivalent of people using AI to write crappy books and trying to make a quick book on Amazon, which happens now more than ever because of these AI tools.
- [31:54]
E
Yeah. Or these biographies of, like famous people that you see come out like a month after they've died.
- [32:00]
A
Yeah, things like that.
- [32:01]
D
Yeah, for sure.
- [32:02]
A
Obvious.
- [32:04]
D
Yeah. There are examples of that for people like Steve Jobs, Michael Jackson, Princess Diana, George Harrison. Like, some of their biographies literally came out within weeks of them dying. So.
- [32:17]
E
Feels icky. Feels like vultures were circling, you know, waiting to publish.
- [32:22]
D
Yeah.
- [32:23]
E
So, hey guys, when it happens for me one day, 50 years from now, which one of you is writing the scandalous Tell all book?
- [32:30]
A
Ooh, I've got plenty of dirt on all of you, so I'm actually writing books about all of you. Quietly in the background. Yeah. Yeah.
- [32:39]
D
Okay. What. What is the most scandalous thing you have uncovered about me to date?
- [32:47]
A
I've got some pictures of you you're embarrassed by. So those are like my lead of the book to really entice people and
- [32:53]
E
this one time have it those shared online. Oh, maybe both of them.
- [32:57]
A
Probably.
- [32:57]
E
I was going to say this one time you left your pants in our hotel room, but everybody knows about that.
- [33:03]
A
I'm teaming up with the writer of the Acid Quill. Remember that blog? Posted lots of bombshells.
- [33:08]
E
You learned who that was then?
- [33:09]
A
We did. Yeah. Speaking of betrayals, speaking of everything you thought you knew about somebody being built on its head. Yeah, literally. Wow. So Hermione's idea to have Harry interviewed by Rita in order of the Phoenix comes back to bite them. Because the Daily Prophet reminds us that Rita and Harry. Harry do have some sort of alliance. If Rita was getting to interview Harry for the Quibbler, so wouldn't that lead one to believe that the information she's going to share about Harry and Albus's relationship in the Life and Lies of Albus Dumbledore would be accurate because she seemingly knows Harry?
- [33:48]
D
Yeah, they're spinning this to give her credibility a hundred percent.
- [33:54]
E
I honestly, it's gross, but I love It. Because it remains true that the interview with Harry was the most important point in Rita's career. Right. Like, that was the defining moment where she was able to use her skills and tell the truth with them. Something she's not, you know, inclined to do, naturally. But the fact that that gave her the credibility to keep spinning lies and do all her bullshit is, like, unfortunate. But I think even she knows that she's never gonna top, you know, that interview that she had with Harry where she was literally forced to participate in. And she wouldn't have done it naturally, for that to have given her the biggest boost or the biggest amount of credibility has to, like, slowly eat her up inside. Maybe a little bit. Maybe not really. But I like to think of thinking of it.
- [34:45]
B
Yeah. And the credibility goes beyond. I think that's what you were alluding to. Not just the portion of the story about Harry and Dumbledore. It provides legitimacy to her writing this book that there has to be some level of truth to what she's saying because she wrote this really great piece on Harry Potter back, you know, in order of the Phoenix. So, yeah, it's one of those. It's interesting in that. Here we are in Deathly Hallows. We've just gone through the first chapter where it's clear Voldemort is on the rise. He's gaining power. He knows when Harry is going to be moved. And in addition to that, now you have the Daily Prophet. You have this nice tribute from Alpheus Doge. But at the same time, you have Dumbledore being discredited and this really salacious book that's about to come out about him. It doesn't seem like things are setting up very well for Harry.
- [35:44]
E
In book seven, you were trying to do misinformation. And one more thing on Rita, though. I'm reminded that the reason Rita was chosen by Hermione was because they needed her credibility to publish. They needed her name, I guess, to be the one to publish it so that people would pay attention in the Quibbler. So it's interesting how they kind of traded on each other's credibility now between Rita and Harry.
- [36:09]
A
And also there is some, I think, in making Rita write this article about Harry.
- [36:13]
D
Well, I also think at that time, Rita was the only journalist they could get. I say journalist very charitably here. She was the only one they could get to talk to Harry. Cause the Daily Prophet was running a smear campaign of him and calling him crazy.
- [36:30]
A
So as Harry is recoiling from what he's just read from Rita. He glimpses at the piece of the mirror again that he is holding at the start of this chapter that he mentions at the start of this chapter and he thinks he just saw Albus's eyes flash in it. And Harry tells himself, oh, I was just thinking about Dumbledore. So that's why I think I saw his eyes in it. But of course, what he will later learn is that the other end of this two way mirror is now in possession of another Dumbledore. Something else that we'll later see about these mirrors is that they were once used by great friends James and Sirius. And they're now being used by Harry and Aberforth, the latter not being a great friend to Harry, but his brother was.
- [37:12]
E
So can you just picture James and Sirius using the mirrors to basically FaceTime each other in the summer when Sirius is back at Grimald Place and he doesn't want to be and he's like, wish I could be hanging out with you, James. And then I picture them as both these boys, like laying prone with like their feet up and like, you know, dangling behind them and their hands crossed and just plotting on their next 10 pranks they're going to play on Snivellus
- [37:36]
A
name Also Max that mirror in book five because the mirror doesn't make an appearance in the films until Deathly Hallow in the Order of the Phoenix TV adaptation. They got to set up Sirius's mere gift in that book and TV show.
- [37:52]
D
Well, and we need to specifically see Harry break it at the end of Order of the Phoenix because if you ever in the movie, it's just like out of nowhere he has this shard of glass that he's seeing some random old dude's eyes in. Yeah.
- [38:05]
E
Where the hell did that come from?
- [38:07]
D
Yeah, like if he hadn't read the books, that was probably really confusing.
- [38:12]
A
So they would have, okay, they would have known about the mirror. They wouldn't have known about the mirror's significance in book seven while writing Movie five, Right? Yeah, correct. Because those two came out in the same song.
- [38:22]
E
Unless it came up because they were, you know, there were extensive conversations with the author that prevented them from removing Creature from Movie five.
- [38:30]
A
Right. She could have left a note. And maybe she did and they still said no. Or she just didn't leave a note.
- [38:35]
B
Budget too expensive.
- [38:36]
A
Budget. Yeah, we don't have room for a mirror.
- [38:39]
D
For a mirror.
- [38:41]
A
Buy one at home. Goods. Pull it out of their dumpster. Odds and ends. I just wanted to mention that, you know, speaking of symmetry and memories, this chapter also finds Harry doing a deep dive into his school trunk for his first time in six years. Lots of memories are unearthed. Quote. Kneeling down beside the trunk again, he groped around in the bottom. And after retrieving an old badge that flickered feebly between support Cedric Diggory and Potter stinks. A cracked and worn out sneakoscope and a gold locket inside which a note signed Reb had been hidden. And it goes on. But I thought this was really cool. Just like getting these little trinkets from earlier in the series come up again.
- [39:22]
E
Yeah, I got a question. Let's. Let's put ourselves on blast here. Did we, guys? Did we do what Harry does with his school trunk most years, which is just kind of scrape off the top level of stuff and put the new stuff on top? Or did we all, like, deep dive and did we deep clean our school supplies or just tend to do the surface?
- [39:43]
A
Yeah. What's the equivalent here? I didn't have a trunk. You didn't have a trunk? Did you like your book bag?
- [39:48]
D
You have a locker?
- [39:50]
E
Your locker? Well, yeah.
- [39:52]
A
That changes every year. Doesn't it change every year?
- [39:54]
D
I guess. But, like, at the end of the year, what was the state of your locker? I had a Trapper key question.
- [40:00]
E
I had a Trapper Keeper that was reused a couple of years. And yeah, I had to take out. It was always overflowing and stuffed with, like, homework and stuff. So I had to take out the worksheets. But I think I left some stuff in I don't think I ever fully cleaned. There was always a layer of pencil shavings and dust everywhere.
- [40:16]
B
It just changed over so much from year to year. I don't think it would pile up. That's. That's the. I guess one benefit of having a trunk is that you can keep a lot of crap in there over the years.
- [40:28]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [40:30]
D
I don't know. I've always been a little bit disorganized. For more on that, see the inside of my purse currently.
- [40:38]
A
But Laura, your backdrop on video looks pristine and organized.
- [40:42]
D
Well, and see, that's. That's how I trick everybody into thinking that I'm a pristine, organized person. I am decidedly not. Yeah.
- [40:50]
E
Coming up, bonus Mugglecast. We're diving into Laura's purse.
- [40:54]
A
The camera turns reveals the truth. And I just also want to say, in light of these little trinkets coming out of the trunk, I love all these throwbacks across the series that we're already seeing. And I can't help but feel like the author must have been Feeling incredibly nostalgic writing this final book and just wanted to throw it back. In lots of ways, she's paying tribute to her story. And to me, these mentions of the badges or the sneakoscope aren't so much written from a storytelling perspective so much as it's paying tribute to the Harry Potter books. Do you guys get the same read? It's just, I don't know.
- [41:35]
E
Yeah, yeah. Harry's like, leaving Privet Drive. It's a big deal for him. And like, looking back, remembering the plot points that were like, oh, the Potter stinks badges were a whole like four to six months of Harry's life in book four. Um, I just find it really jarring to see, oh, like somebody would say Potter stinks now when he's about to embark and save the world. It's kind of. I love how jarring it is in that isn't time funny Kind of sort of way.
- [42:02]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [42:03]
D
It's just a reminder too, of how much the stakes have increased because by comparison to what Harry's facing now, the whole Potter stinks button thing is that's nothing. That's small potatoes.
- [42:17]
E
Yeah, yeah, right.
- [42:18]
A
Time gives you a lot of perspective.
- [42:20]
E
I also have to call out Harry's, I guess, nostalgia or whatever because he leaves some of his spell books behind. He sorts everything into two piles. Thinks he's taking and thinks he's not. He leaves the spell books. Not gonna need them for anything, they're useless. But takes the photo album that Hagrid gave him. And if you had a limited number of space. We know they don't, but if you had a limited number of space. Harry, take the spell books, damn it. Like over the photo album.
- [42:46]
B
Ah, he's going for the nostalgia, as you said. And that means something to him, coming from Hagrid.
- [42:51]
D
He also knows Hermione's coming with him. She's like a walking.
- [42:55]
E
She's gonna bring all the.
- [42:56]
B
Yeah, he's not gonna check a spell book right when he's being chased by Death Eater.
- [43:02]
E
I honestly don't know why he bought the spell books. He probably never opened them.
- [43:06]
D
Can you imagine? Like, Hang on, Mr. Death Eater. Let me just flip over to page 356 to find the hecks that I have.
- [43:13]
E
He's going to have a lot of time to be rereading some of these things.
- [43:21]
C
Chronic migraine is 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting four hours or more. Botox Onobotulinum toxin A prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine before they start. It's not for those with 14 or fewer headache days a month. It prevents on average eight to nine headache days a month versus six to seven for placebo.
- [43:39]
A
Prescription Botox is injected by your doctor. Effects of Botox may spread hours to weeks after injection causing serious symptoms. Alert your doctor right away as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems or muscle weakness can be signs of a life threatening condition. Patients with these conditions before injection are at highest risk. Side effects may include allergic reactions, neck and injection site pain, fatigue and headache. Allergic reactions can include rash, welts, asthma symptoms and dizziness. Don't receive Botox if there's a skin infection. Tell your doctor your medical history, muscle or nerve conditions including als, Lou Gehrig's disease, Myasthenia gravis or Lambert Eaton syndrome, and medications including botulinum toxins as these may increase the risk of serious side effects. Why wait?
- [44:16]
C
Ask your doctor, visit botoxchronicmigraine.com or call
- [44:19]
A
1-844botox to learn more@blyze.com, it's not just about window treatments. It's about you.
- [44:24]
B
Your style, your space, your way.
- [44:27]
A
Whether you DIY or want the pros to handle it all, you'll have the confidence of knowing it's done right. From free expert design help to our 100% satisfaction guarantee, everything we do is
- [44:38]
B
made to fit your life and your windows.
- [44:41]
A
Shop up to 40% off with minimum purchase and a free professional measure right now@blinds.com plus pay at your own pace
- [44:48]
B
starting at 0% APR with affirm terms apply. One other very quick odd in I wanted to mention was that when Harry briefly leaves his room to try and go treat his cut, he steps on a cup of tea, which he assumes was left by Dudley under malicious intent, but is actually a bit of an olive branch that's extended by Dudley that we learn about later on.
- [45:15]
A
Probably just the next chapter. No, just the Dursley story.
- [45:18]
E
Yeah, by pretty soon. Yeah.
- [45:20]
A
Okay. Aw, looking forward to talking about that and thanks for calling that out. So now it's time for the links line. In this chapter, Harry worries about what the Dursley would do with his Hogwarts textbooks and his robes that he's leaving behind. So I wanted to ask what are they going to do with them? My prediction? I took this a little seriously. I think Petunia carefully admired each one wishing she had been in possession of all these as a young girl. And when Vernon says burn them all, she says no, no, no and and says as a fib that she told Harry. She promised Harry she would keep them for him.
- [45:59]
D
Oh, that's very sweet. I went a darker path. So I imagine that Petunia actually has a secret shrine to the wizarding world in a closet somewhere. Kind of like, did anyone watch hey Arnold when we were kids? You know?
- [46:14]
E
Yeah, the Arnold wax figure or whatever.
- [46:17]
D
She had the Arnold shrine in her closet.
- [46:19]
B
Bubblegum.
- [46:20]
A
That's what I have. Micah in my closet. Of Micah in my closet.
- [46:24]
D
Oh, damn it. That was going to be something I included in the Life and Lies of Andrew Sims, but now I guess you spoiled it. But yeah. So I think Petunia has her own little wizarding world shrine that she keeps secret. She would put it all in there.
- [46:38]
E
I like how unexpected that answer is. I went. Very obvious one. I think there's only one clear answer, which is the Dursleys took all of Harry's stuff the second he leaves and they donated it to the Leavesden studio tour down in Watford. I think it's. It's going to fetch a good price for them. It's like prime merch.
- [46:56]
B
It's like their Pokemon cards, basically.
- [46:58]
E
Basically, yeah. That one's worth something.
- [46:59]
A
Literal answer. Literally, that stuff is at the studio tour.
- [47:03]
B
That's fun. I'm going to go the. The more sentimental route. I think Dudley boxes them up and puts them in the cupboard under the stairs.
- [47:10]
A
All right, well, looking to see what our patrons contributed. John said Vernon would bury them in the backyard. Petunia would secretly keep them in the closet and read the books wishing to go to Hogwarts. And Dudley would hawk that stuff on ebay. Ka ching.
- [47:26]
E
Rachelpuff says it's my headcanon that Dudley ends up having a Muggle born magical child. Maybe that child would find them all packed up in the attic of where they're living and that's how they find out they are magical.
- [47:39]
B
Cassandra says the cupboard under the stairs has room. It would probably be dangerous to burn magical objects.
- [47:47]
D
Mev says, I would think that they would be scared to even touch them. Burning the whole house down with them might be an option. I also think Dudley. I also think Dudley. Sorry, that's so chaotic. I also think Dudley might want to give those back to Harry at the end of Deathly Hallows. Maybe with a cup of tea.
- [48:06]
A
Yeah. Carly says Petunia secretly compiles all of it and tries. Now that Dumbledore's gone to sneak into Hogwarts as a first year student. I want to see that. I want to see her trying to pretend to be a young witch. Going to school, Glow says.
- [48:22]
E
I reject the premise that the Dursleys are planning on coming back to Privet Drive at all. It's much more likely that Death Eaters are the first ones in number four Privet Drive after the protection is broken and they would ransack his books and robes looking for any clue at what he's up to. After not finding anything, I'm sure they just blow the entire house up thinking it would send a message to Harry Potter, not realizing that he hates the home and that a part of him would be glad to watch it burn.
- [48:47]
A
Thank you everybody who participated over@patreon.com Mugglecast listeners, we would love your support there. You can pledge at different levels, whatever works for you budget wise and you'll get lots of benefits no matter what level you pledge at. If you have feedback about today's discussion, you can email or send a voice memo to mugglecastmail.com you can also reach out via Spotify or YouTube or DM us on social now, before we wrap up, it's time for the answer to this week's Quizzage question.
- [49:19]
E
Yeah, and this week's question again for those playing at home, was the following After Hogwarts, Alpheus, Doge and Dumbledore planned to travel and see the Wizarding world in our world. What is the term for this period of time following secondary education where students are encouraged to travel, particularly in the UK and the Commonwealth countries? I find the answer we're looking for is gap year. This was correctly suggested by Mev and Carly and Sam and Elizabeth and Becky. Thanks to everybody who's playing live and playing at home as well.
- [49:55]
A
SCAP year next week, chapter by chapter, continues with chapter three of Deathly Hallows. The Dursley's departing. Don't Forget to visit mucklecast.com for links to our social media, our Patreon, our transcripts, our favorite episodes, and lots more about the show. Thanks everybody for listening. I'm Andrew.
- [50:12]
E
I'm Eric.
- [50:13]
B
I'm Micah.
- [50:14]
D
And I'm Laura. Bye everyone. Bye y'.
- [50:17]
B
All.
- [50:17]
D
By.
- [50:46]
B
Close your eyes, exhale, feel your body relax and let go of whatever you're carrying today.
- [50:53]
C
Well, I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class. I got them delivered free from 1-800-contacts. Oh my gosh, they're so fast.
- [51:01]
E
And breathe.
- [51:02]
C
Oh, sorry. I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry. Namaste. Visit 1-800-contacts com today to save on your first order.
- [51:14]
A
1-800-contacts hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile.
- [51:17]
B
Now.
- [51:17]
E
I was looking for fun ways to
- [51:19]
A
tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited Premium Wireless for $15 a month is back.
- [51:24]
E
So I thought it would be fun
- [51:26]
A
if we made $15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial.
- [51:34]
E
Give it a try@mintmobile.com switch upfront payment
- [51:37]
C
of $45 for three months, $90 for six months or $180 for a 12 month plan required $15 per month equivalent taxes and fees Extra initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes. Me slow when network is busy. See terms. Most of us are one good deal away from finally replacing that worn out rugged, fixing up the backyard or getting the bedroom we actually want. Good news, that deal's almost here. Wayfair's Black Friday in July Sale get up to 80% off area rugs and up to 60% off outdoor and bedroom furniture. Shop Wayfair's huge selection of styles and find the piece to fit your style, budget and space, plus free shipping. Black Friday in July ends July 27. Shop today at Wayfair.com Wayfair Every style, every home.