8. The Evidence

Summary

Murder on Songbird Road: Episode 8 - The Evidence

Murder on Songbird Road, a gripping true-crime series by iHeartPodcasts, delves deep into the controversial case surrounding the tragic stabbing death of Jade Beasley, an 11-year-old girl from Southern Illinois. Episode 8, titled "The Evidence," meticulously examines the forensic and investigative aspects that led to the arrest and conviction of Julia Beverly, Jade’s father’s fiancée. Hosted by veteran true-crime host Lauren Bright Pacheco and criminal defense attorney Bob Motta, this episode scrutinizes whether justice was truly served or if an innocent woman is languishing behind bars.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Suspicious 911 Calls and Initial Investigation

   The episode opens by revisiting the critical timeline of events on the day of Jade's murder. Multiple 911 calls were made, including one from Julia Beverly reporting a suspicious person in a dark hoodie running through backyards ([03:13]). Bob Motta highlights the significance of these calls, questioning their authenticity and timing:

   Bob Motta [03:23]: "He said, I made the 911 call."

2. Julie Beverly’s Interrogation and the Walmart Alibi

   Central to the prosecution’s case was Beverly's account of visiting a Walmart before returning home. This alibi has been a focal point of skepticism among listeners.

   During her interrogation, Beverly consistently stated she went to Walmart but only remained in the parking lot ([08:07]). The inconsistency in her statements raises red flags:

   Cindy Geitman [08:53]: "On face value, the Walmart story appears to be a lie."

   Cody Flom, co-host, emphasizes the psychological strain Beverly might have been under:

   Jason Flom [09:13]: "Lying to the police is particularly bad."

3. The Time Gap Between Incident and 911 Call

   A significant point of contention is the approximately 30-minute delay between Beverly’s return home and her call to 911 ([10:10]). The hosts debate whether this delay is indicative of consciousness of guilt or a natural reaction to trauma.

   Cindy Geitman [12:03]: "According to the prosecution's timeline, Beverly failed to dial 911 for roughly 30 minutes after returning home."

   Flom considers the possibility of shock-induced paralysis:

   Jason Flom [12:42]: "If you're in her shoes...that would probably be running through your mind."

4. Forensic Evidence: DNA and Bite Mark Analysis

   The episode delves into the forensic evidence presented against Beverly, particularly focusing on DNA findings and the controversial bite mark analysis.

   • DNA Evidence: A swab from Beverly's arm tested positive for Jade's DNA, but its exact source (saliva or blood) remains unclear. This raises questions about its relevance and conclusiveness.

     Bob Motta [22:08]: "The DNA on the arm to me was probably the smoking gun in this case..."

   • Bite Mark Analysis: The prosecution presented a discredited forensic technique, bite mark analysis, to suggest a struggle between Beverly and Jade. Despite objections from the defense, the court admitted this evidence.

     Cindy Geitman [21:00]: "Bite mark evidence...has been debunked, discredited as junk science."

5. Issues with Evidence Collection and Chain of Custody

   A significant portion of the episode critiques the methods used during the collection of evidence, highlighting procedural lapses that could undermine the integrity of the case.

   • Improper Handling by Investigators: Matt Deschamps, a member of the Illinois State Police Crime Scene Unit, is shown mishandling evidence by not changing gloves, leading to potential contamination ([38:53]).

     Bob Motta [43:15]: "If I was training him, I would have stopped him and said, you need to change your gloves..."

   • Chain of Custody Breaks: The mishandling resulted in a break in the chain of custody, particularly concerning Beverly’s sweatshirt, which could have contained crucial DNA evidence from the alleged assailant.

     Cindy Geitman [44:10]: "The bag containing Beverly's sweatshirt...was left in the interrogation room...resulted in a break in the chain of custody."

6. Selective Testing and Potential Bias

   The hosts argue that selective testing of evidence played a crucial role in shaping the prosecution’s narrative. Essential items like Beverly’s fingernail scrapings and electronic devices owned by Jade were not adequately tested, potentially hiding exculpatory evidence.

   Cindy Geitman [50:26]: "In December 2024...the Illinois office of the State's Attorney's appellate prosecutor confirmed that none of Jade Beasley's electronic devices were forensically tested."

   Flom underscores the gravity of these omissions:

   Jason Flom [52:05]: "It's insane...there was no forensic examination of any of those devices to build a real timeline."

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Notable Quotes with Attributions

• Bob Motta [03:23]: "He said, I made the 911 call."
• Jason Flom [09:13]: "Lying to the police is particularly bad."
• Bob Motta [22:08]: "The DNA on the arm to me was probably the smoking gun in this case..."
• Cindy Geitman [21:00]: "Bite mark evidence...has been debunked, discredited as junk science."
• Bob Motta [43:15]: "If I was training him, I would have stopped him and said, you need to change your gloves..."
• Cindy Geitman [50:26]: "In December 2024...none of Jade Beasley's electronic devices were forensically tested."
• Jason Flom [52:05]: "It's insane...they didn't look at any of those devices to find out if Jade was active..."

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Insights and Analysis

The episode provides a thorough critique of the investigative and forensic procedures employed in Beverly’s case. Key insights include:

1. Questionable Forensic Practices: The reliance on discredited techniques like bite mark analysis, combined with ambiguous DNA evidence, casts doubt on the solidity of the prosecution’s case.

2. Procedural Lapses: The mishandling of evidence collection and the break in the chain of custody severely undermine the credibility of the evidence presented against Beverly.

3. Selective Evidence Testing: The omission of potentially exculpatory evidence, such as Beverly’s nail scrapings and Jade’s electronic device data, suggests a possible bias in the investigation aimed at sealing Beverly’s guilt without thorough examination.

4. Psychological Impact on Witnesses: The discussion around Beverly’s delayed 911 call highlights the complexity of human reactions to trauma, questioning whether procedural expectations adequately account for such nuances.

5. Lack of Defense Advocacy: The episode hints at ineffective defense strategies during the trial, such as not raising critical issues regarding evidence handling, which now hampers any appeals process.

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Conclusions

Episode 8, "The Evidence," of Murder on Songbird Road meticulously dismantles the prosecution’s case against Julia Beverly by highlighting significant flaws in forensic evidence handling, investigative procedures, and the overall integrity of the case against her. The collaboration between Lauren Bright Pacheco and Bob Motta underscores the importance of scrutinizing every facet of a trial to ensure justice is not miscarried by technical oversights or potential biases. As the series progresses, it continues to build a compelling argument that questions whether an innocent woman has been wrongfully convicted, leaving listeners eagerly anticipating further revelations.

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About the Hosts

• Lauren Bright Pacheco: A seasoned true-crime host dedicated to uncovering the truth behind complex cases.
• Bob Motta: An experienced criminal defense attorney providing legal insights and advocacy.

Production Credits:

• Executive Producers: Taylor Chicoin and Lauren Bright Pacheco
• Research and Investigative Reporting: Bob Motta and Lauren Bright Pacheco
• Editing and Sound Design: Evan Tyre and Taylor Chicoin
• Additional Music: Asher Kurtz and Taylor Chicoine

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For more detailed discussions and updates on the case, subscribe to Murder on Songbird Road on your preferred podcast platform or visit the iHeartRadio app for additional true-crime stories.

Transcript

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[Cindy Geitman]

Your [e-mail] Murder on Songbird Road is a production of I Heart Podcasts. Previously on Murder on Songbird road. Julia Beverly's 911 call wasn't the only one of interest on the day of Jade's murder.

[Bob Motta]

And this call was made at 10:30 for a suspicious person.

[Jason Flom]

No way.

[Bob Motta]

He was out there, belligerent, talking about harming somebody.

[Cindy Geitman]

And it looks like there were two calls. The police were responding to Julie Beverly's call, but it looks like Marion police were already en route to a call about a male in all black.

[Jason Flom]

But I did overhear one of the officers state that we had a 911 call. They were looking for a person in a dark hoodie and dark pants suspiciously running through backyards.

[Bob Motta]

There was a guy in a mask.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

Or a person in a mask running through the backyard at that time, and.

[Cindy Geitman]

He made that call.

[Bob Motta]

He said, I made the 911 call.

[Cindy Geitman]

The property that's adjacent to the murder scene with multiple bodies of water, a heavily wooded area. And now what we're hearing, a makeshift encampment for transient people. And the police don't check it.

[Bob Motta]

That's what I can't understand.

[Cindy Geitman]

Jason Flom. Bob Mata. Bob.

[Jason Flom]

Jason, nice to meet you, man. We have this adversarial system right where.

[Cindy Geitman]

The prosecution's trying to win and the.

[Bob Motta]

Defense is trying to defend their client.

[Cindy Geitman]

What we need is an inquisitorial system. I'm Lauren Brett Pacheco, and this is Murder on Songbird. Obtaining the trial transcripts and Julia Beverly's interrogation video had been a long, frustrating, and arduous process. However, once we had them, they provided incredible insights into the prosecution's case against Beverly, particularly regarding the investigation.

[Bob Motta]

Would you state your name so we have voice identification? Julia Besley. Can you give me your date of birth, Julia? 4, 2391. Do you have a middle initial? E, B, e, l, y, mm. All right. And 421 of 91. 423. 423 of 91. All right, I'm going to ask you. Can you start all over from the beginning? What happened? Oh. Oh, wait, wait. Yep. Sorry, I need to redo the Miranda.

[Cindy Geitman]

One to the left of frame. Seated across from two detectives at a small table in a compact interrogation room, a sweatshirt clad Beverly waived her rights to remain silent and to an attorney before agreeing to be questioned for what would end up being ours.

[Bob Motta]

Do you wish to speak with us today? Yes. May I get your signature right here on this line.

[Cindy Geitman]

The prosecution emphasized her staid demeanor during the investigation, but Beverly's emotions are evident when she speaks about finding Jade.

[Bob Motta]

I realized I didn't have my cards with me. I turned around and came back home. Whenever I got home, I saw the front door was open. As I went to the inn, he came out, and I tried to grab the knife from him. And at that time, just multiple things, just trying to grab him and stuff. Got cuts on my hand. At that point, he just ran off. I ran in the house, saw blood everywhere. I ran to my bathroom to grab my rag. I wiped my hand real quick because it was bleeding, and I ran to go find Jade. That's when I found her in the bathroom.

[Cindy Geitman]

Before we delve deeper, let's recap the key bad facts that ultimately led to Beverly's conviction for the murder of Jade Beasley. We have. She left Jade alone. She left the dogs outside. She said she made it to Walmart. That is the number one thing that people who've listened to the podcast have hit me up with. They've said, why did she lie? Why did she lie? The bulk of the case against Beverly was built on the foundation of her statements about making it to Walmart. Here, in Beverly's own words from her interrogation on the day of the murder is her account as questioned by Williamson County Detective Cindy Geitman and Marion Police Detective Carl Egemeier.

[Bob Motta]

When was it that you realized you didn't have your cards? When I got to Walmart. Pulled out my purse, and I was checking my phone, and that's when I realized I didn't have any of my cards with me. Okay. And then you came back home? Yeah. Okay.

[Cindy Geitman]

Later in the interrogation, she's asked for more specifics about that Walmart trip.

[Bob Motta]

When you went to Walmart, did you go into Walmart? No. I didn't even get out because that's when I went to check my phone. I realized I didn't have any of my Cards with me. Okay. But you were in the parking lot. Yeah, just in the parking lot. Okay. All right.

[Cindy Geitman]

On face value, the Walmart story appears to be a lie. A quick aside. I had actually questioned Beverly extremely extensively about that Walmart trip over the phone the day before. And you've mentioned the fact that lying is never good, but lying to the police is particularly bad.

[Jason Flom]

Well, I mean, if you're trying to get yourself arrested and charged, that's the number one way to do it. But again, I cannot stress this enough. It's so easy to sit here in your chairs or in your car or in your bed, wherever you're listening to this podcast and think, well, I would never lie to the police in that situation. I would tell the truth. And again, I'm going to restate this. If you've left your house for 15 minutes, okay, and you come back and. And whoever it is, whether it's your kid, your step kid, whoever, and you come back and that child has been brutally murdered. Brutally murdered. In that short of a span of time. Anybody who thinks that they're not going to think that the cops are going to think that I did it is just not being honest with themselves.

[Cindy Geitman]

I don't suffer from that same delusion because it wouldn't be the first thing that I'd think of, really.

[Jason Flom]

The question for me always, with respect to when somebody in that situation lies, and we see it all the time, is are they lying because they are in protection mode, or are they lying for a situation like what Julie's talking about happening, like her mind, because that was her plan. She thought that's what she was going to do. When is the first time she mentions the Walmart stop? Is it initially before she's brought into the station, or is it when she's being interrogated?

[Cindy Geitman]

It is, I think, on scene that she said that's where she was going, she was heading to town. And then her brain appears to have just filled in the missing pieces. So by the time they're in the interrogation, she's saying where she always parks, because that's the easiest place for her to unload the kids without feeling like someone's gonna park right next to her. Now, I did push her in the conversation we had yester about that because I said, why did you go to Carbondale? There was a local Walmart. Why that Carbondale? And without missing a beat, she said, they are a bigger store and they still had the Black Friday Ben sales left.

[Jason Flom]

The bigger issue for me initially was the gap in time from the time that she gets home till the time that she calls 911. That was something that was tough for me to try to stretch it out.

[Cindy Geitman]

Remember, according to the prosecution's timeline, Beverly failed to dial 911 for roughly 30 minutes after returning home.

[Jason Flom]

This period of time, it's hard to account for all of it. That has always kind of been my one one thing more than anything else. Like, I completely understand that when Julia decides that, oh, my God, they're coming after me, they think I'm. I'm the one who did this, that she'd try to get herself away from that house for longer. If you're in her shoes and she's gone, what, 15, 20 minutes, you would realize, okay, well, that seems crazy that somebody, like, snuck in and did this in the time that I just happened to leave the house. I think that that would probably be running through your mind.

[Cindy Geitman]

I. I agree with you that it's suspect, but we, unfortunately are at the disadvantage of having to confirm the state's timeline because the defense never challenged it.

[Jason Flom]

Right. And it's. It's problematic, but it's still explainable to me because you cannot know how you will respond to a situation like that unless you're in it. People can speculate all day long. I like to think that if I were on the bus or a subway or on an airplane and somebody pulled out a shank, that I would jump out of my seat and I'd go tackle that person and save the day. I've had that kind of fantasy dream a million times. Would I do that in real life? I have no idea.

[Cindy Geitman]

You mentioned the gap in time, and that comes up in the interrogation. She actually isn't asked about it. She just offers that I found her.

[Bob Motta]

And that she could possibly not be breathing. And then at that point, I just kind of was waiting. I sat in the kitchen. I know. I just kind of went to shut down panic mode. I didn't know what to do. I felt like I needed to do something for her.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

I want to do.

[Jason Flom]

Yeah, Julie, shutting down is plausible. When you have all of those things trying to work their way around in your mind and you're trying to make sense of it. I could see that being crippling. I can see that causing somebody to just freeze up, to freak out.

[Cindy Geitman]

The word freeze immediately made me recall conversations I'd had with three longtime friends of Beverly, Hillary, Katie, and Leah during my first trip to Marion. Here are their combined takes on that lapse of time before Beverly called 911.

[Bob Motta]

I could see her freezing like Just in horror.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

I can see her just in total shock, like frozen. And I can picture her that way. I can't even imagine how she even.

[Bob Motta]

Got the phone to call.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

I wouldn't have even had it in me.

[Cindy Geitman]

Incidentally, that's Leah, a former military police officer who, like Julie, is mixed race and was singled out while attending Beverly's trial. But we'll get into that later. And Julie shakes. So. So how she was able to dial the phone, Honestly, I'm so proud of her. I know for a fact that she broke down.

[Bob Motta]

She can't.

[Cindy Geitman]

She's just very emotional.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

She can't handle any kind of thing without crying.

[Cindy Geitman]

What seemed like five seconds to her was probably 20 minutes. She's a thinker. So she had everything going through her head. She had, I'm the stepmom, I'm the one who found her. She had, I'm the mixed one in this white family.

[Jason Flom]

I am the one of color in.

[Cindy Geitman]

This white family in this hick southern Illinois town. My girl that I raised is gone. How are my kids gonna be affected? She probably had every bit of that. And running through her mind in what would have seemed like a five second thought was probably an absolute frozen moment of shock, of straight tears. Let's not forget she was attacked by.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

An intruder walking into her home, then.

[Cindy Geitman]

Found her daughter dead. She is in shock.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

No one can tell you how they would respond in that situation.

[Cindy Geitman]

I've been in a lot of stressful situation situations and I've completely shut down at times where I wasn't even able to speak, just cry. And I'm not as soft as Julie. Murder on Songbird Road. We'll be back after the break.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

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Now back to Murder on Songbird Road Back to Bob and his take on the time gap before the 911 call.

[Jason Flom]

When I first read the CO Burger probable cause affidavit and there was a phrase that was used and I think they called it frozen shock phase. It was the exact same circumstance.

[Cindy Geitman]

Bob is referencing the 2022 Idaho Four killings in which four University of Idaho students were fatally stabbed in an off campus residence.

[Jason Flom]

The roommate who saw the suspected killer walking out had the bushy eyebrows and then in that case doesn't call 911 ever. 911 didn't get called till just about noon the following day. She sees this stranger in the house at 4:00am, 4:30am and doesn't make the call. They use the word she was in frozen shock phase. That one's explainable to me. It's still a bad fact though.

[Cindy Geitman]

The injuries Beverly claimed resulted from a struggle with the knife wielding intruder she says she encountered at the front door along with others she attributed to self harm were also under scrutiny. There was a bite mark on her arm which Beverly attributed to a self inflicted bite. That's when the state brought in something that makes you and I both groan and that is bite mark evidence. Because it has been debunked, discredited as junk science. There's no shortage of wrongful convictions that can be directly attributed to the junk science of bite marks. Identification and analysis. After a local dentist with no forensics training made dental molds, an expert witness in forensic odontology testified, the defense raised a continuing objection to the witness's testimony, arguing it was inadmissible. However, the judge ruled in favor of the prosecution, stating that any observational, not theoretical evidence is admissible in court. Meanwhile, a swab from Beverly's arm tested positive for Jade's DNA, though it was not further analyzed to determine if it was saliva. As a result, it remained unclear whether the DNA sample was related to the incident or merely household DNA.

[Jason Flom]

The DNA on the arm to me was probably the smoking gun in this case in conjunction with the lies about Walmart out of physical evidence that it existed. That DNA that they claim that they tested, that tested positive as to being Jades, but they didn't go so far as to figure out what the source was. They didn't figure out if it was saliva, blood. It's inexplicable to me like, like how are you not figuring that out?

[Cindy Geitman]

Nonetheless, an implication was made supported by the dentist's observations that the bite mark was caused by Jade as she struggled for her life. However, it's important to remember that the prosecution also argued that Beverly had thoroughly cleaned herself after the murder to eliminate any evidence from her body. Here's Bob.

[Jason Flom]

That's going to be the primary wound that you're going to try to clean off if you know that Jade bit you. So, again, it's insane to think that that would remain the one area where they found Jade's DNA, because it would have been the one area that she would have been sure to have cleaned off the most thoroughly.

[Cindy Geitman]

Furthermore, in 2022, the National Institute of Standards and Technology reviewed the scientific foundations of bite mark analysis, concluding there was insufficient data to support its validity as a forensic technique. But what's even more significant, the arm swab taken from Beverly on the day of the murder, which the prosecution used to tie the bite mark to Jade. Despite the fact it wasn't confirmed to be saliva, that swab was the only DNA sample from Beverly that was actually tested. You heard that correctly. None of Beverly's hand swabs, fingernail scrapings, finger wounds, scratches on her forehead or clothing were tested. The only evidence analyzed from that DNA collection was that one arm swab. How do you have all of her DNA and you only test one thing?

[Jason Flom]

It's unbelievable to me.

[Cindy Geitman]

What's also hard to believe is who was deciding what evidence was or wasn't tested. A particular excerpt from the preliminary hearing transcript stood out to us right away. In it, Julie, Beverly's defense attorney, is cross examining Cindy Geitman, the lead detective. It's also worth noting again that this was Geitman's first and last time leading a murder investigation, as she has since retired. Bob and I will read that exchange verbatim.

[Jason Flom]

So every piece of physical evidence would have at least come into your jurisdiction. You were the one that decides what goes to the lab for testing, correct?

[Cindy Geitman]

Incorrect.

[Jason Flom]

Who does make that decision?

[Cindy Geitman]

At the time, at the beginning of trial, we were using the Williamson County State's Attorney's office, and Assistant State's Attorney Lisa Irvin was the one that directed me on what evidence to send to the state police lab for testing.

[Jason Flom]

Okay. Do you have any independent discretion in your own investigation to determine what items should or should not be tested or what items you would suggest be tested?

[Cindy Geitman]

I suggested items, and by my training, it was. I was supposed to use her as the final decision on what items were taken to the state lab. So was the prosecution essentially dictating the scope of the lead investigator's investigation? I've reached out multiple times to the current state's attorney for clarification on whether this is Standard protocol in Williamson County. But to date, I have yet to receive a response. Meanwhile, Bob's not exactly shocked.

[Jason Flom]

I mean, there's some truth to it. They can't test everything. And they are allowed to cherry pick evidence. They are allowed to pick and choose, even though in theory they do have unlimited resources and they do have a state lab that they're sending these things to. When you're talking to laypeople about it, they're not going to like the answer. Well, they should be testing everything. We're trying to get to the truth here, but the reality is, is that they just don't test everything.

[Cindy Geitman]

There's everything and then there's what you would absolutely assume they had tested. Because it doesn't make sense that they didn't test things like Julia Beverly's nail scrap. If you're so sure that she is guilty, why wouldn't you test the swabs of her fingers and her hands, which were covered with blood from what she contends were her defensive wounds when she was met by the assailant, but what the state contends were wounds that she sustained while she was murdering Jade? Either which way. How do you not test her nail scrapings? It would have been a slam dunk.

[Jason Flom]

It's unexplainable. You're asking me to answer a question that I couldn't possibly answer because it makes no sense at all. Like you said, it either opens and shuts the case immediately because she's got jade skin under her fingernails and the case is done, or it's somebody else's. Would I take from it more than anything else is not that the state was cherry picking evidence that they wanted tested because they wanted to keep a very narrow focus on potentially who this could have been that done it. And I hate to do it to a fellow defense attorney, but when you start getting the police reports in, there's a million things that they should be testing and they're not testing any of them. I am filing a motion, getting in front of the judge and asking the judge that they order. Even if you have to narrow it down. Like, they're clearly not going to pay to test everything. But I'm going to narrow down the three or four most critical pieces of evidence that I absolutely think could be exculpatory to my client. I'm going to go in, I'm at least making a record of it. Even if the judge is going to deny it, I'm making a record. Because you know what, that's powerful on appeal.

[Cindy Geitman]

I was just gonna say I think that a lot of people don't understand that your hands are tied on appeal by things that were raised as issues during trial. As we've seen, we have some very real issues, but the fact that they weren't raised by her defense attorney means that they cannot be tackled in the appeal. Honestly. The way in which her newborn son was immediately removed while she was a pretrial detainee speaks volumes to, in terms of lack of presumption of innocence, 100%. That wasn't raised during the trial. What was raised during the trial, however, was something Beverly has remained consistent about since the day of the murder. Her description of the alleged assailant.

[Bob Motta]

Can you describe him for us? Black clothes. I mean, average built, maybe a little muscular, but I mean, couldn't really tell. He had like a ski mask, so I could see from here I could tell he was white. And then he was a little taller than me, maybe a few inches or so.

[Cindy Geitman]

Beverly has always described the male she says she encountered that December day as around 5 foot 5 or so. But as mentioned before, why, if the guy is a fictional scapegoat, wouldn't she have made a made up man sound more imposing? Granted, Beverly's only 4 foot 11, but the average height for American men is 5ft 9 inches. And her then fiance, Mike Beasley, stands about 6 foot. Why, if she was set on creating someone else to blame, would she have said this to police?

[Bob Motta]

I felt it's my fault because I left her. You were there with her. You were there for her. I should have just taken her with.

[Cindy Geitman]

Me to the store. In the interrogation, Beverly even says, this is my fault. I should have taken her with me. This is my fault.

[Jason Flom]

Which speaks to her innocence. I mean, that speaks to her innocence. It does.

[Cindy Geitman]

So does something else. You'll remember from our last episode that police were advised of a male fitting the description Beverly gave in terms of clothing. From the CAD reports, Marion advised they saw a male wearing a black hoodie walking on Buckley about 50 yards westbound off Quarry League. An officer named Sloan was sent to investigate. Here's his testimony from Beverly's trial, which Bob and I will read.

[Jason Flom]

Officer Welge, I believe, advised for me to check on a person that was wearing a black hoodie or a black jacket that was walking on Buckley Road, I believe is the name of the road. So I did that.

[Cindy Geitman]

So Officer Welge went to the residence?

[Jason Flom]

Yeah. He continued on and I stopped.

[Cindy Geitman]

You stopped? Did you get out of your car?

[Jason Flom]

Yes, I did.

[Cindy Geitman]

And did you talk to the person in the black Hoodie?

[Jason Flom]

Yes, I did.

[Cindy Geitman]

Did you identify that person?

[Jason Flom]

I don't believe I identified her.

[Cindy Geitman]

Was it female?

[Jason Flom]

Yes.

[Cindy Geitman]

Okay. Did you speak with her?

[Jason Flom]

Yeah, she was walking her dog or looking for her dog or something to do with her dog. She was looking for a dog in the area.

[Cindy Geitman]

And you were able to confirm she lived in that area?

[Jason Flom]

Yes, she's a resident.

[Cindy Geitman]

Okay. After you spoke with a female, did you. What did you do next?

[Jason Flom]

I continued to songbird to assist officer welge.

[Cindy Geitman]

Here's beverly's defense attorney's cross examination. Officer sloan, did you prepare a written report in this case?

[Jason Flom]

Yes, ma'am, I did.

[Cindy Geitman]

In that report, did you mention any contact with this individual wearing a black hoodie on buckley road?

[Jason Flom]

No, I did not.

[Cindy Geitman]

Did you. When you stopped to identify this person, did you get a name?

[Jason Flom]

I do not believe so.

[Cindy Geitman]

Did you get an address?

[Jason Flom]

I do not believe so.

[Cindy Geitman]

How long did this contact occur?

[Jason Flom]

Guessing. Probably a couple of minutes.

[Cindy Geitman]

Maybe like a whole couple of minutes, I assume.

[Jason Flom]

I. I didn't. I didn't. I didn't time it.

[Cindy Geitman]

Okay, did this person have a dog with them?

[Jason Flom]

I don't recall seeing a dog.

[Cindy Geitman]

Okay, so if you reported back that this individual was walking a dog, that would have been an error.

[Jason Flom]

I said she was either walking a dog or she said something. She was walking or looking for her dog or something.

[Cindy Geitman]

But you don't recall if the dog was there?

[Jason Flom]

I do not believe so.

[Cindy Geitman]

But this person was dressed in black, Is that correct?

[Jason Flom]

She had a black hoodie on.

[Cindy Geitman]

All right, so this, to me, is such an interesting exchange because officer sloan didn't get her name or address, but knew she was a resident, couldn't remember if she was walking a dog or looking for a dog, but remembered the color of her hoodie and did not make any official note or report of this interaction.

[Jason Flom]

Yeah, it's got zero evidentiary value. Again, theene should have filed a motion in lemonade. Barring this entire line of testimony. The only reason that mudge asked that question was in order to say that, oh, yeah, I saw a woman in a black hoodie. I spoke to her. She was looking for her dog or she was walking her dog to just discredit the. The black hoodie situation. Oh, yeah, we found the person.

[Cindy Geitman]

It wasn't a guy. It was a woman. She lives in the neighborhood, but I didn't get her name. Don't remember. She had a dog. Didn't get her address, but she lives in the neighborhood. It seems really disingenuous to me.

[Jason Flom]

It is disingenuous it's and it completely undermines Julie's story in one fell swoop. And it's got no evidentiary value. It shouldn't have been allowed in. If they can't prove it in terms of it's not written in a report that it doesn't exist anywhere other than this cop's memory. I mean, how much weight can he give that they're offering it for one reason and one reason alone? Because of the mention of a black hoodie. That was it.

[Cindy Geitman]

I find it very interesting, too. Just a coincidence, but Sloan was one of the officers who responded to Aaron Lewton that morning and let him go the first time. Murder on Songbird Road will continue after the break.

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[Cindy Geitman]

Now back to Murder on Songbird Road. Next, we turn to the collection of Beverly's DNA. On the day of the murder, after Beverly voluntarily agreed to be questioned without an attorney, she also consented to the collection of her DNA from both her person and her clothing. The entire collection process was videotaped.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

I'll step out for a second just.

[Cindy Geitman]

So here's a little note.

[Jason Flom]

Hello, my name's Matt.

[Cindy Geitman]

I'm with State police. Matt is Matt Deschamps, a member of the Illinois State Police Crime Scene Unit. What struck us immediately was that Deschamps entered the room wearing gloves, propping the door open with his left hand as he entered. Then, without hesitation, he began handling the folders belonging to the detectives who had just interviewed Beverly, moving them to the side with both gloved hands.

[Jason Flom]

So first of all, is it all.

[Cindy Geitman]

Right if I just take some pictures.

[Jason Flom]

Of you, just to document your. What you're wearing?

[Cindy Geitman]

And he then adjusted the camera around his neck, still wearing the same gloves, never changing them, not once.

[Bob Motta]

If you want, you have a shirt.

[Cindy Geitman]

On underneath your hoodie.

[Bob Motta]

Do you want to go ahead and take that off?

[Jason Flom]

You didn't have anything in your pockets.

[Bob Motta]

That you need to do? Okay.

[Cindy Geitman]

All right.

[Bob Motta]

Go a little bit lower.

[Cindy Geitman]

Sorry.

[Bob Motta]

Thank you.

[Jason Flom]

And what I'm doing is I'm going to take these overalls and I'm going.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

To go close up on each arm.

[Bob Motta]

Okay. My camera is being pricked. If you have any more scrapes or.

[Jason Flom]

Any other injuries on Your arms, you.

[Bob Motta]

Know, I mean, that's it.

[Cindy Geitman]

In fact, Deschamps collected all samples while wearing the same set of gloves, which came into contact with multiple objects throughout the procedure. This appears to be in clear violation of the Illinois State Police's Clean Technique protocol, which mandates that investigators use disposable gloves during sample collection and exercise caution to prevent gloves from coming into contact with anything that could contaminate the evidence. The protocol further instructs investigators to check gloves periodically for contamination and change them frequently. Additionally, it specifies that the wearer should avoid touching their bare skin, such as the face or arms, while wearing gloves.

[Jason Flom]

And then what about, I'm going to get. You've got a little cut here on your chin that I'm going to take a picture of and then up here by your eyebrow.

[Cindy Geitman]

The video clearly shows Deschamps touching his own face with his gloved hands. While referencing Beverly's injuries. He also reaches into his pocket for a ruler and later a pen, retrieving them multiple times. Observing this, I began documenting each potential instance of contamination on a Google Doc, which I later shared with this woman.

[Bob Motta]

My name is Katie Hartman and I worked with the Crime Scene Unit in Louisville, Kentucky.

[Cindy Geitman]

And how long did you work in that capacity?

[Bob Motta]

Eleven years for the unit itself.

[Cindy Geitman]

And you were in law enforcement for even longer than that, correct?

[Bob Motta]

Yes, I was in law enforcement for 21.

[Cindy Geitman]

Now retired, Hartman has earned an impeccable reputation throughout her decades long career and is also married to a former detective. Are there standard protocols for collecting DNA samples from a suspect?

[Bob Motta]

Yes, standard. And they can be different from state to state because each state has their own labs as far as that are affiliated with police department or any other law enforcement entity. Those protocols let us know how they want that evidence collected and what that does. It enables them to do the best possible testing without contamination.

[Cindy Geitman]

How often would you, hypothetically, if you had to test for different things, how often would you change your gloves?

[Bob Motta]

Very often. Especially when you're dealing with DNA or gunshot residue, where you're touching the other person's hands or the other person's body. You want to change gloves in between hands even?

[Cindy Geitman]

Really?

[Bob Motta]

Yes. The best thing you can do is change your gloves constantly, make sure that you're not also touching anything else, and transferring anything that might topically be on something, fibers, liquids, anything, onto another piece of evidence by doing so when you're touching something else.

[Cindy Geitman]

I asked Hartman to review the video of Beverly's DNA collection and this was her response.

[Bob Motta]

There was a lot of red flags. Let me say that Got it. If I was training him, I would have stopped him and said, you need to change your gloves, you know, because he was taking samples of her fingernails and everything.

[Cindy Geitman]

Then after all that, he holds the sweatshirt she's just removed with both hands, again with the gloves that he's touched everything, folding it for several seconds. And then the ungloved female detective continues to hold the collection bag to assist.

[Bob Motta]

And again, that goes back to training. You know, the ungloved detective. You know, I can't say I never had ungloved detectives touching my stuff. But at the same time, most of our detectives, thankfully made themselves aware of the possibility of cross contamination, and they would glove up if they were going to be in the room with you.

[Cindy Geitman]

And that sweatshirt further played into something called chain of custody.

[Bob Motta]

Chain of custody simply is what happens to a piece of evidence, including DNA. DNA is a piece of evidence. Blood is evidence. So all these things are documented in where they go, who has them, what time they went there, was anybody else involved in the handling of that said evidence. So what you're doing is you're creating a timeline. That's a chain of custody. If you're in the chain, then that means you had something to do with this case, either rightly so, or negative, negatively. So it protects the person and the case, it protects the suspect, it protects the victim. It needs to be completely untouched by anyone that's not involved.

[Cindy Geitman]

I bring it up because the bag containing Beverly's sweatshirt, the one Deschamps touched with his gloved hands while an ungloved Cindy Geitman helped place it inside, that was left in the interrogation room after Deschamps departed. This resulted in a break in the chain of custody for an item that could have held crucial DNA evidence from the alleged assailant Beverly claims to have encountered. Now, back to Katie Hartman.

[Bob Motta]

That really bothered me. Then he left some evidence in there.

[Cindy Geitman]

Yeah, he left her clothing in the bag behind.

[Bob Motta]

Yeah, that bothered me. And the detective just picked it up and threw it in the corner.

[Cindy Geitman]

Which means that the chain of custody was disrupted. Yeah. Bob and I have discussed Matt Deschamps evidence collection at length. So it's of note also that he processed the crime scene and Beverly's car. We don't have any video of the protocol he followed during that, but when he knew he was being videotaped, it was pretty noteworthy. Do you have any thoughts you want to add on that?

[Jason Flom]

The collection. Look, it's always one of our primary tools in our tool belt as defense attorneys to attack the investigation the collection of evidence, and this one was worse than most. The problem with it from the defense side of it is it's a bit of a double edged sword in that theoretically, if exculpatory DNA evidence was found, that too, in theory, could be tainted. You know, so it's like, it's just a shame. It's a shame that it wasn't done properly. And I don't know that there's anything that you can do to fix it.

[Cindy Geitman]

Katie Hartman remains more troubled by what wasn't tested, including Beverly's fingernail scrapings and finger swabs.

[Bob Motta]

Not upset me, but that disturbed me. Because your job as a crime scene person, sometimes it's hard not to be biased. I'm not gonna lie. It's very hard, very hard. Especially if you see a lot of things through the years, but your job is still to prove or disprove what someone is being accused of and try to find out who did it. Not who they think did it, but prove or disprove if this person who has been accused did it. Those fingernail scrapings, the clothing, all of it that wasn't sent could prove or disprove her story?

[Cindy Geitman]

Absolutely. In your personal experience, who would dictate what should or should not be sent for testing to the state lab?

[Bob Motta]

Our head detective and the crime scene person. I've never had anybody but a lead detective or a detective or a police officer who I was working the case with and worked with me on the lab. No one else has told me what to send to the lab.

[Cindy Geitman]

So it would be unusual in your experience or opinion for the prosecutor's office to dictate exactly what should and should not be sent?

[Bob Motta]

I've never had that happen. Now I have had prosecutors ask me, can you resend something or is there still anything left of this piece of evidence to do an additional testing? You know, they do get involved in that type of thing, but I've never had any of them be the sole person to tell me or a detective what to send.

[Cindy Geitman]

This is how special prosecutor Jennifer Mudge addressed selective testing in her closing argument. So now we're in CSI Miami and we have to test every single thing that was in that house. No, this is the real world. We can't do that.

[Jason Flom]

Yeah, you don't make that statement publicly ever, let alone a trial. It's just one of those things that, you know, there's some truth to it. They're not going to test everything. They're just not. But all the critical things which, had they been brought up on Cross examination would have absolutely laid waste to the state's case. You have to point the finger at who it needs to be pointed at. It shouldn't be you and I on a podcast being the first two people to point this out publicly. This should have happened at trial because it's a big deal. Is that unusual for the state to do it? No, not necessarily. But it isn't unusual for a defense attorney not to point it out. All the things that they should have tested.

[Cindy Geitman]

One could argue that things that would implicate Beverly were tested, while anything that could possibly vindicate her was purposely not tested. Her nail scrapings and her finger swabs aside, it was our impression that only Julia Beverly's phone was subjected to forensic examination. When we talk about a time you have an 11 year old who's at home with a smartphone, a Chromebook, a laptop, and a gaming device, if there was any activity on those devices after 10, 15, or during the time that Beverly is caught on camera at Hucks.

[Jason Flom]

That it's game over.

[Cindy Geitman]

You is exculpatory.

[Jason Flom]

It's game over. It destroys. It completely destroys the state's timeline. That means that she's alive and well while Julie's allegedly dumping all the bloody clothes, murder weapon in a Huck's garbage can. I mean, it just, it destroys their timeline.

[Cindy Geitman]

In December 2024, in response to a Freedom of Information act request, the Illinois office of of the State's Attorney's appellate prosecutor confirmed that none of Jade Beasley's electronic devices were forensically tested. None. Why? Like the testing of Beverly's nail scrapings, it would have potentially been a slam dunk for the prosecution.

[Jason Flom]

It's insane. When we learned of that fact, I about lost my mind. I mean, in the day and age that we live in, where forensic device examination has now become the primary way that they are getting convictions on cases, solving cases. To think that they didn't even look at any of those devices to find out if Jade was active in order to build a timeline, a real timeline is unbelievable to me. This thing slides into the ineffective assistance of counsel column very, very easily because you have to challenge things in court on the record, and when you don't do creates a massive problem.

[Cindy Geitman]

And now the question was, who or what would be able to fit on the next murder on Songbird Road? Access to Huck's footage raises new issues.

[Jason Flom]

Does it mean that I don't think there's any way in hell that that's what she was disposing of there? Absolutely.

[Cindy Geitman]

Compounded by observations about Beverly. She didn't like blood. She didn't like violence before her legal team morphs in a major way. If anyone can get Julie out, it's her. Murder on Songbird Road is a production of I Heart Podcasts. Our executive producers are Taylor Chicoin and Lauren Bright Pacheco Research, writing and hosting by Lauren Bright Pacheco Investigative reporting by Bob Motta and Lauren Bright Pacheco Editing, sound design and original music by Evan Tyre and Taylor Chicoine Additional music by Asher Kurtz Please like subscribe and leave us a review where wherever you're listening, you can follow me on all platforms at LaurenBright Pacheco and email the show with thoughts, suggestions or tips at Investigating [e-mail] for more iheart podcasts, visit the iheartradio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows. Thanks for listening.

[Lauren Bright Pacheco]

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