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- [00:01]
Anya Kane
Audible's best of 2024 picks are here. Discover the year's top audiobooks, podcasts and originals in all your favorite genres, from memoirs and sci fi to mysteries and thrillers. Audible's curated list in every category is the best way to hear 2024's best.
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Kevin Greenlee
In audio entertainment, like a stunning new.
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Anya Kane
Full cast production of George Orwell's 1984.
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Kevin Greenlee
Heartfelt memoirs like Supreme Court Justice Ketanji.
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Anya Kane
Brown Jackson's lovely one. The year's best fiction, like the Women by Kristin Hannah and Percival Everett's brilliantly subversive James Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Go to audible.com imagine and discover all the years best waiting for you.
- [00:48]
Kevin Greenlee
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- [01:27]
Anya Kane
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Kevin Greenlee
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- [01:33]
Anya Kane
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- [01:36]
Kevin Greenlee
Journey today and continue to grow with our innovations. Credit Karma Evolve youe Finances Content Warning this episode contains discussion of murder so today on the Murder Sheet, we're going to be covering a case out of Colorado, out of Aurora, Colorado. And this is a case where I started covering it for a Cheat Sheet episode. But I got my hands on the probable cause affidavit for arrest in the case, and I found it very, very interesting. And I thought that perhaps we could just cover it in its own episode, kind of give it some room. So this is the murder of Angela Craig and the arrest of her husband, a dentist named James Craig, for that case and all the, frankly, wild things that have happened ever since. My name is Anya Kane. I'm a journalist.
- [02:32]
Anya Kane
And I'm Kevin Greenlee. I'm an attorney.
- [02:35]
Kevin Greenlee
And this is the Murder Sheet.
- [02:37]
Anya Kane
We're a true crime podcast focused on original reporting, interviews, and deep dives into murder cases. We're the Murder Sheet and this is.
- [02:46]
Kevin Greenlee
The murder of Angela Craig, the case against James Craig so far.
- [03:17]
Anya Kane
Okay.
- [03:37]
Kevin Greenlee
Okay. So to get started, my source for this was a copy of the probable cause affidavit, as I mentioned. We're going to be going through that and then we'll link to it and we'll also get into some recent, more recent developments in the case. But yeah, to give you some background, this centers around the Craigs, a married couple, James and Angela. They had six kids and they shared 23 years of marriage together, lived in Colorado, as I mentioned, and James Craig worked as a dentist. So by all accounts, you know, looking, looking stable, looking good. But unfortunately, this, this case really, it's, it's pretty horrifying when you dig into it. The, the probable cause affidavit that we're reading from and we'll be looking at was put together by a detective with the city of Aurora Police Department, a woman named Bobby Olsen. She's been there since 2013 and she's assigned to their Major Crime Homicide unit. So this starts on March 6, 2023. The Craigs do a workout together as a couple in the morning, and Craig made his wife a protein shake or some sort of pre workout shake, gives her some extra protein. She was feeling a bit sluggish at that point. Angela drinks it and after the workout she feels very faint and dizzy. And pretty quickly Craig brought her to the hospital. So she goes in there March 6, she's released, admitted again because her symptoms persist. March 9 and then release March 14 and again and again, the medical personnel just cannot figure this out. She's, she's throwing up, she's having high blood pressure, then she's having low blood pressure, she's very sluggish, her eyes are having trouble focusing. It's just, it's a bad situation. Everyone's alarmed, but nobody can really figure out a medical reason that she would be experiencing this. And one thing that struck me about this pca, Kevin, is that so much of it is compiled from statements from Craig's own colleagues, his business partner, who he ran this dental practice with, his office manager, other people who work there. They're really providing a lot of the information for this and I commend them for that because I think in situations if you know somebody, you might want to protect them. But in this case, it seems like all these people valued the truth and honesty over anything else.
- [06:21]
Anya Kane
What sort of information did they come forward with?
- [06:24]
Kevin Greenlee
Well, the. So. So Angela is checked into the Parker Adventist Hospital, March 6. That night, one of the, an office manager. And we're not naming any of these people. They're they're kind of, their names are often redacted, although there are a couple of slip ups in this pca and we're just going to kind of. Sometimes it's confusing because you can't really quite always tell, like, is it this worker or this worker? So some of them might be wrong. I'm just letting you know. But we're trying not to use people's names out of privacy. This office worker is working late at the office at the dental practice, notices Craig in an exam room. It's an exam room at this sort of dead end of the hallway. And he's, the lights are all off and he's on a computer. And she thinks that's really weird. Normally he would be on his computer in his own office. He has his own work computer. Why would he be in there doing that? She thinks it's very odd. And she leaves. Half an hour later she gets a text from him, also kind of odd. Says, hey, I'm expecting a personal package at work. Don't open it. She's like, okay. Doesn't think about it again, most likely until that comes back March 13th. And she finds it and it's opened. Turns out another employee who hadn't gotten the memo opened it on accident. That employee saw something really weird. Also talked to detectives, saw a, this thing had a biohazard sticker on it. It was a canister cylinder sort of labeled potassium cyanide. So the office manager was like, okay, seals it up, gives it to Craig. You know, he, he seemingly doesn't realize it's been opened. And it was just this like foil square, no markings. It was wrapped in brown construction paper, metal lid. They good look at it. And it was odd because there's not really any medical reason for him to have potassium cyanide. It's not something that they're going to really use in dentistry.
- [08:29]
Anya Kane
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- [08:39]
Kevin Greenlee
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- [08:56]
Anya Kane
So if you're over 21, treat yourself to 15% off with our exclusive code msheet@viahimp.com that's V I A H E M P dot com.
- [09:12]
Kevin Greenlee
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- [09:27]
Anya Kane
Give via a try Whether you want to get creative, get rest, get pleasure or get into micro dosing, these are affordable, excellent products. Plus you get a special discount as a Murder Sheet listener this holiday season.
- [09:41]
Kevin Greenlee
Gift yourself some peace of mind. If you're 21 and older, head to via hemp.com and use the code M sheet to receive 15% off. That's via hemp.com and use code msheet at checkout. Please support our show and tell them we sent you. This holiday season enhance your every day with via Tis the season for gift giving so support our wonderful new sponsor Quince and get yourself some affordable high quality gifts. Quince is a company that specializes in making the finer things in life. Cashmere Gold Italian handbags affordable on any budget.
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Anya Kane
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- [10:39]
Kevin Greenlee
We recently gave ourselves the gift of Quints. Kevin got their suede bomber jacket. It's so comfortable and warm and I think he looks really cute wearing it. I myself got a black Mongolian cashmere V neck sweater and a dark blue Mongolian cashmere turtleneck sweater. I'm really struck by the softness of the fabric. I also really like the way I look in these pieces, which for me is a big coup.
- [11:02]
Anya Kane
Quinn's also has 14 karat gold jewelry, Italian leather handbags and European linen sheet sets. Give the gift of luxury this holiday season without the luxury price tag. Go to quince.commsheet for 365 day returns plus get free shipping on your order. That's Q U I n c e.com msheet to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com msheet Today, the LGBTQ community is.
- [11:43]
Kevin Greenlee
At a crossroads with our loved ones and hard won rights increasingly under attack. For decades, the Human Rights Campaign has been at the forefront of the fight for equality in the face of discrimination and harassment. With the support of people like you, HRC fights for a world where lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender and queer people can live openly and thrive free from fear. If you're ready to support the fight for equality, to donate today, visit HRC.org give that's HRC.org giv so you know March 14th as I mentioned, Angela is discharged from the hospital. And one person close to them who was interviewed for the PCA noted that Angela said something to Craig like, quote, there are poisons they don't test for. And she went home on oxygen. But people felt she was almost kind of making an accusation at him when he. When she said that. So. March 15th, around 1108.
- [12:48]
Anya Kane
This sounds like something out of a thriller. And in fact, I recently reread the Scott Turow novel Innocent. And there was a big plot point in there involving what poisons are screened for and what poisons are not. And it's not surprising to me that a doctor, a dentist, would be fully aware of what would show up in a screening and what would not.
- [13:13]
Kevin Greenlee
Kevin, I'm so glad you said that because we are going to become aware of exactly how aware Craig was about this whole business that's in the evidence in the pca. And I think it will probably make you a little bit surprised.
- [13:28]
Anya Kane
Yeah. Anya is the one that researched this case, so I'm learning about it with all of you.
- [13:32]
Kevin Greenlee
Yeah. But I want you to ask questions and definitely, like, feel free to jump in and say, like, what, what you're thinking legally. And also just, I mean, this PCA is quite, quite a document. They've got a lot in here. But anyways, so unfortunately, Angela, who's again only 43, a mom of six kids that day, March 15, 11:08am, she goes into University Hospital. Her symptoms have persisted and gotten worse. She's got a severe headache at that point. She's very dizzy and her brother is the one who brings her in. So Craig comes in later, her husband. At about 2pm that day, she had a very significant seizure. She collapsed. She goes on life support. It's that bad. And the doctors are baffled. She's experiencing increased intracranial pressure, lack of oxygen, no pupil reaction. They can't figure out what's going on. They don't understand why this is happening. And to kind of, you know, back up, one of the people who's all over this PCA is Craig's colleague who is his business partner. Now, it turned out Craig had a kind of a history of failing at businesses. He had gone bankrupt and he was on the verge of bankruptcy. So this guy knew him for years, knew him since dental school, and went into business with him. They. He was essentially his business partner. He was taking on, I think he acquired Craig's practice. So he was kind of, I think, coming in, having that experience, perhaps doing better with the dental business and being able to run it better. So they're working together in that perspective. And that guy and his wife were actually quite good friends with the Craigs, friends with Angela, friends with James. But despite that, this couple, the business partner and his wife, when they went to the hospital, they wanted to be there for Angela. They told the nurse that they believed Angela was poisoned because of some of this stuff that was going on. You know, he had. I think this business partner had heard about the potassium cyanide. He's like, there's no reason that Craig would have that. And the nurse, as a. As a mandatory reporter, called police. So the next day, March 16, the business partner meets with Olson, Detective Olson. And they'd been worked together since August 2022. And he described Craig as a risk taker and one who was experiencing marriage problems with Angela. He said a different colleague said that there was a story out there that Craig had told Angela he wanted a divorce and that he would often become distant when he and Angela were fighting at home. So meanwhile, the office manager, who's, you know, this whole thing, Angela is sick, and she's, you know, they're getting these weird packages and. And Craig's being secretive about it. She also, you know, like, she's also concerned. She's looking up the symptoms of. Of, like, the potassium cyanide and things like that and starts thinking maybe Angela was poisoned as well. Then there's this phone call. This is just completely wild. You know, Craig calls, I believe, the business partner and says, like, did you say anything to the hospital staff? And the. The business partner is like, you know, well, yeah, I knew about the package. So they do a call. It's on the Bluetooth in this guy's car, so his wife can hear it too, I believe. And Craig's like, you know, that package was a ring for my wife, Angela. And the business partner's like, dude, I know it's not a ring. It was opened. Unbeknownst to you. It was opened. The employees saw it. We know it was potassium cyanide. And Craig's like, okay, it was, but Angela asked me to buy it. She couldn't because she lacked the credentials necessary. And then he says something like, I didn't think she would actually take it. It was supposed to be just a game of chicken. And the business partner. This is the best. The business partner responds, stop talking and get a lawyer.
- [17:40]
Anya Kane
Good advice.
- [17:41]
Kevin Greenlee
Yeah. So, you know, the. In addition to that, like, it's. It's sad. You know, you can read in the PCA the text between the business partner's wife and Craig, from like me about March 9th to March 15th. We're not going to read all of them, but she's often checking in again. Angela is her friend. She's concerned. And she has a background in nursing, a PhD, so she's, you know, highly aware of, you know, like, the kind of medical implications of some of what Angela is going through. And she's concerned, so she's checking in a lot, saying, hey, we're going to come visit you. So this is. It's more than just a business relationship. It's a personal relationship. And she's just getting updates from Craig and. And whatnot. So this is something, then, that Craig, I believe, sends his business partner. You know, I was wondering if this is after. I believe so. Unfortunately, as a result of this, Angela, on March 18, was pronounced brain dead at 4:29. So she did not make it. And the day prior, get this, the day prior, it turned out that, you know, well, I should say this. Her family members had been begging him, like, if she dies, please do an autopsy. And he was saying no. And they would be like, but if there's something genetic here, you need to know that for her kids, for your kids, because.
- [19:18]
Anya Kane
Right, that makes sense.
- [19:18]
Kevin Greenlee
You know, like, figure out what happened. And he's.
- [19:21]
Anya Kane
There are reasons to do autopsies that have nothing to do with a potential crime.
- [19:25]
Kevin Greenlee
Yeah. If there's no crime here, which maybe that's the assumption. If you don't, you know, like, if there's no crime, you need to figure that out. Because if there's something that happened genetically with Angela, her kids could face that, and they need to be aware of that. And he's just saying, no. If they couldn't figure it out when she was alive, I'm not gonna have them prod around her when she's dead. That's a weird answer. In my opinion, you would think as a father, you'd want to protect your kids. That means having information. So bizarre. But let's go and. And look at the text that James sent. This is on page seven. Kevin. Yes, that one. I want you to read that if that's okay. You're going to be James Craig in this. And. And this is something he sent his business partner. That is a very odd, in my opinion, text after his wife was dead.
- [20:16]
Anya Kane
Good morning. Thank you for taking my patient load today. I want to make an urgent plea to you. If we were ever friends, please do this favor for me. Please don't talk to anyone about what we talked about last night, including any law enforcement officers. You are under no obligation to answer their questions unless you are served a subpoena. And you would do more damage than good to my family by continuing to insert yourself into this. Angela is gone and I am devastated. There is nothing that can bring her back and I want desperately to tell you all of the details so that you can better understand what's going on behind the scenes with her. There is so, so much that you don't know that I wish you did. If you knew everything, this would make so much sense to you. But there's no use in telling you right now. You and I have a history of you and the other partners and Jackiel talking about me behind my back and deciding what you think is best. And then you're always the fall guy that has to pull the trigger or tell me what you've all decided about me. In fact, yesterday you did not even come to me. I had to seek you out. You have never given me the advantage of talking with you first. You just decide and then act and hope I'll pick up all the pieces later. This is a pattern in our business dealings and now has become a factor in our personal dealings. Let me paint a picture for you of what this has done. Yesterday I had to tell my kids their mom was not going to wake up and they were there to say their final goodbyes. This was at 6:45pm the hospital said we could bring the kids up to say goodbye at that time, but because of the investigation you opened by your incomplete information, the hospital made those poor, grieving, hysterical kids wait until after 10 o'clock to see their mom. After an hour or so of saying goodbye to her, we went home just before midnight, only to have our house sealed against our entry by the police. Instead of getting to go home and find comfort, they were met with flashing lights and cold, unfeeling cops. And the kids, scared and confused, had to go sleep at the home of a ward member. Family is starting to come into town today and I have to tell them they can't come to my house and try to explain why I have to hire a homicide attorney to make sure I don't end up being painted in the light that, you know, some hungry DA is anxious to paint me in because I am most likely going to be charged, even though that is absolutely not what happened. I understand why you did what you did. I do. I get it. But if you had come to me personally, man to man, instead of talking to everyone else about what you thought you knew, I might have let you in on Some details that would have made you less likely to cause this horrible storm. Man, if you had only put me higher on your list of priorities instead of putting everyone else's opinions and gossip ahead of me. For that, I am very, very mad at you. I have talked to you about this multiple times, but you don't seem to care. And now what you thought was responsible has become reckless and so, so destructive. And so I'm asking if there was ever any love in your heart for me. Please don't make this any worse by talking to any officers or anyone else about this. Unless you are legally forced to and whoever else on the team you think is going to be questioned, I would ask that you privately ask them to honor this request, too. Also, please do not respond to this text message until I text you again.
- [24:05]
Kevin Greenlee
Okay, so I'll tell you my impressions about that, and then I would be really curious about yours, especially as an attorney, Kevin, because, like, this guy is basically saying, don't cooperate with anybody.
- [24:18]
Anya Kane
Yes.
- [24:19]
Kevin Greenlee
One thing that strikes me is the level of manipulation in this.
- [24:22]
Anya Kane
Yeah, that's very striking.
- [24:23]
Kevin Greenlee
Very striking. That's kind of just hits you over the head. He's. He's using his children with Angela as a. As a tool, using his own purported grief as a tool of, like, you did this to me. There's a. There's a real ship. Like, if you didn't know anything about the situation, you would think that the business partner had caused some awful situation. What actually sparked this crisis is the fact that Angela Craig died suddenly, was. Was murdered, was poisoned. But, you know, you would think that the central issue here was that, you know, this guy talked to police or said something to a nurse, rather. So I'm struck by the manipulativeness. I'm struck by the kind of very nakedly manipulative tactics. It's not subtle at all. I'm struck by the entitlement. A lot of this is complaining that the business partner, like, talks about him behind his back or has done so in the past. You know, when you kind of learn about Craig's personality, he's a risk taker. He's made bad business decisions in the past. You can kind of understand perhaps why, you know, people might talk about him at work or be concerned or kind of, you know, maybe he doesn't have the best judgment or impulse control or whatnot. But, you know, it's just. It's very entitled. It's very manipulative. What are your thoughts on this?
- [25:44]
Anya Kane
Yeah, I think my thoughts largely echo yours. It's Very manipulative. He's using his kids as a lever to try to control this person's behavior. He is trying to insinuate this person has wronged him in the past and he's continuing to do so and blaming all the problems he must have had in the business to this person's dirty dealings. It's. It's very, very manipulative and not terribly convincing.
- [26:12]
Kevin Greenlee
Also, it's kind of bizarre because, okay, if my business partner is already, like, thinking I might have poisoned my wife and is. Is. Is talking to people about that, including nurses and detectives, do I really think at that point they're going to stop, or do I think, like, the Rubicon has been crossed there? So it's kind of stupid, I think, to reach out and, like, I'm sorry. Like, it's just kind of like, it's dumb to put this in writing because I would say, all right, my business partner is not going to back me up on this. I am writing him off. No contact. Like, does he. He almost seems so convinced by his. I think you'd have to be a bit arrogant or convinced by your persuasive powers to even send something like this, because does he think, like, the guy's gonna be like, oh, man, I really did Jim wrong. Wow. Boy, do I feel bad. I'm gonna. I'm gonna, like, rally together my dental staff and tell them not to cooperate with the cops now. Like. Like, you know what I mean? Because I feel so guilty about what I put this beautiful, good man through, and I have so much love in my heart for him. Like. Like. Or, like, would it be more, like, reasonable to assume that somebody who thinks you killed your wife is going to probably prioritize that over whatever their past feelings for you are?
- [27:23]
Anya Kane
That's an excellent point. So what happened next?
- [27:26]
Kevin Greenlee
Oh, God, it's awful. I mean, I want to. We're going to go into more texts later between Angela and James because I really think they highlight some interesting things, but. So before Angela herself passed away, as you can imagine, things were already rolling. Sydney Romero, a Child Protective Services caseworker, came to talk to the family on March 16. She met with the Craigs, the children, individually, and she was very concerned with what she heard James Craig say. In particular. He claimed Angela had been suicidal for a while and that he had had to revive her over different months. And this started after he asked for her for a divorce in December 2022, she said. He said she was intentionally overdosing on opioids, other substances. Weirdly, despite the fact that these very dramatic suicide attempts were going on. He never sought professional counseling for her or any sort of medical intervention, but he, he noted that he felt that her toxicology report would probably test positive for substances, although what exact substances, he didn't know. Meanwhile, Angela's children said nothing about depression, suicide attempts, anything like that. So Romero felt this was a cover story he was trying to establish. Like, hey, if there's anything in that toxicology report, don't worry about it. She did it to herself. So she called the detectives about that. And that day also, three search warrant applications and affidavits were sent to the 18th Judicial District Court. One was for the Craig home, another was for the Summer Brook dental office, and another was for another address where I believe they were staying potentially. And that day, detectives went to talk to James Craig, and he did not want to speak to them, but they did obtain his cell phone, Angela's cell phone, his wallet, laptop with passcodes and whatnot, and the. And access to the residents. So they got all that through search warrants at the residence. They found protein powders, workout style shakers, a computer tablet, Ziploc bags with white powdery substances, and a water bottle. And the surveillance device at the house had a missing hard drive. So that day, later on, detectives went to the Summer Brook dental office. It was closed that day. They seized hard drives, laptops, a small hand vacuum with a white powdery substance in it. And also they got Craig's United States Drug Enforcement registration number. So for healthcare providers who can write prescriptions, they all have a DEA number to make sure, you know, everything's on the up and up. They also, now that the detectives had all of these devices, they were able to look at the text between James and Angela, this couple, and what they saw was pretty normal. You know, like many married couples with children do, they're texting about their kids activities, how their day's going. Sort of heartbreakingly. Angela Craig had James listed in her phone as the boy. And, you know, they, they kind of just were texting. So I think maybe you and I can go and I'll tell you, we're not going to read all of these, but we can kind of read some of them. I think they give some indication of the nature of their relationship and also how much Angela seemed to trust her husband. Even though we're going to learn later, there was some stuff that perhaps in their history that was problematic.
- [30:52]
Anya Kane
So where do you want to start?
- [30:54]
Kevin Greenlee
Let's read this one, because I think it kind of. Let's read this first one first, and then we can kind of go on from there. But this one was pulled out in the PCA because I believe it highlights something about, you know, their relationship. So cool. So I'm going to be Angela, and you're going to be James.
- [31:11]
Anya Kane
Correct.
- [31:13]
Kevin Greenlee
Your healing and happiness. This marriage is more important than my day. You are more important than my day.
- [31:19]
Anya Kane
Thank you. I know you're getting ready to go out and spend some time with Tony, and I'd like to ask that you keep last night's conversation details just between you and I. I trust Tony, but it was hard for me to even tell you that stuff. I'm definitely not ready for anyone else to hear it.
- [31:36]
Kevin Greenlee
Of course, I wasn't planning to talk about any of it. I haven't actually talked to Tony about any of the last few months since that initial conversation.
- [31:42]
Anya Kane
I'm sorry. I know she's kind of your outlet and your strength and support and somebody who you could always go to. To vent. I hate taking away even a part of that since I know this is really, really hard for you.
- [31:55]
Kevin Greenlee
Okay, so this is interesting.
- [31:56]
Anya Kane
Unquote.
- [31:57]
Kevin Greenlee
Yeah, unquote. So this is interesting again.
- [32:01]
Anya Kane
He's telling her not to tell somebody something or he's telling somebody not to tell other people something.
- [32:06]
Kevin Greenlee
I mean, in any situation, that's a. That's a kind of a red flag. I mean, there's certain things, like, you know, I think, like, couples expect, like, hey, don't put me on blast. All your friends. That's probably. That's probably not good. Not. Not a good sign for our relationship. But I don't recall ever asking you, hey, don't tell anyone that I'm doing that. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know. It's. It's. I guess like, in certain contexts it would be somewhat normal. But, yeah, it's. It's definitely troubling. So then we'll read, like, I think more of their text messages. One thing, with these upcoming ones, I think some of them mention their kids, and I don't want to read any names. So I guess if there's any names, we could just maybe read the first initial or something. How's that sound? Okay, so this goes back to 6:59am on March 6th. Let's. Let's just read these first four panels that were included in the PCA for now. Okay, so you're the gray text from James, the blue text from Angela.
- [33:10]
Anya Kane
Thank you so much for making my drink this morning. I just love you. I hope you have A great day and I'm so glad you're back in town.
- [33:18]
Kevin Greenlee
You're welcome, baby. I love you too. I think my body is not letting the caffeine this morning either. My stomach feels fine, but my head feels funny and dizzy. Very strange.
- [33:28]
Anya Kane
It's been a week since caffeine for you. Maybe your body is saying, no thank you. I did a full scoop of caffeine and a big full scoop of the B vitamins. Is that how much you normally take? I'm super shaky.
- [33:41]
Kevin Greenlee
Oh no. I do a small scoop of the B vitamin mix. It feels really weird.
- [33:47]
Anya Kane
Oops, sorry, baby.
- [33:50]
Kevin Greenlee
That's okay. It'll wear off. I'm dizzy and my eyes don't want to focus. But I can get the stuff done that I need to this morning.
- [33:55]
Anya Kane
Maybe you should lie down.
- [33:57]
Kevin Greenlee
I'm laying on my face on the mat in my room.
- [33:59]
Anya Kane
You have a bed.
- [34:00]
Kevin Greenlee
You know I'm stinky. Just seems excessive for a little extra supplement.
- [34:05]
Anya Kane
Pearl is flying in this morning to see me. I totally forgot. I think she's flying out today though.
- [34:11]
Kevin Greenlee
I don't feel right in my head.
- [34:13]
Anya Kane
Do I need to come home?
- [34:15]
Kevin Greenlee
No, this is just weird. I'm dizzy in my head and my eyes are working slowly and my body is responding slowly.
- [34:23]
Anya Kane
That sounds really wrong. I'm going to come home. I don't like this.
- [34:27]
Kevin Greenlee
You can't. You need to work. I'll throw on some clothes and sit with the girls and see if it goes away.
- [34:33]
Anya Kane
Okay. I'm probably I were acting, but I don't like that. I can cancel patients for the morning or move some to to the other doctor if needed. So if you change your mind, let me know. Do we have a blood pressure cuff? You should try that and see if your BP is low or something. Do you get lightheaded when you stand up?
- [34:53]
Kevin Greenlee
It feels more like I feel when I take heavy meds and everything adjusts and moves slowly. Like I'm moving in thick gel. My eyes are struggling to stay focused.
- [35:02]
Anya Kane
Did you take bp?
- [35:04]
Kevin Greenlee
I don't know where one is.
- [35:05]
Anya Kane
Okay, if you do end up wanting me to come home, I'll bring one. I have a bottle of magnesium in my second drawer down on the left side of my sink. Take one of those. Have you eaten anything?
- [35:16]
Kevin Greenlee
I had my protein shake and magnesium makes me weird. This is not hungry.
- [35:20]
Anya Kane
Are you nauseous?
- [35:22]
Kevin Greenlee
No. I feel drugged.
- [35:25]
Anya Kane
Given our history, I know that must be triggering. Just for the record, I did not drug you. I'm super worried though. You really looked pale before I left. Like in your lips, even.
- [35:36]
Kevin Greenlee
Let's take a pause here for a second. So, to me, most of the text back and forth before that last exchange about drugging sounded pretty nice and normal, right? I mean, like, he's expressing care for her, they're communicating about how she's feeling. It's sort of the thing that you would almost expect to see. And then there's that bizarre exchange about drugging. What did you make of that?
- [36:01]
Anya Kane
Has he drugged her in the past? He has a vague reference there to their history, yes.
- [36:06]
Kevin Greenlee
So what was learned later by detectives is that there was an incident five or six years ago where Craig drugged his wife, Angela. He claimed to her at the time that he did this so he could go in the bathroom and give himself a lethal injection of some kind of drug to commit suicide. He wanted her drugged so she wouldn't be able to come in and save him. And that is what that is referring to. Obviously a very troubling incident, but one where it's just fascinating to me somebody using therapy speak in this situation like, oh, is this triggering for you? You know, like that kind of thing. But obviously. Obviously pretty concerning. So from there, they keep talking. He talks about how he's looking up her symptoms and he's really worried about her possibly having a stroke. He comes home and they kind of talk about, you know, things from there. So the next day, I believe. Let me look at when she was initially in the hospital. I think she. She was. So she was admitted and then released pretty quickly, but then she ended up going back March 9th. So this is from March 7th, and it just made me really sad reading this. So let's go to the one that's kind of labeled March 7th. It's on, I believe, page 11. Perfect. All right, so you're gray and I'm blue.
- [37:46]
Anya Kane
Quote, I love you. It was so nice hanging out with you and just watching a show and snuggling. I'm sorry you still aren't feeling well that you feel like I'm disappointed about that. I'm not disappointed at all. Just feeling empathy for how hard that must be for you. Hopefully things can improve and get better. I'm also so grateful that the last couple of days have allowed me to have more flexibility in my schedule. God really does know what he's doing. Are you feeling anything particular for dinner tonight or this week?
- [38:16]
Kevin Greenlee
I'm having a hard time feeling okay being sick, and an even harder time knowing whether that's me or you. I could tell you were worried yesterday, but I guess I Just think they sent us home and said nothing was wrong, and you think I should be fine. I realize I could be reliving the past. It's just hard. And frankly, all of this is really scary. And I don't feel like we've addressed that at all. But I don't even remember most of yesterday, so maybe we did address it. I'm a crazy person. I'm not feeling anything particular about food right now. T's sending dinner tonight. So then they talk about they're going to get pranara. So this is. This is sad to me because, I don't know, it's like he's, like, being so nice, like, oh, we're snuggling and all this stuff. And she's like. You kind of get the sense that she's sensing something's very wrong, and it's also reminding her of this past incident, but she's not. She's so out of it. She's not even sure if they had talked about any of that again. It's, like, very manipulative and. And she's kind of. You want to trust somebody you love. And he's saying all these nice things, but obviously he's saying the right things. Yes. Let's do. Let's do the next three panels here. This is from. Yeah, this is, you know, kind of. She's. She's admitted to the hospital on the 9th, I believe. And they kind of go from there where she's kind of being admitted and then being released and kind of back and forth. That one.
- [39:55]
Anya Kane
It just occurred to me that I have not brought you any flowers while you're in the hospital. I'm so sorry. I didn't know how that escaped my notice. I think it's because I keep expecting them to let you go at any moment. If I'd known you were going to be here this long, I probably would have done a better job with that.
- [40:10]
Kevin Greenlee
It's okay. I don't need flowers. Clean underwear. Blue and gray pajama pants. Pink shaver. Pink or teal T shirt. Pilates socks. Plastic bag for dirty clothes.
- [40:19]
Anya Kane
Were you wanting me to go home and gather those things and bring them right back, or is it okay to bring them the next time I come down?
- [40:26]
Kevin Greenlee
I like them as soon as possible. I feel kind of gross.
- [40:29]
Anya Kane
Okay, I'll drop the kids off at home and grab that stuff and bring it right back. Where would I find the blue and gray pajama pants and the pink or teal T shirt?
- [40:37]
Kevin Greenlee
The girls. Know what I mean. In case you don't. Pajama pants on the shelf in my closet. T shirts hanging up. My duffel should be in there too. Also travel size soap.
- [40:45]
Anya Kane
Noted.
- [40:46]
Kevin Greenlee
BP 114, 81. I have low grade fever.
- [40:51]
Anya Kane
Man, your blood pressure is all over the board. 145 over 45 followed by 114 over 81. Someone needs to tell your brain to get it together.
- [41:00]
Kevin Greenlee
I've been saying that forever. Okay, I'm adding to the list. Clean underwear, blue and gray pajama pants, pink shaver, pink or teal. T shirt, Pilates socks. Plastic bag for dirty clothes. Body soap, conditioner, my hair towel. My pulse ox doesn't want to work.
- [41:17]
Anya Kane
Maybe you don't have any pulse.
- [41:19]
Kevin Greenlee
Maybe I'm a vampire. They keep taking all of my blood. Okay, I'm trying a sandwich. Wish me luck.
- [41:25]
Anya Kane
Coming up. Me. That is hopefully not the sandwich.
- [41:28]
Kevin Greenlee
Thank you, baby. Yeah, it's, it's. I don't know, it's just like, like just normal kind of coupley banter a little bit. He seems like a very jokey person. Is that fair to say? Kind of get that say, you know, so it's like, I don't know, like, like.
- [41:47]
Anya Kane
And of course the subtext of all of this is he knows something that she doesn't know, which is that he's in the process of slowly killing her.
- [41:57]
Kevin Greenlee
She talks about like the cardiologist thinks she's a puzzle. And he's like, oh, I'm so shocked and whatnot. In his message to the business partner's wife, he even said something like, oh, if it wasn't my wife going through all this, I would find it to be a very fascinating medical puzzle. Things like that. He talks about he's going to get her all this stuff. He's going to bring her a laptop so she can watch an episode of New Girl. Like just kind of very accommodating and thoughtful and you know, like he says, he says like, good night, my love. At one point he says, quote, and just as the song says, I hope you know that you're enough for me. Indeed, more than enough. She says, thank you for spending as much time here as you do. It hasn't been fun. I want to go home. But it really hasn't been that bad either. I love you and I'll see you tomorrow. He's coming on very thick, I guess. Like, am I a SAP? Or like I like. Do you find any of his statements like off puttingly over the top? Or do you think that could, you know, just in a different context read as just sincere declarations of love. Because I feel like knowing what we.
- [42:59]
Anya Kane
Do now, it's very creepy and disturbing. But I could imagine being in that situation she would want to believe him.
- [43:08]
Kevin Greenlee
Although it seems like she made statements there at some point. She didn't. But yeah. So that I think we kind of got through a lot of the texts that were interesting. I think. Let's go what to what the detectives found when it came to his Internet history because you mentioned before a medical professional might understand poison a bit better. We're going to find out just how well that was. So they found on his laptops that he was logged in under dinosaur jim me.com and a new email jim and waffles gmail.com and they look at his Amazon history. He's logged into Amazon on one of those accounts and they find an order from 2-27-2023 and it was delivered to his house in Aurora. Left in the mailbox March 4th. And it was arsenic metal 99.9 999 crystalline metalloid, 10 grams for element collection. It was $13. And it also in the description of the item it said, quote, arsenic is often believed to be used for murder as it has been in many crime novels. And you know, the real danger though is in swallowing it, which could prove fatal. Forget one size fits all diets. With Noom, you get a personalized weight loss plan that's tailored to your lifestyle. Have cravings food fomo. Noom can help you lose weight while still enjoying your favorite foods. Noom's users love the flexible approach blending psychology and biology to help you lose weight in a way that's sustainable for you. Plus, you can rest assured Noom's approach is grounded in science. They've published more than 30 peer reviewed scientific articles describing their methods and effectiveness. Stay focused on what's important to you with noom's psychology and biology based approach. Sign up for your trial today@noom.com Bombas makes the most comfortable socks, underwear and T shirts.
- [45:01]
Anya Kane
Warning, bombas are so absurdly comfortable you may throw out all your other clothes.
- [45:05]
Kevin Greenlee
Sorry, do we legally have to say that?
- [45:07]
Anya Kane
No, this is just how I talk.
- [45:09]
Kevin Greenlee
And I really love my bombas. They do feel that good. And they do good too.
- [45:12]
Anya Kane
One item purchased equals one item donated.
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Kevin Greenlee
To feel good and do good, go to bombas.com wondry and use code wondry for 20% off your first purchase.
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Anya Kane
That's B O M B A S.com.
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Kevin Greenlee
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Anya Kane
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Kevin Greenlee
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Anya Kane
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Kevin Greenlee
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Anya Kane
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Kevin Greenlee
And trade in service on go 5G next and credit required.
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Anya Kane
Contact us before canceling entire account to.
- [45:54]
Kevin Greenlee
Continue bill credits or credit stop and balance and required finance agreement is due so that day. Here are some of his searches Pure Arsenic where can I buy Arsenic? How to Purchase Arsenic Metal Is Arsenic Disulfide Poisonous? Where to put Purchase Pure Arsenic Denver, Colorado Arsenic Biarsenic Aurora, Colorado how many grams of pure arsenic will kill a human? Chemical Suppliers Denver, Colorado Is arsenic a metal? Arsenic Suppliers USA 5 most dangerous chemicals on Earth Is Arsenic detectable in autopsy? Top five Undetectable Poisons that Show no Sign of Foul Play how to make poison top 10 deadliest plants they Can Kill you How to Make Poison Poison the Recipes Project the Deadliest toxins on Earth 9 Horrible Poisons by Botulism Toxin how to Make Poison from Oleander Management of Acute Yellow Oleander Poisoning six Deadly Undetectable Poisons how to Detect Them on Nerdfighter Wiki by Oleander Jim Waffles I guess he went back to his Jim Waffles account. So yeah, that's obviously all very concerning given what happened, right?
- [47:03]
Anya Kane
That's very concerning.
- [47:05]
Kevin Greenlee
As a lawyer, like where do you like, I mean, like you understand the law. Like people look up weird stuff, right? Is that fair to say?
- [47:13]
Anya Kane
That's fair to say, certainly. Considering what we do. If people look at our search history.
- [47:18]
Kevin Greenlee
It could be very probably like murder, murder, murder. You know, it would be really creepy like this old murder case or like, you know, like how does strangling somebody work? Like, I would not want anyone to see my for our jobs. But also, you know, I'm just kind of a morbid person. So I I mean like I don't really ever put too much in a search history because I think all of us, you know, if you're listening, you like true crime, you're probably in the same boat as us. But I think there's a difference between just being a kind of a general interest person and when your search history is almost like how to do this thing that then seemingly happened, that's where it enters the realm of more concerning is that kind of where you stand?
- [47:58]
Anya Kane
Yeah, especially if it's in the context of having someone in your life who is poisoned as you are looking this stuff up.
- [48:05]
Kevin Greenlee
Like if he was looking up knife wounds, that wouldn't really, you know, that that's not what happened. Maybe it would be a little bit concerning, but it's more of something where she was, you know, it's going to come out that she was poisoned. And he's looking up all this. So March 9, 2023, he emails a company called Midland Scientific and he goes back and forth with an employee there. He claimed to them that he was a surgeon performing craniofacial reconstruction and wanted to do an article for the National Institutes of Health. Gave his license number and said that he wanted to buy some of. I think this is where the potassium cyanide came in and goes back and forth. At one point, you know, they say, okay, it's going to be delivered Saturday, March 11. Then he waits all day. This is what he says, literally. So, quote, wow, it's 7:30 at night and I've been waiting in my office all day for the shipment. Looks like it didn't come. I wish they would have just told me they weren't going to be able to get it to me overnight. Please send me the tracking information when you get it, Dr. Craig, end quote. So he's like sitting at his office all night on that Saturday trying to get this thing and is very annoyed when they respond. They said it shipped out, but it was delayed. Sorry, we really sorry. And he responds, quote, it's not your fault. I was just feeling frustrated and needed somebody to vent to. Looks like it's out for delivery this morning, so hopefully we'll see the package soon. Thanks for your help. End quote. So I guess he was ultimately more chill about it, but he got it on March 13th. At this point, Angela's already been sick since March 6th, but it's like he wanted more. But that's not all. Detectives found, perhaps unsurprisingly, he ended up, looks like from the emails, was having some sort of affair with some with a woman who was also in the, in the dental business. And there were a bunch of sexually explicit conversations in these emails. There were also travel plans. So somebody traveled. This woman traveled from Austin, Texas to Denver, Colorado, March 8th to 10th to see him seemingly. And she was visiting him while his wife was sick in the hospital. So this is her email to him on March 16th. Quote hi, honey, I am so sorry for what has transpired this week in your world. I am so. I'm sorry that I'm not a part of your world to be more help to you. And instead I'm pulling you away. This is so hard. I want to be and do whatever I can to support and encourage you. And I don't want to add to what has become an incredibly difficult time. I can't imagine what it is doing to you to walk your kids through this. I do want to give you any comfort I can, but I do not feel it is right for me to mix in with all of those gathering to mourn Angela either. And I do not want to meet your family as a friend and try to conceal what I feel for you. I'm praying for you and seeking God's wisdom for this. I love you. And then she signs it. I'm not going to name her.
- [50:58]
Anya Kane
Right.
- [51:01]
Kevin Greenlee
So he's having an affair, and she's feeling uncomfortable about the secrecy at this time. So the detectives ended up speaking to someone very close to Angela, and she gave some more details. She told them about the drugging story. She told them that Craig apparently had a history of having multiple affairs with multiple women, and he claimed to be addicted to pornography since he was a teenager. They had the story about the, you know, attempted suicide and that Angela apparently had wanted to leave him a number of times over the past 16 years. Angela also would say things like, craig ran the dental office into the ground, and that he went to Las Vegas and gambled away $2,000. But every time he messed up, he would always convince her to stick around. So the detectives kind of were looking at different, you know, possible causes of death, and they found that, you know, her. Her symptoms definitely matched poisoning, and that's what. That's what ended up happening. So he was arrested and he's been charged with Angela's murder. But would you believe it, Kevin, if I told you that things have gotten even more insane recently?
- [52:13]
Anya Kane
What's going on?
- [52:14]
Kevin Greenlee
Audience so the 18th Judicial District Attorney's office hit him with two new charges. So one was first degree solicitation to commit perjury. The other one was first degree solicitation to commit murder. So what does that mean? What does solicitation mean in this context?
- [52:33]
Anya Kane
Solicitation is when essentially it's when you're offering someone some sort of inducement, I guess, usually money in order to perform an act. In these cases, it would be criminal acts.
- [52:48]
Kevin Greenlee
Well, there was some sign that maybe there was trouble ahead. So the day the jury selection for his trial was supposed to begin, November 21st. November 21st, at that time, his attorney was named a man named Harvey Steinberg. He was a. Different attorneys had withdrawn. So Steinberg is ready to go jury selection that day, Steinberg asked to withdraw. How unusual is that for that to happen as of.
- [53:20]
Anya Kane
On the day of the trial? Well, Anya, that's frowned upon because it's very rare. And also take into consideration that at the late. That late day, the day of the trial, the prosecutor has prepared for the trial, has all their witnesses ready for the trial, the judge has cleared their calendar for the trial. So it's frowned on for a number of reasons, I would imagine.
- [53:47]
Kevin Greenlee
But I think Steinberg had a point here. So these are the reasons he cited under the trial rules in Colorado of why he withdrew. One, quote, the client persists, and this isn't his. Quote, these are the rules that he was citing. So, quote, the client persists in a course of action involving the lawyer's services that the lawyer reasonably believes is criminal or fraudulent, end quote. The client insists upon taking action that the lawyer considers repugnant or with which the lawyer has a fundamental disagreement, end quote. What do you think about those rules?
- [54:19]
Anya Kane
Do we know what those actions were?
- [54:21]
Kevin Greenlee
Well, the next day, he was hit with a first degree solicitation to commit murder. So would that be. Could that be connected to that?
- [54:31]
Anya Kane
It could be.
- [54:31]
Kevin Greenlee
So, like, if. If the lawyer finds out, if the prosecutor goes to the defense attorney and says, hey, your. Your guy is trying to kill people from jail, can the defense lawyer be like, bye?
- [54:48]
Anya Kane
There's so many different rules. Are you asking if the defense attorney had foreknowledge of this?
- [54:55]
Kevin Greenlee
No, no, no, I don't. I mean, I. There's no. There's no evidence. I mean, there's not really any real clear details about what's going on here. But I want to stress there's no indication that Harvey Steinberg had anything to do with any of that. I imagine he did not. I strongly imagine he did not. I'm more of asking just from. As a layperson. I don't know if. If someone's a lawyer and they find out that their client is doing other crimes in prison, could that meet those rules where they can say, I don't want to be involved in this anymore? Yeah, that's what I think probably happened. Not that he had foreknowledge, just that, you know, I mean, if he. That would be around the time where they're preparing to bring new charges. If there's some conversation, he's like, he did what you might not want to be a part of that anymore.
- [55:37]
Anya Kane
So where do things stand now?
- [55:39]
Kevin Greenlee
Well, there's been some indications of who he was trying to kill. This is. And also I should note there's actually gonna be a shake up on the prosecutor side most likely too. So the 18th Judicial District Attorney was named John Kellner. He's gonna be replaced by a new attorney who won the election, Amy Patton. So there might be some shake up there too. Obviously everything's been delayed. Oh, and just in case you were wondering, this was a poisoning. Arapahoe county coroner Kelly Learning testified that Angela Craig had 400 times the amount of. I'm going to say this wrong. I'm sorry, everybody, but tetrahydralazine in her body, that's. That's a chemical in visine drops. So she had cyanide and that in her body. So at this point in the pre trial hearings, before all this imploded, the defense had been saying, well, nobody can prove that he put the poison in the drink. Even though there's a lot of circumstantial evidence around this, they don't have him doing literally that. But anyways, it seems like the person that Craig was trying to have murdered is one of the detectives in the case. What do you make of that?
- [57:03]
Anya Kane
Is, Is this a revenge thing or is he trying to stop this person from offering testimony, or do we have an indication?
- [57:10]
Kevin Greenlee
Not clear whatsoever. There's really. We don't even know what detective this is. We know that again, Bobby Olsen is the affiant, but there's a number of other detectives who participated in this case. My guess is it's Olson because she was kind of instrumental in this whole thing. But it, there's not any sort of clarity on that at this point. But. Yeah, but now, now, now he's being accused of plying to more murder. One of the Aurora detectives. And you know, there was a. He basically was what. What's being reported at this point is that he goes to another inmate and says, I want you to kill somebody for me. And it's one of the detectives. Is that a good idea for defendants to do that?
- [58:06]
Anya Kane
No, it's not.
- [58:08]
Kevin Greenlee
I mean, obviously it's not right to do. But it's also really stupid, obviously.
- [58:12]
Anya Kane
Yeah, you can't get away with it. It's stupid. And judges and prosecutors tend to take attempted murders of police officers very, very seriously, as they should.
- [58:25]
Kevin Greenlee
And also it's like the person's doing their job. I mean, maybe it was a revenge thing. Maybe there was some animosity on his part for this person. But at the same time, it's, it's, it's a matter of like, that's not going to make the case go away no matter what. So from a practical standpoint, it's also ridiculous. Anyways, I just thought this was an interesting one. Just there was so much weirdness and all these text messages. I kind of just wanted to go through it and lay it all out. And I think it's a pretty impressive pca. There's a lot of evidence in there. There's a lot of stuff to unpack. And now it seems like Craig may be one of those defendants. I mean, listen, he's innocent until proven guilty, but he's one of those defendants that seems to be potentially adding more and more and more to his problems because, you know, there's a lot you can do in jail that would just really wreck your defense attorney's ability to defend you. And certainly potentially plotting to murder a detective is one of those things. But I guess we'll see what happens next.
- [59:31]
Anya Kane
We'll keep an eye on it.
- [59:32]
Kevin Greenlee
Absolutely. Well, thanks so much, everyone for listening.
- [59:35]
Anya Kane
Thanks so much for listening to the Murder Sheet. If you have a tip concerning one of the cases we cover, please email us@murdersheetmail.com if you have actionable information about an unsolved crime, please report it to the appropriate authorities.
- [59:56]
Kevin Greenlee
If you're interested in joining our Patreon, that's available at wwpatreon.com murdersheet if you want to tip us a bit of money for records requests, you can do so at www. Buymeacoffee.com murdersheet we very much appreciate any support.
- [60:19]
Anya Kane
Special thanks to Kevin Tyler Greenlee, who composed the music for the Murder Sheet and who you can find on the web@kevintg.com if you're looking to talk with.
- [60:31]
Kevin Greenlee
Other listeners about a case we've covered, you can join the Murder Sheet discussion group on Facebook. We mostly focus our time on research and reporting, so we're not on social media much. We do try to check our email account, but we ask for patience as we often receive a lot of messages. Thanks again for listening. So this holiday season, we want to sincerely thank our latest sponsor, Quince. This is a wonderful company that's all about making the finer things in life really accessible for everybody. That means Italian leather handbags. That means gold jewelry and items, but it especially means their wonderful line of Mongolian cashmere products. So sweaters, things like that.
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Anya Kane
And not just, as you so astutely noted, not just that there are Other things they offer. Like, you know, for many years, I thought, well, wouldn't it be fun to dress like Colonel Hogan from Hogan's Heroes? He always wears this bomber jacket. But you go, you go to these stores, you go to these online marketplaces, and these bomber jackets, ridiculously high price because everybody wants to look like Colonel Hogan. But Quince offers that at an affordable price.
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Kevin Greenlee
Yeah. And they even threw in some quirky side characters to help you dig holes in the yard, which has, frankly, been pretty inconvenient for, for our neighbors and. And me. But I'm glad you're having a good time. So that was your goal. And I'm curious because we both got to select some Quint products to, to purchase. And your goal was.
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Anya Kane
And you're not. I'm not saying that if you buy this great jacket, you're going to look like a character from a TV show that maybe you haven't even watched. You're just going to look good because he was a charming character.
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Kevin Greenlee
He was a charming character, and he had a good fashion sense. So, I mean, I think you. I'm just fascinated by the way your mind works, I guess. But. But no, I, I think you look really cute in that bomber jacket. I really like it on you. I was, I was proud of you for getting it because I think, you know, you kind of. You have your kind of Kevin uniform, and this is a bit different, but I think it was so nice and it's such a good price that you kind of were like, I can't, can't say no to that one.
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Anya Kane
So what TV characters were you trying to emulate with your cashmere sweater?
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Kevin Greenlee
None. I wasn't trying to emulate anyone, but I was. I really like sweaters, and so I consider myself. I wouldn't say I'm a sweater connoisseur. You know, I've never really had, like, a cashmere sweater. I mean, that's something I associate with being, like, very luxurious, very fancy. So I got two of their sweaters, and they are so nice. We actually, I wore one when we went to get dinner with our friends the other night. We. I, I've kind of worn it a lot ever since. They're both really cute. And also, you know, one thing with sweaters is sometimes if you're just wearing them and you're not wearing, like, an undershirt or something, they can kind of get scratchy. These ones are so soft. They feel so good on your skin. There's, like, no issues with that. And they're just very. They just feel a little bit like quiet luxury, a little fancy. And that. That's really nice. And I think they, for me, they go with a lot of different things in my wardrobe. So it's like I. I appreciate that. They can kind of be like a bit of a staple there. For me, I'm not. It's, you know, like everyone, everyone's had a thing where they're like, I'm gonna wear this all the time. And then you don't. And like, it doesn't go with anything. So, like, what are you doing? But these are the opposite of that. They kind of go with everything. For Murder Sheet listeners, there is a very special deal. Gift luxury this holiday season without the luxury price tag. Go to quince.com/msheet for 365 day returns plus free shipping on your order. That's Q U I n c e.com/m sheet to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com/m sheet.
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Anya Kane
That's a great deal.
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Kevin Greenlee
It really is.