Podcast Summary

Murder Sheet

Episode: Tony Kiritsis, Richard Hall, and the True Story Behind Dead Man’s Wire: A Conversation with the Makers of Dead Man’s Line
Date: January 15, 2026
Guests: Alan Berry & Mark Enox (Directors, "Dead Man's Line")
Hosts: Anya Cain (Journalist) & Kevin Greenlee (Attorney)

Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the infamous 1977 hostage crisis involving Tony Kiritsis and Richard Hall, which shook Indianapolis and captured the country’s attention. The case, recently dramatized in Gus Van Sant’s film Dead Man’s Wire, is given rich historical and personal context through a conversation with Alan Berry and Mark Enox, the documentarians behind Dead Man’s Line—a documentary that brought renewed focus to the true story. The hosts and guests explore Kiritsis’s background, the events of the crisis, law enforcement and media response, the complicated aftermath, and the process of documenting and adapting this dark, bizarre Indiana legend.

Main Discussion and Insights

1. Introducing the Case & Context

• Tony Kiritsis: An Indianapolis man who, on February 8, 1977, took Richard Hall hostage over a mortgage dispute and engineered a "dead man's line" rig—an improvised shotgun device wired to Hall’s neck.
• Media Spotlight: The event became a national sensation, partially due to Kiritsis’s insistence on involving the press and broadcasting his grievances.
• Recent Adaptation: On January 9, 2026, Gus Van Sant's Dead Man's Wire (based on these events) premiered, prompting a comparison to the documentary Dead Man’s Line by Alan Berry and Mark Enox.

2. Background on Tony Kiritsis

[04:26–09:32]

• Early Life: Hard-working, ex-army, managed family trailer park, prone to volatility and violence, felt underappreciated by his family.
• Family Conflict: Fired gun at his brothers in 1965, took sister hostage in 1968 over disputed compensation, ultimately paid $50k to leave family business.
• Ambition & Grievance: Used settlement to buy land and sought to develop it—took large loan from Meridian Mortgage (run by ML Hall); grew convinced Hall sabotaged his prospects.

“He was one of these guys that is very loyal to friends... But if you crossed him, you are dead to him and he's going to do whatever he can to make your life miserable.” – Alan Berry [12:05]

3. Family & Psychological Complexity

[10:06–14:36]

• Difficult Upbringing: Abusive father, idealized mother—her death devastated Tony.
• Incidents of Loyalty and Violence: Known for generosity to community members, yet capable of severe aggression if crossed.
• Blurred Lines: Kiritsis was both well-liked and feared—a blend of pro-social and anti-social behaviors.

“His mom was clearly the greatest good influence in his life and when she passed, it destroyed him...” – Mark Enox [13:50]

4. Who Were the Halls?

[17:49–20:16]

• Dick Hall: Son of ML Hall, former Air Force, mild-mannered, became the unintended victim.
• ML Hall: Real estate mogul with a checkered history (including federal fraud conviction in 1953), viewed by Tony as a mentor turned betrayer; suspiciously absent during the crisis and refused to negotiate for his son’s safety.

“ML and his wife are in Florida for the winter. And most of us who have kids, if something like this happened, we, we would fly home..." – Mark Enox [18:15]

5. The Hostage Crisis: February 8, 1977

[26:14–35:20]

• The Setup: Kiritsis entered Meridian Mortgage expecting to find ML Hall but found Dick; rigged shotgun with “dead man’s line” (wire triggering the gun if tension was applied).
• Negotiation and Tension: Tony led Dick (and a parade of police/media) through downtown Indianapolis in freezing weather, with the threat that any interference would be fatal.
• Innovation of Threat: The "dead man’s line" concept seems original—likely inspired by TV, as discovered later.

“He puts a steel cable...over Dick's head. That wire then runs to this sawed off shotgun and through the trigger guard...Dead man's line is the term Tony used…” – Mark Enox [26:26]

6. Police & Media Response

[35:20–41:12]

• Law Enforcement Unprepared: No precedent or policy for such an event; FBI and psychologist Patrick Mullaney called in to advise.
• Media as Negotiator: Tony insisted on communicating with Fred Heckman, a respected WIBC radio journalist. Heckman’s calls calmed Tony, enabled him to air grievances, and served as negotiation.

“Fred airs [the call] mostly uncensored...Fred Heckman was able to come in and be that kind of trusted negotiator, even more so than the police or the FBI.” – Mark Enox [37:52]

7. Surviving as a Hostage

[41:12–43:35]

• Dick Hall’s Composure: A stoic, religious man; relied on faith and emotional restraint to survive the ordeal.

“The only thing he found useful was his personal relationship with God. That he would turn this over to God and if he would just be still...God would save him.” – Mark Enox [42:30]

8. Release and Aftermath

[46:17–49:14]

• Resolution: Police negotiated with promises (immunity, settlement, and an apology letter) that were never truly enforceable or honored, but convinced Tony to release Dick.
• Legal Outcome: Kiritsis was found not guilty by reason of insanity. The case spurred changes in Indiana law, shifting the burden of proof for insanity defenses.

“He’s found not guilty by reason of insanity...After this, the law is changed so that...the burden now falls on the defense.” – Mark Enox [48:10]

9. Public & Cultural Aftershocks

[51:01–55:49]

• Folk Hero or Villain?: Split public opinion—some saw Tony as a working-class champion vs. the “big banks”; others saw only violence and trauma.

“Some people do say [he's a hero]...But I think a lot of those people probably didn't know the full story and they were, they were mirroring themselves...” – Alan Berry [51:58]

10. Making Dead Man’s Line: Documentary Process

[56:02–66:57]

• Origins: Project chosen due to vivid memories and the abundance of archival footage.
• Production Challenges: Built trust with interviewees; worked with minimal budget; spent five years on the project while maintaining day jobs.
• Distribution Struggles: Difficulty breaking into film festivals, trouble with aggregators, struggled to generate awareness in a crowded market.

“Our biggest cost was time and filming the people that didn't live here...We just slowly built it up...” – Alan Berry [62:57]

11. Hollywood Adaptation & "Dead Man’s Wire" Journey

[71:12–83:19]

• Multiple False Starts: Optioned by multiple teams, endured industry flakiness and false promises, but ultimately connected with writer Austin Kladney, who scripted the Gus Van Sant film.
• Uncredited Influence: Provided archive materials and became historical consultants for Dead Man’s Wire.
• Reflection: Expressed pride in the documentary’s historical accuracy; bittersweet feelings about lack of financial reward but satisfaction in seeing the story reach a wider audience.

“It was a ten $12 million picture. Everybody made money off that, right? Yeah, we haven't made a penny...But I think at the end of the day, what we really want is people to see our work.” – Alan Berry [81:38, 83:48]

12. Postscript: What Happened to Kiritsis and Hall?

[92:29–97:10]

• Kiritsis: Remained in mental institutions until 1988 after refusing further psychological evaluations; died in 2005; never re-integrated into society.
• Dick Hall: Suffered lifelong trauma, lost job and family stability, struggled with PTSD and alcoholism, never fully recovered.

“Dick Hall...He loses everything. ML dies within a couple years, and then a Meridian mortgage goes under. Then Dick gets divorced...He paid for it with the loss of almost everything that he had in 1977.” – Mark Enox [92:29]

13. Takeaways & Reflections

[96:08–98:08]

• Mark Enox: “Family is incredibly important and it can, in the case of Tony, it created an explosive device way, way back when he was a kid...”
• Alan Berry: “I have empathy for all of them, but most of all Dick Hall, he's the one that got the worst of all this.”

14. Media Inspiration for Crime

[98:24–100:09]

• Kiritsis's “dead man’s line” may have been inspired by an episode of Hawaii Five-O, confirming the power of media in criminal innovation.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• [12:05] Alan Berry: “He was one of these guys that is very loyal to friends...But if you crossed him, you are dead to him...”
• [18:15] Mark Enox: “ML and his wife are in Florida...if something like this happened, we would fly home.”
• [26:26] Mark Enox: “He puts a steel cable...over Dick’s head...this is the dead man’s line...”
• [37:52] Mark Enox: “Fred Heckman was able to come in and be that kind of trusted negotiator...”
• [42:30] Mark Enox: “The only thing he found useful was his personal relationship with God...”
• [48:10] Mark Enox: “He’s found not guilty by reason of insanity...After this, the law is changed...”
• [51:58] Alan Berry: “Some people...thought he was a hero. But I think a lot of those people probably didn't know the full story...”
• [81:38 / 83:48] Alan Berry: “It was a ten $12 million picture. Everybody made money off that, right? Yeah, we haven't made a penny...But...what we really want is people to see our work.”
• [92:29] Mark Enox: “Dick Hall...He loses everything...He paid for it with the loss of almost everything that he had in 1977.”

Key Timestamps

• [04:26–09:32]: Tony’s early life, family dynamics, roots of conflict
• [17:49–20:16]: The Halls’ background, ML Hall’s action (or lack thereof)
• [26:26–35:20]: The hostage taking—dead man’s line rig, police & media response
• [37:52]: Fred Heckman’s role as intermediary
• [46:17–48:10]: Crisis resolution, legal aftermath
• [51:01–55:49]: Folk hero debate and public reaction
• [56:02–66:57]: Making "Dead Man's Line"—process, challenges, independent production
• [71:12–83:19]: Hollywood adaptation journey, industry realities
• [92:29–97:10]: Aftermath for Tony Kiritsis and Dick Hall
• [98:24–100:09]: Origins of the “dead man’s line” device

Conclusion

This episode provides a deeply human and thoroughly researched chronicle of the Tony Kiritsis hostage crisis, its legacy, and the media’s role in shaping public memory. The firsthand perspective of the documentarians adds rich context to both the historical event and its modern retellings, raising questions about justice, mental health, the media’s role, and what happens to those left in the wake of extraordinary violence.
For listeners interested in true crime, journalism, and the reality behind Hollywood adaptations, this is an essential, evocative listen.

Watch the full documentary, Dead Man’s Line, on YouTube.
See show notes for direct links.