Carter Roy (0:06)

This is Crime House. Some historical figures loom so large they become legends it can be hard to remember they were real people like you and me. That's certainly the case for Abraham Lincoln. His story practically formed the blueprint for the American dream. The son of a farmer who worked tirelessly to raise himself up until he held the highest office in the nation. It's a true rags to riches tale. But when the Civil War broke out, that dream turned into a nightmare. Before long, the future of the country hung in the balance. And so did President Lincoln's own life. And if you believe you know the whole story, think again. People's lives are like stories with a beginning, a middle and an end. But sometimes the final chapter comes far too soon. And we don't always get to know the real ending. I'm Carter Roy and this is True Crime, A Crime House original. Thank you to our Crime House community. Please rate, review and follow Murder True Crime Stories to show your support and to enhance your listening experience with ad. Free early access to each two part series plus bonus content. Subscribe to Crime House plus on Apple Podcasts. New episodes come out every Tuesday. And if you're interested in more true crime stories from this week in history, check out Crime House the show. Each episode covers multiple cases unified by the same theme. So every week you get something a little different. This is the first of two episodes on the murder of Abraham Lincoln. In 1865, the 56 year old sitting president was assassinated while watching a play in Washington D.C. today, I'll walk you through Abe Lincoln's early life and his path to the presidency. When he was sworn in, President Lincoln vowed to do whatever it took to save the Union. It was a heavy burden to bear and it was one that would cost him everything. Next time, I'll detail the dramatic search for President Lincoln's killer and the shocking conspiracy that was uncovered as a result. I'll also tell you about the man behind it all. John Wilkes Booth. All that and more coming up. Hey, it's Carter. And if you love murder True crime Stories where we explore the depths of history's most infamous murders. Then you have to check out Clues with Morgan Absher and Kaylin Moore. Just like we search for the real story each week. Every Wednesday, Kaylin and Morgan take you deep into the world of the most notorious crimes ever. Clue by clue. From serial killers to shocking murders. Clues dives into all the forensic details and brilliant sleuthing of the world's most infamous cases. Clues is a Crime House original. Powered by Pave Studios. New episodes drop every Wednesday. Just search clues wherever you listen to podcasts, ladies, you'll end up shopping for your guy's deodorant. Right? So try Degree's Original Cool Rush. You see, last year, Degree changed the formula and men were mad. One guy even started a petition so Degree admitted they messed up and brought the original Cool Rush scent back. It's clean, crisp, and actually smells like someone you want to cuddle. And it's an Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4. So toss one in your cart and find out why it's the best selling men's antiperspirant for the last decade. Degree Cool Rush is back and it smells like victory. She's made up her mind to live pretty smart. Learn to budget responsibly right from the start. She spends a little less and puts more into savings Keeps her blood pressure low and credit score raises. She's cutting it right out of her she tracks her cash flow on a spreadsheet at night. Boring money moves make kind of lame songs, but they sound pretty sweet to your wallet. BNC Bank Brilliantly boring since 1865, any story about Abraham Lincoln's life usually starts with some version of he was born in a log cabin. And while that fact is true, Abe's earliest years weren't quite as destitute as most people think, even by 1800 standards. His parents, Thomas and Nancy Lincoln, weren't poor, but they weren't rich either. Thomas had been working as a carpenter in Elizabethtown, Kentucky, when he and Nancy got married, and although business was good, Thomas dreamed of owning land of his own. In the early 1800s, that dream finally came true. He bought a farm called sinking spring, about 20 miles south of Elizabethtown, Kentucky. There, he, Nancy, and their infant daughter, Sarah did live in that iconic one room log cabin. Like most frontier families at the time, this is where the Lincolns also welcomed their second child on February 12, 1809, a boy they named Abraham, who everyone called Abe. Unfortunately, when Abe was 2, ownership of sinking Spring came under dispute and the family had to move again. Since record keeping wasn't an exact science, this happened a lot back then. While Thomas tried to settle the matter in court, the Lincolns leased a 30 acre farm in nearby Knob Creek. Although Abe and Sarah were still little, both under the age of 10, they were expected to help with tasks around the property. It was difficult work, especially for young children, but it helped Abe and his sister build character. And although Thomas could be harsh and demanding, he had a kind heart. At night, after the chores were finished. Thomas entertained his family with different tall tales. It seems the apple didn't fall far from the tree. Abe could often be found retelling his father's anecdotes to the other kids in the neighborhood. Thomas might have inspired Abe's love of public speaking, but it was his mother, Nancy, who brought out his intellectual side. Like most women at the time, Nancy wasn't formally educated, but she wanted more for her children if they had time during the day, Nancy sent Abe and Sarah to the nearest schoolhouse. Living in such a remote part of Kentucky, most kids didn't go to school regularly and didn't have the money for books or writing supplies. So students learned by repeating after their teachers. But even with the limited resources, Abe developed a deep passion for learning. Unfortunately, seven year old Abe's studies were interrupted in 1816 when the Lincolns fell on hard times. After five years, Thomas lost the court battle over Sinking Spring Farm. Shortly after that, the owner of Knob Creek faced legal troubles of his own, which was bad news for the Lincolns. They could be evicted at a moment's notice. If all the legal problems weren't enough, Mother Nature piled on too. After a volcanic eruption in Indonesia the previous year, the climate was all out of whack. North America experienced a mini ice age and 1816 became known as the year without summer. The freezing temperatures were disastrous for farmers like the Lincolns. We don't know for sure, but the family probably went hungry often. Understandably. By the fall of 1816, Thomas Lincoln was fed up with Kentucky. He moved the family to a new settlement over 100 miles away in Little Pigeon Creek, Indiana. But it wasn't much better. The Lincolns didn't know it, but at the time, Indiana was far less developed than Kentucky. It was basically like living in the wilderness. Still, the family survived for two years. Then in 1818, they were blindsided by tragedy once more. At just 34 years old, Abe's mother, Nancy died after drinking tainted milk. Apparently it had come from a cow that ate a poisonous plant called snakeroot. Nine year old Abe was devastated. Without his mom, the family lost a major source of order and comfort. A little over a year passed before Thomas was ready to move on. And once he did, it happened fast. He took a trip back to Kentucky and returned with a new wife. Sarah Bush Johnston was also a widow with three kids of her own. She'd known Abe's parents when they lived in Elizabethtown. She and Thomas reconnected when he went back to visit and they quickly developed feelings for each other. The new Mrs. Lincoln turned out to be exactly what the family needed. She got Thomas to fix up their ramshackle cabin, demanding he install a proper floor and plaster the spaces between the logs. But the cabin wasn't the only thing in desperate need of some love and attention. Before Sarah arrived in Indiana, Abe and his sister were sleeping on straw and dressed in tatters. Sarah brought them comforts they hadn't known in a while, like beds and proper clothing. The kids appreciated Sarah and she quickly bonded with them, especially Abe. Like his birth mother, Nancy, Sarah pushed him to be curious about the world. She gave him three books, including a copy of the Bible, which he used to teach himself how to read. Unlike the women in his life, Abe's father, Thomas didn't see the value in education. Reading and writing weren't skills you needed to tend a farm. But Sarah stood up for Abe and did what she could to supply her stepson with books. Still, formal schooling was even harder to come by in Indiana than it had been in Kentucky. That meant Abe was almost entirely self taught. Throughout his teenage years, he was known to carry a book with him wherever he went, even out in the fields. But what really got Abe noticed was his height. By the time he was 17 years old, he was already 6ft 4 inches. That's tall even by today's standards. But back in the 1820s, when the average height for men was closer to five and a half feet, it was unheard of. A lifetime of manual labor meant he was surprisingly strong too. That might be why in 1828, 19 year old Abe was hired to pilot a boat carrying vegetables and other produce down the Mississippi River. He would remember the trip forever, but not fondly. When they reached their destination in New Orleans, Abraham saw a slave auction taking place on the docks. Growing up in Kentucky, Abe had seen his fair share of enslaved people. But his parents had been members of Little Mount Baptist Church, which was firmly against the practice. And while 19 year old Abe wasn't particularly religious anymore, he still maintained a belief that slavery was a sin against God. Witnessing the brutality firsthand that day in New Orleans deeply disturbed him. But slavery was just one of the political issues a was concerned about at the time. When he returned to Indiana, he participated in many political discussions, both at home and in public. These conversations helped to shape his sense of how society should function. But not everyone shared his beliefs. And soon Abe would learn just how difficult it was to make the country a better place. If you're a lineman in charge of keeping the lights on, Granger understands that you go to great lengths and sometimes heights to ensure the power is always flowing. Which is why you can count on Grainger for professional grade products and next day delivery so you have everything you need to get the job done. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickgrainger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done. Hey, it's Carter and if you love Murder True Crime Stories where we explore the depths of history's most infamous murders Then you have to check out Clues with Kaylin Moore and Morgan Absher. Just like we search for the real story each week, every Wednesday, Morgan and Kaylin take you deep into the world of the most notorious crimes ever. Clue by clue. I really think you're going to appreciate the care and attention that Kaylin and Morgan put into breaking down how even the smallest pieces of evidence have cracked major cases wide open. From serial killers to shocking murders, Clues dives into all the forensic details and brilliant sleuthing of the world's most infamous cases. If you're looking for compelling storytelling, crime scene analysis and a new perspective through some of the world's most puzzling true crime cases, then you have to check out clues. Clues is a Crime House original powered by Pave Studios. New episodes drop every Wednesday. Just search Clues wherever you listen to podcasts in 1830, 21 year old Abraham Lincoln was still just a farmer's son living in Indiana. But he was quickly growing into a man with a deep interest in current events, and the best place to gather and talk about them was the local general store where Abe worked. When he wasn't helping his dad there, Abe took every opportunity to engage with the different views and opinions around him. He honed his own beliefs and discovered he was pretty good in a debate. The one argument he couldn't win, though, was whether the family should move again. Although Indiana had been mostly good to the Lincoln family, Abe's father, Thomas, decided to pursue greener pastures. He had relatives in Illinois and they wanted him to bring his family there. They promised the soil was richer and the milk sickness that killed his first wife didn't exist in Illinois. That was all Thomas needed. The family packed up and moved later that year. In 1830, Thomas bought land in Macon County, Illinois and set up a new farm. But Abe was done with that life. Like most people in their early 20s, he was ready to forge his own path. However, he did put the skills his father had taught him to good use. Abe moved to a nearby town called New Salem, also in Illinois, and began working as a handyman. After that, he clerked at a general store before eventually opening a shop of his own. But he wasn't the savviest businessman. The general store failed after just a couple of years. That's when Abe decided to change course. With his interest in social issues and knack for debate, he decided to pursue a career as a lawyer. Luckily, Abe had a friend with a law practice and he hired Abe as an apprentice. It was the first step to earning his own law license. But Abe had even bigger dreams. He'd been interested in politics for a few years and decided now was the time to act on it. So while he worked toward one goal, becoming a lawyer, he also got started on another. In 1834, 25 year old Abe ran for and won a seat as an Illinois state representative. Abe spent his first session in the state house Learning and observing his fellow legislators. After a few months, he returned home to New Salem and continued his legal studies. By 1836, he'd really made something of himself. At just 27 years old, Abe was a licensed attorney and was re elected as a state representative. Except this time, his work as a legislator would be more complicated Because Abe was facing his first formal vote on the issue of slavery. When Illinois had become a state in 1818, only those who already owned enslaved people were allowed to continue the practice. But as the years went by, slavery still had a lot of support in Illinois. And for this vote in 1836, the state legislature was proposing a resolution that supported the legality of slavery. Abe was one of six legislators who voted against it. He also joined one other representative in filing an official protest. And although this was his first public stand against slavery, it wasn't quite as progressive as it sounds. In filing that protest, Abe was essentially saying that while he believed slavery was wrong, he agreed the practice was protected under the constitution, at least for those states where it currently existed. It was a far cry from declaring himself an abolitionist. And it was also a strategic move for his political career. Abe's moderate stance meant he didn't lose any public support. In fact, it only made him more popular. Over the next six years, he earned the reputation of Honest Abe and was seen as a politician who was both fair and reasonable. It served him well. In 1840, the 31 year old was elected to the Illinois house of Representatives for a fourth consecutive term. He also was part of a relatively new political party known as the Whigs. The Whigs were seen as the party of education and order. One of the issues they cared most about was the temperance movement. Movement to outlaw alcohol. But their main focus was taking down the current President of the United States, Andrew Jackson. They viewed him as an extension of the British monarchy and called him King Andrew. Abe had been a loyal member of the Whig party since its founding in 1834. Over the years, he'd worked his way up the ranks alongside other movers and shakers. That was how he met Ninian Edwards, whose family was a big deal among Illinois Whigs. He and Abe worked closely together to advance the party's cause. Through that partnership, Abe became acquainted with Ninian's sister in law, 22 year old Mary Todd. Mary was educated, cultured and not afraid to share her opinion. She was everything Abe wanted in a woman. But wooing her wouldn't be easy because Mary and Abe came from very different worlds. Mary was a member of the upper class. Her father was a wealthy businessman and slave owner. And while Abe was a successful politician, he was and always would be middle class at best. None of that bothered Mary, though. They dated for a while, but the whole time, Mary's sister was in her ear telling her she should find someone wealthier. Finally, after a few months, Mary gave in and ended things with Abe. For about a year they tried to avoid one another, but their connection was undeniable. Sometime in the early 1840s, they got back together, this time in secret, which meant a lot of sneaking around. Although Mary lived with her sister 70 miles away in Springfield, she managed to keep the relationship under wraps until the day she and Abe got married on November 4, 1842. Mary was 24 and Abe was 33. And although he couldn't provide the life of luxury she was accustomed to, the pair were very happy together. The next year they welcomed their first child, a son who they named Robert Todd. The family rented a small house while Abe saved up to get them something nicer. And in 1844, he bought their first and only home in Springfield. With his personal life going so well, Abe took another major step in his political career. Illinois had seven congressional districts, but the Whig party only stood a chance in one of them. So the party's leaders agreed to take turns running for the seat. And in 1846, Abe got his shot. He won his election pretty easily and began a two year term in the US House of Representatives. It was his first experience on the national stage and he took the opportunity to absorb as much as he could, including how political parties interacted. For example, as a member of the opposition party, he wasn't expected to support the Mexican American War. However, a lot of people back in Illinois were in favor of the conflict. So Abe's vote against it in 1847 didn't go over very well with his constituents. And suddenly he found himself in the hot seat with voters. With his popularity waning, Abe decided it was time to take a break from politics. In 1849, he switched gears and focused on his family and law career instead. He spent the next five years becoming one of the most prominent lawyers in the state of Illinois. And while Abe wasn't actively participating in politics, he was still paying attention. Especially when the federal government passed the Kansas Nebraska act in 1854. Under this act, these two new territories could choose for themselves if they wanted to allow slavery. It opened the door to one of Abe's greatest fears. The unchecked spread of the practice. And the issue hit very close to home. The law had been proposed by one of the two US Senators from Illinois, Stephen Douglas. Abe was ashamed that someone representing his state would champion such an awful policy. But on the bright side, that meant Abe could do something to fight back. He could unseat Douglas, who was up for re election. Abe got a harsh dose of reality when he failed to win his campaign. And it only got worse when the Whig party started to unravel. But Abe wasn't giving up just yet. He worked with other anti slavery colleagues to form the Illinois chapter of the Republican party which was focused on many of the same issues as the Whigs had been. And while the faction was new, its key players weren't. They quickly gained influence, even securing the governorship in 1856. But even then, they didn't have enough power to help Abe when he went up against Stephen Douglas for a second time in 1858. Although Abe lost the Senate seat once again, he did prove himself to his colleagues. Over the course of his year long campaign, Abe had debated Douglas seven times. It was clear to his Republican cohorts that Abe was an excellent public speaker and a formidable opponent. So despite two failed Senate runs, Abe Lincoln won the Republican party's nomination for president in 1860. Although Abe was clear he had no intention of interfering with slavery where it already existed, he still managed to win the majority of northern states. That was enough for a decisive victory. In November 1860, 51 year old Abraham Lincoln was elected the 16th President of the United States. But it wouldn't be smooth sailing because just a few months later, the country would be in a bitter war over slavery and Abe would find himself in the line of fire. Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile with a message for everyone. Paying big wireless way too much please for the love of everything good in this world. Stop with Mint. You can get premium wireless for just $15 a month. Of course, if you enjoy overpaying. No judgments. But that's weird. Okay, one judgment anyway. Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month required. Intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See full terms@mintmobile.com In November 1860, 51 year old Abraham Lincoln became the 16th President of the United States. He and his family moved from their comfortable, if modest home in Springfield, Illinois to the White House. By then, Abe and his wife Mary had three sons, 17 year old Robert, 10 year old Willie and 7 year old Tad. But the Lincolns didn't have much time to celebrate. When Abe was inaugurated in March 1861, the issue of slavery was at a fever pitch. Just before he took office, seven Southern states had voted to separate themselves from the United States. They declared themselves the Confederate States of America, drafted a constitution and chose their own president, Jefferson Davis. Within a month, four more states joined them. And that's when the fighting began. By April 12, 1861, barely a month after Abe took office, the Civil War was officially underway. In total, 11 Southern states eventually formed the Confederacy. Dedicated to advancing the right for states to have more power, including the right to preserve slavery. The north became known as the Union. Although there were many abolitionists in their midst, the Union's goal wasn't to eradicate slavery. It was to prevent it from expanding into new territories and states. Despite his personal feelings, Abe didn't want to force the south to get rid of the practice. For him, the Civil War wasn't about emancipation. He was simply fighting to preserve the integrity of the United States. For the next year, the Union fought tooth and nail to gain the upper hand. It came at a high cost. Thousands of young men were losing their lives. And all that death and destruction hit closer to home for the Lincolns in 1862. Early that year, Abe and Mary's youngest sons, Willie and Tad, came down with what was likely typhoid fever. They were Both bedridden, but 11 year old Willie never recovered. He died in February of 1862. Abe and Mary Todd were devastated. The loss motivated Abe to work even harder to end the war. For the first time, he truly felt the pain of losing a child. With so many parents around the nation facing the same grief, Abe desperately searched for a way to end the suffering. But it soon became apparent that he couldn't end the war. Without answering the question of slavery, Abe began to reconsider his stance on emancipation. He still didn't believe the Constitution gave him the right, even as president, to free all enslaved people in the South. However, the war provided him with an unexpected loophole. As commander in chief of the military, he was allowed to seize enemy property, including enslaved people. Once all of those people were technically his, he could then go ahead and free them through a process called national emancipation. But Abe hoped that he wouldn't have to go through with it. He thought that just the threat of national emancipation would be enough for the Confederacy to surrender and rejoin the Union. He brought the idea to his cabinet in the summer of 1862. Abe's Secretary of State, William Seward, suggested he wait for a major victory before putting his plan into action. That chance came after the battle of Antietam in Maryland in September of 1862. With a death toll in the thousands, it was the war's bloodiest single day conflict. And although the Union lost more soldiers, Abe considered it a strategic victory. He used the opportunity to make his announcement. If the Confederacy didn't disband and rejoin the Union by the end of the year, all enslaved individuals living there would would be considered free. December 31st came and winked and still the Confederates kept fighting. If they thought Abe was bluffing, they were in for a rude awakening. On the first day of 1863, President Lincoln signed the official Emancipation Proclamation, effectively ending slavery in the United States forever. However, not everyone in the Union was supportive of the proclamation. Not only because there were still people there who supported slavery, but because they saw it as another roadblock to ending the war. How would they reunite with the Confederacy now? With another presidential election coming up the following year, Abe's advisors started to worry he might not win. To try and help his chances, they brought on a new running mate, Andrew Johnson. He was a Democratic senator from Tennessee which had seceded along with much of the South. And while Johnson was pro slavery, he wasn't pro Confederacy. So he had stayed with the Union and was the only southern senator still in Congress. Having Johnson on his ticket was helpful, but it wasn't what put Lincoln's campaign over the edge. That came thanks to the slew of military victories the Union racked up just before the November 1864 election. It finally felt like they were making progress and the momentum led led to a landslide electoral college victory for Abe. In March 1865, 56 year old Abraham Lincoln was sworn in as President of the United States. For the second Time. And it seemed like he'd finally end the fighting once and for all. After a grueling winter and supply chain issues, Southern morale was at an all time low. By April of that year, the tide had turned heavily in the Union's favor. Then, on April 9, Confederate General Robert E. Lee surrendered his troops in Richmond, Virginia. There were a few battles still going on, but many Americans were relieved that the fighting was almost at an end. Finally, they could look forward to a future when the darkness of war and slavery were behind the them. No one was more eager for that future than President Lincoln. Abe woke up on the morning of April 14, 1865, five days after the Confederacy surrendered, feeling more hopeful than he had in years. During breakfast, Mary reminded him of their plans to go to Ford's Theater that evening. They'd made a point to go see a play there once a week. It was a distraction from the heaviness of daily life. Abe was looking forward to it. But first he had work to do. Meetings, meetings and more meetings. There was a lot to figure out regarding the end of the war. It was up to President Lincoln and his Cabinet to decide what reconciliation would lead, look like. Who would be held responsible and how was the biggest question on everyone's minds. For his part, A was done with bloodshed. He wasn't interested in punishing the Southern states and their leaders any more than they'd already been. He was focused on working with them. But there was only so much that could be accomplished in one day. So Abe took a rare break in the early evening to join Mary on her carriage ride around Washington D.C. it was liberating to get a few minutes to themselves, to imagine life after the war. They got back just in time to get ready for the theater. They were still looking for guests to go with them. And the honor went to Major Henry Rathbone and his fiance. He was a survivor of the Battle of Antietam and regarded as a hero. Abe and Mary Todd were thrilled to have the Major and his fiance join them for the evening. But by the time everything was settled, the group was running late. When the President and his party arrived at Ford's Theater, the play had already begun. The group had no chance of getting to their seats without causing a stir. The Presidential box was practically above the stage, as much on display as the actors themselves. So when Abe was spotted entering, the crowd burst into applause. After the brief interruption, the show carried on. The night's entertainment was a three act play called Our American Cousin. It was a comedy about a bumbling American trying to navigate life in the English aristocracy. As a former country boy himself, Abe got a kick out of the humor. He and Mary cozied up to one another as they enjoyed their evening. They held hands and sat closer together as the play went on. By the third act, Mary joked that they must be scandalizing Major Rathbone's fiance. Abe smiled and assured her she won't think anything of it. Minutes later, at around 10:15pm the main character delivered the biggest punchline of the whole show. As expected, the theater filled with an uproar of laughter. At that exact moment, a man entered the President's box. Using a length of wood he'd taken from a music stand, he wedged the door closed. Then he pointed a single shot derringer pistol at the back of Abraham Lincoln's head and pulled the trigger. Smoke filled the box. When it cleared, Major Rathbone saw a man standing behind the President's slumped body and sprang into action. The assassin dropped his gun and brandished a large dagger. He swung at Major Rathbone, cutting his arm to the bone before leaping from the box onto the stage below. The audience cried out in shock. They still didn't know what had happened to the President, but many recognized the man on stage as the Shakespearean actor John Wilkes Booth. He wasn't in the show that evening, but he'd performed at Ford's Theater many times before. Thrusting the bloody dagger into the air, he yelled, sic semper ty renis. The Latin phrase translates to thus always to tyrants and is often used to suggest that tyrannical leaders will eventually be overthrown. After shouting at the audience, Booth disappeared behind the curtains. As Booth fled into the night, Abe lay unconscious and bleeding. Mary wailed, pleading for someone to help them. When the rest of the audience realized the President had been shot, the theater erupted into chaos. But even then, no one knew the full truth that Abraham Lincoln wasn't the only target that night. In reality, Booth's attack was just one part of a much larger conspiracy. The goal? To plunge the Union into chaos and change the course of history forever. Thanks so much for listening. I'm Carter Roy and this, this is Murder True Crime Stories. Come back next time for part two of our series on the assassination of President Abraham Lincoln. True Crime Stories is a Crime House original. Powered by Pave Studios. Here at Crime House, we want to thank each and every one of you for your support. If you like what you heard today, reach out on social media. Rimehouse. Don't forget to rate, review and follow Murder True Crime Stories. Wherever you get your podcasts, your feedback truly makes a difference. And to enhance your Murder True Crime Stories listening experience, subscribe to Crime House plus on Apple Podcasts. You'll get every episode ad free and instead of having to wait for each episode of a two part series, you'll get access to both at once plus exciting bonus content. We'll be back next Tuesday. True Crime Stories is hosted by Me, Carter Roy and is a Crime House original. Powered by Pave Studios, this episode was brought to life by the Murder True Crime Stories team. Max Cutler, Ron Shapiro, Alex Benedon, Natalie Pertzofsky, Laurie Marinelli, Sarah Camp, Megan Hannam, Beth Johnson and Russell Nash. Thank you for listening. How can one tiny clue change everything? Kaylin Moore and Morgan Absher break it all down on their new show, Clues. New episodes drop every Wednesday. Just search Clues wherever you listen to podcasts.