Loading summary
Transcript123 lines
- [00:00]
A
All right, you guys, we are jumping into an ad and ironically the other day I had a friend over and she pulled me aside and was like, hey, I was watching your episode and saw you talking about the new Skims bra that you had ordered and honestly after hearing you talk about it, I was like, I need. I gotta try this. She got it and instantly said it is her favorite bra. She has completely fallen in love with it and now feels like she needs to order more Skims product based off just that. And that is why I am constantly raving to you guys about skims. I am not making it up. They have amazing things. I love their fits everybody line. I actually just ordered some more pajamas as the seasons are getting colder. Their pajamas are just the right weight. They are so, so soft. I've also been wearing the Fits everybody boy shorts underwear. I've told you about that multiple times. I also love the Fits everybody lace unlined scoop bra. I love just having that poke out of low cut shirts or Dr. Also pains not lying.
- [01:05]
B
The real story, the way she was talking made it maybe didn't seem like a real story. It was a real story.
- [01:10]
A
Yeah, Garrett was there.
- [01:11]
B
I really did happen. Also, Skim sent me some stuff because I've been begging them to send me some stuff because I love their underwear. Yeah, I don't know how else to say that.
- [01:21]
A
I mean ladies, if you need to get your man or boy something, I.
- [01:26]
B
Swear this has nothing to even do because they didn't even look it. I love them. They didn't really send me stuff until recently. I bought it on my own. Love it. Yeah, absolutely love their stuff.
- [01:37]
A
Now shop my favorite bras and underwear@skims.com and after you place your order. So at the end of the process, be sure to let them know we sent you. Select podcast in the survey, select our show in the drop down menu. Please, please, please don't forget that step. So after you've already finished the entire thing, just hurry and fill it out. Let them know we sent you. It's just a great way to support the show and let them know that you are listening. A Mochi moment from Sadie who writes, I'm not crying, you're crying. This is what I said during my first appointment with my physician at Mochi because I didn't have to convince him I needed a GLP one. He understood and I felt supported, not judged. I came for the weight loss and stayed for the empathy. Thanks, Sadie. I'm Mayra Amit, founder of Mochi Health. To find your mochi moment. Visit joinmochi.com join Sadie is emoji member compensated for her story. You're listening to an Ono Media podcast. Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the podcast. This is Murder with my husband. I'm Peyton Moreland.
- [02:38]
B
And I'm Garrett Moreland.
- [02:39]
A
And he's the husband.
- [02:40]
B
I'm the husband. Welcome back. Another week, another episode. Thank you for supporting. Thank you for listening. Thank you for buying our merch. Thank you for being you. Starting to get cold. Fall's kicking in. Winter is coming, coming. Side note, I hope everyone has seen Games of Thrones. If you haven't, go and check it out. Other side note, I was thinking about it. I love Cheesecake Factory. Love cheese. If there's anybody out there, anybody that happens to work for corporate or wants to just sponsor me, I'll do it. Not maybe for free. If I get free cheesecake, I'll do it. I just. I love Cheesecake Factory. They have so many options. I think I realized that cheesecake is officially my favorite dessert.
- [03:31]
A
Really?
- [03:31]
B
Yeah, I think so. Not yours. Yours is ice cream.
- [03:34]
A
Yeah.
- [03:35]
B
Anyways, I love Cheesecake Factory. I hope all you guys love Cheesecake Factory. Little update on bagels real quick. We're getting there. I'm supposed to be signing a lease and then the build out will start. And I hope you guys all come to my grand opening. Um, it's a few months away. It's a lot to do.
- [03:52]
A
What, like, it's a lot of months? A bit.
- [03:54]
B
Oh, things are gonna start happening fast. Gonna get crazy. Payton's actually going to be one of the head bakers at the bagel place, so you guys can come say hi to her as well. Yeah, what do you have to say about that, babe?
- [04:09]
A
I have a full time job with my husband.
- [04:12]
B
Yeah, but are you gonna bake bagels?
- [04:13]
A
Oh, I'm not bacon, but I'll, like, help at the place.
- [04:18]
B
No, I'm just kidding.
- [04:19]
A
I don't think anyone wants my bagels. I. I'm not, like, good at baking, so.
- [04:23]
B
Yeah, that's okay. That's kind of what I got for my 10 seconds. Before we jump into it, side note, if you want some bonus content or ad free content, you can join our Patreon or Apple subscriptions or Spotify subscriptions. Oh, real quick. So Daisy swims a lot. And a couple weeks ago we took her swimming for, like, three days. And all she did for three days was swim. I think the chlorine, like, fried her coat, like her hair. So we're getting her groomed again next week. Huh? Babe. But it's like, fried.
- [04:57]
A
Yeah. Which it's never happened before, so I didn't know how much was in. And the pool that she grew up swimming in didn't have chlorine, so I wasn't as worried about it. But now I'm like, how much water did she swallow? Like, it had to have been so high. This has never happened before.
- [05:14]
B
It's more just like it. It wrecked her coat.
- [05:17]
A
How does she know we're talking about her?
- [05:19]
B
I don't know. She just knows. Anyways, all right, that's enough about us. Let's get into today's case.
- [05:27]
A
Our sources for this episode are courttv.com wheretv.com mirror.co.uk wildhunt.org myfox8.com pnj.com whnt.com wkrg.com aetv. The Guardian, Oxygen and the Ledger.com so most of us follow a certain belief system. The idea that there is some power out there bigger than ourselves that pulls the strings and controls certain outcomes, whether that's religion, God, karma, or even magic, witchcraft. These systems all have one thing in common. It is basically the idea of good versus evil. Evil. Not always, but usually. For many, these ideologies can be a roadmap, a lens through which we see the world and find ways to navigate it. But in some cases, these heavy beliefs can also lead people astray. It can cause us to see things that aren't really there, to lean a certain way. Because life isn't black and white. Life isn't just good versus evil. It is nuanced. It is complicated. And when you believe that someone else's ideology is inferior to your own, is more dangerous than your own, that's when things can get twisted. Especially when you're a police officer meant to solve a complicated triple murder. So today I want to take you to this area in Florida known as Escambia county in the westernmost part of the Florida Panhandle. It is right next to the Gulf of Mexico, and for many, this area is a vacation destination. Beautiful sand beaches, dolphin cruises, a vibrant shopping scene, museums, a minor league baseball team. But behind this coastal charm is a darker story. This is a county that has been jokingly nicknamed the Twilight Zone Vortex for its famous and very gruesome connection to true crime. For example, this was where Bird and Melanie Billings, the millionaire couple who had 16 children, were murdered in their home in 2009.
- [07:50]
B
16 children.
- [07:52]
A
It is also where Ted Bundy was finally caught and arrested after a multi state manhunt back in 1978. But in 2015, Escambia county experienced a crime unlike anything they had ever dealt with before. So that year, 2015, the Smiths are living a quiet little life in a suburban part of Pensacola. 77 year old von Seal, also known to her nieces and nephews as Aunt Bonnie, doesn't really venture out of the house much anymore. At 77, her health had been on the decline for some years now. She used to love vacationing with her husband and her two sons, getting out, going on adventures, staying active. And her nieces and nephews idolized her, saying she was their favorite aunt. With her big southern drawl. She was always calling everyone sugar or honey or sweetie. They said that she had a way of making everyone feel special and loved. But ever since the death of her husband some years earlier, things just hadn't really been the same. Now Aunt Bonnie mostly keeps to herself. She likes to spend the days on the couch ordering things off qvc. This is kind of what is bringing her joy at this point in her later life. That and her sons, of course, both of them actually still live at home for their own reasons. John, who is now 47, has an intellectual disability. He's worked at the local Walmart for the last 20 years. Everyone there loves him. He's always smiling. He has a childlike sense of wonder to him. His co workers called him the little brother of the group. They actually remembered how every Christmas John would come to work with these holiday pins that he would give out to his friends. He just seemed to make people smile. And Von Sil, AKA Aunt Bonnie, had actually dedicated her life to caring for John. And then her 49 year old son Richard was also living with them. And he had dedicated his life now to caring for the two of them, his mother and his brother. Richard was an IT specialist with the Department of Homeland Security. Specifically he was in the crypto department. And not like cryptocurrency. Oh, he was like a cryptologic technician, basically working on all the codes that they teach naval officers. So it was clear Richard was kind of taking care of the house at this point. He kind of stepped into his dad's role. He would wake up at 5am every morning, get his brother ready and off to work at 7am Then he would come home and get himself ready. And because of how dedicated Richard was to his family, he really didn't have much of a personal life. He was never married, no real romantic interests or big groups of friends. What free time he did have, he actually dedicated to his love for university of Alabama sports. His co workers said his office walls were actually covered with posters and memorabilia. And that didn't mean he didn't want a life outside of his family. He did once tell a co worker that he dreamed of one day having a wife and kids of his own. But he always just kind of felt like it was impossible because he was just kind of the caretaker for his brother and now his mother. Which is what makes the events of that July 2015 just that much more heartbreaking. So on Tuesday, July 28, both Richard and John went to work that day as usual. No one reported any behavior out of the ordinary from either of them. And then at 6:46pm that night, Richard made an outgoing call, though I'm not sure to who. But the following day, neither Richard nor John show up to work. Now, for 49 year old Richard, this is highly unusual, especially when two more days went by and he still didn't come into the office. So it is now July 31st when one of Richard's bosses really begins to worry. So they actually call the sheriff's department and say, hey, can you just go do like a wellness check on my employee? But also his family, because I know he lives with his brother and his mother. So the police stop by their house that afternoon. They knock on the door, there is no answer. So they call another family member and that family member gives them permission to enter the home and check on them. So police go inside and they see the home is pretty cluttered. Now remember, Von Seal ordered a lot of stuff from qvc. So there are just boxes and items everywhere. But they notice something else. It's a smell. And they also see what looks like a foot sticking out from under a pile of blankets and clothing inside the house. And when they pull back the edges, they see a female hand underneath and then the body of 77 year old von Seal Smith.
- [13:04]
B
Okay.
- [13:05]
A
Now unfortunately, it doesn't end there. Police obviously look around the house for evidence. And the sons, they find another body buried in the clutter. 47 year old John and then eventually 49 year old Richard too.
- [13:19]
B
Okay.
- [13:20]
A
It doesn't take long for the medical examiner to determine that all three had been dead for a few days now.
- [13:26]
B
Wow.
- [13:27]
A
Likely they were killed the night they were last seen. So about three days earlier, he made that outgoing call. That would be Tuesday, July 28th. Something happened that night. Three days go by, the police go, Juan Seal and John have been beaten to death with a blunt object. And their throats had each been slashed. But Richard had been shot in the Head. His throat was also slashed. What's interesting is there is no sign of forced entry. Juan Seal appeared to have been attacked in the chair that she always sat in in the family's living room. And detectives thought she might have been asleep or just sitting in the chair and didn't see the attacker coming. Though she did appear to attempt to fight back. She had some defensive wounds on her hands. John, however, had no defensive wounds on him, so detectives thought he probably didn't even have the chance to fight off the attacker. Someone just walked right up to him, likely while he was asleep, and shot him. Well, this is John. So they just beat him in the head.
- [14:32]
B
Oh, my gosh.
- [14:33]
A
Before he could react. So maybe he was killed first. It's possible Richard saw it coming, though, which was why he was shot, unlike his other family members. So as detectives keep digging, they find a few other items of interest around the home, like a bloody claw hammer. And in the trash outside, bloody paper towels and some cigarette butts.
- [14:57]
B
Okay.
- [14:57]
A
Police also find it interesting that whoever had committed the murders then spent the time wrapping and hiding the bodies under blankets in their own home. It's not like it's in public.
- [15:10]
B
Isn't that usually a sign of, like, remorse? Remorse or. Typically, that's what they say, dish, as weird as that sounds.
- [15:18]
A
Yeah.
- [15:19]
B
So it's probably somebody I would assume that the family knows.
- [15:22]
A
That's usually the connection, is that maybe they knew their attacker, so this person took the time to cover the bodies rather than just fleeing the scene. Now, because of that, they wonder if the crime was more personal than just a robbery. With the state of the house already in complete disarray, it was really hard to tell if anything was missing. But there are some things police have to consider, and a big one is Richard's highly sensitive line of work. This was a big reason why Richard's co workers were so worried about his absence. And the information they were working with was top secret. Something someone else, like a foreign adversary, might want access to. So when someone like Richard turns up dead without explanation, it is a serious matter. It can even be considered sometimes a matter of national security. Which is actually why the Department of Homeland Security sends some of their own agents out to aid in the triple homicide. And these agents discover something interesting. Richard's keys seem to be missing from the home. They also take a DNA sample from his front pants pocket and later find that this DNA sample they collected didn't belong to anyone in their databases. Though after looking at the projects Richard was working on, it becomes apparent to the DHS that they there's nothing so sensitive currently under his purview that would have been worth killing for. Okay, so everyone just kind of ultimately rules out this theory. Why do most of us want to learn a new language? It's probably not about memorizing grammar tables or topping a leaderboard. It's because we want to speak it out in the real world with real people. And Babel gets you there fast. Learning a language with Babbel is all about small steps, big wins and progress. You can actually track and feel. Their bite sized lessons fit easily into your daily routine and are also easy to remember. Just 10 minutes a day is enough to start seeing real results. Babel recognizes that real world connections are at the heart of language learning. Their courses are designed by over 200 language experts, real human beings, to teach you relevant words and phrases you will actually use so you can start speaking with confidence in as little as three weeks. As you guys know, Garrett is fluent in Spanish and so I use Babel to brush up on my Spanish anytime we are traveling so I can keep up and it really does help. Here's a special limited time deal for our listeners right now. Get up to 55% off your Babel subscription at babbel.com husband get up to 55% off at babbel.com husband Spelled b a b b e l.com husband Rules and restrictions may apply. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds. Visit progressive.com to see if you could save Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations. So now police start speaking with others who knew the family, hoping to get more information. And one of the first people they reach out to is a man named Donald Hartung. So Donald actually last saw the family the night they were believed to have died. So Tuesday that evening he was over at the house cooking dinner for the family. But it's important to note he is not just a friendly neighbor. He is actually Von Seal's son from a previous relationship, making him Richard and John's half brother. Now, Von Seal actually had Donald when she was a teenager. Now the 59 year old lived just three miles away from the family and worked as a security guard at a local hospital. And according to Donald, he had a pretty good relationship with his mother and his half brothers. He says he always did. When he was brought in for questioning on the night of July 31, he told police, yeah, that night I went over to my mother's house. I actually do it every Tuesday to cook for the family. And he said he would often help Von Seal and Richard take care of John when they needed it. But he also told police there were a few enemies the brothers had made over the years. He mentioned that Richard had actually been sleeping with a married woman and that John once had exposed himself to a young person at the Walmart where he worked. Okay, now, whether or not any of this is true, I can't find any confirmation. But the police didn't think Donald was someone to doubt, at least at first. He had no criminal record. He appeared to be cooperating with the investigation. He offered up a DNA sample and admitted to seeing the family on the night they died. He even said, I'll take a polygraph. Like, I really don't mind. Though, interestingly enough, the officers denied to polygraph him, afraid that he would pass and then that could later be used to support his claims.
- [20:58]
B
Kind of interesting. I mean, there's got to be money involved somewhere. Just. It's just one of those cases where there's no way money's not involved.
- [21:06]
A
Okay.
- [21:06]
B
Yeah.
- [21:08]
A
Now, I want to say the police denying the polygraph maybe makes sense, because there was something kind of off about the way Donald was behaving during the interview. When police broke the news to him that his mother and half brothers had been murdered, he showed little to no emotion about it at all. And he was very nonchalant when he asked, well, were they robbed?
- [21:34]
B
Did they tell you how your folks. Your family over there was killed? Killed? How would they kill? It looked like they were shot wrong. I don't think so.
- [21:48]
A
Which is kind of a strange thing to be thinking about when you've just been told that your family has been murdered. But also maybe you're just trying to piece it all together. And when police speak with other members of Von Seal's family that day, they kind of contradict some of what Donald had said. They mentioned he was kind of the black sheep of the family. He was mean and arrogant. He often picked on his half brothers and their differences, that he was always reaching out to his mother to help him with his finances and that she had actually disowned him for a while.
- [22:21]
B
Wow. Okay.
- [22:22]
A
Because he was involved with something that she did not agree with, and that was Donald was involved with witchcraft. Now, detectives had learned that Von Seal, as a devoutly Christian woman, was extremely upset when she found out that her son Donald was a practicing wiccan. She called it the devil's work. Donald made little mention of this in his interview with police that day. But the same night the bodies are found and he is called in, he tells the police they are more than welcome to search his home. And so they do. And what they find there proves witchcraft is actually a really big part of Donald's life and was a pretty big part of his relationship with his mom. He was serious about it. They uncover plenty of relics, books, even an entire worship room, as police called it.
- [23:15]
B
This guy's. He's a witch.
- [23:18]
A
Well, they find a Ouija board laid out and ready to go. I just want to clarify.
- [23:24]
B
Don't use those.
- [23:25]
A
That doesn't necessarily mean it's tied to the religion. This is just something they find.
- [23:30]
B
Don't do it.
- [23:31]
A
Apparently, they also find the clothes that Donald was believed to be wearing the night of the murders. And it's from there that detectives actually start putting together the pieces of the puzzle, because they also realize that around this time, it was a rare blue moon. Now, this only happens once every two or three years, and the blue moon is a culturally significant time for Wiccan practitioners. It's considered to be a more heightened energy, which is ideal.
- [24:02]
B
Wiccans. Is that like a male witch, or is that like.
- [24:06]
A
That's just what you would call someone who practices the witchcraft, not a witch? No, they are. They're referred to as Wiccans.
- [24:15]
B
I'm gonna call them witches.
- [24:17]
A
Okay. You can do what you want.
- [24:19]
B
Thank you. I think witches sounds a little cooler.
- [24:22]
A
So basically, this energy from the moon is ideal for manifesting and performing powerful spells. But police think Donald may have timed his crimes, if he did this around the blue moon as some sort of ritual sacrifice. They're attempting to find a motive. And this is what they with for Donald.
- [24:42]
B
This is gonna be wild if this is why.
- [24:45]
A
So after police search Donald's house that night, they go back to the station around 1:30am it's now August 1st. And they ask him some questions specifically about his ties to the Wiccan religion. When asked who else he practices with, Donald says, no one. He's like, I'm not a part of any coven or anything like that. And when they accuse him of, like, hey, well, if you murdered your family and this was part of some ritual, is there, like, a reason you would have covered the bodies or anything? And Donald's like, I have no idea what you're talking about. There's no ritual that would say to do that.
- [25:25]
B
Okay, that's smart answer.
- [25:26]
A
He Just kind of suggests that the police know nothing about paganism and they're just throwing things at the wall to see if Donald will come clean about the murders, but he doesn't. He maintains his innocence and says he has nothing to do with it. And with no confession, no concrete evidence, Donald is released later that morning. But police are far from done with this theory. Three days later, on August 4th, the county sheriff, David Morgan, holds a press conference about the triple homicide. And he openly says in front of cameras that the police truly believe this was a ritualistic killing tied to the blue moon.
- [26:06]
B
Wow.
- [26:07]
A
He then says with sheer confidence, quote, it is witchcraft. I'll say that right now.
- [26:13]
B
That's pretty gutsy to say. I don't know if that's extremely smart, but I guess we'll see where this goes.
- [26:22]
A
It kind of shows that they have their eyes, like, set. So this definitely isn't just like some theory they were trying to use to get a confession out of Donald. They really believe that Donald did this and this was his motivation for killing his family. The sheriff adds the, quote, method of the murder, blunt force traumas, slit throats, positions of bodies, and then our person of interest has some ties to a faith or religion that is indicative of that. And obviously, with this statement, in 2015, the press goes wild. Publications all over the country start printing headlines like Witchcraft Suspected in Savage Murder of Family and Florida Triple Murder tied to Witchcraft. But Donald is not the only practicing Wiccan in Florida. There are a lot of people who see these statements and think, okay, just because the son believes, like, in this religion does not make them a murderer. One practitioner named Peg Aloy said, quote, I'm fairly certain there is nothing in any book on Wicca that has ever been published on planet Earth that describes body positions consistent with ritual murder and then black magic. And then Dr. Gwendolyn Reese, who was a specialist in contemporary paganism at American University, found the entire thing absurd. She said that if the police had done even the slightest bit of research, they would see this crime is not connected to a religion. Instead, this is just an outright prejudice against a subculture the police know nothing about. Others confirmed that ritual murder is not even a part of this religion at all. In fact, it goes against the ethical principles of Wicca. So basically, you have all these people who also practice and are clapping back saying, how dare you blame a religion for such a horrific slaying? It has nothing to do with us. Like, just, why are you even bringing this up? What's even worse is this obviously completely distracts from the investigation itself. But I also want to clarify. None of this means Donald's innocent either. This just means that maybe they have the wrong motive for the wrong reasons. He is still the last person to have seen the three victims before they died. The family still says that Von Seal and her son had their issues with Donald over the years. And there were witnesses who saw Donald driving away from the house that night with the headlights of his car off, even though it was dark. So while they might have the motive wrong, it doesn't mean they have the wrong guy. They just needed more concrete evidence to prove this motive and their case. The issue is Donald's DNA is already all over the crime scene. He was having dinner at that house every week. He was going over there often. What's concerning is when his DNA turns up in places it really shouldn't have been. Like the inside of Richard's belt buckle. Oh, and on Richard's checkbook.
- [29:34]
B
Okay.
- [29:36]
A
This was important because detectives had asked Donald if he had ever touched any of Richard's belongings and he said no. Sure enough, though, Donald's DNA was all over Richard's checkbook. Though his reason for that was, well, I might have just like picked it up and moved it when I was like cleaning the kitchen table or something, you know, Fair enough. But there was another detail that didn't look great for Donald. In the trash can outside of the house. Like I said, detectives had found a bunch of bloody towels that appeared to be used to clean up the crime scene. And then a few cigarette butts. Now, when they ran those for DNA, it was Donald's, which means Donald is likely the one who used those towels, cleaned up the crime scene, and then had a cigarette.
- [30:19]
B
Yeah, I'm not sure how you explain that one or get, get out of that one.
- [30:23]
A
Right.
- [30:23]
B
Yeah.
- [30:23]
A
Of course, it takes investigators a little bit of time to get all of this DNA back. And ironically, it is just a few days before Halloween when Donald is finally arrested for the crime. On October 27, 2015, police put 58 year old Donald in handcuffs and charged him with three counts of first degree murder with a weapon. Unfortunately, it would be another four years till the case went to trial. And I think the big question people who were following this case had was, is the prosecution going to go to trial and use the religion as the motive? Like, are they gonna stick to the story the police were thinking, or are they gonna, like, go a completely different route?
- [31:08]
B
Yeah, I feel like they need to come up with a different route because I feel like if they stick to. To all of that. It's just not going to go well. People are going to see it as, I don't know, disrespectful or whatever, just weird. Whatever you want to call it. I just don't think it's going to go anywhere.
- [31:23]
A
Again, things are more nuanced than we think.
- [31:26]
B
Yeah.
- [31:30]
A
When did making plans get this complicated? It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the secure messaging app that brings the whole group together. Use polls to settle dinner plans. Send event invites and pin messages so no one forgets mom's 60th. And never miss a meme or milestone. All protected with end to end encryption. It's time for WhatsApp message privately with everyone. Learn more@WhatsApp.com this episode is brought to you by White Claw Surge. Nice choice hitting up this podcast. No surprises. You're all about diving into tastes everyone in the room can enjoy. Just like White Claw Surge, it's for celebrating those moments when connections have been made and the night's just begun. With bold flavors and 8% alcohol by volume. Unleash the night. Unleash White Claw Surge. Please drink responsibly. Hard seltzer with flavors, 8% alcohol by volume. White Cloth Seltzer Works, Chicago, Illinois. So all this time behind bars for years really ends up helping the prosecution's case against Donald, though. Because as the trial began to approach, investigators got a letter from one of Donald's fellow inmates. Again, just take it with a grain of salt. He said Donald had told him some things that might be useful to their case. This inmate's name was Marlon Purifoy, and he said Donald had confessed to him that he had killed his family. He also said that a lot of other inmates were kind of a bit scared of Donald because he told them he was a practicing witch. But that wasn't the reason why he killed his mother and siblings. The truth was, at least this is what the inmate said. He told him he had been planning these deaths for years. Allegedly, Donald had told Marlon that one of the brothers had molested Donald's son when he was just three years old. And after his mother refused to take his side, Donald had held a real grudge against them. Okay, but the tipping point was when Von Seal left Donald out of her will. Her assets that were worth $900,000.
- [33:32]
B
I thought you were gonna say, like, $900 million. I was like, oh, man, that have been cool.
- [33:40]
A
But the only way Donald would ever get any of this is if both his mother and the sons slash his Half brothers all died, it would then go to him.
- [33:52]
B
I just find it so weird because it doesn't seem worth it to me to kill for a couple hundred thousand dollars. You know what I'm saying?
- [34:00]
A
I mean, 900,000 all.
- [34:02]
B
I mean, that's if he gets all of it. And then taxes. And it's just. I just find it so interesting because it's like, oh, say you kill for $200,000. Like, okay, you can go buy an apartment, and then it's all gone. What I'm saying, like, it just seems crazy to me.
- [34:19]
A
I definitely think if the stories are true and you add in the trauma, the betrayal trauma, and then the money, I think we've seen worse motives. Like, I think that we've seen motives that are a little bit more.
- [34:34]
B
I think what I'm trying to say is I ain't killing for less than a hundred million dollars.
- [34:37]
A
Okay.
- [34:38]
B
I'm going big.
- [34:39]
A
We're not killing at all.
- [34:40]
B
I'm not. I'm just saying, like, hypothetically, if there was a really bad person and I was a superhero or something. Anyways. Also, what I'm trying to say is it all comes down to money. Like I said earlier, it's always money.
- [34:53]
A
Law enforcement or government listening to this. I have no participation in these.
- [34:58]
B
No, they didn't understand hypotheticals. No, they're not listening. They didn't know what I meant by killing. Killing insects in the house.
- [35:06]
A
Okay, right, right. For 100 million.
- [35:08]
B
For 100 million.
- [35:10]
A
Then, in another surprising twist, Marlon also told investigators that Donald wasn't sure whether to go through with the plan or not. So he had consulted a Ouija board, gave him the permission he was looking for to execute his plan. Now, here's the thing. Marlon is in prison for 30 years for attempted murder. He's obviously looking to strike a deal to get out early. So telling police this information benefits him. However, he knows things about the case that he really couldn't have guessed. He says that Donald told him he cut off his mother's pinky finger to get her to tell him the code to their safe.
- [35:49]
B
Oh, my gosh. That's diabolical coming from a son or a kid.
- [35:55]
A
So the inmate says this, and Von Seal was missing her pinky finger.
- [36:01]
B
Yeah.
- [36:01]
A
When the bodies were found. So, like, it's like someone had to tell him that. So it kind of is backing the inmate story. Donald also told him he usually brought over his dog when he would go visit, but that night, he didn't, which was also true. And the mention of the Ouija Board is interesting because, like I said, they did find one in Donald's home. So Marlon's story seems pretty strong for, like, inmate confessions, which meant now the prosecution had their star witness. And the motive really isn't the religion. Shockingly, though, by the time the case actually reached the courtroom, like I said, there is no mention of wicca or paganism as a contributing factor. So this was solely what the police announced. And then when they get to trial, the state is like, yeah, that has nothing to do with this murder, which.
- [36:56]
B
That's kind of embarrassing.
- [36:58]
A
Yeah. I just don't know why you would confidently.
- [37:00]
B
Yeah, I don't know.
- [37:01]
A
How does anyone ever really know a motive until you get to trial?
- [37:04]
B
That's crazy. Out of all things being like witchcraft.
- [37:08]
A
We found a ouija board. It was definitely.
- [37:09]
B
Yeah, it was 100% witchcraft.
- [37:11]
A
Right. So when Donald's trial finally kicked off in January of 2020, he did not take the stand. And the defense holds pretty firm on the fact that there actually isn't much evidence to implicate Donald in the crime other than his DNA at the home, which he admitted to being there for dinner. They argue none of his blood was found at the house. They never found the gun or a murder weapon. The police hadn't even really looked into other suspects before arresting him. They mentioned how the police refused to give him a polygraph test because they were afraid he would pass it. And no real eyewitnesses to the crime other than the neighbors who said, yeah, we saw him drive away, which he's already admitted to. His lights were off. That was the only weird thing. But I want to mention that this eyewitness account from the neighbor actually was a major point of contention, because, remember, the bodies were discovered on Friday, July 31. Investigators believe the murders were committed three days earlier, on July 28. This is the same day Donald was seen leaving the neighborhood. But the defense hired a medical expert who said, this is not accurate. That based on the body heat and level of decomposition that was recorded when the family was found, it was more likely that they were actually killed the following day. So the next day, after he had gone to dinner, they say, we think it happened on. Well, this expert testifies it happened on Wednesday, July 29. This is long after Donald left. It's also important to note this expert was a big deal. Even the prosecution was worried about him because they said he'd been doing this for a long time. He really did know what he was talking about. The evidence in that regard did point to the murders happening the following day. But this is hard because Richard was found dead in the same clothes he was seen wearing at work on the 28th. So what did he do? Wake up and put the same exact outfit on and then get murdered in it? There is video footage of him wearing those clothes. It's just. Unless he's being held hostage. But there were other issues with the prosecution side. The state medical examiner who had first looked at the case had since resigned after he was accused of misusing state money, which isn't a good look at trial. The crime scene technician who collected DNA at the scene had also been fired because they were prosecuted for stealing drugs.
- [39:32]
B
What is going on?
- [39:33]
A
Okay, so it's just not looking good like the freak. Even though, like it kind of is pointing to him. Like I will say, circumstantial evidence really is pointing to him. The state's case is just falling apart. But there were some details that felt undeniable. Like I said, Marlin's statements, the inmate statements really do hold up in court. Because he knew things he shouldn't have known. That was never publicized. The DNA on Richard's checkbook and Donald's used cigarette butts on top of bloody towels. This appears to be enough for the jury. After three weeks of testimony, they returned a verdict. 63 year old Donald was found guilty of three counts of first degree murder. He was sentenced to three consecutive life terms in prison, but was spared from the death penalty. And ultimately it was proved witchcraft never played a role at all. Which is why this story shows. It is easy to point fingers at something that you don't really understand. To just blame the strange and the unfamiliar. But belief isn't dangerous. People are. And it's not what someone believes that defines them. It's what they do with it and then how other people perceive it. And that is the case of John, Richard and Monsieur Smith.
- [40:54]
B
Interesting, because. I don't know, I mean, I guess there's enough evidence, but I was like, who else could it have been?
- [41:02]
A
I and the inmate knowing about the.
- [41:03]
B
PC, who else could it have been? There was nobody else there. He was the last one to see them.
- [41:09]
A
Them wearing the same clothes. Yeah.
- [41:12]
B
Yeah. I mean, like I. I probably, if I was on the jury, I probably would have.
- [41:16]
A
The cigarette butts on top of bloody towels. How did those get there?
- [41:19]
B
Yeah. No, that didn't just happen. Yep. All right. Wow. That's insane. That's. Yeah, I think so. I think I'm. I think I'm convinced enough.
- [41:27]
A
I chose this particular case because it did have the wiccan element for Halloween. As we know, witches are a huge part. But I also did want to show that, like, just because a religion has a spooky outlook doesn't mean that we should immediately jump to they're the number one murder suspect because of it. Sometimes things are just spooky.
- [41:49]
B
True.
- [41:50]
A
All right, you guys, that is our episode, and we will see you next time with another one. I love it.
- [41:55]
B
I hate it.
- [41:56]
A
Goodbye.