314. The Trap She Never Saw Coming - The Murder of Bonnie Woodward

Summary

Podcast Summary: Murder With My Husband

Episode 314: The Trap She Never Saw Coming – The Murder of Bonnie Woodward
Date: March 30, 2026
Hosts: Peyton Moreland & Garrett Moreland

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the 2010 disappearance and murder of Bonnie Woodward in Alton, Illinois. Peyton and Garrett unravel a chilling web involving a runaway teen, a manipulative narrative of abuse, and an obsessed "rescuer" whose actions would end a life and devastate a family. The episode probes the complexities of motive, manipulation, and the impact on those left behind.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Setting the Scene: Bonnie’s Life and Family (08:19 - 14:36)

• Bonnie Woodward, 47, was a hardworking nursing home aide, breast cancer survivor, and the loving matriarch of a blended family, including her biological children, adopted stepchildren Heather (17) and Aaron (with disabilities), and her live-in boyfriend Gary.
• Bonnie was known for her nurturing personality—her home was the family gathering place, and she extended herself both at home and at work.

"She put on a brave face. She continued to go to work to care for her patients."
— Peyton (12:39)

• Family struggles: Bonnie’s adopted stepdaughter Heather repeatedly ran away. Tensions heightened in June 2010 as Heather left for a teacher’s house and failed to return, deeply worrying Bonnie.

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Bonnie’s Disappearance (14:36 - 17:50)

• Bonnie left work as usual but failed to return home. Her car was left in the parking lot with windows down, doors unlocked, and her paycheck still inside.

• No signs of struggle or electronic activity were found, and crucially, there was no security footage from the lot.

• Eyewitnesses:
  Co-workers reported Bonnie was visibly upset during her last work meeting. They saw her in the parking lot talking to an unknown middle-aged man by a silver sedan—possibly a Chevy Malibu. Several stated she got into this car willingly.

"Other co-workers say... we actually saw her willingly get into his car, and the two of them drove away."
— Peyton (16:56)

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Initial Investigation & False Leads (19:41 - 22:06)

• Police suspicion: Started with Bonnie’s boyfriend Gary (cleared by polygraph, didn’t fit eyewitness description) and ex-boyfriend Chester McAdams (alibi and looks did not match).

“The main suspects are cleared…”
— Garrett (22:04)

• Investigators noticed a disturbing pattern: two household members missing in quick succession—Bonnie and her stepdaughter Heather.

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Heather’s Return & Odd Behavior (25:22 - 32:12)

• Eight days after Bonnie’s disappearance, Heather turned herself in at the library on her 18th birthday.
• Heather acted much younger than her age—clutching a teddy bear and requesting a nap and “her daddy.”

“During this interview, she's holding a teddy bear... acting more like a little girl.”
— Peyton (26:44)

• Shifting stories: Heather initially cited abuse at home when speaking to teachers, but in police interviews, only mentioned chores and babysitting.
• She implicated the Carroll family (Roger, Monica, and son Nathan), with whom she'd been hiding out, suggesting they “didn’t like” her mother and possibly had a hand in Bonnie’s disappearance.

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The Carroll Family Comes Under Scrutiny (32:12 - 38:45)

• Roger Carroll matched the description of the man in the parking lot. The Carrolls had harbored Heather, even taking her to a lake house days before Bonnie’s disappearance.
• Heather reveals: On the day Bonnie vanished, Roger and son Nathan left the lake house early, suggesting possible premeditation.
• Police found Roger’s fingerprints on Bonnie’s truck but struggled to connect Bonnie physically to the Carrolls’ car or property.

“Guess whose prints are on the truck that was left in the parking lot at work.”
— Peyton (35:11)
“Yeah... the father, Roger Carroll.”
— Garrett (35:14)

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The Case Goes Cold — Then Blows Open (40:06 - 44:33, 45:16 - 47:55)

• Years pass; the case stalls.
  In 2018, Monica and Roger’s marriage implodes in violence. Roger assaults Monica, confessing “I have killed for you.”

“He tells her... 'I have killed for you.'”
— Peyton (41:10)

• With Monica now willing to talk, she reveals Roger’s fixation on Bonnie’s life and schedule before the murder.
• Police arrest Roger and, through a grand jury, strike a deal for immunity with Nathan, who had been a teen during the events.

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Nathan’s Revelation and Forensic Breakthrough (44:33 - 47:55)

• Nathan testifies:
  Roger recruited him to drive to Bonnie’s workplace, lured Bonnie under the pretense of Heather, and fatally shot her before burning her body on the family property. Nathan was forced to help destroy evidence.
• Forensics:
  Nathan led police to the burn site. 27 fragments of human bone were found—25 matching Bonnie’s DNA. Shell casings from a 9mm revolver linked the crime to Roger.

“Nathan claims he would come outside every couple hours to stoke the fire and make sure nothing was left of her body.”
— Peyton (46:21)

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Motive and Psychological Dynamics (48:01 - 54:55)

• Motive remains unclear.
  While Roger cited “protecting” Heather from purported abuse, no evidence of this was found. Both hosts probe Heather’s role—was she a manipulator, or was Roger simply eager to play hero and commit violence?

“None of it makes sense. She also lied to her teacher... I just, it's also hard to bring it up because I know she was a minor during this...”
— Garrett (53:55)

• Monica testified about seeing the fire, Roger’s preoccupation with Bonnie, and the strange “walk” between Roger and Heather the day before the murder—hinting at possible foreknowledge or manipulation.

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The Verdict & Aftermath (50:31 - 55:25)

• Roger Carroll was convicted of first-degree murder in March 2020; sentenced to 40 years, plus 25 more for gun enhancement.
• Impact statements:
  Bonnie’s son’s moving words underscore the family’s pain and the loss of closure due to the destruction of her remains:

“Roger Carroll doesn't deserve to spend one more day enjoying the freedom I defended while in the army.”
— Bonnie’s son (51:46)

• Alleged involvement:
  Monica and Heather were never prosecuted, having cooperated with authorities. The ultimate “why” behind Roger’s actions remains elusive, amplifying the tragedy.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “We have the answers of what happened... but the thing we don't have is, like, the main thing people listen to true crime for, which is why.”
  — Peyton (52:31)
• “It just seems a little sus to me.”
  — Garrett (49:19)
• “People are nuts, and weird stuff happened. So maybe he did just want to kill somebody.”
  — Garrett (54:25)
• “Wanted to kill someone. So when Heather came in and he felt like, oh, I can kill someone, which I've wanted to do, but also claim myself to be the hero and protecting everyone, that's probably what happened.”
  — Peyton (54:57)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 08:19 — Introduction to Bonnie Woodward and her family dynamics
• 14:36 — The day Bonnie disappeared; suspicious circumstances
• 19:41 — Police investigation: examining Bonnie’s close relationships
• 25:22 — Heather reappears and acts unusually during questioning
• 32:12 — The Carroll family enters the investigation
• 35:11 — Roger Carroll’s fingerprints found on Bonnie’s truck
• 40:06 — The case goes cold, then Monica’s confession in 2018 reignites it
• 44:33 — Nathan Carroll’s court testimony: details of the crime
• 47:02 — Forensic discovery of Bonnie’s remains
• 50:31 — Roger Carroll's conviction and sentencing
• 52:31 — Hosts discuss the elusive motive and lingering questions

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Episode Tone & Final Thoughts

Peyton brings empathy and narrative clarity, while Garrett injects skepticism and emotional candor, especially around the manipulation and lack of motive. The episode emphasizes the pain of unsatisfying answers in true crime and the catastrophic consequences for families involved in senseless acts of violence.

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Engage with Listeners:
Peyton and Garrett encourage reflections from listeners—how far would you go to save a loved one, and how do you process a case where the “why” is beyond comprehension?

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End of Summary

Transcript

[Peyton Moreland]

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[Garrett Moreland]

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[Peyton Moreland]

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[Peyton Moreland]

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[Peyton Moreland]

You're listening to an ONO Media podcast. Hey everyone, welcome back to the podcast. This is Murder with My Husband. I'm Peyton Moreland.

[Garrett Moreland]

And I'm Garrett Moreland.

[Peyton Moreland]

And he's the husband.

[Garrett Moreland]

And I'm the husband. Happy Monday. Thank you for being here. Thank you for listening. Thank you for watching. I guess that's it, right? Listening, watching. That's all we got. We don't really have any announcements this week, so I think I'm gonna get right into my 10 seconds. And if you want to skip it, you can skip it. It won't be too long. But we had to take Daisy to the vet and it was pretty scary and we thought she was dying. She's alive and she's well and we're still trying to figure out what's going on. So we need to make a vet appointment to, I don't know, like, dig further, further into what's happening with her. A quick little summary is that I was in the room, Daisy came running in and she was. What we now figured out is like a form of inward sneezing. Like she was inward sneezing, but it sounded like she was gasping for air. We thought she was choking on something. We weren't sure what was happening. We took her to the vet and it was kind of getting worse and

[Peyton Moreland]

worse, you know, we took her to the ER.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, sorry. We took her to the 24 hour ER. It was late at night. We didn't get home till like 1am but she was doing things she's never done before. She was like pawing at her face, pawing at her ears. She was doing the inward sneezing. I would. I don't even know how to mimic it. It was crazy.

[Peyton Moreland]

And she was in distress.

[Garrett Moreland]

Complete. She was freaking out. Complete.

[Peyton Moreland]

Her whole body was shaking. I think she might have been having an allergic reaction to something. At first we thought she was choking because. Yeah, it's like. It's like a.

[Garrett Moreland]

It's like.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah. Over and over again.

[Garrett Moreland]

Don't replay that.

[Peyton Moreland]

Which I guess it is a form of them trying to like clear their airways.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, it was. We took her to the er. We had them do a bunch of different tests. They didn't. They honestly didn't know what was going on either, which didn't make me feel great. Now that I look back, I'm like, how did.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah, they were kind of just like. Well, she's. She's breathing now.

[Garrett Moreland]

I'm like, okay, but I'm being. So am I. But.

[Peyton Moreland]

But then we took her home and then the next night it happened.

[Garrett Moreland]

Happened again. No, happened again at 8pm and then again at 3am the same exact thing.

[Peyton Moreland]

Like, woke us up in a panic,

[Garrett Moreland]

but this time she was super itchy.

[Peyton Moreland]

And this is what's so sad is like, it's not like she's just doing this. Like, she's so clearly in distress. She's waking us up.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah.

[Peyton Moreland]

She isn't crying.

[Garrett Moreland]

She doesn't do this normally. Like, this isn't something she. She wouldn't just wake us up and cry.

[Peyton Moreland]

And when she came, she was sitting in the living room alone. And when she came running into Garrett the first time, she had her tail

[Garrett Moreland]

in between her legs and she was freaking out.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah, it's more the way she's acting. That's.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah. And then when it happened again, like, she was super itchy this time, she was clearly uncomfortable, not happy. It took about eight. It took about two hours for it to go away. And then when it happened again at 3am, it took about 30 minutes, and then it hasn't happened since. So it happened for two days, hasn't happened again. The only thing we can assume is it was an allergic reaction. And, yeah, she's okay right now. Anyways, Daisy's alive. We're figuring it out. Don't want to ramble too much, but it was pretty scary. So that's what I got for my 10 seconds. Still have my hair. I haven't buzzed it yet. Right. It's crazy. I got this hair transplant because I like my hair a lot, and I was losing it really fast, and it made a huge difference. It's crazy. For those who don't know, I got a hair transplant. For those who might be new to the podcast, my hairline's crisp, even amazing. I recommend it. If you want to get a hair transplant, go for it. Don't see why not.

[Peyton Moreland]

But.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, but now I'm at the point where, like, I have a lot of hair and I want to buzz it just because it's getting hot.

[Peyton Moreland]

Also, if you're watching. That's his natural. His hair naturally goes like that.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, my natural, the prop. My hair naturally just puffs up like this, too. It's crazy sometimes.

[Peyton Moreland]

Like, we've had a couple comments of people being like, why is Garrett doing his hair like that? That's how he no wakes up. That's how his hair naturally sits. He has no product in it.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, I get.

[Peyton Moreland]

You look like Einstein.

[Garrett Moreland]

I literally get out of bed and my hair look. My hair just looks like this. I don't know. I don't know. What can I do? Anyways, anyway, so I might buzz it. I don't know. I just need a. I just need it shorter for a second, and I want to see how good my hairline looks, you know?

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah.

[Garrett Moreland]

Well, I got a hair transplant. That's what I'm rambling about today. We have a case for you guys, so we're going to hop right into today's case.

[Peyton Moreland]

Our sources for this episode are abc news.go.com, the telegraph.com good morning america.com ksdk.com my journal courier.com box2now.com medium.com thecinemaholic.com union bulletin.com Belleville news democrat pod wave co abc.com and il courts audio we say that we would do anything for the ones that we love, whether that's a pet, a partner, a child. Now, luckily, most of us have never had to test the limits of what that really means. But when you're in a situation where someone or something you love is in danger, I think most of us would find that we're capable of a lot more than we ever thought possible. Because there's just something instinctual, even primal inside each of us, something that takes over when a loved one is threatened. So today I want you to ask yourself, how far would you go to save a loved one that might be in danger? Would you walk straight into the lion's den, into the hands of another predator? And would you be willing to risk your own life to save someone that you love?

[Garrett Moreland]

I it's a good question because I feel like, I feel like I do some crazy shiz. I feel like I'd be nuts, you know, like John Wick, like I'd be nuts. But maybe not. I don't know. Anyways, I don't know. Yeah, let us know what you were doing on Instagram or somewhere.

[Peyton Moreland]

Today I want to take you to a little town located on the Mississippi and Illinois River, A place with a lot of history and a vibrant social scene called Alton, Illinois. And it is here in 2010 that a 47 year old grandmother named Bonnie Woodward is quietly living out her life. Now, Bonnie's had quite this story so far to the year 2010. She has two grown children from her first marriage, Joseph and Jennifer. And Jennifer actually still lives with Bonnie with her two little girls. Bonnie is also the mom to two step kids from her third marriage and those step kids are 17 year old Heather and her brother Aaron, who is living with a disability. And plus Bonnie herself is a breast cancer survivor. So just to recap, it is 2010, 47 year old Bonnie is living in Illinois and she has a lot of people living in her home with her, her daughter Jennifer and her two little kids, and then also her two stepchildren, 17 year old Heather and her brother Aaron. Bonnie is pretty used to putting her own needs aside and being the caretaker because she came from a family of nine siblings. So she always knew what it meant to rely on herself. But that also taught Bonnie how to stand out those who knew her Said she had a huge larger than life personality, that her house was the place the extended family always congregated, that she loved to host, she loved to nurture. Which makes even more sense when you hear what Bonnie did for a living. She had worked for the past 27 years as an aide at a nursing home in town. So both her professional and her personal life was, was all about taking care of other people. And luckily she did have one person that she could lean on in times of need at this point and that was her live in boyfriend, Gary Wilmeth, which was important because things weren't all smooth sailing in their pretty packed home. So this sort of pieced together family had been struggling with how to manage the 17 year old who lived with them. Heather. See Heather's dad, this is Bonnie's third husband, had passed away suddenly back in July of 2000 when Heather was just 8 years old. So by that point Heather wasn't in touch with her biological mother. So for most of her life Bonnie had played that role and she actually adopted Heather and her brother Aaron not long after their father, her third husband, passed away. But those who knew the family said Bonnie treated Aaron and Heather no different than her own two kids. She worked hard to give them the same opportunities, the same life and she really dedicated herself to taking care of Aaron who as I mentioned was living with a disability. But like any teenager, Heather at 17 had been unhappy living in this packed house for some time. She had run away from home on a couple of occasions. She always came back, at least until around June 10, 2010. It was this time, after another argument, that Heather stormed out of Bonnie's house and said she was going to stay with a teacher, a woman named Christine scheffel. And by June 25, Heather still had not come home. So she left on June 10. Fifteen days later, she still had not come home. And this was very clearly wearing on Bonnie. Still she put on a brave face. She continued to go to work to care for her patients. And then that Friday afternoon on the 25th, Bonnie had a staff meeting from 2 to 3pm Then she was planning to leave right after to head home for the weekend. So she punched out around 3pm that day and co workers saw her go to the parking lot to her red Chevy Avalanche. Now usually from there Bonnie was home around 3:30. But that day the clock kept ticking again. 17 year old Heather has run away. She's been gone for 15 days. Bonnie is at work and in the time from getting in her car to being home by 3:30, more and more time is passing and she's not showing up. And so her boyfriend, who lives at the house, Gary, is starting to get worried. And by 4pm he begins trying Bonnie's cell phone. But his calls are going right to voicemail, which is more than enough to set off alarm bells for Gary, because not only is Bonnie the kind of person who does everything on a schedule, since she has Aaron, she would absolutely let someone know if she was running late or wasn't going to be able to make it home to take care of him. That alone is enough to say that this just random disappearing is very uncharacteristic of her. So the rest of the day and into the night, Gary is calling around to people to ask if anyone has seen Bonnie. And when she still isn't home the following morning, Gary calls work to see if she showed up for her shift. Her co workers are like, no, she's not here. We haven't heard from her. But also her car, her red car is still in the parking lot at work. So this is when Gary goes to the police to report Bonnie missing. Which means from walking out of work to getting into her car, she somehow disappeared. She somehow disappeared.

[Garrett Moreland]

Oh, my gosh.

[Peyton Moreland]

Now, when police show up to Bonnie's workplace on June 26, they obviously immediately search her car and find a few strange things. For starters, it hasn't been moved from its parking spot that it was initially parked in yesterday. But now the windows are rolled down and the car is unlocked. So it's almost like Bonnie or someone got in and back out after she left work. So someone has been in this car since she walked out of work. So to the family, this feels like a bad sign, because if Bonnie had just run away or needed a break, there's no way she's just gonna leave her truck behind. She loved the car and had worked hard to buy it. She wasn't just gonna leave it. But after looking closer at the truck, police don't find anything suspicious. There is no damage to the vehicle. There's no evidence of a struggle having occurred inside. However, they do notice her paycheck is still sitting on the seat. This is the one that she had received the day before. And her family said the first thing Bonnie always did when she got her paycheck was just take it right to the bank and deposit it. Yet there it is. So this is when the police decide to look a little closer at Bonnie's digital footprint, and they find there has been no online activity from her. There's no bank withdrawals or Deposits. No use of her cell phone since the day before. And unfortunately, there's also no security footage of the parking lot to show where Bonnie might have gone after she walked out of work. But luckily, there are a few eyewitnesses that spotted something interesting. When police are talking to Bonnie's co workers. One of them, a woman named Wanda Bosley, says she saw Bonnie during her 2pm meeting. And to her, something about Bonnie was definitely off. She said she wasn't acting like her usual upbeat self. She was quiet, internalizing. Something was clearly bothering her. But then Wanda also went to the parking lot around the same time Bonnie did. And she said when she was in the parking lot, she saw Bonnie standing behind her red truck. Talking with someone was a guy maybe in his 40s, one she'd never seen before. She says he was maybe five eight or five nine. He was white. He had a medium build with salt and pepper hair. Wanda wasn't the only one who saw this guy lurking in the parking lot, though. Other co workers said, actually I saw a man in a silver sedan, like a Chevy Malibu, waiting in the parking lot during the staff meeting. A few of them said they also saw Bonnie and him talking afterwards. And then other co workers say, no, we didn't only see her talking to this guy. We actually saw her willingly get into his car and the two of them drove away.

[Garrett Moreland]

I feel like I used to trust eyewitnesses a lot. Now I don't. You know what I'm saying?

[Peyton Moreland]

I mean, they aren't the most reliable.

[Garrett Moreland]

Like we've come to realize. Eyewitnesses are great, but they mess up a lot.

[Peyton Moreland]

I do think there are a lot of eyewitnesses in this case.

[Garrett Moreland]

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[Peyton Moreland]

Not smart.

[Garrett Moreland]

Don't do that. Do not do that.

[Peyton Moreland]

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[Peyton Moreland]

So naturally, the first place investigators start is with those close to Bonnie, which in this case happens to be her boyfriend, Gary. They need to figure out who's this mysterious guy, what was going on in Bonnie's life, how, why would she disappear the two, Gary and Bonnie have been in a relationship on and off for about seven years by this point. And they also learn that Gary has a bit of a rap sheet. He's a convicted felon. He's had some domestic issues in the past. But Gary says Bonnie knew all about his checkered history. It didn't bother her. The two were on good terms. So the police have him take a polygraph and he passes it with no problem. Plus, he obviously doesn't fit the description witnesses gave about the guy that Bonnie was last seen talking to in the parking lot. So they do move on from Gary pretty quickly. And eventually they start looking into Bonnie's exes, and they discover a former boyfriend named Chester McAdams. Now, Chester's father owns a 2009 Chevy Impala, which could be confused for a Malibu, which, according to eyewitnesses, is the car the mystery man was driving. So, okay, police are kind of leaning into this. They also discover he has his own criminal history. Apparently, Bonnie had seen Chester during one of those off periods with Gary, and at one point, the two guys had some heated exchanges, actually once or twice over Bonnie. So investigators start to think, is it possible that Chester was jealous that Bonnie had picked Gary and wanted Bonnie back in his life, so he kidnapped her. Maybe she even ran away with him willingly. So police look Chester up, and they find that he also doesn't match the description the eyewitnesses gave. Chester has a ponytail and a beard. The guy they described was Kind of clean cut. So police bring him in for questioning. He fully cooperates with them. He also says, I, okay, I don't have that car. That's my father's car, and I don't drive his car. Like, he would never let me borrow his car. So they check out his alibi and sure enough, his boss says he was at work during the time Bonnie disappeared. Which means now both Gary and Chester, her two, like, recent love interests.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, the main suspects are cleared of

[Peyton Moreland]

suspicion, but there's one thing that sets off alarm bells, which I've already informed you guys of, and it's the fact that Bonnie is not the only person who's technically missing from her household recently. They still have 17 year old heather who ran away from home, who is still mia. Now, Bonnie's family had actually filed a missing person's report to a different police station about a week earlier. Just saying, like, she said she ran away to her teacher's house. Like she willingly left, but we haven't seen her and now we're gonna file a report. And so when police respond to Bonnie's missing persons report, they're like, okay, what are the chances that not one but two people in the last week have been reported missing from the same, like, household? Yeah, a mom and her stepchild that she's adopted. So the police seem to think this isn't really a coincidence. The investigators on Bonnie's case start comparing notes with the investigators working Heather's case, and they find that as her family had said, Heather's last known location was at her teacher Christine Sheffield's home, which is why police then pay Christine a visit. So they've now almost merged these two investigations. They're looking for Bonnie, but now they're also interested in finding Heather. When they get there, they realize Heather is no longer there. Her teacher Christine says Heather stayed with her starting on the 10th, the night she ran away, but she actually left on the 17th, and she didn't know where the teenager was headed. Christine also tells the police the reason that she even helped Heather out, because, like, why would a teenager run away to a teacher's house? According to Christine, she tells police that according to Heather, she had been suffering a lot of abuse at home. Heather told Christine and other teachers that she would be slapped or thrown against a wall or woken up in the middle of the night to do chores. Heather apparently called Christine around the 10th to say she was being kicked out of her house and had nowhere else to go. But around the 16th, Bonnie called Christine and said, hey. Heather said she was going to your house and she needs to come home. So Bonnie had talked to the teacher, and then the teacher, Christine, told Heather, hey, you need to go home. Like, your mom called, you need to go home.

[Garrett Moreland]

But it's just kind of weird that both the mom and daughter are missing. Like, it's obviously tied to someone that knows them. Why are you looking at me like that?

[Peyton Moreland]

I'm not. I'm not looking at you like anything.

[Garrett Moreland]

Okay, keep going.

[Peyton Moreland]

Apparently, when Christine told Heather that she spent the night crying. And then when Christine left to do something the next morning on the 17th, she returned to find that Heather had just left her house. And Christine assumed, okay, she just went back to Bonnie's because that's what I told her to do the night before. But now we know she didn't go back to Bonnie's and no one knows where she is. That was when Bonnie filed a missing persons report. Heather had been missing ever since. And then Bonnie disappears.

[Garrett Moreland]

What the freak?

[Peyton Moreland]

Okay, so now Bonnie's disappeared. This is where police have caught up to in the investigation. But then, eight days after Bonnie's disappearance, there is a wild turn in this case. On July 3, 2010, police get a phone call from a local library. They say they have a woman there who says her name is Heather Woodward and she'd been reported missing.

[Garrett Moreland]

What?

[Peyton Moreland]

So police drive to the library.

[Garrett Moreland]

I'm so confused.

[Peyton Moreland]

Pick her up, bring her into the station for questioning. There's nothing clearly visible on Heather that would be of concern. She doesn't look bruised or injured or even unkempt for that matter. She just turned herself in after being missing. And when officers are like, hey, what's your birthday? She's like, it's today. I'm 18. Which is why she claims she finally came forward to put this missing person's case to rest. Because now she legally doesn't have to go back to Bonnie's house if she doesn't want to. She's 18. She's an adult. Okay, but she doesn't want there to be a missing persons case on her. So she's turned herself in, said, hey, I'm fine. I'm good. Take me off the list.

[Garrett Moreland]

Okay.

[Peyton Moreland]

But I do have to say her behavior is a little weird in this interview. She's not really acting like an 18 year old.

[Garrett Moreland]

Do 18s ever? Oh, wait, are you saying older or younger?

[Peyton Moreland]

Younger. Because hear me out. During this interview, she's holding a teddy bear, like, clutching it, and she's acting more like a little girl, like the thing she's Saying, quote, like, these stupid, small, claustrophobic rooms. I'm tired. I'm ready for my nap. I want my daddy.

[Garrett Moreland]

Does she look like an 18 year old in the interview?

[Peyton Moreland]

Yes. Yes. And so police are a little weird because she's coming in, being like, I'm 18, I don't need to go home. But then she's also acting really young, like, you know, in an odd way.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, yeah.

[Peyton Moreland]

And so this is when they're like, yeah, Heather, okay, Like, you don't have to go home. Technically, you're 18. But we need to talk to you about Bonnie, because she's been like, she's missing. No one knows where she is, and we need to know if you know where your stepmom is. But Heather doesn't act that alarmed that her stepmother's missing. She says she has no idea what happened to her, but she's just guessing that maybe Bonnie went into hiding to try and draw her out. She's like, maybe my mom wanted me to come home, and so she went missing in hopes that that would bring me forward to look for her. When. When police ask her about the situation at home with Bonnie, they're like, okay, well, you know, how was it at home with Bonnie? She doesn't mention anything about abuse. Like, she's told her teachers. She just tells police that she ran away from home because she was forced into doing free labor, like chores and babysitting, the types of things most teenagers do around the house. So now the police are realizing, okay, we think Heather lied to her teachers. We don't think she was abused. We think she's acting young on purpose. We think she's being manipulative. Like, police decide this. They're like, we think, okay, that this is all an act. Especially after they find a report from the Department of Children and Family Services that said that they had been called to Bonnie's home regarding Heather. In the past, they found claims of abuse to be totally unfounded. And eventually they ask her, okay, you left. You went to your teacher's house. Where did you go after that? Because it's still been a while. And Heather says, oh, I went to a friend's house, but she doesn't want to get them in trouble. She claims that the person she was with doesn't like Bonnie and that it's all her fault that Bonnie went missing. Now, finally, after a bit of more pressure from the police, Heather gives them a name. Well, actually three people's name. So this whole thing with Heather is just a mess. Police are like, what?

[Garrett Moreland]

I'm just confused is going on here. Yeah.

[Peyton Moreland]

So either way, Heather ends up telling police, here's three names you need to know. A 16 year old boy named Nathan Carroll and his parents, Monica and Roger. She says, this is where I was. They don't like my mom, and they probably had something to do with her disappearance.

[Garrett Moreland]

Why did she come back? Like, why. Why come back?

[Peyton Moreland]

I mean, you. And like, they're just like, this is so odd. She says she came back because she didn't want to have a missing persons report on her when she was fine.

[Garrett Moreland]

Okay.

[Peyton Moreland]

So obviously police are like, okay, Heather. And they begin looking into the 16 year old Nathan Carroll and his parents. They find that his parents, both Monica and Roger, were in the medical field. They went to the same church as the Woodwards. So they did. Somehow no Bonnie. They had no criminal history, no records of police involvement. And to detectives, it seemed like they were really just opening up their doors to Heather, who also told them stories about being abused at Bonnie's house. So police decide to pay Roger and Monica a little visit. They go to this giant 60 acre property near Jerseyville, Illinois. And when they get there, one of the first things they realize is Roger, the dad, sort of fits the description of the man the eyewitnesses say Bonnie was talking to in the parking lot the day she went missing. He's in his 40s, he has brownish gray hair, he's clean cut, he's about 5 foot 10, and he drives silver 2005 Interesting Chevrolet Malibu, which, it would

[Garrett Moreland]

also make sense why she got in his car willingly.

[Peyton Moreland]

Because if he's like, hey, your runaway daughter is at my house, then he.

[Garrett Moreland]

Then she would get in.

[Peyton Moreland]

So police are like, okay, we thought Heather was just a little cuckoo, but maybe she was onto something. Like she knew more than she was. She was just being weird about it. But.

[Garrett Moreland]

But it does sound like, not that she's cuckoo, but she's lied about all this abuse and stuff.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yes, but they were just confused about Heather. They were confused about Heather, but now

[Garrett Moreland]

they're like, they're understanding what's happening.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah. They're like, okay, wait, Heather clearly knew more. She was hinting that these people might know something. She clearly knew they knew something.

[Garrett Moreland]

Also, I'm just confused. How do. How does one of your friends and then their parents hate your mom enough to write hurt them? Like that also is. That's. That's pretty outlandish.

[Peyton Moreland]

Again, going back to the fact that police fairly quickly decided that Heather was pretty manipulative, that a lot of her behavior was manipulative that day, which could be.

[Garrett Moreland]

I'm curious to see where this goes. Like, if she told them, my mom's hurting me, my mom's a bad person, you know, like I. This will be interesting.

[Peyton Moreland]

So that day, police show up, they're like, hey, you know, we have Heather. She came in, she said she's been staying with you. She also said you might have something to do with her mom Bonnie's disappearance. We need to take your car in for evidence. And not only that, they sit down and talk to the Carols, and they're pretty cooperative with the investigation. But they say that while they were helping Heather escape what they thought was an abusive household, they claim they never actually met Bonnie. They just knew of Bonnie. Okay, so after this brief discussion with the Carols, the police do some more digging and they learn there is more to the story here. Heather didn't just stay with the family while she was waiting for her 18th birthday so she could cancel her missing persons report. She went on vacation with them. Four days before Bonnie's disappearance, this family plus Heather took a trip to Goreville, Illinois, to the Carrolls lake house. So the next day, police call Heather back in for round two. And they're like, hey, we found out that you didn't tell us, but you went like, you left the city and you went to their lake house for vacation. What happened there? And Heather offers something useful. She admits, yeah, I did go with them. But says on the day Bonnie disappeared, Nathan, the 16 year old, and Roger, his dad, left the lake house to go home early. They left at 7am that morning because, quote, Roger just wanted to go home and he wanted Nathan to go with him. Now police are starting to think, okay, did they go to this lake house, plan this out? And then Nathan and Roger go home and lure Bonnie away from the parking lot with a promise of delivering Heather. Did they ask for money? Was it a bribe? If Roger and Bonnie didn't really know each other, why would she have just gotten into his car? Unless she was promised she would finally be reunited with her missing daughter. Police decide to strategize using this. They think they're in the right direction. They're just really confused. Like they have all the puzzle pieces, they just don't know how to fit them together. They don't have enough evidence to suspect Roger or his family did anything to Bonnie. But they can arrest Roger and Monica for harboring a teenage runaway, which they do. And this allows them to get fingerprints and photographs, put them in a lineup. And meanwhile, Roger and Monica Both plead not guilty to the charges. Still, police start passing Roger and Monica's mug shots around Bonnie's workplace, but unfortunately, none of her co workers ID either of them as a match for who Bonnie was talking to. That.

[Garrett Moreland]

Oh, interesting.

[Peyton Moreland]

Okay, not concretely, at least. However, in September, the prints from Bonnie's truck come back from the parking lot. And guess whose prints are on the truck that was left in the parking lot at work.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah. I mean, yeah, the father, Roger Carroll.

[Peyton Moreland]

So it turns out he definitely knew Bonnie. And if he didn't know her, he touched her truck. But still, Roger denies it repeatedly. He's like, no, I have no idea how my fingerprints could have got there. I'm probably being framed.

[Garrett Moreland]

Oh.

[Peyton Moreland]

But now the police are more suspicious of him than ever. And he has to say this because, remember, they told police they'd never met Bonnie, they'd never seen her in person, they had never had any contact with him.

[Garrett Moreland]

To deny everything then.

[Peyton Moreland]

So when police are like, well, your fingerprints are on her truck, he then has to deny it or change his story. So police are suspicious, and they get a warrant to search the 60 acre property.

[Cassie or Danielle]

Take the exit, turn right into the drive through.

[Garrett Moreland]

Nope.

[Peyton Moreland]

I'm making dinner tonight.

[Cassie or Danielle]

You don't have time. Josh has practice.

[Peyton Moreland]

Oh, that's right.

[Cassie or Danielle]

I'll just get a salad and fries.

[Peyton Moreland]

No, just the salad.

[Cassie or Danielle]

But salad. Cancel fries.

[Garrett Moreland]

Salad only.

[Cassie or Danielle]

Fries.

[Peyton Moreland]

Salad, fries.

[Cassie or Danielle]

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[Peyton Moreland]

Hey, can I get the fries?

[Cassie or Danielle]

Salad.

[Peyton Moreland]

Sorry.

[Cassie or Danielle]

Learn more at. Join Mochi.com Mochi members have access to licensed physicians and nutritionists. Results may vary.

[Peyton Moreland]

My April 15 tax deadline is coming fast.

[Garrett Moreland]

Don't worry. You can hand off your taxes to a TurboTax expert today.

[Peyton Moreland]

That's a load off, right? With Intuit TurboTax, you can hand off your taxes to a dedicated full service expert. They work to get you every dollar you deserve. No chasing after anyone, no working around someone else's schedule, and no wondering if everything is done right. You can focus on what you do and let them handle your taxes for you.

[Garrett Moreland]

While your expert checks for every deduction, you'll see exactly where your return stands right on your phone. Do you know what's happening? And can focus on more important things like family and your favorite podcast. Because your TurboTax expert is on it and you're in the loop. Don't wait. Visit TurboTax.com and hand off your taxes to a TurboTax expert today. That's TurboTax.com now equipped with a huge

[Peyton Moreland]

team, including cadaver dogs and helicopters. Police execute that warrant that same September because, again, they're pretty sure they're on the right track. They find about 30 guns in the home, along with 200 rounds of ammunition. And while the cadaver dogs do hit on a few areas of the property, after digging those areas up, they don't find anything. In fact, they conduct a couple searches of the property that fall, and it leads them nowhere. But they also search Roger's silver Malibu. Shockingly, though, they don't find any. Anything proving Bonnie ever sat inside. No fibers, no DNA, no fingerprints. The car is actually immaculate. So at that point, detectives are kind of reaching a stalemate. They're pretty sure Bonnie has been killed. There's been no activity on any of her accounts. She would never leave her family like that, so unexpectedly. But they don't have a body. They can't prove it. They think they have the right family or people. But there's zero evidence to show that Bonnie ever went to the Carol's property, let alone got in Roger's car, even though his fingerprints were on her truck. So right now, the only thing they have is Roger's prints on Bonnie's car and a few other just strange, random things. Heather told the police, which is hard

[Garrett Moreland]

because that doesn't mean you've killed someone. Is it extremely weird? Yes. Can. Should you be convicted of killing someone? Is there enough evidence?

[Peyton Moreland]

Probably not.

[Garrett Moreland]

Probably not. I don't know.

[Peyton Moreland]

So as police are still talking to Heather, she's just like, dropping information here and there that's not really in, like, tied to anything specifically, but when you put it all together, just is a little confusing. She says that when she ran away to stay with them, Roger the dad wouldn't let her use for phones or computers or anything. In fact, she said she couldn't make contact with anyone outside the house while she stayed with them and that she wasn't allowed to tell the police that she had been staying with them on their property, which is why it took her so long to say it during her first interrogation. But she obviously did tell them. This is certainly alarming. Again, not enough for an arrest warrant. So eventually, police move on. And then five years later, in 2015, the charges against Monica for harboring a runaway are dropped. Roger's charges remain, and Bonnie's missing person case runs cold. Then 2018, eight years after Bonnie's disappearance, a domestic dispute turns this case on its head. By this point, Monica and Roger are no longer a United front. Roger's been cheating on Monica. Frankly, she's had enough.

[Garrett Moreland]

Here we go.

[Peyton Moreland]

She's mentioned divorce to her. She figures he won't be shocked once she finally serves him papers. Turns out she's wrong. On March 2nd of 2018, Monica's getting ready for work when Roger corners her in the laundry room of their home. He grabs her by the hair, starts dragging her around the house, hitting her with a taser gun.

[Garrett Moreland]

Oh, my gosh.

[Peyton Moreland]

Monica starts screaming for Nathan, who's no longer a 16 year old kid. He's now 25, but still lives with them, except Nathan's already left for work. So Monica's alone with Roger and she's on her own. Now, apparently this wasn't out of the blue. Monica claimed she'd been afraid of Roger for some time. She'd been sleeping in a separate bedroom, putting a dresser in front of the door at night. But this, this confrontation was next level. Monica tries to talk Roger down from this fit of rage, hoping she can rationalize with him. But he tells her he's not the same person he was. He has a lot of anger he can no longer control. He's a monster. The devil is living inside of me.

[Garrett Moreland]

Oh, give me a break.

[Peyton Moreland]

At some point, according to Monica, she says, he says to her, quote, I have killed for you. Now, the second Monica is out of the house, she rushes to her car, she drives to the courthouse to get a restraining order, but this makes its way to the police. So obviously the police are like, wait, these two suspects in this cold case that we were pretty sure we had the right people, but we can never put anything together. Nothing made sense.

[Garrett Moreland]

Now hate each other.

[Peyton Moreland]

Now she's filing a restraining order against him. So police find out that she had also said that he had killed for her during this dispute. And they're like, wait, he's in our suspect list and he's telling his wife while beating her that he's killed for her. So they're starting to be like, wait, is this tied to our case also?

[Garrett Moreland]

Well, I'm just curious where this goes because what does killing someone else's mom have to do with killing for her?

[Peyton Moreland]

Right. So after this incident, Monica knows that she has to tell police everything she can about her husband. Like she's now turned fully against her husband. So she's going to talk to police. And while she says that, you know, her and Bonnie or Bonnie and Roger never had a close connection that she's aware of, there were a few things that stood out to her. Keep in mind this is her story. She claims her husband Roger had taken a weird interest in Bonnie's day to day life. Before she disappeared. He had asked Heather, who was staying with them, about where she worked, what her schedule was, like, what days of the week she was there. And at this same time that they're learning all this, police are trying to locate Roger and that day they find him in the woods around his home.

[Garrett Moreland]

In the woods?

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah. So they go to find him after this dispute and they discover him with a bag of syringes and insulin. He claims he's trying to die by suicide because he, quote, hurt his wife bad. Police are like, okay, calm down. Yes, there's been a domestic dispute. Yes, your wife is talking to police, but you need to like, put the things down. He is arrested on charges of domestic abuse. But now prosecutors, when all of this comes to a head, they're determined to get Roger on first degree murder charges too. Because now that they have Monica in their back pocket saying like, no, he was being weird, he was talking about Bonnie, he was doing all of this, they think that they can get him for this. So on March 29, 2018, a grand jury hearing takes place and the star witness is someone the prosecution made a deal with. A promise of immunity in return for their confession. The one person who, according to Monica and Heather, because remember, a long time ago, Heather told police, I was with Monica at the lake house when Bonnie disappeared. Who went home though? Roger and their 16 year old son at the time, Nathan. So police decide to give Nathan immunity in return for his testimony against his father, Roger, who they are claiming killed Bonnie Woodward.

[Garrett Moreland]

So this, it's just so hard. There's no body. They haven't found anything.

[Peyton Moreland]

Right. So this is Nathan's story, which, I mean, he is a huge part of this. This is what he tells the court. On the morning of June 25, 2010, Roger told Nathan they were leaving early from the lake house, leaving the girls there to head to the nursing home where Bonnie worked. When Nathan asked Roger why, he told Nathan she was, quote, a bad person. She was mean and aggressive and abusive and she needed to go away and never come back. Nathan says he also explicitly told him he was going to kill her. So it just feels out of the blue. And even when they're like, what's the motive here, Nathan? He's like, I don't know. She. He said that she was a bad person.

[Garrett Moreland]

What?

[Peyton Moreland]

So he says when they get back to town, they scoped out the nursing home. Roger drove Nathan home to their house near Jerseyville grabbed a gun and went back to the nursing home. So now Nathan's like, yeah, I was home. Later that afternoon, Nathan remembered hearing eight or nine gunshots in the yard. And when he went outside, he claims he saw his dad, Roger, standing next to Heather's mother, Bonnie, who was now shot to death. Roger told Nathan that he used Heather as bait to get Bonnie to come with him from work, because what mother wouldn't take the opportunity to rescue their runaway daughter if they could? And unfortunately, Bonnie never got the chance to even see or say goodbye to Heather, because Heather and Monica at this point are still back at the lake house. Roger moved Bonnie's remains under a pile of brush. He lit it on fire. And meanwhile, Nathan was instructed to keep raking the coals to make sure the body was fully burned. For nearly the next week, Nathan claims he would come outside every couple of hours to stoke the fire and make sure nothing was left of her body.

[Garrett Moreland]

This is insane.

[Peyton Moreland]

He says. After this, they disposed of any remaining ashes in the creek. And then Nathan was ordered to mow the lawn where the blood had pooled from Bonnie's bullet wounds. Even weirder.

[Garrett Moreland]

Holy sh.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah.

[Garrett Moreland]

Could you imagine having to experience that at 16, 17 years old?

[Peyton Moreland]

And like, what, no one questions your dad? And so you're just doing what he says because this is who he is.

[Garrett Moreland]

And now she also just doesn't have a mom anymore.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah.

[Garrett Moreland]

What is happening?

[Peyton Moreland]

Nathan said after that day, he wasn't encouraged to forget about Bonnie. And this is weird. He said his father talked to him every night about it for years.

[Garrett Moreland]

Oh, my. He's nuts.

[Peyton Moreland]

So following nuts, the grand jury hearing, authorities returned to the Carol's 60 acre property once more that April, Nathan led them to the exact spots the crime occurred in. He took them to the place Bonnie was shot, where her body was burned, where her ashes were dumped. And through that process, police found 27 pieces of human bone fragments, along with shell casings from a 9 millimeter revolver. This is the same gun Nathan told the court his father had used to kill Bonnie. Wow. So again, this is just like the pre. Like this is the grand jury. And so Roger is now charged with first degree murder. The case against him was bolstered even further when the DNA testing on those bone fragments found on his Property came back. 25 of them were proven to belong to Bonnie.

[Garrett Moreland]

Why? Like, no reason. I mean, maybe he says there was a reason, but he just wanted to kill somebody.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah, I think that he wanted to kill someone. And when Heather came to them, this was the perfect excuse. He was going to look like the hero for rescuing a teenage girl from an abuse household. Annie gets to kill someone. He's the. He seems like, from the way it's described, to be the leader of this

[Garrett Moreland]

house, which is very ironic because he's also abusive himself.

[Peyton Moreland]

Right, yeah. So you killed someone for supposedly being abusive. So by the time Roger's trial came around In March of 2020, Heather and Monica had also made a deal with authorities. Neither one of them were facing charges due to their willingness to cooperate with the investigation.

[Garrett Moreland]

Okay.

[Peyton Moreland]

Monica testified against her husband at trial and talked about his abuse towards her, his obsession with tracking Bonnie back in 2010 before the murder and how she did see the fire and the cleanup after the murder.

[Garrett Moreland]

So, yeah, I mean, it's a little suspect, right? Like that's. To me, it's a little suspicious.

[Peyton Moreland]

I mean, this is why she's not. This is why she's even getting. If you're innocent, you don't need anything in exchange for testifying.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah, it's a little hard because there's a very good chance that she knew exactly what was happening and just turned

[Peyton Moreland]

a blind eye, even if it didn't come out of her head.

[Garrett Moreland]

And I can't say I can. All I can say is that it's. We'll never know. And allegedly, because, yeah, she was never tried for anything, but it just seems a little sus to me.

[Peyton Moreland]

And interesting enough at testimony when Monica is testifying against Roger, she also mentions how Roger and Heather, Bonnie's stepdaughter, 17 year old daughter who was staying with them after running away, took a long walk together, just the two of them, the day before he left the lake house to kill Bonnie. So Monica's like, yeah, he went and killed her mom, but the day before that, my husband and this 17 year old girl went for a really long walk together. I think she's implying at trial that Heather was told during that walk, before this happened, that he was going to kill Bonnie and save her. That's what Monica's implying at trial.

[Garrett Moreland]

This is nuts. Also, a lot of I just, I'm trying to think about the daughter's psyche, the son's psyche. Like there's just so much involved that I don't know what to really think.

[Peyton Moreland]

Between the witness testimony, the physical evidence found at the scene, and a forensic wood anatomy expert who confirmed there was a significant fire on the property back in May or June of 2010, there was more than enough for jurors to deliberate on. And they found Roger Carroll Guilty of first degree murder.

[Garrett Moreland]

Okay. I mean, obviously, that.

[Peyton Moreland]

October 2020, Roger was sentenced to 40 years for first degree murder and 25 years for gun enhancement in connection to the murder.

[Garrett Moreland]

Okay.

[Peyton Moreland]

During that hearing, Bonnie's son offered up these words. Quote, my mother was a good hearted, dedicated mother, grandmother, sister, aunt, friend, and co worker. Since Roger Carroll senselessly took her from our family, she's missed the birth of two grandchildren, countless holidays, birthdays, homecoming, my discharge from the army, and my wedding, I was unable to dance with my mother at my reception. And now, because Roger Carroll destroyed my mother's remains in an attempt to avoid prosecution, he's also robbed us of the ability to properly lay her to rest. Roger Carroll doesn't deserve to spend one more day enjoying the freedom I defended while in the army.

[Garrett Moreland]

Good point. 100%.

[Peyton Moreland]

But as everyone is currently screaming, and as I can tell, it's bothering Garrett, there's one part about this case that's probably eating us away.

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah. And I feel like it's this. You're just. Oh, I was thinking something else.

[Peyton Moreland]

What were you thinking?

[Garrett Moreland]

Like, the daughter.

[Peyton Moreland]

Oh, yes, yes, yes.

[Garrett Moreland]

Like, I'm just. Anyways, you. You. You can go. Maybe I'll address.

[Peyton Moreland]

Is there manipulation there?

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah. Like what? Like, what's happening? What's going on?

[Peyton Moreland]

I.

[Garrett Moreland]

And I. It's hard because she's young and she still has a life, so I don't want to call her out. If the police didn't address anything and they moved on past it. Yeah, I mean, she was like, what's going on?

[Peyton Moreland]

Here's the thing. Sometimes we have cases that are just so open and shut. You have all the evidence, the motive makes perfect, perfect sense. I don't mean that in that it makes sense, but at least to us, we can, like, apply a motive that we can somewhat understand. You can put a bow on it. They go to prison, blah, blah, blah, blah. In this case, we have the people. We have the answers of what happened. We have the answers of how he got her. We have the bow on the case of him going to prison and serving time. But the thing we don't have is, like, the main thing people listen to true crime for, which is why. Why do people do this? Why would he do this if he didn't even know Bonnie? Why would you kill someone? And sometimes that happens in true crime cases where the motive truly is bewildering and it's going to leave you unsatisfied because you're. You're like, what?

[Garrett Moreland]

Yeah.

[Peyton Moreland]

Why would this happen? What is the motive? Now, all of the sources I read have inferred the same thing about Roger. He was told by Heather that Bonnie was mean, aggressive, and abusive, and he decided to kill Bonnie to protect Heather and his own family. But I can't help but wonder if there's more to the story here, which is where Garrett's stepping in. Is Heather that convincing? She got people she just barely met to fall in love with her and kill for her is.

[Garrett Moreland]

None of it makes sense. She also lied to her teacher. I just. It's also hard to bring it up because I know she was a minor during this, and it's like, do I want to open that? If the police never even opened that can of worms, Maybe it just was. It didn't matter. And maybe they went over it and didn't.

[Peyton Moreland]

Well, here's the thing. The state doesn't really have to prove a motive. They just have to prove that someone

[Garrett Moreland]

killed someone, and that's all they were going for. Which I get. But.

[Peyton Moreland]

Which they did. But we believe no one in their right mind would meet someone and then go randomly kill someone for that person days after meeting them.

[Garrett Moreland]

Correct? I mean, yeah, you could say that. But also, people are nuts, and weird stuff happened. So maybe he did just want to kill somebody.

[Peyton Moreland]

That is kind of the feeling I'm getting from all the sources and everything, is that he was aggressive, he was dominant, he had a God complex and

[Garrett Moreland]

wanted to kill somebody.

[Peyton Moreland]

Wanted to kill someone. So when Heather came in and he felt like, oh, I can kill someone, which I've wanted to do, but also claim myself to be the hero and

[Garrett Moreland]

protecting everyone, that's probably what happened. Yeah.

[Peyton Moreland]

Yeah.

[Garrett Moreland]

Nuts. Sad. Very sad. The son doesn't have a mom. The daughter doesn't have a mom. That's just horrible.

[Peyton Moreland]

And again, anyone else's involvement in this case is alleged, besides Nathan, who admitted to helping at 16, but.

[Garrett Moreland]

Which is also why I'm just not going to address it, because it sounds like they have it figured out.

[Peyton Moreland]

I mean, they. Yeah, I mean, they put away the person who pulled the trigger.

[Garrett Moreland]

That's what matters.

[Peyton Moreland]

All right, you guys, that is our episode for this week, and we will see you next time. Time with another one. I love it.

[Garrett Moreland]

I hate it.

[Peyton Moreland]

Goodbye.

[Cassie or Danielle]

Welcome to National Park After Dark. We're your hosts, Cassie and Danielle. Join us every Monday as we visit a new park through stories of true crime, animal attacks, fatal accidents, miraculous survivals, and other incredible tales that you need to hear to believe. Our hope is that by sharing inspiring tales and our passion for protecting our planet's Wild Places inspires you to explore them yourselves. Find us on your favorite podcasting streaming platforms, Watch us on YouTube, and follow our adventures on all socials at National Park After Dark. And remember to enjoy the view, but watch your back.