491 - Ye Olde 7-Eleven

Summary

My Favorite Murder Podcast Episode 491 - "Ye Olde 7-Eleven" Summary

Release Date: July 31, 2025
Hosts: Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark

---

Introduction to Solo Episodes and Tour Plans (00:52 - 09:22)

In this episode, Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark announce a shift towards solo episodes to accommodate their upcoming tour schedules. They express excitement about interacting directly with their audience through these individual segments.

• Georgia Hardstark (01:22): "So we're doing some solo episodes. I feel like we should just talk about it."

• Karen Kilgariff (01:36): "Reminder, these are free."

The hosts humorously discuss the logistics of their tour, highlighting limited ticket availability and the personal challenges of performing live.

• Georgia Hardstark (01:45): "Fucking going on tour. Yeah. Go to myfavoritemurder.com/live and get your tickets if you want them."

They also touch upon their decision to potentially cease touring post-tour, adding a playful tone to the announcement.

---

Introduction to the Solo Story: Philip Ashton's Survival (09:22 - 41:10)

Karen introduces the day’s main content—a solo narrative episode featuring the extraordinary survival story of Philip Ashton, a 19-year-old fisherman from Massachusetts who became a castaway in the early 18th century.

• Karen Kilgariff (09:32): "And this one especially is very, very thematically off target in a way, but very interesting."

Capture by Pirates (09:48 - 12:16)

Philip Ashton and his crew aboard the Milton are unexpectedly overtaken by a violent pirate named Edward Ned Lowe aboard the brigantine Rebecca.

• Georgia Hardstark (13:53): "So, according to a write-up by the New England Historical Society, 'Lowe had a reputation as a psychopath who mutilated, disemboweled, and decapitated his prisoners.'"

• Karen Kilgariff (13:47): "Lowe had a reputation as a psychopath who mutilated, disemboweled, and decapitated his prisoners."

Life as a Castaway (15:03 - 25:52)

Refusing to join the pirates, Philip is marooned on Roatan Island. The narrative details his harrowing survival tactics, including foraging for food, building shelter, and enduring constant threats from wildlife and the elements.

• Karen Kilgariff (15:33): "He's about status."

Philip grapples with loneliness and the physical toll of isolation, vividly describing encounters with dangerous wildlife and the psychological strain of solitude.

• Philip Ashton (Narrated by Karen) (20:57): "If I had eaten it, it would have been the death to me."

Encounters and Near-Deaths (26:07 - 35:30)

After nearly a year, Philip spots an Englishman escaping Spaniards but loses him to a violent storm. Later, he discovers an abandoned boat and embarks on a perilous journey to seek help, only to face another near-death experience when confronted by Spaniards.

• Karen Kilgariff (27:07): "I was very active in helping get the casks out of the boat and roll them up to the watering place."

• Georgia Hardstark (34:38): "Turn around, damn it."

Rescue and Return Home (35:30 - 37:07)

Philip is eventually rescued by British loggers who establish trust and aid his recovery. His return journey is marked by a miraculous encounter with the ship Diamond, captained by an acquaintance from his hometown.

• Philip Ashton (Narrated by Karen) (35:23): "This small quantity... threw my animal spirits into such a violent agitation."

• Karen Kilgariff (37:07): "This is nearly three full years after he was first taken prisoner by Ned Lowe."

Aftermath and Legacy (37:07 - 41:10)

Upon returning to Massachusetts, Philip publishes his memoirs, which detail his unbelievable survival story. Despite skepticism due to the popularity of Robinson Crusoe, his account remains largely accepted with corroborative elements.

• Philip Ashton (Narrated by Karen) (40:36): "I cannot take notice of the strange concurrence of divine providence..."

• Georgia Hardstark (41:01): "Wow. Great solo story."

---

Discussion and Reflections (41:10 - 41:54)

Karen and Georgia reflect on the remarkable tale of Philip Ashton, emphasizing his relentless spirit and the sheer luck that facilitated his survival.

• Georgia Hardstark (41:03): "Wow. Great solo story."

• Karen Kilgariff (41:10): "It's a fun jaunt, which is what we need sometimes."

They also humorously address the malevolent character of Ned Lowe, the pirate responsible for Philip's initial capture.

• Georgia Hardstark (40:56): "Make fun of my name again. Make fun of Ned."

• Karen Kilgariff (40:50): "Ned is pussy."

---

Conclusion

Episode 491 of My Favorite Murder delves into the true crime history of Philip Ashton, a castaway whose survival against insurmountable odds paints a vivid picture of resilience and fortune intertwined. Karen and Georgia’s engaging narration, coupled with their signature humor and insightful discussions, provide listeners with a captivating exploration of one man’s fight for survival in the early 18th century.

---

Notable Quotes:

• Karen Kilgariff (09:32): "This one especially is very, very thematically off target in a way, but very interesting."

• Georgia Hardstark (13:53): "So, according to a write-up by the New England Historical Society..."

• Philip Ashton (20:57): "If I had eaten it, it would have been the death to me."

• Philip Ashton (35:23): "This small quantity... threw my animal spirits into such a violent agitation."

• Philip Ashton (40:36): "I cannot take notice of the strange concurrence of divine providence..."

---

For More Information:

• Email: [e-mail]
• Follow on Instagram: @myfavoritemurder
• Listen on: iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, or My Favorite Murder Website
• Watch on YouTube: Exactly Right’s YouTube page

Stay tuned for upcoming solo episodes and consider attending the live tour for an immersive My Favorite Murder experience!

Transcript

[Karen Kilgariff]

This is exactly right. Everyone thinks they'd never join a cult, but it happens all the time to people just like you and people just like us. I'm Lola Blanc. And I'm Megan Elizabeth. We're the hosts of Trust Me, a podcast about cults, manipulation, and the psychology of belief. Each week we talk to fellow survivors, former believers, and experts to understand why people get pulled in and how they get out. Trust Me. New episodes every Wednesday on Exactly right. Listen, wherever you get your podcasts.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Hello and welcome to my favorite Murder.

[Karen Kilgariff]

That's Georgia Hardstar, that's Karen Kilgariff, and we're here to do a little bit of podcasting for you.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Just a little, like, a side of podcasting.

[Karen Kilgariff]

One of those small ramekins, cute breadcrumbs on the top.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Ugh. Torch it, burn it a little.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And that's really all you need.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Crunchy and cheesy podcasting.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Don't forget your podcast stomach is only this big.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Are you hungry?

[Karen Kilgariff]

I don't know. Who knows anymore?

[Georgia Hardstark]

I mean, truly.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I mean.

[Georgia Hardstark]

So we're doing some solo episodes. I feel like we should just talk about it. Like, we're planning this huge tour. We have our researchers. They have a lot of work, and so we're just gonna kind of do some solos so we can catch up on all of that.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Reminder, these are free.

[Georgia Hardstark]

It's summer. These are free. We are human beings with lives, trying to live lives at least a little bit.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And going on tour for you. Yeah.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Fucking going on tour. Yeah. Go to my favorite murder.com live and get your tickets if you want them.

[Karen Kilgariff]

There's a couple left. There's a couple left there.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Speaking of, I think we should also say, like, there are no plans for tours in the future. You guys.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Like, this is.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I don't see myself touring again after this. So if you're on the fence about it.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I thought you said you were going to be a standup. Good luck.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I mean, no, thank you. Yeah. Get your tickets.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah. That's a threat. Directly.

[Georgia Hardstark]

It's kind of a threat.

[Karen Kilgariff]

No, it's an absolute threat.

[Georgia Hardstark]

It's a warning. It's just information that I feel like we should give people.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Absolutely. Here's more information we should give people. One of the biggest, we can call it fights that you've ever seen on this podcast.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Scandal. A scandal, even.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's a scandal. I think it's something that you didn't realize. It's gonna say something very political. But instead, I'll say this. This Thanksgiving, we promise you there's something New to fight about. And it is. Who is right in the sister's wedding argument? Big sister or little sister? And the people have spoken.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah. So, minisode 444, you and I discussed an email that came in about wedding drama. Cause we'd asked for wedding drama. And this little sister wrote how high maintenance her big sister was being because the little sister was gonna have her wedding two months after the big sister's wedding. And I thought that that was fine. You understood the big sister side. And so we took a poll. Yeah, right.

[Karen Kilgariff]

A poll that almost 12,000 people responded to. Like, when I first heard these poll results, I'm like, What is that? 300 people? There's no way. There's no way I'm wrong to that level.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah, you're right. I see. 11k. 11.9k responds.

[Karen Kilgariff]

11.9 thousand people were like, I have an opinion. And so the results are. In this poll, after 12,000 people basically responded, 79% were in favor of the little sister, and only 21% were on the big sister side.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's a big margin.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's a big margin.

[Georgia Hardstark]

And so that is for the people who say, stick to true crime. Why do you fucking talk in the beginning of the. That's for you. 11.9. Why am I angry today?

[Karen Kilgariff]

I love it. Get it out. Let everybody know. But here's the thing. If we could stick to true crime, we would have done it nine and a half years ago. We're not. The argument's over. Just like this argument is over. The people have voted on the little sister Georgia's side.

[Georgia Hardstark]

So we posted a clip of the debate to Instagram and TikTok, and we also got a lot of comments, which is, of course, what we actually want.

[Karen Kilgariff]

What we're looking for. Yeah.

[Georgia Hardstark]

So someone says, it's a little sister. This is classic bratty little sis behavior. That's from TikTok. From. I can make another username. It's their username.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Oh, yeah. Well, a very good point that Ange M Z makes on Instagram, which is the military is no joke when it comes to leave little sister all the way.

[Georgia Hardstark]

So I think what Molly did, which is really smart, is gave me your side arguments and you. My side arguments.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yes. We simply must understand what the other side was talking about.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Here's a long one. This is from Instagram, from Tess Jagger Wells. I'm going with both in the wrong, but the younger sister pissed me off with the way she worded the whole thing. You don't get to unilaterally Decide that this will be fun for you and your sister. And I didn't like the way she talked about her sister's relationship. Like that wedding matters less because they've been together and engaged for a while. Yeah, okay, fair.

[Karen Kilgariff]

There was a lot of that kind of stuff, but kind of similarly Ashton with Anne. So Ashton en said, how is this the most divisive content you've ever posted? I cannot decide. I'm an older sister. But can we get both perspectives? LOL.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh my God. Bethany and TikTok said six months apart is the correct answer.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I love that one. Just like we've solved it.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah, that's fair.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Mitch M I C H dot sum said these sisters can afford weddings in this economy. Very good point.

[Georgia Hardstark]

This raised my blood pressure. I've read every comment and I still can't decide someone.

[Karen Kilgariff]

No shit. Shelby said, is there a secret third sister we can side with? I bet there is.

[Georgia Hardstark]

And she's like, I'm staying fucking out of this. Middle sister. Taking both sides. Taking neither side.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah. She basically hates both of them equally and thinks they're both wrong equally.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah. So what do you think? Let us know.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I mean this was a fun. If you didn't hear about it, you can go watch the clip because you will have a very definitive opinion.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Definitely definitive and definite.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Looking for those big sisters arguers. You want to come and show up. Only the little sister showed up, which is very little sister.

[Georgia Hardstark]

They're all on social media. The little sisters are the social media ones. They do have a thermal ones are on Facebook. The little ones are on TikTok and Instagram. Right. Fight me. They're like argue with me about that.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I can't figure out how to log on to Instagram. That's like me with my. Is it a Finsta? I had a Finsta and I couldn't remember what fake name I used and I just never used it again. I think I had some Kevin something. Kevin. I tried to go that's so random. So no one would ever suspect. And it's like they don't because I can't log on. Classic. So because this was such a popular interaction both here on the show and then of course content wise on other platforms, we decided we should have a more Pick a side where George and I argue for or against whatever's going on. So if you have something going on in your family, especially right now, between you and your sister, especially. Or friend of course. Or whoever.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Roommate. Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Something you can't settle, please don't make it. Don't bring us into any kind of a legal area and don't base your.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Decision on what we say either. This is not legally binding, whatever we say.

[Karen Kilgariff]

That's right. Our advice is not professional or reasonable.

[Georgia Hardstark]

We're barely doctors.

[Karen Kilgariff]

We're. We just passed those, that last bar exam. So we want to help you. And we mostly want to argue.

[Georgia Hardstark]

And we probably won't.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And we won't help you. We'll help ourselves argue to you.

[Georgia Hardstark]

The end. Great.

[Karen Kilgariff]

All right. We have a podcast network. Do you want to talk about it?

[Georgia Hardstark]

Sure. We are so excited and proud you've heard us talk about it. We are so proud to welcome our newest podcast. It's about cults called Trust Me to the exactly Right Family. On their premiere episode, Lola and Megan sit down with artist and writer Akina Cox, who shares her experience growing up in the Unification Church, also known as the Mooney's. From mass weddings to unpaid labor and Reverend Moon's surprising ties to American politics, this is the first part of an incredible two part series. New episodes of Trust Me are every Wednesday. Please rate, review, subscribe.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Then over on Bananas, we've got Curtin Scotty talking about a Florida man who celebrated his birthday by doing meth, stealing a tour train, and then going ahead and picking up some passengers to give that tour.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's nice of him.

[Karen Kilgariff]

That's community service.

[Georgia Hardstark]

And then over on Ghosted Roz's gag to welcome back filmmaker, writer and drag queen icon Peaches Christ.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Legend.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Legend. The two talk about stigmata, a mysterious piece of Jesus toast, and new discoveries surrounding the unsolved death of legendary drag queen Hecklina.

[Karen Kilgariff]

In case you missed it, we're going on tour. You may have missed at the beginning of this. We guilted you into buying tickets. Some shows are sold out. Lots of shows actually are sold out. More than half. So if you want to come see us live, go grab your tickets@my favoritemurder.com live.

[Georgia Hardstark]

All right, so this is your solo episode.

[Karen Kilgariff]

That's right. So with solo episodes, we pick stories that are fun. I would say. Okay, I like fun.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Mine for the next episode is not fun.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah, we pick differently, but this one especially is very, very thematically off target in a way, but very interesting. And we've done these kinds of stories before. This one starts June 15, 1722.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, wow. Old Wayback Machine.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And it starts off the southwestern coast of modern day Nova Scotia at a settlement called Port Roseway. There's a group of six fishermen from New England. Their ship, the Milton, is anchored at that port. After a long Day's work. Among those six men is a 19 year old from Massachusetts named Philip Ashton. Philip is exhausted, as is the rest of the Milton's crew, because it's a grueling job. Of course, beyond the usual difficulties of these labor intensive fishing expeditions. Philip, who is a weak swimmer, fell overboard a few days prior. And his shipmate and childhood friend Joseph Libby actually pulled him out of the water. Thank God, because Philip would have drowned otherwise. So Philip and Joseph and the rest of the crew are ready for some R and R before they have to continue on that journey. But there are 13 other vessels anchoring near Port Roseway at the moment. Everybody's ready for some R and R. But then the Milton crew seems to be a 14th vessel entering this port. It's a large ship with two masts. That's called the Brigantine unit.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I must.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So Philip and his shipmates watch this bigger brigantine boat drop a smaller boat. And now that boat is rowing straight for the Milton. So Philip and the rest of the crew don't really think much of it. Cause they figure that the crew on the Brigantine just want to see, you know, other human faces after a long time at sea. Maybe hear the latest news from the American colonies, you know, get the update.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Goss the little gossip.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Wouldn't it be nice after like three years at sea? And you're just like, oh my God.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I'm so sick of these fucking people.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Get me away from these nerds. So it turns out that's not the case at all. They're not just a boat full of gossips. These strangers board the Milton brandishing pistols and cutlasses. And after the initial shock wears off, Philip and the rest of the crew realize that they're dealing with every 18th century sea travelers worst nightmare, pirates. These pirates easily overpower the six man Milton crew and force them to board their brigantine. And once that's done, they board every other vessel anchored in Port Roseway and they take all those crews hostage as well.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Nobody. There's 13 other boats. And nobody fought back.

[Karen Kilgariff]

No, because they're all doing that same thing of like, oh, look at these guys in a rowboat.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Right.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I think rowboats aren't that scary.

[Georgia Hardstark]

No, rowboats, yeah. It's like, oh, it's how cute. A rowboat.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Some guys in a rowboat.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So now everybody, including Philip, is at the mercy of these pirates. No one knows what's gonna happen next. And as scary as that must have been, the truth is that at this moment, Philip's entire life is about to take an unbelievable series of twists and turns that will turn this teenage fisherman into a legend. This is the story of castaway Philip Ashton. All right, so you know on those funny, like, cards from the 70s, when there's, like, a little tiny island with one palm tree and a castaway.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yes.

[Karen Kilgariff]

With, like, the beard and the scraggly pants.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yes. And I'm getting comfortable.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Well, this is kind of the vibe of that. This feel. This guy is the OG of that guy.

[Georgia Hardstark]

He's the basis or he's the reason for the cartoon. He's what the cartoon is based on.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's what I kept thinking where I was like, well, Leeds is not just one tiny plot sand pile with a palm tree on it, but it's not much better. So the main sources for this story that Maren used are a memoir written by Philip Ashton himself, which is heavily cited. Then there's a 2014 book called @ the Point of a Cutlass by Gregory N. Fleming. And there's an uncredited article on the New England Historical Society's website. The rest of the sources are in our show notes. So we're now on board the Brigantine. Things are looking incredibly grim for Philip. And that's because this specific vessel called the Rebecca, is helmed by a notoriously violent and sadistic pirate named Edward Ned Lowe. Ned.

[Georgia Hardstark]

The most terrifying name on the seas.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Ned Ned from Human Resources. Ned or Ned the Pirate Ned.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Okay, no, Pirate Ned.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Pirate dreaded pirate Ned Lowe. So according to a write up by the New England Historical Society, quote, Lowe had a reputation as a psychopath who mutilated, disemboweled, and decapitated his prisoners.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Sorry, Ned. Sorry, I take it back.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I take it all back. You're not a nerd. Mariners who plied the Atlantic were terrified of Lowe, who was said to have French. Fuck. This is so crazy. Okay, Mariners. Mariners who plied the Atlantic were terrified of Lowe, who is said to have fried a French cook alive.

[Georgia Hardstark]

What?

[Karen Kilgariff]

He once cut off a captain's lips with a cutlass, broiled them, and forced the victim to eat them while still hot.

[Georgia Hardstark]

No, that is sadistic. As a person with lips. That was a very painful fucking thing for me.

[Karen Kilgariff]

As a person.

[Georgia Hardstark]

As a person.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Back on the Rebecca, Ned Lowe is now addressing the dozens of fishermen and merchants that he's holding hostage, of course, including Philip. And he offers all of them an ultimatum. They can either surrender all their possessions and join the Rebecca's crew as pirates, or they can be held as prisoners. There are no other Options? No. Thirdsies?

[Georgia Hardstark]

No. I'm gonna get out of here.

[Karen Kilgariff]

You know what I'm gonna do? It's crazy.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Let's get out of here.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I just remembered I have a dinner. Most of the hostages feel they don't have a choice, but not Philip Ashton. He refuses to be forced into becoming a pirate, even as his childhood friend Joseph reluctantly agrees to. Philip later attributes his decision to his, quote, dis of Ned Lowe's company and actions, my concern for my parents, and my fear of being found in such bad company. So he's all about status.

[Georgia Hardstark]

He's got morals and status.

[Karen Kilgariff]

That's right, yeah. He also somewhat naively asks the pirates to put him, quote, onboard any other vessel or send him ashore. Okay, so he actually does ask permission to ski daddle.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah, no, thank you.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Of course, that doesn't happen. And now Philip is on Ned Lowe's radar, right? So he is the guy that basically goes, excuse me, Can I go? Yeah. So he's put in in heavy chains, he's beaten, and he's pushed into a cargo hold along with every other prisoner that's being held on the Rebecca. And as the days turn to weeks and the weeks turn to months, Philip begs to be released. But his pleas are met with more beatings. So it's bad. It's so bad that when the Rebecca finally anchors, one of Ned Lowe's prisoners tries to escape the ship. Occasionally, these escapes are successful, but an unsuccessful escape pretty much means death for the prisoner, either out in the elements or when they're recaptured at the hands of the pirates themselves. But being a prisoner on a pirate ship means being consistently underfed, regularly tortured, and constantly exposed to illness like what anybody else could have in the hot, very densely packed holding area with the other captives. So it's a death sentence in and of itself. So Philip decides to escape, and he figures if he dies trying to make a break for it, at least he tried. But he wants to be smart about it. So he waits for the right moment. And in March of 1722, which is nine months after he is first imprisoned, he finally senses an opportunity. And that comes as the Rebecca is pulling into the Gulf of Honduras, which, at the time, is officially under the control of Spain. You knew that, of course. The brigantine anchors near Roatan, which is an island about 40 miles north of Honduras. It's 50 miles long, but only 5 miles across at its widest part. So it's a long, skinny guy. And today, this island is known for its beautiful beaches and the great scuba diving and great snorkeling. But there is a long history here back then. It wasn't back then. No snorkeling. People hated the snorkeling back in the 1700s.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Tourists hadn't come yet to snorkel and.

[Karen Kilgariff]

To rate, review and subscribe. It's believed that Roatan was first inhabited by the Pech indigenous people who were violently displaced by European colonists in the 16th century. And then by early 1723, when the Rebecca arrives offshore, Roatan is totally uninhabited. Instead, the island and the islands around it have become hideaways where pirates can anchor their ships, row to shore on smaller boats, look around for fresh water after long voyages at sea.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Cheers.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah, right. Could you feel it? The fresh, fresh water.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, thank God for fresh water.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Give it up for fresh water. So Ned Low and the crew of the Rebecca are there to do just that. Once the ship is anchored, Ned Low unshackles Philip and sends him with the group that are going to shore to help fill water casks for the ship. Philip decides this will be his moment. He explains later, quote, I was very active in helping get the casks out of the boat and roll them up to the watering place. End quote. One of the great quotes.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's a must.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It was my senior quote, actually. Now that I'm thinking of it, I forgot. Philip Ashton is who I quoted when I graduated.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Say it again. Say it again.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I was very active in helping get the casks out of the boat and roll them up to the water.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's fucking poignant.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's so mean. As he does this, little by little, Philip wanders away from the rest of the crew. He does the classic whistling walking backwards.

[Georgia Hardstark]

What? What a toucan. I'm gon. I hear my mom calling me.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I'll be right back. So he does this, wanders away, and then suddenly sprints into the jungle and runs for his life.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Hell yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

When the pirates realize that he's gone, they look everywhere for him. But Roatan's forests are very dense, so trying to find one person in it feels impossible. So when Ned Low calls the pirates back to the Rebecca, they just decide to leave Philip behind, Right? They figure he's probably gonna die out there. He doesn't even have shoes on.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, geez. Neither do I. Oh my God.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Have you been chained up inside the bottom of a boat? Make people pay for that. Don't just lift yourself. We're trying to get more viewers.

[Georgia Hardstark]

No, no, no, no.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Not for free.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Trying to get more audience members.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Don't give it for free.

[Georgia Hardstark]

It's just one. It's like, not even a pair, so it's not really worth as much.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So the odds certainly are stacked against Philip at this moment. He has no fire starting tools, he has no hunting equ, and he's already starving, so he's a mess. He's able to find limes and coconuts right away, but of course, the limes are bitter and he can't open the coconuts.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Sure.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So it's. Isn't that life? Luckily, Philip also finds wild figs and something called sapote. I know, right?

[Georgia Hardstark]

It's a nice salad if you put it on.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah. Just kind of put it together and then just hold the coconut in your hand. Philip describes sapote as, quote, larger than an orange of oval shape of a brownish color outside and red within.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Hmm. Grapefruit. What? Why are you looking at me? I'm not. Guess what it is.

[Karen Kilgariff]

No, because I wouldn't be able to tell you anyway. Got it. But I was thinking mango.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, okay. Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

To make sure these fruits are safe to eat, Philip decides he's gonna wait around until one of the native animal goes and eats it first and then study the reaction it has, you know, their reactions to the fruit. But the idea of waiting feels next to impossible because he's already starving. Y desperation leads to a few close calls. Like, in one case, Philip finds a piece of fruit. It looks like an apple to him. He looks it over. He has no idea what it is, but he is almost about to eat it. And then he just decides it's not worth the risk. And he will later learn it's an extremely toxic fruit called the manchineel, which is also known as the death apple.

[Georgia Hardstark]

It's right there in the name, right.

[Karen Kilgariff]

There in his hand.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I wonder if there was, like, there was like, some kind of smell that hits, like, you know, caveman brain.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yes. That's like, no, no, no. He writes later. Quote, if I had eaten it, it would have been the death to me. So as days turn to weeks, Philip manages to find enough fruit for himself to stay alive. He also finds fresh water very easily. Him in those casks. It's his specialty. Soon he builds himself a hut out of palm fronds and tree branches. Classic castaway stuff. But of course, it's all exhausting for him. He's constantly exerting himself and burning tons of energy during those treks, like hunting for supplies and looking for fruit. And although he's grateful for any sustenance, it's like, way more than he Got on that boat. He's struggling to meaningfully refuel. He needs protein, and there isn't any. Although it's there. He crosses paths with countless wild hogs, ducks, pigeons, and deer on the island. It's vegan.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, man.

[Karen Kilgariff]

What are the chances he just sent his check to PETA and there's just no way he's gonna do that. Something with the soul? No, he just doesn't have the tools.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Fair enough.

[Karen Kilgariff]

He would love to kill any of those animals with joy. One day, as he walks along the beach, he stumbles upon some tortoise nests with dozens of small eggs inside. He eats several of these eggs raw and will later describe the taste as, quote, not very good.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, man.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Could you do it? Could you do it?

[Georgia Hardstark]

Crack an egg in my. Yes, absolutely.

[Karen Kilgariff]

A tortoise egg.

[Georgia Hardstark]

How big are those?

[Karen Kilgariff]

Small. Okay. The paper that Maren wrote for me says small.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Okay.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Not very good. No, I could never.

[Georgia Hardstark]

You would. You could. You could.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I could. After a couple months.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah, but. Fuck, yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Let's not get into situations.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I mean, I've had a cocktail that has raw egg in it, but it tastes like. Like. Like cocktail with raw egg in it. No, it's not bad. It's not bad.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Was there any kind of a tortoise essence to it at all?

[Georgia Hardstark]

No. No.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Okay.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Not great.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Then. You weren't on Roatan Island.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I wasn't starving for a cocktail. Or was I?

[Karen Kilgariff]

Or was. Or was you? So months pass, and Philip doesn't have a game plan for anything other than just surviving. And despite this island being relatively small, every one of Philip's days is filled and terrifying experiences. Like when he came upon a snake that he describes as, quote, very large, as big, round as a man's waist, and 12 or 14ft long. And he says, quote, the first I saw of these greatly surprised me, for I was very near to it when I discovered it to be a living creature. Holy shit. And then it opened its mouth wide enough to have thrown a hat into it and blew out its breath at me.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I didn't know that snakes did that. I mean, take a deep sigh like.

[Karen Kilgariff]

A giant hissing python.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

One positive for Philip is that he uses his downtime on Roatan while he's not foraging or building shelter to improve his swimming skills. But, of course, that's also filled with danger. And he later writes, quote, another time, as I was swimming, a shark struck me in the thigh just as I set my foot to ground. So grounded himself on the shoals and could not turn himself to Come at me with his mouth. Through the goodness of God, I escaped, falling prey to his devouring teeth.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yikes.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So a big shark beached itself to try to eat him and just missed, essentially. As the days and weeks go by, Philip becomes increasingly frail, both physically and, of course, mentally. His days become monotonous and they start to blend together. Ben. There, Philip wanders up the same hills, ventures to the same fruit trees, stares at the same expanse of ocean over and over, day after day. He's starved for human connection. And he hasn't talked to another human being in months and complains, quote, the parrots here had not even been taught to speak.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's his complaint.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Two stars.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's his yelp. Review of the island.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Come with me as I explore this island. Then something unbelievable happens. In November of 1723, after being stranded for around nine months, he suddenly spots a man rowing toward the island in a canoe.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Wow.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Hey.

[Georgia Hardstark]

What?

[Karen Kilgariff]

Philip can hardly believe his eyes, and for a second, he thinks he's hallucinating. But when the man comes ashore, Philip realizes that he is actually real. So he cautiously approaches this man who is visibly frightened by Philip and his crazy, unkempt appearance.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Sure.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So I think nine months at this point. Scraggly, beardy y. As writer Gregory N. Fleming note, he stepped back a little, letting the sight of Philip sink in, and then finally approached and shook his hand. So as it turned out, this man is from England. And he tells Philip he's recently escaped Spaniards on mainland Honduras who were trying to kill him. The Englishman claims he came to Roatan because he believed it was abandoned. He doesn't share much more information about himself. He doesn't even say what his name is. But Philip doesn't care because this Englishman came prepared. Philip later writes that the man brought, quote, five pounds of pork, a knife, powder, tobacco, tongs and flint.

[Georgia Hardstark]

What kind of powder are we talking about? Doot.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Doot.

[Georgia Hardstark]

The old nose candy.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Little ski party on Roatan. And this man is, thank God, kind enough to share all of these supplies with Philip.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I don't think I would. Like I was hallucinating that. That's lucky.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's a dream. After nine months, it's like the dream. But as grateful as Philip is to have met this stranger, their time together does not last. After a few days, the Englishman says he wants to go to a neighboring island to scavenge and hunt. But Philip doesn't think that he is physically up for that task. So he decides to stay behind, which to me, I'm trying to read between the lines of, like, immediately did you hate each other?

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah. Annoyed the out of each other.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's like a guy from Boston and a British guy.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I'm just gonna go.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I feel like I want to just check that other island.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Totally stay here if you're not up for it.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Chill, chill. Underneath this palm tree. You got this.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Here's some powder. I'll be back.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Philip's like, cool, cool, cool.

[Georgia Hardstark]

I'll watch the powder, right?

[Karen Kilgariff]

So as the Englishman climbs into his canoe, he assures Philip that he will be back soon. I'm just gonna check out this other party, and then I'll come back and.

[Georgia Hardstark]

We'Ll totally keep up. So I stopped by just for this party, and then I'm gonna come back here.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I don't even want to go.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah, but I have to go. Just show my face on this island.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I need the credit. An hour after the Englishman leaves Roatan, there's severe weather with, quote, violent gusts of wind and rain. That Englishman never returns.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So several days pass. Philip accepts the fact that the Englishman is likely never coming back, and he starts using the supplies the man left behind. He's like, man? You mean three minutes after he left, he's now able to cut up tortoise meat, crabs, and coconuts, and he can cook all of it over a fire. He can finally satiate himself. And it's all an absolute godsend for Philip, and he credits the mysterious Englishman for saving his life. So now It's January of 1724. Philip has been stuck on Roatan for nearly 11 months. One day, while he's out scavenging, he notices a small boat that's on the shore. At first, Philip thinks it could be that Englishman's canoe. As he gets closer, he realizes he's never seen this boat before. It looks more well designed, and it has a small mast and a sail it. So somehow the boat has washed up ashore without a captain. So Philip decides to take it for himself.

[Georgia Hardstark]

And after, it's just an empty boat.

[Karen Kilgariff]

An empty boat just shows up.

[Georgia Hardstark]

This guy is the lucky. I mean, look, he's not lucky, but keeps getting lucky.

[Karen Kilgariff]

I mean, there's islands that are out there that are just like all spiders that literally, you can't go to them because they're covered in poisonous spiders. That's real.

[Georgia Hardstark]

And he got the one where just a random, really cool English guy with tons of coke showed up at and an empty fucking boat.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And, like, coconuts and limes. Like, everything that you need for a Mai Tai except for rum yeah. Now there's just like, oh, a boat got here. He's in the perfect jet stream. After a few practice runs, Philip feels comfortable enough to sail toward nearby islands, hoping to find someone friendly, not a pirate, who can help him get back to Massachusetts. So he packs some food. He takes off on a 20 mile sailing journey to the neighboring island of Guanaja. He doesn't have any maps or anything. He just has to blindly go out into the ocean. As he approaches this new island, he sees a ship in the distance anchored in this island's bay. So he's very excited at the possibility of seeing another person, possibly someone who might be able to help him. But he also knows this area is a hideaway for pirates. So chances are it could be a pirate. Philip will later write, quote, I could never entertain the thoughts of returning on board a pirate ship if I should have the opportunity. I would rather live and die as I was. Until he knows who is on that ship, Philip decides to lay low. He anchors his boat on the other side of the island and then spends two days cautiously crossing the island, still barefoot, Tiptoe, stinky stink. One stick snaps. He freezes for two days, keeps going. When he finally makes it back over to the bay to do some spying, the ship is gone.

[Georgia Hardstark]

He took too long.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Now he's defeated and exhausted. So Philip slumps down against a tree, and while still sitting up, he falls asleep. Very castawayish. It's unclear how long he dozes off, but the next thing he remembers is the sound of gunfire close up.

[Georgia Hardstark]

25 years, sleeps.

[Karen Kilgariff]

When he jumps to up, he looks around and sees several small boats approaching the shore. Philip will later say, quote, I soon turned about and ran as fast as my sore feet would let me into the bushes. So Philip will later learn that these men are Spaniards. They likely think Philip is some sort of political enemy, a pirate or a laborer in the illegal lumber trade, which is now a booming industry in South America. So Philip is once again running from men who want to capture him. He manages to hide until the Spaniards leave. When Philip walks back down to the beach, he sees bullet holes in the tree where he'd been resting and they'd only missed him by inches.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Damn.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So again, lucky. Unlucky.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Now Philip has to hike all the way back to his small boat because he had to be so sneaky. It takes him three days to get there. The mosquitoes and the flies on Guanaja are even worse than they were on Roatan. He's being bitten constantly and he's now running on very little food and water. He finally gets to hop into his boat and sail back to Roatan. And he gets there after nightfall.

[Georgia Hardstark]

So he goes back to the island.

[Karen Kilgariff]

He has to go back to where he started.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Okay.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So irritating.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

More time passes, and when March 1724 comes and goes, he's now been on Roatan for a full year. His mental and physical health are very fragile. He's rail thin. He's covered in insect bites. His clothes are torn to shreds. By June of 1724, Philip's been marooned for 15 months. And he is so weak that he struggles to make his once very routine trips across the island for fruit and water. He now spends much of his time staring out at the ocean.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yikes.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Bad sign. Usually doing this is pretty uneventful until one day when he sees two small dots in the water. As they move closer to shore, Philip sees it's a pair of men in two small canoes. One of them shouts out in English, who's there? Philip breathes a little sigh of relief. He yells back that he's from the colonies and he's been stuck on this island for over a year. The men announce that they're British loggers. They explain that Spaniards are clamping down on their operations, which are illegal, and the Spaniards are planning a raid on the logging camp. So these men are now scouting new potential campsites. So after some back and forth, the men establish trust with one another and the duo and the canoes come ashore. According to Philip, when one of the men approaches him, quote, he started back frightened to see such a poor, ragged, lean, wan, forlorn, wild, miserable object. So. So luckily, these men show Philip kindness. They notice that he is unable to walk very well at all. So the British loggers decide to carry him back to their boats. Then they take him to their logging camp on the neighboring island. And along the way, the men excitedly listen to Philip's outrageous story of survival. And they offer him some rum, which, right, he finally has the missing piece. But now the coconuts and the limes are back on the island.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Turn around, damn it.

[Karen Kilgariff]

The rums is a bit too strong for Philip, who gets very, very drunk very quickly.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's not an empty stomach starving for 15 months. Snack girl.

[Karen Kilgariff]

No. First you order an awesome blossom, then you get some queso and chips.

[Georgia Hardstark]

No, you need a fucking base. Base, base that shit out a coating, please.

[Karen Kilgariff]

So he says about himself drinking this rum, quote, this small quantity, through my long disuse of any liquor, higher, spirited Than water. And my present weakness threw my animal spirits into such a violent agitation.

[Georgia Hardstark]

So you got shit faced immediately.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Shit faced and an asshole drunk.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, no.

[Karen Kilgariff]

On a canoe.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Great.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Get out of here now. At the camp, Philip is finally surrounded by other people. And this group consists of 18 male loggers and a female cook. Ma', am, are you okay? And they all do their best to take care of Philip. He's given new clothes, a much needed pair of shoes, Deer meat and pork, and the time to recover and gain strength.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Wow.

[Karen Kilgariff]

After several weeks, Philip is well enough to help the loggers build a new camp back on Roatan. So he's back. Yes, he's back home where he belongs. Then In August of 1724, a ship called the diamond stops near this logging camp. The diamond wasn't supposed to pass through the area, but storms pushed its journey south. So now the ship's crew is in desperate need of fresh water. They got it on Roatam. Turns out this vessel is from Massachusetts.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, my God.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Just like Philip. Even more bizarrely, the diamond set sail just a few miles from Philip's coastal hometown. But the most fateful twist in this wild story is that Philip knows the Diamond's captain. They're acquaintances from back home.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Shit.

[Karen Kilgariff]

They're like, didn't you work at 7:11? Hey, that's the 7:11 I used to go to every morning.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Ye olde 7:11. Ye old.

[Karen Kilgariff]

No Slurpees, just grog. So that captain, who Philip simply refers to as Captain Dove, immediately and enthusiastically agrees to take Philip home. And with that, his long journey finally ends in May of 1725 when he arrives at Salem harbor on the Diamond.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Wow.

[Karen Kilgariff]

This is nearly three full years after he was first taken prisoner by Ned Lowe.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Three years.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Three full years.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Three real shitty years.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah. Philip says, quote, I went the same evening to my father's house, where I was received as one coming to them from the dead, I bet. Knock, knock, knock.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Can you imagine?

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, my God.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And they're like, what's this beard? Look, it's. No, take off those culottes. They don't look good on you. As Philip readjusts to his old life, he must come to terms with all that's happened to him. He knows very well that he cheated death countless times. I mean, the idea that that ship just got blown off course, it's the only reason they were there.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Is crazy.

[Georgia Hardstark]

All of it.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Tragically, Philip learns that his dear childhood friend Joseph Libby, who saved his life, wasn't so lucky. According to the new England Historical Society quote. While Philip lingered a castaway on a Caribbean island, Libby met his death by hanging in rhode island with 25 other pirates.

[Georgia Hardstark]

W. Oh, so because he said yes to being a pirate.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yep. Even though he's a pirate.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It was like to try to stay alive and stay alive in an okay way.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And they don't care. No, they don't care about that. It's traitor behavior.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Right.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Before long, Philip is encouraged to write his story and his memoirs published in 1725, soon after he returns to Massachusetts. It's very short, and it's very much written in the vernacular of the day, so it is a bit of a dense read. This is Marin's. Marin's, like, commentary on it.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Like, I tried. She's like, look.

[Karen Kilgariff]

But you can find it if you want to read it online under a couple different titles. One is Stranded in the True Account of Escape from Pirates. After this memoir is published, some people wonder if Philip made the whole thing up.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Can you imagine going through that and then being like, liar?

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's like, sorry, so you said you immediately found coconuts.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Right.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And one of the reasons people think it's made up is because the book Robinson Crusoe had just come out and was super popular. So people are just like, oh, you just showed up and basically told the same story and to make money. But as unbelievable as it all sounds, no one has ever been able to disprove Philip's story, and many parts of it have been corroborated.

[Georgia Hardstark]

What about all the other. You know, the other sailors?

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah. I mean, nameless English guy doesn't help anything.

[Georgia Hardstark]

No.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Why didn't you insist upon. I thought there would be a reveal later.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah. Like, take a photo of his driver's license so he could be like, look.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It'S Jack the Ripper.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, my God.

[Karen Kilgariff]

That's quite the island. He didn't want to give his name. We don't know much about Philip past this chapter in his life, but by most accounts, his memoir and his momentary fame don't fundamentally change his life. He goes right back to his work as a fisherman, he gets married, he has some kids, and the rest of his life is pretty hazy. We do know that he dies in 1746, in his early 40s. So to this day, Philip Ashton's unlikely survival story is widely accepted to have actually happened. Although even Philip himself, himself seems to be in disbelief over everything that he went through. Writing in his memoir that quote, I cannot take notice of the strange concurrence of divine providence. All along in saving from the rage of the pirates and the malice of the Spaniards, from the beasts of the field and the monsters of the sea. In keeping me alive amidst so many deaths, in such a lonely and helpless condition, and in bringing about my deliverance.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And that's the story of castaway Philip Ashton.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Oh, my God. The luckiest man in 1724.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Wow.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Aside from Ned Lowe, the super pirate who just got to kill and cut off lips.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah. Jesus. He's just, like, thinking of the worst possible way to torture someone here.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Cut off your lips, fry him up, and you eat him.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Make fun of my name again. Make fun of Ned. Ned.

[Karen Kilgariff]

You don't like the name Ned?

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's pussy. Okay.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Oh, okay.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Wow. Great job. Great solo story.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Thank you.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That was fun.

[Karen Kilgariff]

See the solo story. It was fun.

[Georgia Hardstark]

You were right.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It's a fun jaunt, which is what we need sometimes.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Adventure. Totally.

[Karen Kilgariff]

These days.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Good job.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Thank you.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Well, we did it. You did it. I did it. Thank you. I didn't do much.

[Karen Kilgariff]

You did what you're supposed to do.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Show my feet.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Get those tootsies up there and make us some money.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Let's get on the onlyfans.

[Karen Kilgariff]

You mean of feet Picks dot com.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Yeah.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Well, good job. Thanks, everybody.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Thanks for listening, you guys.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah. Thanks for being here. Thanks for being so understanding about the fact that we were trying to do many things at one time.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's right. And, you know, be women of the world.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Yeah, that's right. You love it when we do that.

[Georgia Hardstark]

That's your favorite part of this podcast.

[Karen Kilgariff]

It really is.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Stay sexy and don't get murdered. Goodbye, Elvis. Do you want a cookie?

[Karen Kilgariff]

This has been an exhaust. Exactly Right production.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Our senior producers are Alejandra Keck and Molly Smith.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Our editor is Aristotle Acevedo.

[Georgia Hardstark]

This episode was mixed by Liana Squillace.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Our researchers are Marin McGlashan and Ali Elkin.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Email your hometowns to my favorite murdermail.com.

[Karen Kilgariff]

Follow the show on Instagram at my favorite murder.

[Georgia Hardstark]

Listen to my favorite murder on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Karen Kilgariff]

And now you can watch us on exactly right's YouTube page while you're there. Please like and subscribe. Subscribe. Goodbye.