Georgia Hardstark (1:27)

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Karen Kilgariff (1:31)

Show your dog some love and head to ollie.com murder and use code 60% off your welcome kit when you subscribe today.

Georgia Hardstark (1:38)

Plus they offer a happiness guarantee on the first box. That's O L L I E dot com murder. Goodbye.

Karen Kilgariff (1:44)

Goodbye.

Georgia Hardstark (1:46)

Hey guys, it's Karen and Georgia and we are so thrilled that Jake Brennan's legendary true crime music podcast Disgraceland is now on the Exactly Right network.

Karen Kilgariff (1:54)

That's right. If you like true crime and music, you're going to love Disgraceland.

Georgia Hardstark (1:58)

New episodes of Disgraceland drop every Tuesday with bonus episodes on Thursday and rewinds on Sunday.

Karen Kilgariff (2:04)

And at the end of this episode we're gonna play the Disgraceland Trail. So make sure you stick around and listen to that.

Georgia Hardstark (2:09)

And after you listen, head over to Disgraceland Feed and hit follow so you can binge over 250 award winning episodes

Karen Kilgariff (2:16)

and you'll be glad you did. And don't forget to follow Disgraceland right Now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Georgia Hardstark (2:23)

Goodbye. Hello, and welcome to my favorite Murder.

Karen Kilgariff (2:44)

That's Georgia Hardstark. That's Karen Kilgariff, and today we are very excited. We have a big announcement. Two of our favorite podcasts in the world joining the Exactly Right Network. And it's such an exciting thing to be telling you about right now, everyone.

Georgia Hardstark (3:00)

Murderinos, this is Jake Brennan of Disgraceland and Hollywoodland, and he's joining Exactly Right Media.

Karen Kilgariff (3:06)

That's right, indeed.

Jake Brennan (3:07)

Yes. And I'm very happy about it. I'm very psyched. I can't believe I. This is completely surreal, actually. I feel like this has been in the works since we kind of met for the first time. It's just the universe and all the people pulling the right strings and pushing us in the right direction, and I could not be happier to be here. And just. Thanks. Yeah. I'm psyched.

Karen Kilgariff (3:29)

Yeah. Thank you.

Georgia Hardstark (3:30)

It's perfect. It's like a perfect mix. We were big fans from the beginning and like true crime podcast friends for a while. So we're glad you picked us.

Jake Brennan (3:40)

Yeah, yeah, of course. I'm glad you picked me. It's been ever since we did that event back in when my book came out. You guys were so generous with your time, and you came to that bookstore opening that I did and probably boosted sales by, like, 100%. So thank you for that, which is cool. But we had just a great time. We had great chemistry on stage together. So this is awesome.

Karen Kilgariff (4:01)

Yes. And we know our audience loves you because you did that during COVID I don't know if you remember doing that crossover with us where you told us that amazing hometown, and it's one of the most popular episodes we've ever posted.

Jake Brennan (4:14)

That blows my mind.

Karen Kilgariff (4:15)

Hell, yeah.

Jake Brennan (4:16)

Yeah. I still run into people in my hometown who are like, who asked me about that episode, which is good and bad. Cause I like to remain breathing, you know, And I don't want certain people to hear that upstairs.

Georgia Hardstark (4:27)

Well, you want to tell us, like, when you started Disgraceland and, like, what your intentions were?

Jake Brennan (4:35)

I started in 2018, and it was really just to make a music podcast that I wanted to listen to. And I grew up, obviously, you know, loving music. I played music. It's what I did with my whole young adult life.

Karen Kilgariff (4:51)

What was your first band name?

Jake Brennan (4:52)

Cast Iron Hike. It was a hardcore band from Boston and snows them.

Karen Kilgariff (4:56)

For real? Yeah. Oh, shit.

Georgia Hardstark (4:58)

You were on Victory, right?

Jake Brennan (4:59)

Yeah, we were on Victory Records. And, yeah, so we toured in.

Karen Kilgariff (5:04)

What did you play or sing?

Jake Brennan (5:06)

I was the singer I was the frontman in that band. Amazing was, you know, was in bands throughout, you know, my. My 20s and 30s, and then I had a family and I had a job at an ad agency, and I was doing music licensing, and I was really bad at it, and I knew I was gonna get fired.

Georgia Hardstark (5:20)

And I was like, so corporate.

Jake Brennan (5:21)

I know, but it was, like, the coolest ad agency, too. It wasn't corporate, but I still sucked at it. And I was like, what the hell am I gonna do? And I knew. This is, like, right when podcasts. You guys started in 16, right. So I remember you guys were around, and I was into, like, S Town and Cereal and Crimetown. And I was like, I'm gonna start a podcast. And my only ambition was that I thought it might lead to some sort of work in audio.

Georgia Hardstark (5:47)

Yeah.

Jake Brennan (5:48)

And I launched it, and it was just this music and true crime mix. And the true crime thing came from. I knew I wanted to tell music stories, but, you know, my whole life I've been the guy, like, in the van with my bandmates being like, I gotta tell you the story about this thing to the point where they're like, dude, shut up.

Karen Kilgariff (6:08)

Shut up.

Georgia Hardstark (6:08)

We know that.

Karen Kilgariff (6:09)

Well, we know that feel.

Jake Brennan (6:11)

And I knew that the stories I wanted to tell, I didn't want to just do, like, music biographies and stuff that's already been done a million times. I wanted to tell the stories that I wanted to hear. So that's where the true crime piece came from. It. And then I remember it was like a month after I launched the first episode and it took off, and I came out here to LA to meet with some folks. I remember being in my hotel room and you guys had mentioned Disgraceland. I think you mentioned the Norwegian Black Metal episode or something like that.

Karen Kilgariff (6:40)

Yeah.

Jake Brennan (6:40)

And that was the biggest thing I was. My favorite Murder is talking about Disgraceland. Oh, my God. And it just blew my mind. And here we are all these years later, which is.

Karen Kilgariff (6:51)

I never heard that. I didn't realize that that happened that way for you.

Jake Brennan (6:54)

Yeah.

Georgia Hardstark (6:54)

I feel that's so, like. Yeah, we got the same thing from.

Karen Kilgariff (6:58)

Oh, Jack o'. Brien.

Georgia Hardstark (6:59)

Yeah.

Jake Brennan (7:00)

From scratch.

Georgia Hardstark (7:01)

Like, he did that for us, and so we're honored to do that, too.

Jake Brennan (7:05)

Very cool. Very cool.

Karen Kilgariff (7:06)

Thank you. We're paying it for Jack o' Brien style.

Jake Brennan (7:08)

Yeah, exactly. He'll be psyched to hear that. He's a good dude.

Georgia Hardstark (7:11)

Yeah, he is.

Karen Kilgariff (7:12)

He's the best.

Georgia Hardstark (7:14)

What was your first show?

Jake Brennan (7:15)

Well, this is kind of. This is gonna sound a little weird, and it might Sound like I'm making this shit up, but I swear to God, I'm not. Like, I saw the Ramones when I was 10 years old. And I have a trepidation in telling this story. Cause I literally got. I got beat up for this. Later in the course of my adolescence from like, you know, once the punk rockers started coming around. Like, I saw the Ramones. Cause my dad opened up for them. My dad was in a band.

Karen Kilgariff (7:39)

Oh, wow.

Jake Brennan (7:39)

And I remember I was too young to really know what it was, but my dad was cool enough and still is and just cool to know that he should bring his son to this, right? And I remember him telling me, because I was into the Beach Boys at the time. I remember him telling me, they're like, the Beach Boys, they're just really loud.

Karen Kilgariff (7:54)

It's true.

Jake Brennan (7:55)

It is kind of true. But it was at a point in Ramon's career, like in the early to mid-80s, when they were kind of like, they weren't what they were in the beginning or what they were by the time the 90s rolled around. But it was a great experience. And just being backstage and like, looking up at, you know, 20 foot tall Joey Ramone being like, oh, my God, what? Sort of. I go back to my little central Massachusetts hometown and whatever, it's just the Ramones. But then five years later or whatever, when I'm in my early teens and all my friends start listening to punk rock, all my older friends who all of a sudden weren't, they were like, acdc isn't cool. I'm like, fuck you.

Georgia Hardstark (8:30)

ACDC's not cool.

Jake Brennan (8:31)

What are you saying? So that was already a point of contention. Cause I wouldn't give up heavy metal. But I was like, you know, I saw the Ramones. You know, I was like, no, you didn't. You're lying.

Karen Kilgariff (8:41)

Immediately. Fist fly.

Jake Brennan (8:42)

Yeah, pretty much. Pretty Bearded Hill, Clinton, Mass. Yeah, that was what it was like back in the 80s.

Karen Kilgariff (8:48)

Serious.

Georgia Hardstark (8:49)

Wow. Boys.

Karen Kilgariff (8:50)

Serious group of boys.

Jake Brennan (8:51)

Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Karen Kilgariff (8:52)

Well, what was your first true crime story that piqued your interest or got you obsessed with those kinds of stories?

Jake Brennan (9:00)

Yeah, we were talking about this the other night, and it was. The first one was Helter Skelter and the Manson story and reading Helter Skelter. I was grounded a lot as a kid. And I spent a lot of time alone in my bedroom reading and listening to music. And this is the result. America.

Karen Kilgariff (9:17)

That's right. Right.

Georgia Hardstark (9:19)

Like, we're college dropouts. And I'm like, tell me someone is doing better than us.

Jake Brennan (9:24)

Hey, wait till you get asked back to speak at the schools you drop out of.

Georgia Hardstark (9:30)

Santa Monica City College. Here I go, SAC State.

Karen Kilgariff (9:32)

I have nothing to tell you.

Jake Brennan (9:33)

Honorary degrees. So Helter Skelter. And I remember reading In Cold Blood shortly after that by Truman Capote. And I was actually thinking about that last night because I just started watching the Feud thing with Capote, which is fantastic. So Helter Skelter and In Cold Blood. But I was always. I had a subscription to Rolling Stone. I had a subscription to Spin, and I had all those cool, like, Rolling Stone anthologies that they would kind of mass market in the 80s and 90s, so you could read all the backstories. And I remember reading this story about Jerry Lee Lewis allegedly getting away with murdering one of his wives. And it was so wild to me that this was in Rolling Stone. And it was also so wild to me that his nickname is the Killer. I was like, are you fucking.

Georgia Hardstark (10:23)

Like everyone knows and no one's trying to hide it?

Jake Brennan (10:25)

Yes, exactly.

Georgia Hardstark (10:26)

And he's getting away with it because he's famous.

Karen Kilgariff (10:28)

Because he's famous. It's almost like a cute joke, right? Can you believe this guy?

Jake Brennan (10:32)

Yes.

Karen Kilgariff (10:33)

He plays the piano, but he also murders women.

Jake Brennan (10:35)

Right. And then you say it, and people

Georgia Hardstark (10:37)

are like, how dare you?

Jake Brennan (10:38)

Yeah. They're like, no. I'm like, yes. So that was the first episode of Disgraceland. That's actually where I got the name Disgraceland is, because that's what they called Jerry Lee's home in Nesbitt, Mississippi, which was a few miles from Elvis's Graceland. And it stood in contrast to that.

Karen Kilgariff (10:53)

That's such a good episode, too.

Georgia Hardstark (10:54)

What a good, not coming of age story. What's the origin story?

Jake Brennan (11:00)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Karen Kilgariff (11:02)

That's a good one.

Jake Brennan (11:03)

Yeah. But the story in Rolling Stone on Jerry Lee Lewis was super true crimey. Super true crimey. And that's sort of like my. Like, I'm researching the Foo Fighters right now. And, you know, I was thinking about this this morning in anticipation of coming on here, and I got really excited about this story about Dave Grohl in Europe with the hardcore band Scream, that he played for the DC hardcore band, and he's getting chased down an alley from heroin addicts with a knife. And I'm like, this is amazing. I get all excited. I'm taking notes about it, and, you know, you can tell the story of young Dave Grohl, sort of his origin story, going on tour in Europe with a hardcore band and be like, oh, they played in this venue and there 20 people there, but they played their hearts out. Or you can be like, yeah, they were playing this venue, okay, but beforehand they were getting chased by heroin addicts with knives. It's just like, it really enhances the performance and it's more interesting to me, at least.

Georgia Hardstark (11:56)

That's so true. Like, asking those same questions that every interviewer asks instead, asking some kind of weirder shit that, like, makes it more interesting or makes it, like, less of a biography than a. Yeah, yeah.

Jake Brennan (12:08)

It's our own take on biography. It's the way you guys tell stories as well. I mean, it's not apples to apples, but your point of view is. Both of your points of view is so strong and unique that, I mean, there are a lot of people who tell true crime stories, but obviously they're not as entertaining. And that's because of the point of view, I think, which makes it awesome.

Georgia Hardstark (12:29)

Thank you. Same, of course.

Karen Kilgariff (12:31)

Yeah. Your point of view. There is a piece of it where it's like, I didn't know if you were a musicologist. I couldn't tell if you were, like, in a band. When I heard that first episode and first got into it, it was a brand new thing. All the. It's like, is this guy a journalist? Is. He sounds like a musician? Like, all those things, which is kind of like, we've said this before. What I love about podcasting, where it's like, if you have a point of view and it's strong enough and you're interested enough and you've already done your time, the research was your life growing up and being in bands on loving music.

Jake Brennan (13:03)

Right. And dropping out of college and being in a shitty van with your band. And I remember before, you know, back to the ad agency thing and, like, knowing I was gonna lose my job, I asked one of my best friends, Adam, who recorded a bunch of my music back in, and my wife, I asked them the same question. I was like, if you could hire me for one job, what would it be? And they both gave me a version of the same answer. And Adam was like, I'd pay to just go in the control room and tell me stories. Fuck, that's so cool. My wife was like, I'd pay to tell stories. I was like, what? And I was like, I have to do this.

Georgia Hardstark (13:36)

Yeah, that's a great way to figure out what you want to do with your life. Like, what are the things like? I mean, I guess my thing would just be snacks. So you can't really fucking just talk

Karen Kilgariff (13:45)

about snacks or it's somebody else telling you I want to watch you eat snacks or I want to hear you review snacks. Review snacks.

Georgia Hardstark (13:53)

I don't want to hear you eat snacks.

Jake Brennan (13:54)

Well, that could be a thing.

Karen Kilgariff (13:55)

Yeah, that's a different part of you too, right?

Georgia Hardstark (13:59)

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Karen Kilgariff (16:32)

Well, it's interesting, though, but you come to that where you're kind of like, trying to crowdsource, hey, I want to do a thing. I'm not sure. Cut to, years later where you are. Do we have that picture of Jake and his very famous friend that he got to meet because of this podcast? Sir Elton John is a fan of Disgrace.

Georgia Hardstark (16:50)

How did this happen?

Jake Brennan (16:51)

Yeah, that was.

Georgia Hardstark (16:53)

How do we do this?

Jake Brennan (16:54)

What you can't see in that picture is that I am on no sleep after, like, two days of being on a plane. It is complete madness how this took place. I can't even believe it happened. It's like a fever dream. I was actually on my way to Denver from Boston to go do a live version of Disgraceland, and I was with my buddy Jackson, and we were gonna go see the Rolling Stones. Now, I've missed out on seeing the Rolling Stones, my favorite picture band, so many times for various reasons. I literally. My friend Adam was once like, you know, the studio we recorded at, I woke up the next day, had all these messages. Ron Wood was at the studio, and I just missed it. It's the word, you know? So, anyhow, I'm going out to play this show in Denver and I. And. And then we're gonna go see the Rolling Stones. And then I was gonna go to LA and meet with some people, and I'm at Logan parking my car, and I get a call from Connell from Iheart, and he was like, hey, you know, if you could interview Elton John, if that opportunity came up, would you do that? I know you don't do interviews, but would you do. I'm like, fuck, yeah, I would do that. Are you kidding me? He's like, can you be in Milan in 48 hours?

Georgia Hardstark (18:11)

Oh, my God.

Jake Brennan (18:12)

I'm like, yes, yes. And no idea how I was going to do that, but just say yes. This is a lesson. Like, don't worry. If you figure it out.

Karen Kilgariff (18:21)

Details come later.

Jake Brennan (18:21)

Yeah. So at the time, I was working with somebody. We were working on an adaptation of Disgraceland for tv, and he's friends with Elton John, and he had just stayed with Elton John and had played him a Disgraceland episode. So when Elton was doing the promotion for the biopic that came out about Elton John, I don't know how the mechanics of it happened, but they were like, who's gonna interview? And my name came up and. And that was it. So it's so cool. I had to go to Denver, do the show.

Georgia Hardstark (18:52)

Oh, you did it. I was gonna say, did you do a makeup show for them?

Karen Kilgariff (18:55)

Cause, yeah. Really? Because it's like, everything's canceled. I think they would have understood Elton's calling.

Jake Brennan (19:00)

They were amazing. And they had no idea. I was just like, on cloud night. So we figured out we could do it. I couldn't go see the Stones. Jackson still came with me. Cause he's awesome.

Karen Kilgariff (19:07)

To Milan.

Jake Brennan (19:08)

No, not to Milan. He's not that awesome. To Denver. I did the show. I got up at, like, three in the morning. I slept for, like an hour. And I had to go back to JFK and then fly to Milan, and it was already tight. And by the time I got to, it was one of those. One of those things where you get to the airport, it's delayed, and you're going like, I can make. I can. I can still do this. And then you get on the plane, and you're delayed on the plane. So I'm like, literally texting Elton John's husband, being like, dude, I don't know if I'm gonna fucking get there, but. And then I'm texting my wife. I'm like, I don't know if I'm gonna fucking get there, but I'm going to Milan to have breakfast, apparently, and I'll be back. And I fully did not expect to be able to do it. I get there. It's the whole thing. The guy with the sign at the airport, you know, I get picked up. They're just flying like, you know, Italian driver, fast times ten, because we're late. And I don't want to give it away where he was staying, but I go there, and I'm brought up to this suite. And they walk me in, and I. I walk in. It's. It's more than a suite. It's like a whole apartment. And I get to, like, the study. And he's sitting there, and I see he's reading an email that I had sent to somebody with the questions, like, my email. And he's like, oh, hi, Jake. How are you? And I'm like, what do I call you?

Karen Kilgariff (20:21)

Can I call you?

Jake Brennan (20:21)

Do I call me sir? Can I call you? He's like, elton. I'm like, elton, where's your bathroom? Postscript. I go to use the restroom, and he's like, outside in his office suite type situation. And I'm in the restroom. I'm sleep deprived. I'm a mess. And I'm like, I couldn't figure out how to flush the toilet. It's one of those European.

Georgia Hardstark (20:45)

Does Milan have a different flushing system?

Jake Brennan (20:48)

All of Europe? It's like, what are they doing with their plumbing? I don't know.

Karen Kilgariff (20:51)

It's rich people stuff.

Georgia Hardstark (20:52)

It's very old.

Jake Brennan (20:53)

Yeah. So I'm like, what? I'm like, okay, I gotta go out and I have to ask Elton John how to flush the fucking toilet. My other option is I just pretend. And then Elton John's gonna be like, who is this barbarian who doesn't flush the toilet?

Karen Kilgariff (21:04)

Disgusting. There's no good option there.

Jake Brennan (21:07)

There's no good option. Second American. So thankfully, I figured it out. It was like the flusher was like, flush, pun intended, I guess, on the back of, like, wallpapered.

Georgia Hardstark (21:17)

Oh, it was like a rich person.

Jake Brennan (21:18)

It was the secret, like, doop. And it worked. And I went out and we did the interview, and it went off without a hitch.

Karen Kilgariff (21:24)

Thank God. That could have ended really differently.

Jake Brennan (21:27)

Yes. Yes. Oh, before we go any further, I have stuff for you guys.

Karen Kilgariff (21:31)

Oh, yay.

Jake Brennan (21:32)

Is that cool?

Karen Kilgariff (21:32)

Absolutely.

Jake Brennan (21:33)

Okay. I got these for both of you. This. All right. So when we did that show in la, I tried doing this. Then I went record shopping for you guys.

Karen Kilgariff (21:49)

Oh, yeah, that's right. Yes. I love this.

Jake Brennan (21:52)

And I flew from San Francisco to la and I left, like, all the records on the plane. So I'm like, I'm doing it this time. I'm doing it this time. Cause I knew I was gonna see. So. Okay, so I got.

Georgia Hardstark (22:05)

Are these the exact same ones that you picked?

Jake Brennan (22:06)

These are not the exact same ones. These are cooler, I think.

Georgia Hardstark (22:08)

Okay, cool.

Jake Brennan (22:08)

I don't remember really what the last ones were, but these are. These all have either some significance with you guys, the show, the whole, you know, whatever. They all have some meaning. So. Karen, I know you have some Stevie Nicks badassery in your past.

Karen Kilgariff (22:25)

Yes, I do.

Jake Brennan (22:26)

So I saw that. And I was like, this is. You know, it's got edge of 17 on it.

Georgia Hardstark (22:31)

Oh my God.

Jake Brennan (22:32)

I think there's an aunt with a Chevy SS Super Sport in your.

Karen Kilgariff (22:36)

My cousin Lisa, who had this eight track in her Chevy Super Sport with the back jacked up that she used to Drive me to 4H meetings going 120 miles an hour on the back roads of Petaluma. Also stopped dragging my heart around on this album, which is one of my favorite songs of all time.

Jake Brennan (22:51)

Amazing.

Georgia Hardstark (22:52)

Tell everyone in the audience what it is.

Karen Kilgariff (22:54)

This is the Stevie Nick's album Belladonna.

Jake Brennan (22:57)

Yeah. Well, we're talking about the greatness of

Karen Kilgariff (23:00)

who took this picture.

Jake Brennan (23:02)

Yes. It wasn't Tom Petty.

Karen Kilgariff (23:06)

So amazing.

Jake Brennan (23:07)

Okay. This is another from the same era. This is a recent episode of Disgraceland. This is the Pretenders. Fantastic album. And just Chrissy Hines badassery has transmutated itself onto you in some fashion. So.

Karen Kilgariff (23:22)

Oh, what an honor.

Georgia Hardstark (23:23)

I love this. I was just listening to this episode and she is just a badass.

Jake Brennan (23:27)

She really is. And a lot of people don't know. I mean, she was almost in the Clash. I know she was almost in the Sex Pistol. She was almost in the Damned. And you're thinking like, oh, that would have been awesome. And I'm like, no. Cause then the Pretenders wouldn't have happened. Yes.

Georgia Hardstark (23:38)

Right.

Karen Kilgariff (23:39)

And when you watch those videos of her from the 80s, like, first of all, thank you so much. Cause this might be the best compliment I've ever gotten in my life to even be slightly associated with Chrissy Hine. But when you watch those videos of her and those Pretender songs, they're so original and individual to her. Like, I don't see her being in other people's bands. It's her.

Jake Brennan (24:00)

The word icon gets overused these days, in my opinion. She is iconic. She truly is. And this, I don't know if you know this, but this is a quintessential LA record. And Arthur Lee from Love has a kind of true crime past as well.

Georgia Hardstark (24:14)

So say what it is.

Jake Brennan (24:15)

So there you go.

Georgia Hardstark (24:16)

Love.

Jake Brennan (24:17)

Love with Arthur Lee.

Karen Kilgariff (24:18)

Reel to Reel is the band. When it was like this, I thought it was the Go Gos, the first album where I'm like, yes, you've nailed it. But now I'll listen to this. Cause it's something I don't know. Arthur Lee.

Jake Brennan (24:29)

I guar. I guarantee you that Charlotte Caffeine from the Go Go's was listening to that album when she was writing a lot of the riffs that were on the first Go Go's album for sure.

Karen Kilgariff (24:38)

I'm sorry. Can you just look at this group of people real quick?

Georgia Hardstark (24:41)

Oh, wow.

Karen Kilgariff (24:41)

This is like LA 1972.ish.

Georgia Hardstark (24:45)

They've met Charles Manson.

Jake Brennan (24:46)

Yeah.

Georgia Hardstark (24:46)

I thought he was a fucking 74.

Jake Brennan (24:49)

74.

Karen Kilgariff (24:50)

Amazing. Thank you.

Jake Brennan (24:51)

You got it. All right, so, Georgia, who am I? Moving on. Who am I?

Karen Kilgariff (24:55)

Get to know yourself through Jake Brennan.

Jake Brennan (24:58)

I don't want to that pressure.

Georgia Hardstark (24:59)

This is Liza Minnelli. I'm gonna be offended.

Karen Kilgariff (25:02)

It's all show tunes.

Jake Brennan (25:05)

Kinda goth show tunes by the Cramps. So I know about the Danzig in Henry Rollins lore in my favorite murder. And I actually was looking for a Danzig album. Couldn't find it. This is actually better.

Georgia Hardstark (25:15)

I know. Yeah.

Jake Brennan (25:15)

The first Kramps record is just. You cannot mess with this album.

Georgia Hardstark (25:18)

Thank you. This is amazing. This is the Kramp's greatest hits. I don't own this. It's so beautiful. I'm honored. Where is this? Is this the ballroom?

Jake Brennan (25:27)

The mental institution.

Karen Kilgariff (25:28)

Oh, this is not the mental institution.

Jake Brennan (25:29)

No, it's not the mental institution one, but it' just. I'm not exactly sure where that picture's from, but great songs on that album.

Georgia Hardstark (25:34)

I fucking love this. And I love that. They were in Glendale.

Jake Brennan (25:38)

Yeah. Where they were living later on.

Karen Kilgariff (25:40)

Just hanging out around here.

Jake Brennan (25:42)

I gotta say, it is serial killer y around here, isn't it?

Georgia Hardstark (25:45)

Burbank.

Jake Brennan (25:46)

It really is. It's truly like a lot of cement

Georgia Hardstark (25:50)

and like long blocks of nothing.

Karen Kilgariff (25:52)

Yeah. Dirt. There's dirt lots. We're like, what's over in the corner over there for. Just keep driving.

Jake Brennan (25:58)

Yeah. There's a lot of places to dump bodies.

Georgia Hardstark (26:00)

Totally. Or like the Hillside Strangler had the their auto shop right around here.

Karen Kilgariff (26:05)

Very close to here.

Jake Brennan (26:06)

Really.

Karen Kilgariff (26:07)

And that alone is like what portal to hell opened where that took place.

Jake Brennan (26:11)

Exactly. Right. You gotta be careful. You can get sucked into that portal.

Karen Kilgariff (26:14)

Yeah.

Jake Brennan (26:15)

Speaking of portals to hell, Evan Dando's this is Come On, Feel the Lemonheads, which is not the one with all the hits, but it's still amazing. It's not. It's a shame about Rhea. I actually think this is better. And it's a 90s connection. Gen X, you know, I love that I am. And I'm from Boston, so there you go.

Georgia Hardstark (26:34)

Oh, my God. It's beautiful. Thank you.

Karen Kilgariff (26:36)

And also, Evan Dando's one of the most beautiful people on the planet.

Jake Brennan (26:39)

He really, truly is. You know, I toured with him for a quick like three or four days. Just me, him, and my friend Greg Conley was tour managing and in addition to all the insanity times a million that you could imagine from him, he was the sweetest guy, and he never said a negative thing about. About anybody.

Georgia Hardstark (26:59)

Wow. That's hard to do.

Jake Brennan (27:01)

And it really. I even baited him a couple times. I was, like, reading Rolston. I wonder about this. You know what I mean? He, like, wouldn't go there.

Georgia Hardstark (27:07)

I don't think I could be friends with someone. Cause, like, that's how I bond with people, is, like, just talking some shit, you know?

Jake Brennan (27:12)

It was a real eye opener for me. It really was classy. It was such a strong thing that it wasn't an accident. You know what I mean? Like, he must have had some governing instinct when he was a kid to kind of make him that way, which is.

Karen Kilgariff (27:24)

Or maybe it's just his life as a beautiful person where he's like, everybody's okay. Or you're just like, you need to get kicked in the teeth a couple.

Jake Brennan (27:31)

Right. What's wrong with life when doors just fly open for you and supermodels want to sleep with you? Everybody wants to give you all their drugs.

Karen Kilgariff (27:36)

They give you drugs and food all the time. It's, like, not my experience.

Jake Brennan (27:39)

Yeah. Yeah. Wish this didn't call me up and invite me on tour, dude. I don't know what you're talking about.

Georgia Hardstark (27:43)

Okay. This is so cool.

Jake Brennan (27:44)

All right. You know this kind of like the Arthur Lee thing, the love album. I went for a little more obscure here. This is the Leuven Brothers, Satan is Real, which. Look at that. That looks like a Slayer album cover from, like, the 1950s or 40s.

Georgia Hardstark (27:55)

I love it. It's heavy. I know this song. It's fucking incredible. It's like a gospel song about Satan is real, which is, like, they're, like, anti Satan, but you could listen to it.

Jake Brennan (28:05)

It's a warning. It's very much Satan is real. Watch out what you're doing.

Georgia Hardstark (28:09)

I love this is like. Feel this. It's heavy.

Jake Brennan (28:12)

Yeah.

Karen Kilgariff (28:13)

This is when the music was really weighty.

Georgia Hardstark (28:15)

This is incredible. I'm gonna put it on our record wall. We have, like, the record wall thing.

Jake Brennan (28:20)

Nice. So there you go.

Georgia Hardstark (28:21)

Thank you so much.

Jake Brennan (28:22)

You're welcome.

Karen Kilgariff (28:23)

I'm gonna listen to the drunkards doom by myself. So good.

Jake Brennan (28:27)

The Levin brothers are good for that, for sure. And they hate each other and hated each other and wanted to kill each other.

Georgia Hardstark (28:32)

So are they brothers for real, though?

Jake Brennan (28:33)

Oh, yeah. There's a Disgraceland episode coming on. The Leuven Brothers. Yes.

Georgia Hardstark (28:36)

How long does it take you to. Because you get deep we do homework podcasts, but it's like a week of homework. You do same.

Jake Brennan (28:44)

Yeah, but to what Karen was saying earlier, it's a life's long kind of baseline education and understanding of this stuff. And then the week of research is I kind of know where the bodies are buried, so to speak, and where to look. And it wasn't always like that. I mean, the first episode took like six months, almost a year to put. Put together. Just the first episode, you know? Cause you're just figuring things out. You don't know what's what. But yeah, it's a week to research, and then it's a week to write, and then I don't know how long the guys take to produce it. Cause we have a production cycle, but, you know, call it a week for that.

Karen Kilgariff (29:24)

Guys, don't wave your hands like that. They can see us right now.

Georgia Hardstark (29:28)

George is like, no, are you kidding me?

Karen Kilgariff (29:31)

There's the phone. Lyanna walks out.

Georgia Hardstark (29:33)

The only reason, truly the only reason. Thank you, guys.

Karen Kilgariff (29:36)

Oh, and I was gonna make a confession that I love that merch that you have your bag, which is basically four of your big stories. I could not finish the big Lurch episode. Yeah, it was the most horrifying story.

Jake Brennan (29:52)

Yeah, it's pretty horrifying.

Karen Kilgariff (29:53)

It was so bad. And I just, like. I remember where I was. It was my old house in the backyard. And then I just, oh, no, no, no, I can't do this. And I was like, I don't really have. You know, as we people who listen to true crime or pay attention to it. It's like you're used to certain things. That story is so above and beyond.

Jake Brennan (30:11)

Yeah. Cannibalism is above and beyond all of it. And it's tough. I've run into that a lot. I'm coming up on one, actually, that I don't know how I'm gonna tell Gigi Allen. No, that was. That I could get through that was just feces. I could work my way through that. The Nazis and. Yeah, but the Ian Watkins Lost profits thing, I've never done anything that involves kids. He was such a dirtbag, and he died in a way that, you know, I don't like seeing violence being foisted upon anybody. But it was just. It's a very dramatic story, and it's kind of a current story.

Karen Kilgariff (30:47)

So.

Georgia Hardstark (30:48)

Which one is that? I don't know.

Jake Brennan (30:49)

Lost profits. I haven't done it yet. It's on.

Karen Kilgariff (30:51)

It's a horrible act of pedophilia that's, like, so beyond Shocking that you're just kind of like, what in the living fuck happened to you?

Jake Brennan (30:58)

Exactly, yeah. It's horrible.

Georgia Hardstark (31:00)

Are there any that you won't do? Like, we have true crime stories that we just don't cover because it's just the dregs of humanity and it's the absolute worst. And there's no way to like spin it the way we like to do with like victims advocacy and like making it a story that's somehow palatable.

Jake Brennan (31:14)

Yeah.

Georgia Hardstark (31:15)

You have those.

Jake Brennan (31:16)

Yeah, I do. I do. I have a couple. And for various reasons, again, the kids thing, like, everyone's like, you should do a Gary Glitter episode. I'm like, I don't. I'm good, man. I don't want my head now. But with the Ian Watkins thing, I think I know how to do it. I've tried doing the Elliot Smith story. I researched it, that ending. And there's a lot there that his friends. You can just tell there's such love for him. And it's so sad. And I'm not saying I won't do it at some point. I just don't know how to do it and have really a reason to do it. Cause I don't have a point of view. Honestly.

Georgia Hardstark (31:49)

Same. I've thought about doing it.

Jake Brennan (31:50)

It is literally heartbreaking. That's what it was for him for sure.

Karen Kilgariff (31:54)

Also, I feel like he was this entity that was doing a thing from my experience. Like the first. I remember where I was when my friend put that CD in her car CD player and was like, you have to hear this. And then we just sat there like, uh, oh, am I going to sob so hard? I never stop crying. Like, what's happening to me? And later, this is my big brag. And I'm sure I've told you this already, but he would play at Largo where we would do comedy shows. So there was crossover. And he came and did when me and Mary Lynn did Girls Guitar Club. And he came and was our guest on the show.

Georgia Hardstark (32:27)

Oh my gosh.

Karen Kilgariff (32:28)

Just cause he was in town and like Flanagan got him to do it or whatever. And I think we had 18 people in the crowd. It was not a sellout show in any way. My friend David still thanks me for like, I can't believe I was there when I got to see that intimate show.

Jake Brennan (32:41)

Did he play his own songs?

Karen Kilgariff (32:42)

Yep.

Georgia Hardstark (32:42)

Oh my God.

Karen Kilgariff (32:43)

He came and played.

Georgia Hardstark (32:44)

I was about to have a. Like, I saw him once. That doesn't even come.

Karen Kilgariff (32:48)

But then afterwards. Here's my double brag, triple brag. Is that afterwards we were standing in the back. Cause our actual. That I did with my friend Mary Lynn. It was all just like, play the guitar, even if you don't know how to. And then we'd, like, go into a cover where we're barely doing, like, the open chords and stuff. And it got a little bit better as it went on. Very obnoxious.

Georgia Hardstark (33:07)

I just. I saw it. I was in the crowd watching you. Not that night, unfortunately.

Karen Kilgariff (33:12)

I know. You should have come to our Valentine show.

Georgia Hardstark (33:14)

It was really great.

Jake Brennan (33:15)

You were at the Money Money Bostones, or you were at some punk show.

Karen Kilgariff (33:18)

She's at full ska.

Georgia Hardstark (33:20)

Thank you.

Karen Kilgariff (33:21)

But all I was gonna say is that I got to have a conversation with him after because he was complimenting what we did, where I was like, please don't do this. I'll have a nervous breakdown. And then he started talking to me about how much his voice bothered him and that he didn't like. And I watched a person who I was like, this is what artists do to themselves. Nothing's good enough. It's always bad. It's this thing where you think you're dis. And him, as a person who was the least disappointing performer and musician I felt like I'd ever kind of experienced Every time I watched him perform, like, when he was on the Oscars, and it was, like, so vulnerable. Everyone was so wrapped. And it was like. And it was perfection. And that song was. It was such a time and place. And to hear him just being like, I'm sorry. I wish my voice was better. Where I was like, no, no, no, Please don't do it. And that it inspired me later, because I love to pull myself apart and be like. And that's why you don't do anything. And it's like, if that man did that to himself, like, if only delusion or whatever it is to just not do that to yourself, to keep going. How it could have perhaps been different. And maybe it's like, many wouldn't have been himself. But it made me later just go, don't shut the door on yourself. Cause you've decided it isn't good when people love it.

Jake Brennan (34:35)

Right? Right.

Georgia Hardstark (34:36)

I love that.

Jake Brennan (34:36)

Yeah, I love that, too. And that's the thing with art. It's the best art. I don't care what medium it is. It's risky. Whether it's a guy who doesn't like his voice but sings like an angel or it's a comedian, ends up talking into a microphone all the time and has to push past whatever you're thinking about with your voice. And I think we all kind of do that and for in some weird cosmic spiritual, call it whatever you want way. That risk, the energy of taking that risk ends up in the work. And I feel like it ends up attracting people. You know what I mean? Like, it makes it. I don't know. I don't know. It's magic. That's why you can't define it.

Karen Kilgariff (35:18)

You know, there's like a seventh sense of like, oh, that's a human being actually being a human being.

Jake Brennan (35:23)

Right.

Karen Kilgariff (35:24)

Like right in front of us. Like, go over there. Cause that's permission then. Like, you're doing it now. I can do it.

Georgia Hardstark (35:29)

Yes. And you can connect with it in a way that's not just like corporate.

Jake Brennan (35:33)

Yeah, for real.

Georgia Hardstark (35:34)

We were going to play a game.

Karen Kilgariff (35:35)

Do you want to do musical Mad Libs? Sure.

Georgia Hardstark (35:38)

Yeah.

Jake Brennan (35:39)

I've never played Musical Mad Libs. Well, I'm a little scared.

Karen Kilgariff (35:42)

Our producer, Kate Schellenbach.

Georgia Hardstark (35:44)

I haven't either.

Karen Kilgariff (35:44)

You might know her from Luscious Jackson.

Jake Brennan (35:46)

You know, it's kind of odd that you have a member of your staff who's actually been in a Disgraceland episode. When I got connected with her on email, I was like, oh, fuck. Oh, shit. And I google wor her name in my Beastie Boys episode just to make sure it was cool. And thank you, Kate, for being cool.

Georgia Hardstark (36:02)

Yeah, that's like our, like, exactly right. Brag. Is that Kate Schellenbach works with us?

Jake Brennan (36:07)

Yeah. I've been on a thread with my family all day talking about how I was going to hang out with a Beastie Boy. No offense, guys.

Karen Kilgariff (36:14)

Oh, I see. You know, get the fuck out of here. Yeah, really.

Georgia Hardstark (36:19)

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Karen Kilgariff (36:24)

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Karen Kilgariff (37:01)

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Georgia Hardstark (37:06)

Goodbye.

Karen Kilgariff (37:07)

Eight years ago, Katie Cannon was playing in the backyard of her family home the day she went missing.

Georgia Hardstark (37:12)

When she was found, she was uncovered alive in a 3,000-year-old sarcophagus.

Karen Kilgariff (37:16)

What happened to Katie?

Georgia Hardstark (37:18)

From the studio that brought you weapons and producers James Wan and Blumhouse comes a terrifying new vision.

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On April 17, discover the truth. Lee Cronin's the Mummy. Some things are meant to stay buried.

Georgia Hardstark (37:29)

Only in theaters and in IMAX April. Rated R under 17. Not admitted without parent. Goodbye. Goodbye.

Karen Kilgariff (37:36)

Allergy season always has a way of sneaking up on you.

Georgia Hardstark (37:39)

One minute you're listening to your favorite podcast, the next it's non stop sneezing and a runny nose.

Karen Kilgariff (37:44)

That's why it's essential to keep Kleenex Ultra Soft tissues on hand. They're silky soft for up to 100% irritation, free skin and allergist approved so when allergies hit.

Georgia Hardstark (37:54)

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Ultra Soft tissues for whatever happens to next. Grab Kleenex.

Georgia Hardstark (38:00)

Goodbye.

Karen Kilgariff (38:03)

Okay, so I'm not gonna tell you the song, obviously.

Jake Brennan (38:06)

And I think, what am I doing here? What's the.

Georgia Hardstark (38:08)

You know, Mad Libs?

Karen Kilgariff (38:09)

Have you ever played Mad Libs? So I'm just gonna ask you for random nouns.

Jake Brennan (38:12)

The one with the battleships, right?

Karen Kilgariff (38:15)

Do you drop the checkers in? I'll just be asking you for forms of the English language, and then we're gonna be plugging them in and reading new lyrics to an old song.

Georgia Hardstark (38:24)

Oh, it's lyrics.

Jake Brennan (38:25)

Am I supposed to know grammar here?

Karen Kilgariff (38:26)

I know this is hard.

Jake Brennan (38:29)

I'm like, fuck, I'm.

Georgia Hardstark (38:30)

Dude, I'm so glad you said it before me.

Karen Kilgariff (38:33)

There's no adverbs, guys.

Jake Brennan (38:34)

Okay? Verb and noun, otherwise. I've written a book, though. How did that happen?

Karen Kilgariff (38:40)

How did you get those?

Georgia Hardstark (38:41)

Editors. Editors. Editors, Editors.

Karen Kilgariff (38:44)

So we are starting with adjective.

Jake Brennan (38:46)

Okay, I got you.

Georgia Hardstark (38:47)

I think I know that one.

Karen Kilgariff (38:48)

That's a description word. Yeah, got that. So any kind of descriptor? Good, bad, sideways?

Georgia Hardstark (38:55)

Oh, any. Oh, that's right. It's just any.

Karen Kilgariff (38:57)

Yeah.

Georgia Hardstark (38:58)

What you got?

Jake Brennan (39:01)

Stinky.

Georgia Hardstark (39:03)

Yes.

Karen Kilgariff (39:04)

And as like fourth grade as you can be with these words, I think it's more fun in Mad Libs.

Georgia Hardstark (39:09)

Right? You have a fourth grader, right? So you.

Jake Brennan (39:11)

I have a sixth grader and a second grader.

Georgia Hardstark (39:15)

Oh, perfect.

Karen Kilgariff (39:16)

Do they like Mad Libs? Have they done this?

Jake Brennan (39:18)

I don't think they have, actually.

Georgia Hardstark (39:20)

Come on, stop depriving your children. For real?

Karen Kilgariff (39:22)

What are you.

Jake Brennan (39:23)

They don't know that The Internet exists yet?

Karen Kilgariff (39:25)

Oh, that's great.

Jake Brennan (39:26)

We're working up to Mad Libs.

Karen Kilgariff (39:29)

Okay, so. Well, this next one is good. Natural disaster.

Jake Brennan (39:33)

Oh, any natural disaster. Or historical natural disaster.

Karen Kilgariff (39:36)

Whatever you want.

Jake Brennan (39:37)

Hurricane.

Georgia Hardstark (39:39)

Okay.

Karen Kilgariff (39:39)

Now. Body part.

Jake Brennan (39:42)

Penis.

Georgia Hardstark (39:43)

Sure.

Jake Brennan (39:44)

I figured I would just take it there.

Karen Kilgariff (39:45)

I'm blushing.

Georgia Hardstark (39:46)

It. I'm blushing.

Karen Kilgariff (39:47)

Place.

Jake Brennan (39:48)

You're asking me all these.

Karen Kilgariff (39:50)

What are you.

Georgia Hardstark (39:51)

I've got your back.

Jake Brennan (39:52)

You got my Glendale.

Karen Kilgariff (39:54)

Sweet. Noun.

Jake Brennan (39:59)

You go with a noun.

Georgia Hardstark (40:00)

Okay.

Karen Kilgariff (40:02)

Let it flow.

Georgia Hardstark (40:03)

I. I can't think of a word. I've never thought of a word in my entire life. I've never said a word.

Karen Kilgariff (40:09)

I don't person, place or thing.

Georgia Hardstark (40:11)

I know, but. Elvis. Nice. Jesus Christ.

Karen Kilgariff (40:16)

Emotion.

Jake Brennan (40:19)

Melancholy.

Karen Kilgariff (40:20)

Deep direction.

Georgia Hardstark (40:24)

Oh, U turn.

Karen Kilgariff (40:27)

Sure.

Georgia Hardstark (40:29)

Is that a direction?

Karen Kilgariff (40:30)

I think it can be. Absolutely. Direction.

Jake Brennan (40:33)

Another direction. Reverse

Karen Kilgariff (40:38)

weather phenomenon.

Jake Brennan (40:40)

How's that different than a natural disaster?

Karen Kilgariff (40:43)

Oh, you'll see.

Jake Brennan (40:44)

A phenomenon so singular. Not phenomenal phenomena.

Karen Kilgariff (40:47)

True

Jake Brennan (40:50)

mudslide.

Karen Kilgariff (40:51)

Perfect person.

Jake Brennan (40:54)

Jerry Lee.

Karen Kilgariff (40:56)

A crime. Past tense.

Jake Brennan (40:59)

Murdered.

Georgia Hardstark (41:01)

Is this a crossword puzzle?

Karen Kilgariff (41:04)

A living being.

Georgia Hardstark (41:07)

Humanoid.

Jake Brennan (41:11)

That could have been band name too.

Georgia Hardstark (41:12)

Oh, yeah.

Karen Kilgariff (41:13)

True object.

Jake Brennan (41:16)

Microphone.

Karen Kilgariff (41:18)

Body part.

Jake Brennan (41:19)

You'd do this one.

Georgia Hardstark (41:20)

Fingernail.

Karen Kilgariff (41:22)

Noun.

Jake Brennan (41:24)

Dump truck.

Georgia Hardstark (41:27)

This is peak podcasting.

Karen Kilgariff (41:29)

Noun.

Georgia Hardstark (41:32)

Kaleidoscope.

Karen Kilgariff (41:34)

Concept.

Jake Brennan (41:36)

Concept.

Georgia Hardstark (41:39)

Black hole.

Jake Brennan (41:40)

There you go.

Karen Kilgariff (41:40)

Nice shape.

Jake Brennan (41:44)

Is it an anagram? Is that the weird. Nevermind. Triangle.

Karen Kilgariff (41:49)

Thank you. Common shape. I should have said a living being. Again.

Georgia Hardstark (41:55)

Jesus.

Jake Brennan (41:56)

I'll do this living being.

Georgia Hardstark (41:57)

Okay. Jesus.

Jake Brennan (42:01)

He's not living. Oh, Elvis Costello.

Georgia Hardstark (42:05)

Oh, yeah, Elvis Costello. So you say. Okay.

Karen Kilgariff (42:09)

A dance style.

Jake Brennan (42:10)

Interpretive.

Georgia Hardstark (42:13)

Is anyone sweating? I'm sweating.

Karen Kilgariff (42:15)

Almost done. This is sound effect.

Jake Brennan (42:18)

Sound effect. Splat.

Karen Kilgariff (42:22)

Nice. And finally. Italian last name.

Georgia Hardstark (42:27)

Italian last name.

Jake Brennan (42:28)

Can I give my wife's maiden name?

Georgia Hardstark (42:30)

Yeah, yeah.

Jake Brennan (42:31)

Petralia.

Karen Kilgariff (42:32)

Nice. Ready?

Georgia Hardstark (42:34)

Yeah.

Karen Kilgariff (42:35)

I'm gonna read you nice.

Jake Brennan (42:36)

Now.

Karen Kilgariff (42:36)

The new lyrics to Bohemian Rhapsody. Is this the stinky life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a hurricane no escape from reality Open your penis look up to the Glendale and see I'm just a poor Elvis I need no melancholy Because I'm easy come, easy go Little U turn, little reverse. Any way the mud slides. Doesn't really matter to Jerry Lee Lewis.

Georgia Hardstark (43:05)

That's true.

Karen Kilgariff (43:06)

Mama just murdered. Put a microphone against his fingernail. Pulled my dump truck. Now he's dead. Carry kaleidoscope. Carry kaleidoscope. As if black hole really matters. Skipping the opera part. Going to. I see a little triangle. O of Elvis Costello. Scaramouche. Scaramouche. Will you do the interpretive dance? Splat and lightning. Very, very frightening. G. Galileo. Galileo. Galileo. Petralia.

Georgia Hardstark (43:37)

Aw, it's like a love song to your wife.

Jake Brennan (43:40)

That is impressive. I'm actually. So did you guys.

Georgia Hardstark (43:43)

I didn't know anything about this. I have nothing.

Jake Brennan (43:44)

Did you put that together yourself or is that.

Karen Kilgariff (43:46)

Do you know who did it?

Jake Brennan (43:46)

No. Kate.

Karen Kilgariff (43:47)

The Beastie Boy herself. Kate Schellenbach, of course.

Jake Brennan (43:49)

Love that. Nice work, Kate.

Karen Kilgariff (43:51)

Right?

Jake Brennan (43:51)

Yes. We barely made it out of that one alive.

Georgia Hardstark (43:54)

Truly.

Karen Kilgariff (43:55)

Listen, when you do a 20 minute

Georgia Hardstark (43:57)

game, I mean, this is like 20 years of podcasting together.

Karen Kilgariff (44:00)

That's right. You know, so we're doing it all right now.

Georgia Hardstark (44:03)

Da da da da. What's your favorite rock memoir?

Jake Brennan (44:06)

The Rick James memoir.

Georgia Hardstark (44:08)

Oh, wow.

Karen Kilgariff (44:09)

Shit.

Jake Brennan (44:10)

Because you're like, are you fucking kidding me, dude? You're admitting to this? Like, what? What are we talking about? He didn't act. It's not an autobiography. The writer finished it after he died, but it's just like. It's gold. Like, I could have done 10 episodes on Rick James. Yeah, it's running drugs for the Colombian cartel and literally breaking out of prison with just crazy.

Karen Kilgariff (44:31)

So good crazy. The Disgraceland out right now is the Patti Smiths.

Jake Brennan (44:36)

Yes. Which her. I mean, she's the memoir master, actually. And actually that is a better memoir. The Just Kids is incredible. Even though it's. I know you guys have talked about it and I think you've read it. It's more her origin story and her love story and then the memoir after that, Empty, which is more her story of being an artist and how she creates and goes through the process. And in M Train, actually this fascinating thing that I never knew about Patti Smith, which is amazing. She's obsessed with cheesy crime fiction.

Karen Kilgariff (45:16)

Oh, really?

Jake Brennan (45:17)

Just like. No, like Law and Order. Oh, the shit we're into, like cs, but good stuff, like the Killing, you know, and when the Killing was canceled, she wrote to the producers and was like, please don't cancel the Kill. Whatever. And they were like, well, we can't do anything about it, but why don't you come on an episode? So she went on an episode. She was on Law and Order.

Georgia Hardstark (45:39)

Oh, my God, really?

Jake Brennan (45:40)

Yeah, she's like, you know, National Book Award winner. And literally we were joking about honorary degrees, like, all kinds of that. She accepted Dylan's Nobel Peace Prize for, you know, like the high priestess of art. But she's like, binging shit crime fiction, like we all do.

Karen Kilgariff (45:58)

She knows what's good.

Jake Brennan (45:59)

She knows what's good. And the thing that as I'm researching her and putting the story together for Disgraceland, I'm like, she survives you know, she lives at the Chelsea. She lives through the whole punk rock thing. She lives through the 80s and 90s. Like the two great loves of her life die. She survives all that and has this incredible sort of, like, late life, reaping the fruits of her artistic labor in ways that artists seldom get to do. And I'm looking back and I'm going, oh, my God. She survived all this crime and violence and drug use and everything that goes along with being a rock star and being an artist. Because she was obsessed with artists who were. And her mother was obsessed with the Lindbergh kidnapping and would talk to her about it. She lives through the Son of Sam. She lives through. You know, Helter Skelter was a huge thing even for rock people on the East Coast. Mapplethorpe was obsessed with it. And if she were alive now, or if she were like, our age now I know she's alive now, she would be like a murderino. She would be my favorite. She probably isn't my favorite murderer.

Georgia Hardstark (47:09)

She probably listens to Disgraceland, too.

Karen Kilgariff (47:11)

Could you imagine?

Jake Brennan (47:12)

Because there's the whole thing of, like, being aware, right? And I mean, I'm looking at your book behind you. Stay Sexy. Don't Get Murdered. Like, that whole thing, like, I know it's a catchphrase, but it's like, it's true. There's truth in it. Like, I think, so Be aware, you know? So I think her sort of fascination with crime, crime, literature. How do you pronounce the guy's name? The French poet Jean Guenet? I can't say it. The correct name. Yeah. Thank you. Matt Bowden, who is our production guy, is French. He's gonna kill me for butchering that. But he was a criminal, and she was friends with Burrows. Burroughs killed his wife and got away with it. And I think she just kind of. She had all that stuff, that true crime kind of steeped in her. And I feel like the knowledge of that, somehow, cosmically, spiritually, whatever, it helped her avoid being a casualty. That's sort of my take on it anyways. And that's. I didn't mean to just give you a whole preview episode. No, I love that. But I'm very excited about it right now.

Karen Kilgariff (48:12)

It's kind of a perfect teaser, though, because it is like. It's like. Do you like music? Do you like True Crime? Do you like both? This is all.

Jake Brennan (48:19)

Do you like Patti Smith?

Karen Kilgariff (48:20)

Patti Smith? Do you like New York in the 70s when it was real dirty and difficult?

Jake Brennan (48:25)

She was writing because the night that her Biggest song during the Son of Sam.

Georgia Hardstark (48:31)

Yeah.

Jake Brennan (48:31)

Just what a time, man. And what a time.

Karen Kilgariff (48:35)

Well, Jake, it is truly such an honor to have a podcast as beautifully made and thoughtfully made and made by a talent that isn't just, like, successful, but also it does feel like we know you and we've known you for a long time. We're fans and now we get to do it with you. And I think it's the dream combination. And we are so, so genuinely thrilled that this is starting.

Georgia Hardstark (49:00)

I feel like one of us. So welcome to the Shit show.

Jake Brennan (49:03)

I, I, I could not be happier to be part of the shit show. You guys are the gold standard in podcasting and you have been from the beginning, and I've been a fan literally from the beginning. So what you've built is just unbelievable. Guys, congratulations and thank you. And your staff is amazing. The people who work here are great. Everybody I've worked with has been a delight to work with. They've all been awesome. And that's a reflection on you guys. And it's really cool.

Karen Kilgariff (49:28)

We got an incredible group over here and everyone just like, what's cool is everyone. And it really feels like there's a sincere love of what we're all doing and it's a great team. It's a great team to be on. It's really fun.

Jake Brennan (49:42)

Happy to be here.

Karen Kilgariff (49:43)

So glad you're here.

Jake Brennan (49:44)

Thank you. Thank you.

Georgia Hardstark (49:45)

So. Okay. Disgraceland is now part of the Exactly Right network. And I heart podcast new episodes every Tuesday, bonus episodes Thursday and rewinds on Sunday. And new episodes of Hollywoodland come out every Monday with bonus episodes Wednesday and Friday. Write that down.

Karen Kilgariff (50:00)

It's a lot of content.

Georgia Hardstark (50:01)

Go listen, subscribe, and give it a five star review wherever you get your podcasts. That's pretty helpful. Yeah.

Jake Brennan (50:06)

Leave some reviews. I often I take calls on our bonus episode and I also will read a review and if I read the review, I'll send that person a little merch I love.

Georgia Hardstark (50:16)

I think we should steal that so

Jake Brennan (50:18)

you can leave a nice review and I'll send you guys some merch.

Karen Kilgariff (50:22)

You can't steal it, but you can participate in it.

Jake Brennan (50:25)

Who do you think you are?

Karen Kilgariff (50:26)

For want C?

Georgia Hardstark (50:28)

Can we at least get a 20% discount?

Karen Kilgariff (50:29)

If not, what's your promo code for Sig? Disco Disco. Yay.

Georgia Hardstark (50:36)

That's it.

Karen Kilgariff (50:37)

I think we did it.

Jake Brennan (50:38)

Thanks, guys.

Georgia Hardstark (50:38)

Thanks for staying here.

Jake Brennan (50:39)

Thank you. Right on.

Georgia Hardstark (50:40)

Stay sexy and don't get murdered.

Jake Brennan (50:43)

What do I do?

Karen Kilgariff (50:44)

You're.

Georgia Hardstark (50:44)

You're saying goodbye. You're saying goodbye in your way that you.

Jake Brennan (50:47)

Oh, oh, yeah. Do it again. Can I do it again?

Georgia Hardstark (50:49)

Stay sexy and don't get murdered.

Jake Brennan (50:51)

Rock yeah, I think we did that last time. And I froze up as well.

Georgia Hardstark (50:56)

It's weird to just point at someone and expect them to know what they're gonna think.

Karen Kilgariff (51:00)

Noun.

Jake Brennan (51:01)

Yeah. Yes.

Karen Kilgariff (51:02)

Body of water. That's true.

Georgia Hardstark (51:04)

Elvis. Do you want a cookie?

Jake Brennan (51:08)

What is up, murderinos? Fans of the Exactly Right Network and elite podcast listeners everywhere, this is Jake Brennan, host of the Disgraceland Podcast Podcast. Your new favorite music and true crime podcast. A show where every week I dive into the story of one musical artist in the true crime or crimes that have impacted them. And I'm thrilled to announce that Disgraceland has found a new home at the Exactly Right Network in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. In Disgraceland, we have episodes on over 200 musicians. Sometimes these artists are the victims, sometimes they're criminals. And some of these stories are the kind they don't want told. The kind that are so unbelievable that you're going to end up telling them to someone else. The story about blondies, Debbie Harry escaping, Ted Bundy, about rock and roll pioneer Jerry Lee Lewis, AKA the killer, allegedly getting away with killing his wife. How Patti Smith isn't just the godmother of punk, but she's also the OG True Crime girl. And of course, stories about the Norwegian black metal, church burnings, Big Lurch, the hip hop artist who ate his roommate, Amy Winehouse, the Stones, Lana Del Rey, Bowie, Kurt and Courtney, Sid and Nancy, and too many wild stories to mention. This is the podcast for the music in True Crime Obsessed. New, fully scripted episodes with award winning sound design are released every Tuesday. Bonus episodes where I respond to your calls, texts and DMs are released on Thursday with rewind episodes dropping every Sunday. I hope you guys jump into your podcast player right now and search Disgraceland and give it a follow. I promise you will not be disappointed. All right. Stay sexy and don't get murdered by a rock star. Rocka Rolla.

Karen Kilgariff (53:04)

This has been an Exactly Right production.

Georgia Hardstark (53:06)

Our senior producer is Molly Smith and our associate producer is Tessa Hughes.

Karen Kilgariff (53:09)

Our editor is Aristotle Lasevedo.

Georgia Hardstark (53:11)

This episode was mixed by Liana Squillace.

Karen Kilgariff (53:14)

Our researchers are Maren McGlashan and Ali Elkin.

Georgia Hardstark (53:16)

Email your hometowns to my favorite murdermail.com

Karen Kilgariff (53:19)

and follow the show on Instagram at. My Favorite Murder.

Georgia Hardstark (53:22)

Listen to My Favorite murder on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Karen Kilgariff (53:27)

And now you can watch My Favorite Murder on Netflix.

Georgia Hardstark (53:29)

And when you're there, hit the double thumbs up and the remind me buttons. That's the best way you can support our show. Goodbye. The Internet loves to say go touch grass as though lawns aren't a constant source of stress.

Karen Kilgariff (53:45)

Brown Patch Personal Failure Fertilizer Grow Up.

Georgia Hardstark (53:48)

Sunday is a yard care company designed to make that easier.

Karen Kilgariff (53:51)

They analyze your soil, use climate data and build a custom yard plan.

Georgia Hardstark (53:55)

Sunday uses nutrient dense ingredients, not harsh

Karen Kilgariff (53:58)

chemicals, which feels better already.

Georgia Hardstark (54:00)

Go to getsunday.com to get your free custom yard analysis.

Karen Kilgariff (54:04)

That's getsunday.com goodbye.

Georgia Hardstark (54:07)

By now you've probably heard of Reef. They've been making iconic sandals forever.

Karen Kilgariff (54:11)

But what you might not know is that they also make ridiculously comfortable everyday shoes.

Georgia Hardstark (54:15)

The Neptune is a lightweight everyday slip on shoe with a crushed back heel so you can wear it traditionally or step on the heel and wear it like a slide.

Karen Kilgariff (54:22)

Lightweight, breathable and easy to wear, the Neptune is the everyday shoe your feet have been waiting for.

Georgia Hardstark (54:27)

I feel like so often you have to set sacrifice cuteness for comfort, which is so annoying because I want both all the time. Everything has to be cute. But also I'm old and I want comfortable shoes so I feel like the Neptunes are the perfect answer to that.

Karen Kilgariff (54:40)

Yeah, I love how cushy they are. They're like, they go with everything. They're really cute, but your feet are like on little clouds.

Georgia Hardstark (54:46)

Check out the Neptune on reef.com and redeem 15% off your first purchase. Goodbye.

Karen Kilgariff (54:53)

If you've ever tried healthy bread and it left you feeling personally betrayed, you're not alone.

Georgia Hardstark (54:57)

If you want an option that actually tastes amazing, try Herobread.

Karen Kilgariff (55:01)

Herobread is baked with olive oil and designed to be soft, fluffy and flavorful the way bread is supposed to taste and feel.

Georgia Hardstark (55:08)

It's built to fit into a more mindful routine without giving up the texture or comfort people expect from real bread.

Karen Kilgariff (55:13)

They make all the essentials sliced bread, bagels, tortillas and buns. So it works for everyday meals like breakfast wraps, grilled cheese sandwiches and bagels.

Georgia Hardstark (55:21)

Hero also releases limited items like their croissant with 2 grams of net carbs per serving, which has developed a strong following.

Karen Kilgariff (55:28)

We had Hero Bread on the counter in the kitchen here at work. When I tell tell you how delicious it smelled in there because everyone started making toast and everyone was eating the bread and loving it. They were just like this is delicious. I mean anything's possible in our kitchen.

Georgia Hardstark (55:41)

Now go to Hero Co check out the 30,000plus 5 star reviews and use code iheart for 10 off your first order.

Karen Kilgariff (55:49)

All figures are per serving, not a low calorie food.

Georgia Hardstark (55:51)

Baked goods contain up to 18 grams of fat per serving. See Nutrition Facts for more info.

Karen Kilgariff (55:55)

Goodbye.