← My So-Called Midlife with Reshma Saujani
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- [00:02]
Gulab Vilasak
Hi, I'm Gulab Vilasak.
- [00:03]
Soo Jin Pak
And I'm Soo Jin Pak.
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Gulab Vilasak
And we're your aunties on Add to Cart, a podcast all about the things we buy, the things we buy into, and what that says about who we are. We're real life friends who love to.
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Soo Jin Pak
Talk about what we're adding to cart.
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Gulab Vilasak
Sometimes that means trying the latest snail serum to slather on our faces or a sweater that screams 1/3 ugly.
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Soo Jin Pak
That's right, Sue.
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Gulab Vilasak
Each week we dive into honest, oftentimes TMI conversations about what's taking up space in our shopping carts and in our minds, be it products, trends or something for our auntie book club. We also bring guests on the show and take a peek into their carts because the things a person buys or doesn't says a lot about them.
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Soo Jin Pak
We like to think of ourselves as aunties to all fun, slightly unhinged and.
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Gulab Vilasak
Always ready to share some sage advice.
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Soo Jin Pak
And a good product wreck.
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Gulab Vilasak
Add to Cart is out now, wherever you get your podcasts.
- [01:00]
Sam Be
Hey, Choice Words listeners. Sam Be here. Guess what? We are back with a brand new season of Choice Words from Lemonada Media. Each week I'll chat with amazing guests like Kerry Washington, Laura Dern and Nick Offerman to dive into the biggest choices they've ever made. We are talking career shaping, history, changing life defining decisions. As someone who has made my own fair share of questionable choices. Hello Bangs. I am pumped to share these funny, poignant, all too relatable stories with you. Season 2 of Choice Words is out now. Tune in wherever you get your podcasts. You won't want to miss it.
- [01:44]
Soo Jin Pak
Lemonada welcome to my so Called Midlife a podcast where we figure out how to stop just getting through it and start actually living it. Reshma I'm Reshma Sajani. So every week I do a little something that honors this current era of my life. I realized as I was entering midlife that to go up, I needed to go in. Like I was just yearning for a spiritual exploration. So I got myself a monk. And every two weeks, no matter what is going on in my life, I have a standing meeting with Rosanath and we spent an hour not talking about how to crush that goal or fix that thing, but just talking about the things I'm curious about. Talking about life, how to live and lead a better life, a more joyful life. And this ritual helps me just be a little kinder to me and all of the other changes that are happening to my mind and my body. So today's guest, Margaret Cho, is the queen of rituals. She's got this easy, confident, almost like, joyful approach to aging. In talking to her, I was so inspired. Margaret is a queer icon and a comedy legend. I was literally just talking to a friend about how I rented Margaret's comedy special, Notorious cho, literally, in 2002 at Blockbuster, and today she's still at it. She's performing a live show called Live and Livid, which is her way of fighting back against sexism, homophobia, and racism. And here's the thing. She is having so much damn fun in her fifth decade. You've probably seen her in recent films like Fire island or Cora Bora, and she's even a musician. She's a woman who composes her own music. I mean, come on. Margaret is well versed in making light out of the hard parts of life, and it just made this conversation refreshing and authentic. Hey, Margaret. How are you?
- [04:06]
Margaret Cho
I'm good. How are you?
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Soo Jin Pak
Good. If you're down, I'll get into it. And I just want to say, I. I think the first show of yours that I saw was Notorious cho in, like, 2002, and it was awesome, so.
- [04:20]
Margaret Cho
Oh, thank you.
- [04:21]
Soo Jin Pak
Huge fan. My husband's like, what? You're talking to Margaret? I'm like, yes, I am. So I'm a fan. Hi.
- [04:27]
Margaret Cho
Thank you.
- [04:28]
Soo Jin Pak
Okay, so, Margaret, on this show, we've been talking about midlife mindset. And, like, if I'm honest, like, it literally varies for everyone. Some folks are like, best fucking time of my life. Some people are, like, worst time of my life. Where do you land? What's your midlife mindset?
- [04:45]
Margaret Cho
Oh, I love it. I'm having the best time. I really am so amazed at how much better my life is. Like, it's great. I'm really happy.
- [04:57]
Soo Jin Pak
Is there anything you've discovered, like, in your 50s that, like, has been a total, like, game changer?
- [05:04]
Margaret Cho
Well, that you can actually be single and happy and also have intimate relationships that don't require marriage or cohabitation, that don't require the emotional labor that kind of consisted of. Most of my romantic relationships up until probably the age of 48, you know, that were really unhappy because I followed the game plan of you meet somebody, you start dating, you're, like, together, and then you get married. Like, it's always been terrible. So now I feel very fortunate to kind of create my own sort of plan around that, which also includes long periods of not having any sort of intimacy whatsoever, which is also great. So I love it.
- [05:56]
Soo Jin Pak
What about friendships, though? Because I don't know about you, Margaret, But I have found, especially recently, like, I'm shedding more friends.
- [06:03]
Margaret Cho
Yeah.
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Soo Jin Pak
Like, it's actually harder to sustain friendships. Do you find that too?
- [06:09]
Margaret Cho
That's true. But also with comedians, we form these lifelong bonds with other comedians that are really, like, they lapse for many years where we don't see each other for years, and then we come back together and we resume. So it's like there's people that I don't see on a daily basis, but I'm very close to and maintain that friendship through texting or calling or whatever. And then there's like, of course, my core group of friends that I see really often. But I mean, I think that in general with friendships is I don't meet as many new people to be friends with.
- [06:48]
Soo Jin Pak
Yes, me too. Like, I haven't had a new friend in, like, years. Like, actually, I did make a new friend, but it's harder. And I don't know if it's about, like, not having time or like, you know, the intimacy that you have to get to. To really. It's like the friendships where, like, you don't. You don't have to talk, you can just exist. Whereas when you make a new friend, like, I feel like you still have to entertain them.
- [07:09]
Margaret Cho
Right. I mean, I don't know. Like, I actually have a couple of new friends with that. We do a meditation group where we actually get together to not talk.
- [07:18]
Soo Jin Pak
I love that.
- [07:19]
Margaret Cho
So that.
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Soo Jin Pak
That's what I need to do.
- [07:21]
Margaret Cho
Yeah. Meditation is a huge part of my life. And so I actually will. I have social gatherings where we don't speak at all. And that kind of fosters a really intense intimacy that to me, that's really so powerful and really rewarding.
- [07:36]
Soo Jin Pak
I have a pro tip question about meditation. So for me, you know how they're like, let the thoughts come in. Like, that's normal. Like, the thoughts always come in, right in like a minute. I'm like planning, like, what I need to. What groceries that I need to buy or like, what my mom did. That, like, really pissed me off. Right. Like, it's like, how has that. As you've gotten better at it and you've practiced more. Like, has that shifted? Does that shift? Do I need to just stick with it?
- [08:01]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, just stick with it because that's going to happen no matter what. Because our minds are geared to work. So meditation is like guiding it back to a point of reference. Like, whatever that is, you know, whatever's happening, like, you just guide it back. So when you start to have the thought, try to Start engaging with. I'm not going to do the planning. Like, I start to have the thoughts where you. Even if it's like, oh, I'm gonna put together a shopping list, put things back on the shelf, like, in your mind, that in itself is a kind of meditation.
- [08:36]
Soo Jin Pak
Oh, that's so wild. Oh, I'm gonna try that. Like, so, like, when I start being like, oh, I need to buy apple and then fish sticks, it's like I actually see the apple and put it back.
- [08:45]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, put it back and kind of think about the weight of it and what it feels like in your hand and put it back onto the stack of apples. So then put it back, put things back. Like that. It works. And part of that is like, oh, I'm actually going to actively dismantle all these thoughts. And then that in itself is a separation from your thought. So that's a handy trick in meditation to use.
- [09:10]
Soo Jin Pak
Oh, I'm going to try that, like, today.
- [09:12]
Margaret Cho
It works. It's weird.
- [09:14]
Soo Jin Pak
Oh, I love that. Okay. You said something that I just loved. You said, so. Everybody wants you in your 50s and you are very sought after. I have found that I'm getting more romantic attention now than ever in my life, including in my early 20s, which is saying a lot. I think there's a kind of grace that we have that's irresistible to people of all ages. It's pretty phenomenal. Like, do you really have more game in your 50s?
- [09:42]
Margaret Cho
Yes, but it's also. I have less energy to run it to completion, you know, Like, I have less patience as well to kind of see things through in terms of just appeal or people kind of coming over, being interested or whatever. Yes, for sure. There's a lot of people of all ages, like, in their 20s and older. Less interest from the other side. Less interest for people in their 60s and 70s. But definitely isn't that fascinating, right?
- [10:12]
Soo Jin Pak
It's like, it's true. It's like, it's like. Like, younger men are like, damn. Or women are like, damn.
- [10:18]
Margaret Cho
Like, for sure, let's get it. Totally. Like, it's like, very. It's zaddy. Like, zaddy. Like daddy likes very zaddy. We get to appeal that we are all very. Yeah, we're all Brad Pitt in the end.
- [10:34]
Soo Jin Pak
But here's the thing. I feel like when I feel like, oh, I look good, I feel good. Like, I'm crushing it. I have my swag. I can literally walk down the street and I feel the buzz. Right? Like, you're like, I guess that's the zaddy. But I know that, like, I could turn it on, but I think for a lot of women, they don't know how to turn it on because they're so stuck in the fact that, like, no one looks at me. So how do you, like, turn that switch on?
- [10:59]
Margaret Cho
I don't know. Like, I think it's just. It comes from, like, feeling good and kind of feeling, like, oh, I would like to feel, like, energized and feel, like, sexually potent, you know, and enjoying it. It could be, like, a color theory, too. Like, for me, red is kind of a power color. Like, whether it's, like, red lipstick or even red eyeshadow, something about that. Like, you know, there's just something about stepping into the power. It's a decision that we make. You know, you can hide from it or you can really step into the light of it.
- [11:34]
Soo Jin Pak
And I think what you're saying is it's not about the intention of. At actual. Of doing anything about it. It's the feeling that you get.
- [11:42]
Margaret Cho
Yeah. And just enjoying that feeling and enjoying the celebration of that, you know, stepping into the energy of that.
- [11:50]
Soo Jin Pak
Is that what queen energy is?
- [11:51]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, it's queen energy. It's divine energy. It's like, you know, I love old movies, and I love, like, Marilyn Monroe and how she was just sort of walking in this sort of goddess energy. And I feel like there's a light there that everybody can benefit from.
- [12:07]
Soo Jin Pak
And you've wrote into, like, that you. You take care of your physical health now, Right? You said, like, in your 50s, you're drinking green juice, you're exercising, you're gardening, you're bird watching.
- [12:16]
Margaret Cho
Yes.
- [12:16]
Soo Jin Pak
And, you know, part of what you talked about is, like, that you have struggled with depression over the years. And, like, your 20s, like, so many of us were so damn hard because we could not. We didn't feel like we fit in. And now in. Many people turn to alcohol and drugs as a way to kind of just numb that sense of. Of difference and alienation. And now it's like, your 50s, you're like, forget it. Like, I don't care. And that's really created, like, this abundance in many ways of, like, pursuit of health. How did you get there?
- [12:48]
Margaret Cho
Well, I mean, I have had a lot of trial and error using medication for depression. I've been in a lot of therapy, many different kinds of therapy, whether it's group therapy or EMDR or just a talk therapy or, you know, know, utilize. Trying to use different psych meds to get there. But I. I never found that perfect solution. And So I realized vigorous exercise combined with meditation combined with these, like, you know, different sort of like, healing communities that I'm part of, as well as taking care of my animals and my home. And, you know, there's a lot of things that my work is a huge part of it. So my. My day begins, like, really early, and I have, like, a bunch of, like, different kinds of readings that I do for my mental health. And then I have my meditation, and then I write a joke, one joke every day.
- [13:43]
Soo Jin Pak
Really?
- [13:44]
Margaret Cho
Every day as part of my meditation, I have one. I can't leave the sort of mat until I write that one joke.
- [13:52]
Soo Jin Pak
Can you tell me what joke you wrote today?
- [13:53]
Margaret Cho
Today?
- [13:54]
Soo Jin Pak
Yeah, Let me see.
- [13:55]
Margaret Cho
What.
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Soo Jin Pak
I can't wait.
- [13:56]
Margaret Cho
I have to see what I wrote today. I can't remember it. Oh, is this about strap on dildos? It's in addition to another joke that I wrote about it because I think the strap on doesn't really hit because there's something about it that doesn't quite replicate dick. Like, because I love the Snickers vein and dick. So. But then there's an area. The joke I wrote to add to it was the strap does hit while you're wearing it, because when you're wearing it, you're not contributing to the patriarchy, and that is really hot. So you're, like, using it and like, my. Our bodies, our choice. Hell, yeah. So that was this morning.
- [14:35]
Soo Jin Pak
I love it. I love that ritual. Every morning, one joke.
- [14:39]
Margaret Cho
Just one. And it doesn't have to be funny, and it doesn't have to be good, and it doesn't have to be used, but I just have to. After all of the sort of spiritual work or whatever that I do in the morning, that's the last. So it's sort of the punctuation of it, like, okay, here it is. The one thing. Sometimes it's like, just like an idea, but it can grow into something else. So that's just for me.
- [15:10]
Soo Jin Pak
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- [18:26]
Margaret Cho
Well, I love it. Like I am really also enjoying hormone replacement therapy. You know, I take ESTROGEN I take progesterone, I take testosterone. And it's really helped me manage the sort of physical symptoms of what menopause can be and also pick and choose what I want and I don't want, you know, and really I also understand now so much of my quote unquote fertility was really bringing me the most problems, that my hormones were more in charge of my choices than I was. And now I'm in charge of like finding out what hormones I need and using them to the degree that I need them. And I just love that.
- [19:07]
Soo Jin Pak
So now basically having control over your hormones, like, what are you doing now that you weren't doing before? Like, what's the freedom that having that type of control has given you?
- [19:18]
Margaret Cho
Well, I'm just very adamant about choosing the people that I want to be with, like choosing the experiences that I want to have, creating those boundaries around those experiences. And I think hormonally before I was drawn to, like, oh, well, I better, you know, stay with this romantic relationship because they really want this. And what am I going to do if I'm alone? Like, and I would just be coerced into full blown marriages that I didn't want to be in, you know, because I was like, so afraid, like, oh, but you know, if I don't hang on to this person, I might be alone. What if I die alone? Like that. The fear of dying alone was so terrifying for you. Was so terrifying. But now I'm like, so excited to, like, I'm like, that's great.
- [20:08]
Soo Jin Pak
Do you think that you came to that though, through menopause?
- [20:11]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, I think it was menopause. It was the cessation of this hormones that were like, keeping me up with this idea that I had a biological imperative to nest and create more or whatever that is, you know, Like, I still thought I had to like, have a family. I think that was like all hormonal. It was never a real decision that I wanted to make for myself.
- [20:34]
Soo Jin Pak
That's fascinating. So what do you say to women who don't want to get married or who don't want to have kids and also don't want to feel bad about that decision?
- [20:42]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, nobody should feel bad about it. Why, why, why have children if you don't want it? Like the huge undertaking of making people, you can do it or not. It's a choice. Some people feel like they are born to do it and they are the people that should have children, but those of us who just don't want to, shouldn't have to. And we should feel fine about that. I feel totally fine about that. It's not selfish. It's selfish to have children. Like, just so. Because people say you should and then not enjoy it, you know, then you're depriving. I would never inflict myself on a child. Like, I, I don't. I don't want to do that to any kid. Like, that would be the worst. So I would rather not have to deal with it.
- [21:26]
Soo Jin Pak
Yeah. I think the point is, right, Having giving women the choice. Right. To decide when, if, how. Do you think menopause has helped with your mental health?
- [21:36]
Margaret Cho
Yes, yes, greatly. Because I think that constant, like, push and pull of, like the hormonal shifts over the month and not remembering that, oh, it's pms. I just think I'm suicidal. Like, you know, like, I was like, how come every month I want to kill someone or myself? And I. I would be like, oh, it's always. Then I get my period and then it's like, oh, oh, that thing of, like, not having that. And that. That, like, is so amazing. There's still cycles that happen throughout the month, especially now with my HRT and stuff, but it's so manageable. It's so different.
- [22:15]
Soo Jin Pak
It's so true. I never know, like, why am I so angry or why am I so unhappy, or why did that thing that my kids said, my husband said, my colleague said just like, take me to 0 to 100. And I feel like I'm like, You know, my husband sometimes calls me Decepticon. Cause he's like, your face is always like, your eyebrows are going in. And it's true. I feel that way. I'm always just a little. Fine. Annoyed or a lot annoyed. And I know it's the perimenopause.
- [22:45]
Margaret Cho
Right? Right. It's weird because. But we don't identify it as that because we're just so used to being ruled by our hormones that it's hard to see. Oh, this is actually just a function of the hormones.
- [22:56]
Soo Jin Pak
I did do a little testosterone this morning on my arms. I'm really excited to see, like, what the impact of that's gonna be.
- [23:02]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, it's energizing and it's, you know, to use little bits, like the way that we do. And I worked it out with my doctor, so I get, like, compounded testosterone. And it really helps so much. So, you know, like, we can definitely get so much from gender affirming care.
- [23:23]
Soo Jin Pak
Absolutely. Did you ever talk to your mom about menopause?
- [23:26]
Margaret Cho
Well, my mom and all of her friends and sisters, they all got hysterectomies, like, right after they had, like, two or three kids. Like, my mom had two kids, and she had a hysterectomy in the 70s, and some of them had them in the 60s. So they were, like, experiencing menopause. So accelerated. They don't. Don't have. I don't have a frame of reference. Like, my family history with menopause is really, like, totally limited.
- [23:53]
Soo Jin Pak
Why were they getting hysterectomies? That. Was that something that was happening in the 70s or just.
- [23:57]
Margaret Cho
I don't know what it is. It was just, like, a weird trend medically that was just sort of, like, encouraged. Seemed like it was under the guise of, like, well, you don't need to have any more kids. This is freedom. But then they also didn't go on hormone replacement therapy. They just kind of had an accelerated menopause, which was so, like, fast. And, like, just take the whole thing out, and then you're just now not dealing with it at all.
- [24:22]
Soo Jin Pak
Yeah, my mother this weekend, she was listening to my menopause episode with my sister, and she's like, I don't know what the big deal is. Everybody goes through it, right? Like, it's that perspective that, like, you just suffer through it. Like, what's the big deal? Like, what are you complaining about? And, I mean, I feel like that's very Indian, you know, in our. In our culture. But did you have conversations with her, though, or. No, they just.
- [24:43]
Margaret Cho
No, because we just don't talk about it. Like, the Korean way is. You don't. You don't address it at all.
- [24:48]
Soo Jin Pak
Yeah, Indian way, the same.
- [24:49]
Margaret Cho
I remember my dad and I, this is like, in the 80s, we're watching Oprah, and it was about childhood sexual abuse and women coming forward to talk about it. And he got so mad, he's like, why do these people have to talk about it now? It's over. It's done with. That sort of, like, silence is just, to him, was like, the norm. Like, oh, of course we were all abused. So.
- [25:16]
Soo Jin Pak
Right. That's just what happens.
- [25:17]
Margaret Cho
Yeah. Why is it such a big deal? I mean, sometimes whiteness can bring privilege like that to us. Like, where people are talking about childhood abuse, and that comes from a privilege, and that comes from whiteness, where people are like, hey, I deserve to talk about my pain. And that is, I think, actually a white idea which works.
- [25:35]
Soo Jin Pak
Do you think the older though you've gotten with him, have your conversations with him changed? Because I assume back then you were like, you didn't say anything. Right? Like, so now, now we just don't.
- [25:45]
Margaret Cho
Talk about it because it's going to be a fight because he'll still fight with me. You know, they're both still. My parents are pretty feisty about keeping the status quo, even though they're like so proud of me and so happy that I've accomplished what I've been able to do and couldn't imagine it ever happening. And tell everybody who their daughter is. They always talk about who their daughter is. They're still like rigid about things. Like they don't want to talk about any of these subjects that I actually do. In my comedy too. I talk a lot about different things like this and they get really, like uncomfortable. But you know, do they sit there.
- [26:21]
Soo Jin Pak
And listen to you talk about like oral sex and all of that?
- [26:25]
Margaret Cho
But they turn their hearing aids down or they take them off completely. And my mom just like leaves her hearing aid at home. She's like, I don't hear. I get, I forgot. Which is fine.
- [26:37]
Soo Jin Pak
I know it's their way. My parents are exactly the same.
- [26:40]
Margaret Cho
Yeah.
- [26:53]
Soo Jin Pak
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- [30:26]
Margaret Cho
Oh, totally. Like the crushing disappointment that I couldn't have blonde ringlets. It was an existential crisis that I'm still fighting. Like, I really, like, I was so angry to not be white, like, as a child. Like, I just couldn't comprehend it even. Like, it was very. It wasn't even like I had the wherewithal to understand what that internalized racism was. I just was so disappointed by it. And I mean, I still am.
- [31:00]
Soo Jin Pak
Yeah. Are you still fighting it?
- [31:01]
Margaret Cho
I'm still fighting it. But also, I know that's just whiteness as a weapon used against myself.
- [31:08]
Soo Jin Pak
So to me, I think when I was younger, like Sweet Valley High, like, that was really those Books were really triggering. Right. It was so much of my identity. I felt in the way I looked. And I think the older I've gotten, I'm like, I recognize that with sometimes with all the talents and the blessings that we have, it's harder doing those things as, like, a brown girl. Like, it's harder blowing up this podcast as a brown woman. Like, it's just a fact, Right? So it's like, where do you feel like now in your midlife? You're fighting that right now?
- [31:43]
Margaret Cho
Well, I mean, I think that it's really. It comes back to the election again. Kamala should have won, but the fact that she didn't is really a testament to how racist this country is, how sexist this country is. Whiteness has now been, again, codified, as, this is the standard that we want to live up to. This is what we want. And of course, that's false. And I have a joke about it in my comment. These white supremacists just don't look supreme because that family tree needs branches. They're so inbred. It's so inbred. And also, as a woman in Korean culture, I don't matter there either. Like, non. Not thin, not particularly. Like, K drama, pretty. I don't matter in Korean culture at all. And I'm not married. I'm gay. There's all these things that, like, make me not matter in Korean culture. So I can't go back to a place that feels like a homeostasis. Like, oh, okay, I belong. So it's a very confusing thing. But also that makes it good to write about. You know, when I'm conscious of that, then I realize, oh, I'm actually lucky to be who I am and where I am.
- [32:58]
Soo Jin Pak
So your latest standup is live and livid, and you're talking about homophobia, sexism, racism. You're also celebrating 40 years of standup. I mean, that is just. It's cool. After the election, people are like, do we march? Do we not march? And there was really this consensus of, like, no, we create, we build.
- [33:17]
Margaret Cho
Yeah.
- [33:17]
Soo Jin Pak
And so I feel like your show is a part of that.
- [33:20]
Margaret Cho
Yeah.
- [33:22]
Soo Jin Pak
How have people been responding?
- [33:23]
Margaret Cho
It's been great. It's been great. People have been really appreciative. It's been really cathartic, I think, for all of us. And, yeah, it's time to create. And I definitely want to march. I want to bring back protest and bring back these ideas that we have always needed. We've always needed peaceful protest. We've always needed marches. We've always needed to demonstrate that I exist and I have a right to be here. So, you know, I think that'll come. But right now is a great time to create.
- [33:55]
Soo Jin Pak
Yeah. And have people come, build community and have people also laugh and feel joyful. Because I do think people are tired.
- [34:04]
Margaret Cho
Yeah. Or disappointed and really discouraged by the way that racism and sexism is so much a part of the American way. Homophobia is so much a part of the American way. And it doesn't have to be.
- [34:19]
Soo Jin Pak
It doesn't have to be at all. You are a tireless performer. Like, you're always out there and you're like, fighting for people and to make our world a better place. Like, do you ever rest? How do you take care of yourself?
- [34:34]
Margaret Cho
Oh, yeah, I rest. I love the new Gen Z bedrotting trend.
- [34:39]
Soo Jin Pak
Ooh, tell me, why am I not doing this? Oh, sitting in bed and doing nothing.
- [34:43]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, doing nothing. Or scrolling or watching TV or. I like to read. I just lay there and read. And I have my three cats and my dog and they all lay on my body and we just lay there.
- [34:55]
Soo Jin Pak
Oh, I love it.
- [34:56]
Margaret Cho
And I love it. Like, I really love just not doing anything. So, you know, I have like, sort of the physical activity that I do in my work and then my friends and all that kind of stuff. But then I just love to lay.
- [35:06]
Soo Jin Pak
Wait, how often do you bedrot? Cause I wanna start doing this too.
- [35:10]
Margaret Cho
Couple times a week if I can.
- [35:12]
Soo Jin Pak
For like a whole day or for like four, three. Four hours.
- [35:14]
Margaret Cho
Three or four hours. Like, a good time to bed rot is like, at night. Like, so I'll go. I'll go to bed at like 8. I love it. I'll lay in bed, like, you know, and just do everything from there. Like, I think it's really healing. So. Yeah, I love an early bedtime.
- [35:30]
Soo Jin Pak
Oh, I love an early bedtime. I go 8:30.
- [35:33]
Margaret Cho
So nice.
- [35:34]
Soo Jin Pak
You know what I also been doing that makes me feel a little guilty, but good. It's like I've been watching like 20 minutes or 30 minutes of a show. Like, in the middle of the day. I'll just like, put on Diplomat. I'm like, this is my right. Like, I'm going to rest and chill.
- [35:48]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, I love it. Like, I'll do like a whole day if I am not working. I'll do a whole day of a K drama, you know?
- [35:55]
Soo Jin Pak
Oh, I get you, girl. Bollywood movies are like my guilty pleasure.
- [35:58]
Margaret Cho
Oh, yeah.
- [35:59]
Soo Jin Pak
I think they remind me of like, childhood. Right. It's like, it's this little sense I could always cry. I don't know what they're talking about, but I think I do. Like, it's. I have to, you know, it's great.
- [36:08]
Margaret Cho
So great.
- [36:09]
Soo Jin Pak
It's so great. Okay, so how can we better celebrate aging? And you know, what was one of the first times you realized this was an era to celebrate? And what about the moment made you realize that?
- [36:22]
Margaret Cho
Well, I mean, I think I just got tired of the narrative of people being, like, scared to age or, like, being upset that they've aged or, like, really looking back at their younger selves. Like, it was somehow better. And that really was, like, a negative way to look, because we're just. If we're alive, we're just gonna get older, so why not? I just enjoy that. And then I always thought about. I had relationships with older people when I was really young. I like sexual relationships and how much I loved it. Like, I really loved older people, like, when I was younger. And so I thought of the majesty they sort of embodied, and I was like, well, now I'm that, so why can't I just enjoy that? So I think, you know, and it doesn't necessarily have to be in regards to other people. You can just enjoy the majesty of aging as you are.
- [37:18]
Soo Jin Pak
I also think it's like putting yourself in the mix. I went to a nightclub. It was a little embarrassing because, like, in the line was, like, a couple of, like, my girls who code students. They're like, oh, my God. I'm like, this is embarrassing. But when I went in, I'm like, they're playing the same 90s hip hop that I loved, and I had so much fun. And I think the other thing is, oftentimes we're scared of spaces that we think we've aged out of.
- [37:40]
Margaret Cho
Yeah.
- [37:40]
Soo Jin Pak
And then putting ourselves in those spaces. Are there any other, like, rituals or things that you do to kind of embrace that celebration?
- [37:49]
Margaret Cho
Well, I think it's just enjoying things like skincare enjoying things. Like, to almost ritualize it. Like, it's like, I do my skincare not for anti aging. Like, I do it because I just want to celebrate feeling good in my skin. All this stuff that I do, it's like reframing the language around it. I'm doing this to celebrate what is.
- [38:14]
Soo Jin Pak
Here and be in the moment of my age rather than rewind it. Right. You're 55.
- [38:20]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, I have a couple of weeks. I'll be in 10 days or 11 days. I'll be 56.
- [38:25]
Soo Jin Pak
What do you want to do in this decade? Like, what's left. Like, what are you looking forward to?
- [38:29]
Margaret Cho
Fight Jake Paul? I want to. I don't know, like, I would love. I don't know. How about like Sports Illustrated cover? That would be great. Ooh.
- [38:40]
Soo Jin Pak
All right, let's put it out of the universe.
- [38:41]
Margaret Cho
Margaret show, Sports Illustrated, all that kind of stuff. I'm not sure. I did my first nude scene in a movie. It was called Cora Bora with the wonderful mix Dalter. She and I were. It was very. It was very interesting because I've never done a nude scene in a film and this was like the first one. So it was hilarious. And we laughed the whole thing.
- [39:03]
Soo Jin Pak
And you had fun or you were embarrassed?
- [39:05]
Margaret Cho
I had the best time. I was really laughing. It was really great. So I loved it. So I think that kind of stuff, like showing my body off, like, whatever that is, whatever that means, just enjoying that. I have a music album coming out in February called Lucky Gift, which is music that I composed. And so it's the first time that I've actually like composed and played music on. So I've made music records. This is my third one, but I'm excited about that. So, you know, I would love a pop career. We'll see.
- [39:36]
Soo Jin Pak
There's so many. Oh my God. You could be like the next K pop star.
- [39:39]
Margaret Cho
Yeah, that'd be great.
- [39:40]
Soo Jin Pak
It's amazing. Well, this was such a wonderful treat. Thank you for such an awesome conversation. Thank you and hope everyone sees your show. And this was awesome.
- [39:48]
Margaret Cho
Thank you.
- [40:02]
Soo Jin Pak
Mar Patro is an actress, a singer and a comedian. And you can check out her most recent standup. Right now she's on tour. It's called Live and Livid. She's also just released a new single, Lucky Gift. Her music is so dope. Remember, this can be your queen, king, daddy era, whatever you want it to be. You are not too old. See you all next week. There's more of my so called Midlife with Lemonada. Premium subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content like Midlife Advice that didn't make it into the show. Subscribe now. In Apple Podcasts, I'm your host Reshma Sajani. Our producer is Claire Jones. This series is sound designed by Ivan Karayev. Our theme was composed by Ivan Karaev and performed by Ryan Jewell, Ivan Koraev and Karen Waltok. Our senior supervising producer is Kristen Lepore. Our VP of new content is Rachel Neal. Executive producers include me, Reshma Sajani, Stephanie whittleswax and Jessica Cordova Kramer. Series consulting and production support from Katie Cordova. Help others Find our show by leaving us a rating and writing a review and let us know how you're doing in midlife. You can submit your story to be included in this show@speakpipe.com midlife follow my so Called Midlife wherever you get your podcast or listen ad free on Amazon Music with your prime membership. Thanks for listening. See you next week. Bye.
- [42:05]
Sarah Silverman
Why hello there. This is your pal Sarah Silverman. You know, the standup comic that's not afraid of a diarrhea joke. Oh my God, I'm so brave. I hope you're enjoying this podcast that you're listening to. I am just dropping in here to let you know about another podcast I think you'd like and it's called the Sarah Silverman Podcast. Each week, listeners from all over the world call in and they ask me for advice or talk about something going on in their life.
- [42:29]
Margaret Cho
Anything.
- [42:29]
Sarah Silverman
Their silliest, grossest, deepest, darkest situations. And then I respond, whether I'm qualified to or not. Go ahead. Search for the Sarah Silverman Podcast wherever you get your podcasts.
- [42:40]
Soo Jin Pak
Bye.
- [42:42]
June Diane Raphael
Hi, I'm June Diane Rafael. And I'm Jessica St. Clair. And we would like to invite you on a hilarious and heartfelt journey each week on the Deep Dive. From navigating the chaos of motherhood and family to exploring the depths of grief and loss, we are just two best friends who process life together and with you guys, discover our secrets to finding joy amidst the madness. And get ready for unfiltered conversations about life, love, and everything in between. And nails. We talk a lot about nails now. Community is everything to us at the Deep Dive. We believe in the power of connection and the strength that comes from supporting one another. And we would love to have you with us. So be sure to join us every Wednesday on the Deep Dive from Lemonada Media. Wherever you get your podcasts.